Frankly

Summary

Aaron Mahnke's Cabinet of Curiosities: "Frankly"

Date: December 18, 2025
Host: Aaron Mahnke
Podcast: Aaron Mahnke’s Cabinet of Curiosities (iHeartPodcasts & Grim & Mild)

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Episode Overview

This bite-sized storytelling episode from Aaron Mahnke explores two fascinating tales hidden in history’s cracks:

1. The surprising near-casting of Frank Sinatra as the original Die Hard hero.
2. The chilling winter folklore of Frau Perchta, a dual-natured spirit that haunts the dark months of European winter.

Mahnke’s signature approach blends the unbelievable with the unsettling, offering fresh perspective on well-known (and obscure) cultural curiosities.

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Tale 1: Frank Sinatra and Die Hard – The Action Hero Who Wasn’t

Timestamps: 01:17–05:49

Key Discussion Points

• Frank Sinatra’s Film Ambitions:

  • By the late 1960s, Sinatra was eager to break out of his typecast roles as singers, mobsters, or criminals and show dramatic range.
  • In 1968, he starred in The Detective, playing “Joe Leland,” a jaded NYPD detective in a film that was “much more realistic than most films and even discussed some at the time taboo subjects.”
  • The Detective achieved critical and commercial success.

• The Unlikely Die Hard Prequel:

  • The sequel novel to The Detective—Roderick Thorp’s Nothing Lasts Forever—was set to become a film in 1987.
  • The plot foreshadowed what would become Die Hard, with Leland (now older and visiting his daughter’s LA office) caught in a brutal hostage situation.
  • Due to contractual obligations, producers had to offer the sequel’s lead role to Sinatra, despite his age (72).

• Sinatra’s Decline and Hollywood’s Scramble:

  • “[Sinatra] looked back over to the waiting producers and told them that this was probably a little more than he could handle at this point in his life. So he declined the role.” (Aaron Mahnke, 04:08)
  • The part was shopped to every major action star of the era—Schwarzenegger, Stallone, Gibson, Reynolds—all turned it down.
  • Script changes included making the protagonist’s wife (instead of daughter) the hostage, injecting more humor, and changing the detective’s name from Joe Leland to John McClane.

• A New Action Hero is Born:

  • Bruce Willis, then known more for TV, was cast.
  • Die Hard (1988) became a smash hit.
  • “A film that should have starred Frank Sinatra, but instead starred Bruce Willis. Die Hard.” (Aaron Mahnke, 05:46)

Memorable Quotes & Moments

• On Sinatra’s Acting Range:
  “Sinatra tended to play characters that were kind of already in his DNA… but could he play a character on the other side of the law? His new film, The Detective, would give him that chance.” (Aaron Mahnke, 01:54)

• On the Producers’ Silent Relief:
  “I can imagine the producers jumping for joy as soon as Sinatra left their office.“ (Aaron Mahnke, 04:26)

• On the Film’s Legacy:
  “When it was released in 1988, the film became an instant hit and is considered today to be one of the greatest action movies of all time…” (Aaron Mahnke, 05:38)

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Tale 2: Frau Perchta – The Winter’s Dark Matron

Timestamps: 06:58–12:11

Key Discussion Points

• The Ghostly Side of Winter:

  • Mahnke reflects on the emotions of the season—“the winter months are a time of joy, of celebration… Christmas, New Year’s, winter revels, Yuletide carols and warm fires” (Aaron Mahnke, 07:18)—but also a time associated with ghost stories and fear.
  • Introduces Krampus as a well-known German Christmas figure, but notes he’s “just the tip of the iceberg when it comes to Christmas boogeymen.”

• Frau Perchta’s Fearsome Lore:

  • An old crone from Central European folklore obsessed with household cleanliness and seasonal weaving.
  • If displeased, she “will come in with a pair of scissors, slit your belly open and fill it with rocks. She also disembowels lazy children upon occasion as well.” (Aaron Mahnke, 08:23)
  • Ritual offerings include dumplings, porridge with herring, or an egg left on the roof.
  • She is said to fly through the air on the winter solstice, accompanied by a spectral caravan.

• Origins and Transformation:

  • Perchta is a product of syncretism, originally linked to the Norse goddess Frigga, and acted as a goddess of in-between spaces and weaving.
  • With Christianity’s spread, she was relegated from deity to folk terror, shifting her haunting to January 6 ‘Perchtentag’.

