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The Morning Meeting
Iran Threatens That No Port Is Safe in Strait of Hormuz as Trump's Blockade Looms
01:07:52
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- [00:00]
Unknown Speaker
Foreign,
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Mark Halperin
everybody, new week here, a morning meeting. Larry and Kevin are here. I'm here, you're here, and we're delighted to have you here. If you are here on the platform and want to get in on the conversation, please raise your hand. If you're watching on x or on YouTube. No, smack in the chat. Peace, love and understanding as we start this very important week. And gentlemen, welcome in. How much of the show would you like to spend on Iran, guys? How much of the show? Give me a percentage.
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Kevin Sheridan
I like to spend more time on Rory than. Than Iran. But, yeah, you know.
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Mark Halperin
How much? How much, Larry? How much?
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Larry O'Connor
I think about at least a third of it, shouldn't it?
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Mark Halperin
At least a third. I'm thinking more like two. I'm thinking more like two fifths. And that's more than a third in my book. That's close, yeah. Anyway, we'll see. I don't know, we'll see. There's other topics we want to get to. The California governor situation and. And Congress and a few other things, but we'll spend a lot of time on Iran. Again, if you're here and you want to get on the conversation, please raise your hand. I'm going to run through the day book and then we're going to get going. So join us in. Join. Join in with us. Thank you very much. Here's the pool today, covering the President who currently has no public events. I'll just note that the secondary TV is Gray TV and the new media is Human Events. Larry, who covers the White House these days for Human Events? Is it John Gizzy, Human?
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Larry O'Connor
No, Gizzy's at Newsmax. Human Events is going to be Jack Posic, I believe. Really?
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Mark Halperin
All right.
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Larry O'Connor
I think he purchased. I think he purchased Human Events, and
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Mark Halperin
Jack's a good pooler. It's called on a lot. Here's the presidency.
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Kevin Sheridan
He's been on your show quite a bit, Mark, hasn't he? He's joined.
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Mark Halperin
He's been on. We'd like him more, but he's been. He's been. Here's the President's schedule today. Nothing public. Executive time right now, Signing time. Close press at 2, policy meeting. Close press at 4, and then a couple events with the King and Queen of the Netherlands, who are a handsome couple. I saw some pictures.
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Kevin Sheridan
We love the Dutch.
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Mark Halperin
Yeah. Of the Dutch. Anyway, 7 and 7:45 is dinner. I'm not. Any of you invited to that dinner?
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Kevin Sheridan
No. See what they serve? Yeah, they're. They're not really.
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Larry O'Connor
Dinners like that.
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Unknown Speaker
Yeah.
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Mark Halperin
Anyway. No, no public opinion Scheduled, but we'll see. Don't know what the vice president's doing. Probably doing some resting after his marathon. Not just a 20 hour meeting, but then a 20 hour flight. That's a lot of stuff. Senate is back tonight. Here's the vice president arriving home. Looks pretty. Looks pretty, pretty. Feisty and energized. Maybe slept on the plane.
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Kevin Sheridan
Well, by all accounts, he was making a lot of phone calls from the plane, too. He called a ton of people.
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Mark Halperin
He burned it up. Air Force Two, I guess, has good, good cell coverage. The Senate comes back. They're voting on a judge thing tonight. Lots of business for Capitol Hill to get done. We'll be talking about that this week, but they've got a very full agenda. Some stuff more timely than others, but they're here all week. The House again back tomorrow. Also tomorrow week ahead, Israeli Lebanon, peace talks are scheduled to start tomorrow. It's IMF and World Bank Week in D.C. so there's tons of sessions with cabinet members, tons of bilateral meetings. Traffic at a standstill. The vice president tomorrow goes to University of Georgia and does a Turning Point USA event. Wednesday, of course, is Tax Day and there'll be events by both parties around that. Senate Appropriations is having a hearing on Wednesday on preparations for the World Cup. Secretary Chris Wright testifying on Capitol Hill. Melania Trump on Capitol Hill talking to Ways and Means Committee members about foster care. But perhaps they'll ask her about Jeffrey Epstein. The president on Thursday travels to the Silver State for a Tax week event. Russell, I don't know how to pronounce it, so I always say the Silver State. As you know, Nevada. Russ Vote will testify House Budget Committee on Wednesday and Senate Budget on Thursday. Ways and Means, here's from Bobby Kennedy on Thursday. The president on Friday is going to a Build the Red Wall event at the Dream City Church in Phoenix. That's another Turning Point action event. Jimmy Kimmel's guests this week include the great Zachis, Zach Galifianakis and Molly Shannon.
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Larry O'Connor
Steve, you can pronounce, but you can pronounce Nevada, Correct?
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Mark Halperin
Stephen Colbert welcomes Anne Hathaway and the great Anderson Cooper. And Jimmy Fallon's guests include Tracy Morgan. Either of you do a Tracy Morgan imitation?
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Kevin Sheridan
We'd be very delicate with that.
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Larry O'Connor
Are you trying to get us canceled?
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Mark Halperin
I used to do a pretty good one, but I can't right now for reasons I'm not at liberty to say. All right, Quick, quick word from a sponsor. Our friends at Cozy Earth are having a new sale for Mom's Day. If you Got two moms you need to buy presents for? Here's a gift idea. The bamboo sheet set. And it's the promo codes. Morning Bogo because you can buy one and get one free right now. Go to cozyearth.com and get two sets of bedding. Best part of the day is often the simplest. Getting into bed and feeling something cool and smooth, soft against your skin. Cozy Earth bamboo sheets. They're made 100% viscous from bamboo buttery soft sateen finish. It gets softer with every wash, ladies and gentlemen, every wash. So you'll be watching them a lot, I guess. Breathable, temperature resistant regulating. Designed with an oversized fit for a gentle drape that settles around you just right. They're available in a range of sizes and colors. And right now, again, get two sets of the bedding for Mother's Day for two moms in your life, get them some fresh sheets. They'll love it. Go to cozyearth.com use my code Morning Bogo for the exclusive. Buy one, get one free offer Morning Bogo 100 risk free. You can keep them for 100 nights. If you don't like them, you send them back. Get your money back. This Mother's Day gives a gift that shows up every single night. Head to cozyearth.com, use my code morningbogo.
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Matt Ebert
I started with one shop. No college degree, no big investors. It was just a willingness to work. Over time, that one shop turned into a multi billion dollar business called Crash Champions. All the lessons I learned along the way came from the grind. And that's what my show podcrash is all about. We have real conversations with people who've built things the hard way. We talk to founders, athletes and blue collar leaders who kept going when things got tough. You'll hear stories of grit, leadership and growth. Plus real world lessons you can take back to your team and your life tomorrow.
- [06:25]
Mark Halperin
When you get momentum, you step on the gas.
- [06:28]
Unknown Speaker
That's how you get separation from everybody else. I was at Harvard Law School.
- [06:31]
Mark Halperin
I was blah, blah, blah. I looked up, let me tell you something.
- [06:33]
Unknown Speaker
There's kids in my neighborhood putting in
- [06:35]
Mark Halperin
sheetrock that are smarter than you.
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Unknown Speaker
AI is going to disrupt a lot of stuff. It is never going to disrupt physical blue collar trade skill.
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Matt Mahan
And the guy just looked at me and he said it's bloody impossible. So I asked him this question.
- [06:47]
Mark Halperin
I said, it's impossible. Unless that's.
- [06:51]
Matt Ebert
Podcast with me, Matt ebert. Watch on YouTube and listen wherever you get your podcasts.
