True Crime Vault: The Sins of the Father

Summary

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20/20 True Crime Vault: "The Sins of the Father"

Podcast: ABC News 20/20
Date: November 25, 2025
Episode Theme:
An in-depth investigation into Carl Carlson—a man whose life is marked by suspicious deaths, insurance payouts, and unimaginable betrayal within his own family. 20/20 revisits the mysterious tragedies affecting his wife and son, chronicling the multi-decade search for justice and the tireless efforts of family and investigators to reveal the deadly "pattern" behind the Carlson family misfortunes.

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Episode Overview

This episode delves into Carl Carlson’s decades-long trail of suspicious tragedies: the 1991 house fire that killed his first wife Christina, and the 2008 death of his son Levi in a tragic "accident." Each calamity brought Carl not only loss but substantial insurance payouts, raising questions within his extended family and law enforcement circles. Through emotional interviews, investigative reporting, and a gripping narrative, the episode explores how justice was finally served—first in New York, then in California.

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Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. The Death of Levi Carlson (2008)

• The Incident:
  Levi, Carl’s adult son, died at 23 under a truck he was repairing on the family farm. The vehicle had been propped up with a single unstable jack.
  • "The truck fell on my stepson. Oh, my God. This is horr..." (00:50)
  • Initial reports treated the death as a tragic accident.
• Family Reaction:
  Levi's sister Erin immediately suspects foul play:
  • "I knew as soon as I heard that Levi was gone that he had done it. I knew every fiber of my being." (Erin Deroche, 09:31)
• Insurance Motive:
  • Carl convinced Levi to take out a $700,000 life insurance policy with himself as beneficiary.
  • The policy was paid out despite Levi dying the day before a required medical exam.
  • "Levi Carlson's medical exam was scheduled for him the day after he died." (14:55)

2. Family History: Prior Suspicious Deaths and Tragedies

• Christina Carlson’s Death (1991):
  • Carl’s first wife Christina died in a house fire in rural California. He received a $200,000 insurance payout.
  • The window in the bathroom—her only escape—had been boarded up days before.
  • The original fire investigation found evidence contradicting Carl's version (the trouble light was not on; kerosene was poured immediately before the fire).
  • "The trouble light didn't ignite this... it had to be a person applying a flame to the kerosene." (Ken Buskey, fire investigator, 77:17)
• Other Odd ‘Coincidences’:
  • 1986: Carl’s new Mustang burns in his driveway; insurance payout follows.
  • 2002: The family barn burns, killing prized horses—again, Carl collects insurance.
  • "Seemed like every couple years something was burning, you know." (Erin Deroche, 41:02)
• Pattern Recognized:
  Multiple incidents involving insurance policies provoked deep suspicion among relatives and investigators.

3. The Family's Struggles and Escape

• Carl was domineering and physically punishing to his children.
• Levi and Erin both recall confiding in each other about suspicions surrounding their mother’s death and their father’s capacity for violence.
• "He lies and he's able to manipulate people very easy. That's who he's always been. ... I saw the monster more than the man." (Erin Deroche, 02:36)
• Cindy, Carl’s second wife, eventually fears for her own life upon discovering a $1.2 million policy on herself.

4. Reopening of Levi’s Case and The Path to Justice

• Catalyst:
  Cindy and a relative contact police, expressing fears and detailing Carl’s pattern.
  • "I would be worth 1.2 million to Carl if I was dead." (Cindy Carlson, 38:20)
• Investigative Breakthrough:
  Cindy agrees to record her conversations with Carl and later to wear a wire for police.
  • "I thought, maybe I can get him to confess. That was my goal." (Cindy Carlson, 41:24)
• Carl’s Statements:
  • On tape, Carl callously refers to Levi’s death as an “opportunity.”
    • "I said I had nothing to do, but I said I took advantage of the situation once it happened." (Carl Carlson, 49:00)
  • Multiple shifting versions of what happened during a marathon police interrogation.
    • "Version two is far more ridiculous than version one." (Investigator/Detective, 54:40)

5. Legal Outcomes

• Arrest and Conviction in NY:
  • Carl pleads guilty to second-degree murder for killing Levi and is sentenced to 15 years to life.
  • During his plea, he admits to jacking the truck up precariously and knowingly leaving Levi alive, trapped beneath.
    • "He left his son Levi alive, crushed under that truck, and walked away." (Co-narrator, 69:56)
  • "It was the loss of my father too." (Katie Reynolds, 70:07)
• Reopening Christina’s Case:
  • Success in NY prompts California authorities, under family and media pressure, to re-examine Christina’s 1991 death.
  • Old evidence—including original fire expert reports and video of the boarded-up window—proves pivotal.
  • Carl is tried and convicted for first-degree murder in Christina’s death as well.
    • "We the jury, find the defendant, Carl Holger Carlson, guilty of murder in the first degree." (79:01)
    • He receives life without parole.

6. A Chilling Final Twist: Life Insurance on Granddaughters

• After Levi’s death, Carl took out insurance policies on his two granddaughters, again planning to be their guardian and beneficiary.
  • "Dad had life insurance policies out on both of my brother's daughters." (Katie Reynolds, 81:43)
• Cindy acts to cash out and close these policies, potentially averting further tragedy.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On the Pattern of Insurance Payouts:
  "A lot of people have said, when this guy needed money, a family member would die." (01:50)
  "Wherever Carl goes, tragedy takes place." (Investigator/Detective, 19:19)

• On Justice and Family:
  "It was everything I wanted." (Erin Deroche on conviction, 79:17)
  "He walked away on their mother, walked away on their brother, and he just walked away on them again." (Family Member, 79:27)

• Carl’s Chilling Attitude:
  "He smiled like a Cheshire cat and said, 'It's been 22 years. They haven't caught me yet, and they're not going to.'" (Erin Deroche, 67:21 & 58:44)

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Key Timestamps

• 00:40–01:56: Initial outline of Levi’s death; first hints of broader tragedy
• 09:31 (Erin Deroche): Instinctive belief that Carl killed Levi
• 14:55–16:13: Details surrounding the insurance policy on Levi
• 22:06–24:17: Christina’s final hours and Carl’s explanation
• 29:09–33:14: Challenges to Carl's fire story and fire investigation findings
• 35:00–41:02: Examples of Carl’s history of suspicious fires and payouts
• 48:00–50:09: Cindy's wire recording and Carl's references to “opportunity”
• 53:53–57:30: Interrogation: multiple versions of Carla’s account
• 69:42–70:07: Carl’s courtroom admission; heartbreak for Levi’s sisters
• 74:52–76:19: Critical testimony in Christina’s murder trial
• 79:01: Guilty verdict in California
• 81:43–82:22: Discovery of insurance policies on the granddaughters and quick action to protect them
• 83:05–83:26: Levi’s and Christina’s graves together; family reflection

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Tone & Narrative Style

The episode maintains a somber, suspenseful, and probing tone, blending emotional family interviews with methodical reporting. The candid reflections from Carl’s surviving children and Christina’s sister reveal personal costs, resilience, and a refusal to let these crimes be forgotten. The podcast’s narrative relentlessly returns to the theme of patterns—patterns of tragedy, greed, and ultimately, the determination to break cycles of silence and denial.

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Conclusion

“The Sins of the Father” is a haunting exploration of repeated family tragedy, the dangers of unchecked patterns, and the extraordinary persistence required to secure justice when so many systems initially failed. Through remarkable personal courage and investigative persistence, Carl Carlson is exposed not as a victim of misfortune, but as a remorseless architect of family devastation for profit—finally named and imprisoned as the killer he always was.

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Transcript

[Narrator]

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[Co-narrator/Interviewer]

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[Narrator]

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[Co-narrator/Interviewer]

Where you'll hear our most gripping stories.

[Investigator/Reporter]

You wouldn't stand a chance.

[Narrator]

I mean, you're gone.

[Cindy Carlson]

He started saying, Call 911. Levi is dead.

[Family Member/Relative]

Ma', am.

[Investigator/Detective]

What's going on?

[Narrator]

The truck fell on my stepson. Oh, my God. This is Hor.

[Investigator/Detective]

23 year old son Levi dies in his tragedy.

[Investigator/Reporter]

At first it didn't appear to be.

[Narrator]

Anything out of the ordinary. No, it appeared to be an accident.

[Investigator/Reporter]

You know, this was a story that played out in upstate New York. I'm from upstate New York and I remember people consumed by this story. And it only got more twisted as the years went on.

[Investigator/Detective]

Wherever Carl goes, tragedy takes place.

[Family Member (Brother or Relative of Carl Carlson)]

It was a deja vu moment for Carl. In 91, he had lost his wife and lost his home and everything they owned.

[Co-narrator/Interviewer]

How unlucky is this guy? Christina was trapped inside that bathroom with the fire raging just outside that door.

[Colette Carlson (Sister of Christina)]

It wasn't an accident.

[Erin Deroche (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

I heard my mother screaming. My father had said, mommy's gone to heaven. Seemed like every couple years something was burning.

[Investigator/Reporter]

A lot of people have said when this guy needed money, a family member would die.

[Narrator]

There's definitely a pattern there.

[Investigator/Detective]

Cindy's concerned. Okay, first wife dies in this tragedy. Levi dies in this tragedy.

[Investigator/Reporter]

Was she convinced there was a killer in her own home?

[Cindy Carlson]

There's Erin.

[Narrator]

Where's Katie? Katie, look at Karina.

[Colette Carlson (Sister of Christina)]

Katie.

[Erin Deroche (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

Hi, Katie. My name is Erin Deroche.

[Katie Reynolds (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

My name is Katie Reynolds and Carl.

[Narrator]

Carlson is my father.

[Erin Deroche (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

It does seem surreal sometimes that this is my life.

[Katie Reynolds (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

Does this much bad stuff happen to normal people?

