Martin Scorsese Is Now An AI Filmmaker.

Summary

Podcast Summary: AI For Humans – "Martin Scorsese Is Now An AI Filmmaker."

Hosts: Kevin Pereira & Gavin Purcell
Date: June 3, 2026
Episode Overview:
This episode explores the growing intersection of artificial intelligence and filmmaking, highlighted by Martin Scorsese's high-profile participation as an "AI filmmaker." Kevin and Gavin break down what Scorsese’s involvement means for Hollywood, discuss the backlash against other creators, spotlight innovative AI filmmakers and tools, and bring listeners up to speed on big open-source AI model news, including Nvidia’s latest moves and PewDiePie's new AI project.

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Main Theme

The episode focuses on how established Hollywood icons, notably Martin Scorsese, are publicly embracing AI as a filmmaking tool, the cultural push-and-pull around AI creators, and rapid technical advances empowering independent creators with open-source AI models and new hardware.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Martin Scorsese Directs AI: A Turning Point for Hollywood

• Scorsese’s Commercial with Black Forest Labs (01:29)
  • Martin Scorsese appears in a new commercial (possibly a paid or equity deal) with Black Forest Labs—creators of Flux models—demonstrating the use of AI as a filmmaking partner.
  • Notable Quote:

    "I think this is probably the biggest filmmaker at large who has come out and basically said they're going to use AI in some form." – Gavin (02:51)

  • Scorsese is shown interacting with AI as if directing a crew; this is seen as a paradigm shift:

    "Watching Scorsese direct the AI as he would a cameraman… I think this is going to shake a lot of people's belief structures." – Gavin (02:51)

• Industry Reaction & Double Standards
  • Discussion on why big icons like Scorsese and James Cameron may not get the same backlash as less established creators.
  • Notable Quote:

    "People love Scorsese... if you have done enough in your career, you get to kind of do whatever you want." – Gavin (04:41)

2. The Cultural and Ethical Debate: Who’s Allowed to Use AI?

• Creator Backlash:
  • Recap of Jorge Guterres (Book of Life director) dropping out of an AI-powered Amazon series after extreme online hate (including from high-profile filmmakers like Guillermo del Toro) (06:37–09:40).
• The “Legend Immunity” Phenomenon
  • Legends get more leeway, but even they face ethical quagmires:

    "The only way AI gets to exist is if Martin Scorsese, Shang Tsung's… some souls out of all of the artists community." – Kevin (05:50)

  • The hosts openly acknowledge AI systems’ controversial origins and data ingestion:

    "We understand that all AI was trained on the creative work of the human history, right?" – Gavin (06:37)

3. YouTube Filmmakers and AI: New Talent Rises

• Recent Box Office Successes:
  • “Backrooms” and “Obsession”—films by young YouTuber directors—are outperforming legacy franchises like Star Wars (Mandalorian and Grogu) (09:40–11:16).
• AI YouTubers & Memes:
  • Discussion of the cyclical nature of new technologies, resistance faced, and how communities form around them.
  • “What exactly is AI really?” – noting blurred lines between “generative AI” and older digital tools used in Hollywood (11:16–12:16).

4. Showcasing AI Filmmakers and Projects (13:00–15:38)

• Gossip Goblin:
  • Shoutout for the short film “Toe Brigade,” praised for creative use of AI in storytelling (13:00).
• Farou (Japan):
  • Innovative, low-budget AI video creation (“gorilla” clip for 10,000 yen) lauded for its storytelling charm (13:44).
• Chronicle of Bone:
  • Creator (originally gained traction with an AI “Dark Knight” film) releases a new, epic 20-minute chapter, gaining 3.2 million views (14:38).
  • Community feedback:

    "I don't care if this is AI, this is some of the best storytelling I've seen in a while." (as seen in YouTube comments) (15:01).

• Sopranos AI Meme:
  • Entertaining Tony Soprano x ChatGPT parody showcases advances in AI audio-visual memes (15:46–16:27).

5. Learning and Community in AI Filmmaking

• J Boogs (a.k.a. J Boog x Creative):
  • Noted for extensive, public breakdowns of his anime AI animation process and prompt strategies, teaching community via Patreon (17:27–18:00).
• Importance of Knowledge-sharing:
  • Strong emphasis on the cycle of learning and democratization echoing YouTube’s formative years (17:42).

