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- [00:02]
Ad Tech God
This episode is brought to you by Amazon Business. We could all use more time. Amazon Business offers smart business buying solutions so you can spend more time growing your business and less time doing the admin. I can see why they call it smart. Learn more@amazonbusiness.com welcome to the ADTech Godpod, your window into the world of advertising technology and the people behind it. I'm your host, Ad Tech God. Welcome to another episode of the AdTech Godpod, where we connect with sales leaders shaping our industry. Today, we're thrilled to welcome Dave Simon, the Vice President of Sales at Viant. Previously, Dave worked at Bright Roll and helped with the Yahoo acquisition, where he was on the North American team helping build their programmatic sales team. He spent the past 15 years truly building programmatic businesses throughout the US and he continues to do so at Viome. Dave, I'm super excited to have you here and as a friend of the podcast and as a friend of Jeremy's, I love that you are joining me today. Thanks for being here.
- [01:08]
Dave Simon
Hi, atg. Thanks for having me. It's been so surreal and fun watching you and Jeremy and Arie build this business from afar. Rest assured, I'm honored to be here and I'm excited to chat with you and get started.
- [01:21]
Ad Tech God
Thank you. Thank you for being here. And Dave, you know, your background's pretty incredible because you've spent quite a bit of time in the programmatic space. You know, when I looked at your profile, you had spent some time at Bright Roll and, and that obviously was acquired by Yahoo. And that's. That's really interesting to hear, but I'd love for you to take it to the very beginning. Like, how did you get into the industry and what led you to lead up sales at at Vyant today?
- [01:44]
Dave Simon
It's a long story. Like a lot of people, I've held a ton of roles within advertising. I've had twists and turns to get to where I am now, and I've definitely had my share of successes and challenges. So after I graduated from the University of Iowa, I was a bartender out of school. I wanted to get into the creative side of advertising, but I had no formal training and obviously I couldn't get hired anywhere as a copywriter. But I had a friend of a friend who is a media buyer on the TV side and she helped me land an interview at BBDO in Chicago. I got that job and I became an assistant media buyer. I was later promoted to a junior buyer where I was filling the country with Dodge, Jeep and Chrysler TV and radio. Commercials. I was at BBDO for maybe two years and then I pivoted to the sales side. I started to work at a rep firm selling local spot tv because I was quite simply just drawn to that side of the business. It felt a little more entrepreneurial to me. It excited me more and I just chose to make the leap and follow that passion. That was kind of the first lesson for me was you need to like what you do. You need to feel some passion, some belief in what you do because otherwise you, you won't, you won't be as good. And now admitting this a hundred percent ages me. But I'll say that my goal at the time was to sell network tv. That was by far the coolest gig at the time. And after a few years at the rep firm I jumped to selling network radio because I felt like selling network at any level in any sort of format would position me best for network tv. I worked at a small independent company called Jones Media America. I was selling network radio for maybe four years and then overnight the company was acquired and they let go of all the salespeople. This was a super scary experience for me because while I was earning a decent living, I wasn't saving anything at the time. I just thought this would continue and money would keep coming in. And we had a baby. We were talking about having a second baby. So lesson number two was I learned the value of saving Immediately after this experience. My wife was working in search marketing. She's a long time search and digital OG and around this time she started talking to me about moving to the digital side. This was 2008. Online video was just starting to come on the scene. I could immediately see the value of it. There were a bunch of ad networks popping up like broadband enterprises and VEO and because I understood that the network aspect of grouping together like minded stations or sites and I love the site sound and motion of tv. I just knew this format was going to work. I wanted to find a way to get to this space. I. I wanted to be on the the cutting edge of the business. It became important to me after leaving radio to try to push the boundaries of of the space. So for me online video was just the newest of the new and that's where I wanted to be. However, just like when I couldn't get a job as a copywriter because I had no training or experience, I found a similar experience waiting for me when I tried to get a job digital after a career in TV and radio. I lied on my during my interview experience and we've all done that, We've all done that. And it's well documented within, within the company. They, they all know. But I somehow convinced a small video startup called Bright Roll to take a chance on me. You had mentioned it earlier. I joined there and I became employee number 19 and I helped open up the Midwest. At the time of acquisition, spoiler alert, it was around 350. But I'll say opening up a market for a brand new company with a brand new format is a special kind of torture. And we experienced so many losses in those early days. But my boss Brad and I, we just kept grinding and working and little by little the business opened up like we thought it would. We made our first hire and then our second, our third and we grew that company into a really large entity. As a company, we pivoted early to Programmatic. So we turned what was an ad network into a programmatic dsp. For a long time I thought we were the first until your friend Jeremy Bloom informed me that Tubemogul beat us by a few months. We were maybe the second DSP. Bright Roll was acquired by Yahoo in 2014 and that was such a huge collective achievement. To go from a small startup where we were worried about making payroll or worried about keeping the doors open to having a large nine figure exit was incredible. Yahoo was then acquired by Verizon and became Oath. And I stated that combined company for a little over 10 years, ending as the head of agency trading desk sales for them and helping stand up the Yahoo dsp, which was a Bright Roll dsp. I mean it was such a great experience. But Oath was such a huge company. I wanted to build again at a startup. I think I wanted that feeling of success that we had at Bright Roll. And so I rejoined my Bright Roll boss at a company called Cubic that was in the mobile location space. It was interesting technology. I stood up their, their programmatic sales. Then I went on to the, to the BD side. I got some, some BD experience and it was a great move. And then March of 2020 happened. The pandemic happened. Nobody moved. We were all stuck in our house and there really wasn't a ton of use for a mobile location company.
