Jimmy Kimmel "Won't Apologize," May Never Be on ABC Again; Kamala Harris' Book "Angering Everybody"

Summary

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2WAY Morning Meeting: Jimmy Kimmel "Won't Apologize," May Never Be on ABC Again; Kamala Harris' Book "Angering Everybody"

Date: September 19, 2025
Hosts: Mark Halperin, Sean Spicer, Dan Turrentine
Podcast: 2WAY Morning Meeting

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Episode Overview

This episode of the 2WAY Morning Meeting digs deep into two headline-grabbing stories: the fallout surrounding Jimmy Kimmel's controversial remarks and uncertain future at ABC, and the divisive rollout of Vice President Kamala Harris' new book. The regular panel—Mark Halperin, Sean Spicer, and Dan Turrentine—unpack the implications for media, politics, and public discourse. The show also includes the "Winners and Losers of the Week" segment, polling analysis, listener questions, and pointed exchanges on free speech, political hypocrisy, and the future of the Democratic Party.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Jimmy Kimmel Controversy (05:58 – 16:27)

• Kimmel's Absence & ABC's Dilemma

  • Mark Halperin frames the Kimmel saga as a complex clash between corporate interests, political pressure, and free speech, elaborating on protests outside Disney offices and questioning their authenticity.
    • "What kind of people are organically making signs and showing up outside Disney?" (06:03)
  • Sean Spicer and Dan Turrentine doubt Kimmel will return, citing his refusal to apologize and network risk aversion.
    • Dan Turrentine: "He was going to double down. They'll never allow that... You cannot allow a guy who's gonna double down go on and ruin your business." (10:16)
    • Dan highlights the irony that Kimmel once replaced Bill Maher after Maher's controversial exit, suggesting a cycle of political correctness and shifting standards.

• Free Speech, Cancel Culture, and Hypocrisy

  • The hosts spar over whether defenders of Kimmel are genuine about First Amendment values, with pointed reminders of past partisan double standards.
    • Mark Halperin: "This is an extraordinary abuse of power. Extraordinary abuse of power. And it should be denounced as such." (12:59)
    • The role of the FCC and potential quid pro quo with affiliates comes up as a dangerous precedent for political intervention in media deals.

• Debate on Punishment for Speech

  • Discussion intensifies over whether public figures should lose jobs over their words and where to draw the line between offensive speech and protected expression.
    • Sean Spicer: "If evening entertainers that don't tell the truth on political commentary is the standard for being fired, there will be no host on almost every cable network." (34:37)
    • The wider concern is government versus private action, with all agreeing that government coercion of speech is a red line.

2. Kamala Harris' Book Rollout & Fallout (18:01 – 24:50)

• Political Backstabbing & 2028 Positioning

  • The panel is bewildered by Harris’s strategy, noting the book has angered almost every Democratic faction and "positioned her for 2028 by making more enemies than friends."
    • Sean Spicer: "You would write a book like this to set yourself up for your next step... Even people I know who really like Kamala Harris and are sympathetic, basically, are cringing at this, and they're like, she looks weak. She looks whiny." (21:22)

• Buttigieg's Reaction & Loyalty Dynamic

  • Buttigieg’s response to Harris suggesting America wasn’t ready for a "black woman and a gay man" ticket is played and dissected:
    • Pete Buttigieg (clip): "I just believe in giving Americans more credit than that. My experience in politics has been that the way that you earn trust with voters is... on what they think you're going to do for their lives, not on categories." (20:15)
  • The panel notes the irony of Harris alienating an ally and suggest her only remaining friend is her husband, Doug Emhoff.

• Book Sales Speculation

  • Debate over how high Harris’s book will land on bestseller lists, raising questions about DNC bulk buys and the NYT's ranking methodologies.
    • Halperin, Spicer, Turrentine: General consensus: may hit #1 due to timing and strategy, but with low real sales.

3. Polls, 2028 Democratic Field & AOC’s Ascension (16:32 – 28:54)

• Biden Approval Deep Dive

  • The latest Washington Post poll is cited: Biden underwater across the board—tariffs (64% disapprove), Russia/Ukraine (60%), economy (59%), etc.
    • Mark Halperin: "He is, as the professional pollsters would say, underwater on everyone." (16:34)
    • Sean and Dan agree these numbers imperil the Democrats' chances to retain the House.

• Speculation: AOC as a 2028 Contender

  • AOC rumored to be eyeing a presidential run; the panel debates her credentials and broad-popularity appeal.
    • Halperin: "Name one idea she has that's broadly popular as a policy idea. Go." (26:40)
    • Spicer points out her base strength and grassroots energy but Halperin counters with lack of mainstream policy appeal.

4. Winners & Losers of the Week (28:54 – 34:50)

• Winners

  • Dan Turrentine: "Charlie Kirk’s legacy"—citing Kirk’s posthumous influence and the faith revival among many Americans. (29:33)
  • Sean Spicer: Faith as a winner, linked to Kirk's example.
  • Mark Halperin: Satirical "the American people... because finally... we now have a consensus savior," referencing a satirical article promoting Dan Turrentine as a future candidate. (29:44)

• Losers

  • Spicer: "Biden-Harris '25"—citing missteps by both the President and Vice President, and the overall perception of weak leadership. (32:10)
  • Halperin: "Those who hate hypocrisy"—pointing to both sides' inconsistencies on free speech and cancellation. (32:59)
  • Dan Turrentine: Schumer for misplaying the government shutdown standoff.

5. Listener Questions & Thoughtful Reflections (36:02 – 59:09)

• Empathy, Unity, Political Tone

  • Caller from Verde Valley shares a personal story connecting generational grief (John Lennon's death) with the current moment after Charlie Kirk's assassination. Calls for more empathy and "love your enemies." (38:55)
  • Hosts commend the MAGA community's peaceful mourning and contrast it to speculated potential reactions from the left.

• Crime, Social Order, & Political Response

  • Caller from Amelia Island: Argues left-wing policies have led to a "broken window society," making more extreme events (like assassination) easier to imagine.
    • Dan Turrentine: "It's okay if you steal, it's okay if you vandalize, it's okay if you do the following things, you won't be prosecuted... The idea that we have a problem when one side, I'm sorry, doesn't think that it's a problem to vandalize, to commit violence if it's in pursuit of what they believe is the greater good. And that is an issue that we have to reconcile with." (46:05)

• Honest Reflection on Reactions to Tragedy

  • Sean Spicer: Admits he wouldn’t be surprised if left-leaning activists rioted in the event of a comparable loss on their side, referencing historical reactions. (48:06–48:56)
  • Mark Halperin: "It's notable Dan said it and it'll probably go viral on Twitter." (49:11)

• Cross-Aisle Tributes at Memorials

  • Martha from Michigan: Asks who from the left could speak at Charlie Kirk’s memorial; suggestions include Kirsten Sinema, Josh Shapiro, and a joint appearance by Mark Kelly and Gabby Giffords.

6. Broader Media & Political Analysis

• Hypocrisy Fatigue & the Need for New Culture
  • Dr. John: Expresses exhaustion over partisan hypocrisy and calls for a less tribal and more principle-centered political culture.
    • Mark Halperin: "No, all beautiful, Sean. And then Dan." (57:01)
    • Dan Turrentine: Reminds the audience everyone processes grief differently, but calls for "inflection about the language we use and how we talk about other human beings and the value of life." (58:51–58:52)

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Notable Quotes & Moments

• Dan Turrentine (on cancel culture):
  "Before you start defending the First Amendment, at least admit that what Jimmy Kimmel said was wrong." (10:48)

• Mark Halperin:
  "This is an extraordinary abuse of power... and it should be denounced as such." (12:59)

• Pete Buttigieg (clip):
  "My experience in politics has been that the way that you earn trust with voters is based mostly on what they think you're going to do for their lives, not on categories." (20:15)

• Caller from Verde Valley:
  "Love your enemies, love your enemies, love your enemies. Pray for them, pray for them. And I think as Christians, we could do better at that." (39:50)

• Dan Turrentine (on Democratic challenges): "If I were her, the last thing I'd be doing is throwing Pete Buttigieg under the bus because he's the kind of guy you want on your team. Secondly, I got to tell you, the only person she hasn't screwed over is Dougie. And I'm wondering if he's next." (22:33)

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Key Timestamps

• Jimmy Kimmel segment start: 05:58
• First Amendment, FCC discussion heats up: 12:13
• Biden and polling segment: 16:32
• Kamala Harris book discussion: 18:01
• Pete Buttigieg responds to Harris: 19:57
• AOC 2028 speculation: 25:15
• Winners & losers of the week: 28:54
• Listener questions and reflections: 36:02
• Empathy, unity discussion: 38:55
• Broken window society/left policies: 43:02
• Left vs. right response to tragedy: 47:55
• Memorial speakers cross-aisle question: 50:43
• Dr. John on hypocrisy: 53:56

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Episode Tone and Style

Lively, candid, and occasionally contentious, this episode oscillates between sharp political analysis, frank admissions of hypocrisy, and rare moments of empathy across the aisle. The hosts don’t shy away from staking strong positions, holding both their own camps and the opposition to account. Audience interaction adds grit and emotional weight, keeping the conversation grounded.

