Democrats Slammed by Robert F. Kennedy Jr's Defenders for Not Taking Responsibility for COVID Errors

Summary

Podcast Summary: 2WAY Morning Meeting

Episode: Democrats Slammed by Robert F. Kennedy Jr's Defenders for Not Taking Responsibility for COVID Errors
Date: September 8, 2025
Hosts: Mark Halperin (as Mark Levin), Larry O’Connor, Dan Crenshaw

---

Overview

This episode of the 2WAY Morning Meeting focuses on the mounting criticism faced by Democrats—particularly from defenders of Health and Human Services Secretary Robert F. Kennedy Jr.—over a perceived lack of accountability for government missteps during the COVID-19 pandemic. The conversation branches into contemporary economic concerns, U.S. responses to increased Russian aggression in Ukraine, shifts in Democratic political messaging, and national debates concerning public health leadership, vaccine trust, and government transparency. Listener questions add to a lively and sometimes heated debate about public trust, scientific integrity, and political posturing.

---

Key Discussion Points

1. The Economic Outlook and Political Messaging

• Segment Start: 06:09
• The economic segment begins with Trump’s comments on beef prices and energy costs, with hosts analyzing both messaging and policy impacts.
• Michigan Democrat Mallory McMurrow’s viral video (“Football is back...corporate greed ruining the things we love” [09:04]) is praised for resonating as both anti-Trump and pro-consumer.
• Larry O'Connor explains the administration’s strategy: “You blame the last guy and you gotta...be patient, wait for our policies to kick in...Energy is sort of a leading indicator” (10:15).
• Dan warns of political risks if the recovery isn’t felt by voters by January 2026: “Voters… haven’t lost patience, but they’re antsy” (11:31).

2. Ukraine/Russia War – Changing Strategies and Global Consequences

• Segment Start: 13:37
• After the failed Alaska summit, Russia’s largest drone and missile attack on Kyiv signals an escalation.
• David Ignatius delivers sobering analysis: “Putin…doesn’t want a settlement...he wants to win the war and he’s prepared to keep fighting until he gets what he wants” (14:47).
• The hosts discuss U.S. and European responses, sanctions, and the persistent issue of Europe buying Russian oil, largely driven by political considerations over fuel prices.
• Exit question on whether the President will act decisively soon, with Larry predicting: “Look for more pressure on India and Europe with regard to energy” (18:55).

3. Robert F. Kennedy Jr., Public Health Leadership, and Democratic Party Tensions

• Segment Start: 18:57
• Mark admits an error repeating a misattributed Kennedy quote, emphasizing the importance of “an adult conversation” and warning against polarized takes: “He contains multitudes…he has done more to put a spotlight on serious public health problems, literally, than anyone in my lifetime...At the same time, he says things that aren’t true regularly” (20:51).
• Larry attributes Kennedy’s tolerance to distrust in previous public health leadership: “We’ve just lived through leaders at CDC and HHS and FDA lying…he’s given a little bit more tolerance to sort of investigate and bring out some of the truth” (21:00).
• Dan: “When he [Kennedy] is on cleaning up the food supply, industry capture…they have a winning message. When he is fixated on vaccines…with no data, he is on the wrong side of 80/20 issues” (22:46).
• Vaccine polling briefly unpacked: “Support for vaccines in general tests 80/20 against the Kennedy position” (23:53).
• Spirited debate over the risks of focusing on fringe positions (“anti-vaxx” messaging) vs. real government failures during COVID and ongoing public trust issues.

4. Use of Military Force Against Drug Cartels

• Segment Start: 26:18
• A recent U.S. strike on a suspected drug cartel boat sparks discussion about rules of engagement and public tolerance: “If you think that we are at war with drug cartels…killing people on boats…is like killing people in Iraq during the Iraq war” (27:21).
• Dan: “No sympathy for drug dealers…Americans believe that drugs are a problem…They will have public opinion generally with them. I’d just say, boy, I hope they get this right…because it could backfire…” (27:45).
• Maureen (former FBI): “They probably had fantastic intel on that boat...they knew exactly what they were bringing to Los Angeles” (37:05).

5. Listener Questions: Trust, Public Health, and “Mayhem” at HHS

• Segment Start: 36:30
• Maureen, a veteran law enforcement officer, provides insight on the intelligence behind cartel strikes and stresses law enforcement burnout: “Law enforcement officers are traumatized…There’s no other occupation in this country where people are allowed to be treated the way we treat our law enforcement officers” (41:08).
• Maureen and Dan spar over government accountability during COVID, with Maureen criticizing censorship and deplatforming: “Deplatforming, demonetizing and destroying people’s lives is in a totally different arena” (46:10).
• Samuel (Groton, CT): “Whether we want to be…satisfied with the status quo…or move towards curing chronic illness...getting corruption out of scientific research and out of the agencies…” (47:51).
• Alexandra: “What’s been happening hasn’t been working. If you want something to change, you have to change something” (54:25).
• The hosts discuss possible alternatives to Kennedy at HHS—Marty Makary and Bobby Jindal are floated.

6. Media, Political Interviews, and “Sherman and Peabody”

• Segment Start: 30:39
• Mark critiques political interview conventions, referring to politicians’ evasive statements about future campaigns.
• Discusses Maryland Governor Wes Moore’s present-tense denials of presidential ambitions and suggests the media needs more creative questioning.

---

Notable Quotes

• On Vaccine Trust & Partisan Lines:
  “Most Americans have concerns about their government...They don’t think the government is entirely, completely, 100% corrupt and has to be destroyed. That is where sometimes MAGA...confuse where the silent majority of this country is and where they are.”
  — Dan Crenshaw (48:28)

• On RFK Jr.’s Role as HHS Secretary:
  “He contains multitudes…At the same time, he says things that aren’t true regularly...We need to have an adult conversation about Bobby Kennedy’s stewardship, not a hyper partisan one.”
  — Mark Levin (20:51)

• On COVID Mistakes and Accountability:
  “Who from the CDC or the Biden administration or from Health and Human Services...paid a price for it? Who was accountable?”
  — Larry O’Connor (51:18)

• On Censorship & Scientific Debate:
  “Deplatforming, demonetizing and destroying people’s lives is in a totally different arena, in my opinion.”
  — Maureen (46:10)

• On Government and Scientific Corruption:
  “Scientists are motivated by the same things other people are motivated by. For money, for reputational integrity, for the approbation of their peers.”
  — Samuel (52:18)

---

Important Timestamps

• Economic Outlook Discussion: 06:09–13:37
• Ukraine/Russia Analysis: 13:37–19:08
• RFK Jr. and HHS Debate: 18:57–26:00, resumes 36:30–54:30 (with listeners)
• Military Engagement with Cartels: 26:18–36:30
• Listener Questions & Mayhem at HHS: 36:30–54:30
• Alternatives to RFK at HHS: 56:16–58:08

---

Memorable Moments

• Maureen’s Law Enforcement Trauma Stats:
  “Every citizen...between one and three traumatic events in their lives...Law enforcement officers have between 600 and 800 traumatic events throughout their career” (41:08).

• Humorous Take on Political Interview Clichés:
  “Saying, ‘I am not running for president,’ means nothing. No one’s running right now. Please, please, my colleagues.”
  — Mark Levin (32:18)

• Passionate Disagreement on Scientific Trust:
  “What’s been happening hasn’t been working. If you want something to change, you have to change something.”
  — Alexandra (54:25)

---

Conclusion

This episode of 2WAY Morning Meeting delivers an authentic, spirited look at the interplay of American politics, public health, and media responsibility in a transitional era. The hosts balance frank admission of past errors with warnings about present “mayhem” and overcorrection, capturing both public frustration over a lack of COVID accountability and the messy process of restoring credibility to American institutions.

The ongoing debate (often passionate, occasionally acrimonious) over Robert F. Kennedy Jr.’s controversial stewardship as HHS Secretary functions as a proxy for broader questions—about government honesty, scientific integrity, and the cultural and political divides shaping the 2025 news cycle.

