32 Final Thoughts

Summary

32 Thoughts: The Podcast – “32 Final Thoughts”

Date: July 6, 2026
Hosts: Elliotte Friedman & Kyle Bukauskas (Sportsnet)

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EPISODE OVERVIEW

The final episode of the 2025-26 NHL season is a marathon summer extravaganza. Dubbed the “32 Thoughts Summer Bonanza,” Elliotte and Kyle conduct one last sweep through all 32 NHL teams – offering final takes, recapping seismic contract moves, and forecasting what’s ahead. The main headline is the landscape-shattering Leo Carlson offer sheet, with ripple effects dissected throughout. The episode also features the final “Thought Line” segment with listener shout-outs and trivia. The tone is casual, reflective, and at times punchy—filled with trademark banter, deep hockey insight, and a sense of gratitude for another memorable season.

STRUCTURE

• Timestamps are provided for each team’s opening segment and notable moments
• Sections:
  1. Opening Banter & Main Storylines
  2. Tour of All 32 Teams (alphabetical – first 16, then final 16)
  3. The Final Thought Line: Listener Questions & Shoutouts
  4. Closing Reflections

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1. OPENING BANTER & MAIN STORYLINES

[00:31]
Kyle and Elliotte set the scene: “One final bash before settling into the off season in earnest.”
Main Event: The Leo Carlson offer sheet (5 yrs/$90M, $18M AAV) from the Flyers is the story of the summer—and the episode.

“This is the offer sheet, Elliot, that changes the business of hockey as we know it.”
—Kyle [02:42]

Elliotte’s Take on Offer Sheets & Changing NHL Business:

• The mega-offer reveals the new “shark” mentality among ownership/GMs.
• Younger players are less afraid to leverage power (trade requests, mobility, big contract asks).
• “The lesson that everybody learned is take care of your business before someone does it for you.”
  —Elliotte [03:42]
• Stresses ripple effect: every club now feels “more vulnerable than ever.”
• Anecdotes: Owners like Tom Dundon, Bill Foley, Vinnie Viola always seeking an edge.
• Anaheim misread the urgency and scale of the Carlson negotiation.

[09:50]
Kyle raises the aftermath: “That throws a wrench into whatever your vision is... If they don’t match, does that not throw a bit of a wrench in the Flyers too?”

Elliotte:

• Ducks have “no choice” but to match: “If they give up Leo Carlson, they will spend the next five years looking for Leo Carlson — and may not even find him.” [11:46]
• Refers to historic Scott Stevens/St. Louis and “if you have the guy, keep the guy.”

“If you come out and say we’re going to match any offer, and you don’t, nobody’s going to believe you again.”
—Elliotte [13:47]

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2. TEAM-BY-TEAM FINAL THOUGHTS

ANAHEIM DUCKS [02:42]

Theme: Carlson offer sheet; looming roster upheaval

• Ducks blindsided by scale of the Flyers’ offer.
• Losses: Captain Gudis (to Florida), McTavish and Zellweger traded.
• New signings: Minov signed 5 yrs, but at an “inflated” rate due to offer sheet threat (“everything changed overnight” [19:11]).
• Ducks must move salary (e.g., Kreider, Vatrano) to accommodate the new cap pressure if they match.
• Ducks' negotiating posture now “changed forever.”

BOSTON BRUINS [19:20]

• Swayman’s bounce-back “huge success.”
• Paterka trade: “That should work” with Pastrnak (potential “dangerous” pairing).
• Deepening the blue line, but still wants more offensive creativity.
• Pavel Zacha’s looming extension: “Now those are big tickets, Kyle.” [23:55]
• Atlantic Division forecast: “A lot of carnage to be had.”

BUFFALO SABRES [26:40]

• Young core emerging: “Restored respect to the sword.”
• Respect from big names: Hellebuyck, Trocheck expressed interest; not the case just a year ago.
• Byram traded out due to contract demands.
• Focus: Internal growth — Benson, Doane, Quinn, Helenius “have to continue to go.”
• Quinn, Krebs RFA situations; “Carlson’s contract is going to be a comparable... everything’s changed.”

CALGARY FLAMES [32:58]

• Rebuild mode: “They’ve accepted their fate.”
• Key negotiation: Nemetz’s contract shifts due to Menshikov's inflation elsewhere.
• Question: “Why isn’t a contender knocking harder for Zach Whitecloud?”
• Huberdeau surgery update: Wait till September.
• Farewell for beloved Saddle Dome; “special season for fans.”

CAROLINA HURRICANES [40:33]

• Stanley Cup champions, “not a lot of holes.”
• Nikishin’s contract drama: trade traction with Rangers & St. Louis, but “contracted stalled.”
• Creative thinking: Rumored to be considering an offer sheet-trade maneuver with another high-profile young player ("could we offer sheet and flip them after?”).
• “They are trying to add something big.”

“For a team that just won the Cup, they don’t have a lot of holes... whatever they’re trying to do is big.” —Elliotte [41:00]

CHICAGO BLACKHAWKS [48:41]

• Bedard: Cautious optimism after awkward summer injury; ‘hide the pens’ from offer sheets.
• Byram extension (6x$12.5M)—highest-paid D (for now).
• Adding KHL scoring leader Kanitsarov.
• Young D core: “They are loaded, but it’s hard to take the step.”
• Will be “hunting for forwards” as market evolves.

COLORADO AVALANCHE [54:36]

• President’s Trophy winners, “judged in postseason.”
• Cale Makar can extend: “I’ll bet you he does not max out—he leaves a little cap flexibility.” [55:19]
• Big focus: Integrating young talent into an aging core (“need some younger blood”).
• Goalie speculation: “Some say they took a shot at Hellebuyck.”

COLUMBUS BLUE JACKETS [61:34]

• Zach Werenski trade saga: “boiled over in a glass case of emotion.”
• Werenski almost dealt to Dallas, “but when it hit the social media whirlwind, you’re not ready if you’ve never been through it before.”
• Marchenko returning; “ticks” before internal clock for playoff push expires.
• Arbitration cases: “a big part of their team, they really value [Cole] Sillinger and Greaves.”

DALLAS STARS [71:30]

• Jason Robertson files for arbitration; hasn't yet bridged gap with Dallas (“wants ~14M”; team wants lower).
• "They’re not panicked from the outside tumult — they still feel like a destination."
• Young depth replacing roster churn vital: “You need some guys that aren’t making Jason Robertson money.”
• “Veteran-laden group but looking for internal help.”

DETROIT RED WINGS [77:16]

• Dylan Larkin trade request lingers.
• Leo Carlson offer sheet “made Larkin even more valuable; Iserman will only draw the line harder now.” [77:48]
• Wants current players back, not just futures.
• Debrincat, Raymond, Seider contracts are future team cornerstones.
• “Red Wings suddenly at a crossroads.”

EDMONTON OILERS [85:25]

• Goalie carousel: Freddie Andersen, Devon Levi join Tristan Jarry.
• Defense overhaul: “Eight guys on one-way deals.”
• Darnell Nurse moved—departure orchestrated smoothly.
• Kapanen and Dickinson re-signings: “Kapanen is playoff guy; keep doing that.”
• Team needs “a break.” McDavid-Babcock dynamic “must-see” (power play drama looms).

FLORIDA PANTHERS [94:27]

• Goalie reboot: Markstrom, Schmid acquired—return of “Cat Attack.”
• Rob Tallis as key goalie coach, believed in Markstrom since the start.
• “They defend really well. They should win the division.”
• Youth infusion wanted but “they are going to be a beast.”

LOS ANGELES KINGS [100:11]

• New coach Peter Laviolette; added Hala, Zuccarello, Lawton, Perry.
• Front office conspicuously leaves flexibility: “They’re keeping the bank vault ready for an L.A.-type move.”
• Next wave must step up: “Byfield has to become a point-per-game guy; Clark is going to play more.”
• Special teams must improve.

MINNESOTA WILD [105:00]

• GM Bill Guerin’s big swing for Larkin stymied by Detroit’s “current player” ask.
• “He won’t give up until the player is his or goes elsewhere.”
• Internal improvement (Shabanov, Yurov) and 3-yr prediction for Quinn Hughes’ extension.
• Guerin always has another move brewing.

MONTREAL CANADIENS [110:47]

• Demidov’s contract looks like a home run after the Carlson offer sheet.
• “Their contract situation is excellent.”
• Aggressively chasing a young-ish top 6 forward via trade.
• Progress from Kapanen, potential fits (e.g., Rust, Raquel) discussed.

NASHVILLE PREDATORS [119:35]

• Chris MacFarland’s first offseason: “Let’s just add talent.”
• Not chasing “crazy” moves unless warranted.
• Blueprint: Strong down the middle + skill on the blue line (“from his Colorado roots”).
• Committed to treating veterans with respect amid trade rumors.

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3. THE FINAL THOUGHT LINE [123:40]

Listener Shoutouts, Banter, Trivia:

• Heartfelt thanks to listeners, sportsnet Stats team, and all who make the show possible.
• Banter about age/senior rates at golf courses and the “leaders eat last” tradition — “Dom was right to eat the pizza” at the draft. [128:09]
• Interesting listener questions include:
  • Most international players in a team’s draft class (Vancouver tied record with 8 countries).
  • Over-35 contracts: “No rule against long term contracts for older players—just rules on bonus structure and cap calculation.”
  • RFA non-qualifying status: “Whether you become a UFA or stay an RFA depends on age and accrued NHL seasons.”

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4. FINAL 16 CLUBS (“PART TWO”) [141:30+]

• New Jersey Devils:

  • Aggressive on offer-sheeting Barrett Hayton (Utah).
  • Emphasis on getting tougher, more snarl “down the middle”; nice Heischer extension.
  • Amadeus Lombardi trade an under-the-radar step.

• New York Islanders:

  • “Beginning to turn over the team,” want internal prospects (Eklund, George) unblocked.
  • “Calls on Horvat and Barzal, but those contracts just became more valuable.”

• New York Rangers:

  • Defense upgraded (Fox, Gavrikov, Derzy, Pedersen).
  • Rebuilt scoring with Dorofeyev, but losing Trocheck leaves a hole; betting on Lafreniere’s next step.
  • Albert Smith (5th overall) is “ready; may push for NHL minutes.”

• Ottawa Senators:

  • Post-Kachuk era.
  • Must maximize the “incredibly valuable” Stützle and Sanderson contracts: “You have to go for it at age 24.”
  • Positive on Batherson, Zub, and the “Great” Pinto deal; Giroux perhaps waiting for Philly unless wowed.

• Philadelphia Flyers:

  • Leaders behind the Carlson offer sheet: “They badly wanted the player.”
  • “Not afraid to make bold moves — true to the Flyers’ DNA.”
  • Must now protect future key contracts from poaching; Zegras and Drysdale arbitration provides temporary buffer.

“The Flyers were always proud of that part of their legacy—We do bold stuff. We’re not afraid.” —Elliotte [185:56]

• Pittsburgh Penguins:

  • “Breathed new life into the organization” after a strong return to form.
  • Adding prime-age talent is the focus; savvy connects with hints they pursued Jason Robertson, might fit with Elias Pettersson if available.
  • Optimism for Nick Robertson to thrive post-trade; Chinnikov extension a big win.

• San Jose Sharks:

  • “Darlings of the draft” but must prep for Celebrini’s future extension in a post-Carlson world.
  • “They preferred Nurse over Reilly” for blue-line stability.
  • Offense is “absolutely loaded” — Will Smith, Chernishov, Marchment, Misa can elevate.
  • D contracts judged by ability to help core youth grow.

• Seattle Kraken:

  • Shane Wright likely to be moved; “time for a fresh start.”
  • Future lies in young core (Catton, Beniers, Neumann, etc.)
  • Looming decisions on vets (Vince Dunn, McCann); maximize asset returns.
  • “Everything is fixable, even if you have to go backwards to go forwards.”

• St. Louis Blues:

  • Thomas, Buchnevich, Holloway, McTavish, Dvorsky headline what could be an “incredibly dangerous forward group.”
  • Contracts are all well-timed and manageable; internal offense must step up post-Kyrou.

• Tampa Bay Lightning:

  • Kucherov enters the final contract year—extension “will be fascinating.”
  • Top heavy on big minutes; need regression from Point/Headman.
  • Still believed to have “more to give”, with some growth expected from Sam O’Reilly and Co.
  • Brought in John Carlson; “great rep for player development.”

• Toronto Maple Leafs:

  • Drastically different team for new era; Bobrovsky in and loads of depth moves.
  • “Still hopeful to add another difference maker; didn’t give up futures, kept powder dry.”
  • “Matthews is the bus driver of this team.”
  • Will not pay a big sweetener to unload Riley.
  • “Not going to be boring — could be boom or bust, but returning players feel much better.”

• Utah Mammoth:

  • Barrett Hayton offer sheet is current focus.
  • Strong internal contract structure (Cooley, Gunther, Schmaltz, McBain all on great deals).
  • Brought in Trocheck (“a big win — willing to waive for Utah this time”); Lee adds net-front presence missing against Vegas.
  • Prospect timeline (Iginla, Wyat).
  • “They are in really good shape going forward.”

• Vancouver Canucks:

  • Turning the page under Manny Malhotra, Rian Johnson.
  • “Redefining what it means to be a Canuck” after several beaten-down years.
  • Bluger’s departure underlines need for rejuvenated internal culture.
  • Prioritizing development of young talent over short-term wins.
  • “If you know why you’re here, maybe we shine you up and you go somewhere else, but the kids are more important right now.”

• Vegas Golden Knights:

  • Familiar faces return, but expected to be “in the mix” all summer for moves.
  • Rasmus Andersson extension a key business, replacing Dorofeyev.
  • Mark Stone/Wm. Karlsson contracts are next up; “they keep who they want, but Father Time is undefeated.”
  • Shea Theodore “ran out of gas” but was spectacular all year.

• Washington Capitals:

  • Ovechkin “coming back for another year” not a surprise.
  • With Kyrou, Tuck, and improved young core (Leonard, Hudson, etc.), team should “take a big jump.”
  • “Fascinated to see Ovechkin’s role — a tougher roster to score against.”

• Winnipeg Jets:

  • “Canada still the golden goose — don’t take them for granted, NHL.”
  • Youth needs to step: Lambert, Rosén, Salomonsson.
  • Serious about winning, but “biggest key is bounce back.”
  • Uncertainty over Hellebuyck: “going to be hard to convince him to stay.”
  • Belleville goalie Skinner added; Perfetti contract a priority.

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5. CLOSING: FINAL REFLECTIONS [257:17+]

• Deep gratitude to the 32 Thoughts team, listeners, and production staff.
  • “We have a great listenership… but what always makes work best is the people you work with.” — Elliotte Friedman
• Reflect on the season’s nearly year-long journey (“this was a long season”).
• Nostalgic nods to travels, late nights, and memorable segments (pizza in Buffalo, overalls in Vegas, syrup shots in Moncton).
• Final sign-offs: “Have a great summer, everybody!”

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NOTABLE QUOTES & MEMORABLE MOMENTS

• On the New NHL:

  “The league has changed in a lot of ways... This is the offer sheet that changes the business of hockey as we know it.”
  —Kyle, [02:42]

• On Carlson Offer Sheet Fallout:

  “If you give up Leo Carlson, you will spend the next five years looking for Leo Carlson—and may not even find him.”
  —Elliotte, [11:46]

• On Club Philosophy:

  “No trade is better than a bad trade. If Iserman has to start the year with Larkin based on what he’s getting, then he'll do it.”
  —Elliotte, [77:48]

• Listener Banter—“Dom was right to eat the pizza”:

  “Dom was soldiering away as your producer... Leaders eat last. Congrats on another great season!”
  —Eno in Petawawa, via Thought Line, [128:09]

• On Philadelphia’s Boldness:

  “This is what Ed Snider’s vision always was. True to their identity. I think for Flyers fans that’s important.”
  —Elliotte, [186:45]

• Classic Bit on Length:

  “We just did this podcast. I have no idea if it made any sense… At this point the only ones listening are you, me, and Dom.”
  —Elliotte, [256:21]

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SUMMARY TAKEAWAYS

• The offer-sheet arms race is now real: The Leo Carlson/Philadelphia move and contract size signal a new era of boldness, leverage, and market tilting across the NHL.
• Contracts done in the last two years (e.g., Stützle, Sanderson, Demidov, Hudson) suddenly look like incredible home runs as the salary landscape explodes.
• Focus for most teams is now on locking down tentpole players ASAP — and expecting the unexpected as the market volatility continues.
• Younger generations of players are more aggressive about their leverage; new-wave owners and GMs think like “corporate sharks.”
• Multiple franchises (Anaheim, Utah, Montreal, Vancouver, Ottawa) face existential crossroads shaped by these seismic shifts.
• The show closes with a heartfelt reflection on another season of NHL storytelling and thanks to the audience for making it a “long year, but a special one.”

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FOR FANS WHO MISSED THE EPISODE:

This jam-packed season finale offers crucial context on how the Leo Carlson contract changed everything, comprehensive insight into every single franchise’s next challenge, witty banter, and an open love letter to the fabric of hockey fandom. Whether your interest is the Ducks’ crisis, Flyers' boldness, or how the salary tsunami affects your team’s future, this is essential listening—or, with this summary, essential reading.

Transcript

[Kyle]

Because I just picture you when you get into your zone. What are you doing? You're pacing. So I thought, oh, treadmill be a perfect place to work. You just keep walking.

[Elliot]

I don't like that. I don't like people who do that. People don't want to work out. They don't want to hear you on the phone.

[Kyle]

I don't know. You're a popular guy in your gym, though, by the way.

[Elliot]

I got to tell you something. I know. We're going way. Sorry. We'll get back to the Flyers a second.

[Kyle]

Yeah, this is a great pod to just go on random tangents on.

[Elliot]

By the way, this is a nice, short pod. There's plenty of time.

[Kyle]

Welcome to 32 Thoughts, the podcast presented by your Canadian Toyota dealers and the 2026 Tacoma. It's time to Toyota. Dom, Elliott and Kyle, back with you. We hope you enjoyed your Canada Day celebrations, your fourth of July weekend, or whatever you may have been celebrating over the past week, wherever we find you here today. Welcome now to the 32 thoughts summer bonanza. One final bash before settling into the off season in earnest. Elliot, how are you feeling?

[Elliot]

I have a feeling I'm going to be doing even more talking here than normal.

[Kyle]

Yes, this is a big one. A tour through all 32 clubs. We've got one final thought line for the year.

[Elliot]

Did you have too many chalk wagon cheers at the Stampede on the weekend?

[Kyle]

Man, it wasn't even that. It's just the venue is so loud. You try to talk to anybody and you've got a scream. So I was out at one of the tents Saturday night. Nothing outrageous. But there were a lot of podcast listeners who also enjoy Stampede Weekend. I learned that over the weekend, too, big boy.

[Elliot]

Well, we are always thankful to our podcast listeners and we will do shout outs in the thought line. But, Kyle, this is a reminder. Conserve your voice. Dana does not want to talk to you.

[Kyle]

I know, I know. That's why I'm trying to save it for this. And I couldn't even do that over the weekend, man. It caught me by surprise, I've got to say.

[Elliot]

All right, so I'm going to do some of the heavier lifting. Do you have intros written for. We're going to go alphabetical order. We're going to do the first 16 teams in the league. We're going to do the thought line. We have a couple of shout outs, and then we're going to do the final 16 teams in the league and say goodbye. This will be our final podcast of the 202526 season. Kyle, do you have any special way that you want to intro the teams or is that not a thing here?

[Kyle]

Yeah, I can set you up as we go along here, no problem. Fridge. So we thought we would go alphabetically because that allows us to start in Anaheim, where the biggest story so far of the summer hit the other day when Leo Carlson signs the offer sheet with the Flyers. Five years, $90 million, about 85 million in bonuses. Set to become the highest paid player in the league at 18 million. AAV. This is the offer sheet, Elliot, that changes the business of hockey as we know it. So what's the latest?

[Elliot]

Well, first of all, the latest is Steph says that I am supposed to be on vacation as of July 2nd. And when that offer sheet came down on July 3rd, she gave me the biggest stink eye I have received in months.

[Kyle]

And that's saying something.

[Elliot]

Yes. Now, you could imagine how many stink eyes someone who would be married to me would give me and take the over. Whatever you think, take the over. This was as lingering a stink eye as I have received in some time. And it wasn't even my fault. The biggest lesson that everybody learned is take care of your business before someone does it for you. This league has changed in a lot of ways. We've talked about the changes in players, right? That this generation, they're not afraid to stand up trade requests. I know not everybody likes it, but that's what they do. They stand up for themselves. And it starts, you know, I was talking about this with Nick and Justin last week. My son's a musician, play a lot of team sports. He's not as interested in them, which is fine. We always support him whatever he does. He's a very talented kid. So I'm not really in the youth sports world, but if you follow NCAA football or basketball, those sports, you see the way players transfer and a lot of youth teams now, if you're in youth sports, you see the way kids move from team to team. That sort of way of living at the youth level has reached professional sports and now the NHL. And I think the other thing that has changed is that ownership and GMs are changing. GMs have different philosophies now. They come from more different backgrounds. Owners come from the business world. Now, look, it's. Bettman said, if Houston's coming in at the Board of governors, it's 3.5 billion between the team and the arena. If you're spending that kind of money, you come from the kind of corporate background where you are a Shark. You do whatever you can to beat whoever you have to beat in your field of choice, and that is going to extend to hockey. The owner whose team just won the Stanley Cup, Tom Dundon, you know, he is fits that to a tee. He will do anything he can to get an edge on any other competitor. Bill Foley, who owns the Vegas Golden Knights, Vinnie Viola, whose team won two consecutive Stanley Cups in Florida, they are guys constantly looking for the tightest edge, and they are three of the newest owners in the league. I think the way teams do business with each other is changing. And, you know, here's the thing. And Pat Verbeek and the Docs, they recognized a threat, but they didn't recognize how big it was. They were out there saying, look, if anyone offers sheets, Leo Carlson, we are going to match. But I don't think they thought it was going to go here. I don't think they thought it was going to go to 18. And that is the lesson that everybody learns now, is that we better take care of our business, we better know our business, we better be sure of our business, because we are now more vulnerable than ever. The NHL is changing. The morning the offer sheet came Friday morning, there was. I don't know if it was a phone call, a zoom call, what it was exactly, but there was a call between the Ducks and Carlson, Carlson's representatives, the father and son duo of Ryan and Matt Cater. And in there, the docs offered. I wrote between 12 and 13, I think it was around 12, 5, and I believe the counter was in the area of 15. And in that moment, Carlson and his representatives know what they've got. They know they've got something. They know they've got options. The Duck said no, and they didn't recognize how serious it was. And if you're the Flyers in this case, and we'll get to them in a minute or somewhere down the pod, alphabetically. You know, you have to blow the Ducks out of the water. You know, you can't just come in there offering 15. You got to blow them out of the water. And that's what they did. And, you know, the thing is, like Pat Verbeek, I think he's got a really good eye for talent. I think he's got a really good eye for how to put a team together. But he didn't see this coming. And now it has changed the trajectory of the Ducks. He has lost control, unfortunately for him, of the structure of his organization. Who knows where this goes, but the Ducks might never be the same. And every team is looking at this and saying, we cannot allow this to happen to us. Let this be a lesson to us. And you know, they were really hard negotiators. The only deal that was easy, for lack of a better term, was Jackson Lacombe. He was the one guy they went to and said eight times nine. And at the time, you know, there's no way that Jackson Lacombe was saying no to that. McTavish was a tough negotiation. Drysdale was a tough negotiation. Zegras was a tough negotiation. You know, Carlson as rep saw this all and you know, the one thing another team told me was that before they signed any offer sheet, he was going to. They were going to give go to Verbeek and say, we're going to have one last conversation about getting this done. And they did. And again, like we said a couple times, Kyle, the Ducks just didn't see the danger.