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Conclusion

A fast-paced and wide-ranging episode, the 2WAY team draws sharp lines around speech, power, and political integrity—frequently challenging their own biases and those of the audience. Expect tough love for both parties, a search for principle amid political theater, and real-time responses to listener insights on the mood of a divided America.

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Transcript

[Mark Halpern]

Foreign. Good morning everyone here. If you're here in the east, it's the morning. Thank you for joining the morning meeting. Last episode of the week. Dan, why dress thusly?

[Sean Spicer]

I am appearing with a former or with a colleague on her new show later taping later today here this morning.

[Mark Halpern]

So, okay, so you're all dressed as Brian DePalmas would say, dressed to kill. And Sean and I of course are wearing merchandise from our sponsors at Fairway and Green. Sean wearing the quarter zip.

[Sean Spicer]

And I multiple.

[Mark Halpern]

Yeah. Many of you have already purchased products. We recommend it to you. Go to two way.com two way tv fairway, use the promo code two way20. Get 20% off everything on the site and lots of great products again, ladies sizes coming next week as well as your ability to get some of our catchphrases like peace, love and understanding embroidered on the sleeve. Lots of options. Morning meeting stuff. Two way stuff. Thank you for your attention. To that matter.

[Anthony Scaramucci]

Hi, I'm Anthony Scaramucci and I'd like to tell you about my new show, Lost Boys. It's a limited edition series. It's hosted by myself and Professor Scott Galloway. We're having honest conversations about a topic no one wants to talk about. The crisis that young men are facing nowadays. Our talks discuss why so many young men are struggling to find purpose, connection and identity in today's world. We dig into what's really going on, politics, culture, loneliness, even rage. And what we can do to help change the narrative. This is a six part series that will challenge your assumptions and encourage you to continue the conversation from the dinner table to the office. Follow and listen to Lost Boys on YouTube, Apple Podcasts, Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts. You can also go to Lostboys Men and sign up to get the latest episodes and news.

[Mark Halpern]

Big show today, as they say in the television business, but I mean it. We have a lot of topics to get through. Jimmy Kimmel, the Charlie Kirk Service this weekend, the President, United States using his powers, the Kamala Harris Book, AOC 28. The list goes on. And of course, since it's Friday, one of our branded segments. I've never understood why people think branded segments sell, but some people seem to like them. Are winners and losers of the week and what to look for this weekend. And my winner of the week will astound you. How's that? For what they call in the business of dts, I've got a great winner of the week. I thank you for being here. If you'd like to be part of the conversation here in the two way format that we use, not one way but two way. Please raise your hand if you're here on the platform. If you're on X or YouTube, don't raise your hand. No smack in the chat. Extend as much peace and love and understanding as you possibly can to all those around you virtually and physically. And extend the presumption of grace to all. Some of the topics we talk about today, I predict, because I know my co hosts could get a little heated. Everybody, now more than ever, let's see if we can't. That's why I got the quarters in a spirited way. Now I will tell you, I've applied for some government license for the show because I want the head of the FCC to try to cancel us or get me fired. I want that. I want that clash. I want to take it on directly.

[Sean Spicer]

No press is bad press. Ok?

[Mark Halpern]

Exactly. Exactly. Somebody just asked me about being sued and I said they're starting a new thing. And I said nothing better for you than to get sued. You get some lawyer friend of yours to handle the case and the publicity will be extraordinary. I call my newsletter, for instance, Wide World of News. I've been trying to get ABC to sue me for the entire duration of the thing. I just, just sue me.

[Dan Turntide]

But they will not opt out of this. Suing, getting.

[Sean Spicer]

Exactly.

[Dan Turntide]

I have plenty of. I've had too much time with lawyers.

[Mark Halpern]

Okay. Anyway, we'll get to you guys before too long. We're going to speed through a bunch of topics and. And at this hour, in theory, the President United States is on with Mr. Xi, Premier Xi of the ChiComs. And perhaps news of that will break during the show. So standby for all of that. But first, a word from one of our sponsors. CB Distillery. Nights when you can't sleep, sometimes tossing and turning with no available option. That's where CBD from CB Distillery can make a real difference. It's not just for sleep. They've got solutions that work for exercise, post exercise. Pain even for some people. Stress, mood, et cetera. All of it made with clean ingredients, no fillers, just premium CBD. 2 million people trust their products. You should give it a try if you're ready for better sleep, less stress, feeling good in your own skin. Try the products CBD products from CBD Distillery. Right now you can save an astounding 25% off the entire purchase you make. Visit CB Distillery and use the promo code. What would you guess the promo code, Dan? I'll give you three choices. My name Mark Evan Halpern. Is it Mark, Evan or Halpern? What's the promo, Mark? Mark, Use the promo code [e-mail] promo code mark cbdistillery.com 25% off. Give it a try today. All right. Jimmy Kimmel, still not on the air, but still not fired. Bob Iger, one of the greatest executives in American history. I would say he's in the top 25 executives and CEOs in American history, is being cross pressured like crazy. And whether you think he's doing this out of his sense of justice or he's seen the light and he doesn't think his late night shows should be liberal or affiliate pressure or worries about Donald Trump coming after him, whatever you think his motivation is, he's being cross pressured. There were protests outside Disney offices both in New York and la. I don't know if Dan Shawn, if you saw the video, just to start off, are those organic protests? Are people organically? Really? Who's organically making signs and showing up outside Disney? What kind of people doing that? I'm skeptic.

[Sean Spicer]

People protest all this time.

[Dan Turntide]

Who sits outside a Tesla dealership on a beautiful Saturday?

[Mark Halpern]

Well, I think those are gendup of the Tesla protest. I mean, people are so passionate about the First Amendment that they get on some sort of text chain and say, let's make signs and go stand outside Disney. I'm skeptical. I don't know who's doing it, but I'm skeptical.

[Dan Turntide]

Well, you're probably right. George Soros has got a lot of money.

[Sean Spicer]

I mean, the unions could be like the, the maybe. Maybe.

[Mark Halpern]

It could be. It could be.

[Dan Turntide]

Pause just for a second and hit the Daybook just because I. Oh yeah, I know.

[Mark Halpern]

Lately I'm so excited about everything we're talking about. I forgot to do the daybook as usual. Thank you for multiple, multiple people reminded me, including Sean. Thank you for that. All right, the Daybook. As I said, the President in theory is on the phone right now with she, but probably on webex or Zoom or something. Not just a phone call. New media. New media Pooler today. Zero hedge, Washington Post. Is the print pool old, reliable, traditional newsmax secondary tv. The President's got no public events on his schedule. Gets his intelligence briefing at 11. Dan, I remember a time when if the President states got their intelligence briefing at 11, they'd be mocked and saying, hey, you gotta be up at like 8:00am minimum to do that. But this president's doing it 11 today and then he's signing unspecified executive orders at 3.

[Sean Spicer]

Yeah.

[Dan Turntide]

Key, keyword gold at 3 o'. Clock. Gold.

[Mark Halpern]

Gold. Okay. Is he opening an IRA with gold?

[Dan Turntide]

Second word card. Second word card.

[Mark Halpern]

Oh, is that. Is that finally happening? As you know, I'm fascinated by that.

[Dan Turntide]

I'm just throwing out two random words.

