A Late Diagnosis: Losing My Mom to Rare Disease

Summary

A Place of Yes | A Grief Podcast
Episode: "A Late Diagnosis: Losing My Mom to Rare Disease"
Host: Heather (Bright Sighted)
Guest: Olivia
Release Date: June 26, 2025

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Introduction

In this heartfelt episode of "A Place of Yes," Heather sits down with Olivia to explore the profound journey of losing a parent to a rare disease. Olivia shares her personal experience of grief, the unexpected nature of her mother's passing, and how she has channeled her pain into positive endeavors, including her recent graduation from nursing school.

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Olivia's Background

Olivia provides listeners with an overview of her life, emphasizing her academic and professional achievements amidst personal tragedy.

• Graduation and Career Path:
  [01:26] Olivia recounts, "I graduated nursing school in December of last year. I started nursing school like two years ago, probably two months after my mom passed away. That was a little bit difficult time, but honestly, I love it."

• Entry into Nursing:
  [01:42] She explains, "So not necessarily nursing was always something you wanted to do... I kind of just jumped into it and then ended up really liking it."

• Educational Challenges:
  Olivia shares her struggles during the COVID-19 pandemic, including transferring schools to find a better environment for her studies and personal circumstances.

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Mother's Illness and Passing

The core of the episode delves into the abrupt and heart-wrenching loss of Olivia’s mother due to Alpha-1 Antitrypsin Deficiency, a rare genetic disorder.

• Onset of Illness:
  [02:37] Olivia describes the sudden onset of her mother's illness: "She became sick the day after Mother's Day... they weren't really sure for months."

• Symptoms and Medical Journey:
  The family grappled with unexplained symptoms such as liver enzyme elevations and signs of heart failure, leading to multiple hospital visits without a clear diagnosis.

• Rapid Decline:
  [03:24] Heather reflects, "It came so suddenly," to which Olivia adds, "she passed away that night. So it was very fast, like suddenly for everyone."

• Rare Disease Explanation:
  [04:31] Olivia explains, "It's called alpha 1 antitrypsin deficiency... it's a genetic disorder."

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Olivia's Nursing Journey

Olivia discusses how her mother's illness influenced her decision to pursue nursing and the challenges she faced in the healthcare field.

• Transition to Healthcare:
  [13:07] After her mother's passing, Olivia decided against working in the ICU, stating, "I don't want to see people sedated, intubated. That is just not for me."

• Clinical Experiences:
  [14:37] She shares a poignant moment when her nursing professor, one of her mother's nurses, recognized her: "I have to say something to her... she's really sweet about it."

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Family Dynamics and Coping

The conversation shifts to the impact of her mother's death on Olivia's family, particularly her relationship with her father and brother.

• Living Situation:
  [08:09] Olivia mentions living with her father and brother, who is away at college most of the year, highlighting the limited family support at home.

• Emotional Struggles:
  [24:32] Olivia reflects on her initial disassociation from the grief: "I was just there. And then, like, all of a sudden I was like, oh, my God."

• Father’s Grief:
  Her father remains a pillar of support but is visibly affected by the loss: [23:01] "He’s still, like, the best dad ever... but he's definitely having a hard time."

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Friendship and Relationships After Loss

Olivia opens up about navigating friendships and romantic relationships post-loss, emphasizing the challenges of integrating her grief into new connections.

• Dating Post-Grief:
  [18:05] Olivia discusses the difficulty of dating without her mother's presence: "It's not the same. My mom would have made it very different, made it comfortable for them."

• Expectations from Friends:
  She highlights her need for friends to remember significant dates: [19:03] "I need them to be, like, my mom's birthday or, like, her anniversary."

• Supportive Friendships:
  Olivia appreciates longstanding friendships that understand her grief without needing to overly acknowledge it: [21:02] "They obviously are, like, I'm here for you on this day."

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Signs of Mother’s Presence

The episode touches on the comforting signs Olivia perceives as reminders of her mother's spirit.

• Connection Through Nature:
  [26:31] Olivia shares, "My mom and I liked Coldplay... the song Yellow was our song. Now, seeing the word 'Yellow' or hearing the song reminds me of her."

• Symbolic Gestures:
  [27:48] Olivia believes these signs are a way her mother remains present: "I do feel that way and I do like saying them. It makes me feel better a little bit."

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Keeping Mother's Memory Alive

Olivia discusses various ways she honors her mother's memory, ensuring her legacy continues.

• Annual Events:
  [31:32] Olivia emphasizes the importance of celebratory gatherings: "Every year we do a cocktail party for her... making the effort to be there."

• Tattoos as Memorials:
  [33:43] She shares her tattoos dedicated to her mother: "All my tattoos are for her. So, I do little things like that... all done for a good reason."

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Advice for Others in Grief

In the concluding segments, Olivia offers poignant advice to those navigating similar losses.

• Hope and Resilience:
  [35:25] Olivia assures listeners, "You will be okay and, like, you will get through it. There's the light at the end of the tunnel."

• Importance of Connections:
  She underscores the role of relationships in healing: [36:03] "Connections... just being present."

• Being There Without Overthinking:
  Olivia advises, "Just have those people that are just there through it all, like, every step of the way, like, no matter what."

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Notable Quotes

• On Unpreparedness:
  Olivia [00:09]: "She wasn't ready. She wasn't prepared."

• On Sudden Loss:
  Heather [03:24]: "It came so suddenly."

• On Presence Over Gestures:
  Olivia [31:23]: "It doesn't have to be like, them bringing you anything or, like, getting you flowers... just being present."

• On Healing:
  Olivia [35:25]: "You will be okay and, like, you will get through it."

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Conclusion

Olivia's candid sharing on "A Place of Yes" provides a deep and relatable exploration of grief, resilience, and the enduring bonds between loved ones. Her journey from loss to finding purpose in nursing serves as an inspiring testament to the human spirit's capacity to transform pain into positive action.

