Lindsay McMahon (2:30)

Oh, that's such a famous. Yeah, I think that's. It's pretty famous in New York, right? The white fish.

Michelle Kaplan (2:34)

Whitefish salad with lox on top.

Lindsay McMahon (2:36)

Okay.

Michelle Kaplan (2:37)

Yeah, like tomato, onion. Oh, my gosh.

Lindsay McMahon (2:39)

Okay. When I go to New York, I'll get like a locks, like just lox. A bagel with lox and cream cheese.

Michelle Kaplan (2:47)

Cream cheese?

Lindsay McMahon (2:47)

Yeah. Yeah. That is so. That's really good. But it's not so much for the bagel. It could be on a piece of bread. I know I should never say that. Yeah, but it's more the salmon and cream cheese together. But anyways, bagels are famous in New York. People. People love them. So if you guys are in New York, get yourself A New York bagel, right, Michelle?

Michelle Kaplan (3:06)

That's right, exactly. So why did you say you've reached a new low?

Lindsay McMahon (3:13)

Well, I'm sort of being a little bit sarcastic here because I know that you love bagels and I've heard about them a lot. But then you're saying yesterday you ate four of them, which is a lot of food.

Michelle Kaplan (3:22)

They're giant. I mean, especially the New York ones. They are giant.

Lindsay McMahon (3:27)

They really are. They're very blown up. Right. And so I'm kind of saying you went really far with your addiction to bagels. A little too far.

Michelle Kaplan (3:34)

Yes, exactly. Because if so, I can't imagine anybody going through four of them. So that's just a lot to eat. So, yeah, I mean, this is an expression about actually being worse than before. So like you said, Lindsay, it can be humorous. It can also be serious, depending on the context. So again, right. The expression is reach a new low. So we're gonna get into that more in just a second here. But first we want to say a huge, huge hu. Huge thank you to our reviewers.

Lindsay McMahon (4:06)

Oh, my gosh. It's all about our listeners on this show, Michelle. And today I want to announce those amazing listeners who took the time to review us in the Android app. So a huge thank you to Jason Sidu, Myria Warmlinger, Lemis, Gabrielle Spaghyari, Mahdi Torabi. Thank you to David Rodriguez, Lorenzo and Mohana Mozafari. Most of these are five star reviews, Michelle, and it's just. It's amazing to hear from our listeners over here. Yes.

Michelle Kaplan (4:34)

Thank you so much, guys. You make our days really. It's so meaningful and we really appreciate it.

Lindsay McMahon (4:40)

Yeah. So wherever you're listening, whether it's in the Android, iOS app, Apple podcast, Spotify, take a minute now to go and leave us a rating and review. Write us a little note, Tell us what you love about the show. You could ask your episode idea, your episode question there, but send us a signal and we'd like to know what you think of the show. All right.

Michelle Kaplan (5:00)

Love it. All right, thank you again, everyone. So. So let's get back into. Reach a new low. So. Yes. Okay. So this basically means, like we were saying, you become worse than in the past. So something's happened, generally. Something. An event where you made me wor. You made. That made you worse in some way.

Lindsay McMahon (5:21)

Made you worse. Yeah, yeah.

Michelle Kaplan (5:23)

And it doesn't have to be a person even. It could be a situation. And I thought of this episode because my kids, one of them has finished off the Halloween candy. But my Son still has a bag of his and he dropped, he's. He dropped some on the floor and started to want to just eat it off the floor or like lick it off the floor. And even though he has more candy. And I said, okay, we've reached a new low.

Lindsay McMahon (5:52)

Yeah. Yeah. When you're licking candy off the floor, no matter how old you are, you've reached a new low of like kind of being addicted to something in a sense.

Michelle Kaplan (6:02)

Right? Yes, yes, exactly, exactly. So, you know, this was used in a humorous or teasing way. But what about in the role play from the beginning?

Lindsay McMahon (6:13)

Like we.

Michelle Kaplan (6:14)

Again, I'd overeaten and you're teasing me about it.

Lindsay McMahon (6:18)

I'm teasing you about it. It's light hearted, right. This is quite light and fun and sarcastic and I'm poking fun at your addiction to bagels here. Right?

Michelle Kaplan (6:26)

Yes. But you know, you want to be careful with like that, with like eating and that kind of conversation because that could be a sensitive topic. So. Ye, you know, like if somebody, maybe somebody does have a large appetite and if you don't know them that well and you're not teasing them and you say, wow, you've reached a new low, like they could get pretty offended. So I would say, yeah, right.

Lindsay McMahon (6:48)

100. That's really important. Yeah. So I know that you don't have issues with eating and so it's okay for me to tease you. I know you have an obsession with bagels and it's kind of a fun back and forth. Right. But. Right. If anyone is struggling with eating issues, I would steer clear of this. Right. Because it would be taken literally. Right. It would be taken seriously, not facetiously or sarcastically.