[Mark Halpern]

Okay. Okay. Good to know you heard it here first, I think. I didn't know. Thank you for that. Vice President don't know what he's doing. I. I will tell you that an enormous focus of the administration, especially the office of the Chief of staff and all the four deputy chiefs of staff, they're very focused on the logistics of Sunday. An enormous number of administration officials are going to Arizona for the memorial service and getting everybody there and having continuity of government. The security is going to be at the level of a State of the Union or Super Bowl. And not everybody can go because you can't have everybody in that one place. But a lot of attention being focused there. Congress is in doing various things, including Hakeem Jeffries. 9:30 Press conference, CDC, the advisory committee on Immunization meeting again today and making various announcements, some controversial. Mr. Acosta is testifying on Capitol Hill.

[Dan Turntide]

Covid and the hep B are going to be the big news coming out of that.

[Mark Halpern]

Yes, Yes, I agree with that. Thank you for that. Alex Acosta, who has been relatively unheard from since he presided over the charging decisions in the Epstein First Epstein indictment for which he was convicted. And did he. Was he convicted and convicted? He pled. Right. There was no trial. Yeah, of course. It was a sweetheart deal. There was no trial. Anyway, he presided over that sweetheart deal. He's testifying today in front of House Oversight. And I would expect one or both parties to. I always call it leaking, but give a readout of. Of what he says in that testimony.

[Sean Spicer]

You think he takes the fifth at all?

[Dan Turntide]

No, no, listen, I will tell you, I know Alex. He is a brilliant attorney. You may not agree with everything he says, but this is not a guy who's going to shy away. He's a smart, smart attorney and he'll be very. Again, I have not discussed this with him, just full. So I. But he is someone of great integrity who will be very open about why certain decisions or were made, in my opinion.

[Mark Halpern]

All right, well, everybody's super interested to see what he has to say. All right. Kimmel not going to be back on the air tonight, I don't think.

[Dan Turntide]

Well, no, because Fridays are always pre taped anyway.

[Mark Halpern]

Well, I know, but they did consider they. Because as you know, Sean, a good way to, to bury this would be to do it tonight, you know, and, and have it on late Friday night and say what he needs to say and hope it tamps down over the weekend. So I don't, I wouldn't rule it out, but I don't think it's likely. Dan, as compared to 24 hours ago. Are you more or less inclined to think he'll never be back on same.

[Sean Spicer]

I don't, I don't think he's coming back.

[Mark Halpern]

Yeah. So you were like 100 yesterday and 100 today, Sean.

[Sean Spicer]

I mean, 90.

[Mark Halpern]

Yeah, Sean. More, more or less likely based on the last 24 hours?

[Dan Turntide]

Less likely. That will be on three quick points. One, he was going to double down. They'll never allow that. So that's, that's number one, you cannot allow a guy who's gonna double down go on and ruin your business. Number two, let's not forget that Jimmy Kimmel got that slot at ABC after Bill Maher was canceled. So there is a bit of irony in how this slot can be. And three, just a pro tip to all of the Jimmy Fallon, Politico, CNN, New York Times and most of the D.C. democrats before you get on your high horse about the First Amendment and Jimmy Kimmel getting canceled.

[Mark Halpern]

Right.

[Dan Turntide]

Remember your lack of concern about the First Amendment the last 10 years when the right was being canceled and at least another pro tip, admit that what he said was wrong. Before you actually talk about the First Amendment, what Jimmy Kimmel said was inflammatory, false, inaccurate. And before you start defending the First Amendment, at least admit that what Jimmy Kimmel said was wrong.

[Mark Halpern]

I couldn't agree more. Hey, there's a new Washington Post poll. We're gonna pull a graphic from it or two, thank you before Dan gets his equal time here because I don't want to be sued by the fcc. I appreciate what you said, Sean, and I hope you and your party would consider your record of in the past opposing government interference in the private sector and what the head of the FCC and the president have said are outrageous. And not only Paul Gigot thinks that and Britt Hume thinks that and what's her name lives in Alaska. What's the name of the lady who raised her. And then any number of Republican officials and even, even at least one person who's in a senior job in this administration who I can't name. So, Sean, I'd love you to acknowledge that what's happening is it's not just something that should be kind of eyes rolled. It should be denounced by people in the Republican Party, any conservative to say the head of the FCC is making mafioso like threats against a private company. Certainly that's just as much of a hypocrisy.

[Dan Turntide]

Well, just to.

[Mark Halpern]

You're correctly calling out on the left, right.

[Dan Turntide]

And I said it yesterday, I am concerned about us using government tools to enact action. I do think ABC should have done it themselves. They weren't going to do it. And so sort of nudging folks to remind them of what the last 10 years have been like for Trump supporters, you know, isn't a bad thing. I think we do need to be careful how far we go. I actually care more about the future because if we set the precedent that it's okay. I am concerned about that. But I will say that for all these people on their high horse that want to talk about the First Amendment and government intervention, they sure didn't seem to care the last 10 years.

[Mark Halpern]

I agree. I cared about it. I cared about it before, but I also care about it now. And I don't think it's enough. I say respectfully and then, Dan, as much time as you want.

[Sean Spicer]

No, you're making my point.

[Mark Halpern]

I don't think it's enough to just say it's unfortunate or I don't like it or ABC should have done it on its own. This is an extraordinary abuse of power. Extraordinary abuse of power. And it should be denounced as such. It doesn't mean you have to denounce them personally. I mean, I think the head of the FCC is a fascinating guy, but his own previous statements did not lay the groundwork for threatening a private company over content. If the argument is we shouldn't be licensing these people to do a extended biased presentation, I have no problem with that. Truly. I understand that point of view. But to say one statement from a comedian warrants government threats. But that's what he said, Sean. He didn't say.

[Dan Turntide]

No, no, no, I get it. But I'm also like to make it seem like Jimmy Kimmel is a comedian and that joke is not what happened.

[Mark Halpern]

It's speech. But it's speech. I don't care.

[Sean Spicer]

But again, he's a comedian. Like I said.

[Dan Turntide]

No, he's not. He's not funny.

[Mark Halpern]

It's speech.

[Sean Spicer]

Well, to you, he's not funny.

[Dan Turntide]

I mean, the bottom line is this, as I've said, and I've been clear, I do. I am concerned about our. My party. And overall, it's not a party thing. It's not like my side or there's a. Philosophically, I don't like the government dictating a private sector, but it should and should not be doing well. It's a hard time getting upset about looking at this and watching Chuck Schumer and these guys are all start to cry.

[Mark Halpern]

But, but do you can do both, you can do years, you can do both at once, you can condemn. But, but, but what I'm saying is, yeah, I say respectfully, it's not, you're saying it's troubling or I wouldn't do it or I don't agree it should be denounced. You should call for them to stop it because it's outrageous what they've done. It really is. Dan.

[Sean Spicer]

So the only other point I would add is the under one underlying part of the FCC chairman's actions is, I believe is that there is a potential acquisition pending between some of these affiliates. And one of the things this administration had talked about precedent setting, Sean, is when you want to make an acquisition, you basically have to come with a substantial political offer to help this specific president. And if that starts to become the standard, that is a very dangerous game. And I think it's totally un American.

[Dan Turntide]

Again, I don't like the precedent that it sets because I worry about what your side will do when you start second Amendment gun companies and saying if you don't put a gun lock on everything, if you don't do what we said, you can't ever own, you can't buy, you know, maintain your first, I.

[Sean Spicer]

Mean, just anything, I mean just you could go around an energy deal, a News Corp deal, anything. It. Yeah, so.

[Dan Turntide]

Well, no, so like I said, I do, but I have a hard time getting feeling really bad when I'm listening to Chuck Schumer talk about the First Amendment, which he hasn't given a crap about for 10 years. And when none of these people, by the way, as I said, let's not forget what's getting lost in this discussion. Jimmy Fallon going on last night, Stephen Colbert and getting all upset, not one of them commented that, you know what? While I think what Jimmy said was wrong, they have been silent on that. So until they're ready to admit what Jimmy Fallon said wasn't just abhorrent, it was wrong. It was wrong, it was a lie and it was misinformation. For all these folks in the media who love to talk democracy dying in darkness and misinformation and the big lie, the they are allowing this to continue. When you talk about the mag.

