AEE 2367: Does English Feel Like Alphabet Soup?

Summary

All Ears English Podcast - Episode 2367: Does English Feel Like Alphabet Soup?

Hosts:

• Lindsay McMahon – The English adventurer
• Michelle Kaplan – The New York radio girl

Release Date: March 4, 2025

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Introduction

In Episode 2367 of the All Ears English Podcast, hosts Lindsay McMahon and Michelle Kaplan delve into the intriguing question posed by a listener: "What is the difference between 'alphabet' and 'number'?" The conversation not only clarifies the fundamental distinctions between these concepts but also explores various English expressions that incorporate letters and numbers, enriching listeners' vocabulary and cultural understanding.

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Understanding 'Alphabet' vs. 'Number'

Lindsay begins by defining the core concepts:

• Alphabet: "Alphabet is the product of all the letters known as the ABCs." [03:51]
• Number: "Number is just 1, 2, 3, 6, 7, 12, 114." [03:51]

Michelle adds depth to the discussion by addressing the absence of a collective term for numbers akin to "alphabet" for letters:

• "We don't really say that. I guess it's because there are only 26 letters and there are infinite numbers." [04:22]

This distinction highlights that while the alphabet is a finite set of symbols, numbers are infinite, leading to the absence of a singular term encompassing all numbers.

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Expressions Using 'Alphabet'

1. Alphabetical Order

   • Example Usage: "Her last name is Zayn, and the class had to line up in alphabetical order; she was last." [05:47]

   • Insight: Often used in academic settings, alphabetical order organizes items based on the sequence of the alphabet, typically by last names.

2. Alphabet Soup

   • Definition: Describes a situation that is confusing or jumbled, much like a bowl of soup containing scattered alphabet letters.

   • Example Usage: "The directions felt like Alphabet soup to me. It was just so all over the place." [06:47]

   • Notable Quote: "It's completely nonsensical." [07:15]

   • Cultural Context: Originates from the visual chaos of alphabetic letters in soup, representing disorganization or lack of clarity. Lindsay relates this to experiences in different cultures, such as navigating the Tokyo subway without knowing Kanji: "It feels like Alphabet soup sometimes, especially reading, it's just chaotic." [08:38]

3. The ABCs of Something

   • Definition: Refers to the basic fundamentals or essentials of a subject.

   • Example Usage: "Let's go over the ABCs of all the gym equipment." [09:54]

   • Insight: A playful and colorful way to present foundational information, making learning more engaging.

---

Expressions Using 'Numbers'

1. Numerical Order

   • Definition: Arranging items based on their numerical value.

   • Example in Conversation: Discussed briefly as the counterpart to alphabetical order. "The program will automatically put everything in numerical order. So no need to do it manually." [12:46]

2. Numbers Game

   • Definition: An activity or process driven by probability and chance, emphasizing persistence despite uncertainty.

   • Example Usage: "It's a numbers game. Just keep trying and eventually you'll get the right answer." [13:05]

   • Host Insight: Lindsay expresses enthusiasm for this expression, hinting at a possible future episode dedicated to its exploration. [13:27]

3. Numbers Person

   • Definition: Someone who excels at working with numbers or has a natural affinity for mathematics.

   • Example Usage: "I'm not a numbers person." [17:44]

   • Insight: Michelle explains that while many people readily identify as "not a numbers person," fewer claim to be inherently good with numbers. This expression helps articulate personal strengths and areas of expertise.

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Role Play: Applying the Expressions

To contextualize the expressions, Lindsay and Michelle engage in a role-play scenario where they act as classmates navigating a project with perplexing instructions.

• Scenario Setup: The professor's directions are confusing, leading to the use of the term "Alphabet soup."

  Michelle: "Honestly, the directions felt like Alphabet soup to me. It was just so all over the place." [15:45]

  Lindsay: "Let's just arrange the numbers in numerical order too." [16:23]

  Michelle: "I'm not a numbers person." [16:47]

• Objective: Demonstrates how "Alphabet soup" signifies confusion and how "numbers game" reflects the approach to resolving such confusion through systematic effort.