Michelle Kaplan (7:10)

Right, Right. So that person might be insecure about it and they're binge eating or have some sort of disorder or whatever it is. And if you just go, wow, you reached a new low. It's not going to be taken the same way as if Lindsay, who knows me well, who knows about the bagels. I know my son well. We're just joking around. We like, there has to be a certain level of familiarity to be able to use that in that context.

Lindsay McMahon (7:31)

Super important. So that's where the nuances in today's episode is. It's the same phrase. But if you use it in the wrong situation. Right. It could be taken literally and directly and really harm someone. Right. Really hurt someone. Whereas if it's used in the right way with the right person at the right time, it's fun, it's playful, it's teasing. That's Real.

Michelle Kaplan (7:52)

A fine line. Yeah, very interesting here. Well, let's do some more examples that don't deal with bagels or candy. So, okay, the first one is I always thought he was rude, but he reached a new low when he asked me to drive him to the airport when I had the flu.

Lindsay McMahon (8:08)

And so this is a little more straightforward and direct. Like you're actually saying he's a pretty bad guy. Right?

Michelle Kaplan (8:15)

Like he, we. You thought he was rude but then it became worse. Right?

Lindsay McMahon (8:18)

Yeah. Or not thought. At the very least not thoughtful. Right?

Michelle Kaplan (8:22)

Yes. Yes.

Lindsay McMahon (8:23)

He's not, you know, thinking about you. He's a little self centered.

Michelle Kaplan (8:26)

Yes.

Lindsay McMahon (8:27)

Or I can't believe we stayed up binging that show until 4am Seriously, we've reached a new low. So this is us just kind of making fun of ourselves, right? We're a little addicted to Netflix or something.

Michelle Kaplan (8:42)

Yes, exactly, exactly. And I'm sure everybody can relate to that moment of even if maybe it's not watching tv but even reading. I just finished a book and I would stay up late reading it. And my friend just finished a little book and she did say that she stayed up till 4am reading it because she was so addicted to it. And I can't read that book because I can't stay up till 4am I mean I can, but like I. Yes, exactly. Or here's another one. This restaurant was going downhill, but their atmosphere has reached a new low. I don't think I'll be coming back so.

Lindsay McMahon (9:17)

And here are we teasing the restaurant, Michelle? No, not really.

Michelle Kaplan (9:22)

Oh, this is the more straightforward one. It's getting worse. It's getting even worse.

Lindsay McMahon (9:27)

Exactly. And here's the next one. Okay, your outfits have reached a new low. This is supposed to be formal night. Right. So maybe for many, many times in a row you are showing up too casual. And again this time you showed up really casual, but you were supposed to be formal. So it's reached a new low. Right.

Michelle Kaplan (9:46)

Well that reminds me of Dan because we've gone on cruises and he kind of. They always have like a formal night on cruises and he's decided that he's not packing a suit on a cruise. So his form, his formal night is like a Hawaiian shirt and shorts and it's like. No, no.

Lindsay McMahon (10:03)

Is Dan one of those guys that wears shorts in the wintertime? Because there was an article, I didn't read it, but there was a headline I saw somewhere about dudes in the U. S who won't wear pants. Like they'll wear shorts and sandals in the winter.

Michelle Kaplan (10:15)

Oh, no, no, no, no, no, no. That's just for like on vacation when it's warm now he wears pants. So. But yeah, you can see it's used with the truth or sarcastically. It could be self deprecating. But again, you have to be very careful if you're teasing someone with this. If you're using it in a teasy, teasy teasing way.

Lindsay McMahon (10:38)

Yes, yes.

Michelle Kaplan (10:39)

And what else is interesting? I thought what I said to my son was I realized this. I actually said, we've reached a new low. I don't think I said, you've reached a new low. So I guess I meant it as a family, as a whole and not to single him out. So kind of more humorous way that we say, you know this. But like, if you want to back off a little bit, you could say, we've reached a new low.

Lindsay McMahon (11:06)

Well, that would be a whole other episode, Michelle. Guys, hit the follow button on the show. We're gonna have to cover this topic. We haven't covered this yet. This is a great one. How we, instead of when we want to say something directly to someone, instead of saying you, we say we, but we actually mean you. And it may be possible that it was a little bit of that too. At the same time. I'm not sure. Yeah, but I know I do this. Instead of saying you, I'll say oh, we. Because I'm trying to soften it a little bit.

Michelle Kaplan (11:33)

Yeah, yeah, it's interesting. You're. You're trying to shift it a little bit so it's not so direct. So very interesting there. Yeah, we'll definitely have to call it. Cover that. Guys, hit follow.

Lindsay McMahon (11:42)

Yeah, it's going to be a great year, guys. So make sure you're following the show and we'll follow up with that episode pretty soon.