[Erin Deroche (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

He lies and he's able to manipulate people very easy. That's who he's always been. So for me, I saw the monster more than the man.

[Investigator/Reporter]

This is a story that has really taken years to unfold. I began covering it seven years ago in upstate New York, but really no one could have imagined, no one could have predicted how this would end up. So we're headed where right now?

[Narrator]

Headed to 885 Yale Farm Road, which is the Carlson residence.

[Investigator/Reporter]

And the family's quite connected in the community.

[Narrator]

Right. They're a well known family. They've been here for generations.

[Family Member (Brother or Relative of Carl Carlson)]

My grandfather settled right here. We're a large family. Carl is my brother.

[Narrator]

Carl had five brothers and a sister, almost all of whom remain in the area. His father was a highway official in that county for almost 50 years. His brother was a town councilor. Definitely a family that has a lot of connections.

[Investigator/Detective]

The Carlson family name has always been a very reputable name in Seneca County. Seneca county sits between two of the beautiful Finger Lakes, Seneca and Kagica.

[Narrator]

Pretty much smack dab in the middle of the Finger Lakes region of upstate New York. We're between the cities of Rochester and Syracuse.

[Investigator/Detective]

The village of Seneca Falls is known for its wonderful life.

[Narrator]

The current belief is that Seneca Falls was the model for the village of Bedford Falls and it's a wonderful life. Yay. Hello Bedford Falls.

[Cindy Carlson]

When I met Carl In November of 1992, he was a single dad to his.

[Co-narrator/Interviewer]

Carlson's first wife, Christina was 30 years old when she died in a tragic fire just years before he would meet his second wife, Cindy Carlson.

[Cindy Carlson]

He seemed like he was a hands on dad. The youngest, Katie, adored her father. Aaron and Levi seemed they had a special bond.

[Erin Deroche (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

Levi was amazing. He was so creative, he was very smart. But he had a learning disability. So when it came to bringing home good grades, he couldn't because of the disability.

[Investigator/Detective]

Levi had a difficult life growing up. Levi's life was everything that you wouldn't want your kid to grow up with.

[Cindy Carlson]

He went through a rebellious time in his teenage years and him and his father seemed to clash.

[Erin Deroche (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

As he got older, he got into more of the metal music and you know, he kind of changed his appearance a little bit. But deep down he was always still that same goofy kid.

[Family Member (Brother or Relative of Carl Carlson)]

He married early, had two young daughters. The marriage didn't pan out.

[Investigator/Detective]

Levi kind of pulled his life together. He was, he was a good young man. He wanted to make better of his life.

[Narrator]

On November 20, 2008, 911 received a frantic call from Cindy Carlson.

[Investigator/Detective]

911-What'S the location of your emergency?

[Narrator]

Yes, I live at 885 Yale Farm Road.

[Cindy Carlson]

Okay, I think I need an ambulance.

[Investigator/Detective]

Levi had come to the home of Cindy and Carl Carlson at the request of Carl.

[Cindy Carlson]

Carl told me that Levi was going to come out to work on an old farm truck that we had that day. Our plan was that we needed to attend my aunt's funeral.

[Co-narrator/Interviewer]

While Levi is in the garage working under that farm truck, Carl and Cindy are getting ready and dress to go to a funeral.

[Cindy Carlson]

I went and got in the Passenger seat of the car. And Carl had told me that I'm just going to go out and let Levi know that we're leaving. It was just a minute or two and then Carl came and got in the car. Nothing seemed out of the ordinary.

[Investigator/Detective]

He and Cindy leave to go to a funeral down in Pena, New York.

[Cindy Carlson]

We were gone for four hours.

[Investigator/Detective]

They return home. Cindy first notices Levi's car still parked in their driveway. She's kind of concerned.

[Cindy Carlson]

I went into the house and Carl came up to the window and the door and started banging and saying, Call 911. Levi is dead.

[Family Member/Relative]

Ma', am.

[Narrator]

What's going on? The truck fell on my stepson. The truck fell on your stepson?

[Erin Deroche (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

We just got home and I don't think he's alive.

[Narrator]

You don't think he's alive?

[Erin Deroche (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

No.

[Narrator]

My husband's lifting up the truck.

[Investigator/Detective]

Cindy's basically taking information she got from her husband Carl and is relaying it to the 911 dispatcher.

[Narrator]

Oh, they want to start CPR. Do you know c. His chest is crushed. His chest is crushed.

[Cindy Carlson]

No, he's probably been under here for hours.

[Narrator]

Oh, my God. This is horrible.

[Cindy Carlson]

Carl had pulled Levi out from underneath the truck and you can see the indentation on his chest.

[Investigator/Detective]

The truck was jacked up by a single railroad type jack.

[Investigator/Reporter]

This is the kind of jack that the police found that's similar.

[Narrator]

Similar.

[Investigator/Detective]

It's a railroad jack and you make for a very weak foundation. And the higher it gets, the weaker it gets.

[Investigator/Reporter]

I'll never forget that the team, we all went to this local junkyard to try to find a similar old farm truck. The weight of it, just to see what it would be like propped up on a single railroad jack. Would you go under this pickup?

[Narrator]

I would never go under a truck. I don't like going underneath trucks when.

[Investigator/Reporter]

They'Re sitting all four tires on the ground. So you've got it jacked up here with a railroad jack.

[Narrator]

Look at that thing tip. Look at that jack going. Just wobbling. That jack is moving.

[Investigator/Reporter]

I mean, that's just crazy.

[Narrator]

It really is. I mean, it's.

[Family Member (Brother or Relative of Carl Carlson)]

I have time to get clear of that.

[Investigator/Reporter]

You wouldn't stand a chance.

[Narrator]

You're gone. I mean, you're gone.

[Family Member (Brother or Relative of Carl Carlson)]

The ambulance, they were just pulling Levi out of the barn and putting him into the ambulance.

[Investigator/Reporter]

When police arrived, what were the parents like?

[Narrator]

Very distraught, very upset, crying, you know, grief stricken.

[Cindy Carlson]

I remember the sheriff's trying to console Carl because he was so distraught.

[Narrator]

Levi was taken to the hospital where he was pronounced dead.

[Investigator/Detective]

Levi's 23 years old at the time of his death.

[Investigator/Reporter]

At first it didn't appear to be anything out of the ordinary.

[Narrator]

No, it appeared to be an accident.

[Colette Carlson (Sister of Christina)]

I get a call from my niece that my nephew has died.

[Erin Deroche (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

I knew as soon as I heard that Levi was gone that he had done it. I knew every fiber of my being.

[Colette Carlson (Sister of Christina)]

I said, I have no idea what he stands to gain from this.

[Co-narrator/Interviewer]

But it begs the question, could a father kill his own son?

[Cindy Carlson]

I first met Carl at a line dancing club. He told me that he could line dance. I was kind of looking for a line dancing partner. Come to find out he really had no clue about line dancing.

[Investigator/Detective]

When Cindy met Carl, she sees this physically strong, good looking, successful, in her mind guy that unfortunately he's dealt with a tragedy of the death of his wife in a house fire in 1991.

[Cindy Carlson]

What he had told me about the fire was that he was able to pull the children out. By then the house was engulfed. It had been almost two years. He was heartbroken. He loved her. I felt extremely sorry for him.

[Family Member (Brother or Relative of Carl Carlson)]

I think she was yearning for the family package. He came with a package.

[Erin Deroche (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

It was pretty quick. He brought her over to the house and introduced us. And initially it was a nice change.

[Katie Reynolds (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

Of pace for me. It was, I'm gonna have a mom like all the other little kids my age have. She did initially fill that void.

[Investigator/Detective]

Cindy now is kind of the instant mother or the mother figure in her life.

[Cindy Carlson]

We were married in 1993.

[Co-narrator/Interviewer]

It turns out it wasn't so happily ever after for the Carlson kids. Their life with Carl, as they describe it, was filled with work, chores, discipline.

[Erin Deroche (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

We did the sweeping and the mopping, dusting, everyday vacuuming. We cooked.

[Katie Reynolds (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

Dad would get home and Cindy would go right to him right away. And, you know, Aaron did this or Levi did this and you need to take care of it right now. And he did.

[Cindy Carlson]

There were times when if the kids really misbehaved, I would tell him he needed to talk to them. And sometimes I felt like he was overly strict with them.

[Family Member (Brother or Relative of Carl Carlson)]

Carl was ruling them with such a tight fist they couldn't be kids. He always had chores to do, there was always work to do.

[Erin Deroche (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

He used physical labor as a form of punishment pretty consistently. One time, I don't even know what I'd done, but he wanted me to carry 10 gallon buckets full to the brim of water, back and forth from the house to the barn, and he would just watch and wait for my body to physically give out. When it was Levi, he would take him outside My father told me that Levi was a man so he could.

[Cindy Carlson]

Take it as far as physical abuse. I did not see that he hid it well.

[Katie Reynolds (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

Levi moved out when he was 16. It became an escape for him. He needed to get out of the house. Pretty soon thereafter he had met Cassie. Levi was 18 when he had his first daughter. And then the second one came two years later.

[Investigator/Detective]

He got married at a young age and their marriage did not work out.

[Erin Deroche (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

She was really one of the only people in his entire life that had loved him and accepted him for who he was. And losing that was traumatic for him.

[Katie Reynolds (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

Prior to Levi's death, his life was on an upswing. You know, he was coming back to the farm more often. He was able to get a job with one of the factories that was in Geneva. They had insurance and stuff that he needed as a father trying to support his children.

[Narrator]

After Levi's death, the investigation was very cursory. General reports were filed. The doctor signed off on it. There was no autopsy. It gave every appearance of being an unfortunate accident.

[Cindy Carlson]

It was shortly after Levi died that Carl had told me that Levi had had a life insurance policy.

