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The photos are great, but the one thing you notice about them is it's only the bride and groom. I don't think anybody was there except for the two of them. And whoever performed the services. A widow and a widower. A new start. And it all began a year before Chad Daybell first set eyes on Lori Vallow in October 2018 in St. George, Utah, where they both attended a spiritual conference. This is video from the actual conference where they first met. If you've had this Holy Ghost experience testify to you, you're on the right path. So Lori had always been a fan of Chad's books. And so that's how I first heard about Chad from Lori was she would talk about this author that she was really interested in and really connected with his work. I would describe her as a super fan. In a series of text messages Chad later sends to Laurie, he talks about that fateful meeting. Friday morning, October 26th. Driving south on the freeway, a voice said, you will meet an extraordinary woman today who will change your life forever. He describes how he became infatuated with her, how the two of them were clearly destined to be together. And he writes it almost in the form of a romance novel, using the names James and Elena. When their hands touched, he felt a shock pass through him and his heart started beating fast. Elena was gorgeous and vivacious and James was a little intimidated, yet honored she would talk to him. It appears to be autobiographical, so it does give us a lot of insight into those first days and weeks of the relationship between Chad and Laurie. Chad tells of them meeting at a conference, of them immediately feeling a spark of attraction. And then he proceeds to describe an almost sophomoric, fumbling, first experience ever with lust. Their spirits could not be restrained any longer and a long awaited makeout session took place. This was manifest in the mortal world to James and Elena through a scientific phenomenon known as loin fire. This reads like something that should be hidden under a mattress, you know, by a 17 year old. This all seems like a sweet story. Two people falling for each other. But they've got a problem at this point. They're both married to other people. Laurie's husband was Charles Vallow. I know. She did tell me one time that Charles was accusing her of having an affair. She said it like this. She said, he's accusing me of having an affair, or with Chad Daybell. Charles was Laurie's fourth husband and she was the mother of two children, Colby and Tylee from her previous marriages. Lori Ryan, that was her name then. Talks about her kids when she goes on Wheel of Fortune. I have two beautiful children. Colby, who's seven, and Tylee, who is one. Yeah. What do you guys like to do for fun? We like to play. We play all kinds of sports on our three acres. Okay. Sounds like you have a nice life there. We do. Congratulations. Nice to have you. Lori does not lack for confidence. She was bold enough to get up on stage at a Texas beauty pageant. And here they are, your contestants for Mrs. Texas 2004. Contestant number four, Lori Ryan. In 2004, Lori was recruited to do the pageant and she worked really hard to get in perfect shape. She is Mrs. Hays County. Lori does have stage presence. She did everything beautifully. Tell us who you are, what makes you different. Being a good mom is very important to me and a good wife and a good worker, and being all those things together is not easy. So I'm basically a ticking time bomb. Her marriage sours and Lori alleges her husband has abused both children. Those allegations were investigated but never proven. And Lori Ryan becomes Lori Valo. Charles Vallow, to me, was the best of Lori's husbands. They had been dating and we all liked him. I felt like he was a great husband. I felt like he adored Laurie and that he would go out of his way to make her comfortable, to make her happy. This is a family that blends Lori's daughter Tyler and their adopted son JJ. Lori and Charles take in his nephew JJ as their own. By this time, Tylee is 11. Tyler is the dearest, dearest little girl. Need someone to cuddle with, but you don't have a significant other. Worry no more. She has tough exterior, but she's Got a marshmallow heart. Lori was who Tylee really loved and I think she looked up to her mom. People describe Lori Valo as an extremely loving mother, an extremely fun mother. She was somebody who made her kids the center of her universe. Charles family, including JJ's grandparents were delighted with Charles new family. Charles and Lori adopted JJ and they let us maintain the grandparents role. We loved Lori, I'll tell you that right now. What was JJ like? So funny. Lori did a great job of raising JJ. JJ's autistic and he learned so many things. Every time I went to go visit him, he would be smarter and Smarter. But after 13 years, Charles and Laurie's marriage is falling apart. Charles makes those allegations that Lori is having an affair with with author Chad Dabel and Laurie fires right back. She says that