[Sean Spicer]

Well, no, almost every single story out there says what Balance said was wrong.

[Mark Halpern]

I mean, that is disagree, disagree. Now people are Saying, oh, it wasn't so bad. You can look at it if you squint, and it's not so bad. I disagree.

[Sean Spicer]

Dan, not the commentator, but have you given the coverage?

[Mark Halpern]

No. Even the coverage. I disagree.

[Sean Spicer]

Okay, I haven't seen that.

[Mark Halpern]

Okay, disagree. We're going to go a little bit out over here because there's a new Washington Post poll. Let's throw that up. It's the President's approval rating on a variety of topics, and he is, as the professional pollsters would say, underwater on everyone. The Disapproval on tariffs, 64%. Dealing with Russia and Ukraine, 60%. Disapproval on the economy, 59%. I'd say that's pretty good under the circumstances. Israel and Gaza, disapproval, 58. Immigration, 55 disapproval. Crime, 54% disapproval. Dan, I bet that last one catches your eye.

[Sean Spicer]

No, I think you can actually disapprove of him on crime and also approve of him sending stuff in because there's no alternative. I think that's a how versus a what issue.

[Mark Halpern]

Sean, Sean, if you were in the Oval and the President saw these numbers and said, sean, are these numbers good? What would you tell him? Are these good?

[Dan Turntide]

First of all, I'd say, why are we looking at this? It's a poll of 2,500 adults, that these aren't even registered voters.

[Mark Halpern]

He's not up for re election. Shouldn't he care about his. All his constituents, not just those who. Who vote?

[Dan Turntide]

I mean, in some theoretical political science seminar course. Sure, but that's not how it works.

[Sean Spicer]

They have to be concerned coming out of summer with these numbers. There's no way you want. If your goal is to keep the House and prevent subpoenas and Democrats, you.

[Mark Halpern]

Can'T keep the House. You can't keep the House with these numbers. Apparently you both said Fallon when you met Kimmel. I apologize. No, no, no.

[Dan Turntide]

I said Fallon because Fallon last night went on and said, jimmy Kimmel's a good guy. I said Fallon. Intention.

[Mark Halpern]

Got it. Now I see what you're saying. Okay. All right. Let's, let's, let's, let's see where we're going next. We'll skip over that for a second. You skip over that because. Because we've used a lot of time. Harris's book. So Kamala Harris. I don't. I'm great at selling books. The thing I'm best at. I don't. I don't understand this Strategy. It's number 12 on Amazon right now, But I just think this rollout's very bizarre. They basically took the Embargo off and let everybody write about the book. A lot of things getting attention from the memoir or from the account of the campaign. One is that Biden's on fourth of July challenged both Kamala Harris and her husband about whether they were loyal. Joe Biden called her right before her debate with Donald Trump and started to talk about himself. She found that a little disconcerting. And then she writes about the Veep stakes. And as we told you yesterday, she said she wanted to pick Pete Buttigieg, but she didn't think America was ready for a black woman and a gay man. She also took a fair number of shots, accurately recounting, as I reported at the time, about why her meeting with Governor Shapiro did not go well. I appreciate her confirming my reporting, which was not the reporting that many other people had. Pete Buttigieg did not like Kamala Harris suggesting that America was not ready for gay men on the ticket. And Adam Ren of Politico, a very good Midwestern based reporter, got an exclusive interview with Pete Buttigieg, who made his disagreement with his friend Kamala Harris quite clear. Please roll number 109. Let's roll 109 with audio.

[Sean Spicer]

109.

[Mark Halpern]

You got to be specific. Let's roll 109, audio and video. Q. Take two. 109.

[Pete Buttigieg]

When I read that, I just believe in giving Americans more credit than that. You know, my experience in politics has.

[Caller from Verde Valley]

Been.

[Mark Halpern]

Well, we're gonna have it, guys.

[Dan Turntide]

Or not technically, they technically did do it.

[Mark Halpern]

So we don't have. If we don't have it. I'll summarize it. We heard the money quote there.

[Pete Buttigieg]

Well, I was surprised when I read that. I just believe in giving Americans more credit than that. My experience in politics has been that the way that you earn trust with voters is based mostly on what they think you're going to do for their lives, not on categories. And I wouldn't have run for president if I didn't believe that. I was right here in Indiana when this state turned blue for the first time since lbj. And it wasn't Bill Clinton who did it. It wasn't John Kerry who did it. That happened in 2008.

[Mark Halpern]

The more I think about what she wrote, it's okay, you can dump out. We got the point. The more I think about what she wrote, you know, why would she write provocative things in the book, whether they're true or false? Maybe to get a big book advance or to sell books or maybe to position herself for 2028. But to the extent she was unpopular in the party, Dan, when she's writing about Shapiro and Buttigieg and by Newsom and Newsom and Whitmer, she just. She's just. She's just making enemies. Right?

[Sean Spicer]

Like, what's going.

[Mark Halpern]

Yeah, What's. What's the point of making all these enemies with this. With these things?

[Sean Spicer]

That's the. You know, there's. There's. She's angering everybody. Right. She is pleasing nobody. And. And you would write a book like this to set yourself up for your next step, which, by all accounts, she doesn't want to completely leave politics. So how is this book helping you with your next step? Like, I literally see no benefit from what she's doing. Even people I know who really like Kamala Harris and are sympathetic, basically, are cringing at this, and they're like, she looks weak. She looks whiny. So I just don't know what she is hoping to accomplish and how she thinks this better positions her. Even if it's like. I mean, let's say she wanted to go serve on corporate boards or whatever. Even then she looks terrible.

[Mark Halpern]

Yeah. Sean, do you just want to let out one of those laughs like this?

[Dan Turntide]

Yeah. That was the first thing. Number one. I will say this. I felt like the ball got put on the tee for Buttigieg, and I actually was a little bummed that he. His response was so muted.

[Sean Spicer]

Perfect.

[Mark Halpern]

I agree with Dan. They're close friends. I mean, he made his position clear. He.

[Dan Turntide]

Fair enough.

[Mark Halpern]

He was dignified. She went low, and he went high.

[Dan Turntide]

All right, fine. Fine. Fair enough. I thought that this. He could have been a little bit more indignant. It will. It will say. It's also funny, because in the book, she says he's the first person that texted and said, I don't even have to be asked. I'm on your team. Like, that's the guy. I'll say this. If I were her, the last thing I'd be doing is throwing Pete Buttigieg under the bus because he's the kind of guy you want on your team. Secondly, I got to tell you, the only person she hasn't screwed over is Dougie. And I'm wondering if he's next.

[Sean Spicer]

Well, she said he wanted Shapiro.

[Mark Halpern]

Yeah.

[Dan Turntide]

I'm just saying. It's just. It's so bad.

[Mark Halpern]

I just. I. Dan, what is the highest number the book will get to on the New York Times bestseller list on the hard hardcover e book combined? What is the highest number we'll get.

[Sean Spicer]

To if the DNC has to buy a million? It'll get to number one. But I. Five.

[Mark Halpern]

Five, Sean.

[Dan Turntide]

I made, actually. Great. So as everyone. Just so everyone on this call knows everyone else uses BookScan. So you sell a thousand books. That's your rank in New York Times says how many books were bought at east side. Whatever you guys have up there, some coffee shop with five books and that counts more. So they have their own hidden formula. I agree with Dan. I think she'll hit five.

[Mark Halpern]

Yeah. As the country's leading expert on selling books will tell you, you can't possibly know because you need to know what else is on sale next week. You can get to number one selling very few books. I think based on my knowledge of what's coming, she'll actually be number one. But she's not going to sell a lot of books because you can be number one in a slow week in September selling, you know, 40,000 books. So I think she will get. I think she will get to number. Yeah. Some weeks.

[Sean Spicer]

Some weeks she did this just to make money and then just for the money.

[Mark Halpern]

I really, I don't think she thought it through because as somebody probably told her, you've got good stories. And I will say, I will say to her credit, I've read the whole book on the Shapiro thing. For instance, she. She's now given the best account of what actually happened. The Shapiro people are all up in arms about it, but her account's 100% right, based on my sourcing. So I think, I think I will.