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Thank you for listening to this episode of A Place of Yes.
Please follow us on your preferred podcast platform and share this episode with others who may find solace and strength in Olivia’s story.

Transcript

[Olivia]

I remember sitting on the stairs with my dad and her just saying, I don't want to die, like, and stuff like that. And then it was like a few days later and I was like, oh.

[Heather]

And a few days later, she passed away.

[Olivia]

Yeah. So that's definitely, like, stuck in my brain, like, hearing her say that.

[Heather]

Those are hard memories. Those are hard moments to, like, process.

[Olivia]

And she wasn't ready. She wasn't prepared.

[Heather]

Welcome to A Place of Yes. A podcast about how I moved through my darkest hour. And for me, that was in channeling my grief into good. Welcome to the show. So welcome to A Place of Yes. I am sitting with Olivia. The last time I saw you, I don't know, was 8ish years ago, maybe you were a kid and you were with your grandparents and you were at Jake's Help From Heaven annual family fun Day. Yes. So your parents, Marty and Greg, have been supporters of. Of Jake's Help From Heaven for a very long time. Always could count on them. The other part of that story is that Marty and Greg's daughter, your mother, passed away in 2022. 2022. And that is sort of what has reconnected you and I as a listener of the podcast, of which I'm grateful that you listen to. Welcome to the show.

[Olivia]

Thank you. I'm excited to be here.

[Heather]

Can you share with the audience just a little bit about yourself, like what you're doing now and just whatever you want to share.

[Olivia]

So I graduated nursing school in December of last year. I started nursing school like, two years ago, probably two months after my mom passed away. That was a little bit difficult time, but honestly, I love it. I didn't think I was going to get through it, but I did. That's just what I've been doing. Working.

[Heather]

Was nursing always something you wanted to do?

[Olivia]

So not necessarily. Like, no one in my family is really healthcare except my grandmother. Marty was a nurse. So that's really the only background I had in it. I just wasn't sure what I wanted to do. I kind of just jumped into it and then ended up really liking it. And I had a great time. And I was also transferring schools at the time. So I had went to school in Virginia my first year. It was Covid. It was 2020. I didn't have a great time. It was 10 hours away from home. So that was a little bit rough going to school for the first year. But then I came home. I ended up going to Russell Sage.

[Heather]

Okay.

[Olivia]

And that worked out perfect for me. It was good because my mom was Sick when I first started living in Troy.

[Heather]

So let's go right into it with your mom and I. I remember when I heard that she had passed, no one really saw it coming, like.

[Olivia]

Right.

[Heather]

Many of us didn't even know that she had been struggling or just, you know, it just. It came so suddenly.

[Olivia]

Yeah.

[Heather]

It wasn't as sudden for you guys living it, or was it. Can you tell a little bit? Just, she had a rare disease, so.

[Olivia]

Yeah. So she. Of the year 2020. She became sick the day after Mother's Day. So that's in May. Right. So in May, she got sick that day, went to the hospital, just kind of had, like, weird symptoms, like symptoms of heart failure, which she was actually in heart failure, but that wasn't what she was so sick from. They didn't know. She had really weird, like, elevations in different. Like, her liver enzymes were really off. They weren't really sure. They weren't sure for months. So she was just super, like, tired all the time, lost a ton of weight, super jaundice. Her skin was very yellow and, like, her eyes, and she was just, like, very sick. Her and my dad were just kind of bouncing all around, like, trying to figure out what's going on. Like, they were getting different recommendations of places to go, people to see, and no one really knew. So it was.

[Heather]

And you were a freshman in college at this point?

[Olivia]

I was a. Going into my junior.

[Heather]

Going into your junior year. Going into junior year. So you were at Russell Sage already?

[Olivia]

Yeah, yeah. So I had started in this in September.

[Heather]

Okay.

[Olivia]

Of that year. So, yeah, it was only a few months until she passed away, so it was pretty quick. And I don't think anyone really thought she was going to pass away. Like, that wasn't really a thought in anyone's mind. Like, in my family or immediate family. Like, no one really was like, oh, my God. Like, she has this timeline. Like, it wasn't like she had some diagnosis that we knew it was going to happen. Like, no one really knew. So it was kind of very sudden. And she was doing well in the hospital. And then the week prior to her passing away, she was doing pretty good. And then she just. Something happened. Which at that time, I wasn't in nursing school, so I didn't really know what was going on. I didn't really have much healthcare background. But now that, like, being in that field, I'm like, oh, now I understand why she, like, got, like, everything went downhill so fast. Yeah. She was supposed to get a liver transplant and then be transferred to a different Hospital, and then she passed away that night. So it was very fast, like, sudden for everyone, like, even in the community, even to us.

[Heather]

Okay, so it was fast. So what was the name of her disease?

[Olivia]

It's called alpha 1 antitrypsin deficiency. So it's like you're deficient in certain liver. I don't really know exactly. It's very rare. It's like a genetic disorder.

[Heather]

So she was born with it and then it just came out, or she.

[Olivia]

We didn't know, though.

[Heather]

Okay. Yeah, yeah. So you would never know until.

[Olivia]

Right. It wasn't something that, like, you're born with and they would just know right away. It's like, if your parents have certain chromosomes, that happens. So, like, my dad got tested for it after she passed away, and he didn't have any of, like, the corresponding chromosomes. So my brother and I haven't been tested for it, but I would like to be.

[Heather]

You raised something that I think is really interesting, and you talk and I think not knowing and then having her pass away quickly one day. You have a mom that is your mom. And I want to talk about your relationship because you kind of had described at times as like, she's your best friend. So you're not only losing your mom, you're losing your best friend. You don't see it coming, right?