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Mark Halperin
All right, gentlemen, we're going to talk about Iran first. Lots going on with Iran. And I want to start with just kind of the latest developments. The blockade begins 10 Eastern time in theory. And we're going to, we're going to see how that goes. Many people in the administration, the New York Post, the Wall Street Journal editorial board, very enthused about the blockade and its prospects for working. I myself have a lot of questions about how this is going to work. Here's retired Admiral Montgomery, who's often quoted on Iran 103. He says the blockade is a good idea. But here's what he also says. Even if Trump was shooting from the hip here, it was a pretty good shot, meaning imposing the blockade. I think Iranians will feel the pinch for this. But then he says it won't be enough to get Iran to return to negotiations. Quote, he's probably going to have to do strikes on their nuclear program, things like that, to get them to the table. That's a horse of a different color, as my grandfather would say. Both sides say they're open to negotiations. The Turks, the Pakistanis, the Egyptians, others, maybe the Chinese are all trying to figure out could there be more negotiations. I'm not sure where and when they would be. No specifics on that yet. But there is the desire, at least the claim desire, to keep the ceasefire going, which so far seems to be holding, and get both sides back at the table. The Iranians, however, don't seem too enthused with the prospects of a presidential blockade. Here's 107, please. The Iranians. The announcement set the stage for a showdown as Iran immediately responded with threats on all ports in the Persian Gulf and the Gulf of Oman. Quote, security in the Persian Gulf and the Sea of Oman is either for everyone or for no one. The Iranian Broadcasting Republic, Islamic Republic of Iran Broadcasting, said Monday, quote, no port in the region will be safe. Iran could hit other ports. They could hit pipelines in Saudi and elsewhere. They also could, of course, try to hit the ships and other the vessels that are trying to enforce the blockade. We don't really know what would happen if a ship tried to evade the blockade. Would the Americans board the ship? Would they use force to steer it someplace else? A lot of unanswered questions right now. And as the Wall street journal reports, 115 that the President may do what Montgomery suggests and use more strikes to break the embargo. This is the Journal. 115, please. President Trump and his advisors are looking at resuming limited military strikes in Iran. The president has talked about this over the weekend as he announced the blockade as a coalition effort, but so far no one can name a member of the coalition. Don't know where the Chinese are on this. They, they can't be happy with the blockade. Here is, here is. Where is this the Brits, Macron, 110, please. Macron and Starmer, they're always for a meeting. So they've announced that they're going to have a meeting and organize a conference with those countries prepared to contribute alongside us to a peaceful multinational mission aimed at restoring freedom of navigation in the strait. This strictly defensive mission, separate from the warring parties to the conflict, is intended to be deployed as soon as circumstances permit. Doesn't sound from that statement like this timely conference. Here's the Starmer statement on X saying the same thing. It doesn't sound like this conference is intended to help enforce a military blockade. Sounds like something else. Finally, let's hear from three people who have on morning TV who talked about where they think things stand. Let's roll 113, 119 and 131, all back to back. This is Hillary Clinton and Tom Cotton and David Ignatius. Not in that order. Progress we're making. Do you think on some level the administration regrets the cease fire?
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Unknown Speaker
No, I don't think so. I think the President has bent over backwards now, going back nine years, trying to allow Iran take very simple, very easy steps of turning over their nuclear materials, shutting down their nuclear infrastructure, stopping their support for terrorism. These are not onerous demands. These are something we expect from any civilized nation.
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Right.
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And the President's going to continue to try to find a way to meet those demands. But he's going to keep the military and economic pressure on Iran until they do.
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Larry O'Connor
They got.
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Unknown Speaker
That would mean a lot of money for Iran, would mean, mean a promise of American assistance in rebuilding Iran after the war. But I am told by people in touch with sources in Tehran that already there is sharp criticism of Mohammed Bakr Kaliba, the House speaker who met with JD Vance for even sitting down and talking about this kind of cooperate, cooperation with the United States. He's being accused of corruption, of selling out the revolution.
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Matt Ebert
So there we go.
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Unknown Speaker
That you, you'd fear, Joe, is that, is that the hardliners are out to get him.
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So we're in a situation now where we are weak, where we essentially have lost the leverage and initiative that we had. I supported Trump bombing the nuclear sites back in June. I thought that was an appropriate and limited strategic objective. I opposed his incoherent attack on Iran and I also know from personal experience how Netanyahu has tried to get every American President to agree to have an open ended war with Iran because I had many, many long hours, long conversation with him and his war cabinet about this and refusing to go along with a very inchoate desire to do something to Iran that, you know, with no real end state that could be described sufficiently. So now here we are. I think you've got to get back into hard negotiations with the right people at the table who know what they are doing.
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Mark Halperin
She was very dismissive of Witkoff and Kushner and to some extent the Vice President, saying they didn't have sufficient expertise to do these conversations. Kevin, how do you see the, the blockade playing out? How do you see the connection between the blockade, the ceasefire and any additional peace talks?
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Kevin Sheridan
Yeah, lot to unpack there. I think. First, on the, on the blockade we talked weeks ago about, and maybe it was Richard Haass, maybe it was someone else. This whole idea of all in or all out as a leverage point for the Iranians, not this trickle of only Iranian ships getting through, only Chinese marked ships getting through. And we'll see how this plays out. It's a major choke point for the Iranians. 80% of their income comes from oil and gas exporting. It's over $100 billion. This is going to cost them upwards of 275 million a day as this goes on. And we're already seeing them have to issue larger and larger pills because of inflation. Is at 50. We think it's a problem here. It's at 50% in the country. So certainly a choke point on the economic front. I think the other interesting factor you brought up at the outset, Mark, is what will the Chinese do? Right. We know 40% of the exports go to the CCP. And, and you tweeted out earlier in the conversation about, I wonder if there was a heads up to Xi Jinping about this whole process. And again, what happens potentially if a Chinese marked ship tries to leave and then we're in another delicate situation involving a geopolitical showdown, potentially.
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Mark Halperin
Larry o', Connor, standby. Kevin, just put a fine point on it. You said it's a choke point. It's only a choke point if it works. I'd like it to work, but I don't think it's, I don't think it's going to. So do you think it's going to work
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Kevin Sheridan
again? You know, it's a pain point for us as well. Right. And then you saw the President, but
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Mark Halperin
just starting in 45 minutes. Do you think the United States and whatever allies there might be will effectively stop traffic from going through that the United States wants to block, or do you think you do?
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Kevin Sheridan
Yes.
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Mark Halperin
And how long?
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Kevin Sheridan
And again. Well, and you've already, You, You've already, you know, re. Reworked so much of the shipping already, you know, to friendlier ports. So there's not that many ships that are going to actually attempt this. I can't imagine either. The question is, what do the Iranians do? They attack a US Navy warship, and then that's then a whole other ball game with this, with this ceasefire going on for the next 10 days, Larry,
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Mark Halperin
why wouldn't they attack a ship? It seems to me that's what's going to happen. The US Is going to try to enforce a blockade. A drone.
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Mike from St. Louis
What?
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Mark Halperin
A drone. A missile.
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Larry O'Connor
They've been trying to attack. They've been trying to attack our Navy vessels with drones since after October 7th through the Houthis and Hezbollah. They don't get there. We have defense. What else are they going to hit us with missiles? They've been trying to.
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Mark Halperin
What if they hit a. What if they hit a port in one of the Gulf states?
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Larry O'Connor
Well, they've been trying to do that and they've been doing that. That wouldn't really change things, would it?
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Mark Halperin
Well, it would violate the ceasefire. It would violate the ceasefire.
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Larry O'Connor
It would. That's true. It would be. I mean, I think this is a brilliant move. And I also think that it will be respected mostly because the US Navy is so respected around the world that I think that. I think the real net result of this is that this is going to choke off China that much further. Mark. Right, China, China needs to get that stuff from the Strait of Hormuz.
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Mark Halperin
So then, so then it's the bank. So it's the bank shot, then that China goes to Iran and says, give them your nuclear material. We need our oil. Is that.
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Larry O'Connor
I believe, I believe China at one, at this point, at some point, China is going to be the missing element here. China has the most influence over Iran. China needs this to be resolved. That's, that's my understanding of this. And I, I think. I, I don't. I think that right now, the US Navy, My understanding is that they feel very confident that they're going to be able to execute this, and it's going to be successful.
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Mark Halperin
If China goes from providing intelligence and weaponry to Iran to help them win the war, to asking their allies to, to, to settle this by acceding to the US Demands, I, I will eat an entire order of mushy pork. That's.
