All Ears English Podcast – Episode 2512: How to Riff in English for Better Small Talk

Hosts: Lindsay McMahon and Aubrey Carter
Date: November 12, 2025

Episode Overview

This episode dives into the concept of “riffing” in English conversation—how to move beyond the limits of typical small talk and create genuine connections. Inspired by an interview with Maya Ross Milan, a business professor and New York Times contributor, Lindsay and Aubrey demonstrate how playful, improvisational banter can transform surface-level exchanges into meaningful, memorable interactions. The hosts offer practical English conversation strategies, especially for ESL learners looking to sound more natural and build rapport. Three detailed role plays illustrate riffing in action.

Main Discussion Points & Insights

1. What is Riffing? [03:40–04:51]

• Definition: Riffing means to improvise, playfully building on a topic spontaneously, much like musicians do in jazz.

  • “To riff, it means to improve and build on a subject.” — Lindsay (04:14)
  • “We do the same thing in conversation. We don’t have anything memorized. We’re having to build on what we hear.” — Aubrey (04:22)
  • Riffing is about being agile and playful, moving quickly from small talk to humor, anecdotes, or quirky questions.

• Why Riffing?

  • Small talk feels superficial or scripted; riffing creates opportunities for real connection and deeper relationships.
  • “You don’t want them to be bored. You want to make it fun and interesting.” — Aubrey (04:42)
  • It signals openness to friendship and helps discover common ground.

2. Why Small Talk Falls Short [05:25–05:50]

• Small talk is safe but doesn’t build depth:
  • “Small talk is so formal and so, I don’t know, it feels scripted sometimes.” — Lindsay (05:50)
  • Riffing acts as a “test” to see if you can move into a more genuine relationship.
  • Staying in small talk can prevent real connection, while riffing is a “cool signal” that you’re interested in more.

3. How to Riff: Practical Role Plays & Topics

A. Awkward Moments [07:00–08:28]

• Situation: Joking about awkward social mishaps (e.g., waving at the wrong person)
  • Example exchange:
    • Aubrey: “Oh, I just dodged a bullet. I thought that person was waving and almost waved back, but they were waving at someone behind me.” (07:00)
    • Lindsay: “Classic. I’m impressed you caught yourself in time.” (07:10)
    • Both share stories and laugh about common embarrassing moments.
  • Insight:
    • These universally relatable topics create a quick sense of camaraderie.
    • “We could just talk about the weather or just small talk forever. But instead, we’re going to be laughing here.” — Aubrey (07:49)

B. Forgetting Names [08:43–09:39]

• Situation: Admitting to being bad with names, playfully teasing oneself
  • Example exchange:
    • Aubrey: “I apologize in advance if I forget your name. I am terrible with names.” (08:49)
    • Lindsay: “Me too. It’s like my brain goes, nope, too much information. Delete.” (08:54)
    • Joking about tricks to cover up, using “friend,” or getting names wrong for comic relief.
    • Lindsay: “Honestly, forgetting names should be an Olympic sport. We’d all get gold medals.” (09:19)
  • Insight:
    • Such honesty instantly builds rapport; humor about shared weaknesses bridges formality.

C. Unusual Food Combos [12:12–13:41]

• Situation: Prompting with an unexpected question about “weirdest food combo” people enjoy
  • Example exchange:
    • Aubrey: “So, what’s the weirdest food combo you secretly love?” (12:12)
    • Lindsay: “Definitely peanut butter on pickles.” (12:17)
    • Aubrey: “Wait, what? Peanut butter and pickles. That’s actually terrifying.” (12:21)
    • They then riff about other odd combos (chocolate & fries, ice cream & sriracha), poking fun at each other.
    • Aubrey: “We’re basically flavor alchemists here.” (12:45)
  • Insight:
    • Fun, random questions jump-start playful interaction and quickly reveal personalities.

4. Tips for Riffing in English [13:55–14:57]

• Start with a Relatable, Slightly Surprising Question:
  • Out-of-the-blue but not so niche your partner can't follow.
  • If the other person doesn’t have an answer, be ready to share yours and make it playful.
• Evaluate Responses:
  • If your partner enjoys the riff, keep going. If not, smoothly pivot back to safer small talk.
• Use Humor and Self-Deprecation:
  • Joking about shared struggles (like forgetting names) helps break down barriers.
• This is a Small Shift, Not a Major Skill Change:
  • “Like I said earlier, for a lot of our listeners, this is just a tiny shift. This is not a huge new skill set we have to learn. It’s a way of engaging.” — Lindsay (14:57)

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On riffing as relationship test:
  • “It’s a kind of a cool signal and a test, a way to figure out, is there going to be something more here? Can we actually become friends?” — Lindsay (05:25)
• On universality of awkwardness:
  • “Everything we said in this awkwardness, we’ve all been there.” — Aubrey (08:28)
• On honesty as connection:
  • “If you say that you’ve done it, I can see myself in you. Like, you know, that’s a real connection moment.” — Lindsay (08:28)
• On moving away from small talk:
  • “We’re moving away from the scripts we learned in our textbooks, the topics like weather, which don’t ultimately get you very far.” — Lindsay (14:36)
• On the essence of riffing:
  • “You need to find something you have in common and then build on it in a fun, playful way.” — Aubrey (14:17)

Timestamps for Key Segments

• [03:40] – What is riffing? Definition and analogy to jazz/improvisation
• [05:25] – Why riffing is a “test” for deeper friendships
• [07:00] – Awkward moments (role play & breakdown)
• [08:49] – Forgetting names (role play & insights)
• [12:12] – Weird food combos (role play & breakdown)
• [14:17] – Main takeaway: moving from small talk to genuine connection
• [14:57] – Encouragement for listeners to try riffing and share their stories

Final Takeaway

The hosts encourage listeners to try riffing during their next English-language encounter. It doesn’t require perfect grammar or native-level vocabulary; it’s about pushing past surface topics and being a little braver, more playful, and more honest. Even a small move away from standard small talk can build bridges and lead to more authentic connections.
“Happy riffing, everyone!” — Aubrey (15:32)

If you experiment with riffing, share your stories with the All Ears English team via email or YouTube comments!