U.S. Denies Iran's Claims That Stuck an American Ship After Trump Vow To Protect Ships in Strait

Summary

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Podcast Summary: The Morning Meeting

Episode: U.S. Denies Iran's Claims That Stuck an American Ship After Trump Vow To Protect Ships in Strait
Date: May 4, 2026
Host: Mark Halperin (with co-hosts Jaime and Hogan)

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Overview

This episode dives into breaking news and ongoing uncertainty about reports from Iran claiming to have struck a U.S. ship in the Strait of Hormuz. The panel analyzes U.S. denials, the broader strategic implications for shipping in the region, and President Trump’s policy direction. The conversation expands to discuss both domestic political maneuvering and international negotiations—particularly regarding Iran, economic sanctions, oil pressure, U.S.-Europe relations, and upcoming U.S.–China talks. The discussion is rich with candid exchange, predictions, and a sharp focus on media coverage and midterm electoral implications.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Strait of Hormuz Incident – Confusion and Contradiction

• [02:00-04:00] Mark summarizes the confusion: Iranian semi-official media reported an attack on a U.S. ship. The U.S. denied any Navy vessel was hit, but there were suggestions a merchant ship may have been targeted. The Pentagon confirmed two U.S.-flagged merchant ships safely passed through today under Navy destroyer escort (“Project Freedom”).
  • Mark: “There are two tracks right now. There’s the track of what’s exactly happening in the strait, and then there’s the track of the peace talks.” (03:19)
• The panel highlights the lack of clear information and the broader tension around the U.S. guiding ships as a possible provocation.

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2. U.S. Policy and Prospects for Peace with Iran

• [10:35-13:29] Mark asks Hogan for a prediction on peace negotiations.
  • Hogan: “I just don’t know how you get to peace without more military action.” (12:06)
  • Jaime: “If Iran did take the step to bomb one of our vessels... that’s going to be a huge increase in the violence of this war.” (12:31)
• There's skepticism about Iran’s seriousness in peace talks. The Iranians demand sanctions relief, control of the Strait, and asset releases before discussing nuclear issues.
  • Mark: “The Iranians aren’t serious about a deal… they’re continuing to say basically, take off all the sanctions, give us control of the strait, unfreeze our assets.” (13:29)

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3. Economic Pressure and Oil as Leverage

• [14:32-16:17]
  • Jaime: “We’re in a wait-and-see game with the Iranians.” (14:37)
  • Hogan: “Some conservatives think the economic pressure Trump is putting on Iran is way more effective... They’re losing $14 billion a month.” (15:06)
• The panel discusses conflicting coverage, media focus, and whether oil revenue losses will force Iran to the table.

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4. International and Domestic Political Context

• [17:15-21:43] Mark plays a clip from Scott Bessant on Fox underscoring U.S. control of the strait and humanitarian justification.
  • Scott Bessant: “Their navy is not a navy anymore. It’s a band of pirates... We have absolute control of the strait.” (17:15)
  • Jaime: “I think he was highly optimistic… there’s going to be an international coalition lobbying the president to open the strait up.” (18:28)
• Debate over whether the President’s new policy is making progress. Tensions regarding the upcoming U.S.-China summit (10 days away)—uncertain if kinetic action may force a delay.

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5. China Summit and Geopolitical Stakes

• [21:43-23:47]
  • Mark: “For the first time, an official agenda item between the President and the Chinese premier will be AI... as a security issue.” (23:06)
  • Predictions from panelists: Summit likely to happen, but if kinetic action starts, it could be postponed.

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6. Transatlantic Relations

• [23:58-25:22]
  • Survey of U.S.-European relations: both Jaime and Hogan place the relationship at a precarious 5 or 6 out of 10, citing election season divisions.
  • Hogan: “I think the next two beats are division. The following three will be unity.” (25:17)
  • Mark notes possibility of unity around Iran as a turning point.

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7. Political Polling & Midterm Strategy

• [25:51-31:42]
  • Latest polls show President Trump’s approval at 39%, with especially low marks on cost of living and inflation.
  • Hogan: “That’s always the problem... That’s what people vote on, that’s what people care about. Cost of living.” (27:09)
  • Democratic versus Republican strategies: Jaime argues for localized Democratic messaging, not a grand national plan; Hogan suggests the GOP should tie every opponent to the sagging Democratic national brand.

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8. Media Coverage, Narrative Control, and Candidate Controversies

• [34:10-37:45]
  • Mark and Hogan criticize “double standard” media coverage regarding Democratic candidate Graham Platner’s Nazi symbol tattoo.
  • Hogan: “If anybody had a tattoo like that on our side… I mean, they scrutinize Pete Hegseth’s tattoos all the time.” (35:21)
  • Jaime: (reluctantly) “I don’t know... maybe the coverage will intensify during the general election.” (37:45)

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9. Fraud, Government, and Election Issues

• [38:56-44:50]
  • Discussion over a new FBI video touting fraud investigations, with disagreement over its effectiveness.
  • Hogan: “This fraud scheme is going across many states… I think Republicans need to hammer that from now until the cows come home.” (42:34)
  • Jaime: “I am a government guy... government provides critical services for the American people that if it didn’t exist, you guys would agree.” (44:24)

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10. Audience Q&A and Closing Segments

U.S. Strategy & Trump’s Approach

• [49:05-52:49]
  • Professor Kenny: “What the hell is going on with Trump?... Why didn’t we take Carg Island and block this trade four weeks ago?” (49:05)
  • Hogan: “Trump believes he can make a deal because he’s had a career making deals… if there’s a glimmer of hope for a deal, he’s going to try and make one.” (51:07)

Iran’s Opposition & Revolutionary Hope

• [53:09-56:29]
  • Wickham: “Where are the Iranian people’s George Washington or Thomas Jefferson?” (53:12)
  • Mark: “A revolution requires somebody like [Havel or Mandela] and maybe multiple somebodies.” (56:29)
  • Hogan: “Remember, a lot of those people locally were murdered... It does quash a little bit.” (54:47 & 55:10)

Messaging for the Midterms

• [56:43-59:12]
  • Kelly (Audience): “I think we have a marketing problem... Republicans get caught arguing policy. We need to do a better job showing problems we fix.” (56:43)
  • Hogan (on Trump’s approach): “He’s trying to change things, change the structure, change the dynamic over there.” (58:36)

Memorable Light-Hearted Closer

• [46:07-48:22]
  • Rahm Emanuel’s New Hampshire bike trip video, friendly banter about “fleece” representing liberal America, and speculation on Rahm’s presidential ambitions.