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Larry O'Connor
How will you do it on the air? With a two liter Diet Coke? Mark, the Chinese are practical and pragmatic and they realize this is a losing mission for them. I don't quite.
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Mark Halperin
But then why are they, why are they helping Iran win? Why are they helping Iran win?
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Larry O'Connor
Well, they're not helping Iran win. Iran is not winning.
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Mark Halperin
Well, according to the President, they are. In fact, here's what the President said,
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Larry O'Connor
but he didn't say Iran's winning. He said they're helping Iran.
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Mark Halperin
Helping them in the end, it's helping them in their effort. Here's the President with Maria yesterday talking about China. This is number 112, please.
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Kelly from South Carolina
Just to be clear, you said the other day that any country that supports Iran and sends military equipment to Iran will face a 50% tariff if they try to bring products. Did you refer to China? Did you mean China?
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Unknown Speaker
Yes, and other people, but yes, China too, if we find that China. Because I hear news reports, so a news report doesn't mean much to me because they're so fake. But I hear news reports about China giving the shoulder missiles, what's called the shoulder missile, anti aircraft missile. I doubt they would do that because I have a relationship and I think they wouldn't do that. But maybe they did a little bit at the beginning, but I don't think they would anymore. No, but if we catch them doing that, they get a 50% tariff, which is a staggering, that's a staggering amount.
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Mark Halperin
So are you guys both, are you guys both saying that what's going to happen now is the ceasefire will hold, the blockade will work and the Iranians will say to themselves, even though we held out for all these US against these US demands on opening the strait on nuclear, on terror, we should just cave in now. We should just, we should just give the US what it wants. We should go, we should reconvene, give them what they want because they blockaded us. Is that what you guys think is really going to happen?
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Kevin Sheridan
I think that the factor, the X factor here is what happens domestically within the country. You talked about the hardliners targeting the moderates that are in conversations with us. The fact that they have to issue these new banknotes that are massive, right, in terms of, to pay for bananas on the street. The domestic issue is what's interesting to me just in terms of you're stopping 80% of the country's income in the short term with these oil exports. And I'm interested to see what the people do.
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Mark Halperin
Yeah.
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Larry O'Connor
I think that there are multiple paths that happen at this point. Iran has several choices. One of them is, is, as you said, you know, send some attacks on these Navy vessels and God forbid, if one of them is successful and they cause damage to a US Navy vessel, then all will break loose in a round. Yeah, yeah, that's number one. Number two, they try and they fail and they look, you know, pathetic. Number three, they re. Examine their position, as you just laid out, Mark, I think that that's a long shot because a lot of them are dead enders still and they still are, you know, fighting the Islamic revolution. And number four, this becomes entrenched. It reaches a point where China exerts their influence and says, enough of this. That's, that's what I think. Right. And there may be other scenarios.
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Mark Halperin
Larry, how long, how long will all that take? Weeks? Days?
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Larry O'Connor
No, I think it's this week. I think that it all, it all transpires during one week. I don't think it needs to take that long if it gets, if, if those ports are blockaded. Right.
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Kevin Sheridan
Well, and Mark, this, this is all, I think, through the lens of negotiation tactics. Right. The blockade, I think we should view through that. Right.
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Larry O'Connor
And you, this, Trump does he increased
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Kevin Sheridan
more pressure now that Pakistan and the Turks and all those. There's still these conversations going on. I think this is literally part of the negotiation tactics that don't have to last for weeks on end, but maybe days.
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Larry O'Connor
By the way, point of personal Republican privilege real fast, because I can't let it go.
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Kevin Sheridan
I believe with your privilege. There you go.
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Larry O'Connor
I believe Jared Kushner has successfully negotiated four different Middle East, Arab, Israel peace agreements. Hillary Clinton has negotiated zero in her August career. Why could you give us a trigger warning next time we have to hear Hillary Clinton telling us about what should be going on in the Middle East? Because that was painful.
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Mark Halperin
All right, Brent. Brent crude. Brent crude is up. The Dow futures are down almost a percentage. So the markets are jittery, although I'm surprised they're not more jittery. The markets seem to still think what you guys think. I'm, I'm surprised you guys are as bullish on this. This is, this is going to require enormous execution. And if past is prologue, the Iranians are not going to cave because the blockade, they're going to rally public opinion around the notion that they're being blockaded
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Larry O'Connor
by the Great Satan whose public opinion. There is no such thing as public opinion in Iran. People are. There is a gun.
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Mark Halperin
Well, there is in the sense that I thought you guys were suggesting that the reason the Iranians were going to cave was because the economy was about to collapse even more.
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Kevin Sheridan
I mean, that's, that's the point I'm making is the massive inflation has nothing
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Mark Halperin
to do with that. Well, it has something to do with that because they're worried about the economy, because they don't want people back in the streets. They're not worried about the economy for themselves.
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Kevin Sheridan
And again, during a cease fire, if the bombs aren't. Bombs aren't falling, does that then encourage, you know, the Iranians, as we saw last December and early January, back into the street?
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Mark Halperin
If the Iranians hit something related to the blockade, Larry doesn't think they can hit a ship. I don't know why, but I respect his point of view.
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Larry O'Connor
Well, because they've been trying to hit ships forever. Well, I mean, they haven't.
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Mark Halperin
But now, but now, but now we've
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Kevin Sheridan
got ships, but our ships haven't. Our ships haven't traversed the strait yet.
- [23:15]
Mark Halperin
Exactly.
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Kevin Sheridan
So now we're in close proximity. More assets that they potentially have.
- [23:19]
Mark Halperin
Exactly. They're much closer.
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Larry O'Connor
They're going to be much closer. US Navy vessels have been under fire from drones shot by the Houthis since October 7th and by missiles since October 7th.
- [23:30]
Mark Halperin
Larry, start drafting your apology note to me because this is going to happen.
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Larry O'Connor
Well, God forbid. I don't want it to happen.
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Mark Halperin
Of course not. I'm just really worried about what this is going to require just to execute it. People talk blithely about blockading here, like, I don't know what they're going to do if a Chinese ship goes through or ship intended for China goes through. They're going to stop it, board it, force it into a friendly port. That's complicated stuff.
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Kevin Sheridan
And we also have questions, you know. Yeah, yeah. Jim Savridis was also out there on one of the networks this morning or, or yesterday talking about what are the Emiratis going to do and what, you know, we, we need the help of the Saudis, too, for this blockade, and the Emiratis in particular to make it that more effective. And we, I don't think we've heard from them. They say the blockade just yet.
- [24:17]
Mark Halperin
They say they're going to help, but there's, as you said, there's no sign they're going to. If, if the president, if the ceasefire is broken either by the Iranians or, or, or some other way, the Israelis or, or the U.S. do you think Americans will pay attention to that in others do you think the Americans think the war is over now and there'd be more of a political price in the short term to pay or, or people aren't paying attention? Like, what's the, what are the politics of, of starting the war back up if that happens? Either of you have a view on that?
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Larry O'Connor
My sense is that the American were happy with the ceasefire, but if they're, if, if the military is engaged once again, it'll be in response to something that Iran does. And I think that that will be. I think, I think it'll be supported.
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Kevin Sheridan
Yeah. And again, God forbid that, that X factor, if we're, if a navy ship or personnel are attacked. And again, to Larry's point, we've got the greatest navy in the world. Go Navy, beat army. But this, this could be a huge, huge factor that then would reignite interest in what's going on over there by the American people.
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Mark Halperin
All right.
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Larry O'Connor
By the way, don't get me wrong. I'm not dismissing that there is a threat there. What I'm saying is that I think the Navy is equipped and prepared and trained and have endured this already. It's been going on.
- [25:31]
Mark Halperin
Yeah.
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Larry O'Connor
And they have not been able to cause that damage. And I think that they're. I don't think they would be entering into this if they weren't confident that they would be able to repel an attack.