Charles is the one having an affair. So apparently when she discovered the evidence of this alleged affair, she canceled his return flight. He'd been away on a business trip. She and another friend took his truck that was waiting at the airport from the airport and hid it and took all of his clothes and just threw them away. Charles Valo claims his business bank account has been drained. He meets with a divorce attorney and later alleges in his divorce filing and to police that Lori threatened to have him killed and claimed that she has an angel who would dispose of his body. Why don't you come over here. She thinks she's a resurrected being and a kind of. Oh God. She took all the money out of her bank account today. Yesterday with a threat to kill me. As their deadly story rolls on, this would not be the last time the police are called about their family. What is the emergency? What is the emergency? I shot my brother in law screaming and like his face was beet red camera. Please follow me and anybody you stop ladies, you'll end up shopping for your guys deodorant. Right. So try Degree's original Cool Rush. You see last year Degree changed the formula and men were mad. One guy even started a petition. So Degree admitted they messed up and brought the original Cool Rush scent back. It's clean, crisp and actually smells like someone you want to cuddle. And it's in Walmart, Target and other stores now for under $4. So toss one in your cart and find out why it's the best selling men's antiperspirant for the last decade. Degree Cool Rush is back and it smells like victory. Are you ready to rock? Big Savings Rakuten's Big give week is a limited time festival of savings. Just 8 days of epic deals. Earn 15% cash back at Ray Ban, Lego, Adidas and more. Big Give Week is only once a year and the cash back rates are through the roof. Plus, your cash back gets sent directly to your PayPal so you'll feel even better about your purchase. Join for free today and get a $20 welcome bonus. Hurry. Big Give Week ends May 12, and there won't be an encore. Go to rakuten.com or download the Rakuten app. It wasn't that long ago that the Vallows were deeply in love. Now, just months after Lori and Chad Daybell meet, Lori's marriage to Charles is falling apart. They've separated and the children live with Laurie. And one horrible morning, it all comes to a head. Laurie and her brother Alex say there was an argument between the two of them and Charles. What is the emergency? I shot my brother in law. The reason Charles Vallow goes to the house that day to his estranged wife's home, is to pick up his son JJ to take him to school. Now, Alex Cox was there supposedly to make sure this handoff went smoothly. It did not go smoothly. Was he armed also or just. Yeah, he came at me with a bat. Okay, what part of his body is injured in the chest? Okay, is he awake and responsive or unconscious? Unconscious. The 911 operator instructs Alex Cox how to do CPR. Just make sure you're still pressing down at least two inches into his chest and it comes up with each compression. 1, 2, 3. The 911 operator doesn't realize it's already too late for CPR. Charles heart will never beat again. 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10. I'm 97. Can you have the subject on the phone step out of the residence? You know, no weapons. No weapons on me. All right, come on out this way. Chandler Police Department. Anybody inside, make yourself known. Alex Cox is supposedly performing CPR on a guy that has two bullet holes in his chest. But when the police get there, he doesn't appear to have any blood on his body at all. He was just yelling at me. He came at me with a bat. Was he living here or visiting? Alex Cox claims to have suffered a blow to the head from the bat swung by Charles. Yet he declines medical attention. Let me see your head. You got a laceration. You want me to call paramedics? No, I'd really like some water, though. In traumatic situations, everybody reacts differently. But Alex has just killed his brother in law. He's complaining about the weather to responding officers. That's hotter for You. That's layers. Although the officers are at Lori's house, they haven't seen Lori. So wife who lives here, her daughter, her son, they all leave. Her husband has just been killed in her house, but she's taking the kids to Burger King before taking JJ to school in Charles rental car, Chicken fries and the Sprite because that's what he ate every morning because that's the routine and that's what he likes. And she took him to school and then they came back. Hi. Who are you? Okay, just stand over there for just a second, guys. Lori and Tylee coming back to an obvious crime scene, seem remarkably composed. There wasn't any huge outwardly signs of like emotional distress. There wasn't tears, there wasn't anything like that. They seemed pretty put together. Hi, neighbor. Sorry. Lori and Tylee are taken to the police station to give their statements. Alex has driven separately to provide his. No handles on the inside. Yeah, no, that's how those