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Notable Quotes & Moments

• Mark (on panel chemistry): “Expect the unexpected and I hope everyone’s delighted when we make the choice [of cohosts].” (01:16)
• Hogan (on Iranian regime): “They’ve got to be, you know, close to complete annihilation, decimation before they would come to the table.” (11:20)
• Jaime (on response to possible strike): “The President’s going to have to think long and hard on how to retaliate.” (12:35)
• Scott Bessant (clip): “Their navy is not a navy anymore. It’s a band of pirates.” (17:15)
• Mark (on polling): “No majority approval on any of the issues... Six months to go until election day.” (26:00)
• Hogan (on campaign messaging): “We ran and won on trying to tie everybody to Nancy Pelosi, Chuck Schumer. The national party is in such disrepair.” (29:53)
• Jaime (on Dem strategy): “I don’t want my candidates wasting their money and time defending the national Democratic Party when… we’re running to take back Congress.” (28:11)
• Mark (on media double standards): “If a Republican nominee had a [Nazi] tattoo... how would the media cover that differently than Graham Platner?” (34:10)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• [02:00] – Strait of Hormuz incident recap and AP account
• [10:35] – Panel begins discussion on U.S.–Iran negotiations and what’s next for peace
• [14:32] – Effectiveness of oil sanctions and media coverage
• [17:15] – Scott Bessant on U.S. control in strait (Fox clip)
• [21:43] – China summit, possibility of postponement, and AI as an agenda item
• [25:51] – Polling: President Trump’s approval and midterm outlook
• [34:10] – Media bias regarding Democratic candidate controversy
• [38:56] – FBI video and debate over fraud as a campaign issue
• [49:05] – Audience Q: “What is Trump’s strategy?”
• [53:09] – Audience Q: Iranian opposition and leadership analogies
• [56:43] – Audience Q: Political messaging for midterms
• [46:07] – Rahm Emanuel’s viral New Hampshire video (light segment)

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Overall Tone and Flow

The tone is frank, lively, and infused with newsroom-style banter and friendly jabs. Panelists offer inside-baseball analysis, express skepticism toward official statements, and challenge each other's assumptions. There are repeated calls for factual clarity, particularly around Iran, and recurrent critiques of media treatment and political branding. High audience engagement is present in Q&A segments, and the show transitions naturally between international crises and U.S. electoral strategy.

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For listeners:
This episode is a deep dive into the fog of an unfolding Middle East crisis, the politics of information, and how newsrooms shape the day’s agenda. It marries breaking news with insightful discussion about the intersection of foreign policy, domestic politics, and media narratives. If you want the mood, think fast-paced, plenty of wry humor, but anchored in earnest debate about high-stakes events.

Transcript

[Kelly]

Foreign.

[Mark]

Everybody welcome in. It's a big week here at the morning meeting about to name the new permanent co hosts and the suspense builds. The betting markets have put a lot on Jaime and Hogan. Not ill advised. They're obviously leading contenders. Jaime, what would be three traits you'd look for if you were running two way and trying to pick the permanent co host? What three just individual traits doesn't allow smack. Yeah.

[Jaime]

Can articulate what the hell's going on in harm on the harmony street.

[Mark]

Yeah.

[Jaime]

And bring a little levity to it.

[Mark]

There you go. Those are good. Hogan, it said in some quarters that you're amongst the front runners. How do you feel about that? Do you wear the crown lightly? Heavily.

[Hogan]

Well first I don't know if that. And that's true. So whatever. I, I would say that you need to make sure that the person people you get with there's some type of chemistry for the viewers to watch. I think there needs to be sensible, reasonable disagreement. A yes man show of course all the time and I think someone needs to provide insight into the goings on of news around the world who has experience in that realm.

[Mark]

I. It sounds like Hogan's pill pulling a Dick Cheney. He just described himself. All the traits. Anyway, that's great. We, we love having you two on, we love having everybody else on and as I said we expect this week to announce the two permanent co hosts and I'll tell you there's going to be a little surprise twist so be ready for the surprise twist. That's all I can say. Expect the unexpected and I hope everyone's delighted when we make the choice. Gentlemen, welcome in. Thank you for being here. Let's run through the daybook and then we'll go through the news including on the straight and for moves where there's confusing news and. And then we'll go to your questions, comments, suggestions. So if you're here on the two way platform, would like to be part of the conversation, we'd welcome you to raise your hand even if, especially if you've never raised your hand before. Oh, and one other thing. No smack in the chat whether you're writing on this platform or on x or on YouTube. No smack in the chat. Just peace, love and understanding even during, especially during times of war. Here we go. The. A lot of confusion about what's going on in the strait right now. The Iranian semi official media. I love it. I love semi official media as much as I love anything else. They said that Iran hit a U. S ship. Then there was some confusion. The US Said they didn't hit a military vessel, but then there was some notion they might have hit a merchant vessel. We don't really know right now, but we know that the US Moments ago. Do we have the Associated Press story? The US Said the US has two American flag ships. I believe American flagships, according to the Associated Press, have gone through the straight today. I'll read from the Associated Press. The US Military on Monday denied claims that Iran struck a Navy vessel as US Forces now offer to guide commercial ships through the Strait of Hormuz. Iran over the past two months has attacks on vessels, blah, blah, blah. The U.S. military Central Command also said two American flag merchant ships have, quote, successfully transited through the Strait of Hormuz and that the Navy guided missile destroyers in the Persian Gulf are helping to restore commercial shipping traffic. The statement on X said the destroyers transited the Straight of Hormuz, quote, in support of Project Freedom, and that the merchant ships are, quote, safely headed on their journey. So there are two tracks right now. There's the track of what's exactly happening in the Straight, and then there's the track of the peace talks. The two sides are pretty far apart, but they are exchanging proposals amidst lots of predictions continuing to occur that there'll be more American attacks. And some think the American guiding of ships through the strait is intended to provoke a reignition of hostilities. The President at the White House today. Executive time started at 8am as it does now almost every day. Policy meeting closed press at 1 o'. Clock. You put up the President's schedule, please. 3 o'. Clock. He participates in a small business summit that's open press in the east room at 3 o'.

[Hogan]

Clock.

[Mark]

So we'll see if he takes questions there. And then signing time in the oval at 4 o'. Clock. So one open event at three. Don't know what the Vice President's doing today. Rudy Giuliani, as far as we know, remains in a hospital in Florida. The family is focusing on privacy except for a very short statement from the the former mayor's spokesperson. Hogan, do you know anything about the mayor's condition that hasn't been out there already?

[Hogan]

No. I was texting with the family last night, though, just, you know, getting to know Rudy over the years and what he did, getting us through 9, 11 and, and, you know, cleaning up New York, et cetera, et cetera, just telling them how grateful I was that I knew him and, and all the work he had done to make New York a better place. So I received no response, but I was texting them, just letting them know we're all praying for the family.

[Mark]

Yeah. So we'll see what happens there. It seems a little. A little on the grim side based on what conversations I've had, but I don't know the specifics of why the mayor is in the hospital or just what critical condition in this case means. We'll monitor that. Scott Bessant's on Fox right now and we'll monitor that as well and turn any sound bites if he makes news. The Congress is out this week. There's an international conference in Armenia today. Amongst those attending, Prime Minister Starmer, Prime Minister Carney. It's the worst nightmare of the anti globalists. It's a bunch of international elites getting together to try to decide things. Cole Allen, the alleged shooter from the White House Correspondents Association Dinner, is appearing at a court hearing today at noon in Washington. Milken conference starts today. Three days in Los Angeles. I should really be at that. I don't know why I'm not. Larry Fink, Ken Griffin Jensen Wong amongst the marquee speakers. The Met Gala, big event starts tonight here in New York. It's a. Hogan's boycotting it because. Because Jeff Bezos is. Lauren Sanchez are amongst those. Is that why you're boycotting Hogan? Am I wrong on that?

[Hogan]

I've got. I've got a. A whole host of reasons why I'm boycotting. That's in there. Sure.

[Mark]

All right. Anyway, Beyonce hasn't gone in like a decade, but she's one of the co hosts and it's a great event. I don't know why people hate on the Met Gala so much. It's a great event. I went one year. I didn't go as an attendee. I covered it one year. It's a great event. Jaime, you ever been to that thing?

[Jaime]

No, I haven't. I would love to.