- [25:39]
Mark Halperin
I'll just say. Well said. I'll just, I'll just say in conclusion, then we'll switch to the Pope. And again, if you want to get in on the conversation about Iran, please raise your hand. As you both have suggested. This whole thing is about getting the Iranians to negotiate in full. Right. The American position now is pretty clear. It's a great list. No nuclear material. No nuclear program going forward. Hand over the nuclear material. No proxies. No proxies. And missiles and open the strait. And then in return for that, the US will turn it into Fifth Avenue in the Middle East. Seems like a good deal. We know what the US Is now asking.
- [26:15]
Kevin Sheridan
Which it was. Which it was in 1977.
- [26:18]
Mark Halperin
Exactly.
- [26:18]
Larry O'Connor
Yes.
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Mark Halperin
And was on offer this weekend in Islamabad. And they turned it down after 20 hours. And now it's on offer still. But I just don't think the blockade as it will play out is the break point. And you heard David Ignatius say, the people who are tempted to negotiate, who will sit with the Great Satan, they're facing pressure from the extremists at home. How you flip these people. Religious fanatics whose, Whose rise and d'. Etre is to destroy Israel and to build nuclear weapons to do it. I don't know how you flip.
- [26:49]
Kevin Sheridan
We have to flip them who also generally don't care about the welfare of their people.
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Mark Halperin
Right.
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Larry O'Connor
The question is, and what Ignatius left out of that is how big and influence influential are those hardliners. How many of them are left? How much do they influence what's going on?
- [27:08]
Mark Halperin
Enough. Enough. Run the government. As Kevin says, we're all hardliners now in Tehran. All right. The President in 2016 attacked the Pope in the run up to the South Carolina primary. And I was surrounded by people who said, that's it. Donald Trump's done this shows how stupid he is. The voters will punish him for attacking the Pope. And of course, he won the South Carolina primary in the nomination. He's attacking a different Pope.
- [27:30]
Larry O'Connor
Now.
- [27:30]
Mark Halperin
This Pope is a a Chicagoan who met with David Axelrod a few days ago. H and this morning, after the President attacked the Pope yesterday, the Pope hit right back. Here's the Pope talking to reporters, I guess on his plane maybe. Where is this quote?
- [27:50]
Kevin Sheridan
Yeah, it was on the plane.
- [27:51]
Mark Halperin
122. 122. Pope Leo says he does not fear Trump citing gospel as he pushes back in feud over Iran war. The President also put on social reposted on social media a picture of himself seeming to be Jesus. I'll just tell you, after more of a decade of this, I just don't think this matters. Maybe it should. And I know some people are offended. But if you're asking if this is going to affect the President's support or his standing or his capacity to get things done, I don't see it. Larry.
- [28:22]
Larry O'Connor
I'm a practicing Catholic. I don't like it when the President of the United States detects the Pope. I don't like it when the Pope was wades into political issues here in America. But it's not gonna have an effect one way or the other. And it is what it was confusing what the Pope said. It doesn't affect my position as a Catholic. It doesn't affect our beliefs in faith and morals. He didn't say it in his infallible role with the church. It was him weighing in on politics of the day. But it was confusing because much of what he said goes contrary to Thomas Aquinas just war theory. And it would carry more weight if he had said just as much against the Iranian regime when they killed thousands of people in the streets a couple of months ago. So it's frustrating. I love the Holy Father And I'll leave it at that.
- [29:10]
Mark Halperin
I think the president probably disagrees with you on that last point, Kevin. Is this going to make any difference?
- [29:16]
Kevin Sheridan
Also, as a practicing Catholic, that one studied for the Catholic priesthood. More to unpack at a show later down the road.
- [29:26]
Larry O'Connor
Buried the lead there, Walling. I didn't know that.
- [29:29]
Kevin Sheridan
Yeah, we can talk more about that. But I think one of the interesting factors with this is, of course, Francis and Trump were going to be at odds. Right. And you had Republican Catholics uniformly against Francis for a lot of different things. This Pope, this American Pope from Chicago has an 80% approval rating among American Catholics. I don't know what the percentage breakdown is, partisanship wise, but this is a different dynamic, I think, with just how popular Leo is and continues to be. And we'll see what happens going forward if. Yeah, and, and also, too, let's not forget the first lady's a Catholic. Marco Rubio is Catholic, to say nothing of J.D. vance with a new voice about his Caroline Levitt, at least Carolyn Levitt. So surrounded by Catholics. I, I forgot that Melania was a Catholic. Is Catholic. So we'll see if this feud continues and if it builds. I think part of this, too was response to the three leading American cardinals on 60 Minutes last night. I'm sure that was part of that factor in terms of the president's response.
- [30:30]
Mark Halperin
Little news.
- [30:30]
Larry O'Connor
We're allowed to disagree with the pope on things like this, though, particularly if he's an American.
- [30:34]
Kevin Sheridan
Not when he's sitting in the chair of St. Peter. He's infallible, just like when I'm in
- [30:38]
Larry O'Connor
this chair right here in everything that he says. Kevin, come on.
- [30:42]
Mark Halperin
You know that federal judge, since that
- [30:44]
Kevin Sheridan
eight changed in the late 1800s, a
- [30:46]
Mark Halperin
federal judge just threw out President Trump's suit against the Wall Street Journal for their publishing of his alleged birthday note to Jeffrey Epstein. I'm sure. Well, I'm not sure, but the president obviously can appeal. But the judge said the president didn't come close to suggesting that that was a legitimate case. Eric Swalwell no longer running for governor.
- [31:04]
Kevin Sheridan
Rupert is going to be springing for free lunch then for everything.
- [31:09]
Larry O'Connor
Was that the anti slapp decision or was that.
- [31:11]
Mark Halperin
No, that's the federal. Federal case.
- [31:13]
Larry O'Connor
Oh, okay.
- [31:15]
Mark Halperin
Eric Swalwell, no running longer running for governor of California after both the San Francisco Chronicle and CNN investigations into allegations of sexual assault and sexual impropriety. He's still a member of the House.
- [31:28]
Kevin Sheridan
Hopefully not for long.
- [31:30]
Larry O'Connor
Remember, in good standing.
- [31:31]
Mark Halperin
Absolutely. By the Fourth of July. By the Fourth of July. Well, Ex Wall will be A, have removed, been removed from the House by his colleagues, be resigned from the House or C, still a member of the House.
- [31:42]
Kevin Sheridan
KEVIN hopefully he'll be forced out. But that 2/3 majority, which is what you need to expel, is pretty high.
- [31:48]
Mark Halperin
What will happen? Not what should happen. What will happen.
- [31:51]
Kevin Sheridan
I think he does get expelled. And I think it's, you know, I think there's, there is growing momentum and there's spreadsheets now tracking these four in question. But if it's tied first to Gonzalez of Texas, the Republican doesn't change the calculus in terms of the vote margin in the House. And I could see that potentially happening.
- [32:08]
Mark Halperin
Right. So there are two Republican members and two Democratic members, one of whom is Swalwa, who are now subject of ethics investigations or ethics controversies. And there's talk on social media of removing them all. But as our, our learned colleagues at Punchbowl News point out, it would be quite a step to expel four members.
- [32:26]
Kevin Sheridan
Members generally doesn't happen.
- [32:28]
Mark Halperin
I mean, it does not happen.
- [32:29]
Kevin Sheridan
And generally, George Santos, that this happens all the time. But it really does.
- [32:33]
Mark Halperin
It really does. And it usually only happens after some investigation of their own. And that's not under, not completed for any of the four. Larry Will Swalwell still be a House member by July 4th?
- [32:43]
Larry O'Connor
I, I'm cynical enough to believe that, yes, he will. He will. Wow.
- [32:46]
Mark Halperin
I'll go with the third option. I think he's going to be forced to resign. I think he'll be, he'll be forced
- [32:51]
Larry O'Connor
to resign because his staff require him to have shame.
