After Show: Blood on the Door

Summary

Podcast Summary: 20/20 After Show: Blood on the Door

Episode Details

• Title: After Show: Blood on the Door
• Host: Debra Roberts
• Producer: Blue Browning
• Release Date: May 12, 2025
• Description: An in-depth exploration of true crime mysteries, investigative reports, and high-profile stories, enhanced by exclusive interviews and detailed analyses.

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Introduction to a Mother's Quest for Justice

[00:33] Debra Roberts:
Debra Roberts opens the episode by delving into the harrowing true crime story of Joan Barry, a mother whose 21-year-old daughter, Jonna, was tragically stabbed to death while a student at the University of Tennessee. For years, the case remained unsolved, leaving Joan consumed by the search for her daughter's killer and driven to advocate for legal changes to facilitate the resolution of similar crimes.

[01:21] Blue Browning:
Blue Browning, Debra's colleague, shares his inspiration for covering Joan's story: "I saw an interview that she did and I saw the anguish in her voice. This mother had no answers for nearly three years. She basically went on a crusade and it led her to wanting to change the laws in Tennessee."

---

A Mother's Shrine to Her Daughter

Debra and Blue recount their visit to Joan Barry's home in Knoxville, Tennessee, highlighting the poignant memorials Joan has maintained over the past two decades.

[03:17] Joan Barry:
In an emotionally charged moment, Joan shares, "This is Johnna's room. We call it Johnna's room. And I still have her wedding gown. Still have her wedding gown after 20 years."

[03:45] Debra Roberts:
Debra responds with heartfelt admiration, "That's beautiful. It's the dress, her wedding gown, all the beading. Oh, look at the train."

[04:12] Blue Browning:
Blue emphasizes the significance of the mementos: "This was a shrine to her daughter. And I think there was a moment that you asked her a question that really stood with me, that this family, they had been planning that dream wedding. You saw the wedding dress months. A dream wedding. And then they had to make that switch, as you called it, to planning a funeral."

---

Unearthing Memories Through Old Footage

The discussion moves to the challenges of bringing Jonna's memory to life without the abundance of digital media available today.

[05:36] Blue Browning:
Blue explains the investigative process: "I looked online. I didn't see any videos of Jonna anywhere. So I asked her, mom, do you have any home videos? But unfortunately, this was a time period where we didn't have smartphones."

After persistent efforts, Blue secures old VHS tapes from a friend, which were converted and shared with Joan via modern technology.

[06:07] Blue Browning:
He shares, "He actually recorded the VHS tapes and wrote on his phone to me. He showed it to Joan via FaceTime... in a way, this story also brought back more memories for Joan. She's getting to see her daughter in these videos that maybe she would never, never see."

---

Advocacy and Legal Changes: The Power of DNA

Joan Barry's relentless pursuit of justice led her to advocate for changes in Tennessee's DNA laws, a pivotal element in solving cold cases.

[09:06] Blue Browning:
Blue highlights Joan's impact: "She helped change laws. And therefore she has said that this is now her daughter's name is going to live on as a legacy, helping these other cases of other unsolved cases, cold cases."

[09:33] Debra Roberts:
Debra adds, "She got that changed so that that way they would have this pool to be able to draw from because that's why it took so long to find her killer."

Joan's efforts contributed to Tennessee joining 34 states that collect DNA upon felony arrests, revolutionizing the way crimes are solved.

---

Transformation at the Tennessee Bureau of Investigation (TBI) Lab

Debra and Blue visit the Tennessee Bureau of Investigation's DNA lab, now named in honor of Jonna, showcasing advancements made since the time of her murder.

[11:29] Blue Browning:
Blue points out, "Jennifer Millsaps... made the match that led to Joan's daughter's killer. She was there at that moment. They're a lot more efficient, high powered, solving cases a lot faster."

[12:46] Blue Browning:
Discussing the law enforcement community's connection to the case, Blue shares an anecdote: "One of the patrol officers, she had said that she came into the scene and noticed that Johnna's hair when she got there was red. She thought she was a redhead. There was so much blood. And she only later learned that she was as blonde as her later."