---

Cultural and Practical Applications

Beyond expressions, the hosts share personal anecdotes and cultural observations that enrich the discussion:

• Navigating Foreign Languages: Lindsay compares the chaotic feeling of encountering unfamiliar scripts, like Kanji in Japanese, to Alphabet soup. [08:38]

• Culinary Context: They discuss the complexity of reading American food labels, often laden with numerous ingredients, likening it to Alphabet soup. [10:39]

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Conclusion and Encouragement

As the episode wraps up, Lindsay and Michelle encourage listeners to "try out new vocabulary by using these expressions in their daily conversations" [18:11]. They emphasize the importance of practice in language acquisition and invite listeners to engage with their content on YouTube for more interactive learning opportunities.

Notable Takeaway:

• Connection Over Perfection: The recurring theme throughout the podcast is fostering a connection with the language and culture rather than striving for flawless grammar or pronunciation. "Connection NOT Perfection!" serves as the podcast's mantra, motivating learners to embrace language learning as a natural and enjoyable process.

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Additional Resources

Listeners are invited to explore more episodes, such as Episode 2354 titled "Was Everyone Smart?", to further enhance their understanding and fluency in English expressions and cultural nuances.

For personalized learning, the hosts offer a fluency score quiz to help learners identify their English proficiency level and chart their next steps towards fluency.

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Stay Connected:

• Subscribe: Ensure you never miss an episode by subscribing to the All Ears English Podcast on your preferred platform.
• YouTube Engagement: Submit your questions and interact with the community on their YouTube channel.

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Thank you for joining Lindsay and Michelle on this insightful exploration of English expressions. Remember, it's about connecting and growing your language skills steadily and confidently!

Transcript

[A]

This is an All Ears English podcast. Episode 2367. Does English feel like Alphabet soup? Welcome to the All Ears English podcast. Downloaded more than 200 million times. Are you feeling stuck with your English? We'll show you how to become fearless and fluent by focusing on connection, not perfection, with your American hosts, Lindsay McMahon, the English adventurer, and Michelle Kaplan, the New York radio girl. Coming to you from Colorado and New York City, usa. To get real time transcripts right on your phone and create your personalized vocabulary list, try the All Ears English app for iOS and Android. Start your seven day free trial at allearsenglish.com forward/app.

[B]

In today's episode, a listener asks us the difference between the words Alphabet and number. Today you get six fun English expressions using letters and numbers in English to sound more interesting. What's the fastest way to achieve a goal to know where you're starting from? Find your English fluency level now and we'll show you the next steps to take to achieve the next fluency level in 2025. Go to allearsenglish.com fluency score. To take our free quiz, go to allearsenglish.com fluENCY.

[A]

Hey, Michelle, how's it going today?

[B]

Hey, Lindsay. I'm good. How are you?

[A]

Good, good. Happy to be on the mic. I have a question for you today.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

So do you tend to organize things in alphabetical order? I mean, you just moved into a new home. Did you go and organize your cereal boxes according to the Alphabet?

[B]

No way. I do not have time for alphabetical order. I, I, I suppose, maybe, maybe one day, but I'm not, I'm not that particular about ordering things. Now. If for something at work I was filing things or really needed to be in alphabetical order, that's different. But certainly not in my personal life. What about you?

[A]

No, nothing in my life is in alphabetical order. I can't think of a single thing. I just, it is too much work, Michelle and I don't have the time. Exactly.

[B]

So today we are going to answer a question from, from a listener. This question comes to us from YouTube.

[A]

Yes, I'll go ahead and read the question. So the listener says, what an interesting topic. I was wondering what the difference is between Alphabet and number. Okay, so it's kind of a broad question, Right?

[B]

So we're gonna answer it and then we're gonna go into, we're gonna dive a little bit deeper and we're gonna give you some expressions with the word Alphabet and with the word number. So that's the direction that we're going to take. So it's a good question.

[A]

Yeah, we get a lot of great questions on YouTube. So, guys, don't forget that our show is very much on YouTube. So if you go. Yeah, very much so. If you go over to YouTube and type in All Ears English podcast, we will come up. You can hit that subscribe button. You can ask your question inside the comments. We do have a team member that goes in to get your questions and that will end up. Your question will end up in our list. All right, so ask your question over on YouTube.

[B]

Okay. All right, perfect. All right, so, Lindsay, what's the difference between Alphabet and number?