[Kyle]

And now the dangers hit them. Because as you say now, they did get Minov signed here on Sunday to a five year extension. So that business is done. They still got to do G some point down the line. Beckett Senica will come into the fray here as well. But you talk about, I mean, of course, 18 million. That throws a wrench into whatever your vision is in terms of a team salary cap structure. If you're Pat Verbeek, I mean, if they don't match here, does that not throw a bit of a wrench in the Flyers too? I mean, obviously they know what they're getting into. They did the deal. But you've still got a big number we haven't seen before come into not only your organization and your payroll, but also the dressing room and how all that plays out.

[Elliot]

There's so many different things. That's an interesting one. I think the we'll talk about the Flyers part of it in a minute, but the first thing. And we'll get to Minov too. Like, there's so much to talk about here. Like Verbeek, he's like wizard of Oz, right? He's like Dorothy, oh my God, we're not in. The tornado hits and oh my God, we're not in Anaheim anymore. Like, that's what it's got to be like for him. Because, you know, all of a sudden the Carlson news comes down and then the rumors come that people are going to offer sheet Menshikov. Like, you've got to be sitting there going, holy cow, like, which hole do I plug first? Okay, first of all, the offer sheet, I could be proven wrong. They have to match it. They have to. I don't think they have a choice. If they give up Leo Carlson, they will spend the next five years looking for Leo Carlson

[Kyle]

and may not even

[Elliot]

find them and may not even find him. I just, I just don't think you can do it. I think you, I. There's a couple things I remember. Number one, David Po, he got five first rounders when St. Louis off receded Scott Stevens and he always regretted it. He regretted it. He says those picks were not worth Scott Stevens. Scott Stevens went to St. Louis and then under the old systems they lost him as compensation to New Jersey when they signed Brendan Shanahan and Scott Stevens almost single handedly changed the New Jersey Devils. You know, you, Washington, you know, Poyle said if he could go back in time he would keep the player. I don't know that Leo Carlson is going to be Scott Stevens, but do you know how hard it is to find number one centers? I think you have to match it. I do. I don't think they have a choice. And the second thing is, and I remember this is a story Brian Burke told me there was one year he had Mike Camilleri and he said, I'm not trading Mike Camilleri for anything less than a third round pick. And Camiller was a UFA and it was in Calgary and he held onto him. And I said, why didn't you just trade him? I heard you could have gotten like a fifth forum. And he said if I say I'm not trading him for less than a third and I trade him for a fifth unless I have like a humanitarian reason to do it, people are going to think I'm a liar. They're going to say, oh, he's a, he's just a big talker. He's going to say third and ten minutes before the deadline we're going to get him for a pick that's lower. He said, I won't do that. I'm not doing it. And I think about that conversation when I think about Verbeek now they came out, they said we're going to match. If they don't match, nobody's going to believe Verbeek again. He won't be, you know, like people will look at him and say that's what he said and then that's what he did. You know, Verbeek was one of the toughest players ever, man. He never took a step backward. I know this is different, but if you come out and say we're going to match any offer and you don't, and I'll be honest Like, I don't think, I think the Ducks thought they were talking about 15 million to match. I don't think they saw 18 anywhere. I just, I don't think they saw this coming. But I think you have to match. I'm sure he's looking around now and saying, look, if I get four picks, what can I do with these picks? You would have to show me

[Kyle]

how

[Elliot]

it would make sense to give up on this player. And this is the guy. When they ended up second in that lottery and everybody knew Bedard was going first to Chicago, Pat Verbeek told his staff, we are taking Leo Carlson. No matter what I say publicly, we are taking Leo Carlson. This is his guy. This was the linchpin to his rebuild that knocked out the two time defending Western Conference champions. I now don't forget people are talking about they've only got 10 million now after signing Minchukov, you can go 10% over the cap in the summer. You deal with what you have to deal with now. You know, it's going to be interesting. You know, he, he might have to move like he's got three guys with some degree of no trade protection, Crider, Kalorn, Vetrano, he might have to move one or two of them, maybe all three of them. It's really going to hurt the depth of his club. And you're right, like somewhere down the road, whether it's go chase who scored 41 goals last year, now Go J can sign an offer sheet. But you know, when I was talking about guys who may not be 18 but now they might think they're 14 or 15, like go chase probably one of those guys 41 goals and go chase a guy who already told one team, I'm not coming here. And then you've got Seneca who had a 60 point rookie season. You know, Daniel Briere isn't even in the Western Conference and he just changed the course of history for a potential Western Conference contender. You know, like this is going to make Minchukov even more important now. This is going to make Tristan Luno even more important now. Luno, 22 year old defenseman who's pretty close to being ready. You know, all of a sudden he's going to be. Anaheim kept their roster a little bit bare bones to try to protect from this and still they walked into a bad spot. Luno's going to be 22 year old right hand D who's NHL ready. Like he's going to have to be a big player for them. The other thing too is now like they just signed Greer four years at four and a quarter. Jeff Malott three years at 1.85. If this had happened three or four days ago, I don't know if they would have been able to sign those guys.

[Kyle]

And I mean, they've lost their captain. Right. Gudis is now back in Florida. They traded Zellweger, traded McTavish, but you can't stop the momentum of what they accomplished last year as a group. But this certainly throws a wrench into things. Anything else about Carlson specifically here?

[Elliot]

No, I just want to do Menchikov a bit. I don't think so. I, I, I think we just wait and I'm sure Verbeek will explore all avenues, but I think he's got no choice. I think he has to match it.

[Kyle]

I'm with you. And he's got till Friday to make a decision. Seven days.

[Elliot]

So Menshikov. Now there was a report that came out that said Anaheim had been called and told they were getting an offer sheet. I've heard some dispute on whether or not that actually happened. I think a team was at least considering it and I assume that team was Carolina. But I had heard earlier on Sunday morning that Anaheim had made the commitment they were going to sign him. Now what's interesting is I was talking with one of the salary gurus in the league and he said the word was that Anaheim. So they traded Zellweger to Buffalo and he signed for, I think three times 3.1. He thinks that's where the Ducks were with Minchukov before the offer sheet. And then all of a sudden it was like Brent Clark, which is 5 times 7.4, and Minchukov ended up at 5 times 7.2. Like it just, it just showed you how much everything changed. Everything.

[Kyle]

Inflation hits almost overnight, coupled with a salary cap that shot up to 104. It's a brand new world.

[Elliot]

It's a brand new world.

[Kyle]

Okay, the Boston Bruins so get back into the playoffs last year, lost out to Buffalo in the first round. They make a draft day trade for J.J. peterka. He's got a fellow countryman as the head coach in Marco Sturm. Lot of additions, depth wise to their blue line to kind of begin the off season here. Fre, where are you at with Boston and Don Sweeney's plans moving forward?

[Elliot]

So I think one of the more like the number one thing that happened to Boston that was good last year was that we kind of thought that Swayman would return after one bad year and be Swayman again. And he was, I think that was A huge success for the Bruins. And I think, you know that he's going to be your rock on paper. Paterka, Pasternock, they should be fantastic together. You know, Paterka is an interesting guy. Let's. Let's put it that way. He's extremely talented. It was time at the end of his stay in Buffalo. It was absolutely time he had to go for him and them. And I just heard it wasn't a great fit this year in Utah. But, you know, whether it's Zaka playing first line center between them or Lindholm playing first line center between them or anyone else, you have to look at Pasternak and Paterka and say that should work. And to be honest, like, I do think, I do think a lot of people in hockey, especially fans, they overrate. And even media, I shouldn't say only fans. I think media does too. I've thought a lot about this. I think we overrate late first rounders. Like, I think if, if you're going to get a guy like Paterka and you're going to give up a late first rounder, I think that's a, a fair price to pay for somebody who could have the impact that he has it. Like we, again, we talked in this interview, Yarmouth kick a line about the chart and those early 20s picks, they're much more hit or miss than you realize. So I think that was a worthwhile gamble for Boston, you know, But I think I look at their young guys like Minton took a big step this year. I think he has to do another Haggins. I think that's a big one for me. I still look at this team and I say I'd feel a lot better about them if they had a little more offensive creativity. And Haggins is the guy who can believe it. Like, even if he doesn't hit the ground running next year, as long as at some point next season he begins to make an impact, I'd feel a lot better about this team. I agree with you about their defensive depth. I think it looks not bad. They did take a swing at Darnell Nurse. That didn't work. You know, there's, there's a couple things here that are going to be interesting. So Busi was a really good goalie in their system who had a chance and they moved him out and, you know, Florida lost him on waivers to Carolina and they saw him win the Stanley cup this year. And I think the Bruins deserve some credit for recognizing, let's give our guy in our system a Shot like D. Pietro hasn't had NHL challenges before opportunities, but he's talented, and I think it's smart for them to say, we're going to give him a run and give him his chance to be our number two guy. You learn from what's happened to you before, and I think that's smart. To me, one of the most fascinating things that's going to happen this off season is the Zaka extension. I do think they talked to other teams about him. I heard that there were some conversations. I kind of thought one of them might be Montreal, but I had a couple people deny that, but it seemed to make sense. But I do think there were some conversations. But then again, like 95% of this league, there's conversations about. So I think that should surprise anybody. But, you know, he's the kind of guy now like a 1C or at worst, a 2C, which is what he is now. Now those are big tickets, Kyle. I. I'm. I'm curious to see how far or how comfortable Boston's going to be with what it could take to extend them. Very curious to see that.

[Kyle]

Yeah. I mean, he hits 30 for the first time this past year and goals, and I feel like we're entering that world. If you're. If you can show you're a consistent 30 goal guy or around there, like, suddenly you're looking at not seven figures, but eight. Where this is all going, wouldn't you say? Like, it's not a stretch, especially as a center. Big, big bucks.

[Elliot]

There's. So that's. That's why I think about. That's why I think about Carlson again. Like, they're so hard to replace.

[Kyle]

Yes. I was also thinking too, like you mentioned, just wasn't a fit in Utah. His production dipped there last year compared to what he was. The trajectory he was kind of on in Buffalo. I mean, if him and David Pasternock could find some degree of simpatico on opposite wings there, like, that could be. That could be real dangerous for Boston.

[Elliot]

You know, I look at this whole division, the Atlantic, and I see, you know, I think Buffalo is going to be really good again. I think Tampa Bay is going to be good. I think Florida is going to be ridiculous. And obviously, I think Montreal is going to be really good. And then, I don't know. I mean, Boston, like Ottawa, we'll get to them. They should be good. But I think people are like, I don't know right now. And Boston and Toronto and Detroit, this could be a really. Like, there's four really Good teams there. I think Ottawa's sort of. We're all curious to see how this goes, but they have a lot of talent and then you've got three teams there that could go boom or bust. Like you just. You don't know what to expect.

[Kyle]

Yeah, it's that it's, it's not quite. It's different than the Central in that it's not like it's a three headed monster at the top. But there's a lot of carnage to be had in the Atlantic going forward. It was pretty wild this past season and I think it's only going to be even more entertaining here moving forward. So let's get to the Sabres here. Cause they had a busy week, draft week. They trade for Zellweger, sign him to a three year deal. But it sounds like, well, for Yarmo Kekalainen, he's not interested in giving up any of his young players, whether they're in the NHL now or in their system to go big game hunting on the trade market.

[Elliot]

It's pretty interesting. So that's a team that had 109 points last year, finished second in the conference and they won a playoff round, went to game seven obviously in the second round. And there was a lot of conversation around them. Like Kekalan made some changes and he was not afraid to consider others. Like I think the big, this, the biggest victory for them last year was obviously making the playoffs. But I think the second biggest victory was they restored respect to the sword. Right. Like Connor Halbach was willing to wave to go there. I think Vincent Trocheck was very interested in going there. That wasn't happening a year ago. The Sabres are a different animal now. They're, they're respected. You know, hey, that's team's pretty good. You know, they traded Byram out. Yarmo Kekalan was like, I'm not having that. When he heard what the contract asked for was. And it was like four years at big money. And I think San Jose was willing to do it. He was like, nope, I'm not having this hang over the head. And Byram was a very big part of that team in terms of its swagger, its personality. I like the bet on Zellweger. I also like to bet on Crevier, who they got in that deal. I think, I think he's going to help them. I think it was time to move on from Devon Levi and I think Buffalo had to do that. There was no path for him in that organization next year at the NHL level with no hello Buck there, it was still going to be Lucan and Lyon and Ellis. And with hello Buck there, it was probably going to be Ellis. So there was no place for Levi to play. And it's. It was. It was just not going to be good for anyone. It wasn't going to be good for the player and it wasn't going to be good for the organization. When I look at Buffalo now, I look at not the Tage Thompsons and the Dalleens because I think you know what you're getting from those guys and you're getting a lot of good play. It's the continued growth of Benson, it's the continued growth of Dawn. It's Quinn, it's Helenius who look really good at the end of last year in those games he got. Austin looked really good before he got hurt. Kulik got hurt, missed time with the blood clots coming back. I'm actually really happy to hear that. I heard initially when they found out what he had, they were really worried about his career. Even Owen. Power, like Power to me, took huge steps last year. I was so impressed with what I saw in the playoffs. I think for that team it is purely about Kyle. Those players continuing, some of them have come farther than others. Like Benson's come farther, Doane's come farther. But those guys have to continue to go and the other guys have to make the same jumps that Benson and don't have. That's how I think Buffalo gets better. You know, Quinn is an RFA after next season. And again, I wonder what Kekalan is looking at here. He said, you know, Byram, you know, we, we didn't like what we heard. We moved them. They got Benson done. They got Doane done. Do they wait and see what kind of year Quinn has? If he has a big year, that becomes a bigger ticket. I'm curious to see what they do there. And Colton Ellis, I assume they're going to do this, but he's played 16 NHL games by the end of next year, he needs to play 12 of at least 30 minutes or he becomes one of those Group 6 free agents, the players who don't play a lot early in their careers. I've heard the Sabres really like him. I assume they have that circled on there. I don't know what people use anymore. Bulletin boards, cork boards, electronic boards, whatever it is. But I'm sure they'll make sure that Ellis gets his time.

[Kyle]

It was noteworthy in our interview with Kekalainen how he almost at one point went out of his way to pump Up Jack Quinn.

[Elliot]

You are right. You are right. I was thinking about that. Yes.

[Kyle]

I don't know what that means, but it was just noteworthy.

[Elliot]

Yeah, I agree with you. I think you're right about that.

[Kyle]

Peyton Krebs, also an RFA that filed for arbitration here on Sunday. You have any inkling on kind of where the path goes there between now and then?

[Elliot]

You know what, Kyle? I really don't know how to handicap these right now simply because so much has changed in two days. You know, it used to be you saw how everything got filed and you kind of sawed it off in the middle. But I think it was a couple years ago we actually had three players go in and have hearings and we hadn't had that in a long time. And you know, the one thing is, it's like UFA contracts you can't use in arbitration cases because UFAs aren't in arbitration. But Carlson's contract, you know, it's, that's going to come up like that's going to be a comparable. I have no idea if that's going to make this harder for teams. Are teams going to say, oh, everybody's bumping themselves up because of that. We have to fight more. I honestly don't know how to handicap

[Kyle]

this because that whole argument of that's their business. This is our business. Does that go over in arbitration? In arbitration?

[Elliot]

In arbitration it's, it's all numbers. Like you're talking to a lawyer or an accountant or whatever they don't care about. My dad's an accountant. He doesn't care about feelings. Don't tell him I said give me the numbers. That's right.

[Kyle]

So the Calgary Flames quiet on the free agency front. As expected, they did make the Blake Coleman deal with Minnesota. Jacob Middleton comes back. Home run first media availability for Middleton talking about Calgary place that they want to raise a family.

[Elliot]

He was campaigning for a 10 year extension. Yes.

[Kyle]

His own suite at the new arena when it opens up next year. So where are we at with Calgary? I imagine the big piece of business still to come is that whatever the next contract for Shimon Nemetz looks like.

[Elliot]

Yeah. And you know what, that, that Minchukov thing changes it now.

[Kyle]

Right?

[Elliot]

There's another, there's, there's another one like that's going to affect the Nemet Steel. I mean if you're like, I was, I was talking about this with somebody. You know, if you're, if you're trying to do like a six or seven year deal with them, you're probably looking at before this and even potentially Brant Clark, you were probably looking at, I don't know, 7 times 6, something like 42 million kind of thing. But now like Clark got 7.4 on 5, Menshikov got 7.2 on 5. This changes the calculus I think for Calgary. But you know, the one thing about them is they have a lot of flexibility. This is an important player for them. Right. So you have to figure they're going to have incentive to get it done. But there's, there's no question the bar has moved a little bit for them. You know, I, I think Calgary, they've accepted their fate. They're, they're rebuilding, they're in a full rebuild. But, and, and I think this year, like what, what do you have to do? You have to give those guys a chance to show. You're going to give your, you're going to give your. Guys like Parak Nemetz, Gridden Coronado has been a first line player before, but you get it even more now. Like all these guys are going to get a chance to get big minutes. They've got to play. And there's going to be some nights where you're going to look good and there's going to be some nights where you're not going to look good, but it's time. You have to do it. You know, Wolf, I'm going to be curious to watch Wolf at the start of the year because last year at the start of the year he just had some nights where you were like, is this the same guy I saw two years ago? It sure doesn't look like it. So you're hoping that, you know, he starts on time and he's better at the start of the year because you're going to need him to cover up for some of those mistakes. I'm watching Zari. I think it was a tough year for him and them Last year he was kind of on the market. Off the market. On the market, off the market. He was on the market again this summer. How's everybody going to feel about including himself about coming back for another season? I have to tell you, I am surprised that nobody has come harder after Zach White Cloud. Like the one thing about Craig Conroy and I kind of like, I really like the way he approaches his job. He kind of gives you every reason to believe he's going to hold on to somebody and then he trades them and you know, like he, he gives you every reason to believe he's going to hold on to White Cloud because he needs him. But I think White Cloud and you still need veterans and you need good veterans. But, like, I look at some of these teams that are trying to win the Stanley cup, and you can't tell me he's not more valuable to them than he is to the Calgary Flames. Like, I am honestly surprised nobody has blown his socks off yet for White Cloud. I have to. I'm shocked at it. But, like, I look at all these guys, pere such a big year for him next year. The other thing, too, is, is that, you know, their number one center, if you kind of look at them right now, it's probably Morgan Frost. You know, Morgan Frost is a free agent in a year, so, you know, who knows what that's going to mean? Maybe the two of them look at it and say, there's a marriage there that can last. But we know they've been looking for a center for some time, and their number two center is probably Backland, who's 37 years old. You know, they have Ryan Strom, too. That's. That's going to continue to be the Holy Grail. The Holy Grail for Calgary is find that center. But they've turned the corner. And I think, like, when I'm watching Calgary next year, I'm going to be watching these guys. I'm going to be like, you know, some nights they're going to get spanked, but other nights you're going to look at the plan. You're going to say, this makes sense to me.

[Kyle]

So Jonathan Huberdeau has that hip resurfacing surgery. Have you heard much about his progress? Because I'm listening to Craig Conroy the other day, and he sounded more hopeful than confident that he was going to be good to go come the fall.

[Elliot]

No, I'll worry about that in September. It's July. Jonathan Huberto is a great guy. I'm not worrying about Jonathan Hubert. Oh, in July.

[Kyle]

Fair enough. As they go into the season.

[Elliot]

By the way, I hope to have a great summer. To our biggest Flames fan listener, Taylor Conroy. Yes, Taylor, I know you always tell your dad everything we say about him on this podcast, so please tell him this. In his first practice with the Canadiens, I think he shot the puck at Patrick Wa's head on purpose.

[Kyle]

Well, when you get to know his demeanor and personality, it all tracks. He seems like that kind of guy. Farewell season for the Saddle Dome next year. It's going to be a special one.

[Elliot]

I heard you already stole two chairs.

[Kyle]

If I could, I would. I know it's. I'm half Murray Edwards.

[Elliot]

If your attendance is too short next year, every game is because Kyle ripped the chairs out there in his basement.

[Kyle]

It's time. But I'm going to miss that place.

[Elliot]

You know why? I got to tell you, I understand exactly what you mean, Kyle. Because Exhibition Stadium was not a great stadium. But I loved every second I spent there in my childhood.

[Kyle]

Right.

[Elliot]

You know, Maple Leaf Gardens. It was time. The Forum in Montreal, the odd in Buffalo. All those places. You know, it was time the world changed. But I loved every second I spent in those places. And if you are old enough to be in the Boston Garden or in Chicago Stadium, you know exactly what we're talking about.

[Kyle]

Carolina Hurricanes, Stanley cup champions. And it looks like as we sit here right now, not a lot of change to their roster going into next year. Yes. Freddie Anderson's at Edmonton now. They tried with John Carlson, the defenseman. What's the latest with Alexander? Nikisha, a name that's been out there quite a bit since the season ended. Also a guy in need of a new contract.