[Investigator/Detective]

The life insurance policy that's taken out on Levi. It's beyond bizarre. Carl Drives Levi, his 23 year old son, to a insurance office and introduces Levi to an insurance agent.

[Narrator]

They wanted to get an insurance policy on Levi, who had two young girls, worked in a glass factory and felt there were job hazards and accidental death was a possibility.

[Investigator/Detective]

Carl convinces Levi to take out a life insurance policy worth $700,000.

[Cindy Carlson]

I didn't realize that Carl actually paid the first premium. I did not know that. And he paid cash.

[Narrator]

When this life insurance policy is taken out and the first payment is made, there's provisional coverage, but it's providing that the subject pass a medical exam. Carl and Levi did not tell the agent that Levi had a serious swallowing disorder that made it difficult to ingest food and that he had been treated for that disorder several years before.

[Investigator/Detective]

The likelihood is that New York Life would have suspended or dropped the policy or we had to rewrite it once Levi's medical conditions were brought to their attention.

[Narrator]

Levi Carlson's medical exam was scheduled for him the day after he died.

[Co-narrator/Interviewer]

Even though Levi didn't make it to that medical exam, the insurance company still paid out to Carl.

[Katie Reynolds (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

Dad also made a point to tell me was that Levi had left a will.

[Investigator/Reporter]

This was a handwritten note.

[Investigator/Detective]

Yes.

[Investigator/Reporter]

Saying what?

[Narrator]

That his father was going to be the sole executor of his estate and basically dispersed the money to his kids.

[Katie Reynolds (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

He said that it was barely enough to cover the funeral expenses for Levi.

[Co-narrator/Interviewer]

$700,000 that would be paying for a.

[Cindy Carlson]

Heck of a funeral.

[Co-narrator/Interviewer]

It turns out nobody in Carl's life knew about that life insurance money other than his wife Cindy.

[Cindy Carlson]

When I questioned Carl, why were you beneficiary? He had told me that because Levi was going through this nasty divorce.

[Investigator/Detective]

Carl made it out to be that Levi didn't trust his ex wife, that Levi wanted his daughters taken care of and he trusted his dad.

[Katie Reynolds (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

I didn't think it was odd because Levi had worked his way back into the house a little bit more and him and dad seemed to be getting along pretty good.

[Cindy Carlson]

I just trusted my husband. There was no reason for me to question anything.

[Investigator/Reporter]

The note says all of the assets go to the father. To be handed out.

[Narrator]

Yes.

[Investigator/Reporter]

And when was the letter notarized?

[Narrator]

The day of his death.

[Co-narrator/Interviewer]

At the time, law enforcement didn't know about any of this. So once it was ruled an accident, it seemed like it was case closed.

[Investigator/Detective]

It wasn't until four years later that the investigation was reopened.

[Investigator/Reporter]

With everything that you discovered here, what then did you make of what happened to his first wife?

[Narrator]

Suspicious.

[Colette Carlson (Sister of Christina)]

I went to the house the next day and could not for the life of me understand why somebody didn't try to get around. It wasn't an accident.

[Narrator]

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[Investigator/Reporter]

Years before Levi Carlson was would die underneath that truck. Carl Carlson had experienced loss before.

[Family Member (Brother or Relative of Carl Carlson)]

When Levi died, I assume it was some sort of a deja vu moment for Carl that he'd been there before. In 91, he had lost his wife and lost his home and everything they owned.

[Narrator]

There's beautiful mommy over there.

[Erin Deroche (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

My mom's name was Christina, but everybody was really close to her, called her Chris.

[Investigator/Detective]

I had two daughters. One was Susie homemaker, that was Chris. The other one was a little sports jock. That was Colette.

[Colette Carlson (Sister of Christina)]

She was three years older than me. Everybody knew I was her little sister. She didn't see bad in anyone. Even though somebody could have done something horrific, she would find a way to find something positive about them.

[Investigator/Detective]

Carl met his first wife, Christina when he was in the air force.

[Colette Carlson (Sister of Christina)]

She had told me she'd met a nice guy and so I asked him questions about him. She seemed very, very excited about this particular person. And then when she told me they were getting married, you know, I wished her the best. And as soon as I could get out there to see her, I got out there.

[Investigator/Detective]

Carl worked at a store, Cory, in Seneca county. And ultimately Carl moved to California to take a job.

[Narrator]

He got laid off.

[Investigator/Detective]

I said, come out here to California. You always have a job out here. I made him a partner in my company.

[Family Member (Brother or Relative of Carl Carlson)]

So Carl, out of the blue, just packed everybody up and he took off for California to strike it rich and famous. And that was a typical Carl adventure.

[Colette Carlson (Sister of Christina)]

And of course I'm excited because that means my sister and her kids are coming home. So I'm very excited.

[Family Member/Relative]

The Carlson family lived in the town of Murphy's. Murphys is a gold rush era town that was settled by pioneers, miners, and it's existed here since the mid to early late 1800s.

[Investigator/Detective]

It's Northern California. It's quite a hike from Sacramento, an hour or two. It's quiet backcountry roads.

[Erin Deroche (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

We loved Murphy's. My mom would actually take us on walks and we would collect leaves and acorns and we would go on picnics.

[Family Member/Relative]

Pennsylvania Gulch Road, where the Carlson family settled was off the highway down a.

[Investigator/Detective]

Rural road where Carl and Christina and their three children was an old mining shack. It was converted into a house, but it was, it was a difficult environment.

[Erin Deroche (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

It was very dilapidated. But I remember when we Moved in. Gosh, my mom put in a lot of effort to get the house clean.

[Colette Carlson (Sister of Christina)]

She painted it, she decorated it, she sewed curtains. She was a phenomenal seamstress.

[Erin Deroche (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

It was amazing when my father wasn't home, but when he was home, it was very tense.

[Colette Carlson (Sister of Christina)]

He just had a very aggressive personality. Kind of that personality that either my way or the highway. And the highway isn't an option. So it's my way. For her 30th birthday, I bought her a Glamour shot. I thought this would just be the perfect 30th birthday for her because she really didn't want to turn 30, walk into my house. He sees her, tells her, take the makeup off, you look like a whore. And she went to the bathroom and took it off.

[Erin Deroche (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

When things would get to the point where she felt she didn't want us to witness the arguments or the fights, she would request that they go back to the bedroom. But we. We heard. I heard.

[Colette Carlson (Sister of Christina)]

There were some glaring things to me that I didn't like that I talked to her about multiple times.

[Narrator]

According to Colette, Christina was getting ready to move out, take the kids with her and move in with her. Just wanted to wait, get through the holidays.

[Erin Deroche (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

Christmas morning, 1990.

[Narrator]

Levi, look at me, please.

[Erin Deroche (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

Let me get your face in this. Thank you, darling.

[Colette Carlson (Sister of Christina)]

It was the last Christmas we all had together at my mom's house. You know, opening presents. It's her being goofy.

[Narrator]

Get out of the dinosaurs.

[Investigator/Detective]

Look at this.

[Erin Deroche (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

On January 1, 1991. It was a day kind of like any other. We were just playing around the house.

[Family Member/Relative]

Carl's daughter Erin recalled him taking a Christmas tree out of the house and dousing it in kerosene.

[Erin Deroche (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

He was gonna burn the Christmas tree and he wanted us to watch. So he lined us up and said that he wanted us to see how quickly a house could burn. And I was just shy of seven, but I assumed it was kind of a lesson like, don't play with matches, don't play with fire. And then we went back inside. Our mom got us ready to go down for our nap.

[Family Member/Relative]

Levi was sleeping in his room. Katie and Aaron were sleeping in their room. And Christina went into the bathroom to take a bath.

[Investigator/Reporter]

So while Carl wife is taking a bath, he says that he was upstairs in the attic working on a fan before then going out to the garage.

[Investigator/Detective]

He walks out into the garage, which the garage is probably 50ft.

[Family Member/Relative]

He's working in the shop, and it's at that point he hears his wife screaming his name.

[Investigator/Detective]

He comes out, looks, and that's when.

[Family Member/Relative]

He sees the smoke, he sees flames, he sees the houses.

[Narrator]

The on.

[Family Member/Relative]

Hears Christina say, carl, get the kids.

[Investigator/Detective]

She loved those kids and she would have done anything for them.

[Erin Deroche (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

I heard my mother screaming and I went to the door. It was slightly jar so I kind of, you know, peeked out the door.

[Katie Reynolds (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

And at four years old, I don't think I really understood what was happening, but I saw it down the hallway, it was engulfed in flames.

[Investigator/Detective]

Carl says, you know, the smoke's pouring out of the house, flames. And he goes up on the porch and to Levi's bed and window and breaks the window.

[Family Member/Relative]

Carl claims he sees his son there unharmed. So he reaches in, grabs his son by the hair and throws his five year old son out of the house into safety.

[Investigator/Detective]

He then goes to the other side of the house, breaks the window, to the girl's bedroom.

[Erin Deroche (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

He was just there and he pulled us out.

[Family Member/Relative]

After saving Aaron and Katie, he said he returned to the house and tried to enter into the door, but there were too many flames.

[Narrator]

It's 1991, not everybody has a cell phone. So he leaves this fire scene.

[Family Member/Relative]

We decided his best next course of action would be to go seek out help.

[Investigator/Detective]

I had two different people come to.

[Narrator]

My door and said they had heard.

[Investigator/Detective]

On the scanner there was a fire at the end of Penguin Road.

[Narrator]

Just walked out here in the street. I could see the smoke and I.

[Investigator/Detective]

Knew, I knew where it was coming from. My first thought, just get out there.

[Narrator]

Emergency services, fire department and first responders respond to the same.

[Family Member/Relative]

The people that were close to Christina had a lot of questions about what happened that day. It's obvious that they're suspicious why he.