---

The Emotional Toll on the Family

The narrative shifts to the profound impact Jonna's murder had on her family, particularly her brothers who had to identify her body.

[16:07] Blue Browning:
Blue explains the family's pain: "Joan had two sons... they had to actually identify their sister's body after the murder because the mom lived in Georgia at the time."

[16:45] Joan Barry:
In a vulnerable moment, Joan reflects, "Jon was on my mind from the time my eyes opened until I fell asleep at night... I have neglected my other children with this... I need to give them support, too, and I need to be the mother that they're used to and have time for them."

Her realization marked a turning point in reconnecting with her surviving children.

---

Legacy of Love and Advocacy

Joan Barry's commitment extends beyond seeking justice for her daughter; she actively engages in empowering others and fostering healing.

[19:13] Blue Browning:
Blue shares Joan's broader impact: "She's even speaking to other victims' families... she recently spoke to some juvenile parolees, about 90 parolees sharing Jona's story in hopes that they will turn their life around."

[21:09] Debra Roberts:
Debra comments on the human spirit: "But when you talk about that part of it, it's more than just the crime. It's about what happens as a result."

[21:15] Blue Browning:
Blue encapsulates the essence of the story: "Human spirit."

---

Closing Reflections

Debra and Blue conclude the episode by reflecting on the profound human connections and resilience demonstrated throughout Joan Barry's journey. They emphasize the transformative power of advocacy and the enduring legacy of a mother's love in the face of unspeakable loss.

[21:32] Blue Browning:
Expressing gratitude, Blue says, "Thank you for covering this. And the human heart that you put behind your coverage of this case, it just... I know it means a lot to the family as well."

---

Key Takeaways

• Joan Barry's Advocacy: Joan's unwavering determination led to significant legal reforms in Tennessee, enhancing the use of DNA in solving crimes.

• Emotional Resilience: Despite immense grief, Joan balanced her advocacy with healing her family relationships, showcasing profound emotional strength.

• Impact on Law Enforcement: The advancements in DNA technology and increased resources at the TBI lab have transformed crime-solving capabilities in Tennessee.

• Legacy and Healing: Joan's story serves as an inspiring testament to the human spirit's capacity to seek justice and foster healing amidst tragedy.

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Notable Quotes with Timestamps:

• Blue Browning [01:42]: "This mother had no answers for nearly three years. She basically went on a crusade..."

• Joan Barry [03:17]: "This is Johnna's room. We call it Johnna's room. And I still have her wedding gown."

• Blue Browning [05:36]: "I looked online. I didn't see any videos of Jonna anywhere. So I asked her, mom, do you have any home videos?"

• Joan Barry [16:45]: "Johnna was the only thing on my mind... I need to give them support, too."

• Blue Browning [19:13]: "She's even speaking to other victims' families... about 90 parolees sharing Jona's story."

---

This episode of the 20/20 After Show: Blood on the Door offers a moving exploration of a mother's quest for justice, the transformative power of advocacy, and the enduring impact of love and resilience in the face of unimaginable loss. Through detailed interviews, personal reflections, and insightful discussions, Debra Roberts and Blue Browning paint a comprehensive and heartfelt portrait of Joan Barry's journey and its broader implications for the community and beyond.

Transcript

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[Debra Roberts]

Hi there, everybody, it's Debra Roberts. And welcome to 20 20, the After Show. Today we're gonna talk a little bit more about the mom who became a warrior to find her daughter's killer. I reported on this story on Friday night's edition of 2020. Joan Barry, whose daughter Jonna was stabbed to death when she was a 21 year old student at UT, the University of Tennessee. There was no suspect and no arrest for years. Just became consumed by this whole thought of who could do something like this, so vicious to her daughter and what laws needed to change to make it a little easier to solve these kinds of crimes. So today we're gonna dig into it and joining me is my colleague, my friend, Blue Browning. Hey, Blue.

[Blue Browning]

Hey. It's so great to be with you, Deborah.

[Debra Roberts]

Oh, good to be with you. And you really are a partner in crime when we come to these stories because you and I have worked on a lot together.

[Blue Browning]

This story was actually somewhere you lived for.