[Olivia]

Yeah. So me and my mom were very close. Like, I have a little brother, so it's kind of like my dad and my brother had their things and we had our things. Like, they lived with ski, and we didn't love to ski, so we would do other stuff. And she was just like, a really bubbly, fun person to be around. Like, she'd always, always have people over. Like, we'd always have parties at her house. Like, her job was. She was in sales. So, like, she was very, like, personable and, you know, comfortable with everyone. So, yeah, we were very close. And definitely, I don't. I think about it sometimes. I'm like, would it have been better if I knew that she had eight months to live, that kind of thing, or if she had cancer and was going to have a year or two left? Like, I don't know if that would make any better for me. I don't know if it's better for them to just abruptly pass away or, like, have this time where you're like, what am I going to do for the next eight months? Like, to make the most out of this or to, you know.

[Heather]

But you can get, like, sucked down that rabbit hole, though, right? Sometimes, like, thinking about It. But I think you're right.

[Olivia]

Like, she was, like, she was in the hospital at this time. I think she was at Albany mad. And we had come home, and we're staying at home that night, and we, like, left her there to sleep for the night. And usually someone would stay, but she was there for the night by herself. And. And my dad came home just, like, regroup, and she, like, called my dad, like, having a panic attack about being there. She didn't like the hospital. You know, no one likes the hospital, but she.

[Heather]

But some people really don't like it.

[Olivia]

Yeah, she really didn't like it. And she was like, I don't want to die. Like, I just remember her saying that on the phone. I remember sitting on the stairs with my dad and her just saying, like, I don't want to die, like, and stuff like that. And then it was, like, a few days later, and I was like, oh.

[Heather]

And a few days later, she passed away.

[Olivia]

Yeah. So that's definitely, like, stuck in my brain, like, hearing her say that.

[Heather]

Those are hard memories. Those are hard moments to, like, process.

[Olivia]

And, like, she wasn't ready. She wasn't prepared.

[Heather]

So what were those initial symptoms? Like? Like, what was it like? You know, you. You said, like, heart failure and she. Was she in heart failure because of. Or was it just, like, two different things happening at the same time?

[Olivia]

I think it was two different things. I wish I knew more in detail about it. It was separate. She was in heart failure, but I'm not quite sure why. Okay, so she had the symptoms of heart failure, like, edema in her legs, you know, fluid in her. She had fluid in her lungs that.

[Heather]

She had to get, like, hard to breathe.

[Olivia]

Drained out. Yeah, she had to go to the hospital and get as well. This must have exacerbated from the heart failure. From what? I believe it affects your lungs and liver, the alpha one, primarily your lungs, when you have that. Which is, like, the more common.

[Heather]

Okay.

[Olivia]

Situation. But hers was more liver, so it was less common.

[Heather]

So what was the timeline? So that was the day after Mother's Day, which. We'll get into that, because that's a horrible thing to happen around that time.

[Olivia]

Anyway, it was the day after Mother's Day, so in May, and then she passed away in October.

[Heather]

Okay.

[Olivia]

So, yeah, like, five, six months.

[Heather]

Yeah, she passed away in 2022. So this coming October will be three years. So how. How is your family doing overall?

[Olivia]

Well, I still live at home with my dad and my brother, technically, but he goes to college in Pennsylvania, so he's away, you know, eight, nine months out of the year, and he hasn't really come home often, so. So it's really just us two.

[Heather]

Was your brother still at home when she was sick?

[Olivia]

Yeah, he was a senior in high school.

[Heather]

He was a senior high school, so.

[Olivia]

He was 17 and I was 20 when she passed away. He doesn't really like to talk about it. We don't really, like, get into it often, which is okay. And I'm fine with that. I don't try and, like, make him talk about anything, but. So as far as I know, I think he's doing okay. But at the same time, like, we don't really talk about it, and we are very close and we talk about everything else, except I think it's just kind of elephant in the room, I was gonna say.

[Heather]

Does that make it weird that, like, you are close and talk about everything, but, like, this huge thing happened to both of you and.

[Olivia]

Right. And it's just like. Yeah, it is weird. And we were together, like, the night she passed away and, like, we were together going to the hospital every day. Like, we did everything together because my dad was just living there, essentially. So we did everything together when she was sick. And I would come home from Troy and stay home with him for, like, a week at a time because he was home alone and my dad was in Albany or in Boston or elsewhere.

[Heather]

You had shared a story. And I kind of want to touch on all of this because there's so much family dynamics during this stuff can be so tough anyways. And you knew she was sick, but you didn't think she was dying.

[Olivia]

Right.

[Heather]

It's just such a hard thing because we are conditioned to kind of think people are always going to get better. Right.

[Olivia]

Right.

[Heather]

Or if they're dying, that they look a certain way at all times or. Or there's just. Or that you would know, or they're old or they're old. Like. And even with Jake, honestly there, people would say to me all the time, like, oh, you must have known this was coming because he had so many medical challenges. But we didn't. You know, we. Keeping him healthy and alive and thriving in his own way. And I didn't see it coming at all. Like, the day he died that morning, I had no idea. And I think about the story you said when you had all come home and it was like, the one time that your. Your dad came with you and your mom called and she was saying, like, I'm scared to die.

[Olivia]

Yeah.

[Heather]

What was going through your head like.

[Olivia]

He was sitting on the stairs. I was like, standing behind him. I don't really know if he knew that I could hear what she was saying, but she would do that a lot where she would call a lot and, like, be really anxious by herself. And like, she called him and said, like, I don't want to die and like, I'm not ready and stuff like that.

[Heather]

How did he respond? Was he, like, just so upset?

[Olivia]

He was just like, yeah, I don't even know what he. I don't even know if he said anything. I think he was just like. Like, do you want me to come back? Like, I'll come back. Her passing away so fast makes it. You wish you had the more time, but at the same time, it's like, I wish I went to the hospital more or I wish I stayed longer, or I wish I. Like, I never slept there. I wish I did that. And like, it makes you, like, think more about life and what you're.

[Heather]

I always wish in life you had, like three do overs, right? Like, you just could, like, hit the button and be like, I'm taking one of mine now.

[Olivia]

Yeah, I know we can't.