---

Listeners interested in news, politics, and the ongoing fight over truth, trust, and accountability in American public life will find the 2WAY Morning Meeting an essential, unvarnished resource.

Transcript

[Mark Levin]

Mike and Alyssa are always trying to outdo each other. When Alyssa got a small water bottle, Mike showed up with a 4 liter jug. When Mike started gardening, Alyssa started beekeeping.

[Dan Crenshaw]

Oh, come on.

[Mark Levin]

They called a truce for their holiday and used Expedia trip planner to collaborate on all the details of their trip. Once there, Mike still did more laps around the pool. Whatever. You were made to outdo your holidays. We were made to help organize the competition. Expedia made to travel. @blinds.com, it's not just about window treatments. It's about you, your style, your space, your way. Whether you DIY or want the pros to handle it all, you'll have the confidence of knowing it's done right. From free expert design help to our 100% satisfaction guarantee, everything we do is made to fit your life and your windows. [e-mail], the only thing we treat better than windows is you. Visit blinds.com now for up to 45% off with minimum purchase plus a professional measure at no cost. Rules and restrictions apply. Good morning, everyone. This is the morning meeting. Welcome. It's Monday, September 8th. It's 9:00 in the east, 6:00 in Los Angeles, and some other time in Moscow. Thank you for joining. Sean is off today. Larry is here. Larry o', Connor, the Larry o' Connor Playhouse. What's the other show called?

[Larry O'Connor]

Larry Extravaganza.

[Mark Levin]

We like to call it Extravaganza. Yeah, it's just Larry. Just Larry. And Dan is here. And welcome in, everybody. Larry, how do you feel about our biggest news story of the day? Howard Stern pranked Everybody pretended Andy Cohen was taking off all of his SiriusXM show. But the king of all media reigns supreme. Howard is staying on SiriusXM. Your thoughts, Larry.

[Larry O'Connor]

As a longtime radio professional, can I just say I hate radio pranks. They're stupid. And. And so it was. And I don't think anybody that nobody believed that Andy Cohen was going, oh, I did.

[Mark Levin]

Oh, I did. Oh, you bought.

[Larry O'Connor]

You bought into it.

[Mark Levin]

Really? The branding of Andy 100 completely tricked me.

[Dan Crenshaw]

Larry, I thought you loved America. I can't believe you hate radio.

[Mark Levin]

Dan. Dan, how do you feel about Howard Sting?

[Dan Crenshaw]

Great. I grew up with Don Imus and Howard Stern going to school in the car in the morning with my father. So I think it's great.

[Mark Levin]

Yeah. Well, folks, welcome in. This is the morning meeting. It's a different show than other shows. We believe in peace, love and understanding. Thank you for all your kind notes and letters about rfkj. I'LL be talking about that in just a moment. And thank you for being part of our community. If you'd like to be in on the conversation, you're here on the two way platform, please raise your hand. Already some great hands up. Last week we had a day with all new people. Maybe that'll happen again. We shall see. If you're watching on YouTube or X Peace, love and understanding. Maureen is up early. I can't wait to talk to Maureen about all things FBI. Don't raise your hand on the other platforms like YouTube, but also Peace, love and understanding. Presumption of grace to all. That'll be a through line. A continuing theme for the program. We'll run through the news of the day like they do in the Network News Division's morning meetings and then kick things around a bit and then take your questions and comments. Eager to have you participate. So again, raise your hand. Now a word from our sponsor, Cozy Earth. You've heard me extol the bedding 100 day night sleep trial and 10 year warranty on the bedding. But you know my view of the pants, right? The Cozy Earth pants. Don't take my word for it. You can divide my audience this on two way tonight and on this program into two groups. Those of you who have heeded my wise words that these are the best pants you'll ever own and those of you who foolishly have not yet taken advantage of our massive discount, let me read you an email from one of our viewers. Here we go. I hate clothes. Never shop. Typical guy. But love two way. So when you pitch Cozy Earth, I bought a pair of their pants. The Kohl's. They rock. Because I don't go out in public in my PJs unlike several of my kids. Probably the most comfortable pants I'll ever wear out and about. Great fit. My wife says they look great. Then again, she married me. Anyway, thanks for the recommendation that from a happy customer. Follow the lead of this person, one of your two way community member colleagues who bought the pants. Upgrade. Now go to cozyearth.com use the code two way for yes. 40% off Larry. 40% off to get the best the best pants of your life again cozyearth.com go there. Code two way 40% off. Telling you do it real life build for real life. Made to keep up with yours. Cozy Earth. Hi, I'm Anthony Scaramucci and I'd like to tell you about my new show Lost Boys. It's a limited edition series series. It's hosted by myself And Professor Scott Galloway. We're having honest conversations about a topic no one wants to talk about. The crisis that young men are facing nowadays. Our talks discuss why so many young men are struggling to find purpose, connection and identity in today's world. We dig into what's really going on. Politics, culture, loneliness, even rage. And what we can do to help change the narrative. This is a six part series that will challenge your assumptions and encourage you to continue the conversation from the dinner table to the office. Follow and listen to Lost Boys on YouTube, Apple Podcasts, Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts. You can also go to Lostboys Men and sign up to get the latest episodes and news. All right, let's get.

[Larry O'Connor]

Did that email really begin with I hate clothes?

[Mark Levin]

Yes. Well, I hate buying? No, I hate buying clothes.

[Larry O'Connor]

Oh, buying clothes.

[Dan Crenshaw]

Out the buying we were.

[Mark Levin]

Oh, no, no, no. Here's what it is. It's I hate clothes, never shop, typical guy. So not the best written sentence you've ever heard. I hate clothes, never shop, typical guy. But love two way. So when you pitch Cozy Earth, I bought a pair of their pants. It's actually one of our more famous viewers. Listeners. This program's available on the podcast. Please download it. But I decided not to identify him. I want to make him everyman because if you knew, like Scott, just whatever. It's a famous. It's one of our famous ones.

[Dan Crenshaw]

He doesn't want to get blood on his clothes when he's kicking the crap out of people.

[Mark Levin]

Exactly, exactly. All right, let's go to our daybook. Not much on the schedule. Slow starting September Monday, ABC News radio is the pool at the White House, the new media seat, the Federalist. And the President has only one public event on his schedule. Shortly after we go off the air live, the President delivers remarks the White House Religious Liberty Commission at the Museum of the Bible. Larry, do you have a. Do you have a membership in the Museum of the Bible?

[Larry O'Connor]

Actually, it has lapsed, but I had a membership for a while. It's a great place.

[Mark Levin]

Yeah. Over the weekend I was at an event, I was speaking at an event and they played the clip of me asking Donald Trump about his favorite Bible verse. And truly, it never gets old. You know, Larry, you know, I asked him that the day he came down that big beautiful escalator. The very day he announced for President only one news organization anchored live. Anchored live from the President. The President's announcement. The Trump Tower atrium. That was Bloomberg News where I worked at the time. And for our troubles, we got an interview with the president. And that's where I famously asked him for his favorite Bible verse. You can look at the clip yourself. Congress is straggling back in. A few things going on the Hill today, but they'll be here. And they got about three weeks to figure out what to do about a government shutdown. Really not much else going on. So let's go to our first topic is the economy, smarty. The economy. Scott Besson on Meet the Press yesterday, talking a lot about the economy. And then the president got asked about the price of beef yesterday. I don't know, is this when he was coming or going on his way either to or from the US Open? Here's Donald J. Trump on beef and prices and tariffs 103 please. Mr. President, the price of beef continues.

[Larry O'Connor]

To rise and other items keep going up.

[Mark Levin]

Is there any way to address the cost of beef? Yeah, once it kicks in, once our policies kick in, the price of beef will be going down. Just like the price of eggs went down and the price of a lot of other grocery items went down. Beef will go down. It'll all go down. Energy has gone way down. The price of gas, gasoline has gone. Really? I mean, I think you'll be hitting two dollars very soon and it was four and a half dollars a little while ago. So energy has gone way down. That brings everything else with it. But beef has gone, as you know, for other reasons. The price of beef has gone up a little bit. It'll be coming down. So every Democratic candidate in the country, both incumbents and people running for open season challengers, is trying to own the I can make viral videos like Mandami, but not be a socialist lane to try to get earned media coverage and raise money online. One of the most touted so far, a Democrat who often goes viral, Michigan Democrat Mallory McMurro. Here is the video she put out over the weekend pegged to the beginning of football season, which everybody seems to love. 104 please.

