The After Show: In the Writer's Chair

Summary

Summary of "The After Show: In the Writer's Chair" on 20/20

Release Date: June 16, 2025

In the June 16, 2025 episode of 20/20 After Show: In the Writer's Chair, host Deborah Roberts sits down with Kim Powers, the senior writer for ABC News' acclaimed true crime program 20/20. The conversation offers an in-depth exploration of Powers' writing journey, his role in shaping the show's narrative, and the intricate process behind crafting compelling true crime stories.

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Introduction to Kim Powers

The episode opens with Deborah Roberts introducing Kim Powers, highlighting his decade-long contribution to 20/20 and his impressive 28-year tenure at ABC. Deborah remarks, “First of all, you've been here 10 years of 2020, but 28 years at ABC” [00:46], emphasizing Powers' extensive experience and foundational role in the program's success.

Kim Powers’ Writing Journey

Kim Powers delves into his evolution as a writer, sharing, “I think you can't be a writer unless you're a reader” [01:52]. He reflects on his childhood passion for stories and adventure, cultivated independently despite his mother's profession as a teacher. This intrinsic love for reading naturally transitioned into writing during his high school and college years, eventually leading him to ABC.

Transitioning from Good Morning America to 20/20

Deborah explores Powers' shift from the brisk, pithy writing style required by Good Morning America (GMA) to the more nuanced and detailed storytelling of 20/20. Kim explains, “the long form as we call the news magazines” [03:13], highlighting the freedom to thoroughly investigate and present a single story over the course of an hour. He contrasts this with the quick, tight scripting of GMA, underscoring the depth and richness that 20/20 allows.

Crafting Engaging Opens and Teases

A significant portion of the discussion focuses on the art of writing effective opens and teases that captivate viewers from the outset. Kim shares a valuable lesson from Barbara Walters: “the button at the end of the open needs a ta da” [09:17]. He dissects an example open from an episode titled "Family Lies," illustrating how it balances emotional hooks with narrative elements to immediately engage the audience. Kim emphasizes the importance of the last few seconds, stating, “there are a lot of things going on… you're out on the water… you can hear your voice talking” [09:17], which immerses viewers in the story's reality.

Storytelling Techniques in True Crime

Powers attributes his storytelling prowess to his Southern upbringing, remarking, “Southerners are natural born storytellers” [05:36]. He draws inspiration from literary figures like Eudora Welty and Truman Capote, emphasizing the rich oral traditions of the South that emphasize drama and suspense. Kim asserts, “God is in the details” [04:06], highlighting how meticulous attention to detail transforms true crime stories into vivid, engaging narratives that resonate with viewers.

Writing “Pages” and Script Elements

The conversation delves into the technical aspects of writing for 20/20, particularly the concept of “pages.” Kim explains, “There's literally a rundown with page one through page 30” [11:46], detailing how each page represents different elements of the show, such as the intro, outro, and various segments. This structured approach ensures a cohesive and compelling narrative flow, keeping viewers engaged from start to finish.

Influence of the New Studio

With 20/20's recent move to a new rooftop studio featuring a nighttime setting, Kim discusses how the new environment inspires his writing. He notes, “it fits the sort of mood and atmosphere of a lot of the true crime shows” [12:56], appreciating the ambient neon lights and urban vistas that complement the program's sophisticated and mysterious tone. This aesthetic shift allows for more creative and atmospheric storytelling.

Collaborative Process and Screenings

Kim emphasizes the collaborative nature of the writing process at 20/20, describing the importance of group screenings and feedback sessions. He states, “We have interns… it would be such a great learning tool” [18:24], highlighting how collective input ensures the story remains respectful to victims and their families while maintaining narrative integrity. This teamwork fosters a supportive environment where writers can refine their scripts to perfection.