6. Open Source AI Hits a New Level: Nvidia, Microsoft, PewDiePie

• Nvidia’s Computex Announcements (19:00–26:10):
  • Release of open-weight AI models (Nemotron 3 Ultra) to accelerate development and maintain Nvidia’s dominance in hardware sales (19:23–20:16).
  • Discussion of the rationale:

    "All [Jensen Huang] wants is this AI world to proliferate...the money they make is from the shovels that everybody's got to use to get into AI." – Gavin (20:16)

  • Rising performance of open models (Nemotron, Gemma, Kimi K2, MiniMax M3) and their global competition.
• New Hardware: Nvidia RTX Spark Series:
  • Introduction of consumer-ish "system on a chip" laptops—running powerful local AI workflows, enabling privacy and reducing cloud costs (24:30–26:49).
• PewDiePie’s Odysseus:
  • PewDiePie releases an open-source “agentic harness” for running local AI tasks; praised for user-friendly design and an innovative “Cookbook” feature that matches models to specific hardware specs (22:13–24:29).
  • Notable Quote:

    "Cookbook looks to solve that by analyzing your hardware and recommending a model based off that." – Kevin (23:35)

7. AI Goal Tools & Hands-off Game Development

• OpenAI/Codex “/goal” Tool:
  • Gavin experiments with the new agentic “goal” prompt, revamping his AI-built “Bear Jump” game over 42 hours with minimal manual intervention, guided by the tool (26:49–29:25).
  • Notable Quote:

    "You can go and give an AI a long-term thing and just let your computer run and just let it kind of work on this stuff." – Gavin (28:41)

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Memorable Moments & Quotes (with Timestamps)

• "I think this is going to shake a lot of people's… belief structures." – Gavin (02:51)
• "The only way AI gets to exist is if Martin Scorsese, Shang Tsung's… some souls out of all of the artists community." – Kevin (05:50)
• "We understand that all AI was trained on the creative work of human history…" – Gavin (06:37)
• "Is it generative AI, or is it that you used a tool that rotoscoped the green screen for you?" – Kevin (11:16)
• "I don't care if this is AI, this is some of the best storytelling I've seen in a while." – YouTube Comment (15:01)
• "Cookbook looks to solve that by analyzing your hardware and recommending a model based off that." – Kevin (23:35)
• "You can go and give an AI a long-term thing and just let your computer run and just let it kind of work on this stuff." – Gavin (28:41)

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Key Segment Timestamps

| Segment | Topic | Timestamp | |---|---|---| | Introduction & Scorsese as AI Filmmaker | [00:00–01:56] | | Scorsese’s Commercial & Industry Impact | [01:29–03:34] | | Culture War over AI in Filmmaking | [04:41–09:40] | | Rise of YouTube/AI Filmmakers | [09:40–12:01] | | AI Creators & Shoutouts | [13:00–15:38] | | Sopranos AI Meme & Community Learning | [15:38–18:00] | | Open Source Model News (Nvidia, PewDiePie) | [19:23–26:49] | | Nvidia Hardware Announcements | [24:30–26:49] | | OpenAI Goal / Codex & New Bear Jump Game | [26:49–29:54] |

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Podcast Tone and Takeaways

• Tone:
  Playful, irreverent, and deeply plugged into both technical and cultural threads of the AI world. The hosts strike a balance between skepticism, celebration, and self-aware humor.
• Key Takeaways:
  • Scorsese’s public embrace of AI marks a watershed moment and may further legitimize AI tools for filmmakers.
  • Backlash against AI creators is still intense—especially for newcomers—but legends seem to enjoy some “immunity.”
  • Open-source AI and better hardware are democratizing creative AI use, enabling astonishing work by YouTubers and solo creators.
  • New agentic tools (e.g., Codex / OpenAI “goal”, PewDiePie's Odysseus) are making automated and highly capable workflows accessible for more people.

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Final Thoughts

The episode paints a picture of a Hollywood and creator landscape rapidly changing under AI’s influence—where power structures are shifting, the lines of authorship are blurrier, and the only constant is the breakneck pace of both innovation and controversy. Whether you’re a skeptic or an enthusiast, the world of AI-powered creativity is already here, packed with new challenges, talents, and opportunities.

Transcript

[Kevin]

Well, Martin Scorsese is now an AI

[Gavin]

filmmaker, and this clip is not AI

[Guest/Caller]

I need a place that doesn't feel modern. A town, not a village, not a city. Almost medieval. Even the streets are narrower.

[Kevin]

Scorsese is just one of a number of major filmmakers who are suddenly embracing AI as a tool, while haters continue to send death threats to cartoonists.

[Gavin]

But as the YouTube driven success of the backrooms movie shows, sometimes the world changes fast. We're going to dive in today to talk about AI filmmaking, show you some favorite creators, and also give you some tips on how to make the best ones.

[Kevin]

Nvidia and Microsoft, they cooked for about three years and they have finally yoinked the future of personal computing out of the oven and dragged it on stage.

[Gavin]

Of course, I got to show you

[Kevin]

the most beautiful part, which is video games.

[Gavin]

And I let Codex's slash goal to cook for about 45 hours and ended up with a very fun version of my bear jumping game. If you remember from back in the

[Kevin]

day, I understand what a percentage of those words were. But I also know for certain that this is AI for humans.