[Mark]

Yeah. All right. Maybe next year the three of us will go. All right. Monday, Monday. Here's the week ahead. The vice president is in Des Moines tomorrow doing remarks at a manufacturing event. There was a story in the Wall Street Journal over the weekend about the midterms in Iowa. It said Republicans are worried about losing the governor's race. There's two competitive House races, but in one paragraph, the Journal. Mr. McCormick, who's a former Des Moines Register reporter who now writes for the Journal, he just kissed off the Senate race. He said Democrats aren't that high on the Senate race. That surprised me a little bit. Primaries in Indiana and Ohio tomorrow. And of course, we'll See the fate of some of those state legislators who defied the president on redistricting. CNN is hosting a California gubernatorial primary tomorrow night in Los Angeles. Secretary Rubio heads to Rome and supposed to meet with the Pope on Thursday and Friday. Here we go folks, the late night guests for this week. Once again, if you don't like the late night hosts, don't hate on me for telling you who's on, just say, well, now I know what the enemy's up to. Thank you, Mark, for filling me in. And some people like the late night shows. Jimmy Kimmel amongst the favorite of the two way community and is hosting Mike Tyson and John Mullaney, Jimmy Fallon. John Mulaney a nice guy. I'm trying to get John Mulaney tickets at a, a show this summer but they haven't gone on sale yet. But I'm, I'm on it for, I'm

[Hogan]

sure you know a guy or a girl or several.

[Mark]

No, no. I'm going to go through the front door, see what happens. Stephen Cober amongst his guests, the great Sally Field and a guy who's opening his library soon. Barack H. Obama appears with Stephen Colbert this week. All right, quick word from a sponsor and then our topics. Ladies and gentlemen, welcome Cozy Earth. New dog pictures have come in over the transom. I'll say again, if you haven't gotten a Cozy Earth bubble cuddle blanket for your puppies, I'm not saying I'm calling the American association for Prevention of Cruelty to Animals on you, but I will be sorely tempted. Here are the photos of the pups. You got those up, ladies and gentlemen. Here we go. There's one. That dog is the same color as its bubble cuddle blanket. That there may even be not even be a dog in that picture. It could just be a bubble cuddle blanket. But if you look closely and there's another pause up. Anyway, right now, 20% off for dogs and humans. Everything on the site go to cozy earth.com use the promo code. Morning. Buy the jogger set. It's super comfortable for sitting around the house, but it's nice enough to go out. I wouldn't wear it to the Met Gala necessarily, but you could wear it almost anywhere else. And the clogs are super comfortable. Slip them on and off. They're great in winter and great in summer. If there's an outfit you want, it's the, it's the jogger set and the, and the clogs. Right now I got a cozy or dot com. Buy them both. Use the promo Code morning. Get yourself 20% off. Everything on the site is great. If you see the post purchase survey, tell them Beyonce sent you. That'll teach them. That'll teach them.

[Matt Ebert]

I started with one shop. No college degree, no big investors. It was just a willingness to work. Over time, that one shop turned into a multi billion dollar business called Crash Champions. All the lessons I learned along the way came from the grind. And that's what my show Pod Crash is all about. We have real conversations with people who've built things the hard way. We talk to founders, athletes and blue collar leaders who kept going when things got tough. You'll hear stories of grit, leadership and growth. Plus real world lessons you can take back to your team and your life tomorrow.

[Mark]

When you get momentum, you step on the gas. That's how you get separation from everybody else.

[Hogan]

I was at Harvard Law School. I was, blah, blah, blah. I looked up, let me tell you something, there's kids in my neighborhood putting in Sheetrock that are smarter than you. AI is going to disrupt a lot of stuff. It is never going to disrupt physical blue collar traits.

[Scott Bessant]

And the guy just looked at me

[Hogan]

and he said, it's bloody impossible. So I asked him this question. I said, it's impossible. Unless that's.

[Matt Ebert]

Podcast with me, Matt ebert. Watch on YouTube and listen wherever you get your podcasts.

[Mark]

All right, gentlemen, a lot of confusion in Iran again. We're talking about the strait and what's happening there. We're talking about negotiations. Hogan, are you bullish or bearish on peace based on what's going on now and why?

[Hogan]

If I'm. If you can be that cut and dry, bullish or bearish, Obviously this thing has been going on for a while now. I'm always kind of stunned, maybe perplexed by the story you read off the top in the AP about this ship being shot. Wasn't shot who shot it, was it? American, you know, blah, blah, blah. As my friend and former boss, chief of staff of the President, United States, Mick Mulvaney used to say, this is knowable information. We don't need to speculate. Someone's going to find out sooner or later exactly the details around this. And so I think this is kind of much to do about nothing. The fact that they are having conversations now is a good thing. But as we've said on this show many times, I just don't feel as though the leadership in Iran, be it, you know, as militant or as fascistic dictatorial as they are now, really respond to anything other than military might. They've got to be, you know, close to complete annihilation, decimation before they would come to the table and they've not been to that point in the past. So if, maybe if that's the one caveat that brings them to the table to have the conversation, maybe, but, but I just, I just don't know how you get to peace without more military action.

[Jaime]

Ima look, I like I, I've been saying this for, for weeks now and I, you have, I've been perplexed by everyone's optimism in moving forward with these negotiations. And I think today, I mean look, I think Hogan's right. We, it's going to be know it's knowable and we will know soon what went on this morning or overnight and I'm curious to know that. But if Iran did take the step to bomb one of our vessels, be it commercial or military, that's going to be a huge increase in the violence of this war. And I think the President's going to have to think long and hard on how to retaliate. And I think one piece of this next step is likely going to be some sort of strike. I'm not sure if it's going to be a full fledged, you know, few days, but I think we're leading toward over the next week or so a strike that's going to have to remind Iran that we, the America and our coalition it, you know, is strong and we believe that, you know, the reason why we went into this war in the first place is still the correct reason. And so I don't know. I think the President's going to think about it the next couple of days but it seems increasingly more difficult to avoid any more strikes.

[Mark]

The Iranians aren't serious about a deal. I mean as best we can tell from the offers they keep floating up, they're continuing to say basically take off all the sanctions, give us control of the strait, unfreeze our assets. Yeah, then, and then let's eventually talk about what we might do on nuclear maybe we'll, we'll restrain the program. It is, it doesn't even seem close and, and I don't understand the US Keeps sending back ideas. Steve Witkoff is said to be bullish on the prospect that the President should keep talking to them, but it really doesn't seem like they're, they're serious about a deal. From, from the reports about what's going on. Scott Bessant again we'll, we'll bring his comments. He's still talking on Fox. But Scott, Besant said yesterday on a Sunday show, he said, well, just a matter of days before Iran's oil capacity fills up. And, and they're so desperate that they'll have to make a deal. That thread, that question of that pressure. Do either of you think, because again, we've talked about this many times, some people say it's weeks or months away. Do either of you think the oil pressure is a real thing?

[Jaime]

I mean, I think it is in some ways, but look, we talked about this, and Hobie and I talked about this last week. We're in a wait and see game with the Iranians, and we're going to see who will jump first. Will the American people feel compelled to, you know, ask the President to make some deal because of gas prices, or will their country continue to collapse? And it seems like, you know, they, they want to fight back, but I don't. I think the pressure is real and they're going to have to, at some point over the next couple weeks, really make a hard choice in how they go forward.

[Hogan]

There's a good story.

[Mark]

Go ahead.

[Hogan]

Yeah, I'm just going to say Jaime is right. I just think some, some conservatives think that the economic pressure Donald Trump is putting on Iran is way more effective than the military pressure. They're losing, what, $14 billion a month, something like that. It's however many millions a day. I don't know the math. I'm a comms guy, not a math guy, but I mean, they're getting crushed here economically. And as we talk about the systematic erosion of so many assets they have on the military side of things, economically, when you can't pay your military folks, you can't pay, you know, your, your higher ups, people start to get a little angry and look around and say, where, where's my money? And I don't know that they're getting. If you continue to choke off that ability to make it, I think that it, it may not cause a deal, but it definitely brings them to the table because they're looking around and realizing what's going on. And I would argue there's a massive dearth of information out there of what's actually going on in Iran. It seems like the mainstream media is just hell bent on making America look bad here as opposed to reporting what's happening to the Iranian people and to the Iranian leadership, to their government, to their economy. And I think that's a big underreported story.