police cars are, you know. When detectives are finally able to sit all involved down at the police station, this trio outlines the story of self defense. They say it all started when Charles came to the house to pick up JJ for school. Everything seemed to be going smoothly at first until Charles went back into the house for a cell phone. He comes back in. I wouldn't give him his phone. He's screaming at me, give him his phone. Okay. So you, you hear the argument. You step out. What's the first thing that you see? Charles chasing after Lori Nellen. Okay. I shoved him back. Okay. I said, what are you doing? Because he's coming at her aggressively. Okay. He's a big dude, so I wasn't gonna. He's not gonna hurt my sister. They say things escalate Even further when 16 year old Tyler hears the argument and gets involved immediately. Just jumped up and I grabbed my baseline bat and I opened the door. I don't know if she swung at him or what, but he like grabbed a bat from Tylee and then went to hit Tyler with the bat. They paint a picture of Charlie Charles Vallow as threatening, furious. He was screaming at me. Screaming and like his face was beet red. He came at me. You shot him? Yep. Okay. Alex says he shot him in self defense. I didn't believe that at all. Why not? Not one bit. I think Laurie and Alex had conspired to kill Charles. When he was gonna come pick up jj, he told me I didn't have any. I said, how are you feeling? He said, mom, I feel terrible, but I'd do Anything to protect Lori and Tyler. In the months before his death, Charles had reached out to Lori's family with concerns about her mental state. Charles had called me and he said, I'm at my end of the rope. I don't know what else to do. Charles called and he said, janice, Lori's crazy. She's gone crazy. Lori's mindset was off. It was definitely off. And she goes, you think I'm crazy, don't you? I was like, I don't know if you're crazy, but what you're telling me is not normal and this is not happening to you. And from that point, she tried to cut everything off with me. Adam tried to help. He worked with Charles to plan an intervention. Well, what can I do to help? He goes, well, you're the closest one to her. You're the only one that probably would be able to talk to her. Tragically, their plans were cut short with Charles death. Remember, Charles also called the police to his house and told them he feared for his life. What did she say yesterday? She said, you're not Charles. I don't know who you are, what you did with Charles, but I can murder you now with my powers. So she's speaking as a spiritual being. She's psychologically, she's gone. Something's happened to her. Turns out all the things that Charles told me were true. Charles had never been violent with anybody. So you kind of start getting a bigger picture of this. Just doesn't feel right. As of right now, there's no crime. Both of us have driven people home after interviews and this would be at the top of bizarre for me. The whole kind of the odd part about it was just the, the complete lack of emotion. It was a very nonchalant. Lori had a big smile on her face. A case like this isn't a sprint, it's a marathon. The case is just beginning. Just weeks after her husband Charles is killed, Lori packs up and moves to Chad Dabel's town of Rexburg, Idaho. Chad Dabel was gathering people to Rexburg. He said, this is where you need to be. They were actively preparing for the end that was inevitably coming very soon. Just nine months after meeting Chad Dabel at a conference, Lori's husband Charles is dead and she's ready to move her kids to Chad's small town of Rexburg, Idaho. Chad Dabel was really a soft spoken, doughy, middle aged, side hustle prophet. But there was just something about the two of them that they seemed to recognize in each other. I'm going to be A little emotional because I see this as the beginning of a great group that is going to save thousands of lives. But while Lori has just become a widow, Chad is still married, and he and his wife Tammy had spent most of their marriage in Utah. His books are all about the end of times and dying. His visions deal with dying. And when Chad lived in Springville, Utah, he was a grave digger. I was working for Springville City as their cemetery sexton. And you just don't get any closer to the ground than that. A few years ago, Chad wrote his autobiography, and it gives you a glimpse of the way this guy thinks and what he believes. In his memoir, Chad Dabel writes, my torn veil allows information to be downloaded into my brain from the other side. The scenes I'm shown are real events that will happen. I've seen some horrible scenes. Brother against brother, even just fighting for food and trying to survive. Police documents show text messages during this time between Chad and Lori where they talk about dark spirits and zombies and demonic entities, particularly related to jj. It sounds like what you're describing is a slow change. That is exactly what happened. And then I think when Lori started seeing Chad, I think then that's