- [07:54]
Ad Tech God
I mean that also hit the digital out of home business really hard too.
- [07:58]
Dave Simon
You're right. Our friends at Clear Channel had trouble.
- [08:01]
Ad Tech God
Yeah, a lot of digital out of home. A lot of like geolocation focused companies. Really Streaming was the only one that benefited after like a small lull for a few weeks where all the budgets were pulled and then suddenly Came back and then the user base just, like, popped like crazy. But, yeah, that was a very odd time.
- [08:20]
Dave Simon
Tell me about it.
- [08:21]
Ad Tech God
You're.
- [08:21]
Dave Simon
You're right. Even thinking about it now, that's when.
- [08:24]
Ad Tech God
I created this account, Dave. That's how weird it is.
- [08:27]
Dave Simon
See? So look how far. Look how far it's come. During this time, the next move I made, I. I tried something outside of ad tech. I think it's something that a lot of people think about doing. So I found a company called Convoy, which is in the logistics space, and they were building a DSP of freight. Don't spend a ton of time here, but one big learning is that I don't like logistics. I don't want to solve the problems that we were trying to solve. And I wanted to get back into ads. I missed the business. I wasn't able to be a very successful leader in logistics because I didn't know anyone. I didn't know the business. I couldn't mentor or grow talent or remove any obstacles. And right around this time, Vian approached me. They were looking to pivot their business to be more programmatic, focused. They talked about a new slate of products and being really big into innovation that they wanted to release, and it was a good match. I've been here for over three years, and it's been great. And to their credit, Viant does have a large history of innovation, and we've been seeing a lot of that on display recently.
- [09:33]
Ad Tech God
I've had Chris and Tim Vanderhoek on the podcast twice now. One is just a regular meet the guests kind of podcast, like I'm doing with you. And then I did. I'm starting to do more kind of ad hoc episodes with breaking news, so I did some on the Google antitrust. Great guys. Like, they're super innovative. They're quite funny. They have a great personality together, and I love that they come as a pair. It's like I asked Tim, but Chris came. I think the first time I was like, hey, Chris, will you come? He's like, I'm bringing Tim. Which I think is pretty cool that they're brothers, they work together, they're co founders, they got a cool sense of humor. And then, like, they just don't leave each other's side. Which I thought was pretty awesome that they do that.
- [10:10]
Dave Simon
Would it surprise you if I told you there's a third brother?
- [10:13]
Ad Tech God
I know that there's a third one, too. And he does. He's what, chief in charge of partnerships?
- [10:19]
Dave Simon
He is not. I'm gonna let you guess But Ross Vanderhoek is also very involved in the business. Not in front of camera so much, but he's also in every meeting. He's with them all the time. There's another brother that's not involved in the business, but these three are involved in the business.
- [10:36]
Ad Tech God
Yeah, I think. I think the story was he gave him some money to buy the domain when they first started or something like that. Like, they needed the money to get started. And he, like, put in money. He said, if I give you the money, then I get, you know, equal share. So they all started together. It's pretty impressive, Dave, like, as. As you've looked back and, like, now you're at Vayant, you're going on three years. You had a little bit of a. I want to say bumpy ride, but like a bumpy ride during COVID which totally makes sense, and that happens. What direction do you see Vayant moving in over the next 12 to 18 months? Because it's obviously innovating and creating new ways to work with clients. Like, how do you seeing, I guess, the industry and the world around you?