[A]

Okay, so Alphabet is the product of all the letters known as the ABCs. Right. And number is just 1, 2, 3, 67, 12. 114.

[B]

Yeah, exactly. So, interestingly enough, this was one thing I hadn't. I guess I hadn't thought about before. Alphabet really encompasses all of the letters, but is there a word that encompasses all of the numbers?

[A]

A word that I just. The numerical system, I guess.

[B]

Right, right, exactly. But we don't really say that. I guess it's because There are only 26 letters and there are infinite.

[A]

Yeah, no, we don't have. No, we don't have any kind of word that would say. Right.

[B]

It's just numbers. So it would be Alphabet and the numbers. Yeah. So, but we're gonna talk about that more. But Alphabet think ABC's numbers. Think 1, 2, 3. And one thing you should do right now is hit follow wherever you're listening to the All Ears English podcast. So you never miss anything from us.

[A]

Yeah, guys, hit that follow button. Wherever you are, make sure you are fully following us so you get every episode. All right, so what are we diving into then today? How are we going to answer this question?

[B]

Well, we are going to get more into it because I realize there are a lot of useful expressions that go along with the words alphabetical.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And the word number.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And so I thought this was a really good opportunity to teach some of those. So we're going to start with Alphabet. So the first one is. We already went over it. Lindsay, what is it?

[A]

Yeah, so just alphabetical order.

[B]

Right.

[A]

I asked you at the top of the show, do you alphabetize? That's a great verb, by the way. Alphabetized. You alphabetize your cereal boxes and you laughed and said, no way. Who does that? Right. And here's another example. Alphabetical order. Her last name is Zayn, and the class had to line up in alphabetical order her. So she was last. Okay.

[B]

Yep. Yeah.

[A]

I always wondered what that was like. Right. Because I feel like in school kids always got. Often got called on for different things according to their last name. Yeah, it seemed to happen a lot for some reason. And I was always in the middle and you too, I guess. Right. Kind of in the middle is. And so that was kind of nice because you're not caught off guard. You're not, I don't know, volunteered for something. All of a sudden that.

[B]

That's true. You're kind of cozied in to the rest.

[A]

You have time to figure out what's happening and how to.

[B]

Yeah, that's funny. I didn't think about that. But yeah. Alphabetical order. So the. The order in which the Alphabet goes. And a lot of times that does happen in school. A lot of the times I would say by last name.

[A]

By last name. Yes, completely. What else? Michelle? What's another one?

[B]

All right. Alphabet soup. Soup.

[A]

This is fun. This is fun. Yeah, yeah.

[B]

So Alphabet soup, it's like something that doesn't make sense. It's too much information maybe, and it just. Everything is kind of all bl. Right. Yeah.

[A]

This is interesting. What is a scenario when you might use this to say something is Alphabet soup?

[B]

I would say when you're being given directions for something, maybe that just doesn't make sense, or say that it sounds like Alphabet. Or maybe, oh, maybe someone's trying to give you some sort of explanation as to why something happened, but you're just thinking that sounds like Alphabet soup. It's kind of. It just doesn't. It doesn't add up. It doesn't work. There's too much. It's all jumbled. Right.

[A]

Interesting. Yeah. So the sample sentence is just Alphabet soup. It's completely nonsensical. And this is a good high level bonus word for listeners today. Nonsensical, Sensical.

[B]

Instead of saying it doesn't make sense, you can say it's nonsensical.

[A]

Yeah, go ahead, go ahead.

[B]

Oh, yeah, no, I was just thinking it's this idea. I think it comes from this idea of. Did you ever have Alphabet soup?

[A]

Yeah, sure. It's the can of soup that has all the ABC, all the letters of the Alphabet as. Instead of SpaghettiOs, right. Or, I don't know, what is it? Spaghetti? I don't know. Tell, tell us what it is, Michelle.

[B]

Well, yeah, no, it's exactly what Lindsay said. It's just you have all the letters in a soup. So I guess the idea is, of course, when you have all the letters in a soup they're not going to be lined up, you know, perfectly. They're jumbled in this soup. So that's, to me, what. What I think of when I hear this expression. Special.