[Heather]

You know, the what ifs can kill you. Like, you just can't let yourself what if? Right. But I hear that and I feel that, like, shoulda woulda, coulda, like, what do you think? Like, you know, you said she didn't want to die, and I think many of us don't want to die. Right. You know, but did she fight really hard? Like, did she want to stay here with you guys?

[Olivia]

She was in the ICU at Albany Med at this point in October because she. They had went to Mass General in Boston on my birthday, which is in August. So they must have came home and then were home for a little and went back to Albany Med. I'm not quite sure the time.

[Heather]

So she was home some. Like, she wasn't in the hospital the whole five months?

[Olivia]

No, no, no, no. She would come back and forth. Like, something would happen in the middle of the night and then we'd bring her.

[Heather]

Okay.

[Olivia]

Stuff like that. Then she.

[Heather]

Did she go back to work? Like, were there moments of normalcy or. No, no.

[Olivia]

She's time. Yeah. Luckily it was the summer, which was her favorite time of year. So she would just lay by our pool every single day. And she was very tan, so it's a chance I've ever seen her. So she did perks.

[Heather]

Yeah.

[Olivia]

She didn't get to do something she liked.

[Heather]

How was she, like, navigating her own, like, Struggle. Right. Like, wanting to stay alive. Like, not wanting to be experiencing this, but also being really, really sick.

[Olivia]

A few days before she passed away, she was intubated and sedated. I don't know. Like, no one could talk to her. Like, she couldn't respond. You know, no one could.

[Heather]

Like, you weren't getting responses like, no.

[Olivia]

And I remember, like, when she passed away, like, me and my brother were. They were. They essentially told us, like, she's going to pass away tonight, so you should come down here. We were at home. My aunts were with us. My dad has two sisters. My mom didn't have any siblings, so my dad's two sisters were there. They had been staying at the hotel for a while. My one aunt lives in Massachusetts, so she was home for that. And then they were with us at the house, staying with us. And they drove us back down to Albany, mad. Cause they. It was like. I think it was like, 1am okay. Because they were like, she's not gonna make it through the night. Like, she was supposed to be transported to a different hospital for the.

[Heather]

For the transplant.

[Olivia]

Right.

[Heather]

And would the transplant have changed the course?

[Olivia]

Yeah, it would have saved her. I think it was too late when they found out. They just didn't know it was wrong. They didn't know she had Alpha 1 until, like, I think maybe a week before.

[Heather]

A week before she died?

[Olivia]

Yeah. Like, it was very. Like, they didn't know what was wrong with her for months.

[Heather]

Okay.

[Olivia]

And then they did. I think they did, like, a biopsy on her liver or something that thought she had cancer, but it wasn't cancer. And then end up somehow they. Someone along the way was like, did you test her for this? And they didn't. And then someone did. And then she had it. And then her. I think her liver just failed. Then everything else just started. It is, like, hard. Like, people are always like, oh, why don't you want to be an ICU nurse? Like, I'm not going to say, oh, because my mom died in the icu. But I'm like, I don't want to be an icu. I don't want to see people sedated, intubated. Like, all my friends from nursing school, like, they went into critical care. They went into ICUs, which is, like, so awesome. It's really cool. Like, really. I'm really happy for them, but I'm just like, that is just not for me.

[Heather]

It's too close.

[Olivia]

Yeah. I don't want to be anywhere. And I was always nervous in nursing school that we were going to do clinical on the same floor that she was on.

[Heather]

So you were. So you did, like, your clinical and everything at Albany Med?

[Olivia]

Yeah.

[Heather]

That must have been hard.

[Olivia]

Yeah, we did some of it. St. Peter's but I was always nervous. I was like, I really don't want to go to. I knew exactly what floor it was. I knew what room.

[Heather]

I was going to say, like, that.

[Olivia]

Luckily, we didn't really go to ICs a lot in nursing school, so I'm like, I really don't want to go there. And I was really hoping I wouldn't, but I didn't run into that problem. And I wasn't really in any ICU setting, like, with any patients that are intubated and sedated like that. I've seen them. But I wasn't really, like, taking care of anyone like that in nursing school. My first semester of nursing school started the January after she passed away. So three months later. And my professor was one of her nurses.

[Heather]

Really? Was that a good thing or a bad thing? Like, did you feel connected or did you feel, like, exposed?

[Olivia]

And I guess the professor, my. My mom liked her, so it was like, the first or second day of school, and I just, like, felt so weird. I was like, I have to say something to her. So, like, after class, I just went up to her and I was like, I just want to say, like, thank you for taking care of my mom. Like, she really liked you. And, like. Like, she knew who I was.

[Heather]

Okay. I was gonna say. So she, like, she knew who I.

[Olivia]

Was talking about, and she was like. Like, apologized and everything, you know, but she was, like, really sweet about it. And then I was with her for two years, so. Yeah, but it was. It was kind of like a good little full circle moment.

[Heather]

I like those moments. Honestly. There's something about those people that are in you, with you, or with the people you love in those very critical, horrible moments. But I feel like that connection is really powerful.

[Olivia]

Yeah. And that's what's nice about being in healthcare as well. Like, you kind of experience that on the other side of things.

[Heather]

How so? You're in a profession that, by default, you encounter more loss than other professions. How is that when you're still so raw with your own grief?

[Olivia]

Like, for some reason, it doesn't bother me. I think everyone always thinks that I'm, like, I don't understand. Like, even if my mom hadn't passed away, like, my friends who are, you know, engineers or teachers, like, they have no idea. Like, none of. None of My friends from high school are in that profession, so they're like, how do you clean someone after they pass away and, like, do all that? And I'm like, I don't know. Like, it. It's kind of like, most of them, they know that they're going to, like, pass away, and they. They've accepted it. It doesn't really bother me as much as you would think.

[Heather]

So your mom was sedated and intubated. Do you think at the end she knew what was happening?

[Olivia]

Probably, yeah. I don't think anyone really knows. What, like, if people.