when the lying started. Lori and Chad, together, they just feed off of each other. They were actively preparing for the end that was inevitably coming very soon. Storing medical supplies, storing food, water, all the things that you would need if you weren't able to access them. Their mission right now is to gather the 144,000 that will be left here on Earth after the doomsday being July 2020. He was gathering people to Rexburg. Chad Daybell had moved his family from Utah to Rexburg in 2015 after what he said was a spiritual calling. A voice told me, you are going to live here soon. And I was shocked, actually. I had no idea I was going to move to begin the great gathering in this area. They were moving there because Chad Daybell said, this is where you need to be. Within seven days of Lori moving to Rexburg, she takes a trip to Yellowstone park with Tylee, JJ and her brother Alex. Authorities say no one ever saw Tylee again after that point. After that very last photo with Alex and jj, JJ disappears two weeks after that. Last seen in this photograph wearing a pair of red pajamas, which was later released by police. Lori allegedly tells houseguests that JJ is acting up. So Lori's brother Alex picks him up in the middle of the night and drives him away. And then JJ's never seen again. The family's getting smaller and smaller. Charles is gone, the children are gone. What's next? He's not breathing, he said. I think I am being their fall guy and I'm like the fall guy for what this message comes from Greenlight Ready to start talking to your kids about financial literacy? Meet Greenlight, the debit card and money app that teaches kids and teens how to earn, save, spend, spend wisely and invest with your guardrails in place. With Greenlight, you can send money to kids quickly, set up chores, automate allowance and keep an eye on your kids spending with real time notifications. Join millions of parents and kids building healthy financial habits together on Greenlight. Get started risk free@greenlight.com Spotify Ryan Reynolds here from Mint Mobile with a message for everyone paying Big Wireless Way too much. Please, for the love of everything good in this world, stop. With Mint. You can get premium wireless for just $15 a month. Of course, if you enjoy overpaying, no judgments. But that's weird. Okay, one judgment anyway. Give it a try@mintmobile.com Switch upfront payment of $45 for three month plan equivalent to $15 per month required intro rate first three months only, then full price plan options available, taxes and fees extra. See full terms@mintmobile.com Chad and Lori are completely infatuated with each other and the body count around them is growing. But at least for now, Chad is still married to his wife of almost 30 years, the mother of his five children, Tammy Daybell, a school librarian. Facebook photos show Chad and Tammy as a happy couple. Tammy is a real spitfire, though she had a mind of her own and she was not one that was easily walked on. Chad is still married to his wife, Tammy, and Chad sends Laurie this ominous text message. Every few weeks I get to escape and have amazing adventures with my goddess lover, but then I have to return to my place under the stairs feeling trapped. But I sense permanent freedom is coming. Permanent freedom from his marriage. Then, in October 2019, Tammy is confronted by a stranger in her own Driveway. She calls 911 to report the incident. I was getting stuff out of the backseat of my car and suddenly he was there and he had a paintball gun and he was okay and he was going to shoot at me and then he just kept doing it. So I yelled for my husband and then he took off running around the back of my house. In the 911 call, Tammy describes the gunman's weapon as a paintball gun, but authorities now believe it was an automatic weapon. Just 10 days later, Tammy dies, according to her Obituary. She passed away peacefully in her sleep of natural causes. And two weeks after that, Chad and Lori are on that beach in Hawaii with rings purchased before Tammy died. Their marriage is beginning and they are preparing for the end of the world. Lori's 7 year old son JJ isn't there. Neither is her 16 year old daughter Tylee. Not at the wedding, not in Hawaii. The thing I think about it is I think that they really believed that they were going to get away with whatever plan they had. Authorities determine Laurie's brother Alex seems bound up in all the beliefs and mysteries. When Laurie started listening to these podcasts, she was telling Alex, you know about these books, read these books. And Alex being a truck driver, he had all this time, so he went on the overboard too. Eight hours of nothing but listening to books or listening to these podcasts. Authorities say his cell phone records show he's at Chad's house there in Rexburg, just hours before that gunman confronts Tammy. And authorities determine he's there again the night Tammy dies. And Alex makes a point of getting Chad's patriarchal blessing when he wants to get married to his girlfriend, Zulemma Pastenis. Zulema