Maintaining Viewer Engagement

A critical aspect of writing for 20/20 involves earning and retaining viewers' attention. Kim discusses the strategy behind creating compelling “teases” that keep audiences hooked, saying, “At the core of any story is the question, what happens next?” [15:22]. By strategically withholding key information, the writers ensure that viewers remain invested and eager to return for the next segment, enhancing overall engagement.

Conclusion and Reflections

As the episode wraps up, Deborah and Kim reflect on the challenges and rewards of writing for a high-profile investigative program. Kim humorously notes, “We need 25 more minutes” [19:02], underscoring the depth of his passion and dedication to his craft. The conversation leaves listeners with a profound appreciation for the behind-the-scenes efforts that make 20/20 a trusted source of true crime storytelling.

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Notable Quotes:

• Kim Powers [01:52]: “I think you can't be a writer unless you're a reader.”
• Kim Powers [03:13]: “the long form as we call the news magazines.”
• Kim Powers [09:17]: “the button at the end of the open needs a ta da.”
• Kim Powers [05:36]: “Southerners are natural born storytellers.”
• Kim Powers [04:06]: “God is in the details.”
• Kim Powers [11:46]: “There's literally a rundown with page one through page 30.”
• Kim Powers [12:56]: “it fits the sort of mood and atmosphere of a lot of the true crime shows.”
• Kim Powers [18:24]: “We have interns… it would be such a great learning tool.”
• Kim Powers [15:22]: “At the core of any story is the question, what happens next?”
• Kim Powers [19:02]: “We need 25 more minutes.”

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This comprehensive summary encapsulates the essence of the episode, providing readers with a clear understanding of Kim Powers' role in 20/20, his writing philosophy, and the meticulous process behind crafting engaging true crime narratives. Through insightful discussions and practical examples, listeners gain an appreciation for the artistry and dedication that drive one of television's leading investigative programs.

Transcript

[Kim Powers]

It's that phrase at the end. It's a perfect button. You need this thing that sums it all up. That was my great writing lesson from Barbara Walters. From the great Barbara Walters.

[Deborah Roberts]

And we all have great stories from Barbara.

[Kim Powers]

I wrote something for her, an intro to something. And she goes, it needs a ta da.

[Deborah Roberts]

It's Deborah Roberts. And Today on the 2020 After Show, I am delighted I have the pleasure of introducing you to one of the people who makes 2020's secret sauce, powerful writing. You'll understand the play there, my friend and colleague, Kim Powers, our senior writer for the program. Hey, Kim.

[Kim Powers]

Powerful writing are us. That's what we do. Mr. Powers, I'm so happy to be here. We have been in the trenches together.

[Deborah Roberts]

Yeah, we have. And you and I always find ourselves just talking and yakking in the hallways and we talk about books and all kinds of things. And that's relevant for. First of all, you've been here 10 years of 2020, but 28 years at ABC.

[Kim Powers]

Yeah. Disney gives out a little statuette of some Disney character every five years. So by the time I've been here 30 years, what do you get? I don't know what I'll get. I've got Simba, I've got Mickey Mouse, I've got Tinkerbell.

[Deborah Roberts]

Yeah, me too.

[Kim Powers]

You know, I want to be excited by whatever comes next.

[Deborah Roberts]

I know. Well, I'm about to hit 30 years, so I'll let you know.

[Kim Powers]

I feel like we started at about.

[Deborah Roberts]

The same time, close to the same.

[Kim Powers]

Low, low level in the trenches.

[Deborah Roberts]

We were definitely newbies here together. And you have written for some of the biggest in our business, of course, over the years. I mean, Diane Sawyer, Barbara Walters, most recently, of course, you know, John Quinones, Robin Roberts, myself.

[Kim Powers]

Absolutely.

[Deborah Roberts]

And when we talk about writing, I mean, that is your passion, clearly, because you've written novels, you've written screenplays. You and I have talked about some of your books over the years. What is it about writing that has just captivated you over the years?

