Encounters with Non-Human Intelligence

Summary

Alien UFO Podcast Episode: Encounters with Non-Human Intelligence Host: Simon Bown | Guest: Mary Rodwell Release Date: June 26, 2026

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Overview

In this episode, Simon Bown interviews Mary Rodwell, a leading researcher in the field of UFO encounters and the contact phenomenon, about her book "The New Human: Awakening to Our Cosmic Heritage." The discussion covers Mary's unique journey from nurse and counselor to experiencer researcher, the transformative nature of alien contact, the hybridization phenomenon, and the emerging new generation of "star" or "indigo" children. The episode explores the multi-dimensional, consciousness-expanding aspects of contact, the psychological and societal challenges experiencers face, and the growing body of evidence for a global, intergenerational phenomenon.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

Mary Rodwell’s Background and Path to UFO Research

[04:37 - 11:31]

• Mary began her career as a nurse and midwife before moving into counseling, focusing on prevention and emotional well-being rather than cure.
• Her work with the dying and experiences in hospice made her confront profound spiritual questions about life after death.
• Spiritual exploration: Developed skills in hypnosis, clinical hypnotherapy, and past life regression, inspired by the works of Dr. Michael Newton and Dolores Cannon.
• Progression from skepticism to curiosity about UFOs after reading "Abduction" by Dr. John Mack and "Communion" by Whitley Strieber, leading to direct encounters with experiencers.
• Quote:

  “So in a way, you know, Dolores [Cannon] was certainly a pioneer in terms of opening up to all of this. And I think many of us...developed our own approaches.” (Mary Rodwell, 10:26)

The First Contact Case and Creating Support Networks

[13:20 - 20:19]

• Her first experiencer case (Ellis Taylor) challenged her professional training and revealed a lack of support structures for such phenomena.
• Presentation of the case study led to other professionals sharing their own anomalous experiences, highlighting the hidden prevalence of such events.
• Mary co-founded the Australian Close Encounters Resource Network (ACERN) and the first abduction support group in Perth.
• Quote:

  “So that was when I went on my own mission and... I decided to create an organization to support [experiencers] professionally.” (Mary Rodwell, 19:00)

Prevalence and Signs of Contact

[23:43 - 25:44]

• It's difficult to estimate percentages, but contact is likely far more widespread than commonly believed. Some people are unaware of their contact until later in life, often triggered by a sighting or other anomaly.
• Signs can include sudden fascinations, phobias of clowns or owls (screen memories), and unexplained physical effects.
• Quote:

  “...if someone's got a fear of clowns or, you know, or Santa Claus or sometimes skeletons or owls outside the window, that it is quite possible that's an indicator they've had some form of contact, but not understood it...” (Mary Rodwell, 25:28)

The Transformative Nature of Experience

[26:06 - 30:04]

• Initial abduction experiences are often perceived as frightening, but with acceptance, the relationship with ETs usually evolves. Many experiencers view their encounters positively in retrospect.
• Surveys (The FREE Foundation’s study of 4,200+ experiencers) reveal 85% undergo "psycho-spiritual transformation," with many reporting healing and upgrades in abilities.
• 50% noted healing procedures during contact; 75% of encounters were out-of-body and not physical.
• Quote:

  “Once people got over the fear... 85% had a psycho-spiritual transformation. It's almost like it's a modern day shamanic wake up call.” (Mary Rodwell, 27:09)

Contact, Consciousness, and After-Effects

[30:04 - 33:55]

• Parallels between the after-effects of ET contact and Near Death Experiences include heightened psychic abilities, synchronicities, and electrical interference.
• Contact is fundamentally a consciousness phenomenon, not merely physical. Opening to other realms can result from many triggers: NDEs, out-of-body experiences, spiritual practices, or contact itself.
• Interpretation of these realms is influenced by personal belief systems.
• Quote:

  “What it really does when you get activated in that way, whether or not it's through a shamanic experience...you’re opening your consciousness to the realm...which includes all of what I'm mentioning.” (Mary Rodwell, 32:11)

The Dual Life of Experiencers and Societal Stigma

[33:55 - 39:29]

• Experiencers often feel they lead two lives: a conventional ("3D") existence and a secret, multidimensional one.
• Conventional psychology/psychiatry pathologizes non-physical experiences due to materialist bias.
• Indigenous cultures accept multidimensional realities naturally.
• Quote:

  “This is what happens to anyone who has contact, is they realize they're leading two [lives]...One is the 3D life...And yet they have another life where they are communicating with many different intelligences.” (Mary Rodwell, 34:16)

The Nature of Contact: Reincarnation, Star Origins, and Soul Families

[39:29 - 44:28]

• Regression sessions reveal that experiencers often recognize familiar ETs from multiple encounters across lifetimes—and sometimes as part of their own "soul family."
• Many report previous existences as non-human intelligences, such as Pleiadians or Arcturians, with conscious incarnations on Earth for a specific mission.
• Examples from children with clear memories of other planetary or crystalline existences.
• Quote:

  “Many of my clients will say, you know, I feel connected to the Pleiadians or the Arcturians or Orion. And that usually means they got that extra DNA that’s awakened in them that belongs to those particular species...” (Mary Rodwell, 41:30)

The Hybrid Phenomenon and Genetic Programs

[50:04 - 60:32]

• Many women report "missing" pregnancies later associated with encounters with hybrid children on board craft; men are involved as well.
• Hybrids receive human emotional nurturing, and the genetic mixing extends across multiple galaxies.
• Some hybrids remain on craft or settle on other worlds; some resemble their ET parentage, others are nearly indistinguishable from humans.
• Memorable moment:
  Mary recounts a Brazilian woman’s encounter with a part-feline, part-human hybrid child, and realizing it was her own hybrid daughter. Later, her human daughter was seen playing with this hybrid on the craft. (57:00)