[Elliot]

Yeah. So he's like Cutter Goat. He's got no rights, so he can't do an offer sheet. He can't go to arbitration. So he's. He's stuck in a tough spot. I don't know how close it came, but there was some traction between them and the Rangers initially. I think the Rangers offered a couple of draft picks, including a first rounder. I kind of wondered if it was that first that they traded to Vancouver for Patterson, but it didn't happen. Carolina wanted a player, and then they circled back around and they had something that I think was gaining some traction. And I heard the issue was the contract. They couldn't get an agreement. I think Nikishan, you know, like every other person, wants to maximize his output. And I. From what I just heard, the Rangers just weren't going where that could go. So I think there's some other teams that are looking around it. I think St. Louis is one of them. It's one of those things that Kyle. It's kind of like late pregnancy. We're there, we're not there. We're there. We're not there. She's dilated. She's not dilated enough. It's kind of been like that. It's like, is it now false alarm? Is it now false alarm? It seems to be on and off all the time. I don't know. Maybe the Hurricanes will finally give birth in the next little while. First of all, I think they're. I don't think they're Satisfied. I think they are trying to add something to their team. And what I think is interesting about them is for a team that just won the Stanley cup, they don't have a lot of holes, as you would imagine. So I think whatever they're trying to do is big. And I have some theories. There was some stuff floating around the Internet. You know, Steve Warrior, who used to be working for the Florida Panthers, he tweets some interesting stuff from time to time. And you know, one of the things he kind of talked about was could a team be successful on an offer sheet and trade the player that they signed? And I do think that Carolina was considering something like that. We'll talk about Seattle later, but remember, they were going to make a trade for Jason Robertson. That was three first rounders and a young player, I believe. And I think that Carolina was considering, could we offer sheet someone. If you match an offer sheet, you can't trade that player for a year. But if you sign someone to an offer sheet and you get the player, there's no such restrictions. And I think what the Hurricanes were considering is, and I don't know if it was Carlson or someone else like Adam Fantilli or something. I think they were considering signing a player. They were going to see if they got the player, could they trade them to Seattle or somebody else? I think that was something. That was one of the rumors that was going around that they were considering. And I'll tell you, the other player I kind of heard in conjunction with them was Simon Edmondson from the Ranger, from the Red Wings. He's a really good player and you know, he's. If they lose Nikitian, they're going to need a defenseman, right? So. And I think Edmondson would be excellent for their system. So I've kind of wondered if they were eyeing him up and down too. We'll see if I'm right about either of those things, Kyle. But Carolina has earned that sort of. You better think of creative things that they could do and they're not afraid to try them. I think also too like Carolina, they have some, you know, the other thing too, when I heard Detroit, it just made me wonder if they're in on Larkin at all. Because first of all, he's Larkin. He's a heck of a player. Although he would have to change his list to go there. And secondly also too, a great skater would really fit in their system. But they, you know, they've got some interesting young players like Carolina. You know, they've got Bradley Nadeau, they've got Felix Ungersorum, they've got Charles Alexis Legault, he's a defenseman. So is Joel nystrom, who played 38 games with them this year. Like Carolina has some young guys who are ready. Just not a lot of spots in that roster on a team that just won the Stanley Cup.

[Kyle]

Yup. And Seth Jarvis, he had surgery done. It's going to be a bit of a timeline for him, looks like.

[Elliot]

Well, so there will be the opportunity for start to start. Yes, you're right.

[Kyle]

Absolutely. I know we talked about after the cup was handed out the possibility of the future with their head coach, Rod Brindemore. Is there anything.

[Elliot]

Well, he was on there. He was on with Mike and Matt and they asked him about it and he kind of tied it into Jordan Stahl. So, you know, Stahl still has another year under contract. You know, we'll see. He did say it was hard to see himself doing it before Stahl. So we'll see. We know it's kind of like a year to year thing now. That was the thing he said to Matt and Micah on the. On Hockey Central I thought was really interesting.

[Kyle]

He also in that interview told the story behind his cup Hoist in 2006. I'd never heard that story before.

[Elliot]

So he basically admitted he ripped it out of Bettman's hands.

[Kyle]

He said it was like he had manifested that for the whole year because he was mad at the league that they had lost the year to the lockout. And he's like, if we win the cop. He's like, I don't even want the league to be able to touch it. Like, I just want to grab it right away. And he basically did that. Like I just thought, you know, overcome by emotions in the moment that was in his mind the whole season. Which is awesome.

[Elliot]

You know, I, I'm glad you mentioned this interview because there was something else that he said in the interview that was pretty interesting and actually Mike Futer brought it up and you could tell Brenda Moore wanted no part of it. Right. So I guess in the game was it game three where they fell down. Which was the game where they fell down 4 nothing and came back and sent it to overtime and lost.

[Kyle]

Oh, yes. That was game three. Yes, about.

[Elliot]

So Dundon left.

[Kyle]

Yes, he left after two periods.

[Elliot]

He was so angry he left. He got on his private plane and. And left and then called and said what happened?

[Kyle]

Oh yeah, just about.

[Elliot]

You could tell Bruno was more eager to tell the story about ripping the cop out of Bettman's hands than he was about admitting that his owner took off in the middle of a. Of a 4 nothing game. And, and I will say this, Tom Dundon is not the only NHL owner ever to do that. In the famous game where the Bruins came back to beat the Maple Leafs in Game 7 in 2013, the Boston ownership left that game when it was 4 to 1 and they missed the comeback.

[Kyle]

Oh, wow. Yeah, I didn't know that one.

[Elliot]

Yeah. So that's at least the second time it's happened. At least.

[Kyle]

All right. Chicago Blackhawks. And it's amazing the world we live in now.

[Elliot]

Oh, yeah.

[Kyle]

Pull up live barn. And you never know what you might see. Connor Bedard skating in Vancouver, goes in awkwardly into the boards. We've got to start there. Do you have any update on.

[Elliot]

I don't. I knew it was going to be tough because of the weekend. I assume we'll find out earlier this week. You know, the one thing is that actually with Bedard, you're thinking about two things. If I ran the Chicago Blackhawks, I would have been at the Bedard household on Saturday morning. I would have been like, A, how's your shoulder? And B, do we have to worry about an offer sheet here at all? Because I am a super paranoid human being and after what happened with Carlson, I would have been like, do I have anything to worry about here? I want to know right now. Now, I don't know that the Blackhawks have any reason to be concerned here. And I think generally player and team have an excellent relationship. I think he's very happy to be a member of that organization. I just personally wouldn't chance anything anymore. I would hide all of the pens in the Bedard house.

[Kyle]

You make a living doing that anyways in your spare time.

[Elliot]

That's right. I am a bit of a pen thief. It's like that scene of Wolf on Wall Street, John Bernthal, the Punisher, where he teaches you how to buy the pen, right? Sell the pen. Write this down for me. And he's the only guy with a pen, so you have to buy the pen from him. That's exactly what I would do. I would steal every pen in their house. That's what I would do.

[Kyle]

Jeez. Problem solved.

[Elliot]

Problem solved. He can't sign an offer sheet if he's got no pen. Anyway, like I said, I don't as I, as I do this podcast here on Sunday night. I don't have any reason to believe that Bedard is. Is chasing an offer sheet by anyone else. But I would just be. I'd be Looking at the way the landscape was changed and I would be like, if I'm the Blackhawks, I'm all over it.

[Kyle]

All right, so that's the situation with Bedard. They sign Byram to the extension that will make him for now the highest paid defenseman. When that kicks in, they next year add some veterans in around the lineup too. Also really curious next year about this cancer of that they've signed and brought over. Led the league in the KHL in goals last year with 36. Sounds like the organization is. Is pretty excited about the possibilities there.

[Elliot]

Yeah, a couple of things about Chicago. Number one, about Byram, six times 12 and a half. And right now he's the highest paid defenseman in the league. And that will change pretty quickly, I think. But someone told me, and this is another team told me that he heard There was a 4 times 14 out there for Byram and I assume that was the Sharks, but I don't know that. But he said to me that the word out there was that Byron was getting paid and the biggest battle was going to be term because. Because they felt that Byram, initially the word was he only wanted to sign for four years. You know, we had that conversation about Byron where he talked about, you know, trading the pick and whether or not it's really worth it. I had a lot of feedback about that about, you know, the fourth pick is not as valuable as you think it is. And it's this. Some teams understood statistically why you would do it, even though they didn't know if they would have the guts to do it. The one thing that they did say was they felt Chicago would have got. Should have gotten the 20th from Buffalo. They should have said, okay, we'll give you the fourth, but we want the 20th back. That was the one thing that they argued, but they didn't disagree with the premise that from an analytics point of view, it was a reasonable attempt to make. I agree with you on some of these young players. Like, I want to see Frontal make his first full season. I want to see cancerov2. I'm really curious to see what kind of player here. I think that the Blackhawks, like you look at it, I look at them and I say the same thing I said last year. Nazar, I want to see another step. We talked about front Green. You want us another step more. You want to see another step on defense like all these. Even Byron himself, he's about to become a number 1d for the first time. How is he going to handle it? Vlasic even More Kaiser. Even more Lev. Shunov. Renzel.

[Kyle]

More.

[Elliot]

The one thing that Chicago shows you is they've got so many good young players, but it's just a reminder of how hard it is to take that step. Now. The one thing I really believe is that they are looking for forwards and they've tried before and they'll continue trying. And even if it doesn't happen this summer into next season, if Chicago finds out that any forward is available, that they think they can make a difference, they will be on it. And someone made that point to me today that even if they don't get it done this summer, watch it. During the year, Chicago will be hunting for forwards.

[Kyle]

Okay, the Colorado Avalanche President's trophy winners last year, knocked out in the third round by Vegas, saw some bodies moved out the door. Nechuskin, Ross Colton, Jack Drury. They do keep Brett Burns for another year, extend Brett Kulak, sign Jaden Schwartz. But with some of the space that was cleared out anytime now, it's worth noting Cale Makar can sign a contract extension.

[Elliot]

So you think he's the highest paid player in the league at some point

[Kyle]

here, do you think he, he goes a notch above this new bar set by Leo Carlson?

[Elliot]

I think it's going to be purely up to him. Purely up to him. He could. Now, Colorado, by the way, is one of those teams that this year has a slightly lower cap. They're at 101.7 because of their overages, but that doesn't affect Makar's extension. That's still a year away, but I think he's going to get whatever he wants. I'll bet you he does not max out, that they'll go to him and they'll be like, we could pay you whatever you want and you deserve it. And I think he takes a big number, as he deserves, but I don't think he takes everything he can.

[Kyle]

That's fair. That's very fair.

[Elliot]

So I, I just don't think he maxes out in terms of either. The maximum number, which this year is 20 million. But I think he takes a big, big number. I think he leaves a little bit of cap flexibility. A little bit.

[Kyle]

Okay. And they have committed to saying they want McCarr to play his entire career in an Avalanche sweater. What else are you looking at for a team that wire to wire tops of the NHL during the regular season and just got beat by a Vegas team that was firing all cylinders in the spring?

[Elliot]

So I think that they're in an interesting spot because I don't think that they will. I don't think that they're going to. After such a dominant regular season and the disappointment, I think they're going to look at next season as a bit of a lab. Look, they. If you look who went out, you know, Ross Colton was a regular. It wasn't always easy this year with him. You know, he didn't have a great year, and he wasn't a great fit. But they. But they moved on from him. Jack Drury was a regular. They moved on from him. Like, if you look the last couple years, they've brought in some guys. Miles Wood was a couple years ago, and it didn't work. And I think this is a year where Colorado was going to try to commit to. Okay, we've got some guys here on our team now, and we're really going to try to give them an opportunity. You know, some of those are the guys they traded from Nashville, Svetchkov and LaRue. They're going to try to help them play and get a bit of a spot. But look, they've got, you know, McCarr's younger brother Taylor. They've got TJ Hughes, they've got Gavin Brindley, they've got Lycelle, who they traded for from Boston. I think they want to give these guys some chances to. They want some younger blood. You know, they're an older team. I don't think they feel they need to expand as much energy on the regular season as they did this year. Again, they're just going to be judged in the postseason. Everybody knows that. But I do think a lot in next year is going to be about how can we take some of these guys and add some fresh, new young blood to our group. That I think is going to be a key for them. And, you know, I'll say this, like, Colorado has had trouble with that in the past. You know, like, McKinnon had that famous quote. It's. It's hard to win with young players. Like, I think young players have been intimidated by him and some of the other guys there before, and I believe the Avalanche want that to change. I think they're like, no, we have to commit to this, and some of these guys have to find their way in, and we've got to be patient with them so they can work. We should also mention Brent Burns next year is within striking distance of number one all time in consecutive games played.

[Kyle]

Take over Phil Kessel's spot.

[Elliot]

Yep.

[Kyle]

Good for him. I remember. Oh, that would have been one. Not this past season, the one before last game. Of the year. Carolina's playing in Ottawa, and I think he played first shift of the game, and it was a nothing game, of course, for the Hurricanes and Ottawa, for that matter. I think he played the first shift of the game, and I think that may have been it, something like that. Or maybe only two or three shifts, but got his game and then save yourself for the playoffs. Do you think Colorado's.

[Elliot]

By the way, I had a couple teams say to me they wondered if Colorado took a shot at Conor Hellabake.

[Kyle]

Oh, yeah.

[Elliot]

I don't know, like, how that could work. I don't know what they would. What they would offer, and I'm not sure that Winnipeg would want to see that. But there were a couple teams that were like, they kind of suspected that the Avalanche considered it.

[Kyle]

Do you think they're going to look at finding a separate guy to be gm, or is that just going to be Sakic going forward?

[Elliot]

So the guy that I've wondered about internally there is Andrew Cogliano.

[Kyle]

Yeah.

[Elliot]

To me, it's about what do you think is the best path for him?

[Kyle]

And timeline, I guess, too.

[Elliot]

Yep.

[Kyle]

Like, do you leave Joe there to handle whatever this Maar number looks like and then go from there?

[Elliot]

Well, even if you. Even if you brought in somebody else, that would be a Joe decision anyway. Right?

[Kyle]

Yeah, I gotcha. Okay. The Columbus Blue Jackets, and I guess we will start with this question, what happened with Zach Warentsky?

[Elliot]

So this is what I think happened there. I think this boiled over in a cauldron of emotion is what I think happened. Kyle, is that the accurate quote from Anchorman? Did I butcher the quote? Did I get it right?

[Kyle]

Glass case of emotion.

[Elliot]

Glass case. This. This was a glass case of emotion. I couldn't remember what it was. Too many Anchorman quotes.

[Kyle]

So what.

[Elliot]

What I think happened here was. I think there was a conversation after the season and it had been a tough finish. They just missed the playoffs and everybody was emotional. Remember, Bonus had that rant about the culture. It was a really emotional time. And I think it was around that time that some comments were made about what the future could be. And I haven't spoken to anybody directly, so I'm not going to. I'm not going to reopen any wounds here. I'm not going to open any scabs because this has been calmed down. But there were some conversations right at the end of the season, and I think that Warrensky had indicated some teams that he didn't give them a list or anything like that, but he said, like, you know, I would consider here I think about there like Tampa Bay was definitely true and Toronto was definitely true. Like I had one guy who wrote to me, some Blue Jackets fan, he goes, I cannot believe you guys are. Are mentioning Toronto. Like he's like, they're worse than we are. Why would you be talking about Zach Warrenski going to Toronto? And I said to the guy, you know, obviously he's friendly with Matthews and the other thing too, for Warrensky and his family and his wife's family, they all live outside of Detroit. It's, it's. It can work. So. But it was just funny. It's like he doesn't want to go to Toronto. They're worse than we are. It was so funny. It was such a great exchange. Anyway, so. And I think one of the teams that was indicated was that he would consider would be Dallas. Now again, I haven't spoken to anybody involved here. So what I think is this, is that that Dallas thing turned into. Some people interpreted it as he will definitely go to Dallas. If Columbus makes a trade to Dallas, he will go there. And other people either meant it or interpreted as if Dallas it becomes available, bring it to us and we'll make a decision then. But it was like broken telephone, Kyle. It didn't. Whatever was meant, it wasn't. It wasn't agreed on unanimously by Warrensky, the team and the Stars. So they make a trade with the Stars, which was Harley and I believe Bork. Okay. And the other thing that. So I think they agreed to it on the Monday and it couldn't happen until the Wednesday because I think there were. There was bonuses involved and they were figuring it out who was going to pay what. I think they'd agreed on the trade, but they were just working through how it was going to happen. They were just working through it. And then there was also an article and it's now appeared everywhere. But the first place I saw it was by Aaron Portzline where Rick Bonis was quoted as saying I'm surprised at all this. Like I. We looked each other in the eyes and we thought it was going to be all okay and just the timing of that happening. And then it appeared like it was a. I. I thought initially was an exclusive where bonus said that Ports land. But it turned out it was in a scrum and a bunch of other outlets including NHL.com had that article as well. I think that article hitting as the. As everyone started to figure out what was happening, it just made the whole situation. It was like the volcano blowing right and I think people got upset, and it just added another layer to this that made the timing all bad. But whatever the case is, they took it to Oransky, he said no, and the deal died. And I think Columbus basically said, it's Dallas or we're keeping you, because the trade, like, Toronto, couldn't do that, and neither could Tampa. So I think it was. I think Columbus said, it's Dallas or us. And then it got out and it really exploded. And, you know, it was interesting. I had a conversation with a player this week, and it was. He had a really interesting perspective. He said, you know, behind the scenes, whenever you ask for a trade, you feel that you've.

[Kyle]

Or. Or.

[Elliot]

Or you're indicated that it might be time for you, depending on what the future is. You know, maybe. You know, and maybe your team knows and maybe your agent knows and maybe your wife knows or whoever else you confide in, but a lot of people don't know. And then he said to me, like, once the articles and the tweets start coming out, it's like, oh, my God. Like, you may think if you've never been through it before, you may think you're ready for it to hit the social media whirlwind, but you're not. If you've never been through it before, you don't know what that's like. Now, if Don Waddell's been around for a thousand years, Jim Neal's been around for 5,000 years, so these guys have seen everything. Borensky's new. He's a younger guy. He's never been through anything like this, and they think it really rocked him. Like, it's like, I don't think Warrensky is, like, a bad person at all. He wants to win. And I think he was probably a little stunned, a little overwhelmed, and, you know, a little bit probably embarrassed about the way it all played out. So they did what adults are supposed to do. They had a call. I don't think it was in person. They had a call or a zoom or whatever, and they sorted out, and I think they smoothed out with. I. I think Warrensky probably smoothed it out with Dallas, too. But, you know, they sorted out, and I expect that he'll start next year in Columbus. And, you know, I think, you know, Columbus wants to win. They went out and they got into Chushkin. I heard Colorado had lots of places they could have dealt Nachu skin, and Columbus got him. Like, there were a lot of options there. They kept coil. They, you know, they. The other thing here that's really interesting is they let Jenner go. They need a captain, you know, and I think the plan was always to make Warrenski the next captain. What are you going to do now? Are you still going to do it or are you going to kind of wait to see how it plays out? Like, that's another really interesting decision. But I think they want to win and I think they want to win badly. And they're a better team with him there. And so I think they start the year next year with him and we see how it goes. But the biggest key was they calmed down the noise. And I think that's the thing I respect about it the most is it got kind of out of control and everybody there handled it like an adult. That's what you're supposed to do.

[Kyle]

Man, that was a wild, wild couple of days. But between the Nichan deal and who they kept around, sounds like Marchenko's staying in Columbus for the time being too. Elliot, listening to Waddell the other day, it's almost like time's ticking for things to change here in a meaningful way to get back to being a playoff team in Columbus. Because we all kind of have a good sense of what's at stake now.

[Elliot]

Yeah. And you know, Marchenko is as you talked about. Don Waddell said he'll be back next year. That'll be an interesting one because he's a 30 goal guy and he'll need another contract after next year. That's going to be a big number. Like people out there have a lot of respect for Marchenko's game and you know, the Fantilly. We talked about the offer sheets. Fantilli. How does Columbus feel? Are they nervous about it? And I'll tell you the other one that's really interesting is Cole Cylinder declared for arbitration on Sunday. Columbus really thinks that Cylinder is a big part of their team. They think he's really important in their room. Like the Canucks really liked him and tried to get him for a while, but they were like Columbus like, no, like we like this guy. So it'll be interesting to see what number he comes up with because they really value him. Greaves too. Oh, yeah. Another two big ARB cases.

[Kyle]

The Dallas Stars. Speaking of arbitration, that's where Jason Robertson is now gone. We've talked at length about that whole saga and where things stand on the Stars. Rfa. I imagine it would do nobody any good really to actually get to a hearing in this case. Does this simply just buy everyone a little more time?

[Elliot]

It does. You know, first of all, Dallas is another team that is. I think their cap number is 101.9 this year because of the overages. You know, there are a lot of people that kind of looked at Dallas this week, and they were like, wow. We never see them as unsettled as it all looked with the Robertson deal and, and then the Warrensky deal. But I don't think they're panicked. I think they're. I think it. They're a little, like. I think they're a little surprised that everything worked out the way that it worked out, but I don't think they're panicked. I think they still feel they're in pretty good shape. They've got a good team. They think they're a destination even with everything that happened. And I. I think they kind of look at this week as more of a strange blip than, okay, we've got a lot to worry about here where we're going. I don't get the sense they're panicked at all. You know, Borg scored 20 goals for them last year. That's a loss. You know, it's not Easy to replace 20 goals in this league. I'm sure they had some fence mending to do with Harley and just talk to him about, you know, kind of the whole situation there and how it. What almost happened and, and how to fix it with him. But I think they still look at it like we're still a good team. You know, the Robertson thing. Yes. You know, the biggest arbitration award in the history of the NHL is seven and a half million, and that's Shea Weber's from Nashville. And Kyle, I don't know that he'll actually get to arbitration, but if he does, he's going to break that. And you know what? I'll say this. You know, when we did the pod after Robertson declined the offer in Seattle, I said that Robertson's going to want everyone to interpret that as how much he wants to stay in Dallas, that he would turn down 125 million or whatever it was for Seattle because he wants to be a Dallas star. And I think there's some other things that have popped up in and around there where he said no to. And I do think on some level, the Stars accept that as he wants to be here. But I still think there's a gap. I think the Stars are and around 12, 12 and a half. And I think Robertson's around 14. And, you know, I think there is a little bit above Robertson. He had to wait. He had kind of prove himself, and he's like, okay, I prove myself. So I think it's still going to be a challenge to bridge this and But I do think the Stars on some level have taken all of this as his preference is to play here. So we'll see how it all plays out.

[Kyle]

Another thing too, Jamie Ben re ups for one more year as captain of the Stars and on pace to Eclipse 1300 career games next season. So he remains in Dallas. Anything else for them, like they're still a veteran laden group, but you know, whether like the Maverick Bork trade was one thing, so there's another young player that's not around but like a Ritzkovian emergence certainly helps matters where for a team that's trying to win, you need some guys that aren't making Jason Robertson money to be able to help you up the lineup and slowly but surely they're, they are finding those guys well also too.

[Elliot]

Like Lundqvist took a step last year before he got hurt and Bixel looks like a player before he got hurt. You know, I look at that team, I think, I think a lot of what they can add or if anything is just going to depend on what Robertson's number is. I think once they know what that is, they'll start to survey and see, okay, is there other help we can get? You know, the thing about Dallas is the league kind of turned over a bit last year. Like a lot of the teams that have been going far in previous years, like, you know, aside from Carolina, really, Florida hit the wall and missed out. Dallas hit the wall, got knocked out early. Edmonton hit the wall, got knocked out early. I think a lot of these teams, and Dallas is one of them, is kind of sitting there and saying, okay, we missed our, we got our knockout early and we're going to be back. Like a lot of guys were hurt. I think, I think that's one of the things I look at with them though is like Ratnan is not a guy who's been injured a lot. He got hurt at the Olympics and affect them the rest of the year. But you know, Hintz is a guy who gets hurt a bit. Sagan's a guy who gets hurt a bit. He's getting, is a guy unfortunately who's been hurt a bit. I think they're just hopeful with a longer summer, a lot of these guys can get healthy and be back and they kind of look at it as if we're healthy, we're okay. And once they see where Robertson's number is going to be, they'll see what else they can do. But that's the one thing I really got the message out of Dallas is that it was an unusual week for them, but it's not anything they're overly panicked about.

