The After Show: Cold Cases - Baby Holly and Yogurt Shop Murders

Summary

20/20 After Show: Cold Cases – Baby Holly and Yogurt Shop Murders

Podcast: 20/20 (ABC News)
Episode Date: July 6, 2026
Host: Deborah Roberts
Guest: Mindy Montfort (Founder, Cold Case & Missing Persons Unit, Texas Attorney General's Office)

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Episode Overview

In this gripping After Show, host Deborah Roberts sits down with acclaimed prosecutor and cold case specialist Mindy Montfort. The discussion delves into the motivations, challenges, and breakthroughs surrounding some of America's most high-profile cold cases—most notably, the mysterious disappearance of "Baby Holly" and the infamous Austin Yogurt Shop Murders. Mindy shares insider perspectives on re-opening decades-old cases, the evolving role of forensic technology, and the emotional toll these investigations take on everyone involved.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

Mindy’s Motivation and Background

• Personal Drive

  • Mindy Montfort explains how her early career in prosecution was rooted in a desire to help victims, especially those unable to speak for themselves (e.g., in murder or sexual assault cases).
    • "I always felt that there were people who needed someone to represent them and to walk them through this very scary system and to be their voice, especially in a sexual assault case or a murder case where the victim just has a hard time or can't speak for themselves." — Mindy Montfort [02:01]
  • The move to cold cases was motivated by a sense of injustice: "Somebody got away with this and they were never held accountable. And these families deserve answers..." — Mindy Montfort [02:30]

• Unique Perspective as a Woman in the Field

  • Acknowledgement that she's one of few women in her role, bringing a different perspective and commitment to justice.

The Baby Holly Case

• Breakthrough Moment

  • Mindy recounts the powerful scene of revealing Baby Holly’s true identity to her after 40 years.
    • "Being able to be there when we gave Holly her identity in person...that was just an amazing moment. And I think that's why you keep doing the work you do." — Mindy Montfort [03:21]
  • She highlights the importance of not just delivering justice, but letting families know that their case isn't forgotten.

• On “Closure”

  • Both Deborah and Mindy agree families rarely feel true closure—answers may bring "peace," but not closure.
    • "Maybe they're able to sort of move forward a little bit because they do have some answers, but they never do have closure." — Deborah Roberts [04:32]

Cold Case Methodology

• How Cases Emerge

  • Cases often "find" the unit through families reaching out when local police stall, not thru random selection.
    • "The cases sort of find you. These families come to you, especially in the Attorney General's office." — Mindy Montfort [04:58]

• Working with Local Law Enforcement

  • They augment, not replace, local efforts: offering resources, technology, and funding that some departments lack.

• Approach to Investigation

  • Prefer starting investigations “from scratch” (page one), to avoid prior tunnel vision and bring fresh perspectives.
    • "The good ones take it from page one. And we actually tell our investigators to not really go and have in depth conversations with the previous investigators because we want them to come in with a fresh eye." — Mindy Montfort [06:11]

• Importance of Context

  • Investigators must immerse themselves in the era of the crime, considering technology and societal differences (e.g., reliance on payphones in the 1990s).
    • "You have to really put yourself into the year and remember what that year was like when you start reviewing a case." — Mindy Montfort [07:05]

Yogurt Shop Murders

• Personal and Professional Toll

  • The emotional toll is real. Mindy admits to losing sleep over the case, haunted by what might be missed.
    • "I do not think I slept a full night without thinking about yogurt shop until we got Robert." — Mindy Montfort [09:43]

• Breakthrough via Technology

  • Austin detective Dan Jackson’s idea to re-enter cartridge shell casings into the national database was pivotal.
    • "Dan is the one who said, we're going to re enter our .380 shell casing because technology has improved. Let's re enter this in the national database system and see if we might get a hit. And he had it. Within hours, he uploaded that, and then within hours we had this hit to this Kentucky case." — Mindy Montfort [10:57]
  • Subsequent DNA testing linked the evidence to Robert Brashear, confirming long-held suspicions.

• Collaboration and Learning

  • Every cold case teaches something new, especially regarding the complexities of DNA evidence and lab work.
    • "Every time we do one of these cases, we learn something more about DNA. It's so confusing, it's mind boggling. But the labs are so patient with you because they'll say, no, no, there's no such thing as a stupid question." — Mindy Montfort [12:34]
  • Importance of inter-agency cooperation, including forensic genealogists and even, occasionally, psychics if credible leads run dry.