[Kim Powers]

I think you can't be a writer unless you're a reader. First reading was so important to me when I was a kid, and I wasn't forced to do it. My mother was a teacher, but I don't think that had anything to do with it. I just wanted to read stories. I wanted to find out new things that happened. I wanted adventure and everything. And bit by bit, you know, as you get opportunities through high school and college just doing papers, I started writing. I was writing and it just Grew into sort of a habit. I was doing a lot of work pre ABC with other writers and there was a certain point when I thought I can do it as well as they can. I was reading a lot of scripts for different production companies, et cetera, and I started doing some little rewrites and thought, I can do this. Yeah, I really can.

[Deborah Roberts]

Yeah, and you can and you do it well. And you've written books. I mean, I read one of your books and actually wrote a little forward for Rules for Being Dead. You've done so many different things. But what's so fascinating to me is how you've. Although you continue to write books, you shifted from Good Morning America where the writing is sort of pithy and quick. I mean, I contribute to Good Morning America a lot and I know that my scripts have to be quick and tight and to the point. And then 2020, which is a long form program and you get a chance to kind of let things breathe and you know, how do you switch gears like that in your mind?

[Kim Powers]

I love it. The long form as we call the news magazines, you know, the writers at Good Morning America, before I worked there, I thought, what does a writer do? I literally thought the anchor, the correspondent.

[Deborah Roberts]

Comes out, that we wrote it all. Not quite always.

[Kim Powers]

Not quite always. Writing wise, you might put a backgrounder together which might be a little 30, 40 second tape piece that sort of tells the story. So that's where I got a first taste of it. When I got up to primetime first and then 2020, it was like the heavens had opened, you know. And I've been with 2020 so long. I've seen it go through, you know, the one hour show it used to be, where there were three or four different stories. True magazine where you'd flip the page, come to a new story to what we have now, which is the ultimate luxury, which is a two hour single story broadcast every Friday night.

[Deborah Roberts]

Yeah. Which can be really compelling.

[Kim Powers]

Can dig in deep, get all the details. God is in the details is that writing phrase. But the details are what make a story come alive. You know, really diggin into the weeds there.

[Deborah Roberts]

And you've had to do that from the very beginning when you started here. So you got kind of thrown right into the ocean right away when you started at Good Morning America. Because one of the biggest stories in the country happened right after you started.

[Kim Powers]

Still remains one of the biggest stories in the country. I started as a freelancer between Christmas and New Year's of 1996. The big story breaking that week was the murder of JonBenet Ramsey. Nobody even knew how to pronounce her name. It was so foreign, like JonBenet, you know, horrific story. But I guess we all sort of presumed it would be solved quickly. And of course, we still don't really have a solution to this very day. And it's ironic that it was true crime with all the different varieties of topics that GMA touches on. My introduction would be true crime, which is primarily what we do at 2020 now, right?

[Deborah Roberts]

Yeah, certainly. Full circle. Well, Kim, when you think about what you bring to it, and you and I, I think both have talked about this too, that you're kind of informed by who you are. You grew up in the South, I grew up in the South. Does that sort of inform your writing? Does that also kind of lead you to certain stories that really grab you in a way?

[Kim Powers]

I think I'm gonna say this and immediately everybody will say this is not true. But I think Southerners are natural born storytellers. You know, they're these, you know, great, iconic, you know, Eudora Welty, Tennessee Williams, Truman Capote, old fashioned sort of. But, you know, I think Eudora said if you're born a Southerner, you have a lifetime of material. So you just know what makes a story. And there's such an oral tradition of storytelling, you know, just sitting out on the porch, you learn how to work in all the drama and the suspense. And at the core, that's what we do every week on 2020. We have starts at A, ends at Z, hopefully where you've revealed the killer and why they did it and explored all the psychology of the characters. But you have told this story with this huge palette at your fingertips.