Michelle Kaplan (11:48)

Yep.

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Lindsay McMahon (12:22)

All right, Michelle, so where to for here? From here, what else would. If you want to convey this idea, what else could you say?

Michelle Kaplan (12:31)

Yeah, so in a similar expression would be to stoop to a new level or a new low.

Lindsay McMahon (12:38)

Right? Okay.

Michelle Kaplan (12:39)

Yes, stoop. All right, so go down. So for example, when she started personal insults, she really stooped to a new level. Or you could say to a new low.

Lindsay McMahon (12:50)

Right. So you kind of cross a line and now things get really bad. Right? Yep. And this isn't really about playing, playing with someone or being sarcastic. This is just directly like, you've gotten really bad.

Michelle Kaplan (13:03)

Yes, yes, yes.

Lindsay McMahon (13:05)

Or I stooped to a new low when I spilled wine all over my boss. Now this is tricky because you didn't do it on purpose, right?

Michelle Kaplan (13:11)

Yeah, yeah.

Lindsay McMahon (13:12)

But you're just kind of saying like, I, I got even more accident prone. Maybe. You're very clumsy.

Michelle Kaplan (13:19)

Right, Right. So this might be in more of a. You're self deprecating, you know. Oh my gosh, I really stooped to a new low.

Lindsay McMahon (13:27)

Yeah, it's. It's a little bit playful. It is. The way it's being used is kind of playing around with the words. Right?

Michelle Kaplan (13:34)

Yeah, yeah. So that's interesting. Here's another one. To have outdone oneself. So this is, you know, really kind of in the sarcastic way. So it's like to. To gone even more than in the past. You're like, you've gone really far. So for example, I think this place has hit a downwards. Oh, wait. Nope, I'm in the wrong one. I didn't think I could be any more irritated at him, but he's outdone himself this time. So.

Lindsay McMahon (14:03)

Yeah, yeah, he's gone further than you thought he could even go.

Michelle Kaplan (14:06)

Right. Yes. Yeah.

Lindsay McMahon (14:08)

Or, oh, no, I burnt the cookies. I've outdone myself.

Michelle Kaplan (14:11)

Yeah.

Lindsay McMahon (14:12)

Although I think I've heard this used though, in a genuine way. Like if someone makes a really good dessert. Oh, you've outdone yourself. This is the best dessert I've ever tasted from you.

Michelle Kaplan (14:23)

Right, Right. So it could be used in more of a genuine, positive way. And depending on the tone and the context, it could also be used in kind of a teasing way. So here you're being self deprecating. I've outdone myself. Like, I've outdone myself this time. Like, oh, last time I dropped it on the floor, this time I burnt them. Oh, gosh. You know.

Lindsay McMahon (14:45)

Wow. This is a very high level episode. I love it. It's because we're trying to figure out which deliveries are genuine sarcastic, teasing or direct. Right. And there's so much nuance here because there's context, there's vocabulary, there's personal history between you and the person. Wow, there's a lot here.

Michelle Kaplan (15:02)

There is a lot.

Lindsay McMahon (15:04)

What's another one, Michelle?

Michelle Kaplan (15:05)

One more Last one we'll do is to hit a downward spiral. This is about go. You know, think of an actual spiral. You're going down. I think this place has hit a downward spiral. It's probably going to close. Yeah. So this is a more serious context. But what about the next. The next example?

Lindsay McMahon (15:26)

Okay, here's the next one. Okay. My shoe choice has hit a downward spiral. Will you go shopping with me this weekend? So here I'm making fun of myself.

Michelle Kaplan (15:34)

Right.

Lindsay McMahon (15:34)

Yes. I am just saying I have just lost my taste in shoes. I don't know what to do. It's okay to make fun of yourself pretty much any time. Right. Especially if you're asking for help.

Michelle Kaplan (15:45)

Exactly. And you could have said, okay, my shoe choice has reached a new low. Right. So. So you could use that as well. But, yeah, it's. I would say that's true for my shoes, actually.

Lindsay McMahon (15:59)

Are things getting worse when it comes to shoes for you, Michelle?

Michelle Kaplan (16:01)

It's not getting worse. It's just that there is. I realize. I only realize in certain. Certain situations, like, oh, I don't have shoes for this. This occasion. I don't have anything. And, you know, so. But I don't realize it until it's that moment.

Lindsay McMahon (16:17)

It's the moment before you gotta leave. Yeah. Walk out the door. I get it. I get it. Yeah.

Michelle Kaplan (16:21)

Yeah.

Lindsay McMahon (16:21)

Shoe shopping is hard. I mean, if your feet don't fit most shoes, it can be really challenging. For sure. I've been trying to buy a pair of boots for the last, like, three winters, and I just give up. Every time I just say, I'll just wear shoes in the snow.