Notions of “Justice” in Cold Cases

• Justice Means Different Things
  • Sometimes justice is prosecution; other times, it’s simply knowing the truth or seeing consistent effort.
    • "Justice to me is trying to find the answer again...Maybe you'll never prosecute that person...But you're going to at least know maybe what happened to your loved one." — Mindy Montfort [15:18]

Advice for Women and Final Thoughts

• Advice to Young Women

  • Be vigilant, trust your gut, and speak up if something feels wrong.
    • "If your gut is telling you something's not right, you know, don't be afraid to call the police or to call a friend or to, you know, turn the light on or to get the heck out of there, whatever it is, whatever situation you're in." — Mindy Montfort [16:37]
  • Emphasizes situational awareness and traveling in pairs.

• Impact of True Crime Cases

  • Mindy jokes about living in a “police report” given all she’s seen, and stresses that while such crimes are rarer than they seem, vigilance remains important.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On the Emotional Strength of Families:
  "People just want to know you haven't forgotten them, that you're working the case..." — Mindy Montfort [03:21]

• On the Difficulty of Cold Case Work:
  "I don't think I slept a full night without thinking about yogurt shop until we got Robert." — Mindy Montfort [09:43]

• On the Role of Technology:
  "Let's re enter this in the national database system and see if we might get a hit...within hours we had this hit to this Kentucky case." — Mindy Montfort [10:57]

• On Seeking Unconventional Help (Including Psychics):
  "When you are at a dead end, you will listen to anybody if it sounds somewhat credible." — Mindy Montfort [13:31]

• On Justice:
  "Justice to me is trying to find the answer again...Maybe you'll never prosecute that person...But you're going to at least know maybe what happened to your loved one." — Mindy Montfort [15:18]

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Timestamps of Important Segments

• 00:00 – Deborah’s energetic intro and overview of cold case themes
• 01:24 – Mindy’s background and motivation for prosecutorial work
• 03:21 – Reflections on the Baby Holly investigation and giving “answers” to families
• 04:58 – How cold cases are chosen and Mindy’s approach to casework
• 06:11 – Importance of starting from scratch and considering historical context
• 09:43 – The toll these cases take on investigators
• 10:57 – Detailed account of the Yogurt Shop Murders’ breakthrough
• 12:34 – Lessons learned and the evolving science of DNA
• 13:31 – Openness to unconventional sources of information, including psychics
• 15:18 – Philosophical take on “justice” in cold cases
• 16:37 – Mindy’s advice for women and final thoughts on vigilance

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Tone & Conclusion

The conversation is candid, empathetic, and pragmatic. Mindy’s southern warmth balances the gravity of the subject matter. Both women acknowledge the pain, complexity, and persistence required in cold case work, ultimately stressing the value of unwavering advocacy for victims and the solace that even imperfect answers bring to families.

Final words:
"Just to be vigilant and to know your surroundings and I think to travel in pairs, I think that's always a good piece of advice." — Mindy Montfort [17:24]

Transcript

[Deborah Roberts]

And we're live on Matchday as Doug reaches for a buffalo wing. He's got it. Oh, and he's gone for a can of Pepsi, too. What a finish. There's no doubt about it. It just tastes better. Match Days deserve Pepsi. Hi there, Everybody. Welcome to 2020 the After Show. I'm Deborah Roberts, and as always, it is a pleasure to have you here with us. As you know, we often dig deeply into some of the episodes we've covered on 2020. And many times somebody surfaces from those episodes who just really leaves us thinking and wanting to know more. I mean, if you've ever wondered what it takes to solve some of the country's most notorious cold cases, well, today we're going to tell you a little bit more about that because we've got one of the keenest minds here with us, Mindy Montfort, who has dedicated her career to delivering justice to crime victims and their families. And she's here to tell us a little bit about her at the Cold Case and Missing Persons Unit in the Texas Attorney General's office and has been a big part of some of the Most talked about 2020 stories over the years, including baby Holly, that investigation you may remember, most recently the yogurt shop murders. She's going to talk to us a little bit about how she zeroes in on all of those cases and what she's learned along the way. So, Mindy, I don't want to hear any of that aw, shucks kind of Southern thing, and we're both Southern gals. But, honey, you have, you have.

[Mindy Montfort]

I was going to just say, go on, go on.