[Dan Turntide]

Tell you, by the way, my hat's off to her. Not the best. Right up there. If the New York Times pulls one of their little crappy things where they. She sells like 3,000 books and someone else sold 6,000, but they give her number one because of where she sold the books.

[Mark Halpern]

No, no, no.

[Dan Turntide]

God bless.

[Mark Halpern]

That's not how it works. Promise. But you can. The New York Times does, if there's buying, like buy the dnc, they put the double daggers, the little double dagger symbol. When Mitt Romney displaced my book at number one, I was number one for a number of weeks. And then Romney displaces. He had double daggers. And believe me, whenever I see Mitt Romney, I say under my breath, double daggers. So annoying.

[Dan Turntide]

Like this. You go like that.

[Mark Halpern]

All right, we're skipping around. Axios has an artfully written piece that says that AOC's people are positioning her to maybe run for senator. President. Doesn't say she's got any intention of doing both. I continue to believe that the, the touting of AOC on one end of the spectrum. And Scott and Governor Bashir on the other end is a manifestation of the vacuum that exists because no one sees any strong candidates. Supports the Green New Deal, supports eliminating a vice, can raise a lot of money. But I see almost nothing else there that you would normally have to win a nomination. So Dan, you previously made her a first tier candidate I believe along with Governor Newsom. Did that item make you think still she's a first tier candidate?

[Sean Spicer]

Yes. And everything I heard in dc, I still think she is going to do it. Because if Mark, If I took AOC's name away and said you have a candidate who's. Who is a co host of a movement, the other host is 82 years old. She has all the energy in the base. She has a massive volunteer army of people who will run through a brick wall and she can raise more money in low dollar than anyone else.

[Mark Halpern]

All true. All true. Again, all true. Close your eyes. Close your eyes, Dan. Close your eyes. Name one idea she has that's broadly popular as a policy idea. Go.

[Sean Spicer]

One idea in the base.

[Mark Halpern]

No, broadly popular in America.

[Sean Spicer]

But you gotta win the primary before you go to America.

[Mark Halpern]

Well, you do, but as you know, the history of your party is nominating someone who has ideas that are broadly popular. It's not just that she's liberal, dad, it's that she doesn't have any ideas. She's got no original ideas.

[Sean Spicer]

Well, no, hold on a second. You said the Green New Deal.

[Mark Halpern]

That's not her idea.

[Sean Spicer]

Yeah, but she's associated with it within the party. Like if the demon.

[Mark Halpern]

If the Democratic Party nominates someone who full throatedly supports a Green New Deal, they will. The Republican party will win 350 electoral votes.

[Sean Spicer]

Right, but Mark, you're. You're talking about who will be the nominee and who will win.

[Mark Halpern]

But you're party saying.

[Sean Spicer]

Okay, I'm not saying she'll be.

[Mark Halpern]

How can you say someone who's not going to be the nominee is a first year candidate? Makes no sense to me. Sean Spicer, another boss.

[Dan Turntide]

I'll agree. I just. I'm going to. I want to help. Dan, she is a first tier candidate in a grade on the steepest curve in the world, kind of. Stop it.

[Mark Halpern]

Stop it. All right.

[Sean Spicer]

No, hold on a sec. But Mark, in any, in any Republican primary in the last, you know, 25 years.

[Mark Halpern]

Yeah.

[Sean Spicer]

The candidate that the base most loves, you would say starts as a top tier candidate. They may get mowed down.

[Mark Halpern]

I wouldn't, I don't do that. I think that's foolish. To tout someone as a top tier candidate who won't be nominated, I think that's foolish.

[Sean Spicer]

I think the history is super long. Was Bernie, was Bernie Sanders a top tier candidate?

[Mark Halpern]

No. And he wasn't the nominee, although he could have been. Could have been. Anyway, Bernie's a little more complicated than she is because Bernie actually has some original ideas. In any event. In any event. In any event, she could be the nominee because there's no strong candidate. I'm going to speed through some things, then we're going to do winners and losers and what to look for and, and then your questions. I'll just say Jeff Zients, one of two of Joe Biden's chiefs of staff, testified on Capitol Hill yesterday behind closed doors and said a version of some of the truth, which is he saw decline and the fact that he testified and the people who were most in charge of managing the decline took the fifth. I'm telling you, folks, this is headed to a really bad place for those involved in the attempted cover up. And I call it an attempted cover up because it failed.

[Sean Spicer]

Take he named names about who told him to alter things and he did.

[Mark Halpern]

And, and, and, and his, his testimony and Ron Clan's testimony. Someday those are going to be held up side by side. That's all I'll say for now. All right, here we go. We're not going to talk about the Middle east, even though we could. Sean, Winner of the week Faith.

[Dan Turntide]

I believe that what Charlie has done more than anything else is give people a sense of faith and purpose. I've heard more people go to church for the first time, go back for the first time, reexamine their relationship with God. And when you can do that, 31 years old, that's a huge feat.

[Mark Halpern]

Dan, Winner of the week.

[Sean Spicer]

Charlie Kirk's legacy. I think he is arguably more power. He's more impactful for more people today than. Than he was prior to his death.

[Mark Halpern]

Yeah. The winner of the week is the American people. Why, you might ask? Well, because finally, out of the morass of division, lack of unity, lack of consensus. We now have a consensus savior for the United States of America showing up in my Google News alerts this morning. Please put up number 111, please. Was this headline American Thinker Dan Turntide Must Run for President by KH Cutts. According to the story 112A please. According to the story I read aloud, Turntide is the left side to Sean Spicer's right on Mark Halpern's indispensable show the morning meeting. We disagree on most things, but he's an honorable man and a person who obviously loves the country. The first comp that comes to mind is Hubert Humphrey. Ladies and gentlemen, I give you your happy warrior, an independent candidate for the presidency in 2028. Our savior, Dan Turntine. Congratulations and thank you for your attention to this candidacy.

[Sean Spicer]

Is that an AI generator? Is that.

[Mark Halpern]

No, it's total real, dude. Go Google it.

[Dan Turntide]

It's right, by the way, can I get on the ax? If you do. If you go through with this, I would like to be on the. By the way, Matthew Bartlett. I don't want to be vp. Actually, VP is not bad. The House is amazing.

[Mark Halpern]

Yeah.

[Dan Turntide]

But I will say this. I just want to be on the access list. Like, I don't want to have to.

[Mark Halpern]

Punch in, you know, people have had reality shows where they've, like, run for office and that they've made that into the show. I really do think it's too late for one of us to run for mayor. If I could turn the clock back, I would do that. But. But, Dan, I think we should file for you and you should run. Right? Why not? It's not very much to why not. We do. This will be. This will be like a. Like a Rose Garden style thing. Like, we'll go to. We'll go to the early states. You'll give a few speeches, we'll do some morning meetings. We'll see what kind of crowd you'll talk about issues. Like, I don't see any downside. And the publicity for the show will be phenomenal.

[Sean Spicer]

Yes.

[Mark Halpern]

All right.

[Sean Spicer]

Fairway and Green.

[Dan Turntide]

Mason, Fairway and Green.

[Mark Halpern]

Ask your family if it's okay to have you run a symbolic campaign. The only thing is, if you'd run as a Democrat, I want to get you into debates. If you run as an independent, you won't be in the debate. So let's. I want to discuss whether you're going to run as a Democrat or as an independent.

[Dan Turntide]

We got to watch the FEC tripwire. So, guys.

[Mark Halpern]

Oh, I know. Oh, I know. We're not regulated. We're not. We have no. We have no licenses yet. Sean. Loser of the week.

[Sean Spicer]

Hold on.

[Dan Turntide]

Brendan Carr just texted and he said lawsuit filed. So my loser of the week is Biden Harris, 25. And the reason I combine them and It's Biden Harris 25. Joe Biden and his legacy in the Biden library and Kamala Harris and her legacy in the book combined make them the loser of the week.

[Mark Halpern]

Dan. Loser of the Week.

[Sean Spicer]

All right, I'm going to audible, Paul, because he just took mine. And I won't. I won't copy with Kamala Harris. I'll say he was my runner up was Chuck Schumer. He has dug himself in a hole. He is going to get hammered again from all sides. We are going to lose the shutdown debate. And he once again has lost, has lost, lost the fight.