Star Children, Indigos, and Human Evolution

[60:43 - 65:35]

• Contemporary children labeled as Indigo, Crystal, or Rainbow are often the next step in human evolution, more multidimensional and less easily programmed into consensus reality.
• Diagnoses like ADHD, Asperger’s, and certain forms of autism often reflect differences in consciousness, not dysfunction, making it harder to force these children into old paradigms.
• Their purpose, Mary suggests, is to maintain awareness of the fuller multidimensional reality.
• Quote:

  “They're wired differently because they can't be so easily programmed into an inaccurate 3D consensus reality...always dialed into higher dimensions because that's exactly how these children are operating.” (Mary Rodwell, 63:50)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Transformation:
  “Once people got over the fear...85% had a psycho-spiritual transformation. It's almost like it's a modern day shamanic wake up call.” (Mary Rodwell, 27:09)

• On Societal Stigma:
  “We live in a reality that doesn't honor the fact that we're multi dimensional...and this is why we have people who end up in hospitals medicated, because our psychology...sees anyone who has experiences out of the physical senses as fantasizing.” (Mary Rodwell, 34:20)

• On Hybrid Children:
  “Many of them will have what they think is a pregnancy, lasts couple of months...and then they're not pregnant. But they may be taken up to see these hybrid children.” (Mary Rodwell, 50:18)

• On Star Children:
  “Always dialed into higher dimensions because that's exactly how these children are operating.” (Mary Rodwell, 63:58; quoting Neil Gold)

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• [04:37] – Mary’s personal and professional background; entry into paranormal and ET research
• [13:20] – First direct case of contact; opening support networks
• [23:43] – How prevalent is contact? Signs and screening memories
• [26:06] – Transformation after contact; research findings and the shamanic journey
• [30:04] – Contact as consciousness; parallels with NDEs and spiritual awakening
• [33:55] – Living dual lives as experiencers; societal stigma and the multidimensional model
• [39:29] – Regression findings; reincarnation and star family origins
• [44:28] – Hypnosis as a tool for contactees to understand their experiences
• [50:04] – Hybridization phenomenon; experiences with hybrid children
• [60:43] – Star/Indigo/Crystal children; new generations and labels like ADHD
• [63:58] – “Always dialed into higher dimensions”—the true meaning of ADHD

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Closing & Additional Resources

[65:35 - End]

• Mary is not currently writing a new book but is focused on sharing the data through interviews.
• Her message: People are not crazy, but part of something extraordinary on this planet.
• Listeners can find Mary Rodwell’s books via Nexus magazine (UK) and her website.
• Simon Bown’s book "Aspects of Alien Abduction" is also available on Amazon.

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This summary captures the depth, nuance, and transformative potential of Mary Rodwell’s research and the experiential reality of contact with non-human intelligence as discussed in this episode.

Transcript

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[Simon Bown]

This is an Alien UFO Podcast Classic episode and I'm your host Simon Bown. There are a number of UFO episodes that I released on the podcast a few years ago that are full of great information and I thought it would be a good idea to share them for listeners who may have missed them the first time around. This week I'm talking to Mary Rodwell about her book. It's called the New Awakening to Our Cosmic Heritage. Mary is one of Australia's leading researchers and writers in the UFO and contact phenomenon areas. She is the founder and principal of Australian Close Encounters Resource Network. Mary is also Director and Chair of the Experiencer support programs at Dr. Edgar Mitchell foundation for Research into Extraterrestrial Encounters. Hi Mary, thanks a lot for coming onto the podcast.

[Mary Rodwell]

It's an absolute pleasure. Simon, I wanted to talk to you

[Simon Bown]

because got a reputation for doing this amazing research and you've got your great books out and one of the books I wanted to talk to you about is the New Human Awakening to Our Cosmic Heritage. But for our listeners who don't know about you, could you tell us about your background?

[Mary Rodwell]