[Maureen]

Football is back and seven hours of commercial free football.

[Mark Levin]

Whopper Whopper Whopper Whopper is not.

[Maureen]

This is just the latest example of corporate greed ruining the things we love. Because it's not just commercials on tv. It's also your grocery store run where chicken wings are going to cost you 19 bucks or a bag of chips 5 bucks. Even beer is getting more expensive. It's a one, two punch tariffs that are making everything more expensive and corporations that are squeezing every last dime out of us. And if it's somewhere this season, you're.

[Mark Levin]

Headed to a game you can watch the whole thing. You watch the whole thing online and it goes on in that vein. Populist, anti Trump, pro consumer, talking like a normal person. You're going to see a lot of that, although not everyone can pull it off the way Mallory McMorrow can. Larry on on Friday, Dan and I went a little anti bessant on the economy. Neither of us, I can tell without having talked to Dan, were wholly reassured by the Treasury Secretary's pledge on Meet the Press that everything's just fine. Are the fundamentals of the economy strong or is the data of last week beginning to cause you to go a bit wobbly at Lady Thatcher might say.

[Larry O'Connor]

Well, the jobs number was a little jarring, but I think that Besant was magnificent over the weekend explaining it and sort of putting it in perspective with some of the positive numbers like GDP growth, et cetera. But what you saw from Trump there is, you know, this is right out of the schoolbook of Barack Obama and Joe Biden the first year of their administrations when the economy was somewhat soft. You blame the last guy and you got to, hey, just be patient, wait for our policies to kick in. Meanwhile, he is right about energy and mind. My understanding is energy is sort of a leading indicator, while beef and other products are sort of lagging indicators. When you get the energy cost down, that has a ripple effect and a domino effect, but it's not immediate. But eventually, because energy affects everything else, including a bag of chips and a bag of wings, the other costs will come down, but you start with energy and that's what this administration's done.

[Mark Levin]

LARRY Are you thinking, Scott Bessant, that this is a fourth quarter thing or a Q1 of next year thing, when things will actually be better, when I won't have to say when I go to order my lunch, I have some low energy for lunch?

[Larry O'Connor]

Yeah, I don't know, but I know that the administration's hoping that it's a Q4 thing because that also coincides with Christmas shopping and all of the Black Friday numbers. And they want to have a success story and they want to have it soon.

[Mark Levin]

Dan I know you hope the economy booms, but I also know that you don't think it's going to correct.

[Dan Crenshaw]

I honestly don't know. I mean, yes, I obviously hope it does and you don't want to be cheerleading for it to tank. And I think Larry hit it, which is you hope that the best answer they have is judge us not today, but judge us tomorrow and kind of try to move those goalposts. I think the voters are not. They haven't lost patience, but they're antsy. And you see this both in kind of economic data and in political data. I think if things start to turn around by January and people have a good holiday season, then Larry's right. They'll get credit. They'll say it just took a little bit of time, but if it doesn't and people are still struggling and more inflation starts to pick up and job losses start happening, then the opposite happens. They say throw the bums out. And in a midterm, it's very easy. Right? You can't take it out on Trump. You take it out on the person on the ballot.

[Mark Levin]

Larry, the Wall street analysts who not that long ago were predicting recession at a pretty high percentage probability are back talking about either recession or stagflation. Do you rule those out? Do you rule out that there'd be stagflation or recession?

[Larry O'Connor]

Well, I think it depends on the interest rates. And listen, Trump has been very smart from day one, setting up the Fed as sort of the, some will call it a scapegoat, some will call it a strawman, others will say that he's been very.

[Mark Levin]

I'll go, I'll go with foil. How about foil?

[Larry O'Connor]

A useful foil. And one could argue that the Fed has sort of played right into this. Mr. Powell has sort of been led right into the narrative that Trump wants. And so a lot of people were jumping up with the jobs numbers saying, yeah, this is why we need the interest rate cut. It wouldn't happen if we had the interest rate cut. And I think there's some validity to that.

[Dan Crenshaw]

Well, but I mean, again, I go back to Powell's job is to look at the data. And as the data has gotten worse, they've shifted that. The challenge with cutting rates and we're, I think about to find out is does inflation then start to pick back up more? Because it's already slowly starting to re, accelerate. And that's the million dollar question. Can they juice the economy without inflation being touched?

[Mark Levin]

Right. All right. We'll obviously keep talking about this forever, including up through the Fed meeting. Russia, Russia. Since the summit in Anchorage, Putin has escalated the attacks on Ukraine, including last night where they launched what is being described in terms of drones and missiles as the biggest attack yet of the war on Kyiv, including a government building. President Trump made some comments that people still don't quite get, saying European leaders are going to be in Washington either today or tomorrow and said, yes, there'd be more sanctions in response to A reporter's question, but also said Putin was his friend or he's close to Putin and he was optimistic about ending the war. Not really sure where either of those two things came from or where they're going. But right now I think the debate is there are going to be sanctions, apparently there's going to be more military arming of Ukraine. The question is, is it to get Russia to the table or is it to win the war? Here's our diplomatic correspondent, David Ignatius.

[David Ignatius]

So, Joe, yesterday's attacks, it's marked, not.

[Mark Levin]

Joe, just of the war.

[David Ignatius]

More than 800 drones, 13 missiles. And more notably, they were on this, many of them were on the center of Kyiv. The Council of Ministers was hit. That's a building that many of us, when we're in Ukraine, go visit officials and has generally not been targeted in the war. What we're seeing is, I think, absolutely decisive, brutal statement by Vladimir Putin that he doesn't want a settlement of the war. He wants to win the war and he's prepared to keep fighting until he gets what he wants, which is essentially a capitulation by the Ukrainian government on key security issues. He wants effective dominance of Ukraine's military. He certainly wants Ukraine out of NATO. President Trump had hoped, I think admirably, that he might be able to settle this war. But the Alaska summit was a bust. And although he talked yesterday about being willing to impose economic sanctions against Russia, I think most people are guessing right now that's simply not going to be enough to alter the course of this war that people are going to have to think seriously about, about more weapons, a more decisive posture for Ukraine's supporters, especially the European countries. But yesterday was a chilling day for anybody who hopes this terrible war can come to an end anytime soon. My feeling is it's going to continue a long while. The death and destruction are only going to get worse.

[Mark Levin]

Dan, thoughts on what David said?

[Dan Crenshaw]

I mean, I think to a large extent he's right, which is, it's pretty clear. So now that the summit in Alaska, while well intentioned, did not have its intended effect. I don't think anyone believes there's going to be a three way meeting anytime soon with the heads of state. And ultimately the question is, how do you force Putin to take what we're saying seriously? And I think as we've talked about it is I liked Besson's line about trying to cut, you know, which collapses first, the Russian will or the Russian economy. But you gotta go all in on that. And they are right to lean on the Europeans to stop buying oil. But at the same time, as we've talked about, you are gonna have to send serious weaponry and let Putin know this isn't a one time thing. You're not getting any further in the trench line, Larry.

[Mark Levin]

Where are the points of agreement or disagreement between you and David and you and Dan?

[Larry O'Connor]

Not much. Except think about what you just said, Dan. It's like, yeah, Europe shouldn't be buying Russian oil. Over a billion euros worth of Russian oil Europe bought last year. Why is that? Why is that even on the table? Why in the hell do they continue to fund Putin's war machine? And then.

[Mark Levin]

Well, in part because the US Part, because the US didn't object because they didn't want oil gas prices to rise during the, during the election.

[Larry O'Connor]

Well, at the time, but during the Biden administration, You're right, but that was also at a time where we weren't as energy independent and pumping as much as we are now, so that we can actually be an alternative. And other countries can be alternatives.