[Deborah Roberts]

And at the end of the day, that's what it is. We tell stories, even if it's a quick crime story. Well, we're gonna talk about the writing on 2020 and here's some examples. But the first thing I want to ask you about is the idea that when you're a writer on 2020, it's kind of invisible work. You're behind the scenes, people aren' going to necessarily know who you are. I'm going to read your words often. So we're not reading a big long script. I mean, right?

[Kim Powers]

Yeah. I was still maybe naive enough or enough of a newbie that even when I, after, you know, all those 10 years at GMA, when I first came up to the magazines and I thought writing had to be me putting words on a page, I didn't understand that in, say, these opens, we'll Talk about that. Get created. I'm figuring out the right structure to put them into. That both tells enough of the story to entice you, but leaves out enough to really make you come back after the commercial.

[Deborah Roberts]

Yeah, yeah. And we want to talk about that, which we call a tease. Well, one of the parts of the program that you play a big part in is our opens. And people wouldn't necessarily know that that is a major thing that you have to sort of obsess about something that is going to get you all to want to watch 2020. So let's take a listen to one of them, and then you can tell me a little bit about what's going on. So let's listen. One family. Oh, my God. Two horrible tragedies. That's. That's pretty dark stuff. At sea and on land.

[Kim Powers]

My father, he is in bed, and.

[Deborah Roberts]

Someone shot him in the head. Do you remember what you noticed?

[Kim Powers]

First thing I thought is, this crime scene is staged.

[Deborah Roberts]

Linda always felt that she deserved more than what she was getting because she and my dad were always butting heads.

[Kim Powers]

We've got no weapons. We've got no enemies that we know.

[Deborah Roberts]

Of, that we know of. And no more details because she disappears.

[Kim Powers]

I told her not to go on.

[Deborah Roberts]

That boat, so she went out of the way to give them information in case something happened. Yes, indeed.

[Kim Powers]

It's just getting wilder and wilder because in the middle of the ocean, nobody.

[Deborah Roberts]

Can hear you scream. Ooh. That was an episode called Family Lies. Yeah. And I reported on this story most recently. A young man by the name of Nathan Carmen. And his grandfather had mysteriously died. His mom mysteriously died. And, Kim, I gotta tell you, when I hear all of that, I mean, it makes me now really feel so proud of the way you're able to do this. I mean, that whole nobody can hear you scream in the ocean. Tell us about putting these things together.

[Kim Powers]

Well, just to pick off that word, that phrase at the end, it's a perfect button. You need this thing that sums it all up. That was my great writing lesson from Barbara Walters. From the great Barbara Walters.

[Deborah Roberts]

And we all have great stories from Barbara.

[Kim Powers]

I wrote something for her, an intro to something. And she goes, it needs a ta da. And I thought, oh, okay. And then she wrote something. She goes, that's a ta da. So I always know the button at the end of the open needs a ta da. So that, you know, in the bottom of the ocean, nobody can hear you scream. But that has so many different elements. Even just hearing it, you can hear so much of it, because you hear your voice talking to these real people, you know, these people who had gone through a tragedy, people who had investigated a tragedy. Detectives, you hear them talking, number one. You hear your questions to them. You hear a lot of sea effects. So, you know, you're out on the water at the very first, you hear a little bit of lapping of the sea, but within seconds you hear, oh, my God. And that immediately grabs you in because you're just immediately into the reality of something. And so there. There are a lot of things going on. You know, I think we. We once had some research that you have three seconds to grab somebody's attention, which is nothing.

[Deborah Roberts]

Yeah.

[Kim Powers]

So you really have to be with, you know, with what you do, with.

[Deborah Roberts]

What we do with our sound and our natural sound and all of that.

[Kim Powers]

We also want to show the viewer who the storyteller for that episode is. So whoever the correspondent is, in this case of the Nathan Carmen story, you, we want you very prominent out in the field. You know, viewers love to see that. You know, we went to the ocean, we went to New England, whatever.

[Deborah Roberts]

Yeah.

[Kim Powers]

So you're our tour guide through that.