[Gavin]

Woohoo. Welcome everybody to AI for Humans. This is your twice a week guide to the wonderful world of AI and Kevin. Today we have some crazy news from the AI video space. Martin Scorsese. Marty Scorsese, who his friends call him. I am one of his friends. I know you are his friend, Marty Swaz.

[Kevin]

That's how he is in my WhatsApp threads.

[Gavin]

Marty Suaz is an AI filmmaker. Now let us like, kind of set the table as to what's going on here. Black Forest Labs, the makers of the Flux models, which we haven't heard a ton from lately, have released a new kind of commercial, I guess, featuring Martin Scorsese. And we do want to be clear here, this could very well be a paid deal. This could also be an equity deal. But Martin Scorsese is in this commercial directing an AI which actually I think is a much bigger deal than you might expect.

[Kevin]

And to quote bfl, that's the Black Forest Labs. He spent six decades shaping how the world sees stories, and now he's helping us shape visual intelligence with human taste and craft at the center.

[Guest/Caller]

So you think Flux actually will storyboard for me?

[Kevin]

Well, let's try it. And we'll go from. From what you think you need a

[Guest/Caller]

place that doesn't feel modern. A town, not a village, not a city. Almost medieval, even. The. The streets are narrower, cobblestoned. The main road through the town is tw twisting and turning, put the camera higher, looking down.

[Kevin]

Suddenly the. The postman shows up.

[Gavin]

His.

[Kevin]

His bobas grow massive. Big, massive. No, that's not what we're doing.

[Gavin]

Martin Scorsese. It's probably like suddenly, suddenly a gun. Somebody comes out with a gun and starts shooting everybody. Which, by the way, you cannot very well do an AI video as of yet because there are so many controls on it.

[Kevin]

True.

[Gavin]

I would like to see the Martin Scorsese uncensored AI that would allow me to get Scarface scenes, which is not there yet. But we should talk about this. We should talk about this because we have been tracking this for a while. There's been this kind of bubbling up amongst Hollywood. And we'll get into more detail in a little bit, but I think this is probably the biggest filmmaker at large who has come out and basically said they're going to use AI in some form. And what was interesting to me is watching Scorsese direct the AI as he would a cameraman. I think this is going to shake a lot of people's, like, kind of belief structures because Scorsese is also seen as one of the, I'd say, top five living filmmakers right now. I don't know when you first saw this, Kevin, what was your first reaction

[Kevin]

out of was, I couldn't believe the estate let them do this. But you just said that he's actually still with.

[Gavin]

Alive. He's. He's still with us making great films. He's making.

[Kevin]

Martin Scorsese is one of my favorite directors of all time. Goodfellas Casino have posters. Had posters in the old CASA. So, like 100%.

[Gavin]

Well, you were poster person. I'm learning something. This is some Kevin lore.

[Kevin]

Not only was I a good fellas poster person, but. But good shout out. Louis Hurtado, good friend back in the day, Photoshopped myself, him and my brother as the three faces on the goodfellas poster. And that was hanging in my house for a while.

[Gavin]

Can we drop that in here? Is there. Is there a visual of that? Do you have that in your file somewhere?

[Kevin]

You know, I might, I might. I. I have the physical poster in storage, but.

[Gavin]

Okay.

[Kevin]

All right, I digress. Big Martin Scorsese fan. And it's. As much as everybody wants to spew vitriol over anybody doing anything with AI I'm sure they won't have a problem attacking Marty the same way they did James Cameron. Even though these are icons, these are legends, right? They really are like, they're. They're still going to. To get all of the Hate.

[Gavin]

Actually, I have a point on this because I think they're not going to get the hate because I think in the same way that when Cameron came out, there wasn't as much hate against what James Cameron said. And I do think I want to be careful about how we talk about this a little bit because what's interesting to me is there's a little bit of a power structure system going on right now. Because we are also going to talk in just a second about a follow up in a story from last week where Jorge Guterres, the creator of that AI series for Prime Video, backed out of his project this week due to the hate he was getting online. And I want to say I think people are not going to crap on Scorsese for this because people love Scorsese. And in some ways, I guess there's this level of if you have done enough in your career, you get to kind of do whatever you want, Right? Which is why like people like Spielberg or Cameron or Scorsese get away with this stuff. I shouldn't say get away with this stuff because I think it's good.

[Kevin]

Let's imagine you're a construction worker, Gavin, and in your little tool belt you got a hammer. What's it made of? Just a random metal wood.

[Gavin]

And if I'm wacky, some sort of very fancy polymer.

[Kevin]

Love it, love it. What about a screwdriver, Gavin? What's that made of?