[Dan Crenshaw]

Well, but the challenge, Larry, is If we ship $1 billion of our oil over, you know, they buy it, it's $1 billion less of oil here, to mark's point, unless OPEC opens the spigot even more, which they might. We could ask our ambassador Eric Adams, if not in Saudi Arabia.

[Larry O'Connor]

Exactly.

[Dan Crenshaw]

You know, it might send prices up.

[Larry O'Connor]

I hear you. All right, you know what? Just for the sake of argument, I'll stipulate that. How serious are we about this war? How are you about this?

[Mark Levin]

Yeah, all right, just exit question. And nobody knows, so just your spidey sense. Will the President act decisively this week on sanctions and a military plan by Friday? Will he have said something decisive about it? Dan.

[Larry O'Connor]

Now, Larry, on sanctions, yes. And look for more pressure on India and Europe with regard to energy.

[Mark Levin]

That's this. This week.

[Larry O'Connor]

This week. This week.

[Mark Levin]

Okay. All right, we'll see. All right.

[Larry O'Connor]

And I say that only because this weekend his remarks, I, I thought he showed more frustration and more anger toward Russia and Putin than I've seen this entire time. I think his patience is done.

[Mark Levin]

Yeah. Although again, as I said yesterday, there was, there was a time when we was talking to reporters where he talked about his optimism about ending the war and about his good relationship with Putin. So he's not. He's not. Yeah. Classic. But not unbridled, angry. All right, Bobby Kennedy, lots of stories over the weekend about what's going on at HHS about President Trump's seeming tolerance for the style there. Best quote I saw was in a story where a former Trump administration from Trump, one HHS official, I believe described the desired outcome as maha without mayhem. And that's what it is. Now. I heard from many of you, I misspoke. I said something wrong. I didn't misspeak. I was ill informed by a senior congressional official who told me Bobby Kennedy said something he didn't. It was said at the hearing. I checked and was told, yes, that was wrong. It's my fault for relying on one source and I apologize for that. But in general, you people are out of your minds. I say that with peace, love and understanding. We need to have an adult conversation about Bobby Kennedy. He contains multitudes, as I said last week. There's stuff about him that's fantastic. I think he has done more to put a spotlight on serious public health problems, literally, than anyone in my, in my lifetime. Truly historic, even if he's, even if he stepped down now, historic what he's done. At the same time, he says things that aren't true regularly. And members of Congress, including Republicans, agree. And that's not great for any public official, but particularly someone who deals with the public health of our kids. So we need to have an adult conversation about Bobby Kennedy's stewardship, not a hyper partisan one. Thank you very much for your attention to that matter. Larry. What happens next? He did the Senate finance hearing. He continues to work on autism. He's got some studies coming out. What happens next with Bobby Kennedy?

[Larry O'Connor]

Listen, I think you painted the picture pretty well. He's got a pretty long leash right now from President Trump. And I think that as long as Kennedy continues focusing on getting data and getting information with regard to children and children's health. And yes, I'm interested in some of the autism information and I'm open minded about it. I have a son on the autism spectrum myself. And I don't think the American people feel like they've been getting the truth about this stuff. So whether he deals in hyperbole to try to get at that data or not, I think is something that's worthy of scrutiny. I think the reason why he's getting a lot of tolerance right now from the Trump base as well as from the Trump administration, is that we've just lived through leaders at CDC and HHS and FDA lying on a regular basis about the pandemic. And I'm not saying one lie is equal to the other. What I'm saying is because of the lies we were all fed, he's given a little bit more tolerance to Sort of investigate and bring out some of the truth right now.

[Mark Levin]

Right. In honor of Sean, I'll say there are two things can be true at once. Kennedy calls out not just big food and big pharma. Kennedy calls out the fact that we don't have trust in the CDC and the fda, that there's decades of big government lies and incompetence and inefficiency that he calls out, that's fantastic. I'm all for it. I don't know who would be against it except maybe knuckleheads in the Democratic party. But that can be true. And at the same time, he can be taking positions that are at best inconsistent, often are false and not in keeping with the best scientific data. Dan, how does your party deal with this? Because right now they've got Kennedy derangement syndrome. But that risks them getting on the wrong side of all the things that Kennedy talks about that are rightly popular.

[Dan Crenshaw]

Well, I think it goes to what Larry was just saying, which is that looking forward, if I were the Kennedy people in the White House when he's talking about cleaning up the food supply, he's talking about industry capture. He is on the 8020 side. They have a winning message. When he is fixated on vaccines and blowing out agencies with, with all due respect to Larry, no data to support it, but long term hunches or beliefs that he's held that aren't supported by facts. He has, he is on the wrong side of 8020 issues. And so I think as much if I'm a Democrat, I would focus on one thing or two things. Transparency and accountability, where you have data, put it out there. But when he doesn't and he just says, well, everybody knows and everybody tells me, sounds familiar. As you said, Mark, people said that's my grandmother. Those are my kids. You've got theories that have no scientific basis. And you put, you know, a thousand experts out there who say that's crazy.

[Mark Levin]

Yeah.

[Dan Crenshaw]

They're going to say most.

[Mark Levin]

Most of what Bobby Kennedy, Larry Talks about does test 8020 in his favor in the favor of Mahaj. Tony. But Tony Fabrizio's poll, the president's own pollster, reported first by Bloomberg and now by other organizations, show support for vaccines in general. Tests 80, 20 against the Kennedy position. Yeah.

[Larry O'Connor]

Vaccines in general. But then when you start to drill down on it.

[Mark Levin]

Yeah.

[Larry O'Connor]

What about the current schedule we have? What about the number of vaccines that children are getting at very young ages? What about injecting every newborn with a hep B vaccine when there's no indication that they're vulnerable to hep B. That sort of thing actually starts to move that needle. And I just want to say, I mean, and I'm not talking about you two. I'm just saying, from the perspective of most Trump supporters, and frankly, I think most Americans, the loudest voices Criticizing Robert Kennedy Jr. Right now are the same voices in the media or in the Democrat Party who still think that Anthony Fauci was.

[Mark Levin]

100% honest and John Barrasso criticized him. He didn't celebrate Fauci. It's just not true, Larry.

[Larry O'Connor]

I don't remember Brasso coming out and criticizing Foushee. I remember.

[Mark Levin]

No, no, no.

[Dan Crenshaw]

I'm saying, look, I think that most Americans believe that under Covid, while mistakes were made, it was the best of intentions, and they got more, including Donald Trump. Right. And they got more right than they got wrong. They got stuff wrong. And the 6ft stuff, I mean, that's embarrassing that they say, well, we just kind of made it up. And like. But this is where sometimes I think Trump supporters confuse their base with America.

[Mark Levin]

Correct.

[Dan Crenshaw]

50% of Republicans believe in vaccines generally. I hear you, Larry. We should always be asking about schedules and should this happen and should that happen? The problem is Kennedy has held views for 20 years, and he's really been out there that I just believe that this causes this and this causes that. And scientists have said, okay, show us your data.

[Mark Levin]

And he's like, we gotta, we gotta move on again. Raise your hand if you want. In the conversation. We're gonna speed through four final topics and then get to your questions. Please raise your hand if you'd like to.

[Dan Crenshaw]

I want to keep talking about it.

[Mark Levin]

And, and, and just to be clear, when I espouse peace, love, and understanding, it doesn't mean that I forswear calling people morons when they are. I have to, I have to balance that, but I do it nicely. I do it.

[Larry O'Connor]

Noted.

[Mark Levin]

Yeah. Okay. Drug dealers being killed. This seems simple to me. A lot of debate over the weekend about it, and the administration still has not given a clear public or congressional briefing on what the justification is. If you think that we are at war with drug cartels, then killing people on boats who you believe are drug dealers is like killing people in Iraq during the Iraq war. You're killing people. That's what happens in a war. You kill people without giving them due process. If you believe that this is the dangerous use of the military for law enforcement activity, then, yeah, it's a big problem. But I have a pretty good idea where public opinion will be on this if it's ever polled correctly. Dan, is this something that should be not just a political fight, but a substantive fight, or is it, as many in the administration believe, pretty plain and simple? We're at war with drug dealers. It's a war. You don't have due process in war.