is a spiritual woman and life coach. What is your emergency? I have a older male here named Alex. He's. He just passed out here on my bathroom. Till death do us part came a little earlier than expected. Just two weeks after getting married, Alex Cox collapses in the upstairs bathroom of his new bride's home. Is he awake right now? He's passed out. Zulema's 25 year old son Joseph is the one calling 911. Alex. Alex. He's not breathing. Paramedics arrive and rush Alex to the hospital where he's pronounced dead. He's only 51 years old. No one will ever be able to ask Alex what he was doing at Chad's house the night Tammy died or about the disappearance of JJ or Tylee. And police are trying to find the truth about how he died. Zulema told police that Alex was suffering from shortness of breath. And the night before he died, she'd urged him to go to the doctor, but said that Alex had refused. Ultimately, the medical examiner would determine that Alex Cox died by natural causes. Sadly, regarding Alex and Zulema, I didn't know they were married until after he died. We had him cremated, which were his wishes, and we had a service for him and we didn't invite anyone to his service that believed he was a murderer. So it was a very small, precious group of us who loved him. Alex's widow, Zulema, wants to know what happened to her husband. After Alex's death. Zulema met with the Chandler police. And she had some really interesting things to say about Alex's last days. One day or two days before he passed, he said to me, zulema, if anything happens to me, I want you to know that there is money in a bag in the closet and it's for you. Did you ask him, like, why would anything ever happen to, to you? Was that an odd statement that he had made? I did. I said, I said, don't say things like that, Alex. I said, why would you say something like that? And then he said, just in case. Meanwhile, Rexburg police at this point take a trip down to Utah to this cemetery where they are going to exhume the body of Tammy Davel. They're in the process of reexamining everyone and everything with a connection to Chad. And the day Alex is speaking about something possibly happening to him, it's the same day Tammy Dabel's body is being exhumed. But I thought that if they had been doing something, if he had done anything, Alex would probably tell me. So that's why I pressured him. Like, would you have anything to do with this? Like, if they assume this body, is he gonna find anything? Did you have anything to do with this? And he said no. I press for another answer and he tells me no. Right? That's when he said, I think I am being their fall guy. And I'm like the fall guy for what? When is it? Tell me, what is it that they're trying to pin on you? What did they do? And he just wouldn't say anything else. And that's when he tells me, either I am a man of God or I am not. In a story that has an awful lot of bizarre coincidences, I think Alex's natural death is something that people struggle with in particular. Particular. It seems so improbable that this 51 year old man suddenly dropped dead. And after Alex's funeral, Chad and Lori returned to where they were married. Hawaii. Give us one piece of information. But Tyler and JJ aren't with them. They're still missing. Chad. Lori, can you tell me where your kids are? And the questions for the couple are getting louder and louder now. Two authorities intensifying their search for two missing children in Idaho. Would you tell me what happened to jj? You know, the grandparents are very worried. Lori, tell us where your kids are. Police, along with the FBI issue a press release. The announcing that JJ and Tylee are missing and endangered children. And that is when the story goes national. Now, two authorities intensifying their search for two missing children in Idaho. First two missing children and now their mother and her husband are both believed to be on the run by the time the nation is searching for them. JJ and Tylee haven't been seen for three months. New developments involving missing siblings from Idaho. Their mother, but not the children, has been found by authorities in Hawaii. Would you tell me what happened to jj? You know, the grandparents are very worried. There's intense media focus. And meanwhile, Chad and Lori have escaped all of this. They are on a beach in Hawaii, seemingly completely oblivious to the welfare of the kids. Lori is served with a court order telling her she's got to produce JJ and Tylee within five days. The deadline comes and goes without a peep from Lori. They gave that mother until tonight to reveal her children's whereabouts. Lori, tell us where your kids are. Everybody wants to know now. It's been five months since JJ was last seen. You tell us JJ is safe. That's really all anyone wants to know. And finally, Lori is arrested. Lori Valo was taken into custody without any incident by detectives of the Kauai Police Department. Lori is charged with two felony counts of desertion and non support of dependent children, and she is held on $5 million bond. Those