[Heather]

Did you talk to her? Like, through. Did you all.

[Olivia]

We did talk to her, and I remember she was like, Tears were falling down our face.

[Heather]

They were?

[Olivia]

Yeah. Like, then that night.

[Heather]

So were you with her when she took her last breath?

[Olivia]

No.

[Heather]

Okay.

[Olivia]

We had left. Me, my brother and my aunts, like, walked out, and then my dad, my grandparents stayed until she passed away.

[Heather]

Like, did you. You made the decision not to stay, or did you.

[Olivia]

I don't think I would have wanted to stay for that. And she looked really. I don't want to say bad, but she didn't look good. And it wasn't like. I don't think it was very comfortable for us to be in there, which, Like, I feel like that sounds bad, saying it out loud.

[Heather]

No, no, no, it doesn't.

[Olivia]

But, like, she's discolored. Like, they don't. Like, you're so sick if you're in that situation in the icu. Like, you are very critical, and she was very critical. And there was, like, nurses surrounding her. Like, multiple. I remember that. Like, doctors in there. Like, I remember that happening and just being like, I don't really want to, like, sit in here, you know?

[Heather]

And some of those images are just. You. You can't make them go away. I'm so sorry, Liv. Like, it's so. It's hard. It's hard when we lose the people we love. It's hard when we lose them unexpected, you know, you had this. It's your mom in five. In five months, she was there, and then she wasn't. And I'm just. It just sucks.

[Olivia]

I know it does.

[Heather]

It just sucks.

[Olivia]

It's not the way it's supposed to go.

[Heather]

It is not the way it's supposed to go. You're still supposed to, like, call her up and be like, hey, guess what happened at work today?

[Olivia]

Exactly.

[Heather]

Or whatnot. When something like this happens, right, It. It changes the course of everything.

[Olivia]

Right?

[Heather]

The things that you even take for granted. Right? But, like, it impacts your friendships, your relationships. So there's two places I want to go. I want to talk about, like, friendships and. And have you had some friends or do you have a boyfriend?

[Olivia]

Yeah, we're recently dating.

[Heather]

Oh, okay.

[Olivia]

So he didn't know my mom. I had a boyfriend before him months ago, but he also didn't know my mom.

[Heather]

Okay. Is it weird having boyfriends that didn't know your mom?

[Olivia]

Yes, it is kind of weird because, like, I meet their parents and I'm like, they meet my dad and that's fine. And my dad's great and very, like, friendly and like, very nice guy, but it's just like, it's not the same. Like, my mom would have made it very different, made it comfortable on them, I think. And I think my dad probably thinks that too. He's like, oh, he probably wishes that she was there to meet them and stuff. And it wasn't just him, but. And that, like, has been, like, a little bit of, like, hard for me with relationships. Like, I just. I feel like I put a lot of people before myself or, like, people's feelings before my own. So I. When people haven't, like, shown up for me or haven't been there on days, I need them to be, like, my mom's birthday or, like, her anniversary, and they just don't show up for whatever reason that just kind of, you know, you hate them. Yeah, I'm just like, I don't, Like, I. Yeah, I. I don't even know where to use. I'm just like, I don't even like it. It's one day of the year, you know, like, it's like, don't forget it. Yeah.

[Heather]

It's not hard. I'm right there with you. I am so petty.

[Olivia]

Yeah.

[Heather]

In my. In my 51 year oldness, like, I wasn't always this petty, but now I'm petty. I have, like. I don't write it down, but I have a mental list of, like, people that.

[Olivia]

Yeah.

[Heather]

That don't hit that. December 8th. It's one day. My kid died.

[Olivia]

December 8th.

[Heather]

Yeah.

[Olivia]

My brother's birthday.

[Heather]

Oh, is it really?

[Olivia]

Yeah. So random.

[Heather]

That is random.

[Olivia]

Yeah.

[Heather]

And it literally send me a text with, like, a heart emoji for five minutes. Like, it would, Like, I don't even need. Like, I don't even need words sometimes. Like, it can be a heart emoji.

[Olivia]

Yeah.

[Heather]

It means that Jake entered your mind and you cared enough to remember because you know how big that is. Like, you know, I mean, like, that's all it is. It doesn't even have to be, like, a phone call or, like, no.

[Olivia]

Or, like, don't have to come to my house. Like, you can just. You know. That has been like, hard for me, like, in relationships and stuff. My friends are really good, and they're really good about it, and they've, like, been there through everything. I've had the same friends since I was in elementary school, which is awesome.

[Heather]

Yeah, I love that.

[Olivia]

Yeah, they've. They've been through, like, it all, but, yeah, it's like, with people coming into your life, and then, like, you let them into your life, you tell them everything that happened, and, you know, they think that you think that they would do more than they do sometimes. And it's. It's, like, upsetting.

[Heather]

How do you tell new people? When do you tell people? Or how do you tell people? And how do you decide when to, like, disclose?

[Olivia]

If it's someone that, like, I'm just, like, briefly chatting with? I don't really know that well, I'll just say that. I'm like. I'll just. If they're like, oh, how's your mom feel about that? I'm like, oh, she's. Whatever. I'll just make it up. The other day, like, I told someone my brother was coming home from college. They're like, oh, your mom must be so excited. I'm like, yeah, she is. Like, I'm just gonna leave it at that. I'm not gonna. I don't. Like, you only know me at surface level. Like, I don't need to get into some, you know, or make them feel bad. And they're like, oh, I just said that, and now I feel terrible.

[Heather]

Well, because then it is. It's like. And sometimes I've done that. I was like, my child's dead, you know?

[Olivia]

Yeah.

[Heather]

Like someone at the grocery store. And I'm like, okay, Heather, you didn't need to do that. Like, you just totally F them up for the whole day.