[Debra Roberts]

Yeah, yeah, exactly. University of Tennessee. I didn't go to school there, but I worked in Knoxville and I was so familiar with that area. But how did you wind up thinking about this story and thinking it would work for 2020?

[Blue Browning]

Well, it definitely was Joan and how passionate she was. I saw an interview that she did and I saw the anguish in her voice. But also I was so inspired listening to her. This mother had no answers for nearly three years. She basically went on a crusade and it led her to wanting to change the laws in Tennessee. And she was successful. But she still did not have an answer as to what happened to her daughter, who killed her daughter. But finally, as we saw in the show, there was an answer.

[Debra Roberts]

There was an answer, but it took a very long time. And Blue, you know, this is almost like the two of us when we drive along when you and I are off covering these stories and we're in the car and you and I get to talk about not only the background, but what your thoughts were. My thoughts. So we're kind of like in the car all over again, the two of us.

[Blue Browning]

And I remember you got us on one of the apps and got us turned right back around. We turned off the wrong road, and.

[Debra Roberts]

I just found ways, and we found our way back on. But when I came to you to meet up with you at Joan's home in Tennessee, as I said, I had worked in Knoxville before, and so I felt a connection, in a way, to the community. And even though I didn't know her story to her, and I remember stepping into her doorway and meeting her and her husband, and it was just really striking to me to get just this lovely woman who, you know, was carrying her heartache still in her hand, but also her daughter's presence throughout the house. I mean, mementos everywhere, even though it had been 20 years. So let's take a listen from the show, and we'll talk more about that. I see memories of Jonna everywhere in the house. Right?

[Joan Barry]

Yes. It's a portrait of Johnna that was actually done after she was murdered. These are Jona's little baby shoes.

[Debra Roberts]

They rest here.

[Joan Barry]

That's where they stay here all the time. Yeah. This is Johnna's room. We call it Johnna's room. And I still have her wedding gown. Still have her wedding gown after 20 years. This is it.

[Debra Roberts]

That's beautiful. It's the dress, her wedding gown, all the beading. Oh, look at the train.

[Joan Barry]

She looked beautiful in it. Yes. 20 years old.

[Debra Roberts]

That was such a touching moment to me. And I have to tell you, Blue, when you had described Joan and you said she had all these mementos in the house and she had Jonah's room, I thought it was kind of almost just her tribute to. She can't forget her only daughter, you know?

[Blue Browning]

Exactly. This was a shrine to her daughter. And I think there was a moment that you asked her a question that really stood with me, that this family, they had been planning that dream wedding. You saw the wedding dress months.

[Debra Roberts]

It was only just months away.

[Blue Browning]

Right. A dream wedding. And then they had to make that switch, as you called it, to planning a funeral. And how do you get to that point? So that really stood with me. And I think you probably were deeply moved by this as well. But the nails, the story of the nails.

[Debra Roberts]

Oh, yeah. She did her daughter's nails before she was in the coffin, because she did that kind of thing. But it was like a last little moment that she could give something to her daughter. A last little, you know, sort of gift, I guess, in a way, to daughter, to clean her hands and to do Her. Oh, my God, it broke my heart. And this woman, on the one hand, yes, she's heartbroken, but she's so strong, too. And, you know, one of the things Blue, that people don't necessarily always understand is when we're doing these stories, and this one goes back 20 years. This is before cell phones were just ubiquitous and everybody's taking pictures and you can find them on their social. That didn't happen with Jona because that didn't exist at the time. So you really had to dig to try to find not only the photos, but just, you know, anything that would help bring her to life for us, but also respecting her mom's heartbreak while you're doing it. How do you do that?

[Blue Browning]

It was a quest that we went on, as we do in all these stories. We're going to bring the victims to life. And I looked online. I didn't see any videos of Jonna anywhere. So I asked her, mom, do you have any home videos? But unfortunately, this was a time period where we didn't have smartphones. And I could relate because Jona, she would be the same age today that I am today. And so I remember myself in that timeframe when the murder happened, didn't have smartphones. I asked her, is there anybody that we could reach out to that would have some home videos?