Michelle Kaplan (16:33)

You sound.

Lindsay McMahon (16:34)

That's the sound.

Michelle Kaplan (16:34)

So me, like, I. I would totally do the same thing.

Lindsay McMahon (16:38)

I just give up. All right, we have a great role play planned for our listeners today, Michelle.

Michelle Kaplan (16:42)

Let's do it.

Lindsay McMahon (16:43)

So what's our scenario here?

Michelle Kaplan (16:45)

All right, so here we are, best friends, and we are looking at Instagram together.

Lindsay McMahon (16:50)

Okay. All right, here we go. Okay, here we go.

Michelle Kaplan (16:53)

Oh, geez. My time limit came up. Meaning we've been doing this for two hours.

Lindsay McMahon (16:57)

Yikes. Okay, we've hit a new low, definitely.

Michelle Kaplan (17:01)

But I actually think we hit a downward spiral back when we started looking up fashion pictures.

Lindsay McMahon (17:06)

Oh, yes. Also, that's when I realized my fashion sense has stooped to a new level. We should go shopping.

Michelle Kaplan (17:15)

Yes. But not at the mall. It's not nice anymore.

Lindsay McMahon (17:18)

You're right. It was getting bad. But now that terrible store that opened has outdone itself.

Michelle Kaplan (17:23)

Definitely.

Lindsay McMahon (17:24)

Yeah. That's a good example, because and everyone on this podcast can probably relate to this feeling of as you get sucked into social media, that you. There's always a moment where you realize what's happening and you've hit a new. Sometimes you've hit a new low. Right. Because you've been there for a couple hours and you're just scrolling and scrolling and scrolling.

Michelle Kaplan (17:45)

It's terrible. And, yeah, sometimes, like, for example, I have an alert come up on my phone when I've been on. But every. Yeah, it would be good if I paid attention to it, but it's just. So I just turned it away. Okay.

Lindsay McMahon (17:58)

I usually I just fill my feed with, like, dog videos, like border collies and huskies and things, and those are less harmful for me, I guess. But. But it's still really. It just. It feels icky, just the scrolling, you know, and everyone knows exactly what we're talking about. Yeah, that is a new. That's a great example of this. So it's a great way to encapsulate this. This phrase. So basically I said, yikes, we've hit a new low. When I realized. When you said we had been on for two hours scrolling.

Michelle Kaplan (18:27)

And then I said, definitely. But I actually think we hit a downward spiral back when we started looking up fashion pictures. So, like, downward spiral, it's like it got worse and worse and worse. So I'm saying the start of that was not. Now that we've reached two hours. Yeah, it's bad. But it was an hour ago when we started looking at fashion pictures that we couldn't stop.

Lindsay McMahon (18:50)

And it's funny how the technology just facilitates that, because if you click on one thing, the algorithm learns that you want that and gives you more of that. So you go down that rabbit hole. Right. So it really becomes a downward spiral, literally created by technology. Interesting, right? Yeah. And then I said, oh, yes. Also, that's when I realized my fashion sense has stooped to a new low. Right. So. Meaning it's never been this bad.

Michelle Kaplan (19:16)

Yeah, yeah, exactly. And then you said, we should go shopping, and then we were talking about the mall, but it's not nice at the mall. So as you said, it was getting. It was getting bad, but now that terrible store that opened has outdone itself. So it's even worse.

Lindsay McMahon (19:33)

Worse. Even worse. Oh, my gosh, Michelle, this has been an interesting episode. I think our listeners are really going to want to gain this skill of sensing. When is it okay to say something sarcastic to whom and when do we need to be more direct? Right.

Michelle Kaplan (19:46)

Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. There's all. There are a lot of layers to this episode. There's more than just, oh, here are the expressions. Right? There's really a lot here. Personal relationships, using it seriously or in more of a comical way. A lot, a lot of layers that you have to think about when you're using these expressions. So I would say that's the takeaway for today. You know, really consider who to like, to whom you're talking to and what you're trying to say. And then. Yeah, and give it a go. Also, head on over to episode 2530 that was given versus give up in English like Lindsay gives up every year on her booths.

Lindsay McMahon (20:27)

Exactly, Michelle. All right, guys, and don't forget to leave us a review. Wherever you're listening, whether it's in the app or in the podcast, leave us a review and rating. Let us know what you think about the show. All right, Michelle, good stuff today. I will talk to you very soon back here on the podcast.

Michelle Kaplan (20:42)

All right, bye, Lindsay. Bye, guys.

Lindsay McMahon (20:44)

Okay, bye. Thanks for listening. To all ears. English. Would you like to know your English level? Take our two minute quiz. Go to allearsenglish.com fluencyscore and if you believe in connection, not perfection, then hit subscribe now to make sure you don't miss anything. See you next time.

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