- [11:16]
Dave Simon
I definitely did have a bumpy ride, and I'm pretty upfront about it. I have to. I think it's important. Yeah. And nobody has a career that is up and to the right all the time. And I'm happy talking about it. I think those experiences help shape us moving forward. So it's. It's totally fine.
- [11:33]
Ad Tech God
I lost my job six months after buying my first condo, and it was four days after the birth of my first kid.
- [11:41]
Dave Simon
That's a rough one.
- [11:43]
Ad Tech God
It was a rough one. And I held it back for about a week before I told my wife. When we went on a walk, and she looked at me and said, what are we going to do? I'm like, I don't know. We'll figure it out. It makes you realize that you're not unstoppable, because at that point, I felt like I was on fire. Right. Like, started a family, bought a place, got a little bit of money in the bank. I'm on the right path. And then the rug gets swept out from underneath you, and you're like, I gotta rethink the way I do things. We gotta save a little bit more, maybe not spend as much. Maybe things can change really quickly. So it just changes your perspective on everything. And it happens to a lot of people.
- [12:16]
Dave Simon
You're right. When I had my first layoff at the. During the radio time, I thought the money would just keep coming in. I didn't think about saving. But the combination of getting let go, which happens to so many people, and having children gives you a level of resolve and grit and humility that has probably been beneficial for both of us over the span of our career. It's not talked about a lot because I don't think people want to admit that these things happen, but I mean, they happen.
- [12:46]
Ad Tech God
And a lot of times it's out of your control. Sometimes there's, you know, like you have a bad you join a company, you don't feel like you're a good fit, you kind of disconnect, you underperform, and for whatever reason you leave or they ask you to leave like that. That happens like you're first on the chalking block when layoffs happen because you just didn't perform like that's totally normal. I think that's happened to everybody I've ever spoken to. They're like, not a good fit. So I don't like it. I'm going to look for something else. It totally happens, but I think it gives you the grit and the drive to realize that, you know, I can rebuild again and do this again. I just got to get my feet on the ground and start sprinting a little faster than most people would like. But you just have to work hard and just do it.
- [13:23]
Dave Simon
You're right. So to get back to your question about where I I see the business, I think the biggest trends that I'm seeing are AI and ctv Cookieless future privacy identity. The only thing I would add is feels like and maybe it's related to what's going on with with Google and the Department of Justice, but it feels like there's a marketplace that's looking for alternatives to the walled gardens and to other large companies. So that leaves an opening for innovative small companies, challenger brands, to create products that have a strong market fit, that give them an opportunity to thrive and that helps the whole business move forward.
- [14:07]
Ad Tech God
Identity is a hot topic and your acquisition of Iris was really interesting to me and I think that's why I jumped on so quick with Tim and Chris. Where do you see that kind of heading with, you know, signals Being lost with Cookie less world Moving forward with clean rooms. Both the positive and the negative of clean rooms. Like, do you see identity being a hot topic even throughout 2025?
- [14:35]
Dave Simon
I definitely do. And I'll tell you, I listened to your your podcast with them. It was great. Granted, I work at the company, so you can take my my feedback with a grain of salt, but I love the fact that you Just reached out to them on Twitter. Chris responded, you had them on a pod within 10 hours or something. That's pretty incredible and wasn't possible 10 years ago. Doesn't feel like that would be, that would be possible. So. But again, to get back to your question. Yeah, I think Identity and privacy and cookie list, those three are sort of linked together and they're going to be a hot topic for a very long time. Apple and Google are continually obfuscating signals and signal loss is going to continue. And marketers that want to understand the return on ad spend will need to turn to publishers and partners that have first party data and that have first party identifiers that are present within a cookie list bid stream. And this is where the business is going and that's why vyant purchased Virus tv. They have an identifier that is able to understand signals within a CTV environment. I believe that CTV is going to be a major growth driver for the industry moving forward.
- [15:58]
Ad Tech God
No, I, I wanted to ask you like that was actually going to be my next question which is, you know, do you think Connected TV will continue to scale and grow the way it has been over the last few years or is it like, are we reaching that like maturity point where it's, you know, the growth has obviously been really impressive for four or five years. Ad spend continues to grow quickly and now it's a maturing market or do you think we're still early on?
- [16:25]
Dave Simon
I think the growth of fast players. I listened to the tubi pod that you had on with Tyler. He had a very interesting point of view on, on the topic. The growth of Netflix ads is going to dump a tremendous amount of ad load into the ecosystem. And just the continued viewing patterns from LINEAR to CTV to me show that this market still has a long way to go. The growth has been substantial, but really the understanding and the ability to measure has not kept up with the demand. And when we can start to increase the amount of targetability and measurement within the space, then I think you're going to see growth actually improve. And that's what that's the goal of a purchase like this is to do.