[Dan Crenshaw]

Yeah, no, no. I mean, I'm trying. Top line, I agree with you. There's no sympathy for drug dealers. Americans believe that drugs is a problem in this country. It has been for 40 years that a lot of them come in from overseas. They will have public opinion generally with them. I think the challenge is you blow up one of these speedboats, and it turns out it was family out.

[Mark Levin]

Do you know how many families we killed in the Iraq war, Jimmy? Families we killed in. Jimmy. Families we killed in Vietnam. How many families Zelensky's killed. It's a war.

[Dan Crenshaw]

I hear you, but, Mark, that is where we as a country have gotten into trouble in said wars. What do we talk about with the Israeli and Palestinians when Palestinian hospitals are blown up, even though there's a military base underneath them? Yeah, a lot of people cringe. So my point is they have the public on their side. I would not try to defend drug dealers, but I would just say, boy, I hope they get this right more often than they potentially get it wrong, because it could backfire if it starts happening in the other direction. Which is to say, what if another country says we start doing the same thing and they hit an American vote and it's not drug dealers?

[Mark Levin]

Well, well, if we. If we accidentally. The US Military at times has accidentally killed people at weddings. Right. We've done that same thing. Yeah, Larry.

[Larry O'Connor]

Larry, exactly.

[Mark Levin]

The.

[Larry O'Connor]

The Biden administration killed a family going to a wedding in Afghanistan, as we're told. It was to get the terrorists who did the Abbey Gate attack, and it wasn't. But there's. When I listen, I think what's going on here, first of all, train to Aragua, we're told, were on that boat. They are defined right now, like it or not, as a terrorist organization. All right? So it's not just the drug issue, because Trenda, Aragua, also, they're a criminal terrorist operation that deals with kidnapping innocent people, murdering innocent people. And under those terms of engagement, this was a lawful act, if you like it or not. And that's the situation with. That's. That's the. The legal basis for the attack against this boat. And the only people who are claiming that they weren't trained to Aragua. Right now is Maduro.

[Mark Levin]

Yeah.

[Larry O'Connor]

And the Venezuelan government.

[Mark Levin]

All right, three quick things we won't discuss. I'll just tick them off, and then we'll talk about one more topic and then your questions. Guy who tried to kill President Trump, allegedly in Florida, goes on trial. His trial starts today with jury selection. The South Korean government's coming to pick up the people who allegedly were here illegally working at a plant in Georgia. We're going to talk more about that story in the coming days. And we're still waiting to see what's going on in Chicago. No action there yet, as far as we know, but the president's advisor on homeland security talked pretty tough yesterday. And I suspect they'll at minimum be a ice action in Chicago, as there was in Boston over the weekend. All right, gentlemen, 108. Please put up 108. Sherman and Peabody. Two of the finest cartoon characters in American history. Sherman is Larry. Is Sherman the dog or is Sherman the boy?

[Larry O'Connor]

Sherman's the boy. He's Mr. Peabody's pet boy, if I remember right.

[Mark Levin]

Yeah. All right. So, Sherman and Peabody.

[Larry O'Connor]

Why are we looking Mr. Peabody.

[Mark Levin]

By the way, why are we looking at Sherman and Mr. Peabody? Because. Because over the weekend, the latest example of one of the things that has made me more frustrated in my career than anything else here is Christian Welker asking Wes Moore if he's going to run for president. 107, please. All right, Governor, finally, before I let you go, you have not announced you're running for reelection.

[Maureen]

If you do, do you commit to.

[Mark Levin]

Serve a full term? Yes, I'm going to be serving a full term. I'm excited about reelection. I'm excited about what I'm going to be able to do for the people of Maryland. Do you rule out a run for president, Governor? Yeah, I'm not running for president. You rule it out. Yes. You completely rule it out. I'm so excited about what we're doing that we've gone from 43rd in the country and I unemployment to now one of the lowest unemployment rates we've had, amongst the fastest drops in violent crime anywhere in the United States of America. Our population is growing. Maryland is moving. And so I'm really excited about going back in front of the people of my state and asking for another term. All right, so the headlines out of that interview initially were Westmore isn't going to run for president. He's flatly ruled it out. No, no, no. Ruling it out requires being Sherman esque. Sherman esque, meaning you make it absolutely clear saying, I am not Running present tense, believe me, is not Sherman S. Peabody. You will not win a Peabody Award as far as I'm concerned. One of the most exalted designations in all of journalism. If you fall for this. Bill Clinton, 1990, running for reelection as governor, swore to the voters of his state in a debate. I will not run. Barack Obama on Meet the Press to Tim Russert, 2006.

[Dan Crenshaw]

I believe that was May. It was the first one was spring.

[Mark Levin]

Said, said. I will not run for president. It doesn't matter what they say, but it especially doesn't matter if they put it in the present tense. I am not running for president. Means nothing. No one's running right now. Please, please, my colleagues. Larry, Larry, how can we get people to stop writing stories saying Westmore takes himself out? It's meaningless.

[Larry O'Connor]

I've got a better question. When are we going to get people like Kristen Welker who have the opportunity to actually ask important, meaningful questions when you've got a governor sitting across from you? I would if I were in Kristen Welker's shoes. I live in Maryland. Governor Moore, why are you decrying President Trump's efforts in Washington, D.C. when your own fellow Democrat, Mayor Muriel Bowser, is embracing the use of federal troops to be able to help law enforcement? And why are you now mobilizing state police in Baltimore now, three years after you became governor? Aren't you just doing that because of Donald Trump? That would have. But instead, she wasted her time with this. What you think Governor Moore is going to say? Okay, you got me, Kristen. I wasn't going to announce it, but I'll announce it now. I'm running for president. It never happens that way, so why waste our time with that?

[Mark Levin]

Yeah, Dan, is Wes Moore going to run?

[Dan Crenshaw]

Yes, he is. And I think, look, I think you just asked once because Tim Russert, when he asked Barack Obama In October of 06, Obama had a different answer. That made news.

[Mark Levin]

Right.

[Dan Crenshaw]

But to your point, it's like when people ask Trump, he would always say in 2022, 2021, I'll be making an announcement about that soon.

[Mark Levin]

Right.

[Dan Crenshaw]

That's it.

[Mark Levin]

So, you know, my general advice to doing interviews is don't ask any question they're expecting. So if you want to ask the presidential question, ask it some new way. For instance. For instance, here's one way I like to ask it, although it's not new anymore, but this example of it is, governor, what would cause you not to run for president? That's better. That's at least you had a shot.

[Larry O'Connor]

How about this one, Governor, you campaigned for Kamala Harris and she only had 107 days to run and you told us she would best be the president, United States. Shouldn't she be the nominee by acclamation from your party?

[Mark Levin]

There you go. Except never ask a yes. No. Never ask a yes. No question. So question would be, will you support.

[Dan Crenshaw]

Kamala Harris if she runs?

[Mark Levin]

That's good. That's a good one. Another way to ask it is, Governor, what's the Democratic Party going to be looking for in a nominee that would be more interesting than another round of are you running for president? All right, now, time for your questions in a moment. As always, please raise your hand, get in on the conversation, and we'll want to know where you are and hear what's on your mind for Larry and for Dan. But first, a word from a new sponsor. Dan, we've got a new sponsor. You know the new sponsor is. Yeah, it's Lean Fad. Diets don't do them. Juices, cleanses, cabbage soup, raw food not recommended because then you yo, yo. You go up and down weight cycling. Doctors do not recommend you. Weight cycle. You lose a lot of weight, you run all sorts of risks. Diabetes, liver damage, heart attack and stroke. To go up and down, losing weight, gaining weight. Most people, bottom line, need to stop weight cycling. And the best way to do that is not with prescriptions or things like GLP1's injectables. Lean is an oral supplement, non prescription. Its ingredients target weight loss in three powerful ways. Maintain healthy blood sugar, control appetite and cravings. Helps burn fat by converting it to energy. Burning fat helps, of course, keeps weight off. All right, if you want to give this a try, meaningful way to lose weight without drugs, prescriptions or dangerous chemicals, go to lean.com lean.com code is mark for 20% off when you enter the code. Marklean.com give it a try.