[Gavin]

Metal polymer and maybe a little bit of human blood.

[Kevin]

And what about an AI tool? Because that's what Martin Scorsese says. You know what that's made of, Gavin? Human labor, Stolen dreams.

[Gavin]

Yes, you're right.

[Kevin]

Still, the only way AI gets to exist is if Martin Scorsese, Shang Tsung's. Some souls out of all of the artists community. And so, yeah, yeah, your soul is mine. The point is, I do think people will forgive Martin Scorsese using it as a tool because he is a legend, he is an icon. Yes. But I don't think he's going to escape that deluge of feedback, right, wrong or otherwise, that the tool you're using only exists because it stole the labor, it stole the creative output of millions of people in its wake.

[Gavin]

Yeah, I think that's right. I mean, I think that there's definitely. I guess we always have to set the table here. We haven't done this for a while,

[Kevin]

so let's do it.

[Gavin]

This is like our disclosures. We understand that all AI was trained on the creative work of the. The human history, right? Lots of artists got swept into these data sets in the very beginning. But we are now at a stage where the tools are allowing people to make things. And we're going to get into some really interesting things that we've seen that are remarkable. And I think the idea that somebody like Martin Scorsese comes in and says, hey, I think these are pretty interesting tools. And this is following up on Steven Spielberg last week saying the same sort of thing, like he doesn't want AI to be a writer, but he's okay with using it as a tool in different ways. Peter Jackson has said this as well. Christopher Nolan even didn't seem like he was that against AI So you're seeing these kind of very high level filmmakers start to have this feeling. But then I do want to talk about Jorge Guterres dropout of this thing because this is a follow up, as we said, to last week's story, where he was getting a remarkable amount of crap. This is a pretty well known animator, the movie the Book of Life. In fact, I realize somebody who's very against AI in the filmmaking community, Guillermo del Toro, was kind of subtweeting to Jorge throughout this process and maybe was a factor in why Jorge dropped out originally. But I don't know, Kev. There's definitely this feeling right now where there's this like, almost like a pressure campaign that feels like it's existing in Hollywood for people not to do this stuff.

[Kevin]

Yeah, it seems like that because there clearly is. And I do think that obviously some change can be made by. Well, I don't want to say by threatening the artists behind the creative works, by threatening boycotts of their output. Certainly we're, we're seeing some of that here. This was definitely more pointed towards Jorge Gutierrez himself. I don't. It's tough because I don't know Jorge's past. In turn, we talked about this a little bit on the episode last time that like he had said some pretty negative things about AI in the beginning.

[Gavin]

Yeah.

[Kevin]

Now he's saying it's like having sex with a machine and they gift you the baby.

[Gavin]

Right.

[Kevin]

Like, yeah. So I don't know how much of a turnaround there was for his particular fan base, but I do agree with his statements that it's becoming harder and harder, if not damn near impossible to get anything made in the traditional systems. Right. Yes. Animation has really taken the brunt of that as well. I do believe that he got excited that he could go from the speed of an idea to the pitch and the acceptance and the green light of

[Gavin]

a series which is cool. Yeah, yeah.

[Kevin]

And it's, and it's easy to bless and anoint and thank the technology for allowing him to get that fast. I do also believe that he was going to work with a bunch of new and seasoned talented artists to make the full fledged, full featured, all singing and dancing series. So on the one hand, like, I felt bad when it, when he withdrew, I kind of thought that was going to happen. But a lot of the damage is already done. The damage. Right. There's some fans that no matter what his next piece of work is, even if he is.

[Gavin]

Yes.

[Kevin]

Yeah. Literally cutting and bleeding on the page for every cell of animation, they are never going to support him again. So on the one hand you upset them and on the other hand you also don't get to make the thing that you were really excited for and provide jobs to at least some degree of animators out there. Right.

[Gavin]

Yeah. I want to give a little bit of context to this particular moment and this weekend is a really interesting thing that just happened in Hollywood if you're not following us that closely. The Backrooms and Obsession are two movies that were made by YouTubers. One is a 20 year old who grew up with Gary's mod and did a bunch of stuff and talks about Portal 2 being his favorite thing. That's Kane. I think his name is Kane Brown, who made the backrooms. The other one is Curry Barker, who's 26 that made Obsession. What is so interesting to me about this moment in the mainstream is everybody's like, I can't believe it. These YouTubers are making films. And by the way, both of these crushed Star wars movie. The Mandalorian and Grogu. What's the name of the little baby?

[Kevin]

Grogu.