- [32:54]
Mark Halperin
It would, but his staff, well, his staff won't work for him now, as you know, sometimes elected officials, if they're under criminal investigation and he's now reportedly under criminal investigation, don't want to resign because they want to keep their seat as a bargaining chip. To agree to resign, to not face prosecution. The prosecutor here in New York I don't think is going to make that deal, but I think he'll find it impossible to continue in his job. And I think he will resign. That's my prediction on that. The California gubernatorial race. Now, Swawa was the front runner. The other two people who are polling well are Katie Porter and Tom Stier. Porter, a lot of people remain skeptical because of her own issues, own accusations against her. I believe that today on the current trajectory we are on, as I said before, Steyer will be the next governor of California. But here's a candidate, Matt Mahan, who is the mayor of San Jose, who most of you Couldn't pick out of a lineup. He was making the rounds at cable news this today and this weekend to try to inherit some of the support that's now including some of the big unions who were for Swalwell and now are looking for a candidate. He's more of a moderate. Here is Matt. Matt Mahan on Morning Joe.
- [34:09]
Matt Mahan
We have to prove that California's values work in practice. And I'm proud to say as mayor of San Jose, I've led us to reduce crime, become the safest big city in the country, solve 100% of homicides. To your point about retail theft, I was the first Democrat in the state to come out for Prop 36 and say there must be accountability for organized retail theft and you've got to be able to mandate treatment if someone's addiction is causing them to harm the broader community. We've reduced homelessness by one third in just the last four years. We've removed barriers to home building. We're growing again. People are building housing in San Jose. That's the kind of resistance we need. The best resistance to this MAGA movement that's divisive, reckless, tearing families apart is to demonstrate results, to get California back to being California being a land of opportunity and aspirational place. Only the Democratic Party can do that for this state. But we can't do it with more of the same politicians.
- [35:11]
Mark Halperin
That guy makes Gray Davis look like Beyonce.
- [35:17]
Larry O'Connor
Does that guy have a chancely named Gray Davis?
- [35:19]
Mark Halperin
Kevin, does that guy have a chance to be in and make the two person runoff?
- [35:24]
Kevin Sheridan
He does it like 1%. I've been bullish about the San Jose mayor for a long time. We talked about this when he entered that race.
- [35:31]
Matt Mahan
Yeah.
- [35:31]
Kevin Sheridan
The fact that Tom Steyer spent millions of hundreds of millions of dollars so far is stagnant. Katie Porter has issues with domestic violence and hurt recent past with an ex husband, to say nothing of that terrible TV interview that she gave. I think Democrats are going to take another look at Mayor Mahan, Matt Mahan, who's making the rounds. He's got a lot of money behind him in terms of business interests in the state and he's got that crossover appeal that I think he can make the case effectively because again, I think a lot of people are looking at who's going to be the white knight, the savior here and it could be the San Jose mayor. I'm very bullish on him.
- [36:09]
Mark Halperin
I want to agree with everything you said, but I'm skeptical. Larry.
- [36:13]
Larry O'Connor
I'm skeptical too. By the way, can anybody point out the fact that every single problem that he just detailed that he's solving did not come because of MAGA and because of Republicans. He said these are only Democrat solutions can fix these things. It was Democrat policies that caused all of those problems.
- [36:32]
Kevin Sheridan
The guy has a terrible relationship with, with Gavin Newsom because he's called out a lot of stuff that Newsom's been doing and think you're also good policy in San Jose.
- [36:40]
Mark Halperin
All right, I'm not going to ask.
- [36:41]
Larry O'Connor
I won't, I, I won't. But let me give you a name. Antonio Viragosa, former mayor of Los Angeles. He act. But look for, look at you shaking your head. He's pulling better than your, your Mr. Mayhar guy there, the mayor of San Jose. And he's got.
- [36:55]
Mark Halperin
I know he is.
- [36:55]
Larry O'Connor
Track record.
- [36:56]
Mark Halperin
I know he is. I know he is. Let me ask you this.
- [36:58]
Larry O'Connor
I'm not going to coalesce around someone other than Sty and Porter. He might do it.
- [37:02]
Mark Halperin
Maybe. I've, I, I've always thought he could, but he's been out there now. The debates haven't started yet, but it's going to be very hard for anyone to raise money, which is why I'm long on Steyer, because he didn't have to raise money. Just tell me in order. Most likely, second, most likely, third, most likely next governor. Just give me three names in order.
- [37:18]
Kevin Sheridan
Kevin Steyer, Mahan Porter.
- [37:22]
Mark Halperin
Larry, you guys go ahead.
- [37:25]
Larry O'Connor
Do you not look at what's going on in California?
- [37:27]
Mark Halperin
Go ahead, go ahead. Give us your three.
- [37:29]
Larry O'Connor
Hilton. Hilton, Bianco, Steyr.
- [37:33]
Kevin Sheridan
Larry, it's still a 70, 30 state.
- [37:35]
Larry O'Connor
Larry, just because you Democrats assassinated Eric Swalwell's future and knocked him out doesn't mean that all of his voters are going to coalesce around Porter or Styer.
- [37:45]
Mark Halperin
Larry, why are you chastising me?
- [37:47]
Larry O'Connor
The two front runners for months now have been Hilton and Bianca.
- [37:51]
Mark Halperin
Steve Hilton wins the governorship. I'll not only eat the mushy pork here, I'll eat the cardboard box and the wires.
- [37:58]
Larry O'Connor
What are you going to eat if Hilton and Bianco emerge from the jungle primary?
- [38:02]
Kevin Sheridan
Well, Trump, Trump.
- [38:03]
Mark Halperin
Now the Trump endorsed Hilton.
- [38:05]
Kevin Sheridan
I don't see it.
- [38:05]
Mark Halperin
I don't see it.
- [38:06]
Larry O'Connor
Oh, no, no, no, no, no, no. Just you guys. I know California politics pretty well. Yeah, just okay.
- [38:14]
Mark Halperin
Congress, as I said, has a million things to do. Ucla. Larry. To give us California for decades of the hundred things that are in Congress has played right now, which one is most interesting? You. And how will it come out?
- [38:30]
Larry O'Connor
Oh, the reconciliation and how will it come out?
- [38:33]
Mark Halperin
There'll be two bills.
- [38:35]
Larry O'Connor
No, no, one bill. That's zero. That's a pipe dream.
- [38:38]
Mark Halperin
How many? How many?
- [38:39]
Larry O'Connor
One.
- [38:39]
Mark Halperin
Just one. Okay.
- [38:41]
Larry O'Connor
One medium, beautiful bill.
- [38:42]
Mark Halperin
Yeah. Kevin, of all the things they're working on, what interests you the most and
- [38:46]
Kevin Sheridan
what's, how's it going to end reconciliation as well? And they're starting the process. It's a long process to do it and we'll see if the Senate is able to cobble together the 50 plus JD I think that's likely what's going to happen. Interesting. They can only lose three as part of that. Interesting.
- [39:03]
Larry O'Connor
What do you say, Mr. Halperin?
- [39:07]
Mark Halperin
The thing I'm most interested in is how they deal with the housing bill. And, and I think, I think the White House is going to butt heads together and get it done as that. How's that for something you care less about?
- [39:21]
Larry O'Connor
You think that's, that's, that's more intriguing than the reconciliation and the drama behind that?
- [39:26]
Mark Halperin
I think reconciliation is just going to all die. So I'm not interested. All right. Lastly, Al Sharpton did a bunch of TV and print interviews about the big event he held that ran into the weekend. We showed you some of it on Friday. Saturday they heard from a few more people. Cory Booker was very well received. Sharpton basically said everyone did a great job, but he was skeptical that Kamala Harris would run for president otherwise. He was pretty bullish. And everyone. He, he thought that Wesmore would run, even though Westmore has said he wouldn't. Kevin, who was the. If there's a winner of the Sharpton primary over the weekend, there's a winner out of that going forward. Who's the winner of it?
- [40:05]
Kevin Sheridan
Well, he really propped up Andy Bashir in conversations after the fact, which was interesting to see and compared, I think Reverend Al compared him almost to a Bill Clinton like figure, which was interesting to me because that's generally not the sheer's audience. I think the winner was Pete Buttigieg. Right. Who did. Pete's path now is to do no harm and to slowly build support among black Democrats. And I think he had an effective conversation, you know, where everyone, Al was praising him after, after the fact. And I think he was likely. He and Bashir, interesting enough at a confab like this for the two winners.