charges are eventually dropped. But a few days later, after Lori's arrest, ABC News correspondent Marcus Moore tracks Chad down. Is there anything that you would like to say to people at all who are, number one, concerned about the kids or concerned about you and your wife? Anything at all you want to say to them? Grateful for any support? We just have to wait for the legal facets to orchestrate. And can you tell me, Mr. Daybell, are the kids. Are the kids okay? Okay. Authorities continue their search for the children. They discover that the day Tylee was last seen, Lori's brother Alex's phone pinged first at Lori's apartment, then on Chad's property. And the cell phone data tells them more about JJ's disappearance. Alex's cell phone once again pings in Chad Daybell's backyard. After figuring all this out, placing Alex behind Chad's home on key dates and times, the authorities execute a search warrant on Chad's property. The FBI gridded off areas, and then they started peeling away the layers. Underneath the white rocks was some thin wood paneling. As soon as they removed the paneling, I could smell the odor of a decomposing body. It was a what appeared to be a small Body tightly wrapped in black plastic, covered in duct tape. One of the investigators recognizes the hair and thinks it may well be jj. They say the body is wearing red pajamas. So then you move on to another section of the property. There was a melted green bucket. It appeared that the burnt flesh had been placed in. Under the bucket was a partial human skull. Those remains were later identified through dental records as matching Tylee. So as the police and the FBI are digging up Chad's property, guess who calls Chad from jail? It's Lori. This is a fascinating phone call to listen to. Are you okay? Should I try to call you later? I don't know. You can try. Yeah. I'll answer if I can. Okay. I love you and I'll talk soon. Okay, baby? I love you. Okay. Love you. Good night. Moments later, Chad is arrested. The day after JJ and Tylee's bodies were found, Lori's family releases a statement. And it read, in part, the family has maintained a strong hope and belief that they were alive and well. The family expresses their deep and abiding love for JJ and Tylee. Nearly a year after the bodies of JJ and Tylee were found, Lori and Chad were charged with their murders. A grand jury has indicted Lori and Chad Daybell in connection to the killing of Lori's daughter and son. The results of the exhumation of Chad's wife Tammy showed that she was killed, asphyxiated. And the medical examiner says bruising on Tammy's arms suggests that she was restrained around the time of her death. Lori and Chad are both charged with conspiracy to commit her murder, and Chad is charged with murder as well. Lori's brother Alex Cox is named in the indictment for Lori and Chad's arrest as a co conspirator in the deaths of jj, Tylee and Tammy. But of course, since he's dead, he can't be tried. Chad and Lori are both tried separately, and both of their lawyers seem to have the same idea to point the finger at the other one. After initial questions about Lori's mental state, she's determined to be mentally competent to face trial. Lori's defense attorney is Jim Archambauld. So quite a remarkable change. The people who knew Lori. One year after meeting Chad, four people are dead. Chad's defense attorney, John Pryor, says she lured him into a love affair. This beautiful, vivacious woman, very sexual person and very manipulative, and she knows how to get what she wants. And she drove through Chad to email into a relationship. But both seem more than happy to point the finger at Alex Cox. First, Chad's defense attorney, Alex Cox would do anything and everything to protect, aid and assist Lori Vallon whenever her endeavors. Lori's lawyer blames Alex and Chad, saying Lori never went near Chad's yard. Remember all the GPS data? Lori's not there. Laurie's not in the backyard when Chad and Alex are. She's not coming and going to Chad's property. On those days, Lori Vallow and Chad Dabell face separate juries who need to decide. All right, please. Is only one to blame, or are these the sort of monsters who would kill innocent children? Is Chad Guy Dabel Lori Noreen Vallo not guilty or guilty of first degree murder of Tyler Ryan? This episode is brought to you by Enterprise Mobility. From fleet management to flexible truck rentals to technology solutions, Enterprise Mobility helps businesses find the right mobility solutions so they can find new opportunities. Because if your business is on the road, they want to make sure it's on the road to success. Enterprise Mobility moving you moves the world. Find your road@enterprise mobility.com this episode is brought to you by Factor. Optimize your nutrition this year with Factor America's number one ready to eat meal service. Factor's fresh. Never frozen meals are dietitian approved. Ready to eat in just two minutes, choose from 40 weekly options across eight dietary preferences like calorie smart, protein plus and keto eat smarter at