• Dualities and Modern Reverence:

  • Perchta embodies both punishment and wisdom: “She is a creepy old woman who may punish you for disobedience, but she is also wise and elderly. She leads a train of ghosts through the sky… but she also guides those spirits that are lost to a final resting place.” (Aaron Mahnke, 10:44)
  • Despite demonization, she remains central to Alpine festivals, where locals still dress as Perchta and pay her homage.

Notable Quotes & Moments

• On Winter’s Cultural Duality:
  “After all, we only light a cozy fire in order to stave off the biting bitter cold and many cultural traditions associate the cold with ghost stories just as much as jolly elves.” (Aaron Mahnke, 07:34)

• On Perchta’s Odd Tribute:
  “Other regions say that you must leave an egg on your roof as a tribute. Why on the roof? Well, some say that Frau Perchta flies through the air on the darkest night of the year.” (Aaron Mahnke, 08:56)

• On Perchta’s Resilience:
  “Some figures from folklore stand the test of time, and some survive by adapting to a strange new world. So as the nights get colder this month, keep an eye on the dark sky above and maybe keep an egg on your roof.” (Aaron Mahnke, 11:55)

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Takeaways

• Die Hard’s cinematic legacy could have looked very different if Sinatra had accepted the call, providing an alternate universe where an aging music legend redefined the action blockbuster.
• The strange, sometimes frightening traditions of winter folklore, personified by Perchta, reveal how ancient gods can survive and morph in response to new times and beliefs—sometimes guiding us, sometimes haunting us, but always staying curious.

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Key Segments & Timestamps

• [01:17] Sinatra and the making of Die Hard
• [05:49] Tale conclusion and sponsor break
• [06:58] The lore and tradition of Frau Perchta
• [12:11] Episode wrap-up and sponsor

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For More

Visit curiositiespodcast.com for info and links, or follow Aaron Mahnke’s storytelling adventures elsewhere on Lore and Grim & Mild podcasts.

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Tone:
Warm, mischievous, and delightfully eerie—Mahnke’s storytelling combines historical detail, playful speculation, and a touch of the macabre.

Notable Quote to Close:
"Some figures from folklore stand the test of time, and some survive by adapting to a strange new world." (Aaron Mahnke, 11:50)

Transcript

[Aaron Mahnke]

This is an iHeart podcast.

[Public Podcast Advertiser]

Guaranteed Human support for the show comes from Public, the investing platform for those who take it seriously. On Public you can build a multi asset portfolio of stocks, bonds, options, crypto and now generated assets which allow you to turn any idea into an investable index with AI. It all starts with your prompt. From renewable energy companies with high free cash flow to semiconductor suppliers growing revenue over 20% year over year, you can literally type any prompt and put the AI to work. It's IT screens thousands of stocks, builds a one of a kind index and lets you back test it against the S&P 500. Then you can invest in a few clicks. Generated assets are like EFTs with infinite possibilities, completely customizable and based on your thesis, not someone else's. Go to public.com podcast and earn an uncapped 1% bonus when you transfer your portfolio. That's public.com podcast paid for by Public Investing Brokerage Services by Open to the Public Investing Inc. Member FINRA SIPC Advisory Services by Public Advisors, llc SEC Registered Advisor Generated Assets is an interactive analysis tool. Output is for informational purposes only and is not investment recommendation or advice. Complete disclosures available at public.com disclosures.

[Aaron Mahnke]