Well, a precis of my background would be that I was a nurse and a midwife registered in the UK and after I had my children I then was invited to learn counseling and work. Did a medical practice actually in Norfolk for about four years, five years before we migrated to Australia and I lived in Perth for nearly 20 years where I continued with counseling rather than go back into nursing because I was looking at prevention rather than cure. And a lot of as you know Simon, emotional and psychological issues are often the precursor to being unwell and getting various illnesses. So I liked the idea of prevention rather than cure. I did grief and bereavement for a couple of years looking at those also that were dying in hospice. So really faced with a lot of huge emotional trauma on one level or another through my counseling experience. And I also continued with working at another counseling agency. So counseling was my baseline ultimately. But in the process of that, I was doing a lot of self exploration into a whole range of what I call spiritual aspects to our lives. Because after working with people who were dying, one of the questions was, you know, do you believe in life after death? And do you think that there's, you know, the reality of spirit? All these kinds of things came up as a counselor and they're asking what I thought about it. And although I had a very, what I would call religious upbringing in the sense that, you know, I was a Catholic, mass on a Sunday, all of that, I felt that I was questioning many things in the dogma of the particular, you know, Christian religion. And I was looking at reincarnation because it was interesting to read stories about reincarnation and how valid it seemed to be for some people. And from that, and to cut a long story short, I started to. I was asked to develop some of my own awareness and abilities. One of them was learning how to do hypnosis and do as you do. I know, Simon, with past life regressions. I did clinical hypnotherapy, although I wasn't taught how to do past life. It was the standard, you know, kinds of issues that you, you know, that I, I learned. But I developed the past life side of it myself by looking into things like Dr. Michael Newton and his between life hypnotherapy, where he wrote about, you know, people having recall of between lives. And that fascinated me with them coming up with soul journeys, you know, the monads, which is, you know, the soul families and this kind of thing. So I developed a fascination of that for that, but particularly about past lives, which seemed sometimes very relevant to present day experiences in their lives where they may have a phobia, for example, of something that wasn't necessarily a present from a present, present life. This life was from another lifetime. And going into what actually happened and helping them to remove that imprint that so that they no longer had a phobia. And that was very satisfying. But in between all of that, I was also developing my own awareness, my own abilities, learning how to use work with energy work, doing healing energy work, tapping into what I call my team. I spent three years training to do that. So that what that did was allow me to understand how people open up to their multidimensional awareness, how they start to work or understand their abilities, like seeing energy fields or seeing orbs of light or spirits or non human intelligences, for example. So I got to understand how that activates these abilities and this awareness in many people. And it can be very confronting. But, you know, what do you do when you start to see more than the average? Do you. You know, many people think they're going crazy or if they're very religious, they think it's something to do with, you know, demons or whatever. Or if they do tap into that the demons are going to get them. This kind of thing fear that many people have over opening up multidimensionally. But people who have encounters with non human intelligences, one of the things that's activated is that awareness, that multidimensional awareness we call clairvoyance, clairaudience, clairsentience, you know, because they start to have communication, downloads of information, this kind of thing. So my own training allowed me to understand more of how that all worked because I was opening up to that myself. And that enabled me to work in a particular way with path, you know, with all regressions. And I got to know Dolores Cannon and I know that you, you know, you've had experience with those that have learned her methods. Yeah, and Dolores was a friend of mine. She came and spoke in my groups a few times. We spoke at similar conferences. She was very broad in her approach, as you know, from all her books. My work was primarily to do with people who'd had experiences, but also, you know, occasionally would go into again, the past lives and whatever. So, you know, although I had a particular specialty, for want of a better word, in terms of people who have contact with non human intelligences, whatever name they want to give that I also, you know, have worked with people on a whole range of other things, from past lives, et cetera, to other lives on other planets, et cetera, et cetera. And that just sort of continues to open out as, as I work. So in a way, you know, Dolores was certainly a pioneer in terms of opening up to all of this. And I think many of us, and she has many people working with her method. I develop my own, which is slightly different, and I can always talk about that if you want, Simon. But that's an overview of what's really taken me to three and a half thousand people who've had experiences globally that I've worked with. And I've also become involved in a lot of research to do with this experience.

[Simon Bown]

And so if we could go back Just a bit. I wanted to ask you about working in a hospice because I've interviewed people who researched deathbed visions and shared death experiences. Did you see anything like that?

[Mary Rodwell]

I wasn't exposed to any of that. I was exposed to the fact that people that were in severe grief often had strange things happen, strange anomalies happen, where they felt their loved one was around them or guiding them in some way. And there were lots of occasions where there were strange things happened that they couldn't explain about still having contact with those that had passed on that they were very close to. And that's been quite fascinating. But they didn't ever talk about visions as such. Although that calls to mind an interesting story because, you know, I'm obviously in Australia and there was a wonderful lady, an Aboriginal lady, that was talking about hitting a kangaroo. And that can happen very much going along at dusk. Sometimes the kangaroos will rush across the road and you sometimes can't avoid hitting them occasionally. And that happens. And this woman described that as she got out the car because she'd accidentally hit a kangaroo. She actually saw its spirit leaving, which was quite interesting that she was seeing that with that animal.

[Simon Bown]

Is there a point in your life where you kind of went from not knowing about this stuff and not believing it to bridging that gap to believing it. Was it a shock? Was there one instant that made you sit back and think, hang on a second, this might actually be real?

[Mary Rodwell]

A good question, Simon. It's actually a process, isn't it? I mean, I've always been open to the non physical realm from my religious upbringing, even though I don't believe a lot of what is said when we pass on anymore, because my research disqualifies some of that, if you like. But what happened was that I've been an avid reader and even when I was bringing up the kids, if I could grab five minutes to look at an interesting book, whether it was on the paranormal, supernormal, supernature, all these kinds of things have always fascinated me. So I've been exploring for. Right from I remember a small child being interested in anything unusual, strange. It's been part of the life journey anyway. But I was a bit conflicted when I came into reincarnation because in Catholicism there's no such thing. You know, when you die, you die. You either go to heaven or hell or whatever. So when I started to read about reincarnation and very valid stories about people that had past life memories and were able to qualify those experiences by going to those places and all the things that they remember in their regression, they were actually being able to verify. I became very, very intrigued and it made so much more sense to me than saying, once you're dead, you're dead. And that was a pivotal one, was reading and of course, you know, reading about spirits, reading about these intuitives, you know, calling psychics or whatever that were able to see spirits. I never dismissed anything to do with that. My mom, although she was a Catholic, was also very open to spiritualism and went to psychics and mediums and clairvoyants and healers. So I was exposed that she's very open minded, Catholic, let's put it like that. And so I never doubted there was a reality to it. I think the thing with the ET stuff was different because I had never really come across that until I coincidentally, which will make everyone laugh or synchronously. I'm getting involved in all the reincarnation stuff and hypnosis, taking people into past lives. I get two books that I pick up that look interesting and one of them is abduction by Dr. John Mack, professor of psychiatry at Harvard University, writing the book Abduction Human Encounters with Aliens. And the other book I picked up at the same time was Communion by Whitley Strieber, which is the classic book of his experiences with these beings. And I happen to have read those. Really within weeks of that, a gentleman walked through the door and said, I've heard you're open minded for this. There's no support groups for this. People just think they're crazy. And proceeded to say that he woke up with marks on his body, shaved areas. He's having experiences with these non human beings, extraterrestrials as he called them. And also his family were having experiences as well. So he was having physical marks and it was a family affair. And he said, and the relatives wouldn't come to the house because they were terrified. It was demons. And that was my first exposure to, to the reality from the academic side, which was reading those books, thinking, oh, this is fascinating. Never in my wildest dreams thinking that I would have someone walk through the door and tell me that that was their experience. And his name's Ellis Taylor. He actually lives in the uk. He's written about four books now. He's an excellent numerologist as well, and he's a dear friend, so. But what I can say is History Story was compelling because he was articulate. He wasn't over dramatizing it. It was affecting the whole family. And he wanted my support if I could help, particularly with his partner and I took his case, believe it or not. I was doing advanced counseling at the time at the Wasley Institute. And I decided to really challenge the supervision and taking a case that is so bizarre as this one obviously would have been seen as. And I put down all the hypotheses. Is he fantasizing? Is it, you know, or is it, you know, some hallucination, or is it actually a reality? And what was fascinating, Simon, and I know you'll understand this, given your own background, was that in the group, there were social workers, there was a uniting minister, there was a whole range of professionals doing advanced counseling. And as I presented the case, waiting for them perhaps to say that Ellis was crazy or something, what was fascinating was it opened the door for them to start telling, sharing about their own strange experiences. Like one was in a haunted house and was seeing spirits and another one explained some of the weird things they'd experienced. So what it had done by me presenting Ellis's story was open them up to telling some of their own paranormal experiences, which was bizarre in a way. It wasn't what I expected. And the uniting minister was the only one who never said anything as a comment to this case study. But what it did do was show me two things. One, that lots of people can be having unusual multidimensional experiences. But not only that, there was no real way of supporting those with these experiences because there was no offer of strategies or anything like that to help me help, help Ellis and his family. So that was when I went on my own mission and I looked to America and also the. I'm just trying to think of what it was called. It was peer. Dr. Mac's organization was called peer. And I got in touch there. There was another organization at the time, and they were able to. They were actually looking into this and offering support. And to cut a long story short, what I did then was I decided to create an organization to support them professionally. And that was when I created ascern. And initially I'd connected also with a social worker that had experiences as well. And we started the first abduction support group in Perth. And we had 12 people turn up, which was amazing, considering we thought this was very rare. But of course it isn't rare. And it is global. And there are not just thousands, not just millions, perhaps even billions of people that are having some form of contact.