FactorMeals.com listen50 and use code listen50 for 50% off plus free shipping on your first box. FactorMeals.com listen50 code listen50 T's and C's apply. Please rise. I'm going to have the clerk read the verdict. Is Chad Guy Dabel Lori Nerine Vallow not guilty or guilty? Two juries deliberate. Did Chad Daybell and Lori Valow murder her children Tyler and jj and conspire to murder Chad's wife Tammy? And did Chad murder Tammy? Guilty. Guilty. Guilty. Jj, say hi. I want to personally thank and I want to personally hug every one of those jurors. Laurie is sentenced to three consecutive life sentences without the possibility of parole. Chad Dabel is sentenced to death and is transferred to a maximum security prison in Idaho to await execution. Now, when given the opportunity to speak, this author and public speaker has surprisingly little to say. Is there any statement you would like to make? No. Unlike her husband, Lori takes full advantage of her opportunity to address the court. Jesus Christ knows that no one was murdered in this case. Accidental deaths happen. Suicides happen. Fatal side effects from medications happen. Soon after their convictions, both Lori and Chad file notices of appeal with The Idaho Supreme Court. The cases are still ongoing. Lori's claim that no one was murdered. Her surviving son, Kobe Ryan, does a jailhouse interview with her over the phone for his podcast, the Scar Wars. What if tightly holding JJ down for too long, trying to get him to not scream and be loud in the apartment, which she was. Was always upset about. What if she held him down too long and realized afterwards what she had done? You're telling me that Tyler took JJ's life and then took her own life on accident? Kobe says that phone call was the first time he's spoken to his mom in four years, and he doesn't believe it. That's not the truth. And I guess I have to accept how delusional my mom is. But the past. It's not done. Catching up with Lori. Arizona is waiting for her. Convicted killer Lori Valo Daybell is set to face new charges in Arizona. Her new trial is for conspiracy to murder her former husband, Charles, with her brother Alex. She pleads not guilty. The Maricopa County Attorney's office isn't charging Chad Daybell, saying there's no reasonable likelihood of conviction. After being judgmentally competent, Laurie decides to serve as her own lawyer. There are serious disadvantages and dangers to representing yourself. Can you just tell me a little bit why you want to represent yourself? Yes, you, Honor. For the past five years that I've been incarcerated, I have taken upon myself to study case law and criminal rules of procedure. And I have real trial experience. I have participated in three different full trials from beginning to end. Her lines of questioning vary, like a discussion with her brother about the last time they saw each other and were we eating my green chili chicken enchiladas. Do not remember that. You do not remember that? Nope. Is that why I made every time we had a family get together, which was like, 10 times a year? I don't remember that. Okay. An exchange with a woman that Charles Valo had dated. So you spent your whole date getting to know each other talking about me? Don't flatter yourself. No, we did not spend the whole time talking about you. There's a famous saying, a person who represents themselves has a fool for a client. And no truer words can be said in this case. You can't disassociate yourself from the passionate plea of your case. The state did not show you evidence of an agreement to commit murder. They showed you evidence of a family tragedy, and then they showed you the sad effects of a family torn apart because of that tragedy. In contrast, the prosecution presents a clear clinical list of the facts of the case as they see them. There is no reason that Alex Cox came over to this defendant's house with a loaded gun. That is conspiracy. That is planning. That is premeditated. It takes the jury just three hours to reach a verdict. Guilty. In the space of five months, four lives ended. Happy family. Two of them still just children. How do you remember them now? All my memories of them are good. Laughing, running around, chasing JJ around, playing games with Tyler. All those memories are all good. I don't remember one bad memory or even about their deaths. I don't know if I block that completely out because I just. I'm focusing on the good things that I remember. What Chad and Lori can't take from us is our memories. They can't take that. They can't destroy it. The Caner races it. Our memories are what we have. This episode is brought to you by Progressive Insurance. It's Brad Milkey, host of ABC's Daily News podcast. Start here. Fiscally responsible financial geniuses, monetary magicians. These are things people say about drivers who switch their car insurance to progressive and save Hundreds. The Visit progressive.com to see if you could save Progressive Casualty Insurance Company and affiliates. Potential savings will vary. Not available in all states or situations.