[Kyle]

The Detroit Red Wings, Elliot so Dylan Larkin remains a Wing for the time being. You mentioned earlier Simon Edmondson, an RFA there, and the intrigue around that player. You can understand why that's a heck of a young defenseman that they have. But I suppose we start with their captain, and I know what the roadmap looks like. He was one of the first, in terms of the more public trade requests to get out there earlier this spring, and he hasn't been moved yet.

[Elliot]

So with the When Leo Carlson's offer sheet hit, one of the first calls I got was from another manager who said, how much more valuable do you think Dylan Larin just got? 5 years remaining at 8.7 million. And what he said to me was, as hard as Steve Iserman was drawing the line before, he's going to draw it even harder now. And, you know, the other thing, too is I didn't think, I'll admit it, I didn't think in part of me still doesn't believe that Larkin will start next year in Detroit. I'm just, I'm not convinced that Yzerman wants to start the season with this distraction. But I also believe that he thinks that no trade is better than a bad trade. And I had a few people say to me, don't underestimate it. He'll do it. If Iserman believes the right thing to do is start the year with Larkin based on what he's getting offered, then he'll do it. But I think the offer sheet made Larkin even more valuable in not only in Yzerman's eyes, but in other people's eyes, too. And yes, like I said in the Carolina section, I believe that I've heard rumors that they've sniffed around on Edmondson, and I wouldn't be surprised if they've thought about it. So those are a couple of things I think the Red Wings are dealing with, and I think Iserman wants current players for Larkin, current players, because the

[Kyle]

mindset has to be once and for all, you got to end this playoff drought enough March collapses.

[Elliot]

I think he believes that very strongly. He doesn't just want futures. I think if he wanted futures, this deal would be done already.

[Kyle]

Right. So that brings another layer into it. I was wondering, do you have any sense of where Patrick Kane might land yet?

[Elliot]

I don't. I don't. I've heard A few things, but I just, I don't feel comfortable in. In what I've heard to say it. I think he's got options and is making a decision. I think Girou is kind of the same. I don't know that I expect him to go back to Detroit. I actually liked the Arvidson signing for them because he had good numbers at 5 on 5 last year. I like Kolasar a lot. He didn't have a great year, and he was a pretty stunning scratch in Game 6 of the Stanley Cup Final in Vegas. But I like Kolasar as a player a lot, and I don't mind that pickup for them. Like, I think that the Red Wings could use some edge and some personality and some identity to them. And Kolasar's got that, you know, if he plays the way he can play, it won't be too long until he's a big fan favorite there. But, you know, the Brinket thing too. I mean, 7.8 million now almost 7.9. One year away from unrestricted free agency with where we're going, like, Iserman doesn't like these contracts, man. So, like, that's the one thing, like, I look at this and, you know, Justin Falk is a bit of a different case. He's. He's 34 years old. He's a year away. But I look at the brink and his 28 and a year away from UFA in this new world. I just. I just don't know how comfortable Iserman's gonna be paying him what he could make on the open market. I. I don't know how to handicap this at all. Like, I think the Red Wings, like, it's. It's kind of weird to say it because as you said, they're trying to build up to get into the playoffs, but they're suddenly at a very big crossroads. You know, Lucas Raymond's contract is going to, I think, going to be one of the best value contracts in the NHL. 8.1 more at Cider's contract might be the best contract in the NHL. 8.55 for a guy who's going to be in the Norris Trophy conversation for the next five to 10 years. So much of this is timing, right? When are you eligible to sign? Well, now you've got debrink it. Who's your best sniper? It's just. It's so hard to read what Iserman's thinking, but he could send the team in a lot of different directions here.

[Kyle]

Well, now refresh my memory again, because the Raymond and Cider deals were done relatively back to back. Almost, right?

[Elliot]

Yeah. Like almost at the start, like in September, I think, if I remember correctly, a couple years ago.

[Kyle]

Yes. And was, was Eiserman, was it that he was reluctant to do term with those guys or that he wanted to guarantee that he got term? I can't remember.

[Elliot]

Guys told me that one of the, one of the biggest issues is that he just didn't like how much the players got paid so quickly.

[Kyle]

Right. But look at this. Look at it now.

[Elliot]

I know. I mean, you've heard me say this a million times. If you. And both those were in September of 2024. I looked it up three days apart. If you have a player who you think is critical for your team, you sign them for as long as you can. Because the best players, the money never goes down. Never, ever, ever.

[Kyle]

Exactly. So that's why, I mean, of course, you can't always guarantee things will age potentially as well as it could for Raymond and cider's deals here. If you're looking at, from Detroit's perspective,

[Elliot]

well, one's 24 and one's 25. If you're getting those ones wrong, then it's not only the fact that you don't have. That they didn't age well, is that you made mistakes. Like one was drafted fourth overall, one was fifth overall. Those are the guys you gotta believe in.

[Kyle]

Exactly. So. Because you just, you never know when the landscape could change in a drastic way like we've just seen over the last few days. And suddenly what are what already looked like great bets look like unbelievable, unbelievable bets to have wild stuff. Okay, The Edmondson Oilers, they went out and got some goalies. Freddie Anderson on one year, Devin Leland,

[Elliot]

I love that pickup. Someone actually said to me that they thought that Freddie Anderson was going to be in Florida, and all of a sudden they traded for Markstrom. And that flipped everything on its ear, that. So, like, there was a guy who bet me that Anderson was going to end up in Florida, and I am glad to collect on that bet. And he blamed Jacob Markstrom for it. And I said, hey, man, you lost. Just suck it up and pay up. But I, I, I like, I like the Freddie Anderson pickup for Edmonton. I assume they're going to carry three goalies next year, right? At least to start now.

[Kyle]

Levi needs waivers, right?

[Elliot]

Yeah, I like the Levi bet. You know, I, I'll say this, like, they did a lot of research into him, a lot. Like, I heard they called everybody that they could think of about him. And like, two years ago or three years ago, whatever it is. He was the centerpiece of a trade for Sam Reinhart and it didn't work out in Buffalo. Sometimes that just happens. But that's the kind of lottery ticket that I think you should be trying. So unless something strange happens, I got to think they're going with three goalies next year. Jari Anderson and Levi.

[Kyle]

Yeah.

[Elliot]

And they'll see how it works. They got a lot of defense on their team now. A lot of defense. They got eight of them.

[Kyle]

Yeah. Even minus Darnell Nurse, of course.

[Elliot]

And all of even minus Nurse. Yeah. They got, they got eight guys on one way deals. So I'm curious to see are they going to do that or are they going to move somebody? I like the Ryan Shea pickup. Like Ryan Shea can move the puck. I think that's. I think that's what Edmonton looked at here. We need somebody who can move the puck. Ryan Shea can do that. It'll be interesting because, you know, he. Here's a guy in like, I always wonder, when you get thrown into this for the first time, how do you handle it? Right. So here's a guy who before last year had played 70 NHL games. He gets a great opportunity in Pittsburgh. He has 35 points, 29 assists. And now he's gone right into Edmonton and he's going to be in the middle of this and he's got a big contract which he earned. No quite. No concerns here. I think if you earn it, more power to you. But I always wonder about guys. Like I remember when Ty Emerson got traded there, one of his former teammates told me, the biggest thing is going to be for him is going to be the adjustment. He's a small town guy, played in San Jose. Now he's going to the middle of a maelstrom. How do you handle it? And he said, when I asked him about it, said it did take him some time to get used to it. So I think that's the one thing about Shea getting used to being in sort of like the middle of the attention and all that, you know, Nurse. It was time they made the best possible deal they could make for him. Like I think with Pittsburgh they were being asked to take a contract back, a bigger one than the one that ended up being the case with Mukhammadulin. And they weren't doing that. I think Boston, they got blocked by a no trade. I think Philly, it never really kind of lined up and I think San Jose was very interested, very motivated. They just had to convince Nurse to agree to it. And you know, finally he did. And you know what? I hope that when Darnell Nurse comes back to Edmonton as a member of the Sharks that people remember that he could have made this exit a lot harder on them. The reason he stayed as long as he did is because he wanted to make it work there. It wasn't always easy, but he wanted to make it work there. And when it was over, he. He allowed the Oilers to move him in the least painless way possible. And you know, I hope the others fans remember that and he should be honored as such. You know, I've always been a huge Spencer Stasney fan since we had him on the pod and we heard, we heard his story. Kyle. Yeah, you know, I'm just. I'm just curious to see they got AD there now and all of them can play. I'll say this about them. I love the Dickinson resigning. I thought he was perfect for them. I like that they were able to get Kapanen back. I, I think he was a good fit for them.

[Kyle]

He's like playoff guy. Hey Kapanen, he's becoming that. Like he's. I don't know if he's going to blow the doors off offensively during the regular season, but he's had two. Of course last spring it was short lived, but two. Good playoffs for Edmonton.

[Elliot]

Yes, I agree with you.

[Kyle]

Keep doing that.

[Elliot]

You know, I have to say this like the one, the most interesting guy I thought they signed was Edwards Tralmax.

[Kyle]

Yes.

[Elliot]

And I know you loved him at the Olympics. You know, Babcock has like. He's. He's a guy who's what. He had 28 goals in the. What did he have like 28. 28 goals in the AHL last year. Like to me he seems to be one of those guys who Babcock would kind of like, like just a. No nonsense. Like he played a hard game. Like hard straight line game for Latvia. Right. Yeah, I'm. I'm just, I'm curious about this guy. Like I've seen guys like this play for Babcock before

[Kyle]

for sure. 6, 4. Had three goals in the Olympics for Latvia.

[Elliot]

They. They were, they were in on Giroud. They're not going to get him, but they were in on him. I'm. I wonder if they have any interest in a guy like Tarasenko. They still got to sign Colton, Doc.

[Kyle]

Yeah,

[Elliot]

but the number one thing for me is they needed a break. They were at the end last year. Like it's, it's very clear reading. So we, we talked about this about what happened in that meeting. And they basically admitted it, that Babcock challenged them and said, you guys are as much the problem. And I, I thought reading McDavid's quotes to Mark Spector, this team was really off the rails at the end of last year. They were. They were really off the rails.

[Kyle]

And

[Elliot]

I think it's going to be a really fascinating dynamic because if they want to be challenged, they got a guy who's not going to be afraid to challenge them. And, you know, when it's a power play in the third period and Babcock sends out the second unit, I think we're all going to watch and say, how's this all going to go? Because that's why he's there.

[Kyle]

Exactly what they asked for. I do like how there's been a few instances now where something major happens in Edmonton. And I'm always curious for the Marc Spector conversation with Connor McDavid and reading that in the aftermath somewhere shortly thereafter. It's always marquee reading.

[Elliot]

That's good. It's very good. You know, like, I'll say this about McDavid, man, like he, he can have bite to him, but he doesn't back down. Like, this whole thing with Babcock obviously had a lot to it and a lot of criticism to it, but McDavid didn't back down. He stood by what he believed was right to win. I thought that was very interesting. The easy thing to do was to back down.

[Kyle]

He ain't about that. And it's all about winning now in Edmonton right now. Speaking of winning, Florida Panthers trying to get back to that. The cat attack is back, Jack. They make the Tachuk trade. Gudis is back six times.

[Elliot]

One and a quarter, one and a half. When I, when I saw that, I started laughing.

[Kyle]

Yeah.

[Elliot]

By the way, Edmonton is also a team with a bit of a lower cap, 103.75 and Florida is at 103.85.

[Kyle]

So Bill Zito on July 1, he's listing off all the different transactions that they did that day. And he gets to the end and he goes, I think that's it. He wasn't even sure of himself. It was a busy couple of days for the Panthers.

[Elliot]

He was probably thinking about fishing the whole day. The sooner I can get this done, the faster I can go fishing. He loves to fish and a great

[Kyle]

spot to do it. So they're. They remake their goaltending. We mentioned Markstrom, Akira Schmid as well, Garnet Hathaway. Isn't he going to fit there like a gloss.

[Elliot]

Oh, God.

[Kyle]

But one year breather, captain's healthy again, and now they get back to regularly scheduled programming and sunrise. It feels like.

[Elliot]

Well, the biggest. One of the biggest keys there is going to be their goalie coach, Rob Tallis. And Rob Tallis was there in the organization when they had Jacob Markstrom all those years ago. And I remember as Markstrom, you know, remember the Hockey News had him on the COVID as the best prospect outside the NHL. And Tallis was a huge believer and a huge fan. And even when Markstrom got traded for Roberto Luongo, he said, that guy is going to be a star. And he always believed in him. Well, so now after a really rough year in New Jersey, Markstrom's back and Rob Tallis is still there. He is still the goalie coach, and that is not a coincidence. And Tallis, who they clearly believe in because he did a great job with Bobrovsky, is now going to be trusted to do the same thing with Markstrom. And how he does is going to be a big part of their success. And, you know, Florida defends really well. They have a great blue line. They have forsling who's one of the best defensemen in the league, but they have a tremendous blue line, Seth Jones. You know, you don't need me to rename all these guys, but it'll. They'll be tighter than New Jersey was last year. I don't count out Markstrom. You know, I know he had a rough year last year. I don't. But he's got a. He's kind of had a. Like a weird thing where he has on year off year, on year off year. So this should be a great year. If he can be what he can be, this team is going to be trouble. You know, I think Zito also said he likes his team. Yeah, I would, too. You know, Barkov is back healthy. He looked great at the world Championships. That's a problem for everybody. And, you know, now they've got. They've got Brady and he's going to be a monster there. He is going to be like, they should win the division.

[Kyle]

I agree.

[Elliot]

They should win the division. They really should. And you know what? Again, how many times have I said this? Now I want to see Florida and Carolina in the playoffs next year. As a matter of fact, I think if the NHL on the Tuesday, they should have Florida in there for Carolina to raise the banner. You want the best entertainment, you send them right in there opening night. Totally don't give the Hurricanes a cupcake Send them. I don't know. What's the opposite of a cupcake?

[Kyle]

Hmm. Wow. Just like pile of dirt to chew on.

[Elliot]

Send them a pile of dirt. But you know, seriously, if you want the best banner raising game this year, you're sending the Panthers in there. These guys are going to be. And you know, look, they, they made, they made this big trade. They didn't have to trade Lundell, they didn't have to trade Los to Rinen who they just extended. They're going to be a problem for everybody next season.

[Kyle]

Yes. Totally capable of winning the division. I just wonder if they taper a little bit maybe because they've been there and done that good quality, soul quality,

[Elliot]

you know, they're going to have. It's interesting. I do think they want like a couple. They're younger guys. I think they would like to see Cole Schwinter get a full time job and They've got a 22 year old Sandisville Manas who played 19 games with the Panthers last year. I think they would love to see him get more of a spot. Like I think they'd feel really good if somebody a little bit younger could gain a foothold. But that's, that's nitpicking, Kyle. They're going to be a beast. And everybody knows they're going to be a beast.

[Kyle]

It's July. Save your nitpicking for the fall.

[Elliot]

Yes, I will.

[Kyle]

The Los Angeles Kings, Elliot. So they've got their new head coach and Peter Laviolette and we're a veteran team to begin with and have added a lot more older bodies to their lineup. Eric Hala, Matt Succarello. They bring back Scott Lawton, Corey Perry reuniting with the Kings as well. We mentioned the Brant Clark extension. 5 years, 7.4 AAV. But another year in LA where there are a lot of veteran names on the lineup card. But at the same time, whether it's Quentin Byfield or now Bryant Clark armed with a new extension, at some point the next wave has to drive the bus for a Kings team that's still trying to hang around in a tough Western Conference.

[Elliot]

So my theory here is such Kyle that the Kings are trying to keep maximum flexibility so they can take a big shot at an LA type move whenever it becomes available to them. That some super stud. You know, it's like the Lakers. You go from Kareem Abdul Jabbar. They drafted Magic Johnson, but they traded for Abdul Jabbar. They traded for Shaquille o'. Neal. They draft, they traded For Kobe Bryant, actually didn't even draft him, but they traded for him. Spent his whole year, whole career there. They brought in LeBron James. Like, you know, the Kings, obviously, Wayne Gretzky, they were the ones that traded for him. Like, they've got those LA kind of moves, right? Like, to me, Ken Holland this year, I don't see one of those moves. So I'm going to plug in the gaps and, like, look at all the contracts that are coming off as you. Armia Perry, Zuccarello, Drew Doughty after next year, both goalies, Kemper and Forsberg. Like, if somebody big becomes available next summer, the Kings are going to have all sorts of flexibility to do it. So I think that's the way, like, I think that's the way they looked at it. They're like, there isn't anybody worth this summer just ripping open the bank vault for us. So we're going to plug our holes and we're going to see what we can do. I think they tried to trade for Hollow last year at the deadline. I heard there was actually a deal where Hollow was going to the Kings, but he had some sort of injury, so the trade didn't happen. You know, they've talked about Campy at center. We'll see if that actually happens. Doughty will be a fascinating one all year long. The more I think about it, the more that is to me, Drew, we're going to want you back, but we got to make it all work. And I think that's why they've kind of punted that, just to see how it would all fit together. We'll see. But, like, the one thing is, by field, like, in his career, he's been 55, 54 and 49 points. They got it. He's got to get to closer to 70. He's got to be closer to a point a game. The Kings fans, they've been screaming for Clark to get a bigger role. Well, you know what's going to happen now? He's making 7.4. He's going to make. Get a bigger role. Like, that's the thing. Colleague. Those guys have to step up and say, we are. These guys are going to take over, as you said, and become bigger parts of the team. But I think. I think Byfield in particular has to become closer to a point a game guy. I really like Ray Whitney as an assistant coach. I think he's a really sharp mind. Whenever I talked about hockey, I really like what he has to say. I like that idea. I think they would still add A puck mover on the back end if they could. But I think it's basically dollar in, dollar out for them. So I think that's part of the issue. But I think they would add a puck mover if they could. And their special teams last year, I think they were 28th on the penalty kill and 30th on the power play. That has to be different. Can't be like. Can't win in this league like that. But to me, it's like the Kings, they. They got Panarin. They were happy to spend money on Panarin, and why not? But I think other than that, they were looking at it like, is there anybody else worth throwing a ton of money at here? No. So we'll plug our holes and we'll wait till someone who does.

[Kyle]

All right. The Minnesota Wild. So they beat one of two bosses in their own division in the playoffs last year, getting through Dallas, but back to the drawing board for them. I mean, they've done a couple of things here, Elliot, but you can't help but look for a guy in Bill Garon, fresh off GM of the Year honors, a guy who likes to make a lot of noise. It's been relatively quiet. Of course, there's the Quinn Hughes conversation, but is this guy still turning over every rock possible to see if he can land the Red Wings captain?

[Elliot]

So, you know what? Like, obviously he's not going to talk about this stuff like Iserman, man. Like, even a fearless guy like Bill Garon, he's not going to cross Steve Iserman, so he's not going to talk about that. But, you know, do I believe that he. You know, when. When he said, I make my best offer, like. Like he did with Quinn Hughes in Vancouver. Yeah, I think he's done that. I think he's probably gone to Iserman and said, this is the best I can do. And obviously, I think that it's probably more futures oriented because he doesn't want to make his team worse. And that's not what Eiserman's willing to do right now. So I, like, I don't think he'll. It's not his nature to give up until he's. Until the. Either the player's his or the player is somewhere else. I just, you know, like, I could see Iserman saying, hey, I'll deal you Larkin, but it's going to cost you someone like Erickson Ek. And I can just see. I can see Garen saying, I'm not. I'm not doing that. I want Larkin and I want Erickson Ek. So how do you navigate that right now? He can't. You know, the guy who's interesting for me is Maxim Shabanov. Minnesota had interest in him when he first came over. It just, it didn't work last year for with the Islanders and we'll see like it's, it's a new chance this year. The guy came over his first year ever in North America. I think the Wild are going to give him a chance to play higher up in their roster. He might get more of a run there at the beginning of next year and we'll see if that can work. Like to me that's a roll the dice that's worth taking. Why not give it a shot, See if your situation can be better than theirs. I had a coach who said something interesting to me about the Wild. I think some people were surprised that they would, they would move Zuccarello when he played so well with Caprizov. This coach said to me that he was. Sometimes when he watched them, it was almost like two on the ice versus five. And he said he wasn't criticizing those two guys, but he said when they were out there, they were looking for each other so much and they, they were so in simpatico it was almost like the other three guys on the ice for Minnesota were not involved. He said on some level it made not easier to defend, but it wasn't as effective for the Wild as it could have been. And he wondered if that was the reason why Minnesota decided to move on. Like you're of got to take another step. I think they like him a lot as a player. Another guy, young Russian, first year in North America. A lot of stuff can happen like that's a guy who might end up getting traded for another center. But as long as he's there, you hope he can take another step. And I do think the Wild like the player. The easiest way to solve your problem is internal. And look, everybody knows they like Larkin. I'm just not sure if they're going to be able to make the deal.

[Kyle]

Okay, what about the.

[Elliot]

And I root for any team that's got Calvin Pickard.

[Kyle]

Yes. Big time. Big time. Thank you for pointing that out. When it comes to the deal of a new contract for Quinn Hughes, you're still on the three year train.

[Elliot]

My prediction is 3 times 18. I think he extends there. And. And like I said, that's my prediction. And until I'm wrong, I'm not breaking off from that. I think he signs there for short term. The one thing here is that I don't think Garen's not a panicker. So I know some people freak out that it's not done already, but it's not his way. I think the one thing you have to remember about Minnesota and Garen has showed it before, is you cannot make your determinations about his team because you know he's always going to be trying to add to it. So I know there's some Wild fans who look now and say, I don't think this is enough, or I think we need more. He's proven that if the opportunity comes to add more, he's going to be aggressively going after it. So I never look at the Wild and say the way they look now is the way they're going to look when it matters.

[Kyle]

Montreal Canadiens. I mean, was there a quicker aging in the most positive of ways than Yvonne Demidov's deal? Signed on July 1st? Knowing what all happened a couple of days later, I mean, that looked great the moment Penn hit paper with how the Canadians have things structured. But to get him for the long haul at just over 9 million Dobish back on a three year deal, business continues to be everybody on the same page when it comes to that Montreal core.

[Elliot]

I'd love to know how long Montreal had that one in the drawer for, like, how long had that one been done? You know, the, the thing is, like, someone said to me after a couple days later, when Carlson signed, they said the same thing you did, which was, boy, boy, he's got to really regret that. And my reaction was, you know, think about where this kid comes from and you throw $75 million in front of him. I don't think so. Do you know how hard it is to say no to that? Like, it's just. No, I, you know, I think, I don't think there would be any regrets on that kid at all. And, you know, I think Montreal is one team and I think Utah is another, where you're looking up at their contract situation. And like, I remember some of these contracts, when they got signed, people were like, I don't know about some of these. And it goes back to the price never goes down. If you really believe in them, lock in them early. Like that Hudson one last year. I think I've talked about this before, but someday there's going to be a chapter somewhere on that negotiation. I think, like, the Canadians basically held his arm down and forced him to sign that contract to get it done.

[Kyle]

But isn't there the image of, like, Hughes's hand kind of Near Demi Daws when he's signing his contract and, like, oh, my God, is he forcing him to sign?