[Olivia]

Yeah, but, like, people that I, like, have a stronger relationship with, like, I will say that. Like, I remember on the first date with my current boyfriend, he was like, asking me what my parents did for work. And I was like, oh, my dad. Like, blah, blah, blah, blah. He's like, oh, okay. How about your mom? I'm like, well. I was like, well, she passed away. And he's like, oh, that. I felt so bad. I'm like, I'm sorry. I don't want to lie to you because, like.

[Heather]

Because I'm dating you, and it'll get awkward in, like, a month if I'm like, oh, by the way, remember what I said?

[Olivia]

Yeah. Like, she's actually.

[Heather]

You're not gonna meet her. Yeah. Yeah.

[Olivia]

So, like, it depends situation. But, like, usually I'll just be like, she'd pass away, but it's okay. Like, you don't have to, like, say anything. That's usually what I'll say. I'm like, it's. It's okay, though.

[Heather]

Have you found people who've really. And you talk about your friends that you've known? Like, do you have a support system where you feel like you've got. Like, when you are just missing her or sad?

[Olivia]

My family, like, my aunt. My aunt that lives, both my aunts, my cousin, I'm really close with them and, like, my. All my cousins, really. But, like, I have a cousin in New York City. And, like, we talk a lot, and I, you know, I only. There's only seven of us, and we're all very close. They're, like, awesome. Like, they're like, my. Like, you got a little villagers kind of. I was just. I don't want to say that, but, like, kind of like that to me.

[Heather]

They, like, fill that void a little bit.

[Olivia]

Yeah. Like, I'll, like, go over to my aunts if I'm, like, having a bad day and just talk to her about, like, whatever. If I'm having, like, some sort of issue in my life, like, I'll just talk to her. Like, sometimes it's just easier than to, like, not easier than to go to my dad, but, like, it's just, like, someone different. It's not, you know, relation.

[Heather]

Yeah. So how is your dad doing? I did want to talk about that. When we had talked before, you had talked a little bit about, like, having to kind of be strong and.

[Olivia]

Yeah.

[Heather]

You know. How long were your parents married?

[Olivia]

Like, 20 years.

[Heather]

So a long time. Like.

[Olivia]

Yeah.

[Heather]

Like. And they.

[Olivia]

Oh, 20 years. They got married. Yeah, 20 years.

[Heather]

Okay. So they, you know. Was he heartbroken? Like, is he heartbroken?

[Olivia]

Yeah. Like, the way they met is, like, his best friend was dating my mom's best friend. So they've been like, you know, all together for so long, and they were together for so long. I don't think he'll ever be the same, you know? I mean, no one's the same after any sort of situation like that. But he's definitely, like, very different. He's still, like, the best dad ever and, like, there for everything and helps me. My brother, with literally anything. He would drop everything to help us you know, but he's definitely, like, having a hard time, like, to this day, which, as we all are. But I do feel, like, very bad for him. And I feel like since I'm the only one that lives at home, I'm kind of like. I don't want to sound like I'm, like, annoyed by it. Like, it doesn't bother me, but just feel like it's a lot on. Like, sometimes on me where it's just like, we're the only ones home. And then, like, we'll start talking and then it just gets brought up in conversation and he gets upset. And sometimes I'm just like, don't get upset in front of people. And, like, I just can't. Like, it could be really sad situation. He could be crying or someone could be crying in front of me, and I just can't. I'm just sitting there awkwardly, and I'm like, some. I talk about this in therapy a lot. I'm, like, sometimes I feel awkward, and, like, I don't want to feel awkward. Like, he's my dad, and, like, we're very close, and, like, he's awesome, and he's going through this. You know, he lost his wife, and that's obviously very hard on him. But sometimes I'm just like, I feel so awkward.

[Heather]

Do you think there's a piece of you that is still, like. Like, still can't believe it, right? Like, is still protecting yourself? Like, as. Like, do you think you fully have accepted it? Like, do you.

[Olivia]

I think now I fully accepted it, but definitely, like, I think I kind of disassociated for it the first, like, six months.

[Heather]

That's kind of what I meant. Like, did you, like. Yeah, yeah.

[Olivia]

Like, when I was, like, going to therapy, it kind of didn't even, like, set in. Like, I wasn't even, like, upset for, like, six months. Like, I was just, like, there. And then, like, all of a sudden I was like, oh, my God. Like, I just, like, it just, like, hit me one day, and I was like, what is going on? Like, for some reason just didn't click in my brain yet. And, like, we had a lot going on. Like, people always, like, coming over and seeing us and stuff. So I feel like that kind of. I don't know if it made. It made me not think about it as much, but. And I had, like, nursing school and then and whatnot. And then all of a sudden, yeah, one day it just kind of hit me, but I think now I've just. I've accepted it. Yeah.

[Heather]

Do you Go down that rabbit hole of, like, the things that you will miss.

[Olivia]

Yeah. Ever since I was a child, I've always wanted to be a mom. So it's just, like, hard for me to think about, like, me being a mom and her not being there and, like, my potential kids not having one of their grandmothers around and, like, me getting married and all that stuff. Like, we would even talk about that when I was, you know, a teenager and, like, what that would look like. And, you know, and she always talked about how, like, she wanted to, like, sell the house and go travel and then get a smaller house in downtown and do all these things. I don't know. I think about that a lot, like, down the road. And it's like, everything that happens or every, like, monumental moment, it's like you have to think about where they would be in that situation or, like, just think about them. Like. Like I said, like, when I get married, when my brother gets married, I don't know anything when my brother turns 21, anything like that. It's like. It's like you think about it in every situation, which is terrible.

[Heather]

But, no, you think of all the big and all the little things. Because sometimes I would imagine it's. Sometimes it's like the little things are even harder because, of course, like, she won't be at your wedding. That's a big thing. And that's. That's hard to wrap your head around, but. But there's, like, I think of stupid things just as being, like, Ethan's mom. Like, I can't wait till he's 21 and have, like, the first legal drink with him. You know what I mean? Like, those moments will be hard. Right. Like, the things that you would have done.

[Olivia]

Right.

