99% Invisible: Constitution Breakdown #1 - Featuring Nikole Hannah-Jones

Release Date: July 25, 2025

Hosts: Roman Mars & Elizabeth Jo

Introduction

In the premiere episode of "Constitution Breakdown," Roman Mars teams up with constitutional law professor Elizabeth Jo to dissect the United States Constitution. Joined by esteemed journalist Nikole Hannah-Jones, the discussion delves deep into the nuances of the Constitution’s preamble, its historical interpretations, and its relevance in contemporary legal and political landscapes.

1. Understanding the Preamble

Timestamp: 03:32 - 04:12

Roman Mars introduces the episode by highlighting the brevity yet profound significance of the Constitution’s preamble. At just 52 words, the preamble encapsulates the foundational goals of the nation, making it a focal point for interpretation and debate.

a. The Text and Its Significance

Roman reads the preamble:

“We the people of the United States, in order to form a more perfect union, establish justice, ensure domestic tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general welfare, and secure the blessings of liberty to ourselves and our posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.”

Timestamp: 04:12 - 05:20

He emphasizes the weight each word carries, setting the stage for a comprehensive exploration of its meaning and impact.

b. Nikole Hannah-Jones on "We the People"

Nikole Hannah-Jones reflects on the inclusive language of the preamble:

“When you think about ‘We the People,’ it excludes so many, particularly Black Americans who were not considered part of this collective when the Constitution was written.”

Timestamp: 05:20 - 06:04

She underscores the historical exclusions embedded within the foundational document and the ongoing struggle for inclusive interpretation.

c. Elizabeth Jo's Legal Perspective

Elizabeth Jo breaks down the preamble’s purpose:

“The preamble specifies the source of constitutional authority, outlines six overarching goals, and indicates the framers’ intent for the document to endure through generations.”

Timestamp: 06:04 - 07:27

She highlights the balance between specificity and vagueness, allowing for broad interpretation over time.

2. Historical Context and Legal Interpretations

a. Dred Scott Case and Constitutional Flaws

The conversation shifts to the infamous 1857 Dred Scott v. Sandford case, where the Supreme Court ruled that Black Americans could not be considered citizens under the Constitution. Nikole addresses the ripple effects of this decision:

“Dred Scott is the root of the endemic racism we see today, legitimizing the notion that Black people are inherently inferior.”

Timestamp: 17:15 - 18:34

b. Jacobson v. Massachusetts and the Preamble’s Legal Standing

Elizabeth Jo discusses the 1905 Jacobson v. Massachusetts case, which effectively dismissed the preamble as a source of legal rights:

“The Supreme Court ruled that the preamble does not confer any rights or powers, limiting its use in legal arguments.”

Timestamp: 21:23 - 23:11

This decision set a precedent that the preamble is more of an aspirational statement rather than a legally enforceable section.

3. The Constitution in Modern Times

a. The Fragility of Constitutional Protections

Nikole reflects on the evolving nature of constitutional protections:

“For marginalized groups, the Constitution is a document of hope that requires constant vigilance to ensure rights are upheld.”

Timestamp: 26:27 - 29:13

b. Supreme Court’s Role and Current Concerns

The discussion turns to the Supreme Court's conservative leanings and their impact on civil rights:

“With a Supreme Court that often sidelines minority protections, there's a growing fear of regression in civil liberties.”

Timestamp: 29:13 - 32:08

Nikole expresses concern over the Court's direction, fearing it may become one of the most regressive in history.

4. Contemporary Constitutional Crisis: Military Use in Civilian Affairs

a. Historical Parallel: 1970 Wildcat Postal Strike

Elizabeth Jo recounts the 1970 Wildcat Postal Strike, where President Nixon deployed the military to break the strike, highlighting the tension between military intervention and civil liberties.

“Operation Graphic Hand was an unprecedented use of the military for domestic purposes, setting a precedent for future crises.”

Timestamp: 56:57 - 60:46

b. Modern Implications: Trump's Use of National Guard for ICE

The episode analyzes President Trump's 2025 actions to deploy the National Guard in California to support ICE raids, bypassing traditional legal frameworks like the Insurrection Act.

“Trump’s memorandum lacks specificity, seemingly targeting peaceful protests and undermining constitutional protections.”

Timestamp: 64:07 - 80:03

c. Legal Challenges and Posse Comitatus Act

Elizabeth explains the Posse Comitatus Act's role in limiting military involvement in civilian law enforcement and how Trump’s actions circumvented traditional exceptions.

“By invoking 10 USC 12406, Trump sidestepped the Insurrection Act, raising concerns about the overreach of executive power.”

Timestamp: 60:50 - 73:06

d. Implications for Civil Liberties

The deployment of military forces for immigration enforcement is critiqued as a threat to civil liberties, with Elizabeth and Nikole expressing alarm over the erosion of constitutional norms.

“This aggressive militarization signals an authoritarian shift, where dissent is equated with rebellion.”

Timestamp: 82:36 - 85:25

5. Conclusion and Reflections

Roman Mars wraps up the episode by emphasizing the Constitution's enduring yet fragile nature. The discussions highlight the ongoing tension between foundational ideals and their real-world applications, especially in times of political and social upheaval.

Notable Quotes

• Nikole Hannah-Jones:

  “Every aspect of America was shaped in some way by slavery and its legacy.”
  [05:20]

• Elizabeth Jo:

  “The preamble specifies the source of constitutional authority and outlines the framers’ intent for the document to endure.”
  [06:04]

• Roman Mars:

  “The Constitution is both specific and necessarily vague, allowing for broad interpretation over time.”
  [07:34]

• Nikole Hannah-Jones:

  “Black folks read the Constitution as demanding liberty, transforming it from a pro-slavery document to a beacon of freedom.”
  [15:24]

• Elizabeth Jo:

  “The use of military forces in civilian law enforcement without clear legal grounds undermines constitutional protections.”
  [64:07]

Final Thoughts

"Constitution Breakdown #1" offers a profound exploration of the United States Constitution, blending historical analysis with pressing contemporary issues. Through the expertise of Elizabeth Jo and the insightful commentary of Nikole Hannah-Jones, listeners gain a nuanced understanding of how foundational texts shape and are shaped by the societal forces around them.

Produced by Isabel Angel, Edited by Committee, Music by Swan Rial. Executive Producer: Kathy Tu.