- [40:41]
Mark Halperin
Larry, who's the winner?
- [40:43]
Larry O'Connor
I will go based on who got the biggest, in my opinion response from the crowd there and got the most headlines. It's Kamala Harris, guys. It's Kamala Harris and the seven Dwarfs right now. The fact that she dangled it out there and kept the talk alive. And as I predicted, Friday talked about national security and foreign policy almost entirely. It's hers. If she wants it, she's got it. And I think she emerged as the bigger name.
- [41:07]
Kevin Sheridan
I think the actual winner was Mark Halpern, who was able to do this show live from the floor of that.
- [41:11]
Larry O'Connor
That was impressive.
- [41:13]
Mark Halperin
People are saying that she. I agree with you, Larry, agree with your choice and your analysis correctly. She, she emerges from that by. Treated by both the media and the activists like a step above everybody else. Now, Newsom didn't go. He had a family conflict, he said, but she really dominated the event. Biggest crowd. And it's just if she wants to run, she, she made her. They loved her. They love. All right, quick.
- [41:36]
Kevin Sheridan
I mean, that's her base. That's her base.
- [41:38]
Mark Halperin
Yeah, it is her base. It was home field for her. But Sharpton treated everybody very well. Everybody had an opportunity to speak, and I actually thought they all did pretty well under the circumstances. I thought they all had better stump speeches and things to say than I would have thought. But they didn't get treated the way she did.
- [41:54]
Larry O'Connor
Did you could. What is Mark Kelly doing? Did you see him? Is he actually make. Does he have traction in this?
- [42:03]
Kevin Sheridan
He's been at a lot of. He was at the DNC finance meeting.
- [42:07]
Mark Halperin
There's such a vacuum. There's such a vacuum for someone who the, the donor class, particularly the rich donor class, not the grassroots, who they want someone I think can win. They want somebody they. They can have over to their Park Avenue offices and sit in the conference room and say, yeah, that guy's really inspiring. That's like Obama. That's like Clinton and Kelly for some of the rich donors, punches that ticket. And, and we've talked about this before. If you think the party needs to nominate a white, male, straight Christian person, that's an astronaut. And astronaut, the pickings are slim. And if you add astronaut, they're just down to one. No, I mean, if you don't think. If you don't think the answer is Newsome or Bashir, and you think the party has to nominate that. That's why Kelly is being discussed, I think, as much as anything else.
- [42:53]
Larry O'Connor
Oh, you said Christian.
- [42:55]
Mark Halperin
Yeah, got to be Christian. Sorry, sorry. All right, sponsors. And then to your questions again, if you're here in the platform and you want to get in on the conversation, raise your hand. If you want to work outside this spring and you want to dress right for that, I recommend to you the clothes that come from true work.com truework.com comfortable no matter what the day brings It's T R U E w e r k.com Performance Workwear brand that designs technical durable apparel built for demanding job sites and outdoor conditions. It blends athletic style fabrics with job site functionality. Lots of pockets and everything. Mobilize prioritizes mobility, weather resistance and all day comfort you could be there's great stuff if you're a professional who works outdoors. But if you're just doing stuff around your yard or around work work sites on your own time, I recommend this to you. Four way stretch for bending, kneeling and climbing. It's all very comfortable and over 15,000 5 star reviews experience the difference that you get with their work pant. Stay comfortable no matter what the day brings. Get 15% off your first order. Go to truework.com promo code two way again t r u e W-E-R-K.com promo code two way built like it matters because it does. And one more sponsor back with us. Shopify free trial a dollar per month trial offer to start your own Shopify account. Go to shopify.com mark if you're starting something new, whether it's a podcast, a business, any idea you have and you need a presence, a digital presence, setting that up can be intimidating and time consuming while you're trying to get the business actually up and off the ground. If you're asking yourself, well what if it doesn't work? What if nobody shows up? You can get people to show up. Take the leap on one of the best decisions you can make here to build your business. That's where Shopify comes in. Commerce platform behind millions of businesses all around the world. 10% of all E commerce, believe it or not, is conducted through Shopify here in the US household brands entrepreneurs just getting started. Go to shopify.com right now. Turn loose. There you go. Let's try it again. It's time to turn those wh ifs into There you go Dollars with Shopify again shopify.com mark shopify.com mark for everything you need and 24 hour customer service. You can reach them by email or any other way you can reach them if you need help. Again, a dollar per month trial offer to start your own Shopify account. Shopify.com, thank you for your attention to this matter.
- [45:32]
Kevin Sheridan
A lot of our friends in the chat were asking about that sound effect and I'm glad we came through for them.
- [45:36]
Larry O'Connor
Yeah, you want your ad to be
- [45:38]
Mark Halperin
a big Part of it. Kelly, welcome in. Thank you for being part of Two Way. Tell everybody where you are, what's on your mind for Larry and for Kevin.
- [45:45]
Kelly from South Carolina
Hey, Kelly, Good morning so much. Hi. Good morning. I am in South Carolina. I am in rural South Carolina. Yeah. And I'll tell you what people think about the Iran conflict in rural South Carolina. They only think about the billboard that shows them the gas price. I care and I know they're. Yeah, I know everyone that's probably on this platform is caring about the intricacies. They're caring about the nuclear material. But if you go and you pull in beside the next car, the only thing they care about is that number coming down. And I think that is where our administration is actually feeling the extra crunch is getting this finished fast because everyone in America is turning against the whole situation politically because of gas prices. And so to buy yourself more time to do this as strategically as. As carefully as one must, I don't know, and I feel like somebody's going to tell me, you can't. But what if we got creative? How can we lower domestic gas prices? Is there not a way to temporarily capture a higher export value to offset domestic prices and say, oh, we don't. And you say, you say one, you say, this is America first, which it is. Which people voted for. Two, you tell the world, we don't want this. We want everyone in the world to get to have fair gas prices. We want everyone in the world to have access to oil. Do you too? We also don't want our nation to be blown up by nuclear weapons or anyone else's. And they're saying, death to America. They're saying death to anyone that doesn't like them. So how about we all, the entire world, get this straight open and get these people out of here and when the next extremist pops up, kill him, too. We took out how many people. If you can handle the gas prices, if you can temporarily create a higher export value, then I think you buy yourself time and you can say, guess what, NATO, guess what, even China. What if we all saw this together and we all have a fair oil price?
- [47:50]
Mark Halperin
All right, Kelly, thank you for that. You speak for tens of millions. The dow is down 360. Brent crude is just above 100 right now. Kevin, thoughts on Kelly's both specifics and her general position?
- [48:02]
Kevin Sheridan
Well, I think if Air Force Two goes back to Islamabad or somewhere else, they need to take you, Kelly, to do a lot of the messaging to back to the American people. And I think what, you know, you touched on what the president was trying to say in his interview with Maria Bartiromo about, you know, China should just start buying American oil exports if they're feeling the crunch from Iran. It's a world commodity oil. So again, the frustrations during the Biden administration that I had trying to convince Americans one way or the other, a lot of things are out of the control of the president in terms of fixing the price of oil, setting the price of oil. We can do some things with the strategic reserve, we can obviously do some things in terms of pressure points with our allies and adversaries, but it's really the markets that decide the cost of what Brent crude is in terms of the larger scale and what, you know, what the the amount of gasoline costs. Matt Mayhan, for example, just talked about this on Morning Joe. I watched him talked about suspending the gas tax in California. So the fact that, you know, Californians are paying seven, eight, nine dollars a gallon because of what the state puts on that, on top of the the cost, I think could also be a winning argument for his race and for Democrats going forward, too.
- [49:22]
Mark Halperin
Larry?