[Deborah Roberts]

Overview, which is a big part of letting them know what's coming. Well, listen, when we come back, there are parts of the program that are written, but the writer's art is also making it sound like they're not. So we're going to talk about that right after this break. All right. We are back with 2020 senior writer Kim Powers, who is talking to us about putting our programs together. Kim, One part of the program where the writers get very involved is what we call pages. When David Muir and I are both on camera introing a piece or maybe finishing up our story. Talk to us a little bit about it, because it's interesting. We call it pages.

[Kim Powers]

Yeah. Nobody else would know what that means. And even I didn't know what it meant when I first started here. There's literally a rundown with page one through page 30. However many different elements are, you know, roll in the tape piece, the intro, the outro. Each of those gets assigned a different page number. So it's just our shorthand. But, you know, somebody else would call it the int. The outro. It's what the anchors say leading into the piece.

[Deborah Roberts]

By and large, I like to call it the intro or the outro myself. Well, David and I now, we're in this new studio downtown, a new building, and David and I are now up on the roof, and we're sort of taking advantage of a nighttime setting does that inspire your writing in any way?

[Kim Powers]

Well, it certainly fits our show because it's. So we used to be in a studio, as all of our viewers know. Now we're outside, way up high, I might add, which is a little scary for me.

[Deborah Roberts]

Like 18 stories.

[Kim Powers]

Yeah. Little terrace, you know, small space, cameras, teleprompter, you know, producers, etc. But it's. It's great because it's nighttime.

[Deborah Roberts]

Yeah.

[Kim Powers]

And we're downtown, so it has a sort of hipper look. You see all the neon from the buildings. You see all the lights coming in from apartment buildings. Everywhere. If you're lucky, there's a little wispy cloud going by. So it fits the sort of mood and atmosphere of a lot of the true crime shows.

[Deborah Roberts]

True crime, yeah.

[Kim Powers]

And it's got a new life to it.

[Deborah Roberts]

I would definitely say we look a little bit more hip. So when you're talking about these pages that we're doing, let's listen to some examples because I'd love to hear you talk about what makes for a good page to you. Let's listen. Two heartbroken sisters, a tearful goodbye and a verdict. Finally, after eight long years of investigations.

[Kim Powers]

And we should point out, Deborah, that after Fabio Simmentelli's death, a scholarship in his name was established to help students in the beauty field hoping to follow in his footsteps. That is 2020 for tonight.

[Deborah Roberts]

I'm David Muir. And I'm Deborah Roberts. From all of us here at 2020 and ABC News, good night.

[Kim Powers]

That's a short and sweet one, but it packs so much into that these updates. This was a breaking news story. The verdict in this case had literally happened the day we went on air. It tells you a bunch of things. You get the emotion coming out of the piece. You know, these two sisters saying, good. You find out how long this trial has been going on. Eight years since the murder happened until this final verdict. So you can imagine the length of time these people have had to endure the waiting. And then, you know, you don't want to leave people on a downer. So you get this little check mark of good news, something good that came out of this, that a scholarship has been established in this man's name, that the legacy continues, and it's been being passed on to students in his same line of business. So you get a lot just tucked into what might be 15 or 20 seconds.

[Deborah Roberts]

And I should say, also, too, because of social media now, too, we actually address that and we make sure we kind of give a little shout out there. Well, one of the things we pay a lot of attention to on our program at 2020 is earning our viewers time, because that's critical. So we want people to stick with us till the very end of the story. 2020 viewers are no doubt familiar with the little promos. We call them promos sprinkled throughout our program about what's gonna happen next, and we call them teases. But it's really important when we're doing these stories and you talked about it's a. And particularly at the end of that one hour, we want to make sure you come back, or if somebody is new just sort of joining us a little later, will come back. How do you work on that?