[Narrator]

Didn'T knock this out.

[Family Member (Brother or Relative of Carl Carlson)]

There was a $200,000 policy on Christina.

[Investigator/Detective]

It's just, it's all red flags.

[Co-narrator/Interviewer]

It makes you wonder just how unlucky is this guy.

[Investigator/Detective]

And these are all from the fire, From the house it burned.

[Family Member/Relative]

Christina Carlson perished in the house fire. They found her doubled over outside of the tub with a rag covering her face.

[Investigator/Detective]

That day I got out there and you know, I started looking around. Somebody directed me over to the ambulance and when I got in the back of the ambulance, I see the whole family except for my daughter Chris. So that's when I realized what had happened.

[Erin Deroche (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

Everybody was rushing around with a purpose and my dad wasn't. And he was just standing there casually like it was any other day.

[Narrator]

There were people in California who write from the beginning of 1991 believed that Christina's death was not accidental.

[Family Member/Relative]

Christina Carlson's cousins went to the burnt out home and created a video.

[Investigator/Detective]

She took extensive video footage inside and outside of the house. The area where Christina's body was discovered in the bathroom.

[Erin Deroche (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

This here is the bathroom where Christina was found.

[Narrator]

The bathroom door is here.

[Family Member/Relative]

Both of them evaluate the house, look through the ruins. It's obvious that they're suspicious why he.

[Narrator]

Didn'T knock this out.

[Family Member/Relative]

In front of the bathroom window is a board nailed into the wall.

[Narrator]

Most of the bathroom area is still intact. You can clearly see the boarded up window to the bathroom.

[Investigator/Detective]

Carl's story is that a few days prior to the fire, his wife was trying to open the bathroom window and she was using a toilet plunger and broke the window.

[Family Member/Relative]

Carl's solution, he said, was to take a warped wooden board that he had in his shop and use 17 nails to hammer it into the wall.

[Narrator]

There's no way she could have got that off.

[Colette Carlson (Sister of Christina)]

Isn't there anything she could have used.

[Narrator]

To get that off?

[Colette Carlson (Sister of Christina)]

I went to the house the next day. I asked somebody to drive me out there. And they said, colette, you don't want to go out there. And I said, yes, I do. I stood in the bathroom and could not for the life of me understand why somebody didn't try to get her out.

[Co-narrator/Interviewer]

Between the boarded up window and the fire raging just outside the bathroom door. She was trapped. There was no getting out.

[Family Member (Brother or Relative of Carl Carlson)]

I asked him, why didn't you get the board off yourself? And he said by the time he got around and got the kids out the windows, that it was too late. He couldn't get near it.

[Investigator/Reporter]

So after the fire, Carl talks to investigators and he tells them how he thinks the fire might have started.

[Investigator/Detective]

Carl goes on with a very elaborate story told back in 1991 that days prior to this fire, his wife brought in a five gallon jug that was filled with kerosene.

[Family Member/Relative]

They used kerosene heaters inside of the house. They have a cat and a dog. And those animals are roughhousing which knocks over the container of kerosene.

[Erin Deroche (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

I do remember there being a spill on the floor. Mom had towels and blankets piled up and we were having fun climbing over the top of them.

[Family Member (Brother or Relative of Carl Carlson)]

He had been working that day of the fire. He was working in the attic area.

[Co-narrator/Interviewer]

Carl says he was using a trouble light up in the attic for light Just before he went out to the garage.

[Family Member/Relative]

Carl's claimed that the trouble light, which either fell from the attic or which he left on the kerosene spill, Likely caused the fire.

[Investigator/Reporter]

And according to Carl, he says that once the fire began, he did what anyone would try to do to try to save their family.

[Erin Deroche (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

There are a few things that are a little fuzzy, but there are some things that I remember just like it was yesterday. He pulled us out through the window. He took Katie and I to the truck. He told us to get down and not to look. We were kids. Curiosity got the better of us. So we turned around, all of us, and just kind of watched.

[Family Member/Relative]

She watched Carl walk slowly to the house and not make any real attempt to break into the house and save Christina.

[Erin Deroche (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

Her mother, my father had said, mommy's gone to heaven. Even before the ambulances got there, the firefighters, like, while we're sitting in the truck, we didn't understand, of course, the gravity or what it really meant, but we knew, so we were all really quiet.

[Investigator/Detective]

Christina's death is ruled an accidental death.

[Narrator]

The actual physical cause of death of Christina Carlson was smoke inhalation, which indicates that the fire was not on top of her.

[Family Member (Brother or Relative of Carl Carlson)]

We just flew to California as soon as we could get there. He was very stoic, emotionless, and he just said, I want to go home, meaning New York. And at the time, it made sense.

[Investigator/Detective]

In four days, they had everything taken care of, and they were off to New York.

[Colette Carlson (Sister of Christina)]

They were gone before she was even laid to rest. If you really were that concerned about everything that happened, you would stay around and you wouldn't be avoiding talking with detectives or the fire marshal.

[Investigator/Detective]

Carl Kent, who was the investigator for California Department of Forestry, had a lot of questions about the cause and who started this fire.

[Narrator]

I was requested to come to a fire scene. I thought the circumstances of the fire were suspicious. The there was concern that something wasn't.

[Co-narrator/Interviewer]

Right, and it didn't help that Carl had taken out an insurance policy on Christina. Just weeks before that deadly fire, Carlson.

[Narrator]

Went to an insurance agent and bought a $200,000 policy on his wife.

[Family Member/Relative]

The fact that the policy was purchased 19 days before Christina's death, I think rang the alarm bells in the head of State Farm Insurance.

[Investigator/Detective]

State Farm brought in Ken Busky.

[Narrator]

Typically, I'm hired by insurance company to answer what the cause of the fire is. The story they related to me, at least initially, made sense as a story that the hot bulb from the trouble light could ignite the kerosene soaked into the carpet.

[Investigator/Reporter]

But, you know, when that investigator looked at that severely burned light, he was able to determine that that the filament had not been energized at the time of the fire, meaning the light wasn't on.

[Narrator]

If a bulb is off, of course, it's not apt to be the cause of the fire. Mr. Carlson's story simply couldn't have been true.

[Investigator/Reporter]

So Ken Busky turns his report into the insurance company telling them he's convinced that this was no accident.

[Investigator/Detective]

This was a set fire by a human being. Well, we clearly know there was only one human being capable.

[Co-narrator/Interviewer]

But for whatever reason, that report didn't stop the insurance company from paying out the claim.

[Family Member/Relative]

Carl was paid $215,000 and it was not explained why. Their recommendation to not have him be paid out was overlooked.

[Katie Reynolds (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

The insurance company did a very good investigation. Law enforcement, it didn't seem was doing anything.

[Narrator]

I never saw Mr. Bussky's report.

[Investigator/Detective]

I didn't know who Mr. Busky was.

[Narrator]

It just seemed like when Carl moved to New York a few days after the fire, it's like everything stopped and there wasn't much follow up. I asked if they would front the monies for me to travel back there and interview him.

[Co-narrator/Interviewer]

Carl Kent wanted to go to New York to interview Carlson in person, but his superiors turned him down saying that there just wasn't enough money for that kind of trip.

[Narrator]

The DA's office said it was a good circumstantial case, but there wasn't enough to prosecute. At that time I was hoping something would happen. But somewhere after maybe the 15th year, I was beginning to think somebody got away with murder.

[Co-narrator/Interviewer]

All these years later, with his 23 year old son Levi dead, there are people who start to wonder, did he get away with murder not once but twice.

[Investigator/Reporter]

You get a phone call.

[Narrator]

I was asked if, if we'd investigated an accident involving Levi Carlson's death.

[Investigator/Reporter]

Do you remember the call to this day? Oh yeah.

[Investigator/Detective]

Cindy's concerned now that my first wife dies in this tragedy. Levi dies in this tragedy. Am I next?

[Narrator]

The truck's now on my steps. I don't think he's alive.

[Family Member (Brother or Relative of Carl Carlson)]

After Levi died.

[Narrator]

Oh my God.

[Family Member (Brother or Relative of Carl Carlson)]

Life moved forward. Everyone went about their business.

[Investigator/Detective]

Time marched on. Carl collected a large insurance policy on Levi.

[Colette Carlson (Sister of Christina)]

If I had known that there was an insurance, I would have gone straight to the sheriff's department.

[Family Member/Relative]

Carl received approximately $700,000. He claimed that this money was going to be used for Levi's children, his grandchildren.

[Investigator/Detective]

Levi's insurance money is being spent by Carl and Cindy, not Levi's children.

[Investigator/Reporter]

What were they spending money on?

[Narrator]

Well, it looks like a lot of money went to a duck business. A gourmet duck business.

[Family Member (Brother or Relative of Carl Carlson)]

It was just another one of Carl's daydreaming ideas, get rich quick schemes.

[Narrator]

The idea was he was going to raise gourmet ducks to sell to restaurants.

[Cindy Carlson]

But what happened is Carl started right away ordering more and more ducks. We went from raising 10, 20 gourmet ducks to thousands. I mean, duck feed for thousands of, of ducks cost a lot of money.

[Investigator/Detective]

He doesn't know really what he's doing. He's just bailing water. It's losing money left and right.

[Katie Reynolds (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

Dad and Cindy, their finances weren't making sense to me. There was also new vehicles quite frequently.

[Erin Deroche (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

They would constantly be going on vacations.

[Katie Reynolds (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

I finally confronted her and I, you know, I said, what is going on here? This doesn't make sense. But she just denied everything.

[Co-narrator/Interviewer]

Carl is the person responsible for spending the bulk of that money. And he kept Cindy in the dark.

[Cindy Carlson]

At this time, he's keeping me blind. He doesn't want me to know anything because he knows I questioned everything. He's just going to do what he wants to do. That's just how it was with Carl.