[Dan Crenshaw]

Hey, it's Ryan Reynolds here for Mint Mobile. Now I was looking for fun ways to tell you that Mint's offer of unlimited Premium Wireless for $15 a month is back. So I thought it would be fun if we made $15 bills, but it turns out that's very illegal.

[Mark Levin]

So there goes my big idea for the commercial.

[Dan Crenshaw]

Give it a [e-mail] Switch upfront payment.

[Maureen]

Of $45 for a three month plan equivalent to $15 per month. Required new customer offer for first three months only. Speed slow after 35 gigabytes of networks.

[Mark Levin]

Busy taxes and fees extra c mintmobile.com all right, here we go. Your questions now, Maureen is first, even though she's not new. Maureen, you haven't been here in a while. Were you in Bombay? Where were you, Maureen? Or just sleeping in, working. Why haven't you been here, Maureen? Where you been? Unmute, unmute. There you go. Where you been? Maureen?

[Maureen]

I've been here every day. I've been watching you since the very beginning of the show.

[Mark Levin]

But not raising your hand much.

[Maureen]

No, because I usually watch it when I'm in la. Yeah, it's very early, and so I always listen to it on YouTube.

[Mark Levin]

All right, what's on that? What's all that gear behind you, Maureen?

[Maureen]

Oh, that's all my. What we call hardware from. Yeah, you know, many, many from decades in law enforcement.

[Mark Levin]

Did you. Did you solve crimes with that stuff?

[Maureen]

I did, yeah.

[Mark Levin]

All right. It's cool looking. Looks a little analog for me, but still. Maureen, don't be making fun of my background now. No, no, it's cool looking. I'm not making fun of it at all.

[Larry O'Connor]

It's like the man in front of a bl.

[Mark Levin]

Exactly. It's like. It's like the bat cave. Anyway, for those who don't know, Maureen lives in Southern California, former FBI agent, longtime member of our community, and now we're going to find out what's on your mind. Maureen.

[Maureen]

Well, you said you had questions for me, but the one thing I'd like to say about that shooting that boat out of the drug dealers out of the water, the one thing no one's talking about is because I work gangs in Los Angeles or drugs and narcotics gangs, drugs in Los Angeles for 15 years or longer. And they probably had fantastic intel on that boat, that whole shipment coming forward because we have a lot of informants here, there, everywhere. And they knew that that boat was likely coming here. They knew it had fentanyl or whatever else it had in it. That's my. As soon as I saw it, that's exactly what I thought. They have this thing dead to rights. They know who's on it, and they know, in large part, at least a couple of people. And they knew exactly what they were bringing to Los Angeles. And once they get past a certain point, it's very. If you talk to the Coast Guard, we've done a ton of briefings with the Coast Guard. We work very closely with them, and they'll try to interdict some of these shipments in the seas, but they'll pull up to like, you know, a number of times to Laguna Niguel or Laguna beach right there, and then, boom. These guys are in the wind. So it, once they hit shore, it's really, really hard to, you know, to seize that, that shipment.

[Mark Levin]

Yeah, Maureen, I, I, Go ahead, Dan.

[Dan Crenshaw]

Maureen, is it possible, given that we have informants and other things that you don't want to reveal sources and methods, but is there a way that the government could say, hey, we had it on very good intent and they either brief members of Congress or something? I think the problem is saying trust us is hard. Right? Because historically we don't necessarily trust our government when it just says trust us. Is there a way to kind of show some evidence?

[Maureen]

Dan? The problem with that is you tell Congress anything and you may as well broadcast it. You may as well broadcast it. They do not understand the importance of keeping of loose lips sink ships. And if they're not saying anything right now, it's because they, they don't want to burn their informants, if any. And four, if any information like that got out, people would start dying. The informant and probably other people also.

[Larry O'Connor]

Yeah.

[Maureen]

So no, it's not going to get out and you cannot trust these people. So it's, you know, that's, this is more of the stoic mindset where it's like, hey, we're going to do what we have to do and then we'll litigate it later.

[Larry O'Connor]

Yeah, thank you, Maureen. And by the way, my parents used to live in Laguna beach, so that's.

[Mark Levin]

Maureen, I wanted to ask you an Epstein question, but there's something else you want to talk about.

[Larry O'Connor]

Could I just quickly, I also want to follow up real fast in terms of this was the fact that they put this video out. There's a deterrent effect to this, isn't it?

[Maureen]

Absolutely.

[Larry O'Connor]

Talk about that a little bit.

[Maureen]

Well, the deterrent effect for all crime is important. It's like hook em, book em, we're not taking this anymore. Move on. And it even goes into the whole concept of Trump going into D.C. or into Chicago or whatever. He just wants to show that police presence makes a difference. Difference. It's a deterrent. And law enforcement numbers are down like never seen before. Applications are down and people are just bailing from law enforcement because you guys, law enforcement officers are traumatized. They're asked to do whatever the massive failure is in this society. It falls squarely on the shoulders of law enforcement officers. They're supposed to be ninja warriors, jiu jitsu masters, master negotiators, social workers and everything else. It's ridiculous. No one has that type of breadth in their skill set. And every person in, you know, every citizen, as a general rule, will experience between one and three traumatic events in their lives. Statistics show that law enforcement Officers have between 600 and 800 traumatic events throughout their career. These people are traumatized and we're just throwing them to the wolves. There's no other, no other occupation in this country where people are allowed to be treated the way we treat our law enforcement officers. It's ridiculous. So I hope that's going to be next on Trump's thing because we have to do something to get them signing back up again to be law enforcement officers and to understand that it's a noble profession, which it is.

[Mark Levin]

All right, Maureen, you ask your question, then I'm going to ask you my Epstein question.

[Maureen]

Ghislaine Maxwell. It wasn't a question. I was just going to say, guys, she's working a case with someone. Everyone's like, why'd she go to a.

[Mark Levin]

Minimum security.

[Maureen]

Minimum security. Because she's working with someone. When I had high level informants, I took a high level informant out of a prison, you know, and he was going to be in there for life. And I moved him to a local jail so that I could debrief him every day. He was helping me with other, other cases. I had an informant that was a Mexican mafia member that had killed a bunch of people. We had to move him. And not only was he working, helping us work cases, he was also review information on other ongoing cases where he would say, this is a code word. This is what this means. This is what you know. And he would help us with our methods and tactics working these other investigations, and then he would testify for us if need be. So she's, she's moved to another location because they're using her to. And I don't mean using her, but.

[Dan Crenshaw]

You know what I mean.

[Mark Levin]

Yeah, yeah. So here's my question because it relates to Maxwell. Thank you for that. I think, I think that's as good a theory as anybody's offered. Unless.

[Maureen]

It's not just a theory, Mark.

[Mark Levin]

Really? Oh, you know, she. Well, meaning. I'm kidding. Okay.

[Maureen]

It just happens all the time. It's rather frequent.

[Mark Levin]

I mean, the alternative is that they moved her to reward her because they're about to pardon her. That's the other theory. Of course. She said no one ever interviewed her, no one from the government ever tried to talk to her. Is that plausible that when she was under investigation that no one ever tried to talk to her?

[Maureen]

Well, doesn't happen all the time, but I have heard of instances like this where during an investigation, but not an investigation this big. I find that, I find that almost impossible to believe, to be honest.

[Mark Levin]

I do too. It makes me, it makes me suspicious that something, something's not right. Maureen, thank you for coming back. Please come regularly. We love having you on Wait.

[Maureen]

I also wanted to say I'm mad at Dan for on Friday, first time ever I got mad at you, Dan, because you were saying the damn it. We've always been for questioning science, more questions the better. That's what we stand for. When you guys just destroyed the lives of medical doctors who spoke out against the COVID vaccines and the mandates and everything. I mean I'm sure. Am I the only one that was jumping through the screen that day?

