Afford Anything Podcast – Episode 700

Q&A: A $30K Promotion Near FI, Learning Put Options, and Scaling a 16-Unit Portfolio

Host: Paula Pant
Co-Host: Joe Salsihai
Release Date: March 24, 2026

Episode Overview

This milestone episode (#700!) of the Afford Anything podcast delves into pivotal questions on making smart, nuanced money decisions. Paula Pant and co-host Joe Salsihai field three listener questions:

1. Should you take a major promotion with more responsibility close to financial independence (FI)?
2. How do you avoid scammy finance courses when wanting to learn options trading?
3. What’s the best way to scale a small real estate portfolio to the next level—and should you sell, refinance, or hustle for capital?

The discussion explores financial psychology, behavioral nuances of money, and practical steps for career, investing, and business growth.

1. Navigating a $30K Promotion Close to Financial Independence

Listener: Melanie
[01:37 – 26:14]

Core Question:

Should Melanie pursue a $30k pay increase through a higher-responsibility job, even though she’s a few years from financial independence and pension vesting, or should she prioritize ease and enjoyment in her final working years?

Key Discussion and Insights

• Aligning Work With Meaning
  Paula urges Melanie to consider fulfillment:
  • “What enjoyment would you get from this role? … Mastery, autonomy, purpose.” ([04:00])
  • Ask: Will you gain mastery? Will you have autonomy? Will you find purpose and make a positive impact?
  • Joe cites research on “mattering”—how making an impact and feeling needed is a crucial retirement factor. ([05:36])
• Pitfalls of Using Only the ‘FI Number’
  The duo challenges traditional FI strategies:
  • Joe: “I think, to some degree, the idea of the FI number is BS.” ([12:33]) The safe withdrawal rate and single ‘magic number’ for retirement are often based on dynamic, unpredictable factors—like inflation, life changes, and personal black swan events.
  • Paula aligns: Annual spending and happiness are dynamic: “Your spending every year of your life is dynamic…yet we often form these FI numbers by pulling a singular data point.” ([18:08])
• The “Peak-End” Experience
  Paula highlights psychological research:
  • “We tend to remember things based on two variables—the peak and how it ended.” ([21:58])
    Your feelings about your final job can shape your memory of an entire career, making enjoyment now especially important.

Memorable Quotes

• Joe:
  “The biggest problem [in retirement planning] was meaning—was mattering. Do I matter anymore? Am I making that impact that I used to make?” ([05:36])
• Paula:
  “You get to choose your job not based on its pay, but based on whether or not you want it. The underlying question is, what do you want?” ([11:30])
• On New Responsibilities:
  • Paula: “Sometimes with increased responsibility comes increased freedom… With great responsibility comes great freedom.” ([25:27])

Key Takeaways

• Shift focus away from money or societal pressure; prioritize meaning, autonomy, and impact.
• Don’t over-index on a single FI or ‘safe withdrawal’ number—the bigger picture (life, economy, personal evolution) matters.
• Choose your last years of work with intention, for both enjoyment and to set up positive memories.

2. Finding Legit Learning for Put Options & Avoiding Scams

Listener: Amy
[29:59 – 41:05]

Core Question:

How can you find reputable, non-scammy courses to learn options trading (specifically puts)? Who can you trust, and how do you choose the right teacher?

Key Discussion and Insights

• Who, Not How
  Joe and Paula extol the value of “ask who, not how”—get recommendations from trusted people, not just Google or social media. ([32:00])
• Finding a Teacher
  • Paula suggests: Look up Rose Hahn, a podcast guest who is well-regarded (but she hasn’t taken the course personally). ([33:07])
  • Evaluate instructors through their free materials (newsletters, YouTube, podcasts) to see if their style and philosophy match your needs. ([34:56])
• Options as Tools—Not Just Gambling
  • Joe: “Options can be used in a very conservative way to make your portfolio less volatile… but on the other side, it gets into the area of gambling.” ([33:48])
  • Choose instructors who emphasize risk management and clear frameworks.
• Not All Teachers or Mediums Are Equal
  • Assess free content to check for depth, approach, and transparency.
  • Paula: “Once you ingest enough free material from someone, you understand the framework through which they view the world, their decision making matrix.” ([41:05])

Memorable Quotes

• Joe:
  “Ask who, not how… We’re a much, much, much better ‘who’ than Google.” ([32:46])
• Paula:
  “There are some people who use options to make your portfolio safer, and others who use it to make it riskier and to gamble… So how do you separate that out? I would start by looking at their free material.” ([34:56])

Key Takeaways

• Look for trusted, conservative, and transparent instructors.
• Vet teachers with their free content for fit and philosophy before paying.
• Embrace the “ask who, not how” mindset—seek out recommendations within your trusted communities.