[Investigator/Reporter]

Cindy Carlson told us that it was about two years after Levi's death that she actually started to grow suspicious of the man she was married to.

[Cindy Carlson]

There is not one thing that I just said, oh my God, he did it. It happened over time. I would have these panic attacks. I would be in my living room and say, oh my gosh, did he have something to do with Levi's death? Christina's family said he had something to do with her death.

[Investigator/Reporter]

Was she convinced there was a killer in her own home?

[Narrator]

I think that she suspected it.

[Co-narrator/Interviewer]

Cindy Carlson says that during this time she was so terrified of her husband, she started sleeping with a knife under her bed. And finally she just had to move out.

[Cindy Carlson]

At the end, when there was very little money left and Carl kept spending and spending and spending. Yes, I took some money because I needed to keep myself alive. I had nothing left and I'm scared.

[Narrator]

She is concerned enough that she hires a private detective to look into it.

[Erin Deroche (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

It was self preservation. She probably was concerned for her life. When she realized that there was a.

[Cindy Carlson]

Policy on her, the private investigator started digging in and finding out I would be worth 1.2 million to Carl if I was dead. One night I had called my cousin and told her I think Carl might have killed Levi. She said, why would Carl kill Levi? There's nothing for him to gain from that. And I said, yes, there was. He gained $700,000.

[Erin Deroche (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

Cindy's cousin Jackie Hymel called in a concern that she had to the police.

[Investigator/Reporter]

And you get a phone call and what are you told?

[Narrator]

I was asked if we'd Investigated an accident involving Levi Carlson, and I looked it up.

[Investigator/Detective]

This family member's got some suspicions, concerned that things just aren't ending up, you know, wherever Carl goes, tragedy takes place and financial payoffs follow suit.

[Narrator]

Once we started looking into prior incidents, that was the first indication that something wasn't right here.

[Investigator/Reporter]

And so as investigators start to look into Carl Carlson's past, you know, it doesn't take them long to see what is a frightening pattern that dates back decades.

[Narrator]

The first thing that came up was a car fire from 1986. It was a brand new mustang purchased by Carl Carlson, had $10,000 insurance on it, and it burned up in his.

[Family Member (Brother or Relative of Carl Carlson)]

Driveway, According to the report we heard was nothing in the trunk, nothing in the glove box. The car just burned up, and insurance took care of the payment, and he got out from under it.

[Investigator/Detective]

The barn fire is another one of those coincidental tragedies.

[Cindy Carlson]

One evening in 2002, I was asleep, and Carl sat upright in bed and looked out the window and said, oh, my gosh, the barn's on fire. I knew there were horses in there. There was our prize Belgian mare and two babies.

[Katie Reynolds (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

It was devastating to see the barn burning down, which is part of our family's history, and then also to see the loss of these horses that were conveniently just put in the Barn.

[Investigator/Detective]

It's around $115,000 Carl's paid out on this barn and the horses.

[Family Member (Brother or Relative of Carl Carlson)]

Here we go one more time. A tragedy and a payout.

[Investigator/Detective]

I call it blood money. He got an insurance policy from my daughter. He got another insurance policy when he had a barn burned down with expensive horses in it.

[Erin Deroche (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

Seemed like every couple years, something was burning, you know, So, I mean, I feel like we kind of knew and just expected.

[Investigator/Detective]

We choose to reach out to Cindy Carlson to further the investigation.

[Narrator]

First thing she said was, thank God you called.

[Investigator/Reporter]

When you asked her to help you out, she said, yes, she agreed and put a wire on.

[Narrator]

Part of me feels like I'm walking into a booby trap.

[Cindy Carlson]

Do you want to go through my purse? I thought, maybe I can get him to confess. That was my goal.

[Investigator/Detective]

If Carl did this, she wanted to get him.

[Cindy Carlson]

I'm terrified. I'm thinking, oh, my gosh, my husband is a murderer.

[Narrator]

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[Cindy Carlson]

Edu.

[Investigator/Reporter]

Shopping is hard, right? But I found a better way. Stitch fix online Personal styling makes it easy. I just give my stylist my size, style and budget preferences. I order boxes when I want and how I want. No subscription required.

[Investigator/Detective]

And he sends just for me pieces.

[Investigator/Reporter]

Plus outfit recommendations and styling tips. I keep woodworks and send back the rest.

[Narrator]

It's so easy.

[Investigator/Reporter]

Make style easy. Get started [e-mail] Spotify. That's stitchfix.com Spotify. You know, this was a story that played out in upstate New York. I'm from upstate New York and I remember people consumed by this. And it only got more twisted as the years went on.

[Cindy Carlson]

What kind of parent or father would push a truck over on their own child and let them suffer and die? It was the most terrifying time in my life.

[Co-narrator/Interviewer]

And it becomes a huge story.

[Cindy Carlson]

They asked him, you know what this is about?

[Narrator]

And he said, oh, you want to talk about, about my dead wife and dead son, Linda Lindo. So when he says, who could do that? Who could kill their wife that way? Well, we already, we already know that you killed your, your son that way.

[Colette Carlson (Sister of Christina)]

I told him that I wanted to see my sister and he said, you can't. She's a crispy critter. That was his turn, a crispy critter.

[Erin Deroche (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

He smiled like a Cheshire cat and he said, it's been 22 years. They haven't caught me yet and they're not going to.

[Investigator/Reporter]

But before Carl would walk away for good, there would be one more unbelievable twist in this case that it's almost impossible to believe.

[Erin Deroche (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

There's Carlette getting the turkey ready.

[Cindy Carlson]

Levi, boy, don't you look handsome today.

[Investigator/Detective]

This wasn't about a job. This was a passion. This was a passion to bring justice.

[Erin Deroche (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

Look at those two lovely people over there.

[Investigator/Detective]

For Christina Levi and their family, my pride and joy.

[Family Member/Relative]

Sitting over in the rocker, investigators in Seneca county get a tip. And that tip is lookin to Carl Carlson.

[Narrator]

Look at that big son in law.

[Family Member/Relative]

Mind you, Katie, that's when the tide starts to shift.

[Investigator/Reporter]

So the year was 2012. It was about three years after Levi Carlson had died. And as investigators begin to take a much closer look at this case, they learned that Levi Carlson had a life insurance policy and that his father Carl was the beneficiary to this $700,000 life insurance policy. That seems very odd. When Levi had children of his own to leave money to.

[Narrator]

Yeah. For me, that was enough to reopen the investigation right there.

[Cindy Carlson]

It was the most terrifying time in my life. I decided that I just could not do it anymore. I couldn't live with Carl anymore. I needed to get out of the house. Shortly after I left is when law enforcement called me.

[Narrator]

First thing she said was, thank God you called. And that. She said. And she said that she also had suspicions.

[Cindy Carlson]

They said they had a tip from a family member that maybe there was something more to Levi's death. That's when we started working together, law enforcement.

[Investigator/Detective]

Cindy was coming in on a regular basis. It was an ongoing process for months. I think she was almost kind of like almost wanting to be part of the police investigation team.

[Cindy Carlson]

I was watching a show where a woman was taping her mother, secretly trying to get her to confess to killing her father. And I remember just thinking, I'm gonna do that. I'm gonna get a recorder. I'm gonna start recording my conversations with Carl. I met Carl in a busy restaurant, and Carl had actually picked the place, I think, because he was worried that I was recording. And I just told him that I'd consider getting back together with him if he came clean or confessed about every single thing he did during our marriage, Every lie he told. You come clean, and I'll consider it. He actually confessed.

[Narrator]

When she came to my office, she was all excited, and she said, he just told me he killed Levi. And she goes. And I recorded it.

[Investigator/Detective]

I think she. She pretty much thought that this was the home run.

[Cindy Carlson]

What happened was it was inaudible.

[Investigator/Detective]

It was a pretty poor recording at best, and surely one that didn't capture all that Cindy thought it captured.

[Investigator/Reporter]

But now it's the detectives who have an idea, and they ask Cindy if she's willing to wear a wire to try to get Carl Carlson to confess to this again.

[Narrator]

We're gonna pick a restaurant, we're gonna put undercover officers in there, and we're going to wire her up professionally and see if they can recreate this conversation.

[Cindy Carlson]

And I said, yes.

[Investigator/Reporter]

She's got the wire on. Where?

[Narrator]

Underneath her clothing.

[Investigator/Reporter]

And what does he think he's walking into?

[Narrator]

He thinks he's coming to talk to his wife about getting back together, about reconciliation. Yes.

[Investigator/Reporter]

But she has no plan to get back together? No.

[Narrator]

She's here for you.

[Investigator/Detective]

Yes.

[Investigator/Reporter]

So the two of them were sitting together in the corner, and you had private investigators all through the room?

[Narrator]

Yes.

[Investigator/Detective]

Several of us sat in the immediate area with other investigators in plain clothes sitting inside the Restaurant nearby.

[Narrator]

Side two?

[Cindy Carlson]

Yep.

[Narrator]

Sit up by the fireplace here. Where would you like to sit?

[Cindy Carlson]

Over by the fireplace is good, I think. Is that all right? Thank you. This time. Now he's very suspicious that I want to hear the same things that he said before.

[Narrator]

Did I purposely do it? No, not at all.

[Cindy Carlson]

That's not what you told me, Carl. No, it isn't.

[Narrator]

Just part of me feels like I'm walking into a booby trap.

[Cindy Carlson]

He even said, I feel like you're setting me up. How am I going to set a trap? Do you want to go through my purse?

[Investigator/Detective]

Carl's denying that he ever made any such admission. So we're kind of like taking like. Well, what did he really tell Cindy what's going on here?

[Cindy Carlson]

I couldn't get him to confess to the same exact thing that he had confessed two days before.