[Elliot]

Like, I think it was. It was something like that. But, you know, you look at them and, you know, their. Their situation is excellent, excellent. And, you know, I mean, it's funny. Like, another manager said to me, I'd love to see if Hughes was still working as an agent, what he would have been like on the other side of the table if some of these deals got thrown at him. But, you know, all you can do is give them credit, right? Like, obviously, they're put into a situation where they're given permission from ownership on down to do all this, and. And they get it done, and it's going to make them a very dangerous team for a long time. Now, I think the one thing, the one bit of frustration for the Canadians, and they got Dovish done, too, but I think the one frustration for the Canadians is they are still trying to sort out, could they find a younger top six forward, like somebody in their 20s. And they would be aggressive, like, really aggressive. And, you know, I think Marchenko would potentially be one of those players. But right now, Columbus is saying they're not doing that. You know, I think they've. I think they've made a lot of calls. And like, I heard they called people that weren't even obvious and said, is this player available? And so I think when I hear that they would be aggressive going after another younger forward, they absolutely would. I think that. I don't think we've heard the last of them now. You know, it's interesting, like, there were some reports out there that they made a big offer to. To Columbus. There was definitely an offer made. I think beauty is in the eye of the beholder there, Kyle. But they definitely tried, but right now, that's not available. And I think they called around to just about every team looking at centers that might or might not be available and said, hey, like, would you. Would you move this guy? Is this somebody who interests you in moving? And to this point, they haven't been successful, but again, that doesn't mean they're going to stop trying.

[Kyle]

That was the one thing for Montreal, just in making my notes here for this, is that I felt they look like a team and Ken Hughes looks like a guy that he's got another card up his sleeve somewhere. And maybe it's just, as you say, finding the right trade partner that says yes, but they don't look like a team that's. That's done trying here this summer. To do something of real significance.

[Elliot]

You know, I think too, I look, I look at them next year. Bullduke, I think is a player that they're hoping has more to give. And you know, for me, the other guy I would, I would be working a lot with this year is, is Kapanen. You know, he had a 20 goal season. Most of his assists came from Demidov and then he had a really tough playoff. But he's still young. You don't throw the baby out with the Bathwater. Centers are hard to find. I would be. See, it wouldn't surprise me. I'll say this, Kyle, it wouldn't surprise me if in some of these attempts to get somebody, if Kapanen could. Please don't go crazy with this could be potentially be part of the package because he had such a good regular season last year. But let's just say he is back on your roster at the start of next season. He's, you know, he's a player that I would say, all right, it didn't end great, but there's still a player there. Someone else told me, you know, they thought might be really a good fit in in Montreal and I have no idea if it's even possible. One of those two Pittsburgh wingers, Rusta Raquel, they were like. And, and I think those guys would have to approve. But he looked at Montreal and he said, I thought with another score, like one of those two guys, they might look pretty good.

[Kyle]

Yeah, it was. I still think of when they got knocked out by Carolina and Mike Matheson after that game was saying, you know, great as the run that they had and how far they got. It was a real eye opener of how far off they still are with how Carolina handled them. And as the playoffs wore on like that was it of course size in certain parts of their lineup, but just having some, some pop at certain parts where they weren't getting. It really started to as things separated in that, that conference finally. So I can see why an idea at least of a Brian Rust or a Raquel that speaks to that perfectly.

[Elliot]

You know, it's funny you brought that up because, you know, when we talked about Jordan Spence in Ottawa about how, you know, I thought a team like Carolina might be interested in a guy like that because they had success with Gossas Bear and, and Walker and Walker's more of a thick guy. He's not, he's not a big guy, but he's thick. And you know, someone said to me, they still think that even though Carolina did that most Teams will be, will be thinking, I can have one or two of those guys, not more. And so it's interesting, like size. I kind of wondered if a guy like Rista Linen might end up in Montreal. But, you know, we'll see where that all goes. I like, I think they're a very progressive front office in the sense that they say we identify something we like and we go out and get it. This is going to be a good team for a long time. A long time.

[Kyle]

The Nashville Predators, the first off season with Chris McFarland at the helm has been a pretty busy one to this point. We talked about Maverick Bork. They make the deal for him and sign him to a six year extension. One of the things that McFarlane said was he doesn't believe the Predators as it sits right now are strong enough up the middle of the ice and on the blue line. So where do you think they go from here?

[Elliot]

So I was on Nashville radio, I do a Nashville hit, Kyle, every week and what I said to them was the Predators whole philosophy is let's just add talent, let's just get better, let's just add talent. And I don't think the Predators have any delusions of where they are. And you know, we talked about LA a couple of minutes ago, about how they were like, we don't see anything crazy worth chasing, so we're not going to do anything crazy. We're just going to fill holes until we feel there's something we can chase. I think Nashville is going to be the same way. I don't think they're going to chase. They're going to say this doesn't make sense, were not going to chase it. You know, if you look at where Chris McFarlane came from, he came from a team that was really deep down the middle and they had one unbelievable defenseman and a lot of other pretty good defensemen. Like they were down the middle and good on the blue line and I think that's what he's going to try to copy. People stick with what they're successful with. And when he was in Colorado, that's what they were successful with. He adds Colton center, who he knows. He adds Jury center who he knows. And I think he's going to try to add some skill on the blue line too to help Yossi, but they're not going to do crazy chasing. They're right now more solid down the middle and then add some skill on the blue line. And you know, the other thing, I think there were a lot of rumors about their veterans last year, O'Reilly, Stamkos, and I think they've gotten some calls on them and I think they've probably even gotten some calls on Yossi. I think some teams are checked in. But the thing I've heard about these guys is we don't want trade rumors around these guys all year. We're going to treat them with respect. And I think they've had a real point about that is they just don't want the noise. And McFarlane is the master of saying almost nothing. So look, I, I expect all those guys to start, so I don't know if I expect any big bombshells out of there, but what I do expect is they're going to sit there and say, how can we add skill? How can we add skill at center? How can we add skill on the blue line to help out Yossi? And we'll just keep on doing that until we think we're in position to take some big swings.

[Kyle]

All right, so 16 teams down, 16 still to go, and we need a breather. So why don't we take our first break, we'll come back back with the last edition of the Thought line of the year and then get to the back half of our tour through all 32 around the NHL. 32 thoughts. The podcast continues after this. Okay, time now for the Thought line presented by BetMGM. Make it legendary. Last one of the season, last blast of shout outs from you, Elliot.

[Elliot]

Yeah, I got a couple, I have to say. So first of all, Kyle, when at the Stanley cup final and the draft. By the way, I saw you get carded three times. Well, something happened to me this week that I think you would have really loved. So my brother in law, John, his birthday this week and he is a big golfer and I went to his, he plays a lot right near his home at Don Valley. It's a great municipal golf course in North York of Toronto. And I went to go buy him a few free rounds. And the gentleman who was working in the pro shop, his name was Mackenzie, he was great. He helped me out, he helped me put the money right on the account. And he looks at me and he goes, since he's your brother in law, would he also qualify for the senior rate?

[Kyle]

Excellent, excellent.

[Elliot]

I knew you would love that. I knew you would love that. I looked on beard starting to come

[Kyle]

in a little bit, a little bit.

[Elliot]

But he goes, I go, wait a second, how old do you think I am? How, how like what's the senior? How old do you have to be to get the Senior rate. Guess what the answer was.

[Kyle]

Oh, boy. Well, I'm going to guess it was a higher number if that's the way. I don't know. 65?

[Elliot]

60. Okay, go. How old do you think I am? And John would be even more insulted because he's like 10 years younger than me. Anyway, Mackenzie, you're a good guy. And thanks for giving the pod some entertainment because I was laughing at Kyle as he got carded in both Vegas and at the bar in Buffalo. And so I knew he would love it if I got told. If he got told. I gotta ask for the senior rate.

[Kyle]

Well, well, well. How the turntables have turntabled.

[Elliot]

Okay, and I gotta read one more. So this is from a listener named Susan knack in Elgin, Illinois, to the 32 Thoughts team for the greatest podcast out there. Thanks. Well, which is true. No lies told. Thanks for all your hours and efforts. This store, which is called Ray Gun, is in my old hometown of Des Moines, Iowa, where I learned to love hockey by watching the only broadcast Tuesday night repeats of CBC Hockey Night in Canada from the previous Saturday. And it ran on the local PBS channel mid to late 1970s. Thanks, guys. Susan Knack, Elgin, Illinois. A big Leafs fan. So she had shirts made up for all three of us. A T shirt in gray, which is I'm going to show you guys right now, says it was my understanding there would be no math.

[Kyle]

Oh, wow. Are you serious?

[Elliot]

Yeah.

[Kyle]

That's outstanding.

[Elliot]

And she made those and she sent them to all three of us. Now here's the funny thing. Two of them. I always say everybody knows the camera adds 10 pounds, right, Kyle? There must be a lot of cameras on us because two of them are double XL and one of them is xxxl. And I assume the triple XL is for Dom after hearing the pizza story from last podcast.

[Kyle]

She had the double in the shopping cart. She's like, oh, you know what? Better make a change. One more X, please.

[Elliot]

But thank you very much, Susan. Those are fantastic. And we will wear them happily. As Dom says, great pajama shirt. Yeah, Dom, yours is so big, it could fit you and your girlfriend into it.

[Kyle]

Oh my, the possibilities. Not only will we be wearing them, we will be swimming in them. Thank you so much.

[Elliot]

That is so great. Shirts I got, they were delivered to me on July 1st and I opened them up after the show and I was howling as I saw them. Thank you, Susan.

[Kyle]

I'm glad you brought up the pizza because that perfectly segues into our first submission here from Eno in Petawawa. Ontario hello. 32 thoughts team. Thank you for all your work again this year, informing and entertaining us all. Dom was right to eat the pizza. In the army, when food is brought out to the field, the officers, sergeants, warrant officers, etc. Line up with the ladles and tongs to serve while the soldiers line up to eat. The principle is that the troops eat first to make sure there's enough for the junior ranks and no one is allowed to take seconds until everyone has had firsts. Even when people have been lined up for a while, a leader will step out of the queue if someone junior shows up behind them. Dom was soldiering away as your producer and barely escaped the dungeons of KeyBank to unhinge his jaw and devour that pizza hole. Kyle and Elliot, you were doing the right thing as leaders to stand by and make sure the troops got fed. Leaders eat last. Congrats on another great season and enjoy your summer break.

[Elliot]

You know, that's a great, great submission. Awesome submission. First of all, I don't know if this means that you are a member of one of our armed services, but if so, we thank you for your service and anyone out there who is a member of one of them who is listening. The only thing I will dispute with you is that you might not have noticed, but we are not members of the armed services and if we were, Canada would have fallen a long time ago.

[Kyle]

We would not be in a position of leadership there.

[Elliot]

We would be eating first.

[Kyle]

That's right.

[Elliot]

Like we'd be right at the front of the line. Yes.

[Kyle]

Yeah. Be like, oh boy, better get. We feel bad for these guys. Get them fed. That's awesome. Thank you for that.

[Elliot]

That's a great submission.

[Kyle]

No. Okay. Charlie from the hometown of newly drafted defenseman ryan Lynn, Richmond, D.C. yep. Greetings, Kyle and Elliot. My name is Charlie and I live in the hometown of Ryan Lynn. I'm a huge Canucks fan and was wondering if any other team in the history of the NHL has drafted eight players from eight different countries this year. Vancouver drafted players from Canada, Czechia, United States, Norway, Russia, Belarus, Slovakia, and Sweden. And I am wondering if that level of international diversity has ever been matched before. Love listening to the pod while busing to school.

[Elliot]

That is a great question. I got it off the top of my head. No chance I've ever heard of that before.

[Kyle]

It's never been more than eight. Three other times it has been matched.

[Elliot]

Really?

[Kyle]

So tied for the most Vancouver this year, Dallas.

[Elliot]

This is a four hour pod. I'm not even guessing.

[Kyle]

No, no, no, it's fine. I was expecting to Dallas and Columbus in 2002 and Nashville the next year. In 03, eight countries represented in their draft class.

[Elliot]

That is what first of all, also congratulations on you for noticing.

[Kyle]

Well, he said he's a huge Canucks fan and he has proven it, by the way.

[Elliot]

So I was thinking one thing I was thinking about. So the NHL draft, as you know, is seven rounds. The NBA draft used to be seven rounds. And then in the 1987 NBA draft, the Atlanta Hawks, in the first round they took a player from DePaul, which is in Chicago. They took a player from Wagner College, which is in New York State. And then they took a player from Alabama, also in the second round. And then they made a mockery of the rest of it. In the third round they took a player from China. In the fourth round they took a player from Greece. In the fifth round they took a player from Spain. In the sixth round they took a player from Italy. And in the seventh round they took a player from which at that time was Yugoslavia, but is now Bosnia and Herzegovina. And they just said like, we only have 12 to 15 players on our roster, why are we doing this? And the next year the draft was only three rounds and now it's only two.

[Kyle]

Ah, so that's what kickstarted things.

[Elliot]

That's what ended the seven round NBA draft.

[Kyle]

Wow.

[Elliot]

I always remember that one.

[Kyle]

All right, great stuff, Charlie.

[Elliot]

Great, great stuff, Charlie. Excellent.

[Kyle]

Gavin, hello. 32 thoughts team and stank with the recent signing of radkogudis to a 6 year contract which would take him to age 42 and prior long term contracts for similar older players like Brad Marchand which will take them into their 40s. What is the ruling on contract length for a player that is over 35 years of age? I seem to remember something around this when Toronto signed Kristanov a couple of years ago. And is there a written rule about this or is it more unspoken? Also, what is the benefit for the player to take a contract structured this way for team? I understand it stretches out the cap hit, make the AAV lower, but why would a player accept it?

[Elliot]

Well, answer the second part easier. You know, Rack of Gutas wanted to be a Florida Panther and the only way that he was going to be able to get there was to do a contract like this. So that's why he did it. He was happy enough to go there and wanted to go there and this was the way it was going to work. There are no rules. Like there's nothing that says that they can't do this. There's no rule that says over 35, you can only sign a guy to a one year contract or a two year contract. In theory, the NHL could void the contract, but the only time they've ever really voided contracts is when the money doesn't work or they think it's like they voided the 17 year one on Ilya Kovalchuk. So obviously if somebody tried to sign someone to a 17 year contract, I mean, you can't even do that anymore. But that was one they voided. And they voided other contracts that for whatever reason didn't clear salary cap rules. Like the variances in between years didn't work. Or like, for example, like this offer sheet they gave Leo Carlson Starting September 15, you can't do that structure of an offer sheet anymore. Like right now, this, this one is 95% signing bonuses. Starting September 15th, it can only be a maximum of 60. So those are the only reasons contracts get voided and they have to be rewritten. That TANF thing, I remember at the time someone said, oh, the league's going to fight this. I remember asking. And I was like, people said to me, like, they're not going to do anything about this. Like, why are you wasting our time with these questions? So I have no idea where that whole thing came from. I remember when Tano signed that deal. I never like, I remember someone said to me, there's a report that they're gonna, they're gonna avoid this. And I was like, what? And, and I was basically told, don't bother us with this kind of stuff. So I don't know what the line is, you know, Gudas could only sign a maximum seven year deal. He got six. And you know, basically what's going to happen, he's going to. Either he's going to finish it out or he's going to go to a point where he's too injured to play and Florida will just pay him as cash.

[Kyle]

Up next, Bill, a passionate, wild fan from Minnesota. Could it be Garam?

[Elliot]

I doubt it.

[Kyle]

Oh, okay. Hello, gents.

[Elliot]

He can barely tolerate talking to me. I can't imagine he'd write to me.

[Kyle]

Yeah, well, maybe this is his preferred avenue of communication. Longtime listener, first time writer, wondering if you can help me understand the RFA designation of players who are not tendered a contract. For example, Minnesota did not tender Bobby Brink a qualifying offer, essentially making him an unrestricted free agent, after which they did negotiate a deal at a lower number. I was surprised to learn that after this new contract expires, he will still retain RFA status. That seems weird. If the team decided not to tender him at the offer, but they resigned him, why wouldn't he transition to an unrestricted free agent after the deal is up? Thanks for the information and hours of content to pass the day away.

[Elliot]

It's a really good question, Bill, and here I really hope this isn't Bill Guerin, because he should know the answer to this question. It's a really good question, Bill, and here's the reason. And it's determined by your agent experience when your contract ends. So in this particular case, they didn't qualify him, so that makes him a ufa. But they give him a new contract and when it's up, he's still not eligible to be an unrestricted free agent based on age and experience. So because he hasn't hit that threshold, he's still technically a restricted free agent then. Now if he finishes this contract and again they don't qualify him, he'll become a ufa. But because when it ends, he's still not old enough or experienced enough to become a ufa, he can't be one. This is not the first time that that kind of thing has happened before. There have been situations before where players were not qualified and signed a one year deal and then we're still restricted. It all depends on what age or experience level you have once your contract expires. And to be an unrestricted free agent, in most cases it's seven years in the league or you're 27 years old. There are some other exceptions, but those are the key ones.

[Kyle]

Good stuff. So Elliot, as you know, normally throughout the year we like to wrap up the thought line with trivia. However, in lieu of that, this episode, final one of the year, I wanted to instead shout out the names of Daniel Santos, Joshua Lessard, Richard Choi, Brandon Pollock, Andrew Conti, Tristan Trumpor, Dave Worland, and of course, the great Steve Felon. Those are the names.

[Elliot]

Great call, Kyle. Great call.

[Kyle]

Those are the names behind the magic that is sportsnet Stats that find answers to all the quirky questions, the brilliant trivia you come up with each and every week. For us, if not for them, we would have no chance getting to the bottom of it. Elliot may every once in a while backwards fall into the right answer. But when it came to finding certainty, we go to them. So thank you to that team for all the assistance they give us all season.

[Elliot]

That's a great call. They deserve it. Good on you.

[Kyle]

All right, so that'll wrap up the thought line one final time this year. Presented by BetMGM. Make it legendary. We'll take another break and go through the remaining 16 teams in the NHL. More 32 thoughts after the break. All right, here we go, part two of our 32 thoughts. Summer bonanza. 16 teams down, 16 to go. And we'll start this block in New Jersey. Elliot, who also put in an offer sheet. Barrett Hayton out of Utah. Just a one year deal at just over four point. It's 4.775. So if Utah chooses not to match, it only be a second round pick in compensation. On the surface, you look at that and think, what was the point of that for New Jersey? What an easy match that would be for Utah. But it does put the Mammoth in a bit of a bind here. So can you explain all the inner workings and what Sonny Mehta and his team was up to?

[Elliot]

So there's apparently a backstory here.

[Kyle]

So

[Elliot]

New Jersey had interest in Hayton and I think the marriage between Hayton and the Mammoth has been slowly eroding. And you know what, there's a lot of players there that fit in Utah and they're doing pretty well. Not everybody fits. It happens sometime. And I guess the negotiation between Hayton and the Mammoth hadn't been going really well either. He was arbitration eligible and it just. The two sides were far apart. It wasn't going anywhere. So at the draft, the two sides talked trade and it didn't happen. And the two sides haven't commented on this, but the Devils feel it was late. They felt there was a verbal agreement and it should have been done and it didn't happen. And so in a fit of pique, the Devil's offer sheeted for Hayden. And you know, in terms of fit, I understand why they're doing it. Hayden's a big body, he's a center. And they could use some of that. You know, the Devils aren't exactly a physical force down the middle. They have talented players, but they could use some beef there. And I totally understand why they're going after this player and I totally understand why they want this player. I think what we've learned here is that if you're a mechanic and you give Sonny Meta an estimate and you do the work and you go over that estimate, he's going to offer sheet your business.

[Kyle]

How much for labor?

[Elliot]

Offer sheet. So that's the story behind this thing. You know, obviously nobody's commented about it publicly, but that was, that was the genesis of all this. You know, New Jersey really wants the player it's, it's pretty clear. And we'll talk about more about the effect on Utah and when we talk about their team. And I think the Devils would still love to add some forwards, but have to wait on the outcome of this to see where it goes. You know, I'll tell you this. There was another interesting one the Devils did. His name is Amadeus Lombardi. And this one got flagged for me. So Amadeus Lombardi had. He's a young guy. He's still. He just turned 23 and he played the last three years in Grand Rapids in the American Hockey League. And he was basically a point a game player the last two years. He had 40 points in 44 games two years ago and he had 42 in 47 this year. And I don't know exactly what happened. I heard this from someone else, but I guess there was a bit of a battle between him and like sometimes I'm fascinated about AHL contracts where I guess there was a battle between Detroit and him over his next AHL deal and the Red Wings traded him to New Jersey. He got traded from a fourth rounder. And you know, I'm always interested when a guy like Sonny Matta takes trades for a player like this. And then he kind of mentioned, I noticed he mentioned them in his post draft zoom or his post free agency zoom with the media. And so that says to me that whatever models Meta is using or their pro scouts who are watching them, one of the other said this is a guy worth gambling on. You know, he's not a big guy. He played his junior hockey in Flint, but he's a point per game guy in the American Hockey League. And I had a couple people say to me it's going to be interesting to see is there something there that New Jersey found here? Did they catch lightning in a bottle with this player? You know, other than that, he sure extension. That's a big W for them. Very big W for them. And again, 11.7. He'd signed it for two days when the contract already looked better. But I, Evan Rodriguez, I like him for them. Like I think they need, you know, they need a bit of snarl. They really do need a bit of snarl there. Rodriguez, I think is, is, is a good pickup for them. And I think the other thing that was really interesting was I didn't think there would be a lot of ways that we would see Dougie Hamilton in New Jersey this year, but it sure looks like we will.

[Kyle]

And

[Elliot]

I'm, I'm curious to see if the change that they seem to have towards him, really helps him as a player and them as a team. Goaltending will be a fascinating one with Sonny, with Meta, because they've got Alan, Nico Dawes, we really talked up, and David Riddick. You know, I'll tell you this. When they traded Markstrom, a lot of people started linking them to Hellobach. I have to say this. People who know Sonny Meta better than I do say they can't see him doing that. That he is very careful when it comes to contracts for goalies. And I'm curious to see. I want to see how his philosophy, how his philosophy develops over the years, but Allen, 35 years old. I hope Jake's riding the bike this off season because they're going to need him to play a few games.

[Kyle]

Yes. Well, he's proven in the past he can still in his later years be a very, very effective guy in a whole host of ways beyond just. Just making saves. It's funny, I was going back through this, Elliot, we kind of joked it a couple times how long this season has felt. And I was thinking about, you know, the whole Jack Hughes hand injury.

[Elliot]

Yep.

[Kyle]

That really set things in a bad way for the Devils. And I was like, that was. That was two years ago. Right. And I go back, I go, no, that was. That was this past year that that happened. But it felt like that was two seasons ago. It was incredible. But I just. More so. Just the point for the Devils is that, you know, they. I think in a lot of ways they feel they should feel that there's still a good team there. Just can't lose your way for an extended period like they've done.