[Debra Roberts]

You came to Joan with this question. Yes.

[Blue Browning]

And she gave me a list of friends names. One was an ex boyfriend's name. And so I reached out to him, and he said, I may have some VHS tapes. I have to look. It took weeks, months before we got it. But I kept pressing him. He ultimately found some VHS tapes that he had to send to me through his smartphone. He actually recorded the VHS tapes and wrote on his phone to me. And so in order to get these, he wanted to make sure that Joan was okay with that. So he showed it to Joan. He did a FaceTime video and showed her the actual video as it was playing out. And I think, in a way, this story also brought back more memories for Joan. She's getting to see her daughter in these videos that maybe she would never, never see. So in a way, I do feel like I'm helping bring bring back more memories of Jonna to her friends and family that had never seen these videos. So we unearthed new videos.

[Debra Roberts]

Yeah. Yeah. And something may be painful, but also maybe comforting to her.

[Blue Browning]

Exactly.

[Debra Roberts]

You've done a lot of this digging and everything, and that's the only way we can paint a picture.

[Blue Browning]

And I think this. This meant a lot for the Friends. The friend who was in this video, Lacey Pope, who we interviewed, she had never seen this video 20 years. So you can imagine the emotion when she saw it. When we interviewed her for the first time seeing this, it really.

[Debra Roberts]

Well, also what was touching, too, is that even though this happened a long time ago, Joan is still a crusader. And DNA was a big part of this story because when the police were investigating, they had unknown DNA. So we're going to take a quick break, and when we come back, we're going to talk about how Joan helped change laws surrounding one of our most powerful crime solving tools, which is DNA.

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[Debra Roberts]

I am back with Blue Browning, one of our producers here at 20 20, who worked with me on this most recent story. Blue, we got into the advocacy that Joan Barry has done around DNA after being so frustrated with the slow progress in the investigation of her daughter Jonna's murder. And of course, in the show we touched on that. But I mean, she so much and continues even still, and people know her, they know her name because she got involved in state government. I mean, she really has become a crusader.

[Blue Browning]

Oh, she has. I think for her more than anything, it was not knowing what happened to her daughter, finding the killer. And as a result of that, she helped change laws. And therefore she has said that this is now her daughter's name is going to live on as a legacy, helping these other cases of other unsolved cases, cold cases. So the DNA laws have changed in Tennessee because of the very work that she's been working on.

[Debra Roberts]

Well, she was so surprised because one of the things she discovered, and if you saw Friday's show, you saw this, that she, you know, at that time in Tennessee and a number of other states, when somebody is arrested, they didn't necessarily collect the DNA only if they were convicted. And so she got that changed so that that way they would have this pool to be able to draw from because that's why it took so long to find her killer. Jonas killer.

[Blue Browning]

Exactly. And she said that you would not know about these laws unless you go through what she had gone through, what these families are going through, where they have a victim, a homicide victim. We did find out that Nowadays there are 34 states where they take DNA upon arrest, upon a felony arrest. And the federal government, not necessarily as a result of Joan or this law, but in the back of my head, as I was going through this story, I thought that was interesting.

[Debra Roberts]

Yeah. And maybe she didn't necessarily lead to those changes, but things started to roll, and her influence in Tennessee and the knowledge of it probably did have ultimately some impact someplace.

[Blue Browning]

And DNA today, as we know, it's changed.

[Debra Roberts]

Changed the whole game.

[Blue Browning]

A bunch of crimes changed the whole game. So this was all new to her, and she was learning. This was not something that she had studied and planned for. It was something that life presented to her, and she. She took it on. She's a warrior.

[Debra Roberts]

She really is. And, I mean, this is a woman who was sort of in the hairdressing field, in the beauty field and all of that. This wasn't her natural inclination, but because of her daughter's death, and we've seen that so many times in these stories, a parent or a relative has to step up and become an advocate. Well, I drove with Joan to go visit the tbi, the Tennessee Bureau of Investigation, to see the DNA lab. And it's named for Jonna. And here's what's interesting. Jennifer Millsaps, who runs that lab, was there at that time, 20 years later. You informed me of that in the car when we were driving, and why that was so significant.