- [49:22]
Larry O'Connor
Yeah, Kevin. Kevin's not wrong about any of that. But I would also say, Kelly, you know, South Carolina right now has, I think, about a 30 cent per gallon state tax on gas. That could make a difference. California is much more expensive, not just because of taxes. I think they're around 70 cents or 65 cents a gallon. But it's also because the environmentalist policies in that state have driven refineries out of the state. And so much of that gas has to be trucked into, in and brought in from other places. That adds to the cost. And it's another reason why California is so expensive. But that's a bit but we need to look at perspective here, if you don't mind. And I, I don't mean to downplay the cost of the price of gas or the price of oil, but I think where are we right now? About $109 a barrel.
- [50:04]
Kevin Sheridan
I think it went up $8 last night. I think, I think we're just over 100.
- [50:08]
Mark Halperin
Yeah, it's about $7 or $8 up. Kelly, thank you. Great show.
- [50:11]
Larry O'Connor
You know, in, in 2022, it was one hundred and thirty and we were not waging, you know, a military strike against Iran. We weren't engaged with anything in 2022. They blamed it on Russia and Putin and Ukraine. But we're a long way from where we were during Biden's time. And you would think we would be worse off right now. Right. So that is putting it in perspective, I think.
- [50:38]
Mark Halperin
Sandy, welcome and tell folks who don't know where you are what's on your mind for Larry and for Kevin and thank you for being here.
- [50:45]
Sandy from Birmingham
Birmingham, Alabama. Just wanted to comment on 60 Minutes last night and the bishops, excuse me, the cardinals, I guess the archbishop was on there last night. I was astounded at what they said. Of course, it's not the first time that leaders of faith have gotten involved in politics, but considering that, you know, where we are right now, for them to jump into this debate, it to me is a little short sighted that they're going to offend a lot of their parishioners. I think they, there were some great stats that how many conservatives voted, how many Catholics voted for Trump? I think it was 55 in the last election.
- [51:18]
Kevin Sheridan
And, and Nora O' Donnell brought that up in the interview.
- [51:21]
Sandy from Birmingham
That's right. And she was great point. And, and, and, and they also made the point that he said that he was going to deport people and they, you know, were very critical of ICE and, and I just don't understand why they decide to weigh in on this particular battle at this particular time. There are two sides to this coin. I think the war is just, I don't think it's a war of choice because I think that we, we don't have a choice considering what we face with Iran in the future. And you can have a different point of view, but my goodness, why go on national television and pick a fight with the president, who loves to pick fights with, with people on authority? It's a little bit like, I don't know, going to a rock show and, and listening to the politics of Eddie Vedder or someone like that. I just don't want to hear it from the, from the pulpit. I don't want to hear it from the stage. They have moral authority, but I wish
- [52:07]
Mark Halperin
they wouldn't weigh in.
- [52:07]
Sandy from Birmingham
So that's my comment.
- [52:09]
Mark Halperin
Thank you. Sandy. You speak for tens of millions, I'm pretty sure. Larry.
- [52:13]
Larry O'Connor
I don't disagree with you, Sandy.
- [52:14]
Matt Mahan
I did.
- [52:14]
Larry O'Connor
When I was watching it, it sort of looked, I, I felt sad about it and it looked like sort of the last vestige of a certain generation of priests and bishops and in this case, cardinals, who frankly aren't part of the larger movement in the American Catholic Church right now that has seen record numbers of new converts over the last couple of years. That's what's ironic about it. And if you, if you are a Catholic and you're looking at what's going on with the American church. You're seeing a real divide between those guys and, and the type of politics they represented coming out of the Second Vatican Council in the 60s versus the new breed of priests who are being ordained right now. It's a real story if you're all plugged into it here. And it's sort of their last attempt to be relevant, sadly, and I hate to say that with all respect.
- [53:01]
Kevin Sheridan
Kevin. Yeah, Larry brings up an important point. I think a lot of this generation of cardinals, and These are the three active cardinals right now in terms of D.C. chicago and Newark, New Jersey, our social justice, kind of raised in that post Vatican II mentality. But you also saw bishops and cardinals speak out against the wars in Iraq in the past. You've always seen some bishops really, you know, take on political issues, whether it be issues of communion and abortion and, and what have you. So I think it's important that they have this platform. They're also three of the closest aligned, you know, princes the church when it comes to Leo's mentality, too. And I'm sure there was some level of communication or conversation with Christophe Pierre, the apostolic nuncio, who's a representative, Leo very close to him as well. It's the first time we've had in a long time the cardinal, a cardinal archbishop, represent the Vatican in Washington. I'm sure there was some coordination of the messaging and this was likely done with Leo's blessing in terms of getting that message out. And we'll see how that resonates, I think specifically with conservative Catholics. To your, to your point, Sandy and
- [54:13]
Larry O'Connor
Kevin, again, it just, it burns us politically aligned conservatives who were Catholic that just want to make it clear because there's a difference between being a conservative Catholic and being a political conservative who is a Catholic. It is so maddening to see that these three decided to do this when they did. Why didn't they do this 60 Minutes interview when Joe Biden was distorting the church's teaching on abortion, when Nancy Pelosi was claiming that Aquinas was pro abortion? Now, Maybe that's because 60 Minutes didn't invite them and I don't know, but it is maddening, right?
- [54:47]
Kevin Sheridan
This is, this is a hot topic right now. But I do think you saw the cardinals agree to strong borders and things like that. That wasn't. They're trying to thread this needle in terms of just war, Augustine theory and then also immigration and border.
- [55:01]
Mark Halperin
I care just as much about what Ozzie Smith says. If you're talking cardinals Mike. Well, welcome in, Mike. Thank you for being here. Tell folks who don't know where you are what's on your mind for Kevin
- [55:12]
Mike from St. Louis
and for Larry, coming from St. Louis, home of the Cardinals.
- [55:15]
Kevin Sheridan
So there you go right there. We plan this. We planned this.
- [55:20]
Mike from St. Louis
Okay, so Kelly brought solutions. I'm going to continue and I'm going to bring my solution for the an approach to the straight. So somebody's got to tell me why this is either naive or stupid so I can quit thinking about it. We give Iran a list of 50 economic energy targets. For every ship that Iran targets with a missile, a drone or a paper airplane, we select one of those targets and we take it out. Targeting is enough. The ship doesn't have to be hit. We punish the intention. At the same time, we use Israel's ability to use Iranian airways to tell their people, if you have family working at these sites, they should not go to work. It isn't safe. The hope would be to disrupt operations at some of those sites without firing a shot. Once they do it, we have to follow through. We've got to be willing to go and actually take out one of those sites. And again, we tell their population it's coming, but not which one, and hopefully disrupt operations at multiple sites at one time because their staff is afraid to show up.
- [56:43]
Mark Halperin
Kevin, thoughts, Mike?
- [56:45]
Kevin Sheridan
It's a good idea. I think you give the Iranian regime a little bit too much credit that they would suggest that folks stay home and not engage. This is the same regime that's lining up children and women on bridges.
- [56:59]
Mike from St. Louis
I'm not saying the regime says don't
- [57:02]
Kevin Sheridan
go to work, but the people themselves.
- [57:04]
Mike from St. Louis
But the people themselves and we and every family member saying, dad, you can't go to work today. Did you see this list?
- [57:11]
Kevin Sheridan
You're on the list, Mike. It's some great ideas, but part of the problem is getting the word out to the Iranians themselves, right? So there is no really way that we can communicate directly because everything is state controlled. There is no Internet access. So it's difficult to Israel potentially, but it's difficult to telegraph that to the average Iranian right now because we would be doing that more effectively and telling them to take on their regime. But, but it's really difficult to telegraph anything in that country reaching the average Iranian. But it's, it's good ideas, Larry.
- [57:48]
Larry O'Connor
Yeah, I wouldn't be surprised, Mike, if as things progress and there isn't more movement, then that might be the sort of thing the President has voiced over and over again that he's very reluctant to do that, partly because he doesn't want to go after innocent people and harm innocent people's quality of life by going after those assets, number one. But also he's very intense and I think very hopeful that something's going to emerge here as a functioning cooperative government in Iran so that they can rejoin the, the world community, such as it is. And so he doesn't want to destroy their, their civilian infrastructure. But if it, if it has to be done, the President has said that it will be done. The question of whether it's done in a systematic, you know, sort of list sort of way, that kind of thing, I mean, it's an interesting concept, really,
- [58:32]
Mike from St. Louis
is just one more thing. I think, I think we need, I'm going to channel my inner Noah Rothman here. I think we need to reconnect the deterrence to the action. And the point would be that we're not choosing and taking to take out these targets. The Iranians are choosing to fire on a ship. And this is our response. This is, this is our deterrence. And if you reestablish that connection, then I think long term there are benefits for everyone.