3. Growing a Real Estate Portfolio from 16 Units—Sell, Refi, or Hustle?

Listener: Ben from Cincinnati
[43:17 – 69:20]

Listener Situation Recap

• From handyman with no properties (2020: episode 243) to owning/managing 16 units (2026)
• Portfolio: Fourplex, multiple units, mix of self-management and professional management
• Seeking advice: Should he sell current units for a bigger multifamily? Continue incremental growth? Or hustle (wholesaling, starting new ventures) for capital?

Key Discussion and Insights

• Celebrate the Journey
  Paula: “You are now—you’ve grown from four to 16 [units]. You are right there. Six years later you’re doing the thing that you set out to do.” ([48:08])
• Eliminate Distractions—Cactus Business & Wholesaling
  • Paula is firm: “A cactus business is great for someone who is focused in that area. For you this would just be a distraction.” ([49:25])
  • On wholesaling: Only pursue it if deal access is your true aim—not just to accumulate a side job for income. ([52:00])
• Leverage and Lending Strategy
  • Use commercial banks for growth, not just hard money or private lenders.
  • Joe: Relationships with small/local banks are far more effective than large institutions:
    “I would look for community banks versus a huge bank with a name that you’ve seen on television ads.” ([57:36])
  • Paula: Only bring in a silent partner if it’s a perfect fit; wrong partners are worse than no partners. ([54:00])
• Preserve and Build Efficiently
  • Don’t cash out the current properties unless absolutely necessary—especially with highly favorable mortgage rates.
    “As you mentioned, 4 out of those 16 units have a 2.75% mortgage. Hold that one. That is gold in today's market.” ([59:38])
  • Focus first on getting to 20 or 30 units, not just gunning for 40. ([63:30])

Memorable Quotes

• Paula:
  “There is a certain level of risk that is mitigated when you so deeply know your properties.” ([59:38])
• Joe:
  “The power is always stepping through the door. Because now that Ben has stepped through several doors… all of a sudden, now he sees wholesaling might be an option… It gets more difficult because you see low hanging fruit… that end up just being shiny objects.” ([64:13])
• Paula:
  “First, do no harm. …Preserve what you’ve already built and then continue to grow.” ([63:30])

Practical Strategies and Cautions

• Protect existing assets and leverage your expertise.
• Only expand into new ventures if they closely align with your main business and skills.
• Build real relationships with local bankers for better borrowing power.
• Carefully vet any potential partners—don’t let urgency override fit.

Through-Line and Final Thoughts

Throughout all three questions, a common theme emerges:
“What do you truly want? What energizes you, gives you meaning, and aligns with your skills—versus what looks shiny or simply pays more?”
Both hosts urge listeners to:

• Be intentional with job and business moves (especially near FI)
• Vet sources and teachers carefully in a world full of scams
• Avoid distractions—even lucrative ones—if they don't fit your primary goals and passions

Notable Quotes by Timestamp

• Joe: “The biggest problem was meaning—was mattering.” ([05:36])
• Paula: “With great responsibility comes great freedom, and with that freedom … you’re more likely to enjoy it, not less.” ([25:27])
• Joe: “Ask who, not how.” ([32:00])
• Paula: “There is a certain risk that is mitigated when you so deeply know your properties.” ([59:38])
• Joe: “The power is always stepping through the door… but you start to see shiny objects that distract you.” ([64:13])

Key Timestamps

| Segment | Timestamp | |------------------------------|--------------| | Melanie’s FI/Promotion Q | 01:37–26:14 | | Amy’s Options/Course Q | 29:59–41:05 | | Ben’s Real Estate Growth Q | 43:17–69:20 |

Episode Tone and Closing

As always, the exchange between Paula Pant and Joe Salsihai is warm, insightful, and laced with humor and relatability. They blend deep behavioral finance wisdom with accessible advice and celebrate the journeys of their listeners, all while championing careful thought over prescriptive, black-and-white solutions.

Paula: “Thank you to everyone for tuning in to episode 700… and here’s to the next 700 ahead!” ([72:36])

For more resources, podcast episodes, and the free book 'Escape,' visit AffordAnything.com.