[Heather]

So I'm a huge. Like, Jake. When I see a cardinal, it's Jake. And when you see a cardinal, it's your mom. I love that.

[Olivia]

Yeah.

[Heather]

How did that start?

[Olivia]

Well, I think that's kind of like a universal thing.

[Heather]

I didn't even know it at first. Yeah. Like, I'm like a wackadoodle who had no idea that this was a thing. And when Jake died, I was, like, running like a lunatic. Like, miles and miles a day just because I didn't know what to do with myself. There was, like, a stretch of time where I'd be out on these really long runs, like, 8, 9, 10 miles, and I'd see these cardinals. And I came home once. This is a legit story. This I knew. I was like, Brian, this, like, cardinal is, like, stalking me so Then we made this thing. We're like, oh, maybe it's Jake. Whatever.

[Olivia]

Yeah.

[Heather]

Like, months later, someone was at church actually, and, like, tapped me on the shoulder and was like. Gave me a cardinal. And it was kind of awkward and weird because I was like, okay. Hey. She's like, I've been reading. And I had a blog back then, so she was like, I was reading your blog posts. I know about the cardinal. Here's the cardinal. And you know that it's like, it's a real sign. Like, it is, Jake, because dead people come back as cardinals. And I'm like, sitting in the pews at St. Clement's and I'm like, what the F is happening to me right now? Like, this is. The whole thing is weird. I just didn't even have a clue.

[Olivia]

So.

[Heather]

So you knew it was a thing?

[Olivia]

I did know it was a thing. And I. I don't think of it as often like that, but, like, my friends or like, people that I'm with, like, if we're like, on a walk or something, they'll be like, oh, a cardinal just flew by. Or we're sitting somewhere and it's like a cardinal right there. Like, they'll point it out. So, like, that is nice.

[Heather]

Do you. Do you believe it? Like, do you feel like it's your mom with you?

[Olivia]

Like, yeah. Like, even the other day I was at my grandparents, sitting on their porch with them, and there was one, like, sitting right there, and my grandfather said something. So, like, I. I do feel that way and I do like saying them. Like, I think it makes me feel better a little bit. But I have, like, this thing with the word yellow. I think I wrote that.

[Heather]

Yes. So. So talk about that. I think the audience will love that.

[Olivia]

Yeah. Yeah. So my mom and I liked Coldplay a lot. Like, the band and Taylor Swift, of course, but we don't have any. Any connection there. So we liked Coldplay. And I remember, like, one day we were driving. I don't remember where we were going, probably shopping somewhere hours away. And we were going somewhere, like, on a road trip. And. And we were listening to Coldplay and the song Yellow. We, like, loved that song. We listened to it over and over, and we loved that song. So that was always, like, our song and whatnot. And then on the way home from the hospital, the night she passed away, there was a big, like, 18 wheeler on the highway next to us, and it said yellow on the back, like in big letters. And I see it the same truck, like, randomly. Yeah. Like, when I'm driving the highway always see it. Like, I don't know how often, but every so often, like, or I'll see the word yellow or I'll, like me. My friends will be at the bar and that song starts playing, like, randomly. Randomly, you know? And it's just like, I always, like, think of her when I hear that.

[Heather]

And it's hard to explain to people who don't have those things.

[Olivia]

Yeah.

[Heather]

Like, it can make or break me. Like, right. Like, because if. Yeah, like, when it happens, it's so, like. Like, like you're telling that story and I'm so, like, full body happy for you because it's like, it's. We crave what we will no longer have. Right? Like, and it's just you crave any connection. And to have that connection to. Do you feel like sometimes you see something when you really need it?

[Olivia]

I haven't noticed that yet.

[Heather]

Okay.

[Olivia]

It does, like, make me upset when the song. Like, when I hear the song or I hear, like, a Coldplay song, but, like, seeing the signs doesn't make me upset, but just like the song for some reason. But it is nice to have something like that.

[Heather]

It's all we've got, right?

[Olivia]

Exactly.

[Heather]

There were a few things that you've said that I just. That have stood with me a little bit. One is kind of about, like, your current life, and then one is kind of like about your mom. But I think about how you talked about, like, friendships and relationships and, you know, the people who you've known forever just kind of know what to do. And I feel that. Right. Like, I. And not just around grief or whatever, but there's almost like a. Just an easiness with people who've known you your whole life, like, since you were little, and that friendship and just the ability to be yourself. But then there's other people who are still good friends and can really be important parts of your life, but it's just not quite the same. What advice would you give to people? Like, like, what do you. To. To be there for someone like you or even someone like me? Like, for someone who is struggling. Like, what advice, like, would you give to someone? Like, what would be a takeaway of.

[Olivia]

Like, I think, like, you just need someone that's there and it doesn't have to be like, them bringing you anything or, like, getting you flowers or, like, a gift on, like, the anniversary. Could just be someone that's, like, there all the time through everything, that's not just someone who passed away, you know? Like, some of my friends, they Come around. They'll text me, like, on Mother's Day, or they'll text me on the anniversary, but I don't see them that much. So it's like, that's nice. It's having those people that just, like, think about you on those days and, like, even just send a text that they're miles away. But there's also people that I think just feel awkward and don't know what to say, which is also fine. I wouldn't really know what to say either. And people always ask me, like. Like, should I be saying I'm sorry? Should I be saying, like, how are you? And I'm like, I mean, I don't really know what to say either. I'm like, I feel like when people say I'm sorry, I'm like, thank you. Like, I don't know what to say sometimes you. But it is awkward in, like, every situation. But, yeah, I think just having those friends that are just there through it all, like, every step of the way, like, no matter what, and they're just present, doesn't have to be anything crazy.

[Heather]

No. And, I mean, I think that's the takeaway, right? Like, be present. Like, be there. And you don't, like, don't say something because you feel like you have to say it, but just be there. Like, make your presence right.