[Blue Browning]

She actually made the match that led to Joan's daughter's killer. She was there at that moment. So I thought that was a huge, pivotal moment. She's still there working at the lab, and she's seen it change from the days of when Jonah was murdered to where it is today and how much progress has been made. The DNA lab used to be backlogged. It would take months, some, you know, weeks to get results from DNA test. It's not like we think of in law and order where you solve a case. Yeah, yeah, this. This took time. And then. So today they have about 17 people that work at the TBI lab, but at the time of the murder, it was only about 2. So you can see the progress that has been made. So now they're a lot more efficient, high powered, solving cases a lot faster.

[Debra Roberts]

Yeah. Yeah. They really have seen A lot of change. And Jennifer was so interesting because she was very matter of fact. You know, she's a lab kind of person. But she said that she was really shaken. I mean, she remembered feeling that she wanted to help solve this murder of this young girl. Everybody in the community was talking about this and so it really impacted her. What about law enforcement? Because you began making calls on this story, you're digging into what was happening at the time. Of course you got these detectives to talk to us, but what did you hear from them about the case?

[Blue Browning]

They all were impacted by this case. The whole Knoxville, Tennessee, they all were impacted by this case. Everybody from the Knox County Sheriff's Office, they said this is one of those case that sits with them. It was such a mystery and also so heartbreaking for them. I think one of the officers really, the gravity of the situation hit me. Her name's Diana Kidd. One of the patrol officers, she had said that she came into the scene and noticed that Johnna's hair when she got there was red. She thought she was a redhead.

[Debra Roberts]

Oh my gosh. Yeah.

[Blue Browning]

There was so much blood. And she only later learned that she was as blonde as her later. So I think these things stuck with the officers who worked on this case. And of course, the detectives have such great respect for Joan. They wanted to participate in these interviews that we did.

[Debra Roberts]

Yeah, yeah. I remember when she talked to me about that and she said she was so shaken up by the whole thing, even though she had to be strong on the job, but she was pretty new to the job and she went home and she had her child and she went to go spend the night with her mom because she was just so shaken up. Because this community, and a lot of times when we do these stories, oftentimes they're in smaller communities and they don't see these kinds of crimes. So you and I talk to people who haven't encountered these kinds of things before. Well, we know that when they are working on these cases, whether they're advocates or, you know, law enforcement, it can take a toll. So we're going to talk more about that, what we learned when we come back.

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[Debra Roberts]

We are back. Blu and I are talking about the case of Jonna Berry, the 21 year old student who was murdered all these years ago and her mom has become an advocate. But blue, one of the things we also discovered, and I certainly talked to her mom about, is that she had two sons also in addition to Johnna, Jona had two brothers and they had to actually identify their sister's body after the murder because the mom lived in Georgia at the time and they had to go and deal with this and it was just awful. In fact, they didn't want to do an interview with me. They didn't want to. It's been so difficult. And that's one of the things I'm proud of. At 20, when we do these stories, it's not just about the crime, it's about the human element, the families, how they were impacted. And you reached out to these guys and they still carry this pain, right?

[Blue Browning]

Well, I asked Joan if the brothers would be willing because I think that was so important, that moment when they go to the hospital. So I did ask Joan, but she had declined on their behalfs because it's such an emotional toll on them. And respectfully we honored that. But it's another example of how this is so difficult sometimes being the surviving siblings.

[Debra Roberts]

Absolute said it can take a toll on these families. And one of the things we like to do on this podcast is we like to give you information and little clips that you didn't hear, we didn't share in the show. So let's hear a clip of our interview with Joan, something that didn't make it into our 2020 program, but it really stuck with us.

[Joan Barry]

Jon was on my mind from the time my eyes opened until I fell asleep at night. And I remember that's just all I thought about or done. And I didn't realize how I had neglected my other children with this. And they never complained about it. They never did. But I was talking with Tim, my oldest son, one day, and he said, oh, mom, forget you have Kelly. And I. So I thought, wow, that is really an eye opener. Because I have essentially just. John has been the only. Johnna's murder was the only thing on my mind, and I have neglected them, and that's not fair to them. It's not. You know, it's not their fault. It wasn't their fault that Jona was murdered, just like it was, you know, none of our faults, but it made me realize that I need to. I need to give them support, too, and I need to be the mother that they're used to and have time for them.