[Elliot]

I don't disagree with you there. I think they're going to be. There's a lot of skill there. Like, you look up and down this roster. Jack Hughes, Jasper Brat, he sure, like, there's. There's a lot of talent on this team like Hayton. To me, I can see why they targeted him. He's. He's the perfect kind of player they need. I think Rodriguez is perfect for them. I think what they just need to do is you have to be in this league in the regular season. You can kind of get away with it for a while, but to be really successful, you have to be hard to play against. I don't think there were enough games last year where they were hard to play against.

[Kyle]

All right. The New York Islanders, full year of Pete DeBoer as head coach. Incoming nearly got into the playoffs last year. They also need a new captain. Anders Lee departing a lot of captains with new places now over this off season for a variety of reasons, but it feels like for Matthew Darsh, similar to Kekalainen and Buffalo, we're sure they're looking at what a big swing would take. They don't want to move off, whether it's prospects or just young players in their system, because it's taken a bit, at least for the Islanders to replenish that.

[Elliot]

See, I look at the Islanders and I know some of their fans were like, do more, do more, do more. I think what it is right now is New York is in a position where they are starting to turn over their team. And, you know, sometimes you hear and Montreal talked about this a couple years ago, we don't want to block guys, right? Like, I. I think that, you know, they brought in Shen Braden. He's only got two more years. I think if Lee wanted one or two, he might still be there. I just think they. They weren't going to three like Utah did with Peugeot. He's a center. I think they were willing to be a little different there because Peugeot's a center. I think they felt they had to bend there a little bit. But other than that, you know, you can start to see, like Cal Richie, he's going to have a bigger role there next year. All of a sudden, they've got a lot of young defensemen, a lot of young defensemen, and maybe they won't all be ready to play next year, but they're coming. They're not far away, like Isaiah George. It's going to be interesting to see what they do there because that guy's ready to play. But they're really jammed up on his side, on the left side of the ice. But I think also, too, they want to be in a position in a year or two now when some of these guys like Iserman, Finley, Ackland, Prokorov, those guys are all forwards. But you look on defense, we mentioned George Aitchison, you know, all these young defensemen that they got.

[Kyle]

Gustafson, who they just drafted.

[Elliot]

Gustafson, who they just drafted. I think they've decided that none of these guys, when they're ready, are getting blocked. So if you look at the end of this year, they've got. Look at all the guys who are coming up who are in the last year of their contracts. Defense, not so much. Those guys have a bit more term. But Casey Suzikis, Great Islander, 35, he's in the last year of his deal. Kyle Palmieri, he's about to go into the last Year of his deal, palat last year of his deal. I think they're really curious to see if Eklund, and that's Victor Eklund, forces his way into the NHL next season at some point, maybe even not right away, but at some point he plays like he played a game. At the end of the year he got a point, he got an assist. But I think they want to give him a chance to prove that, you know, and again, maybe it's not the start of the year, but it's during the year they want to play. So I understand while the Islanders fans are a little bit frustrated because it's not doesn't look like it's there for them now they're going to have to battle to make the playoffs. But I think they look at it like we're starting to turn our team over and we don't want any of these guys blocked. You know, the other thing I'll say about this is I think they did get calls on Horvat and I think they did get calls on Barzell. But Now Horvat's an 8 and a half, Barcelo's 9.15. All of a sudden those are great contracts. You know, Horvat's 31, Barzella's 29. Those are. And they've both got five years left. You're not getting Bo Horvat at five, five times eight and a half anymore. You're not getting Barcelo at five times nine plus right now. And I think they look at it like if we lose these guys, those are going to open up huge holes to fill and we're not getting guys at those numbers. So I think the way contracts are going makes it. I mean someone can always blow you away with a great offer, but to me I think it makes it less likely they're getting dealt. You would they they those two guys got even. We just talked about how more valuable Larkin just became. I think these guys just became more valuable too.

[Kyle]

And I'm really curious to see the dynamic between Barzell and DeBoer and how that all looks because I mean, I was just looking at this, Elliot, you know, Barzell's first full year in the league had 85 points in 82 games. He's never bettered that. He's never topped his rookie year in terms of point total. Part of it's been injury related, part of it's been shortened season, of course, all that. But we know there's still a very high end player there.

[Elliot]

I agree with that.

[Kyle]

The head coach. How does that go well?

[Elliot]

He's going to push him. Like he'll push everybody. There's no question. But you know, I think the thing too is Barzella's proven he's deeply appreciative of that team. Deeply appreciative. And I think he'll do whatever it takes to win there. You know the other thing too now, Schaefer and he has changed, like we talked about this briefly, the way that those young draft picks looked at him while he was interviewing him. Like he is single handedly changed the franchise. Right. And players are going to want to play with him. He's only going to get better. What do you think is Cap, what do you think he's going to sign for in a year?

[Kyle]

Oh, well, that's.

[Elliot]

Yeah.

[Kyle]

Like how you talk about stealing the Pens away, making sure that contract gets done a year out and not when all three years are gone by for him. Right. I don't know.

[Elliot]

Scott Malkin, the owner there, who really is a good owner, he's going to have to give Schaefer property in like the UK where he's based.

[Kyle]

Yes. That's just totally fine to do.

[Elliot]

No problem with that.

[Kyle]

Yeah. 5 million yet less AAV,

[Elliot]

but a castle overseas. But we'll give you a castle overseas. I, you know, I would take it.

[Kyle]

Yeah.

[Elliot]

Real estate, always a good investment. But you know, the thing about that is it's like with Schaefer, I was thinking about this. It's not only about the numbers. He hit the jackpot in all the numbers, but it's like the impact

[Kyle]

we talked about, like they, they could not keep up over the holiday season last year with the, the demand that their team store for shaving jerseys. It was out of control.

[Elliot]

Yeah.

[Kyle]

How that caught like wildfire and that.

[Elliot]

And that matters. That, that absolutely matters. But that, you know, that's the other thing too is that, and I think that's, that's also a part of their summer. Well, I mean, the offer sheet obviously came after July 1, but it's probably good now that the Islanders didn't throw money around because after that offer sheet came down, you're probably all sitting looking at each other and saying, all right, what did this just do to our franchise?

[Kyle]

Player number doesn't go down.

[Elliot]

So I think even Islanders fans who might have been like, we didn't do enough. The landscape has shifted so much. That might be the best thing that ever happened to you.

[Kyle]

Right. It's probably okay right now because you

[Elliot]

can give them a big number and you'll still be able to build around them.

[Kyle]

Okay, so we did Long island, we did Newark, New Jersey and now Manhattan, the Rangers. So Vincent Trocheck no more, no package. Back with Sean Dersey, Cole, Bo Dwang, Marcus Patterson is now on the scene and we mentioned draft night, the Dorothea trade and seven year extension that soon followed. There's a lot going on in New York in a season which another letter was sent out to their season ticket holders and their fans. I just wonder. So Molly Walker had that story in the Post about how James Dolan, the owner, is handing over the transition now of handing over the day to day of the Rangers to his son Quinton. And for all the talk of, you know, again the letter of okay, we're gonna have to reshape and rethink where we want to go here. Watching what the Knicks just did this spring in the NBA, is there not a part of that that goes okay? How quickly can we make that happen with the Rangers now as well?

[Elliot]

I think it's a bigger job, a much bigger job. But there was a time when the Knicks looked like it was an enormous job too. You know, it's interesting, like I tried to find out a little bit about Quentin Dolan. First of all, I don't think in general we're going to notice a big difference in the day to day around the Rangers. But I'll tell you, I heard some pretty interesting things about Quentin Dolan. Like apparently I didn't realize, but he ran like the sports science for both the Knicks and the Rangers. So I thought that was pretty interesting. I, I still have to learn a lot more. The, the amount I know, like I read Molly's column, I made a couple of calls. But you know, the Knicks this year, when it came to injuries, you know, they had some guys who got hurt. You know, Mitchell Robinson got hurt, I think in the middle of the playoffs. Anunoby got hurt and they were able to come back and still be factors at its base that leads me to think that the part of the organization he was running ran smoothly. So, you know, that's the first thing I think of when I think of that. But admittedly, I don't think that fans are going to notice a big change. It's not, not like, you know, Jim Dolan wasn't really out there a lot and was kept pretty private. And then after the Knicks won that championship, they played that speech he gave to them before the playoffs, which was honestly quite fantastic. It is amazing how much he's probably never not changed at all. But now he's won a championship with the Knicks. He's seen so much more positively than he was beforehand. It's funny how that works, eh? Anyway, anyway, the Rangers number one, I think teams asked Drury about Adam Fox and I think he basically told them to get lost. You know, I think I like their defense a lot more. Fox, Gavrikov, Dersey, Marcus Pedersen and I assume Braden Schneider, who was going to arbitration fouled on Sunday. That's a lot better a group and whoever plays the sixth, that's a lot better of a group, I think. And I think they'll be better in front. That group will be better in front of Shusturkin. I was a little surprised that they did not keep Trocheck when they traded for Dora Fayev. I just think like Dora Fev is a talented guy and he can score but you know he's a killer on the power play and in Vegas he had guys setting him up and you know, they still have some talent there. Zerbina, Jet, obviously, Miller, obviously. But Trocheck really could have helped that. And I actually heard that the Rangers thought about it, but I just think it was. It was time, I think for tro check it was time and we'll talk more about him in the Utah section. But even though I think the Rangers kind of thought about keeping him,

[Kyle]

I

[Elliot]

just think everybody had been too far gone. It was time. So while I do think they have players there who can help Dora Fev, I would have liked it a little bit more with Trocheck. You know, I think this too left Raniere. I think he's in a better place and they're in a better place with him. I think there was a time last year where it didn't. Everybody think this didn't was in a place where it wasn't going to work. I think there's a bit of a better feeling now post Panarin that there's more of a role for him where he can be successful. And I think that's going to be an interesting one to watch as the season starts because the easiest way to you can either trade your problem or solve your problem. It's always better to solve your problem. And I think there's a bit of a chance here for a new lease on life for him with the team. And I think that's very important that it starts well for them next year and then it's all like the younger guys. Laba started last year. He was a pleasant success for them. Continue going Gabe Perot like those kinds of players, they have to keep going and, and keep making an impact. Honestly, I don't know what to expect from these guys this year. Next year, I think they should be better. But, you know, Trocheck is a big hole. I think if Lafreniere, if it's really going in the way that it's sounded like it was going at the end of last year, I think that would be massive for these guys.

[Kyle]

I also wonder the likelihood that. So they take Albert Smith's fifth overall in the draft. And Bukola said he felt of all those defensemen that went early, he was the one with the highest floor, like the one that's the most NHL ready now. But as you laid out, like they've got a lot of defensemen back there already that can play. So what does the path look like for him? Guy, that's, I think, I also think

[Elliot]

that's one of the reasons the Rangers took him. I, I, I, I think the Rangers would really like that.

[Kyle]

For him to push.

[Elliot]

Yes.

[Kyle]

Just take a job. Yeah.

[Elliot]

You know what? Even if you're, even if you're a third pair D, you're still paying, what, 15 to 18 minutes? It's not the worst way to learn if you're ready for it.

[Kyle]

Absolutely. Anything else in the Rangers?

[Elliot]

No, I think we're good.

[Kyle]

Okay. The Ottawa Senators. So I'm sure you saw the lights going out during Steve stales presser on July 1st. Did you see it was like 118 millimeters of rain in our nation's capital on Canada Day?

[Elliot]

I did not see that in all

[Kyle]

my years living there. I felt, if memory serves, I mean, there was maybe only one or two Canada days in Ottawa where there was not a thunderstorm somewhere in the day, if not all day.

[Elliot]

Do you think the Kachaks seeded the clouds?

[Kyle]

That's right. I could see it said more salt in the wound. So you're right. Post Kachak era for the Sands, looks like CLO Giroux could end up elsewhere too. So how do you view this for Ottawa, a team who went through a lot last year, still got into the playoffs, and still believe they should be in go for it mode with who remains in house?

[Elliot]

Well, first of all, I agree with that 1,000%. 1,000%. Tim Stutzla's 24. How many contracts have we talked about that are aging beautifully right now? You've got him for 5 more years at 8.35. You are never getting that again. You have to go for it at age 24. Jake Sanderson's 23. You got him until 2032 at 8.05 million. You are never getting that again. Okay? You have to go for it. You have to. There's no other property option or way to look at this. You have to go for it. I, you know, I think this, the Tkachuk thing, we talked about this at length and it was time, it was time to end the noise around the whole situation. That's number one. As we talked about in a previous pod post Olympics, it was time. A lot was going on and the players were tired of it. And you know what, Kyle? I did have someone who reached out to me, one of the players and said the only thing he felt that we should have added was the podcast. And he said the podcast caused some problems and it was just time. Like it was time. And so I said I would, I would add that because one player made a point of reaching out and saying that. So the noise, it's better for the Kachaks, it's better for the Sanders just to end the noise. I strongly believe that. Now it's the player, really good player, big hole. How are you going to fill that? And I like the Eklund trade even more when I heard he was at a Pitbull concert when it happened because I've seen Pitbull once and I'm going to see him again in September. So always a bonus when you pick up a player with good taste in music. I think that is an underrated intangible for any team. We've talked about the Eklund, Zetterland friendship. One of the things about the Sanders is they traded for Zetterland. They almost had too many guys. Like it's almost a waste to have him on the fourth line. He's not Brady Kachak, but I think he can if, if this means his role goes, gets more. I think that's better for the player and I think he can help the team. This is still a very good roster. This is still a team that was analytically better than it showed last year, record wise. And even though it's of little consolation, I would love to sit down with the Hurricanes on their true serum and say, okay, rank your teams that you played in the playoffs last year. Ottawa, Philly, Montreal, Vegas. And rank them from 1 to 4. Who was the biggest challenge? And I bet you Ottawa would finish at worst second. Now, it's not a lot when you're down, when you lose for nothing, but I still think this is a good team here and I just think what they need, Ersin or Mary Linen has to Give all Mark minutes a rest. I think that's critically important for them. You know one thing I've heard about Ersin and one of the Philly guys told me about this is he reads a little too much social media. Sammy, don't read social media. Take it off your phone. Okay. Who cares what anybody says about you? They say worse stuff about Kyle and he's still very happy. So like that's one thing I would say. I think Ersin and Marilynen have to give all Mark minutes. I still think this is a good team.

[Kyle]

Ignorance can be very blissful.

[Elliot]

Yes, ignorance is bliss. I really do believe it. In this day and age, ignorance is bliss.

[Kyle]

Just get the sense that.

[Elliot]

I got to tell you something too. You know what? This World cup is proving to me, Kyle, that when you get off your phone and you go out there and you touch grass and you just meet people, world's a pretty fun place.

[Kyle]

And all penalties can be rescinded.

[Elliot]

All penalties can be rescinded.

[Kyle]

That's the other thing we've learned this World Cup. Now it does sound like Steve Stales is like don't judge us now. Judge us in the fall when the games start. See what else they do over the course of the summer in Ottawa.

[Elliot]

You know what's an interesting one is what are they going to do with Batherson?

[Kyle]

Well, extension eligible, right?

[Elliot]

Yep.

[Kyle]

And you talk about and Zube. Those are the two.

[Elliot]

Zub's a really good player for them. Really good player.

[Kyle]

Talked about never getting Stutzlin Sanderson to the numbers they're at. Like you got one more year of a very favorable number for Batherson and Zube to an extent. Don't let that slip away.

[Elliot]

See, I gotta think that they were. Whatever they were hoping to do with Batherson, hoping they were probably thinking they were going in the eights right before all of this happened. Now where are you?

[Kyle]

Right. So as we learned, he's a player that continually one ups himself every year. Point total higher than the one previous.

[Elliot]

Yep. Now where are you? That Pinto deal also looks four times 7.5. That deal also looks great right now. 25 year old center, cousins, four more years at 7.1. It's excellent.

[Kyle]

All the more reason to do something that helps you right now. And you think as the door shut on Drew coming back there or is there still a chance?

[Elliot]

So there were reports on Friday that he'd. That he was going to Philadelphia. I couldn't confirm that. I did ask. I did ask like Edmonton was in there. Toronto was definitely in there. I think actually Toronto might have bid the most money. Another team that was in this thinks, and again, this person could be wrong. This was their impression. They think that Giroux is, is seeing if anybody can really change his mind. They think he wants to go to Philadelphia and he's waiting to see if anybody can really change his mind. But I, I don't want that reported as fact, because that was just this guy's opinion and it could be wrong. But as that's a team, that's. That was in it and that was his impression that Giroux is trying to see if anybody can convince him not to go to Philly.

[Kyle]

All right, speaking of Philly, the Flyers, the team that signed Leo Carlson to this tectonic plate shifting offer sheet. So where do they stand through all of this? Because they've also got Trevor Zegras to deal with and Jamie Drysdale as well.

[Elliot]

So, first of all, I wanted to shout out Jesse, who's one of the staff at the JCC where I work out in Toronto, because I was about to get on before I got the stink eye from Steph. As I mentioned during the Anaheim segment of this pod, I was actually at the gym and I was about to step on the treadmill when this hit. Literally, as it hit, I was about to step on the treadmill, my phone was at 57%. And in about half an hour, as my workout was ruined, my phone was at 1%. And Jesse saved me by getting me a charger. So, Jesse, you are a lifesaver. Thank you very much for your help. She was fantastic. I wanted to show her out. And I want to say this to Daniel Brier. I take pride now in keeping my waist at 34 inches. If I can't fit into a 34 inch pant at the start of next season, because you blew up this one treadmill ride of mine, I am going to rip the Flyers from beginning of the year to end. So I want everybody to know that if I have an irrational hatred of the Flyers next season, it's because Danny Briere ruined my 35 minute treadmill on July 3rd.

[Kyle]

That's because you had to buy new pants.

[Elliot]

That's right. That's why I no longer fit into a size 34. Do you know how much work this was to get from where I was, which I'm embarrassed to say, to 34? So I'm going to be really unhappy if this cost me my 34.

[Kyle]

I watched you put in the work, man. I don't begrudge you at all for that. But you're telling me. So this all happens and you just. What, did you just stand in the gym?

[Elliot]

No, I moved out into a side area. But my next thing I noticed, my phone was down to, like, 1%, so. Is there music playing in the gym with me? Well, I stepped out of the room. Yeah. Yeah. And also, you know what? Don't you hate those people who talk on the phone in gyms while other people are working out?

[Kyle]

Yes. That's fair. That's good. Common courtesy.

[Elliot]

I have done that before, but I really try not to.

[Kyle]

Yeah. Because I just picture you when you get into your zone. What are you doing? You're pacing. So I thought, oh, treadmill be a perfect place to work. So you just keep walking.

[Elliot]

I don't like that. I. I don't like people who do that. People want to work out. They don't want to hear you on the phone.

[Kyle]

I don't know. You're a popular guy in your gym, though, by the way.

[Elliot]

I gotta tell you something. I. I know we're going way off. Sorry. We'll get back to the flyers a second.

[Kyle]

Yeah. This is a great pod to just go on random tangents on.

[Elliot]

By the way, this is nice. Short pod. There's plenty of time to listen. So I was in a store the other day, and, like, there were like. It was like. Well, I don't. I don't mind saying, because I think their customer service is excellent. But I was in an arch store, I was buying, like, a shell jacket, and there was a guy doing a conversation on a speakerphone, and there were, like, 25 people in the store. And I was. I was like, is this for real? Like, he did not care.

[Kyle]

And that's the most upsetting part of all that, because you see so many examples. Airports. It's a real problem. There is just no regard. Like, there isn't even, like, the body language of, like, I'm sorry, I'm a little embarrassed that I'm doing the speakerphone right in front of everybody. Every. They're acting like it's just an accepted part of how we live, and it should.

[Elliot]

When did this become normal behavior?

[Kyle]

I don't know. I don't know. We've really lost the plot on that one. Like, it's never been easier to get headphones. They hand them out on planes.

[Elliot]

You can get good cheap headphones out there.

[Kyle]

I don't know. I'm glad you see the world through that lens, too, because it's been very concerning.

[Elliot]

Anyway, now that we've solved this and everybody understands why I'm going to hate the Flyers next season. So, number one, I think it's important for everyone to understand that the number one reason I think the Flyers did this was because they wanted the player. They wanted the player bad. I know there's this whole subplot of, of cutter, go chain everything and people say they did for go Che. No, I think that's like the fourth or fifth reason or the added bonus. Number one is they wanted the player. They badly wanted the player. I'll say this about Philly. You know, they've been, they've been building. They've been building, they've been building. They've been adding some good players, but they were like, we need a star and we need a difference maker. And I think they saw this year when they, when they got knocked out by, like, you. You talked about how Montreal said they realized how far they went, how far they were away. Well, Philadelphia got swept by them around earlier, so imagine how they felt. And they aren't drafting high enough to get that player. Like, I had heard that if Caprizov had hit the market this year, Philly was gonna drop bags of cash on his house. And I think Minnesota knew that. I think Minnesota knew that. One of the reasons they did that was because they knew that Philly would if they didn't. And so. And you know, honestly, I think that this had been something that had been brewing. Like, as you mentioned, they still have to do Zegrist, they have to do Drysdale. But look, they, they made sure they, they got, they got Tippett locked up a year ago. They have they before, right? On July 1, they had an extension done with Tyson Forster at 7.1, an extension done with Ladar at five and a half. None of their other contracts are onerous. You know, their top ski forward is connect knee at 875. Very manageable. Their top D is Sanheim, 625. Very manageable. Like, they don't. It'll be interesting to see where Zigris ends up now because of all of this. Where does his number actually go? You know, I think that. But Brier had a lot of his business lined up and he'll have to make sure, like, Briero now will know, like, he'll be a target. There will be other teams that say, like, if you look at Carolina, they did an offer sheet with Kakanyemi that was revenge for the Ajo one, and they threatened Bouchard and they threatened Keandra Miller and they got the player. And what has Carolina done? They've made sure they're not vulnerable. They've gotten their guys signed. You know, McKeesian's not eligible for one. They've, they know that one day someone's coming after them and they defend themselves. Philly will have to do the same thing. They will have to make sure with guys who they really like, they are protected. And right now because Drysdale and Zegris have filed for arbitration, you can't offer sheet them. So that's sorted out and they'll have to sign them. But you know, they wanted the player first and foremost. They talked about this as an organization, ownership gave them the sign off to do it. I, I think one of the things they kind of went back and forth about was would they really get the player. And to be honest, I'm a little bit surprised they didn't go even higher. But I guess they obviously knew what Anaheim was willing to do and they, you know, anaheim was indeed a 12.5ish. Like I'd heard they beat that by a third. Like that's, that's a big hurdle. And I don't think they did this to screw up the Ducks cap or anything. They wanted the player and I think deep down they expect the Ducks to match. But I still think they really hope they get the player. And you know, I'll say this too, like, there's some GMs in this league who are really good at misdirection. I think Craig Conroy is really good at it and I think Brier's really good at it. I think people suspected that the Flyers would be willing to do something bold, but nobody for sure saw this coming. And you know, we'll see what happens if, if they don't get him, you know, what else do they do? Do they, do they consider what alternate moves do they consider? And you know, you take a look at their guys, you know, like Mishkov, obviously Martone looked good to start Bump. Barki, Lucchenko, Yuricheck, can those guys all take steps too? But this Carlson thing is a real game changer for them. And one of the other reasons, I mean as a reporter, it's awesome. But the other thing too is like this is the way Ed Snyder created the Flyers. This is what his vision always was for them. It is true to their identity, it is true to who they are. And I think, like, I think for the fans of the Flyers, that's important. I think the Flyers were always proud. The fans were always proud of that part of their legacy. We do bold stuff. We're not afraid And I think that's a nod to what the Flyers are

[Kyle]

supposed to be, and maybe under the radar with all this going on. But the fact that they sign Nol Achari. You talk about the Flyer's identity. He screams Philadelphia Flyer, too.