[Investigator/Reporter]

You can hear Cindy Carlson pressing her husband, Carl, over and over again. She doesn't give up.

[Family Member/Relative]

As the questions become more aggressive, Carl appears to make a halfway admission.

[Cindy Carlson]

I asked you if you push the truck, and you said yes.

[Narrator]

No, I didn't push the car. I said no. I said I had nothing to do, but I said I took advantage of the situation once it happened. And that is exactly what it said to me.

[Cindy Carlson]

Carl, you told me that you didn't set it up that way, but when you were in there, you saw the opportunity after it had happened.

[Narrator]

Then I panicked and saw the opportunity.

[Investigator/Reporter]

Opportunity, A very strange word for a father to use about a son's death.

[Narrator]

I would find it very unusual that a parent would refer to the death of their child as an opportunity.

[Cindy Carlson]

For right now, I need.

[Narrator]

I know, but I'm just telling you.

[Cindy Carlson]

I mean, did it fall hard or no? I mean, you just had to bump it.

[Narrator]

I mean, it's so wobbly, you know, because the only thing that was touching the ground is just the back.

[Investigator/Detective]

Wheels.

[Narrator]

Any dessert?

[Cindy Carlson]

Oh, no, no. But I'll have more coffee than sure. So then a bit. And then, I mean, what, did he make a noise Atlas instead? I thought.

[Narrator]

I mean, you think?

[Family Member/Relative]

It's not clear cut and it's not definitive.

[Investigator/Detective]

By no means did we think this was a slam dunk.

[Cindy Carlson]

All right, I'll be in touch with you. Okay. All right, bye.

[Narrator]

So at that point, we knew we were going to be bringing him in.

[Cindy Carlson]

For an interview, and they asked him to come in for questioning. They said, do you know what this is about?

[Narrator]

And he said, oh, you want to talk about my dead wife and dead son?

[Investigator/Detective]

This isn't going to be a Simple interview and a simple confession. And we all kind of know that.

[Family Member/Relative]

Going into this, Carl's very comfortable with them until they start asking him very pointed questions. That's when the interview turns into an interrogation.

[Narrator]

Killed him.

[Investigator/Detective]

What killed him?

[Narrator]

The truck. How did the truck kill him?

[Investigator/Detective]

Landed out, just fell over.

[Narrator]

I felt like I was getting close. He was close to telling me what really happened that day. You're that close, man. You're close.

[Investigator/Detective]

It was November 23, 2012.

[Narrator]

Go ahead and have a seat.

[Investigator/Detective]

Carl is picked up by two investigators. He's brought to the Seneca County Sheriff's office into an interview room.

[Family Member/Relative]

And you can see in that interview that Carl's very comfortable with them.

[Investigator/Detective]

I think it's the 23rd, but you know what?

[Narrator]

Let me check.

[Investigator/Detective]

We want to be sure about that.

[Family Member/Relative]

The investigators are very reasonable with how they initially approach it. They Mirandize him.

[Narrator]

We're obligated to read to your rights.

[Investigator/Detective]

I don't want you to get nervous.

[Narrator]

About it, but we're going to do it because we do everything by the book. Okay? So you have the right to remain silent.

[Investigator/Detective]

Most of the questions we asked we already knew the answers to. It was just going to be how Carl was going to answer them.

[Investigator/Reporter]

You haul him in and you begin asking questions. How many different stories did he have?

[Cindy Carlson]

3.

[Investigator/Reporter]

What was version one?

[Narrator]

Version one was essentially the same story that was in the original report.

[Investigator/Reporter]

So Carl would tell detectives that after he returned home from that funeral with Cindy that he walked out into the garage and discovered his son Levi crushed underneath that truck.

[Narrator]

Went out there, then found him, you know, then we went to the hospital. What do you mean you found him? I found him dead.

[Family Member/Relative]

Carl knows that they know something. He doesn't know the extent of what they know.

[Narrator]

Here's the thing. You confessed to your wife. I lied to my wife. I'm just here.

[Colette Carlson (Sister of Christina)]

You have her wired?

[Investigator/Detective]

Yes, we do.

[Narrator]

I thought you did. It's all recorded. One thing became very clear is that he liked to talk. And he liked to talk about his favorite subject, which was him. Do you mind if I stand up?

[Colette Carlson (Sister of Christina)]

No.

[Family Member/Relative]

Carl is talking about his history in the air force.

[Narrator]

We knew that you were in the air Force.

[Family Member/Relative]

His personal injuries, and it tore three of them. He's going through basically a complete narrative of his life.

[Investigator/Detective]

So anyways, we put him back down again.

[Narrator]

I have to, because I'm 100% disabled.

[Investigator/Detective]

He wants to keep reverting and talking about the pain in his back and how his back's bothering him and wool me and forget about that his son's died, his wife's died. Let's worry about Carl and his back problem.

[Cindy Carlson]

It was typical of him trying to get sympathy throughout the whole interrogation.

[Narrator]

There's one thing that stuck in my mind that came from Cindy Carlson. Her exact words were, he's a sympathy junkie. And as we got into the latter part of the interview, I gave him a lot of sympathy and a lot of hands on contact. And that did work.

[Investigator/Detective]

Roughly three hours into the interview, his version two starts.

[Investigator/Reporter]

Version number two was what?

[Narrator]

When he went back into the garage to see Levi, he was already dead. The truck had already been fallen over, and I found him dead.

[Investigator/Detective]

You went out there in the truck was rolled over on him.

[Colette Carlson (Sister of Christina)]

Yeah.

[Narrator]

And I. I don't know.

[Investigator/Detective]

You panicked in what regard?

[Narrator]

Just I left.

[Investigator/Detective]

So you saw him. Did you run over to call medical help, call 911 now, was there a phone in the garage or a cell phone? Or you run back to the house and called 911?

[Narrator]

No, I went to the funeral.

[Investigator/Reporter]

So he saw his son trapped and dead under the truck and still left for the funeral?

[Family Member/Relative]

Yes.

[Investigator/Detective]

Version two is far more ridiculous than version one. And instead of screaming for help, going to get help, he simply goes, well, okay, my son's dead.

[Narrator]

I mean, it was an accident. I blame myself every day.

[Investigator/Detective]

But now when he returns and he finds his son dead underneath the truck is when he flips and goes crazy and starts screaming for help.

[Narrator]

I love that kid more than. Because I knew he was struggling. I knew he went through what I went through as a kid. You know, I would give my life for that kid. I think throughout the interview, he was convinced that he was going to convince us. I mean, he had reason to think that way. He had gotten away with it for a long time.

[Family Member/Relative]

The interview ultimately lasts for nine hours. They put on the. The pressure harder. Carlson asks to move his chair. Right? He moves his chair. He puts it in the corner of the room. Both the investigators have literally backed him into a corner.

[Investigator/Detective]

Did you tell Cindy that you.

[Narrator]

When she asked you if the car.

[Investigator/Detective]

If you push the car over and Levi and she asked you, did it push hard? Do you remember telling her? No, it pushed easy.

[Narrator]

I. I don't remember ever could. Have you said that I could if.

[Investigator/Detective]

It'S on the audio.

[Narrator]

If it is, then I probably said it.

[Investigator/Reporter]

Yeah, you keep pushing. And yet a third story emerges. Come at.

[Narrator]

Let it out, let it out, let it out. I'll walk with you, man. I'll walk with you. Was it just a split second thing I Felt like I was getting close with him. It's almost like a physical thing. You can almost feel it. I thought he was close to telling me something more about what really happened that day.

[Investigator/Reporter]

It would turn out Carl Carlson would have one more version of this story. He said that when he went out into that garage, that his son Levi was still alive, was actually working on the truck.

[Narrator]

Never hurt him. Good. I opened the truck door.

[Investigator/Detective]

Okay.

[Narrator]

To open the truck door, because I had to get inside to move the linkage for the truck. And when I did, it tipped and it just fell over. So you see, car was watching. We've gone from he was dead and he walked in there to now letting the falcon who opened the door so take the final step. There is no more. I stepped into the truck and the night fell, and I was just scared. I don't know why. I can't imagine walking away and leaving your child dying on the floor.

[Investigator/Reporter]

They were going to a funeral.

[Investigator/Detective]

Yes.

[Investigator/Reporter]

And yet many would argue he had just created one right here in his own garage.

[Investigator/Detective]

We know that the real version is version four, the untold version, where Carl jacked it up on a single post, got Levi to get underneath there and with all his force, pushes the truck over on him, causes this truck to crash down onto Levi.

[Cindy Carlson]

What kind of parent or father would push a truck over on their own child and let them suffer and die underneath a truck?

[Investigator/Detective]

That evening, after the interview with Carl, we arrested Carl for the murder, murder in second degree, and for the insurance fraud.

[Narrator]

I remember thinking, well, that one in California certainly needs to be looked at a lot harder than it was.

[Erin Deroche (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

I went to go visit him and I was like, I know that you killed my mother. And he smiled like a Cheshire cat. And he said, it's been 22 years. They haven't caught me yet, and they're not going to.

[Colette Carlson (Sister of Christina)]

Once Carl was charged in New York, it gave me a glimmer of hope that maybe we could finally get some traction in Calaveras County.

[Erin Deroche (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

Look at me, please.

[Colette Carlson (Sister of Christina)]

Please.

[Erin Deroche (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

Chris. Thank you.

[Investigator/Reporter]

Two decades after Christina died in that house fire, her sister Colette never gave up. She believed that this was not an accident.

[Co-narrator/Interviewer]

It turns out the investigators in New York have been digging into this case as well.

[Narrator]

Watch Carl. I don't trust that man.

[Investigator/Detective]

We're interviewing Carl about Levi, obviously, because we're investigators with New York State, but we're going to further this investigation in California.