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[Mary Rodwell]

and

[Simon Bown]

do you feel it's. I don't know. If you talk about percentages, then would you say it's 30% of people might be doing it? 50%?

[Mary Rodwell]

Well, it's hard to know. All I can say is when people, and some people don't even know that they are for them, it may be that there'll be something that happens that activates that memory. And they may be in their 30s or 40s when that happens, where they have this activation or awakening. And it might be because they've just seen a UFO for the first time and that seems to activate memory within them. After seeing the ufo, what is interesting with those that have sightings often when they will ring me and say, I've just seen this strange craft and it was there for so many minutes and it was really weird and it was certainly not a conventional aircraft, one of the questions I asked them is, did you feel different afterwards? Because what they may not be aware of, there's sometimes a pickup or a download when you see a craft and they will suddenly say, yeah, and I got really fascinated with astronomy or I got really fascinated with ancient history and, you know, our origins and whatever afterwards. And this is often a really good indicator that something more happened after that sighting. But many people don't know. They may have a phobia of clowns, Santa Claus or owls with big eyes or whatever. And these are indicative of a screen memory of the grays, for example. You know, they will present as an image that is familiar, such as a clown or Santa Claus, but the person seems to know it isn't what they're seeing, that it's something else. And then it generates a lot of fear. So if someone's got a fear of clowns or, you know, or Santa Claus or sometimes skeletons or owls outside the window, that it is quite possible that that's an indicator they've had some form of Contact, but not understood it because it's a screen for these beings.

[Simon Bown]

And when you hear about people being abducted from their beds and cars and things and it sounds like a terrifying experience. But then it seems like as life goes on and they get more and more contact with the ETs it changes to a different type of relationship. Do people say actually at the end of the day I'm glad it's happened.

[Mary Rodwell]

It's absolutely Simon and you've obviously done some homework there. What I've discovered and why I wrote the book Awakening how it transforms your life is because it often does. And we had surveys that we did not only from my own research, but the research that came from the Dr. Edgar Mitchell Free foundation, which is in fact co founded by myself. Ray Hernandez is a lawyer who has experiences. Dr. Edgar Mitchell and Dr. Rudy Shield. And from that first survey with 4200 or 300 individuals, 600 questions of conscious memory. It's all in the book Beyond UFOs. This survey demonstrated that once people got over the fear of the unknown and started to accept and integrate their experiences, what we discovered was 85% had a psycho spiritual transformation. And they will say that I wouldn't have changed anything. It's almost like it's a modern day shamanic wake up call. And I say it that way because it's very similar to the shamanic process where if you want to be a shaman, you have to transcend your human fears so that you can operate in a multi dimensional reality. And in a way this is exactly the same thing. Transcending those fears of the unknown. Why me? Is it real? Am I going crazy? All the kinds of things that people experience when they've had this experience, but then as they get to understand more, that shifts into a different kind of relationship with these intelligences. And what I found with my regressions particularly, they can be life changing in the sense what someone has believed has happened may not have happened at all. And they may see themselves having an experience where they're shown or they can understand that the procedure that's being done can often be a healing procedure. In fact we found 50% of that 4,000 people had healing procedures on board craft that they, you know, that they hadn't realized was the reason for their that particular experience or whatever. So there is genetic material taken, but there's also healing procedures. There's often an upgrade in terms of intelligence and what have you as well. And of course many of them, particularly the children and I write about that in the human, these children talk about what they learn on the craft. And there are certain data and knowledge that these children are given through their lessons on board craft. And the other thing people need to know is not all of that is physical. In fact, what we discovered, and this is again why the nuts and bolts in ufology struggle with this one, because it isn't as tangible, is that we've discovered that out of the 4,000 odd that had experiences, 75% of their encounters were out of body and not physical. So then it seemed like a dream. And they'll say, you know, I had a dream where I was on a spacecraft and whatever and it was really weird and what have you. And I chuckle because I often say to them, well, when you know, how long have you remembered that dream, dream? And they'll say, oh, I've remembered it about 10 years. And I just chuckle because most dreams you forget within seconds or minutes of having them. If you've got some a dream like that and it stayed with you 10 years, it's most likely not a dream, it's just that you are remembering it as a dream because you'll have been in either a trance state or out of body.