Welcome to Erin Menke's Cabinet of Curiosities, a production of iHeartRadio and Grim and mild. Our world is full of the unexplainable, and if history is an open book, all of these amazing tales are right there on display, just waiting for us to explore. Welcome to the Cabinet of Curiosities. Frank Sinatra Frank Sinatra was one of the most iconic musical artists of all time. His voice was synonymous with the idea of a crooner or a dreamy singer who sings love songs. You may know that he was also a successful dramatic actor, but what most people don't realize is that he was one role away from becoming an action star. Sinatra's acting career began all the way back in the 1940s, but by 1968, he was looking to challenge himself to see if he could get outside of his wheelhouse. Up to this point, Sinatra tended to play characters that were kind of already in his DNA. He was a singer, so. So he played singers. He had a lot of friends in the mob, so he played mobsters. He played a lot of criminals. But could he play a character on the other side of the law? His new film, the Detective, would give him that chance. The Detective was based on a novel by author Roderick Thorpe. It follows Detective Joe Leland, a tired working class man exposed to heinous crime after heinous crime. He doesn't like to listen to orders from his incompetent superiors, and his marriage is disintegrating as he gets pulled in deeper and deeper by his work. It was the perfect role for Sinatra. It allowed him to showcase his signature grumpy Persona, while in a mature, nuanced package. The film portrayed police work in a much more realistic way than most films and even discussed some at the time taboo subjects like homosexuality and sexual violence. The Detective was a critical and commercial hit. Seeing the wild success of his novel being adapted for film, Thorpe was eager to write a sequel so that it too could be turned into a movie. His second Joe Leland story, nothing Lasts Forever turned the drama up to 11. It took Joe across the country from New York to visit his estranged daughter at her office in downtown la. While there, criminals attack the office and Joe is forced to use his skills as a detective to stop them. He manages to succeed, but not before his daughter is killed. It was a well received sequel and producers were excited to turn it into a film. The only problem was that by the time they were ready to make the movie in 1987, Sinatra was 72 years old. No way could he reprise the role in such an action heavy sequel. And the part that really stung for the producers was that Sinatra's contract from the Detective stipulated that they had to offer him the role for any sequels. So they approached him, hands likely shaking as they gave him the script, secretly hoping that he would turn it down. And Sinatra read the script with his usual grim expression, not giving any indication if he liked it or not. And then once he was finished, he looked back over to the waiting producers and told them that this was probably a little more than he could handle at this point in his life. So he declined the role. I can imagine the producers jumping for joy as soon as Sinatra left their office. And what followed was an intense casting call to find just the right successor to Sinatra. All the great action stars of the time were called up too. Schwarzenegger, Stallone, Gibson, Burt Reynolds. But in the end, all of them turned down the role as well. Ultimately, the producers had to go with a newer, younger actor who was more popular on television than film. They rewrote the script to be a little less dark and a little more funny too. For example, the detective was now trying to save his wife instead of his daughter. And he was successful in the end. Also, the criminals weren't out for revenge, they just wanted money. And finally, the character of Joe Leland had his name changed to reflect that this was not really the same guy from the movie from 20 years before, and I'm happy to say that it worked. When it was released in 1988, the film became an instant hit and is considered today to be one of the greatest action movies of all time. A film that should have starred Frank Sinatra but instead starred Bruce Willis. Die Hard.

[Public Podcast Advertiser]

Support for the show comes from Public, the investing platform for those who take it seriously. On Public, you can build a multi asset portfolio of stocks, bonds, options, crypto and now generated assets which allow you to turn any idea into an investable index with AI. It all starts with your prompt. From renewable energy companies with high free cash flow to semiconductor suppliers growing revenue over 20% year over year, you can literally type any prompt and put the AI to work. It screens thousands of stocks, builds a one of a kind index and lets you back test it against the S&P 500. Then you can invest in a few clicks. Generated assets are like EFTs with infinite possibilities, completely customizable and based on your thesis, not someone else's. Go to public.com podcast and earn an uncapped 1% bonus when you transfer your portfolio. That's public.com podcast paid for by Public Investing Brokerage Services by Open to the Public Investing Inc. Member finra SIPC Advisory Services by Public Advisors, llc SEC Registered Advisor Generated Assets is an interactive analysis tool. Output is for informational purposes only and is not investment recommendation or advice. Complete disclosures available at public.com disclosures this.

[Aaron Mahnke]