[Gavin]

Grogu. See, I don't even know. I'm a Star wars nerd. I don't even know how to say the damn baby Yoda's name. But in the second weekend, Mandalorian and Grogu dropped 69%, which is a massive amount. And Obsession has actually grown over each, over this first three weekends. So all I'm saying here is this moment where people are finally waking up to this kind of like creator world and all these people who were brought up on YouTube, we are seeing the birth of the next generation of that. And you and I have talked about this for a long time. We've done talks about this that like things go in cycles, they flow in cycles. Right. And I think what's so interesting about AI filmmaking right now is it's just getting started and people, I guarantee you, the people who started doing this on YouTube, you know, came around and all these other people probably had massive haters who were like, screw you, you suck, blah, blah, blah. And they just kind of work through it. And I do think it's an important thing to kind of realize that is a part of the process, I guess.

[Kevin]

I don't think our stance has changed much. Right. Sort of like you pick a side and then you wait and see how it goes and obviously reserve the right to change our minds. But I do respect those that say never AI for me don't want it. I don't respect people, obviously, that threaten creators or their families personally. Obviously I can't support that. But it will be harder and harder, I think, to toe that line when we go, well, what exactly is AI really? Is it generative AI or is it that you used a tool that rotoscoped the green screen for you? Because that used to be somebody's job to click and do that? Is it using Gen AI to make your storyboards? But you have to shoot everything practically in camera, like those lines are blurring. Have you updated your sensibilities about that or your opinions on that?

[Gavin]

I think so. I mean, I think always. I'm very cognizant of like making sure that humans can work. But I do want to point out something. The reason I laughed there, Kevin, is because. What did you say happens to the line again? What do you do to the line?

[Kevin]

It blurs.

[Gavin]

No, go back a little further.

[Kevin]

Go.

[Gavin]

You do what? You're on a line, you're kind of close to it and you're walking over it, but you don't exactly. What are you doing?

[Kevin]

Oh, you're one step closer to the edge and you're about to break. You're Lincoln parking.

[Gavin]

No, Kevin, you're crossing the line.

[Kevin]

You're crossing the line.

[Gavin]

You're towing the line. You're towing the line. And the next thing I want to talk about is some of our favorite. Why did you say, what do you do when you're a little barge or

[Kevin]

a little boat in the Delta and you're towing the funny.

[Gavin]

The reason why I wanted to connect

[Kevin]

those two things is because I do

[Gavin]

want to shout out a couple really big interesting filmmakers that are doing the work of AI right now. And the first one is Gossip Goblin, who we've talked about in the show before. But he has a three minute YouTube short or Instagram short that just came out called the Toe Brigade. And you would be not wrong to assume that this has something to do with Toes and what you'd expect, but because it's Gossip Goblin, you see this entire world that he has created. And one of the things I love about this is that Gossip Goblin is kind of working in a slightly more realistic world. But then there's a kind of a big twist in the middle of it. You should just go watch this. It's two and a half minutes of an artist really at work. And to me, this is a cool thing. Another person I do want to shout out is Faru for Ruru. Farou. Farou. Who is the Japanese guy? If you remember, there was a Japanese scope, I think it's who put himself into all these kind of like, I can't wait.

[Kevin]

I can't wait till they're announcing these names after opening envelopes. Goblin.

[Gavin]

Goblin.

[Kevin]

Oscar is 2037. Yes, exactly. Yes.

[Gavin]

So he has a new video out that he said it cost him 10,000 yen, which is not very much money, obviously. I think that's something like, you know, seven bucks or something in Japan. And it's just him in a gorilla. And it's like this very charming thing. There's a little few things in it, but you can tell he made this quickly. But it's a good storytelling. And finally, Kevin, this is a guy that actually made something that we talked about forever ago. If you remember the original kind of Dark Knight AI film that we talked about, the Batman film. Kevin, the kid who has continued to kind of get and better at his craft, has a new thing called Chronicle of Bone. He's sponsored by Magnific. Magnific, you know, bring that sponsor money to us. Just thank you so much in advance. But this is a 20 minute chapter one kind of a show. And I watched the whole thing and it is so good. And this is just what it shows you like the epic storytelling that is possible when you're able to kind of have an unlimited canvas. And you know, what to do with these tools is remarkable.

[Kevin]

Yeah.

[Guest/Caller]

And.

[Kevin]

And listen, 3.3.2 million views in about three weeks, right? We know there. There are pockets of YouTube where AI is celebrated. Then there's our channel.

[Gavin]

We just. We exist in the back rooms. We're in the back. I did back.

[Kevin]

I scrolled down just a little bit and one of the comments is like, I don't even care that this is AI. This is great, right?

[Gavin]

Yes.

[Kevin]

I don't care if this is AI. This is some of the best storytelling I've seen in a while. And that was like something that you and I were pointing to for like a long while. It wouldn't even matter if the models didn't really even improve beyond this. They can make.

[Gavin]

Yes.