[Simon Bown]

One of the sort of things that I find fascinating is that with a near death experience they call it a spiritually transformative experience. And you're kind of saying that that's what happens with alien abduction, it transforms you like that. But also with near death experiences they have those after effects where they have psychic flashes, amazing synchronicities, they can't wear watches because they just won't work. Do you see that with people who experience contact with ETs?

[Mary Rodwell]

Well, the interesting thing Simon, is what we're discovering is that it's about consciousness. And for some people their wake up call will be after a near death experience because what happens is that that seems to activate some higher awareness within them, their consciousness, so that then they're not only aware of the greater picture of reality and their journey as a soul, but also then they start to be able to access not only more of the non physical realm, which will include spirits, angelic beings, elementals, maybe all sorts of different intelligence, including non human intelligences. So some people, that's their wake up call through a near death experience, or those that start to learn to astral travel or have out of body experiences or start to remote learn, Remote viewing for example, will activate that awareness and they start to see more in those realms, including not just what we see as the spiritual realm, or many spiritualists will see the spiritual realm only Being ascended masters, angels, Jesus and Mary or spirits or whatever. And it comes as a shock that in that particular frequency and realm are all sorts of other beings, from energy beings to light beings, to cat like beings, to mantis and grays and other humanoids and tall whites and on it goes. So what it really does when you get activated in that way, whether or not it's through a shamanic experience or, you know, magic mushrooms or ayahuasca, or if it's to do with near death experiences, or you start to open up to channel, for example, what you're doing is opening your consciousness to the realm of this, this whole realm of intelligence, which includes all of what I'm mentioning. And it's not separate. You can't separate out. For some people, they may see angels, but someone else will interpret that as a light being or an energy being or whatever. You know, it really is just on, in terms of their perception of their reality and what their belief system is, is how they will interpret it. I mean, some people will connect to their spirit guides. And what can be shocking for them is that it's not the North American Indian or the Tibetan monk, but it's actually a mantis being or it might be a blue being with big black eyes and that will be their spirit guide. And it can be a bit of a shock to the system when they connect to that because what it's doing is showing us the vast diversity of intelligences in different forms we connect to once we open up to that multidimensional side of ourselves. And we're not just talking about physical now in terms of, you know, seeing physical beings. We're talking about interdimensional ones, extra dimensional ones, trans dimensional ones, even some coming from what we would call the future. So you've got all of this in the matrix of our greater reality. And this is where it takes you. You really were saying it's consciousness, it's. And consciousness is primary to this.

[Simon Bown]

And it's, it sounds like there's so much to it and it's so complicated and it's so bizarre and you know so much about this. And then you might walk down the street and pass people who know nothing about it. It's almost like you live on a different planet to them. Do you feel that, you know, you're separated from the average person?

[Mary Rodwell]

Well, this is what happens to anyone who has contact, is they realize they're leading two different, you know, two lives. One is the 3D life, which is acceptable and consensus reality. And yet they have another life where they are communicating with many different intelligences on that other level. And they can, you know, and that's the hard thing, Simon, because we live in a reality that doesn't honor the fact that we're multi dimensional. We have a model of psychology that only allows us to translate our reality from physical senses. And this is why we have people who end up in hospitals medicated, because our psychological psychology and the psychiatry is anyone who has experiences out of the physical senses is fantasizing or is schizophrenic or whatever, when in fact many of them are just opening up to more of their multidimensional reality. And the reason it's important that we do is because we're more than our physical body. We are, as you know, we are a consciousness that is inhabiting a physical container, but is unlimited by it, by the fact that we can go out of body, we can remote view other life forms, or we can communicate with these intelligences. All of this is a natural ability that indigenous tribes right across the globe do not naturally without any problem at all. But we've, you know, grown up with a mechanistic way of looking at a life, a Cartesian way of saying that the only things that are real are the ones that we can touch, feel, see or hear. When in fact many people realize that they have senses beyond that, but may be afraid of it simply because they're afraid if they do, somehow they're going to go crazy, or somehow people are going to think they're crazy and what have you. And this is why many people don't talk about it. And so you've got this dual reality, the one that's acceptable and the one that's not acceptable. And it's only in recent years it's becoming more acceptable to say, well, you're a bit psychic or you're a medium or, you know, you channel or whatever. It's in recent years, people say, oh, well, you know, they have a communication, but it's still not really taken seriously in mainstream. Because one of the first things you'll get asked certainly if it's a psychiatrist, is, do you hear voices? Well, actually I communicate with them. So are you crazy? No, of course you're not crazy. All you're doing is tapping into that other frequency that these intelligences work from and it allows you. And I mean, when I was doing counseling at the medical practice in England, there were a number of people going through grief issues. And one, I always remember one gentleman saying to me that his father, who died and passed on, talks to him. And I asked him, I said, is it helpful, you know, that your dad talks to you? And he says yes, he says he guides me and he helps me understand things and whatever. And I, I thought to myself, well, why not? If that's useful to this gentleman and it was helping him live his life and make sense of things, what's wrong with that? You know, I mean, for me, the only time it's a problem is because people get scared. Because if it's new to their awareness, they can be scared that maybe in some way that they are going to lose the plot or perhaps go crazy or whatever. Not if they're supported, not if they understand what it is and what's going on. It's just that that's society's way of saying you're out of the box. And that's not okay. Certainly not in this consensus reality at the moment. And that Simon has to change when

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[Simon Bown]

so have you ever come across, I don't know, done a regression with somebody to an abduction and the ETs have specifically talked about reincarnation.