[Mark Halpern]

Dan. Sorry, I lost my train of thought. Your turn, your turn, my loser. Daniel. No, I had something to say about Schumer, but just gone out of my head. My loser of the week is those Americans like myself who hate hypocrisy because the right is, is, Is suddenly championing cancellation and the left is suddenly opposing people losing their jobs for things they say. It makes me bonkers to see all this hypocrisy, Sean.

[Dan Turntide]

I don't. I respect. I'm not gonna. We're not gonna debate this. Yeah.

[Mark Halpern]

You're gonna say there's a principal difference between them. No.

[Dan Turntide]

And I think there's a difference. There's no both sidesism. I've said it all week. It's not the same. Canceling someone because they made, supported, made or condoned violent act viol versus digging up something that they said in third grade.

[Mark Halpern]

Not everyone who the left canceled was canceled for somebody digging something up. They said in third grade. Some people were canceled for things they said contemporaneously. I'm not saying they're identical things, but you either believe that people should not lose their jobs for things they say or you don't.

[Dan Turntide]

That's actually. I don't believe that you should lose your job for your beliefs. For being a conservative, for supporting. Donald Trump said that. There's a difference between that and saying, I think somebody's assassination is acceptable.

[Mark Halpern]

Yeah. And if ABC wants to fire someone for saying, making fun of someone's assassination, they can. But you even. You don't think that the government, the federal government.

[Dan Turntide]

Oh, no, no.

[Mark Halpern]

That's the question. But that's what's happening here. You're saying, great Kimmel. Great Kimmel. No, it's not great. When the government.

[Sean Spicer]

And if, if, if, if evening entertainers that don't tell the truth on political commentary is the standard for being fired. There will be no host on almost every cable network.

[Dan Turntide]

I also think we're buying into a narrative. Somehow. Brendan Carr is responsible for all this versus nexstar, Sinclair, Tenga and other actors.

[Mark Halpern]

We don't know. We don't know why Bob Iger did it. As I said, earlier, but we know that Carr shouldn't have said what he said. Regardless, if you want to make what to watch for this weekend related to Phoenix, you've got to be more specific. You can't just be watch the ceremony, Sean.

[Dan Turntide]

Well, I was going to say what I. It's the first day of early voting here in Virginia, so I was going to look for the vote. But what I am really looking for when it comes to Phoenix is how the Dems respond to it. What did they say coming out of this Sunday, Monday, Dan?

[Sean Spicer]

Well, a twist on that specifically. So Phoenix, how much do the Speeders focus on Charlie, what he accomplished and his legacy that they want to be, and how much turns into railing against the left and that I'm curious how the American people respond versus just necessarily the Democratic Party.

[Mark Halpern]

Sean, did you send me a stage direction by text that I didn't, I didn't heed?

[Dan Turntide]

Not the first time, I mean, all.

[Mark Halpern]

Right, I, I, I'm just seeing it now. That's why I didn't need it. I would have, I would have. It doesn't matter. I would have, I would have happily heeded it. But I apologize. All right, time for your participation.

[Sean Spicer]

Wait, what's yours?

[Mark Halpern]

Oh, yeah, mine's the same as yours. Then I apologize. Same as yours. All right, Mr. Pop, is that your, is that your true last name, Pop?

[Caller from Verde Valley]

Yes, it is.

[Mark Halpern]

That's an awesome last name. Thank you for being part of Two Way welcome and tell folks where you are, what's on your mind for Sean and Dan.

[Caller from Verde Valley]

Okay, I'm nervous now.

[Mark Halpern]

Don't be nervous. Don't be nervous. I know you're speaking to a future president and that could be.

[Dan Turntide]

I just want one, one thought, though. If you are nervous, CB Distillery always has. It'll help you.

[Mark Halpern]

Yeah, yeah.

[Dan Turntide]

Code word Mark.

[Mark Halpern]

Yeah.

[Caller from Verde Valley]

You don't see what's below here, so.

[Mark Halpern]

Yeah. All right, then don't be nervous. Just, just tell us where you are. What's on your mind?

[Caller from Verde Valley]

I'm Verdi verde Valley. About 17 miles from Sedona.

[Mark Halpern]

Yes, sir. Beautiful place.

[Caller from Verde Valley]

And I'm a dog rescuer, so. There are 23 dogs right here.

[Mark Halpern]

Right. Can you pan, can you pan over and show us that? Take your time.

[Sean Spicer]

All right.

[Mark Halpern]

I see a bunch. All right.

[Caller from Verde Valley]

And then we got some dogs down here.

[Mark Halpern]

Yeah.

[Sean Spicer]

How do you have them so quiet?

[Mark Halpern]

It's early.

[Caller from Verde Valley]

It's 6:30am that could, that could change in any moment.

[Mark Halpern]

Okay. All right, tell us, tell us what's on your mind.

[Caller from Verde Valley]

Oh, there's so much. But, Dan, you're Wonderful. I, I, you're just, you're awesome. Thank you. You're like the old, the old school Democrats that we could argue with and have a conversation, you know, and not.

[Pete Buttigieg]

Be a bad person.

[Sean Spicer]

Thank you.

[Caller from Verde Valley]

And it means a lot, too, to be able to listen to you and be able to actually respond to it rather than react. Because I get, I react when somebody calls me a bad name. You know, I'm not, I'm not Jesus yet.

[Sean Spicer]

Understandably so.

[Caller from Verde Valley]

I wanted to share a story. My dad's a very, a liberal. I used to be a liberal. And he cried twice in his life that I saw. And one of them was when John Lennon died. I had come downstairs and he had died that it was that morning. And my dad said, john Lennon died. And I said, who is he? My dad looked at me and he just started to cry. Like, you don't even know. Like, it meant so much to him. John Lennon. And I, you know, being so young, didn't know who he was. And that's where his pain was, that somebody so important to him, these people didn't know. I feel that coming up here with Charlie Kirk, there's a lot of people that, that feel like my dad did. I told my dad this story too, and he got it.

[Mark Halpern]

He got it.

[Caller from Verde Valley]

That don't understand what it meant to them. And it hurts. It hurts. And, and anytime somebody dies, it hurts. And I think the other thing I like to say about my side is, as Christian, the thing I've been reading all. Love your enemies, love your enemies. Love your enemies, love your enemies, love your enemies. Pray for them, Pray for them. And I think as Christians, we could do better at that. I mean, how are we different if we're, you know. And so I've been doing that this week. My clients, I have a doggy daycare and liberal clients, and I actually called her up yesterday. It's like, I just love you so much because I'm seeing what the conservatives are saying about her.

[Mark Halpern]

Right. Stand by for one second. I want to get Dan and Sean to react to what you've said. Really, really eloquent, really lovely, Sean.

[Dan Turntide]

I just, I'm fascinated by it. But I will say the one thing I'll tell you. Mark knows Leo Grillo as well from Delta Rescue. Uh, do you? I'm not familiar. My California geography sucks. How far are you from, like, the LA area in Sedona, I'm 502 miles.

[Mark Halpern]

Exactly.

[Dan Turntide]

Because I thank you for what you're doing for animals. It's, it's really cool. I and I think it's a great. I remember I was really young when, when, when Lennon was shot and my next door neighbor was a big Beatles fan and she was very emotional at the time and I knew obviously enough Beatles songs but I didn't fully appreciate how invested some f in the music. And it's a great story and analogy to what's happening for different reasons. So thank you for sharing that.

[Mark Halpern]

Dan.

[Sean Spicer]

Yeah, I think just two things. One, I think a lot, I think MAGA should be commended that mostly the way they are honoring and mourning is with vigils. I mean it's kind of what you would want. The way to remember people and to release your emotion is prayer and gathering, you know, in a peaceful way. I think the second thing is the reason people don't understand is half the country still doesn't understand the Trump movement. They don't want to understand the Trump movement and therefore they can't understand its leaders. Obviously Trump, but they don't know anyone else. It's just all about Trump and that's a tragedy. And hopefully that Charlie's passing will help some people realize how much the tentacles have spread into society.

[Mark Halpern]

I say thank you. Grateful to you for being part of the community and for what you said. Lee welcome and tell folks who don't know where you are what's on your mind.

[Caller from Amelia Island]

Good morning from Amelia Island, Florida.