[Narrator]

Well, about halfway through the interview, he does make a real off the wall remark. He comes out and says, what kind of person does that what kind of person kills his own son or his wife? There's nothing that can justify killing your wife, your kids, your. Your uncles, your parents, your. I mean, it'd be different if you killed. I didn't say you killed your wife. No, I know, but I'm just saying, you know, on. That's why I'm saying wife, kids, whatever. Carl, did you. No, no, I already been through that. No, hell no. And no way in hell. I thought it was a strange thing for him to bring up. California was on his mind, even if it wasn't necessarily on ours at the moment.

[Investigator/Detective]

Does he stick to his story about what he told in 1991? To some degree, yes. And some degree, no. So was there a window in the back?

[Narrator]

There was one that was like extremely, extremely, extremely small.

[Co-narrator/Interviewer]

But of course there was that video that Christina's cousin made showing us exactly how big that window was.

[Erin Deroche (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

This here is the bathroom where Christina was found.

[Co-narrator/Interviewer]

Here on a picture of this window.

[Investigator/Reporter]

Was it like an old window or was it.

[Narrator]

Well, the window was like that big and it was boarded up.

[Investigator/Detective]

Wait, did you board it up?

[Narrator]

What's that?

[Investigator/Detective]

Did you board it up?

[Narrator]

Yeah, we had to because it was no good. But you couldn't sit out of anyone. You couldn't put. You might be able to put a baby out of it. A baby. You and I, or 80 pound woman.

[Co-narrator/Interviewer]

There's no way that video zoomed in on that bathroom window and you could see it was large enough for a person to get out of.

[Erin Deroche (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

Why don't you give Carl a big kiss?

[Narrator]

Oh, geez.

[Investigator/Reporter]

The investigators ask Carlson about the insurance policy that he had on his way Christina, and how long before her death that he actually took that policy out on her.

[Investigator/Detective]

So about how long before do you.

[Erin Deroche (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

Think.

[Investigator/Detective]

Was it like in other people's minds?

[Narrator]

Like relatively soon? It's gotta be, it's gotta be.

[Family Member (Brother or Relative of Carl Carlson)]

It'S.

[Narrator]

Gotta be like three, four months or something. Oh.

[Co-narrator/Interviewer]

But detectives already know, and Carl certainly should have known that he had taken out that life insurance policy just 19 days before Christina died.

[Investigator/Detective]

It's very simple. The truth is the truth. But when you start telling lies, it's hard to remember the lies and retell the lies. And for every lie you tell two lies, and for the two lies you tell four lies. And it keeps getting. And compound it, it's, it's interesting the, the situations you've had occur in your life.

[Narrator]

Tell me about it. I look back at it, I look at it.

[Investigator/Detective]

It doesn't strike twice.

[Narrator]

No, it strikes. Well, I'll tell you what, when friends get around and I, we talk about that, and it's like, there's no way. How can one person have this much happen?

[Family Member/Relative]

There were so many people that harbored suspicions in 1991. There was documentation from State Farm Insurance, from fire investigators.

[Investigator/Reporter]

Fire investigators like Ken Buskey, who was hired by that insurance company all those years ago back in 1991. Turns out he had even more damning evidence that this fire wasn't an accident, that this fire was intentionally set.

[Narrator]

It appeared that the fire had started on. On the carpet outside the bathroom door. So I was very interested in the carpet for that reason.

[Co-narrator/Interviewer]

Buskey examined that carpet closely, and he discovered something that was surprising. His report noted that there was evidence of a second kerosene pour right before the fire, not the spill that happened from the dog and cat roughhousing around. This pour happened right before the fire.

[Narrator]

The second spill appeared to be a deliberate pour, anywhere from a few seconds to a matter of just a few minutes prior to the fire. And so at that point in time, I was thinking that the state of California would proceed to treat this as if it were a murder. I kept my files and still have my files.

[Investigator/Reporter]

And there would be another person who never gave up the evidence that he collected. State investigator Carl Kent.

[Family Member/Relative]

Carl Kent harbored suspicions for so long that when he retired, he took documents, two boxes of them with an audio recording, with papers, and kept them.

[Narrator]

That's the only one that I've ever done that with. I would have loved to gone to New York. I think I could have talked to Carl. And it may have taken, you know, 5, 6, 7, 8, 10 hours, who knows, of talking to him? I think we might have been able to get a confession.

[Co-narrator/Interviewer]

After Carlson is arrested in New York for the murder of his son, the media catches wind of it, and it becomes a huge story.

[Investigator/Reporter]

A man accused of killing his wife and son for the insurance money.

[Erin Deroche (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

Do you have anything to say, sir?

[Investigator/Reporter]

Tonight, it's the explosive case. But was the accident really a surprise to everyone? Because when investigators start digging, a shocking discovery. Was there a deadly pattern in this family?

[Investigator/Detective]

After all, the media brought so much attention to this case. It was relentless. The pressure that was continuing to put.

[Narrator]

On Calaveras county, that's what really got things going.

[Co-narrator/Interviewer]

But before he could get to trial, Carlson did something that no one saw coming.

[Family Member (Brother or Relative of Carl Carlson)]

I was thrilled and I was pissed because that was him in control again.

[Narrator]

This episode is brought to you by Greenlight. Get this. Adults with financial literacy skills have 82%.

[Co-narrator/Interviewer]

More wealth than Those who don't from.

[Narrator]

Swimming lessons to piano classes, us parents invest in so many things to enrich our kids lives but are we investing in their future financial success? With Greenlight you can teach your kids financial literacy skills like earning, saving and investing. And this investment costs less than that. After school treat start prioritizing their financial education and future today with a risk free trial at greenlight.com Spotify greenlight.com Spotify.

[Investigator/Detective]

A KFC tale in the Pursuit of.

[Narrator]

Flavor the holidays were tricky for the Colonel. He loved people, but he also loved peace and quiet. So he cooked up KFC's $4.99 chicken pot pie.

[Investigator/Detective]

Warm, flaky, with savory sauce and vegetables. It's a tender, chicken filled excuse to get some time to yourself and step.

[Narrator]

Away from decking the halls. Whatever that means. The colonel lived so we could chicken.

[Investigator/Detective]

KFC's chicken pot pie the best $4.99.

[Narrator]

You'Ll spend this season.

[Family Member/Relative]

Prices and participation may vary while supplies last. Taxes, tips and fees extra.

[Erin Deroche (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

We were never allowed to talk about our mother, but Levi and I would talk about it. About what he remembered, about what I remembered, and about how things just didn't add up. A year or two before Levi moved out, Levi and I told our father that we knew that he had murdered our mother.

[Cindy Carlson]

Levi was around 17 years old and Carl had heard that Levi was telling people that he, Carl, had killed his mother.

[Erin Deroche (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

He was arguing with our father and just blurted it out.

[Cindy Carlson]

I remember is Carl just saying, why would you say that I killed your mother? What are the people gonna think?

[Erin Deroche (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

Levi, God love him, he had a steel spine. So he did not back down. And that only infuriated my father further. And it resulted in a fistfight in the kitchen. After he was jailed, I went to go visit him. He wanted to be able to give me a hug or something. And he was very pissed off that he was in this box and he was trying to convince me that he never would have killed her brother, he never would have killed her mom. And I just listened to it for a little bit and I stopped him and I looked at him and I was like, I know that you did this and I know that you killed my mother. And he paused and it was like he completely calmed down. And he looked at me, he smiled like a Cheshire cat. And he said, it's been 22 years. They haven't caught me yet and they're not going to.

[Family Member (Brother or Relative of Carl Carlson)]

After he was arrested, I was involved as much as I could. I followed every news article and I was Excited. I wanted that thing to go to trial because there was no way he was gonna walk off that thing.

[Family Member/Relative]

There was no trial in Levi's case.

[Investigator/Detective]

After insurance fraud was dropped as a charge, Carlson.

[Narrator]

Carlson pleaded guilty.

[Co-narrator/Interviewer]

Carlson admitted to killing his son.

[Erin Deroche (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

It was a huge relief to know that we weren't going to have to go through trial.

[Family Member/Relative]

Carl ultimately pleaded to second degree murder.

[Narrator]

Carl's image is super important. I felt that in the New York case, when he saw the witness list including his own children testifying against him, I think he thought he was going to look bad.

[Family Member (Brother or Relative of Carl Carlson)]

That was his cowardly way up not doing that trial. That was him in control again.

[Co-narrator/Interviewer]

As a part of his plea deal, Carlson had to stand up in court and tell the judge exactly what he had done to his son. And in this version of the story, he tells the court something more horrifying than we ever thought before.

[Narrator]

He admits that he pushed the truck onto his son. He jacked it up on a wobbly jack, knowing that it was life threatening for someone to be underneath it and that Levi was still alive when he left.

[Co-narrator/Interviewer]

He left his son Levi alive, crushed under that truck, and walked away.

[Katie Reynolds (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

It was devastating for me to have my dad admit that it wasn't just the loss of my brother with that one statement. It was the loss of my father, too.

[Family Member/Relative]

He was sentenced to 15 years to life in the New York State prison system.

[Family Member (Brother or Relative of Carl Carlson)]

He showed no remorse. Today, it's like it was a game, and it wasn't a game. It was people's lives. I didn't like the sentence at all. Was my nephew only worth 15 years?

[Investigator/Detective]

Some of the Carlson family say there's.

[Narrator]

More work to be done, not here, but in California.

[Investigator/Reporter]

Then there'd be a turn. Authorities had decided to reopen the investigation into Christina Carlson's death in California back in 1991.

[Investigator/Detective]

For all these years, I literally thought the man got away with murder and there was nothing I could do. And the hard part is you never forget.

[Katie Reynolds (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

I think it really was the media exposure in combination with the New York State Police pushing California and of course, the family.