[Mary Rodwell]

Well, not in in quite that way. Although let me put it like this. When I've regressed various people to an experience where they may be on a craft, they may what they can do. And this may. I don't know what your listeners are going to make of this, but anyway, one of the things that you can do is when someone's in a altered state and they're realizing that they are seeing a number of different beings, they might be, you know, the little grays, they might be tall grays, they might be light being, they might be a humanoid, they might be a mantis or whatever. One of the things that first of all I will say to them is, does any of these looks familiar to you? Any of these beings look familiar. And nine times out of ten they'll say, yes, that being is. And it might be a humanoid or it might be even a gray or whatever. And what I say to them is ask that being how many times they've picked you up. Because if they're familiar, it means they've seen them before. And the person in the regression will often say, oh, 2, 5, 7, 8 or whatever. They'll reel off the times that they get from this intelligence or whatever. And what they also discover is sometimes some of them have had an insert of ETDNA along with both their parents, and that's part of the reason that they are involved in being examined and a part of the program. So they will find that they have a connection to a particular species. And many of my clients will say, you know, I feel connected to the Pleiadians or the Arcturians or Orion. And that usually means they got that, that extra DNA that's awakened in them that belongs to those particular species or star beings, as you know, many call them or whatever. And what they discover is that in a previous existence they may very well have been one of those. That's that particular species, if you like, or come from that particular origin. Many of my, the children that I write about in the New Human have talked about coming from other dimensions. 110 year old explaining he came through a portal in the sun from another dimension. Another 10 year old explained that he was a blue being in another life, but had incarnated for the first time in human form. And because he was connecting, he was bringing his skills to deal with the pollution on this planet. Because many of them talk about they've got a, they've got a mission or a mandate for being incarnating in this particular body at this time. And you've got children talking about coming from water planets, crystalline planets, and recognizing. I mean, one young girl was saying to her, mom, don't you remember when we were here in this particular planet together and we did this this and this. Fully aware of the memory of connecting to a mother in that lifetime, as well as this one, because of the. What I call them, the soul families. We. We appear to have soul families where we reincarnate with particular people that we're, you know, in different. Different lifetimes. Whether it's on Earth or another planet or another. Or another dimension, it doesn't. It doesn't really matter because that's all part of the greater reality, isn't it? You know, the. The quantum hologram, as the physicists say.

[Simon Bown]

Now, I told you before we started recording that I had a weird experience. I was taken through a past life regression, and towards the end of that, I spontaneously came up with an abduction memory, which I'm still not sure actually happened. But part of that experience was that it was kind of like the ETs gave me a vision in my mind where I was standing in a forest area and loads of trees had been cleared and there were ETs there and lots and lots of adults. And up in the sky, there was a planet that was really close to us. I mean, it was too close to actually be real. And there was a path coming off that planet down to where we were standing. And coming down that pathway were lots and lots of children. And the adults were greeting the children as they were coming from the planet. And then I got this sentence in my head, seemed to come from the ETs telepathically, which was just, when the planets meet, the children will return. So what do you make of that? Is this something to do with hybrids, do you think?

[Mary Rodwell]

I can't say for sure. I think part of you will know. And it probably would be a good idea, Simon, if you go back to that space and ask for more information. Because what I would have done if you were in hypnosis and you were coming up with this information and you didn't fully understand it, I would get you to clarify that with one of the beings that you were. You were hearing or seeing or what was coming into your mind and asking the question. And you know, as a hypnotherapist, how that works is that you're really talking to that intelligence. Or, you know, it may be that that's come from your superconscious higher self even. So what you do then is say, I don't fully understand. Can you explain more of why this is relevant? Because that's often what happens when I take somebody into hypnosis and they're having a dialogue with a particular intelligence and they may come out with they may say that this being is telling me this, this, and this. And I will say, do you understand that? You know, does it resonate? Or do you understand? If they say no, I'll say, right, well, ask again for them to explain in a way that you can understand so you get them to revisit that question and to get more information. And I would say that if you go back to revisit that, ask the question, explain more about what this is, what you're being shown, or what this means. Because that's one of the most valuable things with hypnosis that I've discovered is that, you know, people may have a page of questions that they've wanted to understand all their lives about their encounters or experiences. And one of the things I do before I do hypnosis is say, I. Right. Put down, in order of priority, all the questions that you want to understand or have an answer to. And it doesn't matter if it's half a dozen or whatever it is. And when they're in that space and I've got them communicating with whatever intelligence it is that they're talking to, and it can be a Zeta or a light being, or it's a being that they find familiar or they've connected to. I then get them to ask those questions so that they can get the understanding of why that is important or what they need to know about it. And if they don't fully understand, I will get them to go back and say, okay, you don't, you know, I don't fully understand that answer. Can you explain in more detail or in another way so that I have some understanding of that? And you can literally cover a page full of questions in that process. When they're in hypnosis, when they're in trance, when. When their subconscious is open to actually getting that information. And it's very fascinating some of the information that comes through. And they. And I also do this. And you're. As a hypnotherapist, you'll understand, I will say, now ask the being, have they got anything else they want you to know? So it may not be part of your questions, but there may be something that intelligence wants you to understand. And so you're giving them the opportunity to actually feed that person more information about why they're having these contacts and why it's important and what their connection is to them. Because that's what people want to know. Why me, for example? What you know, what is it all about? What is, you know, what is the big picture? And also the other question that many people feel like, you know, this has not been something I've agreed to or I've not consented to or whatever. And I will ask them this question, and I will say to them, have you on any level consented to this experience? And nine times out of 10, they'll give me the answer yes, before I came here. So it is as a soul that the agreement has come. Not always. It doesn't always. I don't always get that. But for many, that seems to be where there has been a consent about a trade in helping this particular species with their human life and vice versa. And, I mean, one of the young ladies I write about and have written about in my books is Tracy Taylor. And she said that she discovered that there was a trade, a trade in. By allowing them to take certain genetic material and be part of their program. Her psychic abilities were increased. In other words, they were assisting her to be more multidimensionally aware through this process. And that's why so many people that have contact start to open up psychically, start to see energy forms like, you know, they might see different beings. They may see orbs. Start to see orbs. They may find them more empathic that they tune into people. They may find they're even more telepathic. Some find they have healing abilities. Some find they can communicate with animals. There's a whole range of abilities that become accelerated after contact, including downloading of information from all sorts of topics, from quantum physics right down to origin of the species, right through to artwork that is downloaded, music scripts and light languages or star languages as well. Many start to articulate those as well. So there's a huge range of expressions of creativity that occur once someone's opened up to their contact.