[Deborah Roberts]

Okay, go on some more. Go on some more. Why not? Why? Well, clearly, clearly you find satisfaction, as difficult as it can be, you find great satisfaction in your work. And you're one of few women around the country who does what you do. Give me a sense, first of all, as a woman, and you've been on both sides of the aisle, you've been a prosecutor, you've been a defense lawyer. You've seen sort of the court system from every angle and also detective work from every angle. What is it that just motivates you to keep going when you are sometimes dealing with very gruesome, brutal situations?

[Mindy Montfort]

You know, I think I got into the area of prosecution because I always felt that there were people who needed someone to represent them and to walk them through this very scary system and to be their voice, especially in a sexual assault case or a murder case where the victim just has a hard time or can't speak for themselves. And I wanted to be that voice, and I wanted to. To be able to make sure that we're safe. I think I just had that instilled in me when I got into the cold case work. It was more about injustice, that, wait a minute, somebody got away with this and they were never held accountable. And these families deserve answers, and I would want those answers. That's kind of what led me to really have a passion for the cold

[Deborah Roberts]

case world and to kind of motivate you. Well, as I said, you have worked with us on some of the cold cases that we've covered. As I said, the, the case of Holly Marie, who was called the Baby Holly story, because the case goes to when she was a child and she had been missing for about 40 years. It was suspected. Tell me, take us back to that case. Because it was suspected that her parents, Dean and Tina Clouse, were murdered. And it was just a very intense story. My colleague David Muir covered this story and people were talking about it for a very, very long time. What still sticks with you from that particular story and case?

[Mindy Montfort]

Being able to be there when we gave Holly her identity in person, you know, right there at that moment, that's just. You can never relive that. And that was just an amazing moment. And I think that's why you keep doing the work you do. You know, you mentioned. Well, it's so heinous and the crime scenes, they weigh on you and the trials. Yes, but then you have those moments and then, you know, going and talking to the families in yogurt shop and delivering the information they've wanted and waited on for so long and bringing that, you know, maybe not justice, but it's answers. Maybe it's peace. They'll tell you it's not closure. Yeah, but, but it's, it's something. It's an answer. And, you know, the other thing is, I think that people just want to know you haven't forgotten them, that you're working the case. So that, that was what was amazing about Holly is she didn't even know we were working on the case.

[Deborah Roberts]

You know, she didn't know.

[Mindy Montfort]

She had this right, this, this story. That was a question in her mind. And when we showed her the photo of, of her parents, because she asked to see it, that, that, that moment was amazing. The look on her face. And that's when she's teared up and got emotional.

[Deborah Roberts]

Yeah, I remember that. You raise a very good point, though. And I'm reluctant to say closure in our stories because every Family member has said to me, they never have closure. Maybe they're able to sort of move forward a little bit because they do have some answers, but they never do have closure. Give me a sense of when you're talking about cold cases, I mean, there's so many out there. What you. To sort of pick and choose cases and what draws you to them.

[Mindy Montfort]

There's no place to just throw in a dart and starting. I think the cases sort of find you. These families come to you, especially in the Attorney General's office. They would come and say, look, we know that this police department has done a great job, but they're just sort of in a holding pattern. Do you all think there's something else you could do with it? And we definitely don't come in and try to grade papers of the detectives that were there before because a lot of them have done incredible police work. It's just they're at a dead end. And so, you know, I think what we can do is offer resources. A lot of these departments don't have full time cold case investigators. They definitely don't have the money to do DNA testing. And so when you have a bigger agency that has access to state funding and then also grant funding, we're able to pass that on and help these agencies with their cases.

[Deborah Roberts]

Yeah, yeah. Because you can bring in so much more. And sometimes when you're thinking about modern technology, those things are very pricey. You're right. And you're talking small towns oftentimes. Right. And small police departments. Well, do you typically start off where they left off, or do you often just sort of start from scratch? Like, let's go back to the beginning or. I'm assuming that it depends on what case you're looking at.

[Mindy Montfort]

It does, but I've always been. And again, I'm not an investigator. I'm, you know, an attorney. But in dealing with the investigators, I think the good ones take it from page one. And we actually tell our investigators to not really go and have in depth conversations with the previous investigators because we want them to come in with a fresh eye. Tunnel vision. That's right. And start from page one. And they usually start and they go through the entire report before they make any conclusions. And then they'll do an evidence chart, an evidence log, which is painful. They hate doing them. But they're so important because you've got to figure out what. What do you have left? You know, that you can test in today's world that you couldn't back then. And that's another Great point. I think you've got to remember that a lot of these cases, you know, we'll say, we'll catch ourselves saying, well, I mean, why didn't they just call somebody with a cell phone?