[Mark]

Hey, Mehta, how much revenue in oil is Iran losing a week? I'm asking Meta right now because it's the easiest way to ask while waiting for the answer. So Wall Street Journal has an excellent story explaining why although there are certainly stresses of the international economy, that the conflict has not destroyed the US Economy, our world economy set it into recession. Stock market futures are mixed. Rising oil prices are dragging the Dow down. We're about 15 minutes away from the open West Texas. Crude still over a hundred. Gas is $4.46 a gallon right now. And the S&P 512th record close, Nasdaq 8th record close. S&P 500, Nasdaq up five straight weeks, longest winning streak since 2024. So not a lot of pressure there. Here's Scott Bessant moments ago on Fox News with Dana and Bill.

[Scott Bessant]

They hunkered down in bunkers all over the country and I don't think they know what's going on. But what is going on is that they're reduced. Their navy is not a navy anymore. It's a band of pirates. They are trying to cut off international freedom of navigation through the Strait of Hormuz and the US Is opening that up. This is a humanitarian effort, I can tell you. Two weeks ago was IMF World bank week in Washington. And I had numerous countries come up to me, some of the poorest, some of the most vulnerable, and ask us to do this because it's not only energy that's in there. It's fertilizer, it's food transport, it's LPG for the more than more than a billion plus people in India used to cook. So we are saying the Iranians do not have control of the strait. We have absolute control of the strait. We have blockaded the ships going into or out of Iranian ports. Their economy is in free fall. And everyone says they have a high tolerance for pain. Well, well, their soldiers will not have a high tolerance for not getting paid

[Mark]

any, any Pinocchios assigned to any of what he said there?

[Jaime]

I mean, I think it's too, too early to say, but I think he was, he was highly optimistic and I do think he's right. I mean there's going to be an international coalition that's going to be lobbying the president and delegation to open the straight up and, and get things flowing because he's right. Fertilizer and other goods are have to get through and at some point the international economy is going to suffer even further.

[Mark]

Yeah, the president, according to Axios this morning, Caputo and Ravid say he's impatient, he's not happy just kind of sitting around and waiting this out and although Scott Besson asserts the US has full control of the strait, I'm not sure that's entirely true because Iran seems to have some say over who goes through. And the Wall Street Journal says this new idea of a humanitarian oriented effort to guide ships through rather than escort ships through, there's a lot of skepticism amongst the stakeholders who have to be willing to go through. That's the insurance companies, the captains of these ships, the crews of these ships, the owners of these ships. It does not look even, even with the ambiguity about what happened this morning, it doesn't look like the President's new policy so far has unstuck much. Although again, according to the ap, according to the Pentagon, two US Flagships have gone through today, which I believe is a first in a while. There's also the question in terms of timing and forcing mechanisms, the summit's in 10 days between the President and Xi. Another story in the Journal today says that the Chinese, or the New York Times rather the Chinese, are kind of ambivalent about this whole war thing. But of course they continue to be close to Pakistan and there's some signals that the Chinese would like this thing to wind down. The president delayed the summit when kinetic action was going on. My understanding is if there's kinetic going on, he's, he's probably not going to go to Beijing. So it would have to be delayed again, which the Chinese won't like because they like order. Hogan, can the president start kinetic action and keep the summit or once it starts, you don't know that it will stop in 10 days. Right, right.

[Hogan]

And again, it depends on what it's going to be. If some type of surgical hit to electric grid or a bridge that have been mentioned as potential targets before as dual use from the military, than possibly. I'm just interested to see what the agenda is for this meeting. As you know, shutting down this strait hurts many sectors of the world. Not America because we don't get our oil from there, but so many others do. And a lot of our enemies do as well. China being one of those, you know, again, I sat across the table from President Xi in the first administration with Trump as they negotiated a massive trade deal that of course China pulled back from at the last second. And Trump went to Prime Minister Abe of Japan and basically said, you do the same deal. And he says, fine, I'm going to buy all your ag products. Biggest deal in Japanese history. So we know they're kind of a bad actor. We know they are one of our biggest, if not the biggest geopolitical foe we have. So I'm interested to see where the war or the military operation is at that time and then also what's on this agenda? What are we trying to accomplish here with this meeting?

[Mark]

I'm a, what you, what would you tell the ChiComs if they said if you thought the meeting was going to happen?

[Jaime]

Look, I mean I, I, I agree with, with Hogan on, on, on the points that he just made and I'm interested, interested to see how the war plays into this. But this is a, this is a bigger, you know, this is they, we've been waiting for this for quite some time, even before this war began. And so there's some huge trade implications that this summit will have that go far beyond justice, rate of humus and far beyond this war. And so I think currency manipulation is coming back up. And, and that's going to be a big part of the conversation, I think. And, and if, if the president, our president's smart, he's going to take this conversation far beyond the war. This is a once in a lifetime opportunity for President Trump to really go in and settle the case with China or at the very least reestablish where America stands on, on these issues that we've not agreed with China for quite some time.

[Hogan]

One slight correction. This is the second in a lifetime opportunity as he's met with man many times before.

[Jaime]

Yeah, yeah.

[Hogan]

And so there.

[Mark]

Noah, do we have a sound bite from Besson on the China summit? Yes, we do. Let's play that.

[Jaime]

Oh, wait, no, Mark, it's, it's on Iran.

[Mark]

On Iran. All right, well, he talked about the China summit. He's, he's a point person on, on China. I reported last week, nobody seems to have matched my reporting or frankly cared about it, that for the first time an official agenda item between the President and the Chinese premier will be AI and they're going to talk about how to deal with hostile actors, other countries. And, and, and AI is a security issue. It's been discussed between leaders before, but it's an official agenda item, treasury officials say, for the first time. So there's a lot of important work to be done. Let's do mandatory prediction. H Will the summit occur on schedule?

[Jaime]

I think a roundabout. Sure.

[Mark]

Hogan.

[Hogan]

Same.

[Mark]

So it might be delayed a little bit, you guys are saying?

[Hogan]

I don't know. I think it's going to happen. Yeah, I think he wants it to happen.

[Mark]

I, I'll take no, just for fun. I, I, I, I think the war might be underway and I'll have to cancel.

[Hogan]

Again, this was just gentle agreement, a disagreement and agreement I was talking about before. Yeah. Yes, Moving forward.

[Mark]

I hear you. I mentioned earlier, there's this European meeting. You know, it's easy to overstate the tensions, but all weekend, there was a back and forth between the US and various European countries. Again, the Secretary of State's going to Europe not just to meet with Italy, not just to meet with the Pope, but with Italian officials. If 0 is. Is lovebirds, and 10 is a full break, full divorce, where is the US European relationship now? Jaime?

[Jaime]

I. I say it's in a tenable situation right now. So I give it maybe five or six.

[Mark]

Okay, Hogan.

[Hogan]

I was gonna say five.

[Mark]

Five or six. Do you think the next beat in this storyline is. Is more division, or do you think the next beat is unity? Jaima?

[Jaime]

I. I think it's. It's. I hate to say this, but the posture is probably up to Europe and how they, you know, how they approach the next few days, next few weeks. But, you know, look, the King was here last week. It felt, you know, really nice to have some. Some European allies here on American soil. But I don't know, I feel like, you know, as we get deeper into this election cycle, things may go a little bit more divided for a bit. But I do think that Europe has to step up if they want this thing to continue to come together.