[Simon Bown]

What do you make of the hybrid phenomena? Because there are women who report missing pregnancies and then being on craft and being introduced to children.

[Mary Rodwell]

Yes. And that was something I wrote in Awakening is the missing pregnancy whole phenomena, which was very. And I wrote about that in 2002, still very controversial in many ways. It's less so nowadays because so many women have become aware of the fact that they've got these children on board craft, the hybrids, if you like. And many of them will have what they think is a pregnancy, lasts couple of months, two or three months max. All of a sudden they're not pregnant. But they may be taken up to see these hybrid children. And, you know, part of it is for them to connect with them because they're part human and need the energy of Human love as well. What was fascinating to me is not only does that happen with women, it also happens with men. Some men have had their genetic material taken sperm and have ended up finding out that they've got children on board craft. And sometimes a lot of children have come from them with a mix of various species as well. But I always remember a wonderful lady I met actually when I was in the UK who told me she had full memory of going on board craft and being one of the supervisors, if you like, helping human mothers connect to their hybrid children. Because some of them would be a bit afraid or uncertain or whatever, and she would help them overcome that so that they could connect to their hybrid children. And this now is, you know, very much recognized as part of this program, if you like, of hybridization for different species. And an 8 year old explained it really well when her mother contacted me and said, my daughter wants to talk to you. I'd known the mother and she said, because she had an experience a couple of nights ago and she wants to tell you about it. And as I spoke to this lovely young lady, all of eight, she said that a couple of nights previously she'd been taken on board craft, taken to a place where she was shown how to levitate, how to use her third eye. And then she said, and they showed me what they're doing. They're doing this mixing of species. She said, they're showing me how they do that. So they mix various genetics with various beings. And she said, and they seed other planets with these mixes of genetic mixes, not just in this galaxy, but many galaxies. So this is not just us and happening on our planet. This is happening right across the cosmos.

[Simon Bown]

It makes you wonder why they're doing it. I suppose there's many, many souls, billions of them that will need to live lives as physical, you know, in a physical body. But maybe they're doing it for that. Or is it they're doing it for some other reason? I mean, really, I don't expect you to have the answer. It just makes you think, well, one

[Mary Rodwell]

of the things that you're often wondering, well, what is the motivation? The motivation is experiencing the soul experiences in different forms. So every planet is different in terms of its ecology, its life forms, its cultures and what have you right across the cosmos. So if you're in a cat form, for example, people see cat beings and feel very connected to the felines or the lion beings or whatever. They will have a different culture, a different form. You've got those that are connected dolphins. Because in a Previous life, they've been a dolphin or whatever. So we've experienced as a soul many different forms in different environments as a way of growing, growing as a way of learning about what it is like to be in a different density, for example, than the different densities that we may experience during our soul growth and understanding. So it, to me, it's all about the source experiencing different forms and different ways of its soul growing and changing from those experiences, from the big scheme of things. We all, from what I understand, we're all connected to that source, that consciousness you know, some people call God or the universal consciousness or whatever name you want to give that source of, of creation. And we're all aspects of that. And as aspects of that, we can experience different forms, different awareness, different limits, depending on what the soul has in mind for its next journey of exploration in terms of understanding. And that, to me, makes the most sense because otherwise, you know, to understand. I'll give you an example of that. I'm a young man, a graphic designer, had a regression. And he said to me, I'm seeing myself as one of these gray beings. He said. And he said, and we're moving something big from one dimension to the other. And then he said, it's a planet and we've moved it too quickly and we've messed up its energy. Now we have to. We really have to rebalance it. So in other words, he's talking about literally some species being able to use planetary bodies from one dimension to another. In fact, he did a drawing of what he saw when he explained that. So this expands the whole understanding of what we are as a soul and what we can be and what we can manifest as a soul. And, you know, at the moment, we're experiencing the limits of being human, of being in an awareness and. Or a culture that is fairly limited in the 3D sense, even though we can experience more than that. But to me, it's all part of the adventure of the soul that wants to experience and explore.

[Simon Bown]

And do you find that the reports of the hybrid children that they're introduced to, over time, they're becoming more and more so that they look just like humans. Because I think originally I was hearing that they were described as quite pale and with large eyes and just wispy hair?