[Deborah Roberts]

Right, right back then? That wasn't, that wasn't part of the technology deal.

[Mindy Montfort]

Right. You're going to need a pay phone or you're going to need a landline. And so you have to really put yourself into the year and remember what that year was like when you start reviewing a case.

[Deborah Roberts]

Yeah. When we're working on our stories for 2020, as you often have to go back and sort of, you know, visualize that for people and remind you that there was a payphone involved or the conveniences that we look at now just were not possible in the 1990s and so forth. So you have to transport yourself in some ways. Mindy, don't go anywhere because I want to talk more about that. We'll be right back.

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[Deborah Roberts]

Welcome back to 2020 the After Show. I am joined today by Mindy Montfort. Who founded the cold case and missing persons unit in the Texas attorney general's office. And she's giving us a. They do their work. I'm really curious about what kind of a toll it takes, because, you know, when you think about immersing yourself in these cases, and as I said, you know, they're difficult cases. You sometimes. You work on them for many, many years. You're dealing with family members who are also heartbroken and maybe sometimes skeptical of the system. I know it takes a toll on them, but what about on you when you're. When you're working these cases?

[Mindy Montfort]

You know, Deborah, I do not think I slept a full night without thinking about yogurt shop until we got Robert.

[Deborah Roberts]

Really? Since you. Since you took the case off.

[Mindy Montfort]

Yeah, I. I think there's all. And if it. Maybe. Maybe it wouldn't be about yogurt. But I go to bed and think, what are we missing on this one? Or, you know, there'd be a case that I had just been reviewing. And I'm thinking at night, there's got to be something we need to be testing or what should we do tomorrow? You know, because you just. You live and breathe these cases. You really. They do become. People say, well, what do you read for pleasure? I don't. I, you know, I'm reading police reports all the time.

[Deborah Roberts]

When do you have time?

[Mindy Montfort]

I want to go watch 20 20.

[Deborah Roberts]

Well, we know you watched 20 20. That is the one thing you do make time for. Well, you mentioned the yogurt shop murders. You had worked exclusively with us on this story. It was a heartbreaking story of four teenage girls who were viciously, horrendously, you know, murdered, and then their bodies set on fire as somebody tried to, you know, cover their tracks. Here it was a case that it stretched on for more than 30 years. It seemed to be unsolvable. Police had done a lot of work. But tell me a little bit about that case. And when you're looking at cold cases, what was that moment that finally sort of helped crack the case?

[Mindy Montfort]

Well, I have to give complete props to Dan Jackson with the Austin police department, because really, it was his great detective work. I mean, obviously, over the years, we all work as a team and everybody contributes. And I don't think we would be here where we are today if there hadn't been one piece of the puzzle that somebody put together and contributed. But Dan is the one who said, we're going to re enter our.380 shell casing because technology has improved. Let's re enter this in the national database system and see if we might get a hit. And he had it. Within hours, he uploaded that, and then within hours we had this hit to this Kentucky case. It was unbelievable. So it was the first big moment, and then it just sort of snowballed from there because it was all hands on deck at that point. It was, we want to test everything. We had been holding back a lot of the evidence, waiting for technology to improve or, you know, knowing that that might be our last ditch effort. But once we finally had the word that Brashears actually matched to our, you know, infamous unknown male profile that we'd had for years, we had that piece of evidence. Then it was Dan's call to say, let's go for broke. Let's send everything now to the private lab, get it tested, and let's do it on a rush.

[Deborah Roberts]

Yeah.

[Mindy Montfort]

And so within a few days, we had even more DNA from Robert Brashear's under the fingernails of Amy Ayers.

[Deborah Roberts]

And it paid off. What did you learn from that case that you've been able to apply to other cases? I'm sure you build on different things that you learn that you can maybe take to something else.

[Mindy Montfort]

Absolutely. You know, I think every time we do one of these cases, we learn something more about DNA. It's so confusing, it's mind boggling. But the labs are so patient with you because they'll say, no, no, there's no such thing as a stupid question. Ask it again. So I think you do that enough times, you realize what questions you need to be asking. And then you also know which labs you can use and that are going to have good results and they're accredited and you build those relationships. Relationships with other agencies. You know, we couldn't have put all these pieces together without talking to, you know, all these police departments and working together to figure out different crimes. I mean, I can say that about any of our cases.