[Dan Crenshaw]

Well, I think, Maureen, I was speaking kind of broadly, not the conversation is kind of fixated on that moment in Covid. I think in the same conversation I've said repeatedly and I think I said it earlier today, the party has not admitted where it got stuff wrong during COVID I just, it was so much.

[Maureen]

More than that, Dan. It was destroying lives. No shutting down any conversation. People were walking around like I don't even want to say anything. I don't even want to say that. You know, I have questions because this thing is brand new and it was pushed through.

[Dan Crenshaw]

I, well, Americans in real time, I believe you and I may disagree that the government, Both governments, Trump 1 and Biden 2 or Biden 1 had the best of intentions while they were drinking from the fire hose. They got stuff wrong. Trump got stuff wrong in his first term on Covid and Biden got stuff wrong. And if you want to have trust, you have to admit where you got stuff wrong. But only I don't think they around saying how do people, I think they thought it was an, it was a Nash, it was a health crisis and they thought that wearing the masks and, and the vaccines and everything was the right solution. It turns out they got some of it wrong, Dan.

[Maureen]

But deplatforming, demonetizing and destroying people's lives is in a totally different arena, in my opinion.

[Dan Crenshaw]

Well, look, I mean the Democrats would say take a look at some of the stuff happening now. So I, I mean look, they're not getting deplatformed.

[Maureen]

We're all for free speech. But okay, thanks for that.

[Dan Crenshaw]

That's a much longer conversation. I would not say that on the.

[Maureen]

Right right now in the golf tournament. I just, I, I really wish Dan would have been or Sean would have been here because I want to talk about that big golf tournament Golf or tennis?

[Mark Levin]

Golf.

[Maureen]

The. The one that. Remember one of the Two Way members suggested early on that we should have for the 250th anniversary, we should have a huge nationwide golf tournament.

[Mark Levin]

Yeah. All right, well, when Sean's here, come back, we'll plan it. Maureen, thank you. Appreciate it. Samuel, Sam, welcome in. Thanks for being part of Two Way. Tell folks that I know where you are. What's on your mind, guys?

[Samuel]

Good to be with you. Coming to you from Groton, Connecticut and let's go submarines. Yeah. Since his hearing, the, the reaction to Kennedy. Well, the hearing itself from, especially the questioning from the Dems and then the reaction in the media has had me a bit exercise because I feel like this is a really kind of a make or break issue for the country, whether we want to be. Be satisfied with the status quo where we're the sickest wealthy nation in the, in the world. And so called healthcares the third leading cause of death according to a 2018 study published by Johns Hopkins. And we spend about 50% of.

[Mark Levin]

What.

[Samuel]

The world spends in total on pharmaceutical drugs. Or do we want to move towards, you know, curing chronic illness through, you know, reforms, through getting corruption out of. Out of scientific research and out of the agencies and out of the.

[Mark Levin]

Yeah, I love the way you framed it, but all I'd say is we shouldn't have to choose between those two. You know, it shouldn't be. We need to fix the system, but we have to take the mayhem because the mayhem's not good.

[Dan Crenshaw]

Well, and that's where too you raised like four different issues and they're all valid. And I think most of the country would say those are the right questions. But when you go to trying to eliminate like Florida saying kids don't have to get any vaccines anymore, it freaks parents out because some of those vaccines are absolute. The polio vaccine is a good thing. Us ridding the world of polio is an outstanding achievement. Us making sure that kids are healthy and safe and grandparents is an outstanding accomplishment. Most Americans have concerns about their government. They want questions asked. They don't think the government is entirely, completely, 100% corrupt and has to be destroyed. That is where sometimes Maga and Maha confuse where the silent majority of this country is and where they are.

[Larry O'Connor]

Yeah, I don't, I don't think that it's the position of the Health and Human Services secretary to destroy the public health institutions. And I think you think he thinks.

[Dan Crenshaw]

They have to be torn down and rebuilt.

[Larry O'Connor]

I think that you and your party have not and the media, for that matter, have not yet come to terms with the damage that was done to our public health institutions during the pandemic and what was fed to it. And I know that you can say it was the fog of war. They were doing their best, but I have, Larry. That they knew that.

[Mark Levin]

Larry, I've come to terms with that. But like Senator Barrasso and the gentleman from Louisiana, I just don't want mayhem at the top of its scientific.

[Larry O'Connor]

People believe that it's mayhem. The people who have left the CDC and accused Secretary Kennedy of doing things were part of the problem in.

[Dan Crenshaw]

That is not true. That is absolutely not true.

[Mark Levin]

Some of them. Some of them, yes, but some of them were Kennedy hires.

[Larry O'Connor]

The ones that have been jumping, Larry. People doing research, doing their media tours were part of the problem.

[Dan Crenshaw]

You know what? But Larry, this is where. And as a Democrat, I encourage you guys to keep speaking this way, okay? Scientists working on kids diabetes are not deep staters trying to. Who like went out there off the reservation night. Like, this is where you guys are just have. Are going to lose the public. There were mistakes made, but the idea that that place and all these people fired were fauci.

[Mark Levin]

Hold on. First of all, hold on, hold on, hold on, hold on, Larry, because Alexandra's laughing very hard at this conversation. So Samuel, stay with us. But Oscar, what's so funny? I don't mean that in a mean way. I mean that in a. Seriously, like, why. Why are you laughing at this?

[Alexandra]

He's talking about mayhem. It was mayhem before. I mean, that's what's funny to me. Like, yeah, yeah, I denounce.

[Mark Levin]

I denounce the past. I denounce the status quo and I denounce.

[Larry O'Connor]

I appreciate that, Dan, but here's the question. Who from the CDC or the Biden administration or from Health and Human Services back when that mayhem was going on, who paid a price for it? Who was accountable?

[Dan Crenshaw]

Who actually higher party got wiped out in 2020.

[Larry O'Connor]

That's politics. I'm talking about the human that doesn't do anything for children who lost three years of schooling and.

[Mark Levin]

Amen. Amen. Amen. Larry, you're 100% right. You're 100% right.

[Dan Crenshaw]

I hear you, Larry. That's why I've said it was a mistake to keep the schools.

[Larry O'Connor]

That's what I mean when I say people haven't come to terms with that. There are.

[Mark Levin]

All right, hold on, hold on. Let's let Mr. Jenks in one time than. Ms. Howard. Mr. Jenks, do you have anything you want to say in conclusion or you.

[Samuel]

All done one more point to feed into this. The New York Times. New York Times had two. Two articles this year, one about. About fraud and Alzheimer's research as an example, and one of them was called the Devastating Legacy of Lies and Alzheimer's Science. I suggest read checking it out.

[Mark Levin]

It's.

[Samuel]

It's bone chilling and, you know, leaves you with the impression that we cannot trust the science because scientists are motivated by the same things other people are motivated by. For money, for reputational integrity, for the approbation of their peers.

[Mark Levin]

Yeah.

[Samuel]

And, you know, I don't think that Robert Kennedy is perfect. I do, however, believe that, like, if he says something false, he believes it to be true. I don't think he's a liar.

[Mark Levin]

I don't know if you're the cabinet secretary. I don't know that you get a pass because you believe lies. But thank you. Let me say it this way, okay? Playing off what Larry said. Thank you, Samuel. The left in this country is either playing dumb or is dangerously willfully blind to how angry with justification people on the right are about what happened not just during COVID but with the deep state implications for medicine for our kids and for science. The left must come to terms with that. But, Larry, you must come to terms with how frightened half or more of the country is about what's happening now. Don't, don't defend. Don't defend what's going on simply by pointing to what happened in the past. Think about why they're upset. Think about why they're concerned. That's no better than what the left is doing about the recent past. It's no better.

[Larry O'Connor]

I take your point. I think the problem is when you consider the source of the criticism of Kennedy, that it would be.

[Dan Crenshaw]

It would.

[Mark Levin]

John Barrasso. John Barrasso.