[Mary Rodwell]

Well, it depends on how much human DNA and how much ET DNA the hybrid has. And I don't think some of them are meant to ever be on planet Earth at all. Some of them stay on the craft. Some of them go to other planets, other life Systems or whatever. To give you a story of one that's, that was quite a fascinating one that I talked about a few years ago was a former air hostess from Brazil. She wrote to me saying that her experiences. There was no 1 in UFO Land in Brazil that was able to help her understand her experiences. She always said that she had this connection to this tour feline type being that was very maternal that visited her as a child. But the most astounding experience for her was she was in a hotel on her way to have breakfast. And in the corridor was this little girl who looked about 11. And the woman, you know, she said, mary, I just was afraid that, you know, she was lost cause there was no mom and dad around. So I went up, up to her and said, can I help you? You know, do you need your mom or dad? And as this little girl turned round, she saw a being that was part human, part feline. And it freaked her out. And she ran down the corridor to have breakfast absolutely traumatized, not knowing what on earth she'd seen. What happened later was when she'd been taken up on the craft, she then saw this little girl that was part feline, part human. And as she went up to her, she realized that in fact it was one of hers, it was one of her hybrid children, and there were several others. But the story doesn't finish there. What she found out when she got taken up on the craft was her six year old human daughter was often taken up on the craft and she saw a human daughter playing with her feline hybrid sister on board craft as well. So her daughter was quite comfortable interacting with this hybrid that was part human and part her own sibling, if you like. So we've got this continual expansion of understanding that depending on their mix of whatever genetics they have, some will be going and being part of other civilizations, other realities, some stay on board craft and the more human types. And there are many people now, Simon, that I've met that say they're hybrids, that they're a human Zeta hybrid, or they might be part reptilian, part human. They may be part feline, have feline genetics or whatever, but are looking primarily human. So they are aware of that. And this is what's so fascinating now is that, you know, people are identifying with that and saying, you know, that my family is Arcturian or Andromedan or Pleiadian or whatever, because they connected to that, because they have an insert of genetic material from one of those particular ancestors, star ancestors.

[Simon Bown]

Do you find that there are certain characteristics of children nowadays that they're kind of, I think they call them star children or Indigo children.

[Mary Rodwell]

Well, that's what really the new human's about, is about identifying the new generations of human. I mean that in metaphysical terms, we've noticed anyway that the recent generations of children have been very different and they've given them different names because of their energy field. For example, you've got the Indigo children, you've got the crystal children, the rainbow children, children of light. A whole range of different names are given to the energy or the abilities or awareness of a particular a child in more conventional terms because they're different and behave differently. They're given labels and they're called ADHD or they're called Asperger's or some forms of autism or dyslexic or whatever. And that is because they are different and because they have not really been able to understand why they're different. Now let me explain my perspective on all of that. When I talk to people who've had experiences, what I discovered, and it's very well known that this is an intergenerational experience. So in other words, if I've got someone who's had experiences, I often will say, what about your parents? Was your mom or dad ever had experiences? Or your grandparents, and many may say, oh, granddad was always into UFOs or grandma was always very psychic or whatever, and there's your link to the present person that's having the experiences. But then you've got the children of those people and they will say, my child's very different. They're more sensitive or they're, you know, they'll come out with different things about them that are different. And because of that, they, you know, given often these labels as ADHD or Asperger's or whatever, what they are, and this was what my research was indicating, was these differences are for a purpose. Not only are they more aware and more awake because they are more aware of their heritage, past lives, their abilities, their connection to these intelligences. They're given these labels. And what do we do with these children? The whole idea is that they're wired differently. So why are they wired differently? And so we notice the difference, but we think it's a dysfunction. They're wired differently because they can't be so easily programmed into an inaccurate 3D consensus reality. The whole idea is if they are wired differently, you can't bring them into a reality that isn't accurate, which is our 3D consensus, because we're all multidimensional so this is why the only way you can educate some of these children, such as ADHD is to slow them up. And they're given drugs like Ritalin. But there are ways that you can stabilize that without Ritalin. But the whole point is that what I think these intelligences are doing is because so many people are programmed out of their awareness or have it shut down due to the educational, scientific programming that we have on this planet, they've made it harder to program them. And this is why you're getting all these different so called dysfunctions. And what's interesting, Simon, is, you know, this is gradually what I was noticing when I talked to someone who was in their mid-50s who had recognized that they would have been diagnosed as adhd. And he wrote a book about his close encounters of the ADHD kind. His name's Neil Gold, who I met a couple of times when I was in Hong Kong. And what he said was he saw, always saw reality in a more complex, multidimensional way that the average person didn't. And he retranslated ADHD as always dialed into higher dimensions because that's exactly how these children are operating. They're operating in a completely different way. And it's seen and perceived by those that don't understand as a dysfunction. What it's really doing is allowing them to operate more multidimensionally and so they don't get so easily programmed into this whole system that is inaccurate, which, you know, many people, you know, realize isn't the full story, but they're afraid to explore it because of the judgment of being different or being thought of as crazy. And that's what we're all fighting is the judgment of being different.

[Simon Bown]

It's been great talking to you and I'll put the links in the show notes so people can find the books and your website. Do you have any plans for another book?

[Mary Rodwell]

Well, not at the moment. I've sort of booked out, as it were, But I may down the track that my main thing at the moment is sharing the data by doing these kinds of interviews. And I'm grateful to you, Simon, for that as well. If anyone wants to get my book in England, you can order it from Nexus magazine in England because he's got several copies of both books and whatever, so you can get it that way. But for me, Simon, at the moment it's about sharing the data because you never know who's going to listen and this is going to make sense to them and help them with their journey. And that's really the prime motivating of all my work is to help people understand they're not crazy and that in fact there's something very extraordinary going on on this planet and it's about us all waking up to that.

[Simon Bown]

Well, it's been great talking to you. Thanks again for coming on to the podcast, Simon.

[Mary Rodwell]

It's been an absolute pleasure. Take care and look after yourself and many thanks for your time and energy in putting such important information out on these lines.

[Simon Bown]

And that was an interview with Mary Rodwell where she was talking about her book the New Awakening to Our Cosmic Heritage. And my book called Aspects of Alien Abduction is out on Amazon and you can get it on paperback, audiobook or Kindle. And if you enjoy this podcast please leave a review and be sure to subscribe on Apple Podcasts, Spotify or via your favorite podcast app to make sure that you don't miss out on any episodes. And thanks for listening.

[Mary Rodwell]

Sam.