[Mark]

Oh, very interesting. But I'll repeat my question. Is the next beat unity or division?

[Hogan]

I think the next two beats are division. The following three will be unity.

[Mark]

All right, that's a fake, but good answer, Jaime. You like that answer? Just take. Take that one. Two beats. I say the next one's unity, because I think there might be unity around. Around Iran. We'll see. Hey, Meta, what's the president's approval rating now, according to the latest poll? Yeah, go ahead, Meta. Sorry, I interrupted. Once you talk, they stop. Go ahead, Meta. Yeah, it's a flawed moment for me. My fault. Go ahead.

[Jaime]

All right, Meta's telling you want the Washington Post poll.

[Mark]

No, put that up, guys. Washington Post, 39. According to Meta, the Washington Post poll over the weekend is only the latest poll to show the president's approval rating is very poor. Here's his approved rating on various things. Overall, 37%. A little lower than Meta has. Average cost of living, 23% approval. Inflation, 27% approval situation in Iran, 33% approval. Highest is US Mexico border, 45%. So no majority approval on any of the issues the Post tested. And this is consistent, ladies and Gentlemen, as we tell you regularly, not just with liberal media polls that are out to get the president, but private Republican polling as well. There's six months to go until election day, I think, minus a day early. Voting starts much sooner than that. Republicans are worried, but, but they say there's time to turn things around. Hogan, what is the poll number that most worries you now in the, in all the polling that's out there regarding the midterms, what's the single number that's most scary to you?

[Hogan]

If you go back, the economic one.

[Mark]

Yeah. You go back to the previous slide. President's approval, a cost of living, 23%, inflation 27, the economy, 34%.

[Hogan]

That, that's always the problem. Everybody knows this economy, stupid. The famous line, that's what people vote on, that's what people care about. Cost of living. The debate always is how we got here and what are we going to do to fix it is the second debate, and I think that's what's going to be litigated in the midterms to some degree. So I do think those numbers change as we get closer to the midterms because there'll be more information out there, and these folks who have pieces of data, but not all of it, I think they're going to see more and more information, more and more ads trying to push the needle one way or the other. So I think it moves a little bit, but that's always the one that I'm concerned about.

[Mark]

Jaime, all the polls also show the Democratic brand is no great shakes, and there continues to be a debate about whether there needs to be some sort of Contract with America or something. I couldn't tell you a single thing the Democratic Party in a unified way stands for to do differently on the economy. Again, there's individual ideas, but will the Democrats, should the Democrats have some sort of ideas of things to say, hey, vote for us and, and we'll do stuff differently?

[Jaime]

Yeah, look, I mean, I, I think in some ways these, these numbers, and I defended Joe Biden for a long time when he was president, and these numbers look similar and we couldn't get people to trust us on the economy. So I think Hogan's right. The economy, the economic number is really important. But from the Democratic side, Mark, I, I vacillate, you know, in, in thinking that we need some grand national plan and vision versus going into these states, into these districts and have individual messages that work. You know, I, I, you know, knowing that the Democratic brand nationally has suffered, I don't want my Candidates wasting their money and spending their time trying to defend the national Democratic Party when if you're Sherrod Brown, I want you to figure out, you know, what was the impact of tariffs in Ohio and how do you moderate your language and enough to go after this incumbent Republican senator? And so I don't want to fall into the trap that you, that, you know, that you and other people are setting right now with asking Democrats to have a national platform and vision. Look, we're not running for the White House. We're running to take back Congress. And so we got to go in. You're seeing what's happening even look, you know, in Maine and in Texas, I'm very concerned about, about those two races because I'm not quite sure that those two candidates are going to be the right candidates to beat those incumbent and our incumbent party senators because they have used such a national message and a national underpinning. And so I don't think that they need to do that right now. I think they have to take the economic message and localize it as much as possible and try to win each of these races one by one.

[Mark]

Brilliant. Brilliantly said. Hogan. Just want to say, brilliantly said, truly, the only thing I'd say is, although I'm a veteran trap setter, I wasn't trying to set a trap. I was just asking the question, will and should Democrats do that? I don't really know what the answer is, Hogan.

[Hogan]

I think it's on our side. I think it's a little bit the opposite in that the Democrat national brand is so bad, pushing every candidate to expose the radical nature the, the, the, you know, the rampant disregard so many people have. The Democrat Party into that bucket, into the, under that umbrella would behoove a lot of these candidates. And while they do need to focus on local issues, don't get me wrong, it needs to be a broader. It's like when they would, you know, having Democrats run trying to tie everybody on the Republican side to Donald Trump. We, we ran and won on trying to tie everybody to Nancy Pelosi, Chuck Schumer. The national brand, the national party is, is in such disrepair. I think it's a good, a good way to go about it. Obviously, local issues matter. So Ham is right there. You want to focus on local issues, but I think there's a way to do it for our side that says, but look at where these Democrats are and look at what they're coalescing around. Do you really want that for your future? So, and I will say one More thing too. There's a baseline problem as it relates to, to, to cost of living. So this is a clunky analogy, but one I'll make. It's like in the Joe Biden administration, he took $10 out of your pocket. Donald Trump gave you back seven, but you still are missing the three. So now you're gonna blame Donald Trump for not not only giving you back the 10, but, but giving you an extra five spot on top of that too. And I think a lot of people thought once he came in he would change and go back to 2019 prices when that is probably never ever going to happen, regardless of the economic growth or tax cuts or anything else, because it was out of whack and things just get more expensive over time. So there's a mentality with voters that they think, oh, we should go back to that pricing when that's virtually a long gone thing of the past that also.

[Mark]

Go ahead.

[Jaime]

You've made a point I've been trying to make for the last seven days. I think you're absolutely right about that. And, but the thing I think we have to also consider is President Trump when he ran for office said he would do these things in short order and, and he was unequivocal about, you know, taking these costs back and you know, and make, you know, so I, I don't think it's unfair for, for the American people to use that as litmus test one, and then two, this is going to be the second week in a row that I give Rahm Emanuel a shout out and I promise you he's not paying me to do so. But to mark to your point, I think as we move out of 2026 and, and we get closer to, you know, the 2027 mini primary for the Democratic nomination for presidency, you will then have to see people talking about a vision and sort of some sort of Contract with America or a great society or whatever it may be. So I think it will happen and it's going to start happening, but I don't think it's right right now.

[Mark]

Got it. A few things. First of all, a few more topics, then to your questions. Comments, please raise your hand if you'd like to be in on the conversation. Second, I don't read the chat, but I do glance at it and Meta is not a sponsor of the show. As far as I know, they're not going to be. I'd welcome their sponsorship, but they're not. I got these over the weekend. I've been playing with them. And the reason I'm wearing them is I'm trying to see if I can do like research on the fly without having to rely on anybody else. But just by asking Meta, it's a little hard to anchor. And where the mom now learning, I probably have to mute myself because. Because if I talk, if I continue to talk, Meta stops thinking. So I gotta. I gotta sort that out over the weekend. Tucker Carlson interview with the New York Times dropped. New York Times is so funny. Their heroes now are people who used to support Donald Trump but no longer do. If you supported Donald Trump, like Marjorie Taylor Greene or Todd, and now you're adverse to Trump, boy, the New York Times loves you. All of a sudden, Marjorie Taylor Greene and Ty Carlson are the two finest people in America. It's very funny. I also thinking about Graham Platner, guys. Imagine there was a Republican Senate candidate in a targeted race, like a really one of the critical races determining control of the Senate. And imagine the Republican nominee, okay. Beat an establishment candidate. And that Republican nominee had a tattoo that was a Nazi symbol up until recently and had said things about rape and about. And about all sorts of controversial things. Imagine if that were a Republican Hogan. How would the media cover that differently than they're covering Graham Platner?