[Kevin]

Compelling enough visuals that if you maybe if you're not trying to go ultra photorealistic, if you're stylizing at some point, like now, it's going to become about your craft, your taste. Can you tell a story? Can you. Can you present it in an interesting way? Do you have killer sound design? How's your editing? All of that stuff is going to come into play. And I do think you're going to. I mean, again, there's still going to be the Never Ayers, but I think a percentage of them are going to go, yeah, yeah, that's bad. That it's AI. It's really funny. Oh, that's really good.

[Gavin]

Well, and you pointed out there's very. The memes keep getting better. Right. There's an amazing Sopranos AI video that you shared. You want to play a tiny bit of this just so we get a sense.

[Kevin]

I do. And in between the bleeps, you can hear Tony Soprano working with Chat GPT.

[Gavin]

And it's image of the ducks. Don't you start with the ducks. Image created. Tony, how do you feel now?

[Kevin]

Jesus.

[Gavin]

I asked for a shrink, not the Discovery Channel. Okay. No images. But your reaction to the image is still useful data. Forget it. Let me ask you one thing. Am I a bad person?

[Kevin]

It's him being therapized by Chat GPT. And the voice is great. The performances are performances. Is still weird to say to me when you're talking about the performances are good. It has the, like, the Tony Soprano mannerisms. It just made me giggle.

[Gavin]

It's a good. Yeah. And I will. You know, one of the things that's so interesting about that is that they're obviously taking somebody that exists. He's. He's passed away, but he's a real actor and his real voice and like that for a meme is fun. And it's a very complicated conversation about how people use actors, but still super incredible what they're doing. I want to shout out one last thing before we go on. About a week ago, I watched J. Boogs. Booger. I don't know how you say his name. It's J Boog X Creative. We'll put a link in our show notes who has been doing amazing videos online for a while. Remember, he's also a little spicy sometimes. Like, he did the videos of all the, like, cartoon eggs that were like, you know, cracking. And I'M not even going to go further into that. But yeah, he, he has started to make these animes that I've seen on Instagram, have done really well. And he did a six hour live on YouTube going through his process. And I just want to say when I sat there and watched a lot of it and he has a Patreon, which you can join and he has a lot of very special prompt systems that he's created for Claude and all these different things and different ways to prompt it. And like there are these people that you can learn from out there who are doing this stuff at a very high level and they're sharing their stuff now. You know, you have to pay for his, his Patreon to get access to it. But I like am going to do it. I believe that like he's got developed the skill set and I also believe that's kind of part of the game here is how can you share the stuff that you've learned so that other people can learn and be lifted up from it as well. Which I do think goes back to the YouTube whole world. Like YouTube did this in a really cool way. There were a community around people and that's where these, these filmmakers came from. I think that's happening with AI video as well, which is very cool.

[Kevin]

I love AI and I love community. And when they come together, that's amazing. I just wish there was a way like, because we kind of have our own little mini community. Gavin. We do. You're right, we do. We really do. The few and the proud. The AI for human head.

[Gavin]

But there's no way to get in touch with us at all. There's no way to talk to us. There's no, no way to help.

[Kevin]

No. And there's no way that they can thank us and help us out.

[Gavin]

Right?

[Kevin]

There's nothing they can do. Hold on a second, I'm getting a call. Airbud. Hold on.

[Gavin]

Wait.

[Kevin]

Mom, I'm recording a podcast. Go away. Let me talk to this producer. He's telling me to tell you to like and subscribe. If there is a bell in your area live. Moss baby, click it. Click the gong. Turn on alerts. Hype the video on YouTube. And if you're getting us in the Audio only programs, 5 star reviews help out immensely. Right? Whether that's Apple podcasts or a Spotify or people still Stitch. Do people stitch? I heart rate.

[Gavin]

I don't know what stitch is. So clearly that from my brain. That's fine.

[Kevin]

Anyway, whatever platform you're on, knock the dust off and help us out. Leave a comment To Juice the algo.

[Gavin]

That's right. You can go to our Patreon and give us money that actually helps us pay for the show. All sorts of stuff is really great, but we do appreciate it. All right, Kevin, the other cool thing happened this week is that there's a lot of big open source news, especially coming out of an event that Nvidia had in Taiwan called Computex, which is, I don't know why I said it that way, Computex, but it's a, it is a big show. And there, Kevin, there's some really cool stuff, hardware wise, but also some interesting model stuff that's come out of this too.

[Kevin]

Yeah. So everybody's wondering like, why is Nvidia doing this? And by this we mean like release these open source. I think they're even open weight models. Yes, that open weight models as well. Are they open, Are they open weight too? Yeah, yeah. New leader for US Open Weights Intelligence, Nemotron 3 Ultra, scores a 48 on the artificial Analysis Intelligence Index. It's well ahead of the next strongest US Open weights model, which is Gemma 431B that was recently released by Google. It's still a little bit behind Kimi K2, which is a Chinese led. Now some will say, hey, there's benchmaxing going, going on here, especially with the Chinese models where they don't actually perform as well as they say. Some people also point to US models and say that, but why is Nvidia doing this, Gavin? Why are they releasing for free models that, that perform as well as some of the their supposed partners? Oh, okay, you're doing this.