[A]

It's also kind of what it feels like to travel. Let's say, for example, in Asia, like in Japan, if you don't read kanji, it feels like that, let's say, trying to read the subway map. Luckily, it's actually quite good. The Tokyo subway system, they do a good job of putting subway stops in Romaji, which you can. You can understand. You can read the letters. Right. Like an R is an R. Right. But it just feels like that when you come into contact with the Japanese language. For me, it feels like Alphabet soup sometimes, especially reading, it's just chaotic. Yeah.

[B]

Well, I remember in Tokyo, it was great with the. With the train system, because I remember sometimes people were just working there to point you in the right direction. You would just say the train you were looking for, and people would point, and it was so nice. And it's like, oh, no. In New York, maybe.

[A]

New York is really the Alphabet soup, right?

[B]

Yeah. And because you might have someone sitting at a. At the stand, you know, there's. But usually it's. You get in there, and there's no one actually there.

[A]

Usually. We used to say on the show, it's the lady yelling at you from inside the booth.

[B]

Right.

[A]

It's like. Or on the train, they yell at you, too. The conductor yells at you on the train if you. You know, if you. If you hold the doors or something. Right, right, right. Yeah.

[B]

The real treat. Yeah.

[A]

So different. Nothing could be more different than the New York City subway and the Tokyo Metro, right?

[B]

Absolutely. So, all right, the last one for Alphabet expressions is the ABCs of something. So it's the basics. So I'm so glad to be your personal trainer. Let's first go over the ABCs of all the gym equipment. So you're not actually saying, let's go over something that starts with A. Let's find a gym piece of equipment that starts with B. You're not doing that. It's just saying, oh, these are the basics. Yep.

[A]

It's just another colorful, fun way to say the basics. I would say it's not super common. It's a little playful.

[B]

Right.

[A]

If you're just trying to make it, mix it up and say something different. But we're giving you guys some variety here, right?

[B]

Definitely. Yeah.

[A]

Yeah. So we've talked about what we've tried to learn. That feels like Alphabet soup. I Mean, also for me, Arabic. Trying to read Arabic felt like Alphabet soup when I learned. Tried to learn Arabic a few years ago to get ready to go to Cairo. Yeah. Anything else, Michelle?

[B]

Sometimes see, well, I mean, sometimes certain politicians might say something that sounds like Alphabet. I'm not naming any names. We don't get into it.

[A]

But yeah, yeah, a lot of things can. Or maybe reading food labels. Ooh. Talking about processed foods in the U.S. okay, there's a good one. When you go into the U.S. pick up your average product in American on American shelves. Uh, it's going to be Alphabet soup if you look at the ingredients, because there's way too many ingredients. All right.

[B]

I was just last night reading ingredients.

[A]

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[B]

Go.

[A]

Okay, here we go. Michelle, let's go into numbers now. Right?

[B]

All right.

[A]

What do we have to say about this?

[B]

Well, in the same way we have alphabetical order, there's also numerical order. So the program will automatically put everything in numerical order. So no need to do it manually.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

Or.

[A]

I actually love this expression. It's a numbers game.

[B]

Yeah, me too.

[A]

And we could. You're right. We could do a whole episode on this, and I think we will. So hit the follow button, guys. I want to go more into this. This. But basically the idea is, you know, there's a lot of chance in life. Right. So for example, it's a numbers game. Just keep trying and eventually you'll get the right answer. This is why people go to Vegas and spend all their money.

[B]

Yeah, I really like this expression as well. So. Yeah. Well, maybe soon we'll do a follow up and we'll just really dig into this one. So.

[A]

Yeah, let's do that.

[B]

Give it the amount of time it deserves. But it's a very good one for sure.

[A]

What else, Michelle? Anything else?

[B]

A numbers person. So that's someone who is good at numbers. You, you don't say. I'm a letters person. Right?

[A]

It doesn't actually. No. That's interesting. Yeah.

[B]

Yeah. And just to be clear, to remind everybody, letters make up the Alphabet. So. Okay. Just so numbers. But again, we don't have a Alphabet word for numbers.

[A]

Right.

[B]

Okay. So a numbers person. Someone who's good at numbers. I am not a numbers person. Thank goodness for calculators. Lindsay, are you a numbers person?

[A]

No. What do you think, Michelle? Well, no, not naturally. I've had to get a little bit more numbery, kind of running the business, running spreadsheets, But I still don't know how to run the spreadsheets. You know, I still.

[B]

Right.