Show is sponsored by American Public University. You want your master's degree? You know you can earn it. But life gets busy. The packed schedule, the late nights. And then there's the unexpected. American Public University was built for all of that. With monthly starts and no set login times, APU's 40 flexible online master's programs are designed to move at the speed of life. Start your master's journey today at Apu. Apus. Edu. You want it? Come get it at apu. As winter rolls in, I found myself thinking of the emotions and feelings we associate with the season. The winter months are a time of joy, of celebration. Christmas, New Year's, winter revels, Yuletide carols and warm fires. You get the idea. Breaks from the drudgery of work to spend time with family, friends and our communities. These things are universally beloved, even if you don't ascribe to any particular holiday. But that's not all the winter is made of. After all, we only light a cozy fire in order to stave off the biting bitter cold and many cultural traditions Associate the cold with ghost stories just as much as jolly elves. And you've probably heard of Krampus, the goat like creature that follows St. Nicholas around in German Christmas stories. But he's merely the tip of the iceberg when it comes to Christmas boogeymen. You see, German folklore is full of so called childhood nightmare figures. These are the monsters that you tell your children about in order to scare scare them into doing their chores or going to bed on time. But some of them come for adults too. In Central Europe, one of the most well known of these beings is Frau Purchta, an old crone who cares very much about the cleanliness of your house and whether you've done all your weaving for the season. It's said that if your house isn't clean, she will come in with a pair of scissors, slit your belly open and fill it with rocks. She also disembowels lazy children upon occasion as well. Those who observe her traditions make sure to leave out an offering dumplings in some regions, or porridge and herring. Other regions say that you must leave an egg on your roof as a tribute. Why on the roof? Well, some say that Frau Perchta flies through the air on the darkest night of the year, the winter solstice. And behind her is a caravan of spirits. In some traditions, these are the spirits of unbaptized children. In others, they are a parade of monstrous Krampus like creatures called Perkton. And she flies by riding on a distaff, a wool spinning tool that looks very much like a broom, enough so that her image might call to mind that classical image of a witch on a broomstick. But Frau Perchta is not a witch. She's a result of something that we would call syncretism and assimilation. Purchta was originally something more resembling a goddess or a folk deity. Her tradition can actually be traced all the way back to the Norse goddess Frigga. And she was the goddess of in between spaces who guided the spirits of the dead to the afterlife. In these older stories, it's said that she taught people how to weave flax into linen. But when Christianity started taking over the region, it went to work relegating the creatures of folklore to secondary roles that fit into Christian worship. Krampus, for instance, became Santa's helper. And Purchta became a figure who haunted people not on the winter solstice, but on January 6th, the 12th day of Christmas. But that day still holds its own special name for those who prefer to celebrate it the old way. Perchtentag like many classic pre Christian gods or goddesses, Perchta has a sort of duality to her. She is a creepy old woman who may punish you for disobedience, but she is also wise and elderly. She leads a train of ghosts through the sky in the dark of night, but she also guides those spirits that are lost to a final resting place. And as the nights grow longer and the days grow shorter, she makes you focus on the hearth and home, ensuring all is ready not just for her, but for your family as well. This duality makes her perfectly suited for the winter months and also makes her resistant to the ways that Christian influence tried to demonize her. And to this day, many Alpine communities still dress as Frau Perchta in holiday festivals and pay tribute to her just as enthusiastically as they do to St. Nicholas. Some figures from folklore stand the test of time, and some survive by adapting to a strange new world. So as the nights get colder this month, keep an eye on the dark sky above and maybe keep an egg on your roof. I hope you've enjoyed today's guided tour of the Cabinet of Curiosities. Subscribe for free on Apple Podcasts or learn more about the show by visiting curiositiespodcast.com this show was created by me, Aaron Manke in partnership with Howstuff Works. I make another award winning show called Lore, which is a podcast, book series and television show and you can learn all about it [e-mail] and until next time, stay curious.

[Public Podcast Advertiser]

Support for the show comes from Public, the investing platform for those who take it seriously. On Public, you can build a multi asset portfolio of stocks, bonds, options, crypto and now generated assets which allow you to turn any idea into an investable index. With AI. It all starts with your prompt. From renewable energy companies with high free cash flow to semiconductor suppliers growing revenue over 20% year over year. You can literally type any prompt and put the AI to work. It screens thousands of stocks, builds a one of a kind index and lets you back test it against the S&P 500. Then you can invest in a few clicks. Generated assets are like EFTs with infinite possibilities, completely customizable and based on your thesis, not someone else's. Go to public.com podcast and earn an uncapped 1% bonus when you transfer your portfolio. That's public.com podcast paid for by Public Investing Brokerage Services by Open to the Public Investing Inc. Member FINRA SIPC Advisory Services by Public Advisors llc SEC Registered Advisor Generated Assets is an interactive analysis tool output is for informational purposes only and is not investment, recommendation or advice. Complete Disclosures [e-mail] Disclosures this is an iHeart podcast.

[Aaron Mahnke]

Guaranteed Human.