[Hogan]

I think we all know how that would be covered. Of course. You know, I, I was watching one of the Jon Favreau, the podcast bros, doing a thing with Grant Platner.

[Jaime]

Yeah.

[Hogan]

And you know, they were going through all this stuff and someone, someone unearthed a tweet from a while ago. If everyone says, yeah, when a Democrat candidate has a Nazi tattoo, then call me. And I'm like, grandpa didn't have one for like a minute. He had one for, like decades.

[Mark]

Yeah.

[Hogan]

All of a sudden ran for office, got called out for it, and then wanted to change it. So it's a real problem, I think, for them. And I think it's, you know, you know, as we always say, candidates matter. We've lost some significant races on our side by picking bad nominees. I think this could be the inverse for Democrats because, look, he'll get a certain subset of voters regardless because of the layout of the state, but also the support he has from Schumer and Democrat establishment types. And you need all those coalescing around your campaign to win. But, I mean, come on, you know, and I know if anybody had a tattoo like that on our side, I mean, they scrutinize Pete Heg says tattoos all the time.

[Mark]

Yeah.

[Hogan]

And they weren't even overtly Nazi. They were like Christian Tattoos. So, you know, it's always a thing.

[Mark]

Hi, Mom. I'm not going to ask you if the press coverage is different because it's a Democrat, because I'm just going to stipulate that it is. But I'm going to ask you why. Why is the press not covering not just the tattoo, but all the, all the, they cover the platinum stuff. Not as, like, moral disapproval. They just, at the extent it's covered, it's covered as well. Well, this is a thing that happened and maybe it'll hurt him. But not asking every Democrat in Maine, every Democrat who support, supported, supporting Platner, how can you endorse a guy? Again, not just the tattoo, but his controversial statement. So what's the why, why does the press cover that differently, do you think?

[Jaime]

I mean, look, I, I don't agree with you, but I, I really, I,

[Mark]

I don't know if, if a republic, let's say, let's say, let's say, what would be a race to, to do some, let's say Mike, let's say Mike Rogers had had, up until recently had a Nazi. A Nazi tattoo. Nazi tattoo. And it said all the controversial things as an adult that Platner had. You're saying the press would just cover that as kind of a political curiosity as opposed to something where he should be hounded out of the race?

[Jaime]

I, I, I don't know. I don't know.

[Mark]

Okay.

[Jaime]

And I'm not trying to be insincere here.

[Mark]

Understood.

[Jaime]

And I'm not, and I'm not here to defend Graham Prer. And, and look, I alluded to just a second ago that I was concerned about our candidate choice in some of these races, and I think Maine is one of them. And I've talked about Governor Janet Mill several times with you and with Hogan and with others.

[Mark]

Yes, sir.

[Jaime]

I thought that she would be, have been a stronger candidate for the general election. Well, look, I don't know. And I don't work in, you know, while I was just on cbs, you know, an hour ago, I'm not being paid by CBS or any other media outlet, so I don't know. I can't force them to cover anything. And I'm not gonna, you know, look, I, I don't know. We'll see what happens. And I think it's unfortunate with the way he's portrayed himself. And I, and I, you know, I'm trying to be open ears. I'm not a main voter, but I'm trying to be open ears to his apology and the way he's explaining these things. And, you know, look, I, I, we can, you know, go back and forth with this and say that the media is not covering Kim Paxton in a way that's sincere either, and that's a very tough primary. Yeah, so. So we'll see. I, I don't know. Maybe, you know, maybe as we get into this real general election, you know, the glass will be put on on Graham Pradner in a way that will have these issues come back up to light and have mainstream media covered a little bit more. Not sure.

[Mark]

Do either of you have tattoos?

[Jaime]

I don't.

[Hogan]

I don't either.

[Mark]

Neither of you do. All right, a few more things. Markets are open. They're opened. Lower national gas prices, up 30 cents since last week. Up to 446. Redistricting. A number of southern states are still looking at. We're still waiting for the Virginia Supreme Court to rule on the ballot measure there amidst some concern amongst Democrats that the Supreme Court's going to strike the thing down. We're still looking probably at a net of what, Hogan? After all the redistricting's done, it's a net of what, four or five? Four or five plus.

[Hogan]

And the next time there may be more.

[Mark]

Yeah, but for this cycle, you think It'll end up 4 or 5h.

[Jaime]

Yeah, I think maybe between 2 and 5. It's not huge. Huge net.

[Mark]

Yeah. All right. Finally, gentlemen, I don't know if you saw Saturday Night Live. Olivia Rodrigo was excellent as host and musical guest. And they had a Cash Patel in the cold open. And Cash Patel decided to compete on the entertainment front. Here's a new video from the FBI itself promoting the record of Hogan's friend, Cash Patel.

[Hogan]

The FBI continues its relentless crackdown on fraud.

[Mark]

The FBI cracking down on a massive feeding Our future fraud scheme. Operation Gold rush uncovered nearly $15 billion in false claims.

[Kelly]

The largest health care fraud bust in department history.

[Mark]

Federal agents swarming homes from LA to Sacramento to make arrests in a sophisticated mortgage fraud case.

[Hogan]

FBI director Cash Patel and the bureau

[Mark]

are providing major investigative support. Report to the White House task force to eliminate fraud.

[Hogan]

The hunt continues as agents seize millions in stolen assets nationwide.

[Mark]

FBI agents raided a Bloomington business on Thursday after prosecutors say it billed Medicaid for more than a million dollars worth of services, but didn't do much. The level of fraud in these programs. All right, enough of that. Hi, my first of all, what do you think of that music?

[Jaime]

I'm annoyed. I don't know who that is, but I'm like, sabotage. Beastie Boys, maybe I'm already on edge this morning, but I'm like, turn it down, please.

[Mark]

Yeah, I, I couldn't agree with you more about that. Hogan, would you have greenlighted that video if you were the comms director over at the FBI?

[Hogan]

Quite possibly, depending on what the director would want out of it. I do think, to me, while I, I, I believe the fraud is going to be one leg of a three leg stool in the midterm elections that will determine the outcomes. I think focusing on the children, he found that Joe Biden just completely let go into sex slavery and workhouses and things like that, slave labor, et cetera. Hundreds of thousands. That hotline went to nowhere. You could call and no one ever returned to call. He found those children. While I like the fraud angle, I think leaning in on the children piece of it, stopping crime, crimes down, it's like a 210 decrease. It's crazy numbers. I think crime, children and then fraud or children crime, then fraud would be a better play. But look, I think they're doing great work. But that's me.

[Mark]

I'm a, who are the two greatest FBI directors in the history of the FBI?

[Jaime]

I don't know. I'm trying not to think about FBI directors to be quite honest, and I think they should probably not be thought about. And the fact that having this propaganda video, it's very concerning, like the, just go do your job and then it will speak for itself. But one, one of the, one of the things here that I, I, you know, I just, this, the fraud thing, you know, I get it. You know, Minnesota, if we're looking at one state, this is not something that we're looking at across multiple states. And so are I, I think. Well, I mean let's, well if that's the case, then let's go ahead and put it on the table. I'm, I'm, I'm all for, Look, I am, I am a, I am a government guy. I have worked in government most of my entire career and, and I am all about cutting waste when it's appropriate and making sure that we're serving the American people best possible. And so if that, and if that's going to be something that the Republicans are hanging their hat on, I just don't think it's going to resonate as well. Because you got to, you've got to prove that there's fraud in multiple states and you got to prove that this fraud has hurt the American people or has, or has abused taxpayer money in a way that people are going to care about. And so I, I, I do, you know, want to clean things up as much as possible. I just don't think that that's going to be the, the thing. I wish Cael would just go do his job and stop make videos. I'm sick of talking about him and, and quite frankly, you know, if he's making my life safer, that's all I care about. And I don't, I don't care about his girlfriend or his videos.