[Sean Spicer]

Beautiful.

[Caller from Amelia Island]

Two time very shy Trump voter, was living in D.C. at the time and then moved down to Florida.

[Mark Halpern]

Was a little.

[Caller from Amelia Island]

Little louder about Trump. The third time I say, I say that to say I appreciate what Mark and Sean do. The main reason I watch this is because of Dan. I like hearing the other side from an honest broker and I think he does a great job of that. And I don't know how you feel.

[Mark Halpern]

So, so great you'd be willing to vote for him for president.

[Caller from Amelia Island]

Well, where I was going with that is I don't know how you feel about him, but if you partnered up with Harold Ford, I would have to give it a real, a real thought. He's another one that I'm really.

[Mark Halpern]

Would you be the Florida chair or at least for your county of Republicans for turn time with Harold?

[Caller from Amelia Island]

Potentially.

[Mark Halpern]

All right, that's a lot of caveats. Even if we get Harold and we surmount the fact that they both live in New York, even then it's only a maybe. All right. But nonetheless you like Dan. Good to hear.

[Sean Spicer]

Tell us what else I bet did you think? Do you think Harold may still have registration in Tennessee, just or. No, he Almost ran for mayor. That's right, he did. He's registered here. That's right.

[Dan Turntide]

Oh, really?

[Sean Spicer]

Yeah, Years ago. We thought about it.

[Mark Halpern]

Harold. Harold has two residences, Manhattan and the Hamptons.

[Sean Spicer]

Uptown and downtown.

[Caller from Amelia Island]

But I say that the next thing I'm gonna try to say as respectfully as possible. I've been thinking about the events with Charlie over the last week, and I think we're looking at it, in my opinion, a little bit differently in that we've talked a lot about toning down the rhetoric and I don't see any reason that that's going to change based on the past and current. And I look at, and I'm looking at it from a slanted point of view, but I look at it that we've almost created a broken window society with some of the policies on the left. When you talk about rioting, the looting, stealing from Walgreens became acceptable. Violence on the subway we blamed on mental health. Not that this is wrong. And keying people's Teslas and things like that that we started to accept as a society, we pushed further and further down the line to where at one point assassination was way over here. And we started creeping closer and closer. And I guess my question would be is, is there do you think anybody in the Democrat side is going to have the courage to stand up and say, you know, we need to rethink some of these policies to where society is slowly shifting over to.

[Mark Halpern]

Great question, Dan.

[Sean Spicer]

Yeah, it's a great question. I mean something. And I, I put this on social media yesterday, the Group Chat, the show that I co host every Thursday. My colleague Emma Jo Morris made the point about kind of how MAGA has mourned Charlie Kirk, which I just said a minute ago in terms of vigils. And I thought to my. I mean, it was. Thought we got off the air and I thought to myself, how would Democrats probably have responded if, you know, God forbid, like AOC were shot. Right. And killed the way Charlie Croak was? And I have a really hard time believing that there would not be riots in cities because Democrats, to your point, I think the crime stuff is slightly different here, but the acceptance of acts of kind of what they would call of violence. I'll stop commenting. It's gotten too far in our party. And I do think that if we're going to win the White House and you think about kind of where you're going to have to confront the party on some issues, all winning candidates kind of confront their party on, on, on some things, that idea that it is acceptable when something bad happens. To lash out for a community that feels aggrieved is not okay. And to your point about petty crime and small crime and just kind of turning the other eye and being more sympathetic to the people who commit the crime than society that has to deal with the intimidation and. And the results, I agree. Again, I think both sides have some issues, but, yes, on our side, totally.

[Dan Turntide]

Yeah. It's a fantastic point you're bringing up for two reasons. One, because I do think the crime issue, whether it's the stuff we talk about in the cities and the idea that we've sort of now accepted it's okay if you steal, it's okay if you vandalize, it's okay if you do the following things, you won't be prosecuted. I mean, I know this sounds like the old man thing that I now apparently do a lot more, but when I was a kid, if someone said to you, I'm calling the cops. Your parents will find out. That was just enough to be like, oh, my God, you'll have a record. I'd be like, okay, like, I'm out of here. Not that I ever really did that many bad things. But the difference now is that you can do them with reckless, abandoned. Like, there's no consequences for stealing stuff or for vandalizing stuff or for doing anything. In fact, you're encouraged to do it. Walk into any CVS or Walmart or whatever. At Walgreens in a major city, everything's behind glass, and there's a guard that's standing there that will tell you, I can't do anything when they loot me. Right. To Dan's point, though, there is a difference in the response these people. Look at what Erica Kirk did, calling for tributes to Charlie and how everyone's reacting. Candlelight vigils, and not only that, you get a bunch of them where people are showing up doing disgusting, ridiculous things at that same moment, and they're not being called out for it. So I do think there is a big difference in how the two sides handle things and how their leaders handle it. David Dorn, you may not remember his name, he was killed in the wake of George Floyd protecting a friend's pawn shop. There was very little outrage on that. I mean, the idea that we have a problem when one side, I'm sorry, doesn't think that it's a problem to vandalize, to commit violence if it's in pursuit of what they believe is the greater good. And that is an issue that we have to Reconcile with.

[Mark Halpern]

Dan. Just to clarify, did you say that if someone was equivalent or rough equivalent of Charlie Kirk on the left was killed under similar circumstances, you're confident there'd be rioting? Is that what you said?

[Sean Spicer]

I'm not confident, but I've tried to think how would our party, based on Emma Jones comments, would our party have be as calm and, and I think, Mark, likely there would be riots potentially. I mean just look at the history of, of the last 40 years when stuff like that has happened. I'm not saying one community necessarily, but do I have confidence that we would be as calm and measured, not leaders? I'm talking about like regular, you know, people emotions coming out. Yeah, it's not that I think there would be riots, but would I be surprised if there were riots? No, I would not.

[Dan Turntide]

Okay, Mark, I will say this. I give Dan a lot of credit for that statement. That's, it's an honest reflection. Did you, were you wondering what he said? Are you questioning the outcome? Because I don't have any doubt. I don't think that.

[Mark Halpern]

I'm not going to take a position on this right this second, but I do think it's notable Dan said it and it'll probably go viral on Twitter.

[Sean Spicer]

Oh, I didn't mean it that way. Well, I said it on X yesterday because Emma Jo said it.

[Dan Turntide]

Now it's on the morning meeting.

[Mark Halpern]

Yeah, it's a different thing. All right, Lee, thank you. Grateful to you for being part of two ways. Hope you'll come back. Martha, welcome in. Tell folks who don't know where you are. Gnm what's on your mind for the gentleman here there.

[Martha from Holland, Michigan]

Thanks for calling on me. I just popped in. I am in how. I live in Holland, Michigan.

[Mark Halpern]

Right there. Yeah, go blue.

[Martha from Holland, Michigan]

Yeah, my daughter actually goes there. So anyways, I work in higher ed. I have pretty much my whole career. I've worked in private colleges. I'm in a fairly mid sized state university and I've worked at a big university. So I actually just wanted to ask about Charlie Kirk's memorial service. I was listening to you guys yesterday and was wondering hypothetically to you know, reach across the aisle, who could Charlie Kirk's people ask on the other side of the aisle to make statements at his memorial service? If they.

[Sean Spicer]

Oh, great idea.

[Mark Halpern]

You mean if they were, if they were inclined to have a Democrat speak, who would it be? Yeah.

[Martha from Holland, Michigan]

And who would accept and who could they trust to.

[Sean Spicer]

To stay on mess?

[Mark Halpern]

Probably. Probably Arizona's Kirsten Sinema. I would say probably could I actually.

[Sean Spicer]

Think if Josh Shapiro would, would, were asked, he would go. I do. And I think he'd talk about his own experience.

[Mark Halpern]

Yeah.

[Sean Spicer]

And how it's not acceptable.

[Mark Halpern]

Yeah.

[Sean Spicer]

I don't think he'd go after Trump and stuff like, I think he'd know in that environment, you, you, you, you, you seek common ground, not trying to, you know, spike a football. I think Shapiro would have that discipline.

[Mark Halpern]

Yeah. That's good, Sean.