[Deborah Roberts]

Yeah, you talk about that a lot. That it's not obviously just you alone. You work with others to try to put all of this together. In fact, you collaborate with, like, forensic genealogists sometimes and even psychics. Is that right? Somebody, a little birdie told me, I

[Mindy Montfort]

made the comment that we will take what. When you are at a dead end, you will listen to anybody if it sounds somewhat credible.

[Deborah Roberts]

Yeah, you'll listen.

[Mindy Montfort]

You'll listen. Yeah.

[Deborah Roberts]

I've heard that in other stories that I've covered. Oftentimes psychics will weigh in and call police departments, and sometimes they do have an idea about something that actually turn lead you in a direction that might help get you someplace. Mindy, I want to dig a little bit more. I want you to just stay with us. We're going to have to take a quick break, so don't go anywhere.

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[Deborah Roberts]

Welcome back to 2020 the After Show. I'm talking with Mindy Montford, who is a former Assistant Texas Attorney General. She founded the Missing Persons and Cold Case Unit and she's been work with our team here at 2020 on a lot of our most talked about investigations. When you're talking about finding justice for the families, Mindy, and justice isn't always, you know, neat and tidy, as you said in the case of the yogurt shop murders, the killer was eventually was dead by the time you actually were able to find him. Justice is kind of different for everybody. I mean, is that what you're going for? Do you feel like you're finding justice or are there times where you feel like it's, it's solved and there's an answer, but it's not really justice, you

[Mindy Montfort]

know, justice, at least when the families I've talked to say, look, at least you haven't forgotten our family member. The fact that you, it's not collecting dust on a shelf that you're actually looking in 2026 at new things to do on this case. They do feel that that's some justice. I think justice to me is trying to find the answer again. You know, yes, you're right. You may never prosecute that person and you may never get 50 years or life sentence or anything like that or restitution. But you're going to at least know maybe what happened to your loved one. I can't even imagine losing a loved one to a horrible, violent crime and then not having the extra, you know, punch in the gut that you don't even know who did it.

[Deborah Roberts]

Yeah, you just write it off over the years before I let you go. So many of These cases that we cover involvement young women. And it's never lost on me that it impacts young women in a big way when they hear about these stories. Have you. Do you. Any lessons you might impart or any thoughts when you've looked at violent crime and things that have happened around the country? And, you know, oftentimes it is, you know, women who are. Who are the victims here. Any advice for young women who might be targeted in these cases or just, I don't know, any thoughts for women who might be listening to this?

[Mindy Montfort]

You know, I think we do, as women, we have to be observant of our surroundings. And someone said this to me the other day on a case, you know, it tells you to trust your gut. And I think if your gut is telling you something's not right, you know, don't be afraid to call the police or to call a friend or to, you know, turn the light on or to get the heck out of there, whatever it is, whatever situation you're in. But I think we've got to trust our intuition and our gut. But to mainly be observant of your surroundings, I think we just sort of take it for granted sometimes that people aren't watching or it's scary to think we have to live like that, but. And, you know, when you see these, the shows and the stories and the cases we do, it's very. My son always makes fun of me, like, mom, you know, God, I'm just going to the store.

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[Deborah Roberts]

Yeah, I do the same thing.

[Mindy Montfort]

You know, you have. You just see these fact patterns. I feel like I'm living in a police report sometimes. So, you know, it doesn't happen as often as we think it does, and, you know, it really doesn't. And you can still trust people, of course, but just to be vigilant and to know your surroundings and I think to travel in pairs, I think that's always a good piece of advice.

[Deborah Roberts]

A good piece of advice. And I think to your point, just like, really trusting, if something doesn't feel right, chances are it's not. And to speak up and to speak out. Well, hopefully this will be helpful to folks out there. And also, too just thank you so much for the work that you do, Mindy. It is such a pleasure to get a chance to talk to you and learn more about how you've been able to help families around this country and also find some satisfaction yourself in doing work that makes a difference.

[Mindy Montfort]

Well, thank you, Deborah, and thanks again for the show and for putting that word out there to everybody.

[Deborah Roberts]

Absolutely. Well, we'll be talking. I'm sure I'll be talking to you sooner than later because we'll be teaming up on something. Mindy, thank you for being with us and thank you for joining us for this podcast episode. And of course, you can find 2020 on Friday nights on ABC and stream episodes like this one anytime on Disney and Hulu. Take care.

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