- [17:13]
Ad Tech God
That's, that's the true unlock. I, I think the, the general ad spend across Connected TV is growing as a hot median. Like this is great. CTV is great TV but you know, connected differently, but same similar user experience. I think when we can actually deliver on what we promise as a digital solution to these brands, which is, you know, the improved targeting, the improved measurement, backing it out for better, you know, return on ad spend. I think that's when we'll see the boom because I think it's the writing's on the wall for linear. Like it continues to be a big piece of the industry and always will be or will be for a long time. But CTV is really scaling fast, like really taking a cut out of budget and user base.
- [17:58]
Dave Simon
It's where everybody spends their time.
- [18:00]
Ad Tech God
I mean, I stream everything. I haven't had cable TV or a satellite box like my parents do for 10 years now. So I mean this is all I do is stream.
- [18:10]
Dave Simon
You've had no cable for 10 years.
- [18:12]
Ad Tech God
I want to say I started with a box called Sling. I think it was actually the original Sling TV box which was like you would buy it, you'd plug it in, you get all the channels and it was like an own independent little box that you would plug into your tv. And I don't even know if it was even. It was something that you just bought online at the time.
- [18:30]
Dave Simon
Wasn't that the product that allowed you to watch your TV in another location?
- [18:35]
Ad Tech God
No, that was called Slingbox. Yes, this was called, I think this was the original Sling tv.
- [18:43]
Dave Simon
But it was basically where my confusion was.
- [18:46]
Ad Tech God
Okay, yeah. So basically what it was was almost like it would streamlinear TV over this device. It was almost like somebody had a video camera pointed at a TV screen and you can, you could stream it. It was like the early, early days and if I remember the name, I'll actually send it to you. But it was similar to like the little dongles we have now with, with Sling or with Roku. And I'll try to find the name and actually find if I still have the little unit that you plug into. It was pretty pioneer, pretty early days. And then I finally pulled the full plug across the house. So that was what I mostly had in one room and then the other room was cable. But I've been streaming for a long time because you got access to everything through it and it was like a one time fee of like a hundred bucks.
- [19:30]
Dave Simon
You're right. We don't use our cable and I keep it. I don't know if my wife and I are just afraid to pull the plug on it, but we pay a lot of money to Comcast and don't and don't use it.
- [19:40]
Ad Tech God
I stream everything now. But I think I mentioned on a prior podcast I feel like I'm paying more because I'm subscribed to like everything, Paramount, Netflix, Hulu. I'm a big user of Sling tv. I Still find them to be the easiest user experience. But I use everything now and now I feel like I pay a few hundred bucks a month and I think it's basically the same price as cable.
- [20:01]
Dave Simon
Right. Better content and easier to find. And I know we both have kids and I'm assuming your kids don't watch anything that's not streamed.
- [20:09]
Ad Tech God
My kids only stream and they refuse to get off of Roku. They refuse. I tried getting them on Apple tv, they wouldn't do it. They're like, we like the remote and they're just comfortable with the user experience. So that's what we do. We just have the, you know, whatever the 4K device and that's what they, that's what they stream on.
- [20:27]
Dave Simon
Got it.
- [20:28]
Ad Tech God
Dave, we've talked about streaming kind of the direction of Viant and the direction you guys are heading in. You guys obviously have integrated a lot of AI into your solution. But what is like the one thing that kind of keeps you in this industry? Because you've obviously tried to leave. Well, not tried to leave. Gave it a shot.
- [20:46]
Dave Simon
I gave it a shot.
- [20:47]
Ad Tech God
Yeah, you gave it a shot and you came right back. But what do you love so much about the industry that keeps you here and keeps you focused on, I guess, growth in your career in this space?
- [20:58]
Dave Simon
I think it's the pace of change. I think having an industry that is both competitive yet so social is also very in line with my personality. I'm in sales. I am a very com competitive individual. But I'm also an extremely good team player and I'm very social. I love that aspect of the space. I love the fact that in my network there are friends on all sides of the aisle and we communicate and help each other out when we're down, even though we're competing against each other for dollars. The human aspect of this business, I think is what drives me. Ad tech is a technology driven by humans and human interaction. It's a people driven business, regardless of what people want to say. And I just think between that and the pace of change, the fact that we're talking about AI right now and we're talking about actual products that are being released related to AI when this wasn't even a thought five or six years ago, the fact that we're focusing on all the CTV inventory, which wasn't available within a DSP when we started this, these changes are very large and they keep the business interesting. And it also keeps it so that you're constantly learning if this was a job or an industry where you had it figured out from, you know, after one year and then nothing changed. I think it would be pretty boring. I, I don't, I don't see how you could have the motivation to keep growing and trying new things. But in our space changes every week. Yeah, we're constantly learning things and you're constantly forced to ask, like, raise your hand and say, I don't understand this. Can you explain it? So I would say those, those two things between the people and the pace of change, that's, that's what keeps me motivated and keeps me in the space.