[Elliot]

He sure does.

[Kyle]

Fits the mold all right. The other Pennsylvania team, the Pittsburgh Penguins. So Sunday, Igor Chenikov gets his extension done. 3 years, 6.25. Great addition partway through the year when he landed with the Pens from Columbus, they bring in Kuzmenko, Trevor van Reemsdijk, Kaden Korzak, and what was the line from Kyle Dubas? Brick by boring brick, they continue to build this up after a season in which they surpassed everyone's expectations, even their own.

[Elliot]

So, you know, first of all, I want to talk about a couple of things I think Pittsburgh could do, but first of all, I want to talk about what I think they're thinking. This was a great year for them. Even though they lost the first round of the playoffs, they breathed new life into the organization. They had a great season. You know, I think if you know Dubas and you do and you've heard them, can they continue to add players in the early to mid-20s? Like, if you take a look at all the guys they've drafted, and I had some people who really spoke highly about, you know, Bill Zaunnen to me in particular, like, they're starting to put together a good group there of guys, and they want to add to that. You know, they've got the young guys and they've got their veterans, Crosby and. And Malkin, obviously, and Latang and Carlson, who I thought had a great year. And I wonder if they can add some pieces in the middle. They've got youth, They've got the hall of Famers. What about in the middle? You know, I like the Korzak ad. I like the Carlisle ad. And they've got some young defensemen like Pickering and Brunica who are coming. You know, Pickering is a really interesting one. He had a great second half. He had a great playoffs. I didn't realize he played through a broken foot and he played really well in the playoffs. And I think the Penguins are really excited for him. I think they're really hoping that Willy Koivonen can take another step. He had a good end of the previous year. He had a rough year this year, scoring wise. And I think they've basically told him, you need to have a massive summer, and then we see where we go. I don't think they've given up on him by any means, but I think they've told him he needs to have a massive summer. Now, I talked about sort of in the middle. I think they had some conversations with Dallas about Jason Robertson. I don't know why it didn't happen, but I heard, like, there were some pretty legitimate talks. So I don't know if this was the Penguins call or this was Robertson's call. And like we said earlier when we talked about Dallas, the belief is he wants to stay there. So maybe it was Robertson's call. I don't know. But that is a potential option because I heard they had some pretty serious talks about it. And we don't know where this is going to go for Robertson in Dallas. I'll tell you this, Kyle. Here's another one I've wondered about, and that is Pedersen. Elias Pedersen from the Canucks. And remember, he has control, but I, you know, look, all of a sudden, look, he's got to play better in that 11.6 is. Everyone's been talking about that. I know, but again, the ground has shifted here in a huge way. I. I've sat there and I said, where could he go that could be good for him? I don't know. I wonder if the Penguins with Crosby and Malkin might be good for him.

[Kyle]

I do believe a fresh start somewhere is. Is the best course of action.

[Elliot]

I think it has to happen. I do. But he's got say in this

[Kyle]

for sure. So there's Jason Robertson. They also acquired Nick Robertson, who of course goes back. That's a Kyle Dubas draft pick with Toronto. He's a guy that files for arbitration. Where do you think that all goes?

[Elliot]

You know what? I just hope it works out for him. Um, I really like. I really like Nick Robertson. Just dealing with him. He's such a. Like, you know why? He's just, you know, like, he's just such a nice, friendly. Always shakes hand, like he's one of those guys. He had a lot of ups. No, a lot of downs, and nine times out of 10, he was an absolute pleasure to deal with. I just hope it works out for him. You know, Chinnikov, chinikov just got 6.25 times three. I mean, if it works out half as well for Nick as it did for Chinikov there, that's a big win for everybody involved.

[Kyle]

All right.

[Elliot]

You know, the other one, too, is Carlson. All of a sudden, he's in the last year of his deal and now

[Kyle]

is, like, actually found a fit there.

[Elliot]

He had a phenomenal year last year. His bonus so Remember, I got this wrong and I was told, would you stop getting this wrong? So this year, his base salary is $1,500,000, and he has $6,000,000 in bonuses. I believe 2 million of that was paid on July 1st. And there's two other $2,000,000 payments throughout the season. So basically, right now he's five and a half in cash. And. But he was great for them last

[Kyle]

year, and he could be valuable in a multitude of ways, depending on how the Penguins look next year.

[Elliot]

Yep.

[Kyle]

But suddenly the dynamic and the conversation around them has changed. Very much so with where they went in the last year and a no

[Elliot]

move clause with say you got it.

[Kyle]

So from Pittsburgh out to San Jose, they were the darlings of the draft. And we talked about how they needed defensemen on their NHL roster. They went and got a few of those. Hello, Darnell Nurse. Hello, Jacob Truba. Hello, Michael Kesselring. Then some other ads up front. But again, we go back to where we started this whole podcast with what Leo Carlson signed for. And now looking at a guy like Macklin Celebrini who doesn't have to sign a contract this summer, but how much longer can the Sharks afford to wait?

[Elliot]

He will not go to July 1st. And that is a guy. Like, he's the max. And it's going to come down to him. Like we talked about with Makar. Does he want. Like, this is the way these conversations are going to go with San Jose. They're going to say, macklin, you deserve the max. And next year the max is going to be like 20, 22 million dollars, because the last year will be 113. So the max is going to be like 22.6 or whatever it is. And they're going to say to him, macklin, you deserve the max on the ice, off the ice, you deserve it 1 billion percent. Is there any way we can sign you without giving it to you so we can do some things around you? And that's going to be the answer. He will not get to July 1st. It is going to be signed well in advance of that. Like, I know San Jose is taking some heat for a couple for the Truba contract, but, you know, generally, I think they make really good decisions and I think they're going to. I think they'll get what they need to get done.

[Kyle]

Right. I was actually talking about that with somebody over the weekend was just that, like, since my career's taken over, like, he's done a lot. Some of it has taken time, of course, but there's Not a lot where you look at. And though, oh, man, what was he thinking there, you know. So with what has gone on since free agency opened, I'm just going. He's earned the benefit of. Let's see what this looks like with time.

[Elliot]

Yes, yes.

[Kyle]

That's where I'm at with this, like,

[Elliot]

look like, you know, it's interesting. They could have had Riley. They got nurse. I heard they really preferred nurse. I heard that was a preference. They, they had a choice and they took nurse over riley and he's 4 at 9.25. Now, the trouble one, that's a big one. There's no. When I, when I heard that, I was a little bit surprised. I thought it was going to go the other way. From what I heard was going on in Anaheim, like he wanted five or six years. I thought when Truba signed it was going to be five or six at a lower number. But they made this choice. I think the Kesselring one is fine. I know he had a rough year last year. I think he's better than that. I still think they could use a power play quarterback, and I think they might look for one. But to me, you know, the bigger one is like, to me, I think when you're on defense there, you're looking at Dickinson. Does he take a step? Do we think that this group they have around him this year, Nurse Truba, Orlov, Kesselring, Havilid, whoever's there. Do we think it gives Dickinson a better chance to make a step? I think in a year from now, if we look at him and we say he got better around this group, I think that's a win for those guys. But up front, man, they are going to, they are loaded and they are going to be fun to watch. You know, Mason Marchman, I think it was a really impressive thing getting to play there and wearing his dad's old number. I hope it works. I really do. And I'll tell you this, somebody told me that Marchmont was getting 7 million somewhere. It was just less than that. It was 6.75. So I'm not surprised at the number. But you know what, you know, Will Smith is a year away. We talked about Celebrini. What's that Will Smith extension gonna look like in a year? And I'll tell you this, that Chernishov kid is pretty good too. Vancouver really wanted him in the Sherwood deal. Didn't. Didn't get him, obviously. But like, and, and the other one I'm watching this year is Misa. You know, I'd love him. Scar off Dickinson. Those are the guys I want to see kind of take the step. You know, I'll say this. If, if, though if the rest of those guys grow, I'm not worried about the D contracts. I'm not. If those guys don't grow, then I worry about it more because I think those guys will be good enough to make the whole team better.

[Kyle]

All right, Seattle Kraken. So they, they went through the ringer not that long ago, of course, with the Jason Robertson stuff and there was the Panarin stuff earlier this year. And I just wanted to touch on what you had reported on the other day. And we had kind of talked about it a little bit over the last little while, Elliot. But it sounds like one way or another, by the time we get to next fall, Shane Wright will likely be playing elsewhere.

[Elliot]

So I, I did some interesting reaction to this stuff. I don't think the Kraken were really thrilled with the agent quote, Kurt Overheart, who represents Shane Wright. And as I wrote in the article, I think that while over. Kurt overheard had told me on the record that they agreed even though Seattle didn't want to talk about it. It was pretty clear from talking to other teams and that it's not a guarantee from the Kraken that they're not just going to do it to do it. And they've got to get something they feel is fair. But it's clear that we're headed in this direction and he's a right shot center and I think there is interest out there. It just comes down to does everybody agree on the price? You know, Kyle, as you mentioned, it hasn't been easy. I always choose to believe in the best. I have a life philosophy. Maybe today was a crappy day, but I really try to govern myself by when I wake up tomorrow, I'm going to be in a better mood and I'm going to try to make things better. You know, Seattle has done that big internal audit about the way they do things. I think the other thing you can always be asking is you can be asking your players and you can be asking their agents. You know, what do we have to do? Is there anything we're missing on what do we have to do? And the number one thing I believe that you have to do is no player is ever going to be more attached than to the team that drafts them. Right. Like when you. That day, like. And first of all, Seattle knocked it out of the park in the draft. Like Chase Reed fell to them. I thought that was a Huge get for them. I think that that's where you have to really work it. Like the guys who get drafted to you, the guys who put on that Kraken jersey for the first time, they're like, wow, I'm in the NHL now. This team believed in me. Those are the guys that you have to build yourself around now. I think this thing with Shane Wright, I don't think there was a player in hockey that was more affected by, like, Covid than Shane Wright was. Like, here was a guy who was at the top of the draft, was an absolute stud and basically didn't play for a year and a half. And I just think it's time for a fresh start. But I look at all these guys here. Neumann, 22, 21. Berkeley. Catton, 20, Winterton, 22. Samoskiewicz is a little bit different. They just brought him in, but he's still young. He's 23 years old. Benier's is 23. You know, those are the guys, you know, Riker Evans is a guy that Seattle believed in for a long time. He's 24. They've got another prospect that they feel really highly about. Oscar Fisker Mulgar, 21. He played his first 13 games last year and he had 34 points for Coachella Valley. He's. He's a center. Like, I think those are your drivers, right? Those are the guys you. You build around. And I know it's been hard for Seattle, but I always believe, like, look at Buffalo. We talked about them earlier a year ago, look where they were. And now you've got Hellabak and Trocheck saying, if I can get traded there, I'm going there. There's no reason you can't be that. You just have to keep building up through those guys, and one day you're going to get a big W and it's going to change. That's the only way you can think. The only way. To me, one of the most interesting things that's going to happen with their roster is Vince Dunn one more year at 7.35 than a Ufa Montour who still got term there. He's basically taken Dunn's role. So I'm curious to see, do they see extension or do they see they move them? Jared McCann, Seattle Success story, one more year, $5 million. How do they see that 40 goal scorer in the past? You know, they've got some interesting decisions to make with their, with their veterans. And again, I don't. I don't think they should. They probably want to Move this along as fast as they can. But if your best deal for Don and McCann, if you decide not to keep them, if your best moves are for players who are a little bit younger, I don't think these guys should be afraid of that. They should be selling themselves as you're going to get your opportunity here.

[Kyle]

Yeah. And especially with however that plays out with those two guys if they're not part of the long term plans. I mean we just talked about the swings they tried to make that didn't work out. Now you've got the opportunity to maximize what a return could look like there. Like you can't, you can't miss on those to try to set yourself up for better days ahead.

[Elliot]

Yeah, I, I, I don't disagree with you, Kyle. I just, I like I always believe and Buffalo again, that's a perfect. I always like I know Kraken fans are like ugh. But I always believe everything is fixable. I don't think that life can be lived any other way. Sometimes you have to go backwards to go forwards. But if that's the way it's got to be, that's the way it's got to be.

[Kyle]

The St. Louis Blues so in comes Connor McMichael in the Kyra deal with the Capitals. They wait out and get Mason McTavish out of Anaheim. They bring in Brandon Carlo to fill out the rest of their back end. I mean, I just refresh my memory. They were not a team that had trouble scoring per se last year. But you look at that forward group now, they look incredibly dangerous going into next year. Could be a lot of offense to be had with the Blues.

[Elliot]

Well, again, all of a sudden, how much better does Robert Thomas's deal look right now? How much better does Bushniewicz is Dylan Holloway McTavish, first of all, I thought there was a lot of McTavish slander recently. He's a better player. Look, the struggle. Yes. Do you have a tough time fitting at times this year? Yes, he's better than that. But all of those contracts look so much better now. Like, you know, I'll say this though, like in a year or even now. Are you trying to get Neighbors done? Are you trying to get Snugaroo done? You know, just because, just because you never know anymore what this is all going to look like. Neighbor's going to have Arb writes again next year. Right. So I mean like I love their contract situation. They have a lot of good players. You know, Broberg is eight for five more years. Pareco is Six and a half for four more years. Like, if you know, Binnington will be interesting, he's got one year left. What do they do? And Hofer is obviously a really good goalie. But you know, Kyle, first of all, I like the moves they've made. I think they have a chance to be a better team. But all of their contracts are good, really good. This. And, you know, now the only thing is, you know, Alex Stein's the new GM now. We don't really have a big, I don't, we don't know what he thinks or, well, not so much what he thinks, but we don't really have a long way of understanding how he's going to react or how he approaches things. The one thing I've heard is he's not a carbon copy of Doug Armstrong. They have some things that they agree on, but they have some things they disagree on. They're not carbon copies. You can't expect him to act as, equally as Armstrong did. But like, this team has a lot of flexibility to do a lot of things if they want to. And again, like, Perico could have been traded last year, Thomas could have been traded last year if they both agreed. But, you know, now their contracts are more attractive.

[Kyle]

I will say this, you certainly cannot fault Doug Armstrong or accuse him of putting Alex Steen in any kind of tough spot. Taken over for everything you just laid out. Got to figure out a new contract for Connor McMichael. But there's a lot to work with there in St. Louis and a lot of good things that they already have cooking in house.

[Elliot]

Yeah, you know, Ross Johnston, they, they really seem to target him. They gave, they, they gave him like, I, I, those are the kinds of guys I'm, I'm happy to see cash in. You know, it's three times two. It's hardly a big deal. But that guy's earned his money the hard way. You know, I, I just, I just look at this team and I see a talented roster without a lot of bad contracts. Kyle, you brought up McMichael and I agree with you. I think he's big, but the other guy I really think is big here is divorce. Two more years on his entry level deal. And I think if, like I look at them, they didn't score a lot last year and they lost Cairo. If I think Dvorski could be so important for that as a creative player. He scored 12 goals last year, first full season. You know, this is a guy who scored 45 in the OHL, and as a 19 year old had 21 in the American Hockey League. I think his ability to elevate them offensively, I think is. Is really huge for St. Louis potentially.

[Kyle]

Well, and how do you view the Tampa Bay Lightning? I mean, obviously they have no intentions of going anywhere in a very good division, but all of a sudden there you see Nikita Kucherov going into the last year of his deal. And when you look at how Julian Brise Bois and that organization has handled players that have been around a long time there have done a lot of good things for that franchise and they are not afraid to make tough decisions. I don't for a second think they would be looking at moving away from Nikita Kucherov. But now that we're at that point, the interest certainly is there of where this goes.

[Elliot]

Well, I think it's different with Kucherov because he's still at the top of his game, right? Like, you know, he just had look at the hardware he's. He's accumulated again. So, you know, he's. He's our hard trophy winner, right? So you can't, you can't look at him and say his game is falling off. I think it's a fascinating contract because I'm sure at one point they were thinking maybe they were getting him for right around the 95 he was at before. I am fascinated to see where this number is going to end up because you could make a case for especially depending on the term they want to do here. And Kucherov is going to turn. It just turned 33. He'll be 34 next June. Especially if they go short term, you could argue the number should be significantly bigger. I still think Tampa is very dangerous. I look at this group, a lot of their big minute players had strong years last year. Kucherov was obviously great. I thought Hagel was great, Gensel was great, Sorelli was great, Moser was great, took a huge step, got a big extension and Vasilevsky was obviously fantastic. Can all those guys duplicate that? I think there were a couple of big minute players that had tougher years last year, you know, Point got hurt. I think he was one of them. And obviously Headman and everybody's rooting for Headman. I think they need both those guys to return to form. I think I look at Headman now and he's been through so much physically and emotionally. I think you recognize that the role he takes might be a little bit different, but it doesn't mean he's not an important critical player for your team. So I think Point and Headman are going to be very, very critical in terms of their return. But also like I look at Connor Geeky, it's, it's time for him. We saw Dominic James at the end of last year. Can he still be one of those guys? Gage Gonzalez scored a big overtime goal. Lilleberg I liked. I'm very interested to see if Sam O'Reilly makes this team next year. You know, I like Veal for them, I liked McKay. Ev for them. It wouldn't like. I think they tried Ryan O'Reilly last year and I wouldn't be surprised if maybe they poked around another center of that kind of level and if they could do something and obviously it didn't happen, you know, but it's interesting. Like I think they have growth in this roster. I think they do. Like every year people say to me, oh, they've, they've hit their, their peak and they're going to fall. I don't believe that from this group. Even though some of their players are older, I think they've still got a lot to give and, but I think a key is can some of those younger guys. I don't want to put too much pressure on O'Reilly, but I think eventually and I don't know when it'll be, I think he has a chance to be a real game changer for them and I think the Carlson fit is fantastic

[Kyle]

for sure. Especially with Radish moving on to Toronto. Great decision to bring in John Carlson there for, for the Lightning. They've got, I think they have a pretty good reputation out there in terms of their development path. You know, especially think about those guys. Elliot, that other late round draft pick didn't get an opportunity where they started. Maybe an undrafted player that has been playing pro elsewhere. I think the words certainly out there that if you're willing to put in the work, there can be a path in Tampa.

[Elliot]

I think the tough thing always there has been like the top end opportunity. They have so many great players there that take those spots.

[Kyle]

Yeah, but there are, but you're right.

[Elliot]

If you want to accept a role, they will give you a role. They will give you one.

[Kyle]

Okay, Elliot, the Toronto Maple Leaf. So you've been a believer that they could have gone one of two directions here with the new regime and it's all about the next couple of years and John Ceika has certainly been operating as such. A number of new faces have been brought into the fold. We know Gavin McKenna will be wearing number 92 because they land Sergei Bobrovsky in goal. Three years to get him done. Where else? Bluegrass, Sizz Duhame, Nick Paul, Jack Roslovic, Emil Andre. Of course they had him sign Elliott. And there's Darren Radish on top of all of that. It is a different looking Toronto Maple Leaf team going forward, to say nothing of a new head coach and the new front office that's been in place for a couple of months now.

[Elliot]

So I'll tell you a funny story. On July 1, I didn't realize it, but I was, you know, everything's going a million miles an hour. And I reported that duheem signed for three times 1.85 and it was really three times 2.6. And I heard that Duhaim was like, you gotta get him to change that. I wouldn't sign for that. And I fixed it. Oops.

[Kyle]

At least someone's keeping you honest.

[Elliot]

Yeah, sorry, Brandon. I'll apologize in person in. At training camp. I didn't want to shortchange you. You know, I'll say this about Toronto. We mentioned before with Carolina, they're still out there lurking. I think Toronto is also still hopeful to add another difference maker. Now, it may not be now, it may be later, but I think that's what they're considering. You know, they, they didn't give up any of their futures really. And I think that they have and they even restock some. I think they kind of looked at it as we kept that powder dry to stay alive and any opportunities that might arise. So that's one thing with Toronto. But I do think, and I think the whole organization feels this way, they really believe that Matthews is still the elite of the elite. They really believe it and they are hoping that he shows up healthy and ready to go and he drives the bus. They still believe that he is the bus driver of this team and that they, they've added around them and they think all these players are going to help and make them better. But they still feel that he is the critical key to the engine and that's going to be a very, very important part of next year. You know, Bobrovsky this 3 times 7 that the Leaf signed for, I heard that was his last ask of Florida and Florida was not willing to go there. They made their decision and Toronto gave him the offer that Florida wouldn't do. I think it's going to be fascinating. I think he's, I think he's a really motivated guy. I think he wants to prove there's a lot still there. I, you know, they don't have to worry about Hildeby anymore. Because they trade him. I was kind of wondering if Hildeby was there, if they might carry three goalies. But we don't have to think about that anymore. But I'm looking forward to watching Bobrovsky work. And I'm like everybody else, this could be boom, this could be bust. But they are very, very comfortable betting on him. I mean, I don't know where else. You know, the other one here we should talk about initially is Morgan Riley. I said that there's a chance they keep him. I don't know if that made everybody involved happy. There was some reporting after that he would like to move on. I just think that the. I don't know if that's true or not. I know it's out there. I just heard that Toronto told people they're not paying a big price to move them. Like, if it's something they consider too much of a sweetener, they won't do it. And I think one thing that hurt them, as we talked about with San Jose, is that San Jose with a choice, seemed to prefer Nurse over Riley. You know, I look at their D, Radish, McCabe, Tanov, Ekman, Larson, Andre Stetcher. If Riley comes back, they'll try to make it work for him. I think they feel that with a new approach and maybe a bit of a different role, that could help them. You know, I think he's a fantastic human being. I hope it works out for him. But I heard Toronto told teams they are not paying a big sweetener to trade them.

[Kyle]

So you mentioned, you know, the Kings situating themselves where somewhere down the line, if there's the opportunity to make an LA type move, they can pounce. You read into it at all of all the signings they did.

[Elliot]

I think there's. I think there's something to do that here. It's also two years that, you know, Matthews is up. Right. So I think there's that part of it. But yes, I do think that they did that on purpose. You know, nice things probably calmed down around him for a little bit, which is probably best for him. I was talking to someone the other day, was like, I feel sorry for that kid. His name is in a new trade rumor every day. And maybe it calms down around him. Yep, it's. You know, I don't know how this is all going to go, Kyle. Like I said, it could be boom, it could be bust, but it's not going to be boring. And I'll say this, like, I've heard a lot of the returning players who Were very demoralized at the end of last year. Really liked what was done. They feel much better about their team.