[Kim Powers]

I think at the core of any story is the question, what happens next? And certainly in murder mysteries or true crime or anything that ends up in a courtroom setting, you want to know what happens next, who done it, et cetera. But I think even in things that are more human interest, you know, that aren't in the genre of true crime or mystery, what happens to the human heart next? Why do people do what they do? So you want to keep that heartbeat going through the whole thing. You never want to give away too much information. You want to hold something back to keep people coming back out to the commercial. When I was at gma, I would write teases for the whole show, or bumpers, we sometimes called them. So what was something that was so enticing that they just had to know the answer to? That's sort of the. The cliffhanger you would leave viewers with.

[Deborah Roberts]

And sometimes it's not the writing. It might be a little bit of an audio clip. Let's take a listen. No matter what the jury decides about her fate.

[Kim Powers]

Bring the jury in.

[Deborah Roberts]

Dee Dee's about to tell us exactly what she thinks about it. They didn't get to hear my side. They didn't get to see my evidence.

[Kim Powers]

They didn't get to hear my witnesses. Why didn't you take the stand then?

[Deborah Roberts]

Ooh, I would definitely come back for that.

[Kim Powers]

Yeah, that was. I remember that so well with Matt Gutman. Matt Gutman, A case of a guy, incredible guy named Abraham Shakespeare, who won $30 million in a lottery and was murdered. Someone who wanted his money. And we got to the end of the show, pretty close to the end of the show. And the killer had, you know, come up against the jury. They were gonna see if she's guilty or not. And originally in a screening, we played it, and it was, what will the jury decide? And. And I thought it was a Little kind of perfunctory. We know the verdict's coming next. But what was also in the act coming up was this incredible interview that Matt does with this killer, as it turns out, in prison. So I thought it would be much more enticing to tease a little bit of that interview you're gonna see. And it really. That's what you hang on to. Not what the verdict's gonna be, but like, oh, what are they gonna do?

[Deborah Roberts]

What are they gonna do? What are they gonna say? Yeah, I love that. Well, just to give people a little taste of how all of this comes together, we do what we call screenings of our episodes of 2020. And these can be marathon screenings, by the way, because we all get together either in the conference room or sometimes we're on the zoom board if you're not in or if I'm not in. And we all, along with Janice Johnston, our executive producer, and all of the other producers and senior producers involved with the story, we all watch it, and we make comments and we make decisions. And you get a little testy every now and again if you don't really like what's being said. Standing up for what I did, standing up for your writing and all of that, and talk to us about why that's so important. I mean, to me, you know, it can be some of the hardest work we do, but it can also be some of the most rewarding because we move things around, we decide together as a group.

[Kim Powers]

I think it's valuable for a kid just coming into the business. You know, we have interns. I just think it would be such a great learning tool to see, really, how the sauce is, how that sauce is made. We want to honor the victim and their loved ones, and we dissect everything, you know, from a particular line that you, Deborah, the correspondent, might say to a sound bite one of our people in the story has. But especially these bumpers. That's what keeps you turning in.

[Deborah Roberts]

I think we also care so much about the moral center of it and what we're doing and care about the people who are in the work that we're doing. Well, Kim, this has been really Great.

[Kim Powers]

We need 25 more minutes.

[Deborah Roberts]

I know, I know.

[Kim Powers]

This is flat bomb.

[Deborah Roberts]

We didn't even get a chance to talk about the books that we were reading and all of that. Another program, another time. But, Kim, it's such a pleasure to get a chance to catch up with you. And just before we're getting ready to go work on another one of our reports tonight.

[Kim Powers]

Absolutely. Shooting some more pages.

[Deborah Roberts]

That's exactly right. Well, Kim Powers is our senior writer here on 2020, and you can hear more of his work, of course, Friday nights at 9 o' clock Eastern on 2020. The 2020 after show is produced by Amirah Williams, Cameron Chertavian and Sasha Aslanian with Brian Merzursky and Alex Barenfeld of 2020 Theme music by Evan Janice Johnston is the executive producer of 2020, Josh Cohen the director of podcasting at ABC Audio, and Laura Mayer is the executive producer.