[Dan Turntide]

I respectfully, I, I, I, I'll answer the question, but I hate any, like, questions when we ask what someone who has passed, you know, what someone said to me, what would your father think? Or something. It's like I always, I always feel like that's a very difficult spot to put someone in. But out of respect for, for Martha coming on and I want to, I'll actually, I could see I would do a duo, Mark and Mark Kelly and Gabby Giffords, and, and they could stand together the one caution. And Joe Biden did this too often in a wrong way. When you're paying tribute to someone and their legacy in their life, Biden would always make it about himself. And I don't think he meant it. And I say that respectfully because I can't imagine the pain of losing the people that he has in his life. That's the one area that I'll always give Joe Biden a ton of grace for, is that I can't imagine the tragedies that he's had to deal with. But when someone's being comforted to try to pivot and say, I know what it's like is always a very dangerous place to go, but it's in Arizona. I think Mark Kelly can be, is a very measured kind of speaker, and he knows he can read a room really well. So I would have a hard time thinking it would be a good idea to begin with, but if I had to give someone that, I'd say the two of them get up and say, we in Arizona and make it about Arizona. And so that's probably where I'd go.

[Mark Halpern]

Okay, go ahead.

[Martha from Holland, Michigan]

You guys were my security blanket during the, during the election. I found out about it when you were on Tucker.

[Mark Halpern]

Mark.

[Martha from Holland, Michigan]

So, Martha, this is the one political show I had my husband watch one time, and he said it wasn't that bad. So that's pretty high praise.

[Mark Halpern]

You know, we're working on a new sizzle reel, so we might add that not so bad.

[Sean Spicer]

Yeah, I was gonna say that should be a new slogan on the sleeve.

[Dan Turntide]

Well, speaking of that, Martha, I know that we're not just your security blanket, but pleased to announce Fairway and Green has a brand new the morning meeting security blanket that you can get at 2 a TV fairway.

[Mark Halpern]

Martha, thank you for being part of 2way. Tell your husband we said hi. Thank you. All right, Dr. John, welcome in. Dr. John treats young people in Tennessee. Welcome, Dr. What's on your mind? And I'd like to see you clean shaven every so often.

[Dr. John]

I'm trying. I do it for you. Mortgage.

[Mark Halpern]

Thanks. Welcome in.

[Dr. John]

Well, I have a lot of thoughts. I was on vacation last weekend out in Yosemite, so I was A very strange way to be seeing all the reactions to Charlie Kirk's murder. I'm with you on your loser of the week though, Mark, and I wish I wasn't so pessimistic about the hypocrisy, you know, when my 3 year old and 6 year old are fighting, if their excuse is, well, the other person did it first or hey, no, actually, you know, it was, it wasn't bad when I did it, but it was bad when they, it just, it's, it doesn't work for three year olds and it shouldn't work for adults. In a national conversation, I think going back from, you know, who got fired from which job and which employers are doing this, backing up from the perspective of an independent voter who's in the middle, genuinely not in the middle like on every issue. I'm all over the map on individual issues, but in the sense that I don't feel at home in either party. I think what I look at and see as a Democratic party who claimed fascism but was willing to throw away democracy in order to save it for money in 2016 and then for power in 2024, you can't win an argument saying, you know, I can, I'm going to take away democracy in order to save it. That was so frustrating. And that, so that's my, that's, I'm going to get one side mad at me for that. On the other side, Donald Trump is just not suited to meet this moment. And I say that for a few reasons. Charlie Kirk, agree or disagree with him on any one issue, was clearly a man who lived by principles, deeply held principles, a man of faith who would be willing to die for ideas as his faith instructed him. No greater love than this to lay down one's life for their friend. He would have been willing to die for certain principles. And when I saw Donald Trump last night in an interview and someone, and I think it was Martha McCollum or somebody, asked Him. You know, Charlie Kirk said that there was no such thing as hate speech. And Donald Trump's response was, well, he might think differently now, or saying Donald Trump saying that the people in the restaurant who protested him should be put in jail. That was a interaction, a direct quote with a reporter or J.D. vance going from. From being aghast at the concept of, you know, making light of some. An innocent person losing their life to saying, I don't recommend going fishing off of Venezuela right now. It's this just like, diminution of the value of human life and the hypocrisy that it's just so grating and it's hopeless. And when you have hopelessness and income inequality and tribalism, you get violence, and usually in the form of fascism or socialism. And I just am so tired of it. We need a completely different way of viewing this than the other side did it, too, because we need it to be completely different.

[Mark Halpern]

Doctor, thank you. I will run a gump against the cloud. That's okay. No, all beautiful, Sean. And then Dan.

[Dan Turntide]

Well, first I would just like to say at some point, John, I'd love you to come back and talk about how you think. I've heard a lot of young people talk about how they're wrestling with the impact of this, and I'd love to get your take on how kids. I mean, I think it's very scary for kids, especially for college kids who are wondering about their safety on the campus. So at some point, I'd love to hear you back. Look, I agree about language. We've got to be careful about it. And sometimes, hopefully, these moments make us reflect a little bit, hopefully, about how extreme some of the language is. I will say that for a lot of people, the president in particular, it's a little personal when you get shot, when you get shot at and then tries to do it again a few weeks later, again, I think for a lot of people, this is a very personal matter for the vice president. Obviously, Charlie was a close friend and obviously very instrumental in his ascent. So I give a little bit of Runway to people who are dealing with this in different ways. And I've always told people when people are grieving or dealing with death, I've seen people sometimes have nervous laughs or whatever. I try not to be critical of how people deal with that kind of stuff because everyone processes things in a different way at a different timeline. There are days, sometimes two months after death, that you find yourself just crying because you don't know what the hell happened or why. And that's so the immediate aftermath of this, I'm willing to extend a little bit of time to folks to process it. But I agree that overall there needs to be some inflection about the language that we use and how we talk about other human beings and the value of life. For those of us on the side that advocate being pro life, we've got to think about how we talk about life regardless.

[Mark Halpern]

Dan.

[Sean Spicer]

John, just great, great set of points. And I think I, I wonder, looking forward, if the marketplace is going to start rewarding people who follow what you just said versus what for the last 30 years, it's rewarded the extremes.

[Caller from Verde Valley]

I hope so.

[Mark Halpern]

Yeah. Dr. Thank you. Very grateful to you, John. Tonight.

[Dan Turntide]

Well, this is an awkward pivot. We're going to go from unity and peace in our language to me telling you that tonight Stephen K. Bannon is coming and Steve doesn't come with anything less than full fire.

[Sean Spicer]

So we're going to talk about understanding.

[Dan Turntide]

Yeah, maybe the understanding part. I'm going to ask him about calls for unity. Steve's been very outspoken about some of the forensics, evidence and text change. I'm going to ask him for that. And then also Steve Bannon, I'm getting to weigh in on the Fed chair.

[Mark Halpern]

Okay.

[Dan Turntide]

So I've got a lot of questions and only 46 minutes.

[Mark Halpern]

All right, Dan, anything you want to tell us about your weekend?

[Sean Spicer]

Just going out with my wife tonight.

[Mark Halpern]

Okay. Random offense, Ethan stress, 2:00pm today, Mike Pesco returns, host of the Gist, or as I like to call it, the Gist. 2:00 clock today, random offense and then two way tonight, final one of the week, West Virginia Republican Congressman Riley Moore, who wants to have Pat Buchanan honored, will be our guest. We'll talk about everything that's going on. But I used to be on TV regularly with Pat. I know he's even now, especially now, maybe a controversial figure for some, but he's a great guy and a great part of American history. And his 1992, 1996 presidential campaigns provided me with one of the great educations I've had in my career. So, so we'll talk with Congressman Moore about that. And of course, as always, take your questions of all the day's news, including the latest, of course, on Kimmel and whatever the president ends up doing. And more preps for the weekend in Phoenix. Grateful to you all for being part of Two Way and the morning meeting. Happy to see you here and get wonderful new people in all week for questions as well as our returning champions and the three of us will be back Monday morning, 9am Full coverage of Sunday's ceremonies in Phoenix.

[Dan Turntide]

I will tell you just as a reminder, I'm going live Sunday, so we will cover that on my YouTube channel if anyone wants to be in the chat and join us.

[Mark Halpern]

Great. Okay. Thank you all. We'll see you Monday morning. Have a good weekend.