[Erin Deroche (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

My aunt, God love her, my Aunt Colette was on them like white on rice to make sure that this happened.

[Colette Carlson (Sister of Christina)]

I definitely ramped up my activities to try and get their attention that, you know, we're still out here, we're still waiting for justice.

[Co-narrator/Interviewer]

The authorities in California start digging into the case, and they unearth evidence that had long been forgotten.

[Family Member/Relative]

You start to hear about all these former figures that were Vettel Forefront in 1991, getting contacted again So I pick.

[Narrator]

Up the phone and I'm totally surprised to hear about this case. It's come back. The DA's office in Calaveras county, they contacted me and says, do you know anything about the fire that happened in 1991? And I go, yes. And they said, do you know where the records are? Darn.

[Investigator/Reporter]

All these years later, that California fire investigator still had those two boxes of evidence sitting in his basement. And he turned them over to the DA. This evening, a brand new development in the 2020 exclusive you saw here first. The DA there suddenly announces that they're charging Carl Carlson in the death of his first wife, Christina.

[Narrator]

I was very surprised when I was California's case went forward. That case is 29 years old. I knew that those witnesses and that evidence were going to be scrutinized.

[Family Member (Brother or Relative of Carl Carlson)]

I was very eager to see California's trial play out. We as a family needed to see it play out.

[Cindy Carlson]

I submit to you that the defendant.

[Erin Deroche (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

Built Christina a coffin and trapped her in there. Christina took her last breath trapped in this coffin.

[Investigator/Reporter]

It just becomes more unbelievable with every development. No one could have seen where this was going.

[Colette Carlson (Sister of Christina)]

Everybody in the courtroom just kind of sucked in their breath. They were so surprised. This was not an accident. It was intentional. We want to go to trial. My mom never stopped believing. She believed from the very beginning that the trial would actually occur. And she's got a very strong faith, you know, and ultimately she was right.

[Family Member/Relative]

The trial took place in Calaveras county superior court, approximately 29 years almost to the date after Christina Carl's and died.

[Katie Reynolds (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

It was heartbreaking to see my dad in the courtroom. He turns and looks at me and smiles. Just a normal dad looking and smiling at his daughter. And it brought back all of these emotions.

[Erin Deroche (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

Christina Alexander Carlson. With so many fans to so many.

[Cindy Carlson]

People, the defendant, through cold and calculated.

[Erin Deroche (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

Measures, extinguished the light that was Christina.

[Cindy Carlson]

And he did it on purpose.

[Co-narrator/Interviewer]

The prosecution scores an early victory by convincing the judge to allow them to tell jurors about the previous incidents and all the insurance payouts.

[Family Member/Relative]

To Carlson, I'd say it was absolutely foundational to the setup of their case that the jury know not just about the death of Christina, but about the barn fire, about the car fire, about the death of Levi.

[Narrator]

So when he says, who could do that? Who could kill their wife that way? Well, we already know that you killed your. Your son that way. Carl has a conviction in New York for the murder of his son. I can't argue against that and I wouldn't try. You're not Here to determine whether he's a good and pious man. That's not your job. Your job is to determine if the people have proven beyond a reasonable doubt that Carl killed his wife and that he did it for money.

[Family Member/Relative]

The first person on the stand was Erin Deroche.

[Erin Deroche (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

She knows what happened. She knows what her father did to her mother.

[Family Member/Relative]

She could speak so clearly about the moment that everyone was evaluating.

[Erin Deroche (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

I testified about his behavior after getting us out of the house. And, of course, for the few days following the fire.

[Family Member/Relative]

She brought memories of her confronting Carl after his arrest and the death of Levi. It doesn't get much more damning than someone who's supposed to. To love you unconditionally. Says, I believe he killed my mother. I know he killed my brother.

[Colette Carlson (Sister of Christina)]

I was very nervous to testify. I've never participated in anything like this before.

[Investigator/Reporter]

And it was on the stand that Collette tells jurors this chilling story about the very first conversation she had with Carl Carlson after learning that her sister had died. That fire.

[Colette Carlson (Sister of Christina)]

I went into the house and I told him that I wanted to see my sister. And he said, you can't. She's a crispy critter. That was his turn. A crispy critter. Everybody in the courtroom just kind of sucked in their breath. I think he truly believed that my sister had been burned up in the house and that there would be no evidence. And he was wrong.

[Co-narrator/Interviewer]

But some of the most critical testimony came from that fire investigator hired by the insurance company, Ken Buskey.

[Narrator]

The trouble light didn't ignite this. None of the appliances in the home ignited this. It had to be a person applying a flame to the kerosene.

[Family Member/Relative]

Though Carl Carlson barely spoke in person during the trial, the jury heard him a lot. They heard recordings that were made over the course of his lifetime regarding the investigation into Christina's death.

[Narrator]

You're not proud of getting money from someone's death? Not proud? Well, I'll tell you where pride comes into it. You break the wall down, you pull your ass over. Ladies and gentlemen, the defendant had motive.

[Cindy Carlson]

His motive in this case was greed. Greed.

[Family Member/Relative]

The defense was questioning the validity of what happened.

[Narrator]

We all know that that evidence is 29 years old.

[Co-narrator/Interviewer]

The defense's arguments seem to be that if the case was. Wasn't strong enough back in 1991, what would make anything different now?

[Narrator]

This case was ignored 29 years ago. It was brought to them. They looked at it. They said, no pass. There's nothing here.

[Katie Reynolds (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

I was looking forward to it being done with. And it was the end of week three, when the jurors were finally able to go and deliberate.

[Family Member (Brother or Relative of Carl Carlson)]

I really thought this would drag out much longer than it did. But the jury came out and said they had a verdict.

[Narrator]

We the jury, find the defendant, Carl Holger Carlson, guilty of murder in the first degree.

[Co-narrator/Interviewer]

Carlson had no reaction at all. Stone cold. In fact, it looked like he almost expected that verdict.

[Erin Deroche (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

I've never been more humbled by or grateful to 12 strangers in my entire life. It was everything I wanted.

[Family Member (Brother or Relative of Carl Carlson)]

He very stoically stood up and he walked away. I really wanted to see him look over his shoulder, make eye contact with those two girls, and just by eye, tell him something, say something to him. Never looked back. He walked away on their mother, walked away on their brother, and he just walked away on them again.

[Investigator/Reporter]

But before Carl would walk away for good, there would be one more unbelievable twist in this case that it's almost impossible to believe.

[Co-narrator/Interviewer]

I mean, who would take out a life insurance policy on little girls?

[Narrator]

We, the jury, find the defendant, Carl Holger Carlson, guilty of murder in the.

[Erin Deroche (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

First degree of killing Christina A. Carlson.

[Katie Reynolds (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

The Monday that the jurors came to a verdict was actually Levi's birthday. He would have been 35 the day that the guilty verdict came in. My mother's death. It was surreal.

[Investigator/Reporter]

So after all of these years, that fire back in 1991, it was just weeks ago that Carl Carlson finds himself in the Calaveras county courthouse to hear his sentence.

[Narrator]

In this case, the defendant would be sentenced to state prison for a term.

[Investigator/Reporter]

Of life without the possibility of parole.

[Investigator/Detective]

I just want to seem rot in jail, you know, I'm not a vindictive person normally, but in this case, I am. I can't help it. We should have never been investigated in the death of Levi. This fact went through enough in 1991. It should have ended then.

[Co-narrator/Interviewer]

But it turns out that there are people in Carlson's life who think had he not been arrested, he may have been trying to get away with murder yet again.

[Narrator]

After Carl collected on Levi's death, additional policies are taken out on the two granddaughters.

[Katie Reynolds (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

Dad had life insurance policies out on both of my brother's daughters.

[Narrator]

Levi's widow said that she had recently got a visit from Carl after many, many months of no contact at all, Wanting to renew his contacts with his granddaughters and get them out to the farm.

[Co-narrator/Interviewer]

Most people don't even realize that you could take out life insurance policies on your grandchildren.

[Cindy Carlson]

I was scared half to death an accident was going to happen with one of them eventually.

[Co-narrator/Interviewer]

Cindy cashed out those policies to make sure that there was nothing hanging over the heads of her granddaughters.

[Erin Deroche (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

It's a relief to know that we don't have to worry for ourselves, for our children, for our nieces, for our nephews.

[Narrator]

It felt really good that some justice was finally done for this family. It's way overdue.

[Katie Reynolds (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

I found these. This is the first time Erin and Aunt Colette have seen them in a long time. But they are her rings.

[Colette Carlson (Sister of Christina)]

This is her class ring. She's teeny, tiny little fingers. My sister was real small.

[Katie Reynolds (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

I mean, I don't think anything, you know, of any value, real monetary value, but it's got obviously the sentimental value for us.

[Investigator/Reporter]

There were so many twists and turns in this case. And one of the things that I think brings real comfort to the family is that Levi is now buried right next to his mother Christina in Murphy's, California.

[Erin Deroche (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

They are actually together in Murphy's.

[Katie Reynolds (Daughter of Carl Carlson)]

I'm very happy that he got to be buried next to mom.

[Colette Carlson (Sister of Christina)]

I go and I sit and just wonder if I've done enough for her kids. I tried to make sure that they knew their mother through me. And now, you know, with Levi there, it's. They're there together.

[Co-narrator/Interviewer]

And you can find all new broadcast.

[Narrator]

Episodes of 2020 Friday nights at 9 on ABC. Give it up for Chicago. Sebastian Maniscalco's new stand up special it Ain't Right is now streaming on Hulu. Thirty years ago, Jeff Bezos, completely nerd. Bezos now ripped the shreds on his super yacht and the boxes keep coming. Watch Sebastian Maniscalco It Ain't Right now streaming on Hulu and Hulu on Disney plus for bundle subscribers terms apply.