[A]

I know how to sum columns, but that's pretty much it. So.

[B]

Yeah. Yeah, I, I, some. I don't know. Did you ever have a friend like Dan is very good at kind of fast math? He'll just, he'll always know how to calculate, you know, the algebra for something. If we're trying to calculate something, he'll, he'll be able to do it quickly. And I just kind of nod along because I, I did like math in school by just to do it quickly like that and think of how I'm going to figure out some sort of formula. Not, Not.

[A]

Well, I think that's, that's the cool thing about being an adult, being out of school. We get to choose where we want to focus our energy and our career. And there are a lot of careers where you don't really need to come in contact with numbers on that level. Right. So that's a good thing. Thank goodness. But if you're an accountant, then we want you to be good at numbers. Right. For sure. For sure.

[B]

Yeah. So should we do a role play?

[A]

Yeah, let's do it. So here we are, classmates, and we're working on a project. All right. Okay. Okay. So the professor wants everything in alphabetical Order.

[B]

Right. Honestly, the directions felt like Alphabet soup to me. It was just so all over the place.

[A]

Oh, I know. Maybe I'll ask some follow up questions via email. Oh, let's just arrange the numbers in numerical order. She probably would appreciate that.

[B]

Definitely. Maybe you can sort them. I'm not a numbers person. Not. I'm very tentative on my skills for this.

[A]

Right, right. For sure. All right. So I said, first, the professor wants everything in alphabetical order. Gosh, what a pain. Right? Yeah.

[B]

And I said, honestly, the directions felt like Alphabet soup to me. So to me it just felt like nothing made sense. Everything was kind of out of order. I'm confused.

[A]

Yep. So you're just kind of conf. You're saying, ah, I need help. I'm confused. Right. When you say that, Alphabet soup. And I said, oh, let's just arrange the numbers in numerical order too. Okay. So to arrange in numerical order, does 1, 2, 3, 4, or just in the correct order of the numbers.

[B]

Right, exactly. And then I said, maybe you can sort them. Them. I'm not a numbers person. So I'm saying I'm not good with numbers.

[A]

I do think that that phrase I'm not a numbers person is very common. Right. I feel like I hear that a lot. Maybe it's just, I don't know the people I know or something. But yeah, people say that. Right. To declare what their skills are. Maybe if you're playing a group game and someone needs to be the math person or the scorekeeper, you know, people like, I'm not a numbers person. Someone else can keep score here.

[B]

Right. It. And to me, it. I. I feel like people are more likely to say they're not a numbers person than to say, oh, I'm a numbers person. I mean, they might, they might say, oh, I'm a numbers person. Like if you're contrasting with something. So maybe if you say, oh, I'm not really good with writing essays, I'm more of a numbers person. So you could say that. But yeah, it's a good way to talk about your strengths. Yeah.

[A]

But it's a good question. I mean, what is the opposite of what. You know, we don't say I'm not a letter or I'm a letters person or I'm not a letters person. Right. What do we might say? I'm a language person or. Yeah, I don't know.

[B]

We'll have to visit that another day. Interesting how that. Yeah, it doesn't really work out. But it doesn't work out.

[A]

It doesn't work out. Michelle, is there another episode we could check out here?

[B]

Yes, guys, Check out episode 2354. Was is everyone smart?

[A]

Yes, that is a provocative thought evoking title. So I want our listeners to go over there, guys, just scroll right down, not very far. 23:54. Michelle, where should we leave our listeners today?

[B]

Okay, well, this was a great question. I mean it really led us to. It was a very broad question, but it led us on a really interesting path up for an episode. Yeah, there are a lot of expressions that go along with Alphabet or numbers or letters and we went over them with you today. And yeah, I would say give the. These are all pretty comments. I would say give them a try.

[A]

Yeah, for sure. Try them out. That's how we learn. No vocab new vocabulary is by trying it out. All right. And hit the follow button while you're at it. All right, good stuff, Michelle. Well, I'll see you back on the show very soon. All right.

[B]

All right, bye.

[A]

Take care. Bye. Thanks for listening. To all ears. English. Would you like to know your English level? Take our two minute quiz, go to allearsenglish.com forward/fluency score. And if you believe in connection, not perfection, then hit subscribe now to make sure you you don't miss anything. See you next time.