[Dan Crenshaw]

Look again. And guys. Larry, if we're going to talk about inconsistency, then both parties basically have to go home. Right. Because the both parties are completely inconsistent on half the things out there. That's been the history of politics since the beginning of time. Again, we have an 8020 issue here.

[Mark Levin]

Yep, yep.

[Dan Crenshaw]

Every poll, even Republican says it.

[Mark Levin]

Alexandra, Alexandra, hold on. We got it. We don't get at least. Alexandra. And maybe one more. Alexandra, go ahead.

[Alexandra]

Well, what's been happening hasn't been working. And so if you want something to change, you have to change something.

[Dan Crenshaw]

Well, that's why I would disagree with you about vaccines and that science in general, we are the most innovative country in the world. We've solved more health crises than anywhere in the world. Don't confuse. It doesn't work. Could be better. Don't say it doesn't work.

[Mark Levin]

Hold on. Alan, unmute, please. We want to get you in before we need to go. So here's Alan. Alan, tell folks who don't know where you are and what's on your mind for Larry and for Dan.

[Alexandra]

Well, I'm in Germany right now, but I have a house in New York. So I just wanted to add to this that I don't think that it's even just the COVID time that it's, you know, cumulatively, I think people have felt that you can't really trust the science. I'll just remind you that in New York City, you can get out of taking the getting vaccines for your kids on religious reasons. That's not science.

[Dan Crenshaw]

Well, that's the Constitution.

[Alexandra]

And, you know, and another one, my kids are in their 20s and 30s, but at one point, probably around child number three, I had a friend who worked in high places in banking who was in one of those meetings with the pharmaceutical company that was trying to push through one of the vaccines for kids. And it's not one of the important ones. It's not the polio or the measles, but they were pushing it through. And he came home and said, we are not giving our kids that shot because he watched the greed basically on that thing. So that's just. I don't think it's. That's not a Democrat or Republican side. It's a power. It's people wanting to keep their power. And so my question actually to you guys is if you could get rid of rfk, who's somebody that could fill that spot, who, who can still shake things up and get to the truth that we're all wanting. I mean, that's just. I just, I heard you guys say that the other day, and I thought, okay, who's better? Who do you have in mind?

[Mark Levin]

Great, great question, Larry. You got a candidate if rfk somehow.

[Larry O'Connor]

I'm a big fan of our current head of the FDA, Marty McCary. He's a Johns Hopkins doctor. He was a really. I had him on my program because we're local to Johns Hopkins in D.C. he was a very, very sober and intelligent voice on public health policy. Most of the people who are passionate about this issue like I am, we are. Our passion is out of an understanding that we need a credible public health policy in this country. When you say a poll, dan says that 80% of Americans believe in vaccines. I'm one of those 80%, I believe in vaccines. But when you drill down further into that poll and you reveal how many vaccines our children get before the age of three and what the schedule looks like and the lack of transparency and the lack of accountability on a lot of those vaccines, then you get a very different question. This isn't so cut and dry of oh well, you're either anti science or pro science. This is about public health policy. I would pick Marty Makary if we but I don't think we're getting rid of Kennedy.

[Mark Levin]

Yeah. Dan, I thoughts If Kennedy decided to.

[Dan Crenshaw]

To go do something else, Dr. John off this platform would be phenomenal. But I mean, look, I would agree with Larry, someone who is a doctor, someone who brings data and facts to the conversation. If they've held these theories, hopefully they're not. There isn't this long paper trail. Let the science and the data guide you to your answers. Not long held convictions and you look for data to match your conviction.

[Mark Levin]

I'm sure I'll be hammered on this because I'm basing this on a relationship of 10 years ago, but Bobby Jindal, former governor of Louisiana.

[Dan Crenshaw]

Oh yeah, Louisiana.

[Mark Levin]

Larry, is he in good stead with MAGA these days? I don't even know.

[Larry O'Connor]

He hasn't been on the radar in a while. But I think he is very good with health policy and funding.

[Mark Levin]

Yeah. Knows a lot about public policy and health. A brilliant guy, a lot of integrity. So I'd be for him. But again, not a good one. Not if he wouldn't be vetoed. Ellen, thank you. What are you doing in Germany?

[Alexandra]

My husband's working here. We just got sick of New York for a while.

[Mark Levin]

Are you from New York state or New York City?

[Alexandra]

New York City, Queens. Which my follow up question, which has nothing to do with health except my own is when should I sell my house? Should I wait till he becomes mayor or how long do I wait?

[Mark Levin]

Might be too late. You have a couple weeks, but I wouldn't wait much longer than that. Alan, thank you. Grateful to you for being part of two ways. All right, Larry, earlier on Maureen said everyone in life will go through three traumatic not law enforcement. Three traumatic events in their lifetime. I feel like you've had two today.

[Larry O'Connor]

Really?

[Mark Levin]

Right here on this program now. Just making sure you do it.

[Larry O'Connor]

I don't feel traumatized at all.

[Mark Levin]

You're doing all right. All right.

[Larry O'Connor]

Sean Spicer is the luckiest man in media.

[Mark Levin]

Yeah, speaking. Speaking of Sean Spicer, although he's skipping this program today for cause, as we say. At the Fed. He's got Blogo on his program tonight. So look forward to that. Megan McCain back. Citizen McCain noon eastern time today. Please check it out. Guy Benson of the Guy Benson show on Fox News Radio will be your guest. Larry, I don't know why you didn't choose that as the name of your show, the Guy Benson Show.

[Larry O'Connor]

It was already taken. Yeah.

[Mark Levin]

Yeah, seems like it.

[Larry O'Connor]

Guy and I are old friends and we both work at Town hall together.

[Mark Levin]

He's a very smart guy. All right. Two way tonight, tonight. Okay. Two way tonight, tonight. Not one, not two, not three, but four guests all star here. First of all, Dan's colleagues from the group chat, Emma Jo Morris and Nina Turner will be will be here. Rachel Bade of Politico or what it was called in its original incarnation, the Politico. Rachel broke a huge story this morning which you can read now about Scott Besant and Mr. What's his name? Pulte. Bill Pulte. Is that his name? Bill Pulte getting into, getting into confrontation at a big dinner in Washington at that new club. Larry, you've been to that big new club.

[Larry O'Connor]

I haven't. I know.

[Mark Levin]

I, I feel like reporters, reporters aren't supposed to be allowed to go. Somebody just asked me if I'd have dinner there and I said I don't think reporters are allowed and he checked and no, I'm not allowed to go.

[Larry O'Connor]

But anyway, I'm a radio host.

[Mark Levin]

That's called different rules. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's called, it's called the executive committee. Is that what it's called, the executive something? Anyway, read Rachel's story and come come to come to Two Way tonight and Rachel will talk you through why Scott Besant nearly came to blows with the Med.

[Dan Crenshaw]

And you'll get my reference when I started the show about how Bessant would go beat the heck out of somebody.

[Mark Levin]

Yeah. That's what Dan was referencing. And then David Bonson, managing partner of the Bonson Group, will also be joining to talk about the economy. So tonight, 6:00pm Eastern Time. Please join us. And we're here all week, as they say. Larry is going to be at Chuckles in Dayton Tuesday through Thursday, so don't miss that. And Dan, what do you got coming up this week? Anything we should know?

[Dan Crenshaw]

I'm going to go see a lot of people in Washington, D.C. and Capitol Hill to hear the latest on how Democrats are thinking.

[Mark Levin]

Yeah. So if you passed, if you're on Capitol Hill.

[Dan Crenshaw]

Yeah. You see me.

[Mark Levin]

If you see Dan, just point and say that looks just like Dan Turntine say it's a Lamar Alexander joke, although it's not his originally. Somebody comes up to Dan and says, did anybody ever tell you you look, look just like Dan Turntine? And he says, yeah, I get that all the time. And that person says, you must hate that. One of my favorite political jokes. All right. Thank you for watching. We'll be back in 23 hours. Sean will be back. Larry, always so grateful to have you on. Thanks for making time. And we'll see you all. I'll see you all at 6pm tonight for 2A tonight. Thank you for being part of the two way community. Good night. Good luck. Have a wonderful day. Go Bills.