[Hogan]

A couple of quick things. This fraud scheme is going across many states, including California, New York, Texas, other places. They are finding it all over the place. And I hate to say it, even when Brooke Rollins, the Secretary of Agriculture, went on TV and said, look at the red state data we have with people's SNAP benefits having, you know, Teslas and Alfa Romeo's and these crazy expensive cars, even though they have government assistance in the red states, that's what we know about. The blue states now are being pulled apart as well with billions, if not trillions of dollars of fraud over the last several years and these governors just completely ignoring it. I think it's a huge thing. On top of that, this is, I think, a good seminal fight to have in the midterm election, which is Democrats. As Jaime said, he's a government guy, right? Most Democrats are government guys. They like a strong local, they like a strong federal, I would argue invasive government. But if that's where you stand, fine. But these programs that they told us are designed to help the downtrodden. They're designed to help American citizens. If they are proven to have lost billions of dollars to people who do not deserve the programs, how could you not be outraged that American citizens who are struggling every single day, who are supposed to be helped out by these very programs designed to do that, aren't getting the money. Like, it blows my mind. And I think Republicans need to hammer that from now until the cows come home. Because for whatever reason, regardless, crime, illegal aliens or fraud in Medicare, Medicaid, SNAP benefits, whatever, they're siding with the criminals and not the victims of the crime. I just think one thing that we

[Jaime]

have someone who's, who's on government. You guys can criticize being a government guy, but look, this is not just about Medicaid and about SNAP benefits. This is also about delivering services like picking up people's trash and filling potholes and making sure that they can pay their taxes. And so, you know, you can criticize, you know, government all you want, but particularly local government provides critical services for the American people that it didn't exist. You guys would agree.

[Mark]

I'm. Stop reading. Stop reading the chat. Hi.

[Hogan]

I agree. I agree with that. But that's my point. You don't need that much money to do all the local things. If all the fraud wasn't occurring somewhere else, you can.

[Mark]

Hogan, who's the greatest FBI director of all time?

[Hogan]

I don't know. I don't like to think of FBI directors either.

[Mark]

All right, all right. Let me ask you some adjectives. Jim Comey, exactly. In the next President United States, do you want the next president United States to look young, yes or no? Just shout out yes or no. Yes. No, but to look young. Look young. Yeah. Energetic.

[Jaime]

Energetic. Yes.

[Hogan]

Energetic, Energetic. I'd say young.

[Mark]

Do you, do you want the new next president United States to fancy wearing fleece? Want the next president to wear fleece?

[Jaime]

When appropriate.

[Mark]

When appropriate. All right. Do you want the next president United States to be.

[Hogan]

Yeah.

[Mark]

Okay. Do you want the next president United States to be friendly?

[Jaime]

That's not necessary.

[Mark]

Not necessary. All right, ladies and gentlemen, finally, before we go to the community, here is someone who would like to be president. A fleece wearing, friendly, energetic. Rahm Emanuel announcing his New Hampshire bike

[Hogan]

trip

[Rahm Emanuel]

5th starting in Portsmouth, New Hampshire. I'll be riding all the way to Hanover, the spin free tour, New Hampshire style. Be meeting people all along the route as I've done on three different trips here in the United States. I love biking as I did as ambassador four different times in Japan and I've done also with my daughter and my wife in Europe. I look forward to hearing from you, seeing you along the route, enjoying different diners, different bed and breakfasts, but also, most importantly, listening, hearing and seeing the beautiful state of New Hampshire June 5th to June 8th. Join. And in addition to that, it's 110 miles. We're going to donate through the foundation in New Hampshire. 110 kids will get a free bike on this door. I can't wait to see you come along for the ride,

[Mark]

man. I haven't seen Rob smile that much in the last 40 years combined. Yeah. What do you think of that video, gentlemen?

[Hogan]

I'll tell you, watching the video now, click as to why I'm not a huge fleece fan. I think this is it.

[Mark]

Yeah.

[Hogan]

Because as he's going through the Northeast, a rabidly liberal area, you will see a lot of fleece up there because it's always cold here in the south. You don't see as much fleece. And this is more real America, I would argue, than the northeast than the elitist acelic corridor that Mark frequents. So I feel that's why I have an aversion to fleece because of what it represents, which is a liberal America that is not real America there.

[Jaime]

Well said, Hogan. Jaime there, I think Rom is having fun for the first time in a while. I don't know. He's enjoying it. And look, he loves that we're talking about him. I've now talked about him for the third time in three weeks. He's getting out there ungarnished. And this video shows that he is serious about being a part of the conversation and he is serious about running for president. He is serious about setting the the philosophical agenda for, for Democrats.

[Mark]

And so can you see this? There's a picture on the front of the Union Leader website. Look at that. Rahm Emanuel. That's not, I don't know, fleece. That's like. What do you call that? Lycra. He looks like he's wearing Lycra. I don't know if I want a president Lycra. Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe that's close minded.

[Hogan]

This one that didn't fall off a bike.

[Mark]

Be nice one one more sad note and then enter to your questions. Newsmax, which has a very close relationship with the Giulianis, says that Rudy Giuliani is on a respirator and he's had trouble, was having severe respiratory distress and that's why he was placed in the a West Palm beach hospital near his home and that he's in intensive care. So we'll continue to monitor that. All right, there's see that from John Huddie at Newsmax. All right, Professor Kenny, welcome in. Tell folks who don't know where you are and what's on your mind for Jaime and for Hogan and thank you for being a great part of our community.

[Professor Kenny]

Thanks, Mark. Mark, don't forget about a baseball game.

[Mark]

Yep.

[Professor Kenny]

Okay. Hey, Jaimer and Hogan in the two way community. And I want to say hi to the youtubers who love me that I'm being facetious. So my question is what the hell is going on with Trump? What the hell are we doing? Can somebody give me an answer because I'm getting confused now. I had a plan, I had a strategy and he's not following it and now I'm concerned. So I don't know why we didn't take Carg island and block this trade four weeks ago. And then I think the ball game would have been over. But what do I know? So can anybody Give me some kind of answer. I know waiting it out is good economically. Look, Iraq is having problems now. Syria, they're all, you know, that whole region's having problems. So what is Trump going to do?

[Jaime]

I'm a. Yeah, I think it's probably one. I. Good to see you. And I agree with you. I think we should have taken some of those steps a couple weeks ago. But I think it's a combination of the two. And I'm interested what Hogan says. One, waiting them out and just sort of trying to see how much pressure, economic pressure they can really take and if they're going to just sort of collapse and not be able to function. And then two, look, I, I think understanding that when we went into this, you know, 50 days ago alone, our Israel wasn't quite enough. And so I do think the president is going to, going to go at it one more time with Europe and others and see if he can pull other people into helping bring it into this thing. And then I think that third piece is trying to see where Asia and how much Asia and China and those guys can stand, stand this and that they're going to step up and, and try to have some sort of economic and military stake in it as well.

[Professor Kenny]

Hogan, before you go, does Trump actually believe he can make a deal?

[Jaime]

Good question.

[Professor Kenny]

With who?