[Gavin]

This is the rain of cash coming down on Jensen. That's why he's doing this. Because to Jensen Huang, who's the Nvidia CEO, all he wants is this AI world to proliferate across everybody. And one of the best and easiest ways to do that is to make it so that everybody has access to models, so that more people need things, especially locally, to generate stuff. And we're going to talk a little bit about a very famous YouTuber, PewDiePie, who is now working on a very interesting local AI harness. But Kevin, I think one of the cool things about this is that Nvidia is kind of taking up the reins themselves and trying to push open source forward in America because Americans, I don't think they've given up on it. But clearly OpenAI and Anthropic and Google are all pushing forward on closed source right now. And even Meta, who was going to be the leader of this, mostly because I think they believe that they need to make money from it. And Jensen's just like dropping stuff because the money they make is from the shovels that everybody's got to use to get into AI. So I'm very excited about this. I think you had pointed out, and I'm really curious to do this is at some point I want to take a Kimmy K 2.5 or Mini Max M3 just came out as well, which has very good stuff, and try to do the sorts of stuff that I'm doing only locally and just see where we're at. I know you've played around a bench with this. Like, do you feel like we're close enough yet

[Kevin]

for 90% of things if you're not like coding at the very, very edge of the frontier? Like, yeah, we're there. Where we're not there is with the compute, with the actual power needed to run these models in a non super distilled or super nerf way. Or you might be able to run them, but the output is going to be so painfully slow that it could take you five minutes to generate what would take, you know, 45 seconds if you were running at turbo speeds in the cloud. But we will get to Nvidia's answer for that. Surprise, surprise, it's you buying more of their products. Yes. But you did mention PewDiePie, which we should, we should talk about for a second to round this out, because he famously built his own local compute rig for like, I think $20,000 or whatever.

[Gavin]

Yeah.

[Kevin]

Through that process, he was struggling to find an interface that was palatable to him, one that would let him chat, drop files, have it run agentic workflows for him, manage his calendar use, image editing, et cetera, et cetera. And so he was sort of vibe coding solutions for himself all along the way. And he got to the point where he's like, hey, I feel like this is actually powerful. I should productize this. I'm going to go ahead and just release it open source. And so he did. PewDiePie, the YouTuber hath released an open source agentic harness called Odysseus.

[Gavin]

Yes. And I, Kevin, it's so funny you talk about him because I see a lot of parallels between you and PewDiePie and I know not financially and I'm sorry about that. We can put that in your back

[Kevin]

pocket for what that means for you.

[Gavin]

But you guys both started very early making stuff and you've both kind of folded into this interesting world where you're technically interested in advance, but PewDiePie, I think, like you, was not brought up a pure coder. But what's interesting about this is just watching him dive into this and like, what's cool is like, whether or not people use this, by the way, A lot of people seem like they're liking it. They're like 10,000 GitHub stars. GitHub stars on this particular thing. But it is just cool to see somebody in the world who has this big of an audience really dive into open source AI and want to make something interesting for other people to use. So I do think that alone is really cool.

[Kevin]

Yeah. And a special shout out to the Cookbook portion of the software, which is a major pain point. This is hardware aware model recommendations. If you get into open source, you try to on your computer, you will go down the worst rabbit hole ever. Trying to figure out with my particular hardware, this MacBook with this much RAM or this graphics card running with this cpu, what's the best that I can run? Well, the best isn't always so cut and dry. And what's the best that you could. What's. What's the best that you can run? Or what's the best that you can run? Well, you should run. Those are often. Yeah, and there's so many different answers for that. So Cookbook looks to solve that by analyzing your hardware and recommending a model based off that. So, yes, you know, it's not a competition with the bank accounts and the commas and the zeros. And I hope Beauty's happy with whatever it is he has and he shouldn't compare it to me. Yes, no green screen here. That's a real window, baby.

[Gavin]

It's a real window.

[Kevin]

It looks right into another neighbor's window right across the way. So again, the point is, I'm happy for him. I'm glad he released it. And here's the bottleneck for so many people. It's the hardware that you're running right now in your homes. And that's why so many think that local AI isn't here. Because it's again, way too slow. Takes forever. You can't actually run them. You don't have graphics cards. Yeah, turns out I don't. Well, Nvidia has been trying to change that for a long while. They've been releasing small dedicated workstations. But I think like the age of consumer era or in your home on premises, AI is really starting to get here. And Nvidia announced their RTX Spark series. Basically, the system on A chip era where it's unifying all of the things, all of the memory, special processors that are particularly good with agentic workflows or with these, you know, crunching these LLMs. Now they're coming to laptops which look like MacBook in size but have enough power to run really, really massive open source models like the ones that Nvidia just released this week, it turns out.