[Olivia]

And, like, come to the events. Like, every year we do a cocktail party for her on, like, the day that she passed away or, like, the weekend after. So it's just, like, showing up to that or just, like, being there for an hour doesn't even matter. Like, just stuff like that. Like, making, like, making the effort to be there.

[Heather]

Sometimes I think we overthink it a lot, too. Right? Like, because, yes, there's things that people might say that piss us off. There's things that don't hit. Right. If we just assume that people are trying their best. Right. Like, so maybe someone says, I'm sorry, and then you're kind of like, oh, okay, thank you. Like, you know, I mean, like, it's a weird thing.

[Olivia]

Like, it's not, but.

[Heather]

Yeah, like, it's a weird exchange. But I sometimes rather have people if they're saying they're sorry because they don't know what else they're saying, but they're trying to show up for you. That's different than. Do you know what I mean? Yeah.

[Olivia]

And, like, some of, like, even my closest friends, like, I don't even think they've ever said that to me. Like, they obviously are, like, I'm Here for you on this day. Like, if you want to do anything, let me know. Or, like, the other day, like, posted a picture of, like, my parents on my story.

[Heather]

I saw that. Yeah.

[Olivia]

And, like, one of my best friends stood up and was like, you look just like your mom in this. And I literally started crying. Like, that made me, like, feel, like, happy and, like, sad at the same time. But it's like, stuff like that where it doesn't have to be.

[Heather]

Like, it's not formal. It's just showing up.

[Olivia]

Like. Like, you look just like your mom in this. And like, that just like.

[Heather]

Do you love that?

[Olivia]

Yeah, like, that was nice. Where it's like, other people are just.

[Heather]

Like, ignore it or.

[Olivia]

Right.

[Heather]

Yeah. I love how you said it. Like, just show up, just be present. Like, it doesn't have to be a big, extensive formal.

[Olivia]

You said earlier, like, doesn't have to be any show up.

[Heather]

So then the last thing is, you know, we talk about this podcast, right? It's like a place of. Yes. And our whole thing is, you know, chant, like, what do we do with our grief? Right? Like, you can sit in it, you can stew in it, you can be sad all day, knock out of bed, or you can figure out how to, like, channel it. And, you know, I think you working as a nurse, working in healthcare, I think some of that, whether it's directly connected or not, it. There's some connection there. What. What would you say about, like, do you feel like you're trying to come from. I mean, totally being corny, but like, a place of. Yes. Like, you know, are you trying to. I just, Like, I just went there.

[Olivia]

I think I've been trying. Like, I've been working with my therapist about this. I'm like, I wish I had something that I could do more often. Like, I wish I had something that I did on Mother's Day that I could like, you know, like an actual.

[Heather]

Like a ritual or a. Yeah, like.

[Olivia]

Something that I do every year. You know, like, we do the cocktail party for her, like, anniversary, and like, all my tattoos are for her.

[Heather]

Well, I was. I actually. I'm glad you said that. I wanted to ask you about your tattoos.

[Olivia]

Yeah, so they're all done. Besides one are for her. So I don't. I only have five, but that is like, a way I kind of did it. And I liked that I turned it into that because, like, my dad was kind of like, oh, you're gonna get tattoos. Like, we're not a big tattoo family. I'm like, well, it's For a good reason. He's like, all right. But, yeah, I love my.

[Heather]

I have tattoos all over about that are all Jake. Yeah.

[Olivia]

Yeah. It's like, I love tattoos. And, like, it's nice when people ask you, like, they're like, what's the R for? Like, my name's Olivia. Like, people are like, they're gonna say, yeah, yeah. Or like, I. My Starbucks pickup name is Rachel.

[Heather]

Is it?

[Olivia]

Yeah.

[Heather]

So I love that.

[Olivia]

Or, like, anywhere. Like, Duncan. Like, when I pick something up, it says, like, Rachel instead of my name. So, like. So I do, like, little things like that. But I wish I had something, like, big I could do. Every year I've been thinking about it, but I don't know. I haven't come up with it yet. But it'll come to me one day.

[Heather]

It totally will. And those are great way. Like, that's keeping her name. Like, people saying her name. It's keeping it present. It's making it. It puts a smile on your face when you go get the coffee. I actually love that. I think that's awesome.

[Olivia]

Yeah. I actually saw another girl. She's, like, a influencer in that realm. She, like, doesn't even live here, but her mom passed away when she was in nursing school, and she's also a nurse, and she did that. So I was like, oh, that is so smart. I'm going to start doing that.

[Heather]

I love that.

[Olivia]

Yeah, I started doing that, and I like that I did that sometimes.

[Heather]

It's. They don't have to be these big grandiose gestures, right? Like, they're just these little ways of, like, keeping our people. Keeping our people, like, in our circle, like, keeping them. Yeah.

[Olivia]

Yeah.

[Heather]

So if anybody listening to our episode is kind of in your shoes, right? Like, just going through it, having lost someone important. Do you have any advice?

[Olivia]

I think the best advice I would give is that, like, you will be okay and, like, you will get through it. It seems like in the moment, like, you know, it's the end of the world. Like, you don't. Like, what are you going to do? How are you going to move forward? How are you going to live your life without your mom? Like, especially if you're younger and you know your mom's supposed to be there for all these important moments. It's like, what do you. What do you do? Like, how do you move forward? How do you. But you get through it, and you do. And it seems like you won't, but you do. There's the light at the end of the tunnel. Like, like we said like finding things to remember them by and, you know, include them in, like, have their presence and stuff. Like the cardinal and stuff like that. Like, you'll find stuff to find.

[Heather]

Connections.

[Olivia]

Yeah, connections.

[Heather]

Thank you so much. I and thank you for being on the show, Liv. It's been so nice having this conversation. Thank you for listening to A Place of Yes. Please follow us wherever you listen to your podcasts. If you really like this episode, please share it with a friend. It would make a world of difference if we could just reach more people and share the work that we do and the stories we want to tell. Thank you so much for watching.