[Hogan]

I think Trump believes he can make a deal because he's had a career making deals. And so he also, though, understands the difficulties and nuance, the dangers of foreign policy and making a deal on this massive scale. You see him with ending all these wars now. So he wants to end this one. He wants that feather in his cap. Russia, Ukraine, he wants this one, too, because he did such amazing work in the Middle east last time. And as we've said on this show, that everybody from Hillary Clinton to Bill Clinton to Kamala Harris to Joe Biden to Barack Obama all said, Israel, excuse me, Iran can't have a nuclear weapon. And he said, all right, I'm gonna make sure they don't have a nuclear weapon. You, Professor Kenny, and your loyal viewership here at two Way have made the point that he should finish the job by using more military activity. I'm not saying he's averse to that. I just think if there is a glimmer of hope for a deal, he's going to try and make one. And notice, too, the media were mad that he was using military options. Then he tries to make a deal with Iran, and then they kind of mock him trying to make a deal with Iran. It's like, well, which do you want? I mean, he's trying to get something accomplished here for the region. I think if he puts the right amount of political pressure and, excuse me, economic pressure and military pressure on them, they would come to the table. But as we've also said, Jaime and myself and I would, I think Mark did to some degree. Unless the people at the negotiating table change, it's going to be hard to change the trajectory of anything moving forward because you, you know, you can't reason, you can't have rational conversation with people who just want to kill you and don't care if they die.

[Jaime]

Yeah.

[Mark]

Yeah. Professor, thank you, John Sterling. John Sterling, the voice of the Yankees passed away. And that's sad. And I do owe you an answer and I apologize. I'll be back to you. All right, Wickham, welcome in. Thank you for being part of Two Way. Tell folks who don't know where you are what's on your mind for. Hi, Hogan and Heimer.

[Wickham]

I think I've unmuted.

[Mark]

Yes, sir.

[Wickham]

Okay, Mark, I recently finished reading the first two volumes of Rick Atkinson's History of the American Revolutionary War, and I'm having a hard time not comparing 18th century America with 21st century Iran and asking questions like, where are the Iranian people? Where is the Thomas Jefferson? Where's the George Washington? Where's the Madison, the Monroe? Where are the thousands of people who went through Valley Forge and the even worse winter at Morristown? What is going on with the Iranian people? And am I mean spirited for even asking that question because the IRGC is so much more difficult than the Brits were.

[Mark]

Yeah, it's a great question. You know, I, I always say the only way you can do this is with somebody like Havel. You need, you need an iconic brave note Mandela. You need a figure like that. It doesn't guarantee success, but I find it kind of incredible that not one person on here, as far as I know, I say it's true of me. Like, people keep asking me, like, why isn't the Shah's son getting more attention? You know, he's not been anointed by anybody. But I agree with you that even though the circumstances are extremely adverse, it would be a lot better if we knew the names of people who could be freedom fighters, who could be the guy who stood up in front of that tank in Tiananmen Square. Could be Havel, could be Mandela. Hogan, where are those folks? Why don't we know of people, even people who are even people besides the Shah's son who are in London or the United States.

[Hogan]

Well, remember, a lot of those people locally were murdered.

[Mark]

I understand, I understand. But even, but even, but even then we should know some of their names.

[Hogan]

I mean, I guess, but we know them at what, posthumously? I'm not sure.

[Mark]

Yeah, possibly say this guy was the Thomas Jefferson of Iran and he was killed.

[Hogan]

But remember, but remember, they shut down the Internet over there so no one can.

[Mark]

I know.

[Hogan]

You know, then that's the answer. But also, I think on the back side of this, if we can come to some type of agreement, there's a good chance you hear about those names, you learn about those people who actually were the forebearers of the peace that we could hopefully achieve over there. But right now, like you said, Wickham, and I appreciate the question. No, you're not, you're not hateful to ask where they are. I'm sure they're there. But remember, this is a regime that has been, you know, strangle in stranglehold of their populace for a long time. Hanging people publicly, killing people publicly. So it's not like you, you find out and you throw them into jail and that's kind of the end of it. They kill them out in the open and that's what they do. So it does quash a little bit. Now, they did that, you know, in England back in the day, too, to people who would dare sniff of a revolution. So I get it. But it's easier when our people came, you know, our, the founding fathers came to this country and we're looking around going, wait a minute, England's not necessarily here. Let's figure out what to do. They can't kill us on the spot, whereas you're in the middle of it over there. It's a different, different scenario. But I, but I appreciate the question, Jaime.

[Jaime]

Yeah, I completely agree with Hogan. Only I will add what Canessa, Very good question is. I don't think the Iranian people or any of us are going to be able to hold our breath and wait for some great hope out of Iran as it stands.

[Mark]

Yeah, yeah. Wickham, thank you. Great question, Important topic. And again, I just think a revolution requires somebody like that and maybe multiple somebody's. Kelly, welcome in. On mute. Up against the clock. So, quick question, if you would. Thank you for being here.

[Kelly]

Thank you. I think we have a marketing problem and I say we. But if I was going to get to speak, speak to the president and to the Republicans running for the midterms, I would say, Mr. President, when you speak to the press, pool today. And they say, Mr. President, what about the straight. Mr. President, I would say take a deep breath. Did you. Did you enjoy that breath? It's because you weren't annihilated by a nuclear weapon. And I would keep pushing that message because I think the message that if I Google News Iran, all I'm going to see is, this is a problem. This is a problem. This is a problem. And what you don't get any credit for is preventing something like a 9 11, preventing something like a nuclear weapon destroying you. So I think that is huge. And then I would pivot to say, as we talk, I know we're up against the clock, but as we talk about the midterms, to say, we are. We. I want to fix problems. And if you had all the information that I had, you'd be making the exact same move that I'm making right now is what I would say from the top down. But then to say, as far as midterms goes, that, that, that we have a party that wants to fix problems. So there was a border problem, so we fixed it. No one wanted dyes and chemicals in the grocery store. So we're solving that. You've been ripped off by medicine prices. Okay, solving it. And now you introduce new solutions. And the two that I, I'm so big on is one. We said we wanted to eliminate the Department of Education. Okay, guess what? Now we're going to send $10,000 for every single teacher. This is what. And the president says, I can't do this myself, but if you, if you hire these congressmen, if you hire these.

[Mark]

Kelly, tell us your. Tell us, tell us your second one. And then we got to.

[Kelly]

And the second one. And the second one is the solution for cutting health care premiums, which we'll have to have a whole talk about that. I've done research and.

[Mark]

Kelly, thank you. Thank you, Kelly. Thank you. Hogan, quick thought on what Kelly said.

[Hogan]

Some good messaging points. I would quibble with one piece where you said that, you know, President Trump should say, look, if everyone else, if they had my information, they did the exact same thing. Other presidents did have that information. They did nothing. That's the difference here. He's trying to change things, change the structure, change the dynamic over there. But I think Jaime and the Democrat Party is so good at arguing people. Republicans get caught arguing policy. We need to, we need to do a better job of. You just said the criminal activity in these city streets, we cleaned it up. The mass migration, taking away our resources and, and healthcare and first responders all

[Mark]

right, we gotta stop. We gotta stop. We gotta stop. We gotta stop. Sorry. Up against the clock. Noon. Thank you, Kelly. Noon today, Citizen McCain. Janiah Thomas is amongst Megan's guests. Two way tonight, five o' clock tonight, full coverage of everything. Tomorrow morning on the morning meeting on this Week, where we expect to unveil the announcement about the new co hosts, Eric ERICKSON and Melissa DeRosa coming on. And gentlemen, thank you both. I'm headed over to Sirius XM now for our second hour. Join me there, please. If you'd like to get in on the conversation on SiriusXM, please call me there. And I'll see you at 5 tonight, guys. Thank you. See you soon.

[Hogan]

See you guys.