[Kyle]

It's certainly different, and we'll see how much better it is for Toronto after. So, yeah, felt like whatever could go wrong did go wrong, particularly in the back half of their season last year. Okay, the Utah.

[Elliot]

I want to. McKenna. McKenna. I don't know who does his media training, but he said everything, right.

[Kyle]

Well, I mean, he was a guy that didn't go big on the skills coach and this coach, and then that coach, growing up, just played. I don't know, maybe a lot of that. I'm sure. Of course there's some training there, but maybe a lot of that is just who he is, too.

[Elliot]

Yeah, I thought he. I thought he hit every right note. He didn't have any stumbles, and everyone's always looking for you to stumble. Right? And I don't think he had any of that. And that's also a big, you know, win for him and them as they. As they start the season. I think. I think one of the more fascinating ones, too, is going to be Nylander. I think last year was. Was a really tough year between Nylander and the organization, but everybody gets a fresh start. Everybody gets something new. And, you know, we talked about Matthews and how important he was. I think Nylander is going to be pretty important, too. But like I said at the top, we were talking about this team. I don't think they're done swinging. I think if there's something out there that they could do that they see as impactful, they will do it.

[Kyle]

All right, well, how about Utah then? Are they done swinging? They were a team that was believed to be out there looking to do something big. I mean, they bring in Vincent Trocheck, that's not nothing. They sign Anders Lee, Andrew Peak for some depth on the blue line. What else do you think Utah is looking at, if anything?

[Elliot]

So, Kyle, number one on their list is the offer sheet with Hayden. They have to decide what they want to do with this. Like I said, we talked about the New Jersey part of it. I heard the negotiations between Hayton and the Jazz. They're not the Jazz. That's their NBA twin brother. Hayton and the Mammoth were really, really tough. Like, Utah drew a hard line and they weren't budging, and that's kind of why we kind of got into this situation. Normally with offer sheets, my position is match. Unless they really give you a reason not to or the player isn't a fit for you. I look at the Mammoth. And I can make a real argument here that they shouldn't match. Now, Hayton can play center. I don't like to give up on centers, and he's a bit of a bigger player. And Utah is not the biggest team, but particularly with there with Trocheck now, you know, down the middle, you've got Trocheck, you've got schmaltz, you've got McBain, who I really like. You've got Stanland. You know, I guess you could keep hating there is a bit of a utility, but I just don't get the sense that the Mammoth and Hayton are overly thrilled with one another. And I just wonder if it's the better move to take the pick. Move on and see what you can do with the pick. That's just my opinion. I can see a situation here where Utah doesn't match, like we said with Montreal. The number one thing I like about the Mammoth, Kyle, is their contracts look good. Cooley is signed. 10 million. That looks tremendous. Schmaltz has signed 8 million. Remember when they signed Genther? He hadn't even played a full season yet. And that contract at 7.1 looks fantastic. You know, Keller is going to be up. He's eligible for an extension next summer. They'll have to figure out what they do there. You know, McBain, four more years at 4.25. That's fantastic. You know, even on the blue line this the circuit. Chevy had a rough playoff, but his contract is fine. So is weaker. They don't. You look at their contracts and you don't see, oh, boy, they've got a problem. Like, they're in really good shape. Trocheck is a big win for them. Last year they tried to trade for Trocheck and they. He was on their no trade or. Sorry, they were on his no trade. He just vetoed it. He said no. Trocheck took Utah off his no trade this time around, and that's one of the reason the deal got done. And I think that's a real credit to the Mammoth and what they're building that he was willing to go there this time around. And they got him there. And I think he will be a great fit for them. Kosa, is he ready to be an NHL backup? That's a big one. Vamelka got burned out last year, played a lot of games, led the league, and then got tired at the end of the playoff series. Kosa giving Velka minutes, I think is critical. And the other thing with them is their top prospects. IGINLA does he start to bid for a job then why a still young got time. How far away is he? Like, we've talked about these Utah prospects for years now. How close are they to really taking a spot? But I like this team. I like their contracts. Cooley's 22. He's only going to get better. Gunther, 23, is only going to get better. I think Lee is a good fit for them because he brings in something they don't have a lot of. He's not as fast as a lot of these other guys, obviously, but he can score in a different way. I thought that was a good piece for them.

[Kyle]

Yeah. Because what did we feel watching them in the playoffs? They had no issue with the pace.

[Elliot]

No.

[Kyle]

But the heaviness of Vegas as that series wore on, you could tell it. It played a role there and it was a Different bodies. Don't want to lose the speed as a whole, as a group. But yeah, I can't see that as a coincidence that they would target. I mean, Trocheck for one, but Lee as well. Just elements they didn't have before, higher up their lineup.

[Elliot]

We're running out of steam. Three teams left.

[Kyle]

I know.

[Elliot]

Hang in there.

[Kyle]

We're almost there. The Vancouver Canucks. So we're looking at this Elliott, all the players they brought in over the last couple of weeks. You can kind of break down individually what they all bring. It just seems like first and foremost, yes, there's the development, yes, there's where they ultimately want to get to in the long term. But job number one, it feels like for Rian Johnson is redefining what it means to be a Vancouver Canuck fair.

[Elliot]

I think there's no arguing that. You know, one thing that got a lot of play were Teddy Bluer's comments after he signed in Toronto about what it was like there. This is a. This is one unhappy group, really unhappy group last year. And you know, in addition to the fact of what Bluer said, I think there were some guys who kind of arrived midway through or came in at the end of last year. They were surprised about how it was. Like, I think it was a really beaten down, defeated. It had been just a long couple of years kind of group. And now I think that's what Manny Malhotra's main job is going to be. Turn the page. It's over. New regime and we're doing things differently. And he's going to try to build some of these guys up and he's going to give the young players a bigger responsibility. And you Know, I think it's like we talked before with Calgary. There's going to be some nights where you can really see the promise, and there's going to be some nights where, oh, boy, this looks really ugly. And that's just the way you go. You know, they brought in some veterans. Sometimes I think term hurts you more than money. They didn't do any of that. And the other thing also, like, like Paul Cotter, that was one of the signings I really liked. I think he's a good player. That's a guy who might get you something next year at the deadline. And you know, Alexia was 2 times 5. Same thing. Whether he's playing for you or he's playing for somewhere else, that's a guy you can flip maybe for something at the deadline. I think a big one next year is going to be Le Cara Mackie. I think one of the things they're really hoping is that playing for Malhotra, who he was with in the American Hockey League, Malhotra will have an idea of how to unlock him or give him a better chance to succeed in the NHL. I think that's a big one for them. But next year is going to be all about, does V. Lander get better? Does Bouilliam get better? Does Pedersen, the defenseman, get better? Does La Caramaki get better? Does Ogren get better? You know, I don't know if they think Coots is going to be ready for the NHL or he plays somewhere else next year. You know, do all of these guys get better? And then at the top of the structure. Look, we talked about Pedersen. You know, I. I think he's got. He's got six more years. Does what happened with the salaries change the conversation for him? We talked about Pittsburgh earlier. He has to agree to this. But I think we all feel he needs a change of scenery. And I just think these kinds of things will happen with time, that more of the players who have long term, they'll be available. And when Johnson gets what he wants and they agree to it because all them have some degree of protection, they'll move on. Like you still need some veterans to play with your kids, to shield them, to help them. But I think we can see what's happening in Vancouver. I don't think they have any specific plans for here on in, but they will do things to help, not jeopardize the rebuild.

[Kyle]

I think about early on when St. Louis took over in Montreal, that line of, you know, you plant the trees, even though you're not likely to still be around to enjoy their shade. There's a lot of that going on in Vancouver right now with who they brought in.

[Elliot]

Yep.

[Kyle]

Setting the tone of where they hope to be, even if they're not going to be part of it. When they're ready to win, if it's

[Elliot]

done right and you know what they like those players will be able to take some minutes, but I think they all know that there's going to be. There's going to be times where those big minutes, they're going to be played by the kids. You know why you're here. Right. Maybe we shine you up and you go somewhere else, but the kids are more important than you are right now.

[Kyle]

The Vegas Golden Knights, Elliot. So runner up last year fall to Carolina in six games. A team that by and large a lot of familiar faces coming back. Yes, Dorothy is in New York now, but Rasmus Anderson gets his extension done at 8 and a half million per. How do you feel about Vegas and where do you think their priorities lie over the summer months?

[Elliot]

See, I don't think we're done hearing from them. You know, one of the things that's very obvious is that people believe like they. There's a lot of people who believe that there's going to be less vacation. They said, good luck going on vacation this year. I said, oh, I'm going on vacation. But they said good luck with that because there's going to be stuff happening all summer between the Macaras and the Hughes and the extensions that they are eligible for and Bedard too, and the trade requests, Kyle, and the trades that are going to happen. They said that this is not going to be a quiet summer. There's going to be tremors and maybe earthquakes all the way through. And this is one team that I don't think we've heard the last of. At least I think they'll try. You know, the Rasmus Anderson thing was pretty interesting because there were some rumors during the Stanley cup final that maybe they wouldn't do the deal. I didn't really believe that. And at the end it turned out to be completely correct. They had a handshake with Anderson, nothing illegal. They had some cap issues they had to sort out and they stayed to it. We did hear also during the Cup Final there was a chance that they would move on from DorothyV because they just didn't think they would be able to do what his numbers indicated. They weren't going that high and that's exactly what happened. I thought it was interesting that Kelly McCrimmon said Aiden Hill. He thinks he's better than he showed because there were definitely a lot of rumors about him, too. But McCrimmon indicated he'll keep him as a duo with Carter Hart. I still think, Kyle, that they will be trying to do something, whether it's Lin or it's something else. I don't think we. It's just not their DNA. It's like we talked about before with Minnesota. Bill Garon has a certain way about him. So do the Golden Knights. To me, two of the more fascinating conversations are going to be around Mark Stone and William Carlson. Both of them are heading into the final years of their contracts. You know, William Carlson this year, he's. He missed almost all of the season. He came back, he made an immediate impact and they were not the same after he got knocked out of the final. Like he is still. He'll be 34 in January. He is still a very, very important player to their team. Stone just turned 34 and he's the captain, he's the leader. You know, it was interesting at the Stanley Cup Final, he said that he had no idea about some of the trades that Kelly McCrimmon did. He says he knows some. I think he said the Rasmus Anderson one. He had no idea that one was coming. I think that was the one.

[Kyle]

If I'm.

[Elliot]

If I said. If it's a different one, I forgot. But I think. I think McCrimmon really depends on him. You know, some captains, the GM says no, you run the room, I run the team. I don't think Stone is going out of his way to collect more information about things. But I do think Kelly McCrimmon, who coached Stone in junior, really depends on him to know the pulse of his team. You know, McCrimmon is one of those guys who has to know everything, and it's very important to know the pulse of his team. And I think Stone is that guy. Eichel is kind of like the league social convener. I hear, like a lot of players kind of call him, but Stone is the one who has, who runs the room. And, you know, I think those are. Those are going to be two very interesting contracts for Vegas. They keep who they want. That's what they do. But they're both father times undefeated and they're both getting closer to that aging curve. And they've both battled a lot, lot of injuries which has, not to their credit, hurt their effectiveness.

[Kyle]

Yes. And Stone in particular, I think in a lot of ways, a lot of his career has involved some element of, oh, you Think I can't do this? Oh, you think I'm. I'm done now? Or you think I won't be able to still play? Just watch. Just watch. We were talking during the final on one of the off days, just that whole, I mean, it's followed him, as he said, since he was a teenager, the idea of foot speed. Right. It was gonna cost him. And he kind of joked at the end, said, you know, I've managed to plod my way to a half decent career through, through all of that. So that was a good way of putting it.

[Elliot]

You know, it's interesting.

[Kyle]

A lot of time for Mark.

[Elliot]

I do too. You know, Theodore ran out of gas at the end of the year too. I thought he had a fantastic season. I thought he ran out of gas at the end of the year. I don't know if there's any way they can fix that, but he did so much for this team this year and he played so great. I thought in addition to the Carlson injury, one of the things that changed the course of the Stanley cup final was after he scored his overtime winner in that incredible game. I think he really, I think he hit a wall.

[Kyle]

He was asked to do a lot.

[Elliot]

Yes. And, and he delivered.

[Kyle]

Yeah. No question. Okay, a couple more here. Elliot, the Washington Capital. So last pod, we talked about Alex Tuck being in the mix now Jordan Cairo as well, and Alex Ovechkin is coming back for another year. I wasn't surprised, were you?

[Elliot]

No, I, I was leaning towards that, especially at the, when he didn't shake hands at the end with Pittsburgh. I just heard like, I heard he was really down at the deadline when Carlson got traded. That one really hurt them. But then when I think he saw like Hudson and the younger, definitely not smaller producer and some of the moves they made in the off season for Cairo and Tuck, I had a feeling he was, he was coming back. Like, somebody told me that the rumor was that he wanted a two year deal, which obviously the Capitals didn't do. I am actually fascinated to watch it too because, like, part of me is looking at it. Like, I wonder if we see him deployed differently like they, like last year, they still needed him to do a lot of things and they really had trouble scoring, which is still the one thing he does best of all. Right. Like this year with Kyru there and Tuck there, they should score more. So, like, that's one of the things I'm curious about is Ovechkin's, like, he still gets probably first power play, but how much does his Role change. How much do we see his maybe even strength. Time change. I'm curious about all that. And, you know, Ken Holland talked about this with Drew Doughty. He said, when I was in Detroit, we had like 10 hall of Famers. I saw them on the back nine of their career and dealt with it. It's a hard thing to do. And I'm not trying to make this a big negative, but I looked at the roster and the way they were building it, and I was like, it's going to be interesting to see how they piece it all together at even strength. So I'm very interested to watch it. These guys had all sorts of trouble scoring last year. It shouldn't be the case next year. They're a lot better on paper. A lot better. You know, you look at Ryan Leonard, okay, Ryan Leonard's agent is the Caters, who just did the big deal with Leo Carlson. Now, this doesn't mean that everybody here should be running and screaming and worried about what Leonard's future. But if you're the Capitals, you're looking at this and saying, hey, we realize the landscape has changed here and we better be prepared for this. And Leonard is obviously a huge part of the capital's future. In addition to Leonard, Sortif is a restricted free agent. After next year, he will be arbitration eligible, which Leonard won't be. So, you know, like other teams, you're looking at the changing landscape and you're saying we better be prepared to deal with this ourselves. But the, the thing there, too is not only should they be better with Cairo and Tuck, but Leonard, the younger produce, Cole Hudson, Sortif, if these guys can take leaps and they're all really talented guys and, and Hudson in particular has pretty elite offensive skills. I think what Washington's hoping is not only do Tuck and Cairo make them better, but these guys all continue to improve and take more of a role. And that makes us better, too. Like, they rise us as well. That's why I think it's so fascinating as to where Ovechkin is going to fit and how he's going to be used, because I think they're hoping that some of these players can take bigger roles. And it's tougher to do that with Ovechkin just because of he's Ovechkin. You know, the other thing I thought was interesting was I was pretty sure this summer they were going to deal Charlie Lindgren, and they didn't. They kept them because they think he's so important for Logan Thompson. I just didn't know if the Capitals felt a backup making 3 million was something that they could handle, and they just felt it was too important for Thompson to make the deal. I think. I think Washington's going to take a big jump.

[Kyle]

I'm with you. I like what they've done. I like what their lineup looks like. We'll see in the fall. Great that Ovechkin is back for another year. Okay, one more Team 32, the Winnipeg Jets.

[Elliot]

I need. I need a vacation from this vacation at the end of this podcast.

[Kyle]

Some vacation this is, eh? How long this podcast is.

[Elliot]

God.

[Kyle]

Well, Dom alluded to on.

[Elliot]

I think we started this podcast. We were on round two of the draft.

[Kyle]

Yeah. Yes, exactly. There was still pizza uneaten.

[Elliot]

So.

[Kyle]

So the Jets, Elliot. I mean, there's the Connor Halibut conversation still to be had and determine where that goes. They bring in Stu Skinner. Colorfetti needs a new contract. But I kind of asked this of Jason Buchal and Sam Cosentino on our free agency show was. I mean, where. What direction do you go if you're the jets at this point with all this going on?

[Elliot]

You know, one thing I wanted to say first is that, you know, there's been a lot going on in this league right now, and you're talking about migration of players out of Canada and into the United States. You know, the one thing I think the NHL has to be aware of, and I figured I would talk about it here when we talked about the jets, is in a lot of ways, Canada is still the golden goose. Right. A good chunk of the league's revenue, third of it, comes out of the Canadian teams. A lot of the interest comes from here. We just signed a big new TV deal with them. The league is very healthy and US is very important to every country is important. But Canada is still very important to the overall economic health of the league. League. And I from every once in a while, I like to remind everybody not to take that for granted. And in moments like these or times like these, when this is going on, I do worry that sometimes they take it for granted. Look, we just saw Canada's best ever performance in the World cup. Was pretty thrilling to watch. I just think that if you keep disappointing your Canadian fans, eventually you risk turning them off. And I don't think that's now. I don't think that's necessarily a year from now, but it could happen. And I don't think that's a good thing for the league. I wanted to say that. I say it periodically. I wanted to Say it now. And I figured right here was the perfect spot. I don't think the jets are going to change, Kyle, in terms of their goal. Their goal is to win. Their goal is to compete, and I don't think that changes. We'll get to hello, Buck, in a second. I think that you mentioned Perfetti. I think that's a huge priority for them. He filed for arbitration on Sunday. I think they want to get that done. You know, the jets as a team, they've kind of moved the line a bit contract wise. They can grind, sure, but you look at Kyle Conner last year, you know, they gave Kyle Connor the kind of contract they've never given anyone before with the bonuses and the big number. So they, you know, obviously Cole Perfetti is not going to do what Kyle Conner did contract wise, but I think they recognize he's an important person and I think they want to show that. They were really thrilled to get Vigo Viggo Bjork at the draft and I assume they're going to try to get a contract done with him as well. The key thing for them is two years ago they had a dynamite year. Many of their guys had career seasons and they had down years. Either injury or they just couldn't get back to that level. The biggest key is bounce back. And I think also with the jets, it's youth time. Lambert, Roseanne, Solomonson, and he played well at the end. He'll be hurt. He won't start the year, but it looks like it's his time. I thought Ferraro was a really good signing for them. I think he was the kind of player that they could use again to see. Still a big one. I wouldn't be surprised if Bjork has given a chance to show. Is he in any way ready for that? Jaeger? They've kind of talked about that. I mean, they've got to plug it from within. It's going to be a different team. They signed Skinner. I thought that was a really interesting signing. I think we all know about the elephant of the room. We'll see what happens with hello, Buck. They have talked about can they convince him to come back. I think that's going to be a really hard thing to do. I'm not counting on that. The more I hear about it, the more I believe that the biggest hurdle with the Sabers was they were getting the fourth overall pick from Buffalo and they wanted to keep eight. Buffalo was like, no, if we're giving you four, we have to get eight back. I think Winnipeg wanted both those picks and that's why it didn't happen. I don't know where this goes, but I think it's going to be hard to convince Hellback to stay. But I do think that, you know, one of the things with the jets is do they make their young players wait too long? I think the I think it's going to be interesting this year because I don't think they're going to be afraid of. If Bjorker Jaeger gives them a reason to give them a shot at 2C, I don't think they're going to be afraid to try that.

[Kyle]

There's opportunity there, no question. The Jets a great example each and every year of how special of a place that is when you can be successful. And trying to get back to that after a real disappointing season in 25, 26. Oh. All right. 32 teams down and now just like

[Elliot]

I, I, we just, we just did this podcast. I have no idea if it made any sense.

[Kyle]

All I do know is that the only people listening at this point are you, me, and Dom. So you can say anything.

[Elliot]

You know, normally I listen to the pod just to make sure.

[Kyle]

Sure.

[Elliot]

Did I make any mistakes or someone calls me and says, I can't believe you said that. I know what they're talking about. I am not listening to this.

[Kyle]

It's probably for the best.

[Elliot]

Tom just wrote, I'm not listening.

[Kyle]

He's not listening to it either. Well, we should probably then get to the final thought presented by your Canadian Toyota dealers. The final thought from you, Elliot, before we enter the summer hiatus.

[Elliot]

Well, you know, I just wanted to say thank you to you. And I just wanted to say thank you to Dom and you guys are great for me. I know I'm a demanding guy and I know that I'm always late. And I know that I'll say that sucked and make us do it all over again, which I'm not doing on this pod, by the way. That's just not happening. But both of you are critical for this pod. You know, we're lucky we got a lot of people who listen. We have a great listenership and there's no pod without the listeners. And I thank you all very much. But. And what always makes work best are the people you work with. And Kyle, you and Dom are great for me and I appreciate everything because I know I'm not the easiest guy to work with.

[Kyle]

Nah, you are. It's all worth it in the end. Dom, I will follow in the coattails of Elliot Friedman. And thank Our fantastic listeners who are always active on Twitter and elsewhere where they get in touch with us and

[Elliot]

tell us how much they listen to

[Kyle]

the podcasts in person too. I absolutely love it when people tell me in person that they listen all the time. So thank you very much and also thank you to the two of you. Elliot, you are always late, but you do make this as easy as you can, so I do appreciate it. And Kyle, I I always write you about coffee and Family Guy and whatnot. So appreciate your friendships, both of you, and I hope you both have great summers. It's so great from an audience perspective how they keep us on our toes, how they recognize where there's a potential bit to exploit and they walk right through that door, much to all of our enjoyment and entertainment. They are on the ball with all of this stuff and so not only do they listen, they really do follow each and every week, which is so, so cool. I was thinking about Elliot, how long this season was. So start of the season in Italy.

[Elliot]

This was a long year. Long year.

[Kyle]

Started the season in Italy. Enjoyed some AC action, though we later learned that you, Eliot wants no part of AC in your hotel room at night. We made the annual voyage to the desert to quench our thirst for conversation with the league's best. We did some work and played some golf together in Edmonton and pei. We got together in Toronto a few times to hear from the likes of Josh Doane and Connor Bedard and Frank Nazar. We put back shots of maple syrup in Moncton and we also admired Dom's complicated shorts in the hotel lobby way past our bedtime. We paid Milan another visit for the Olympics. There was no gold for Canada and hockey this year, though. Elliot, you did get your cigarette. We shared coffee on set during another trade deadline. We shared Elliot's room while recording on the road at the GM meetings. We put up with each other for not one but three playoff rounds this spring. Buffalo and Montreal and Carolina and Vegas, where the Stanley cup was handed out. The grind overall. But the one thing I learned is that I look better in overalls. We went back to Buffalo for the draft, a city known for its wings. But Dom made the trip about pizza. And then we gathered on Canada Day. One last show on TV for the season and now the final podcast of the season. And we enter this new era on Rodgers with the NHL in the fall. Can't say what where that journey will take us, but I wouldn't change a thing about how we got here. So thank you both. What a year. Thank you.

[Elliot]

What a year.

[Kyle]

Have a great summer, everybody.