- [22:51]
Ad Tech God
I've always been a big reader of content, and that's kind of where I, where I got my information and stayed up to date. And that's been something that I've been pretty adamant about doing just for my own, you know, improvement of industry knowledge. Like, I always read the trades. I obviously ask people I work with in my close, trusted circle that I would ask questions to that I felt that they wouldn't judge me. And I think with, with creating this ATG brand or Persona, it's forced me to read more, even more than before. But what's nice is I get to ask questions. And it seems like nobody ever really has the exact right answer. It seems like everybody has an opinion. So it also kind of solidifies that we're changing so much and so fast that if the industry leaders don't have a exact answer to every question, it makes you feel like, okay, good. I do have a good understanding of what's happening, and we're all trying to figure out what's next, and we're all learning together and we're watching each other to see how people innovate and solve for this problem. And I think it's, it's kind of refreshing. And that's what keeps me wanting to be in the industry, is like, you just don't get bored. Like, it's constant learning and it keeps you sharp and it keeps you on top of things. That's, that's personally why I'm here.
- [24:08]
Dave Simon
You're right. And you bring up an interesting point. You have all of these industry leaders pontificating about the direction they are sure this space is going, and we're all wrong. We're all wrong so often because we all thought, you know, the year of mobile was 10 years ago and then it was five years ago, and, and we're so sure that cookies are going to go away, and they're not. There's just so many disparate bodies in this space. But I, I do find it fascinating. I just. It's a fascinating space.
- [24:40]
Ad Tech God
All you need is one disruptor. All you need is one regulation change. All you need is one person who pops out of nowhere with a solution that kind of throws everybody into a tailspin because they've knocked it out of the park with what they're doing. And that changes everything. That changes your product roadmap, that changes the way you package your product. That changes the way you expand on your business because it's so fast. It changes incredibly, incredibly fast that, like, you have to pay attention or else you're very quickly left behind.
- [25:10]
Dave Simon
A really interesting example of that is when the agencies pivoted to launching their trading desks. There was an ad network business that was flourishing in, in 2010, 2009, 2010, and then the rise of the trading desks happened. And I remember the third quarter of two thousand and ten, I think it was, was the worst quarter I have ever had in the history of my career because all of the business that we had went to the agency trading desks and nobody was prepared for that in our company. And I don't think many people were prepared for that at the ad networks that we were competing with. That's an example of just immediate disruption that. That takes the industry by storm.
- [25:55]
Ad Tech God
Yeah. The brands wanted to take over their buying and they did it. It's interesting to see where things are heading. I mean, there's a lot of DSPs, such as Vayant and all the others in the market that continue to innovate. And it's just interesting to see how the, you know, quote, lumascape changes over time and how things merge into one or things move their location. We've got a fun few years ahead of us, and specifically in the connected TV space, I think it's going to be a fun ride.
- [26:24]
Dave Simon
I agree. I'm looking forward to it.
- [26:26]
Ad Tech God
Same here. I love this stuff. I'm like a total nerd. I read this stuff all the time. I'm way too into it, I think. But, Dave, I want to thank you. That actually brings us to the end of the podcast and I want to thank you and the team at Vyant for having you here today. And I really enjoyed meeting you.
- [26:43]
Dave Simon
I did, too. I enjoyed the experience. It's nice to meet you. I had a lot of fun. More fun than maybe I thought. And I appreciate the invitation. Happy to come back.
- [26:53]
Ad Tech God
Nice casual chat. Dave, I just want to meet you and get to know who you are. So I, I really appreciate you taking out the time.
- [26:59]
Dave Simon
Yeah, you bet. Good luck to you and the rest of the of of your partners.
- [27:03]
Ad Tech God
Thank you. Thank you. Dave thanks for tuning in to another episode of the AdTech Godpod, a podcast for the people about the people. Stay connected with me for more insights, trends and interviews in the realm of adtech. Don't miss out on the latest updates, so follow me on X Instagram and connect with me on LinkedIn. Don't forget ATG Slack community has insights, networking opportunities and jobs. Keep the conversation going and stay at the forefront of adtech innovation.