[Debra Roberts]

Such a vulnerable moment. And clearly she had this realization and made some adjustments in her life, right?

[Blue Browning]

Oh, yes. She had told us, you know, even off camera, about the grandchildren in her lives. They call her Nana, and how close they've become and how her grandchildren, in the beginning, they were very cautious and worried that they would make Joan cry by saying Jonah's name. But Joan told us, you know, Jonah's not dead. In her heart, Joan says she likes talking about Jonah and making sure she's not forgotten. And obviously, we saw that in the home. We saw that in the DNA lab, that Jonah's name is everywhere. It's present today.

[Debra Roberts]

Yeah, yeah. And her husband, Jonah's father, wears a picture of her on his shirts. I mean, every day. Every day, every day. And he said he's done that since the very beginning.

[Blue Browning]

He even told us people, you know, were wondering, why, who is this? He's asked that question, and he says, this is my daughter. Proudly says, this is my daughter.

[Debra Roberts]

Yeah, yeah. It's a story. I mean, I have a friend who I had met when I was in Knoxville years ago, who I caught up with for coffee, and she knows this story. I mean, people in that community, Blue, you do so many of these stories, and you and I together have done a lot of them, but some kind of stick with you and haunt you a little bit. How about this one for you?

[Blue Browning]

Of course this one will be there for me. I mean, I'm so touched by Joan. Everybody that met Joan was touched. I think there was one moment when you were interviewing her, and I heard a noise, and I didn't know what it was, and it was actually sniffles from one of the camera guys. So touched by Joan, in her words. She just has that way where when you talk, you lean in a little bit more. She has a vulnerability to her. And I think we all are touched by her. And she even is speaking to other victims families she's helping. Other victims families she's helping. She even said she recently spoke to some juvenile parolees, about 90 parolees sharing Jona's story in hopes that they will turn their life around and think about.

[Debra Roberts]

The human element of who they might have affected. Well, Blue, you do such a great job on these stories. And before we go, I'm just sort of curious what. What motivates you because you find a lot of these stories you pitch this particular one. I mean, what are you looking for when you're digging around for these stories?

[Blue Browning]

I think it is that human connection, that hearing somebody who's experienced something that we don't experience every day. Joan, she was put in such a horrible situation, and she took that. I think you even said some people would ball up and just couldn't go on with life. But she is such an inspiration. The way that she rose above like a phoenix, and she took on. Took on this challenge, and she ultimately was looking for her daughter's killer. Billboards were used. She paid her own money for billboards. She. She helped change the laws, and they ultimately found that killer. So I. I think these are stories that. That stick with a lot of people.

[Debra Roberts]

Yeah, yeah. But when you talk about that part of it, it. It's more than just the crime. It's about what happens as a result.

[Blue Browning]

Human spirit.

[Debra Roberts]

The human spirit. And you were so good at doing that, Blue, maybe it's because you're a Southerner.

[Blue Browning]

Yes.

[Debra Roberts]

Maybe that makes us uniquely qualified to be able to go in and help people sort of process a lot of this. Well, Blu, it was such an important story about what a mom's love can do, and you do such a great job.

[Blue Browning]

Thank you for covering this. And the human heart that you put behind your coverage of this case, it just. I know it means a lot to the family as well.

[Debra Roberts]

It's always a pleasure to work with you. Blue Browning is a producer with 2020, so it's always great. Blue, thanks so much for swinging by. Well, remember to tune in Friday nights at 9 Eastern for all new episodes of 2020, and you can still catch a Bad Romance on Tuesday nights at 9 for a few more weeks. The 2020 after show is produced by Amirah Williams and Sasha Aslanian with Joseph Rhee, Brian Mazersky and Alex Barenfeld of 2020 Theme music by Evan Viola. Janice Johnston is the executive producer of 2020. Josh Cohen is the director of podcasting at ABC Audio. Laura Mayer is the executive producer.

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