- [59:06]
Mark Halperin
Very elegant idea, Mike. Thank you. Grateful to you.
- [59:09]
Larry O'Connor
And you're much better looking than Noah Rothman.
- [59:12]
Mark Halperin
I'm going to head over to SiriusXM to roll the second hour of the morning meeting. With the Dow down Now just over 300 points and Brent crude up 6,7 bucks now to over 100. Gentlemen, thank you for being here. We'll see you throughout the week. Grateful to you and I'll see everybody also. Larry will tell you in a moment.
- [59:29]
Larry O'Connor
Thanks.
- [59:30]
Mark Halperin
Tonight at 5. Have a great day.
- [59:31]
Larry O'Connor
Excited to have mushu pork with you. It's going to be great.
- [59:35]
Mark Halperin
Delicious.
- [59:35]
Kevin Sheridan
Not the cardboard, though. Not the cardboard, thanks.
- [59:38]
Larry O'Connor
That would be rough. That would be rough. And the wires.
- [59:42]
Kevin Sheridan
Yeah.
- [59:42]
Larry O'Connor
Is it that? Why am I so outside the box by saying that the two guys who have been leading the polls consistently for six months have the best chance to
- [59:50]
Kevin Sheridan
be governor again because it's just California, you know, And I do think Steve Hilton is going to make, you know, one of the two spots because of the frustration. But, but Democrats will come home in November.
- [60:03]
Larry O'Connor
To whom?
- [60:05]
Kevin Sheridan
To whoever the Democrat is, hopefully Matt Mayhem, who is good crossover appeal.
- [60:10]
Larry O'Connor
So wait, so wait, hold on. I just want to be clear here. Not to beat a dead horse, but now the dad is gone, so it's more reasonable and gives, you know, wiser, political.
- [60:20]
Kevin Sheridan
I'm sorry, we're at.
- [60:21]
Larry O'Connor
The guy currently pulling at 1% has a better chance of being governor.
- [60:26]
Kevin Sheridan
1 and 4. 1 and 4.
- [60:28]
Larry O'Connor
All right.
- [60:29]
Kevin Sheridan
You know, enough said. It's going to be a little, little April miracle.
- [60:32]
Larry O'Connor
What a great Monday.
- [60:33]
Kevin Sheridan
Little Cinderella story. Cinderella story at a second story.
- [60:36]
Larry O'Connor
Well, and he's exciting. He is. Let's do the promos. What have we got ahead of us, sir?
- [60:43]
Kevin Sheridan
We got Citizen McCain live at noon today. Of course, Megan is back in action.
- [60:49]
Larry O'Connor
That's right.
- [60:49]
Kevin Sheridan
Megan is going to bring in Katie Pavlich and favorite, a good friend of both of ours, two of my faves.
- [60:56]
Larry O'Connor
Absolutely.
- [60:56]
Kevin Sheridan
News Nation. So that's going to be a great conversation Today, Monday the 13th at noon,
- [61:01]
Larry O'Connor
Katie Pavlich, former editor of Town hall, succeeded by.
- [61:05]
Kevin Sheridan
Yeah. The great sky people. People are saying, love Katie.
- [61:11]
Larry O'Connor
Katie's the best. All right, that's Citizen McCain at noon two way tonight, live at 5pm with Kevin Sheridan, Republican strategist. You know Kevin, don't you?
- [61:20]
Kevin Sheridan
Yeah. That'll be great conversation, too, at 5pm And I'm sure the whole world is going to change in the next seven hours, too. So a lot of reporting. Obviously, Mark will cover in that. And then we've got lifelong.
- [61:31]
Larry O'Connor
The fallout and repercussions of the blockade will definitely be item number one, which
- [61:35]
Kevin Sheridan
is now in effect for the last minute. And of course, we got Lifelong. And then at 7:00pm, 7:00pm yeah.
- [61:41]
Larry O'Connor
Oh, there you go with even. I always want to call his name Slurpee. I don't know why. Yeah, my brain sees that name supply. And I want to say Slurpee. He's going to have Johnny Murasan, a marathoner. There you go. What does that.
- [61:57]
Kevin Sheridan
What do you mean?
- [61:57]
Larry O'Connor
What does that mean? Marathoner. That's his title. That's what he does professionally. He's a professional marathoner, I guess.
- [62:04]
Kevin Sheridan
That's not. That's not my title.
- [62:06]
Larry O'Connor
So you know that he does not have the classic runner's body. I'm just going to say he doesn't.
- [62:10]
Mark Halperin
Mm.
- [62:12]
Larry O'Connor
Looks a little more like a alignment. Although I ran a marathon last year, so. Oh, sorry. Yes. And then.
- [62:19]
Kevin Sheridan
And then the morning meeting is back live tomorrow at 9am Please, we won't be there because of course it'll be Hogan and Jaime. But please, community, try and turn out and support them. I know it's not this dynamic duo, but two very good guys.
- [62:33]
Larry O'Connor
And these two knuckleheads will be back Wednesday, I believe. Are you back Wednesday? I'm back Wednesday.
- [62:37]
Kevin Sheridan
Yep. Yep. And then of course, join Mark right now over on Sirius. And then you got the official after show with Professor Kenny, the chat is open now for that. And that, of course, kicks off at 11am Eastern and then noon, hopefully. Larry Noon.
- [62:53]
Larry O'Connor
You want it my show? That's right.
- [62:54]
Kevin Sheridan
Yeah.
- [62:55]
Larry O'Connor
I'm live at noon on all video platforms. Look for Larry o' Connor Live marathoner marathon. And I'm hoping that yeah. LARRY o', connor, Marathoner There's a, that's a see the red frame there? Those are pictures of me running the marathon right right behind me. And I hope in Professor Kenny's after show they continue the debate over the California governor's race now that Eric Swalwell is well, by the way, Kevin, just real fast, he has suspended his campaign. He's, he hasn't ended.
- [63:24]
Kevin Sheridan
They love he could come out. Yeah. Drop out for family reasons.
- [63:27]
Larry O'Connor
Kevin.
- [63:28]
Kevin Sheridan
Suspend all that kind of stuff.
- [63:29]
Larry O'Connor
What is your of of all of the Democrats who over the weekend, from Adam Schiff and Nancy Pelosi to Mark Warner to every everybody in between who claimed outrage and shock and said that this is beyond the pale, Eric Swalwell must step down from the governor's race. What percentage of them knew full well that this kind of thing was going on?
- [63:47]
Kevin Sheridan
I mean, we all knew that he was like, again, Kevin McCarthy was on the Sunday shows talking about he kept young interns away from Eric Swalwell and Matt Gates. So I think this was I, I mean, I spent a good amount.
- [63:59]
Larry O'Connor
Yeah.
- [63:59]
Kevin Sheridan
Open secret.
- [64:00]
Larry O'Connor
Open secret.
- [64:01]
Kevin Sheridan
So, yeah, I don't know if they I don't think they all knew that he is credibly accused of sexual assault. That's a whole different.
- [64:07]
Larry O'Connor
Yeah, we didn't know the detail then,
- [64:09]
Kevin Sheridan
then, you know, flirting and stuff like that. But this is get him.
- [64:13]
Larry O'Connor
Get in the say you I wish Republicans were as ruthless as you guys are when you, when you isolate somebody and it's time to take them out, you guys do not mess around. Seriously. Sort of impressive and terrifying. Thank you, Kevin, my friend. We'll see you on Wednesday.
- [64:29]
Kevin Sheridan
Yep, we'll see you on Wednesday. Thanks, everybody.