[Gavin]

Yeah, I think it's so interesting to me that, I mean, one thing that's tricky about this is you're going to have to have like some new drivers and all sorts of things like that built for these machines because they're doing something differently, they're unifying it all in one place. And these are particularly for ARM computers right now. And it'll be a kind of a question of like who will develop for them. But the interesting thing right now about open source software in general is hey, you can eventually build a driver yourself or you tell the AI to build a driver for you, or different ways that you can get the AI to do the connective tissue. And I think that's a really interesting thing. Where the silicon meets the AI and they can kind of work together is fascinating to me at large.

[Kevin]

Yeah. So coming this fall, you will be able to from multiple providers, but they're really touting the Microsoft relationship right now. You'll be able to buy these new laptops with this new Spark hardware built into it and you'll be able to run, you know, agentic workflows locally on your computer. This is going to become massively important when you're worried about your privacy or you're worried about your bloated billing costs as these foundational providers start charging more and more. You'll just have an agent running on your machine that you can probably talk to, that you can show images to, that you can access with your phone as well while you're remote. And it will do all the compute for you. You will have your Jarvis in your pocket.

[Gavin]

So here's the thing I want to jump into talking about OpenAI's slash goal tool. So this is within Codex. This is something that you, you type in slash goal and it gives a goal to your prompt, which means that it's going to try to hit a specific goal for what you can do. There's been versions of this in cloud code. Obviously this is kind of a based on the old Ralph Wiggum loop which we talked a while back again. But this is basically telling your AI, don't come back until you finish something amazing. If you remember on this show, if you're a long time listener, you remember I made a bear jump game like about a year ago in Google, Gemini's AI studio. It was very simple. You type a space bar and you try to hit a percentage of bear jump. I have now made a new version of this bear jump where I only jumped in maybe five to seven times over 42 hours. Kevin and I just said very something very simple. I said make this game better. Make it something that you could lose a couple hours in. Use your image gen tool to create different stuff and in 42 hours it's not like, I wouldn't say this is like ready to go but like this is a much more robust version of the game. If you're looking at it on the screen here or maybe Kevin, you can kind of describe what you're seeing specifically that differentiates it from the last one.

[Kevin]

Well, I mean I'm clicking and holding and it's giving me a trajectory for where my bear can jump. And it is, there's like a little power bar like an old Mortal Kombat break the board minigame and you want to try to release at the right time so that bear will jump, grab coins, grab little power ups, land on the, the safe landing pad and then you get rewarded with some honey and some tokens and you can buy some little upgrades. So I'm going to actually crush this high score.

[Gavin]

Yeah. So what's interesting here is my old game was very simple but if you look, there's animations baked into this. There are level up graphics, there are things that are all built. I didn't do any of that. I let Codex do all that. I said to Codex, I steered it a couple times but when you steering means you just kind of put a line or two in there and you hit, you know, keep going. I think what's so interesting about this, I'm not saying this is good but I will put it up a link in our show notes. It's on Vercel right now. I'm not going to like publish it. I might put it out later when I've done some more work on it. But what's so cool about this is like with this goal tool you can go and give an a long term thing and just let your computer run and just let it kind of work on this stuff. I will say so. 42 hours of working on this took about 15% of my ChatGPT Pro account for the week. So that's a fair amount of stuff. But isn't that bad, right. Considering, like, how much stuff is there. I didn't spin up a lot in parallel, but I don't know if you've had experience with goal, but, like, I do think this is, like, one of those moments where we are really getting closer to agentic AI working for you and what you do. I see you're zoned in right there. Are you locked in on. I don't locked in on it.

[Kevin]

I'm going to have to just fully agree with what you said, Gavin, because I just. At the very end when it was very clear that, like, oh, I need to, like, jump in and have an opinion, I literally jumped and my bear missed the platform. And so, yes, my. My fever combo hath broken and now I'm crestfallen.

[Gavin]

So go try this.

[Kevin]

I agree with you.

[Gavin]

And, yeah, go try this and. And have some fun with it. Again, this is just another experiment that you can do with AI today. Like, literally, this was not that hard. You can go and use the goal tool. Go play with it and we will see you all on Friday.

[Kevin]

Bye.

[Gavin]

Bye.

[Kevin]

Bye.

[Gavin]

Bye.

[Kevin]

Bye.

[Gavin]

Bye. This is my new thing. At the end of the show, I'm just going to say bye. Weirdest way possible.

[Kevin]

I can't wait to see the retention graph. Bye.