← All Of It with Alison Stewart
All Of It with Alison Stewart
A History of Black Craft
00:23:57
Robell Awake is a designer, chairmaker, researcher, and educator.
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- [00:00]
Alison Stewart
All of it is supported by Progressive Insurance. You chose to hit play on this podcast today. Smart Choice. Make another smart choice with Auto Quote Explorer to compare rates for multiple car insurance companies all at once. Try it@progressive.com Progressive Casualty Insurance Company and affiliates not available in all states or situations. Prices vary based on how you buy.
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Robel Oweka
Listener supported WNYC Studios.
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Alison Stewart
This is all of it on wnyc. I'm Alison Stewart. Every object or design has a Story. A new book tells the stories of black craftsmakers who have been historically underappreciated. This includes Ann Lowe, who created Jacqueline Kennedy's wedding dress from scratch. Ironworker Philip Simmons, whose gates you can still see around Charleston today. And also how in enslaved Africans influence a now common feature in American homes, the front porch. Robella Weka is a designer, chairmaker, researcher, and author of the book A Short History of black craft in 10 objects. The book is out today. Rebelle is with me now. Happy pub Day.
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Robel Oweka
Thank you so much. I'm excited to be here.
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Alison Stewart
The book starts about an essay that you discovered by historian James Newton. You describe yourself as being stunned by what you read. What was it about the essay and why did you react that way?
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Robel Oweka
Yeah, I think. Well, what really struck me about the essay was that, and this essay was written, I believe, in the 70s was that I'd been working for most of my life in the trades. Started out as a carpenter. I welded for a couple years, and 10 years ago I got into making furniture. And, you know, I. It was very hard for me to find stories of black craftspeople just because as I got into furniture making, the field got a lot less diverse than the trades. And I knew there had to be a story there. Typically, you know, when a profession is so racialized, there's usually a story of exclusion there. And I just didn't know the extent to how outsize the role of black craftspeople was pre Civil War.
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Alison Stewart
How did it, how did the. You. The essay and your. The way you reacted to it affect your research or change how you thought about it?
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Robel Oweka
Yeah, so I think it really, it really lit a fire for me to just. To really do the research. Not only do the research, but I think it's. It kind of sustained me in pursuing my craft. You know, it's hard when you're. When you don't feel represented in a field that you're kind of pursuing. It's hard to keep going. It's hard to kind of sustain that interest when you don't feel like super connected to the community. Around it. And I think these stories kind of became my community in a way.
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Alison Stewart
Your book deals with what is called material culture. What does that mean?
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Robel Oweka
Yeah, I mean, it's just a fancy way to say objects of the past, basically. Yeah, it's like an academic way to say that. Um, but, yeah, you know, the things that people made and used on a.
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Alison Stewart
Daily basis, how can material culture, the fancy way you say that, how can it be a unique window into understanding the past?
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Robel Oweka
Yeah, I think, you know, one example in the book how it can be a very direct way of telling a story is the story quilts of Harriet Powers, where, you know, each quilt square was kind of its own narrative, and they depicted either biblical scenes or, you know, natural. Natural phenomena that she was interested in. And so it can. It can tell overt stories, but it can also tell kind of like meta stories about, you know, a time and a place. And I think something that I'm trying. I was trying to do with the book is like, you know, I'm not an academic. I'm a craftsperson. You know, I work. I make things for a living. So I think, you know, like, I'm trying to interpret these objects, understanding how materials kind of work and. And how to work them, and hopefully, you know, I can kind of like decipher the language, craft as. As a maker.
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Alison Stewart
Yeah. Harriet Powers, she was a folk artist, a quilter. She was born to slavery in Georgia in 1837. And in one of the quilts she. You talk about, she depicts an astronomical event that occurred. What happened, and why was it significant to the black population in the American South?
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Robel Oweka
Good question. Yeah. So her central square of her pictorial quilt, which is now housed at the Museum of Fine Arts in Boston, she completed it around 1898. That central square depicts the Leonid meteor shower of 1833, which happened before Harriet was even born, which is significant because it's a testament to how strong oral tradition was in black communities at this time still to this day, and how that the story of the Leonid meteor shower, it became a. A time fixing device, a way for people to kind of like, you know, kind of position things in time, like when things happened in this time period. But it was seen when it happened. You could see it. It happens every 33 years. And depending on where you are on the planet, you can see an amazing shower of falling stars. And in 1833, you could basically see it anywhere in the United States and in the South. When it happened around midnight, it was seen by a lot of enslaved folks as judgment day or the rapture or some kind of, like, harbinger of better days to come. And, you know, the fact that I never learned the significance of this event that was very significant to enslaved communities, and that I was. I was taught this through her quilt, and that the quilt is still teaching somebody like me till this day was pretty. You know, it was pretty profound for me.
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Alison Stewart
Yeah, you had to think about those times. Enslaved Africans and African Americans. It was illegal in the south to read or to learn to write. How have the objects, how they prove to be a valuable tool in passing down knowledge from generations to generations?
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Robel Oweka
Yeah, I think even, you know, that. Harriet Powers, quilts aside, you know, objects are a way to, I think, just kind of embody people in a place, you know. You know, like you said, like, you know, objects, it has a story, whether it's telling one directly in, like, a story quilt or just the materials that were used tell the story of place. And the methods used to create something also tell a different kind of story. So, yeah, they can be. Objects can be very, very informative.
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Alison Stewart
My guest is Robel Oweka. He's a designer, cheer maker, researcher, and educator. We're speaking about his new book, a Short History of black craft in 10 objects. Visitors to the Metropolitan Museum of Art will remember an exhibition about black potters in Edgefield, South. Carol, we covered it on the show. And you write about the story of Edgefield potters in the book. What designs are the potters from Edgefield most known for?
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Robel Oweka
Yeah, so Edgefield is known for its face jugs. It's also known for Dave the potter, who was an incredible potter from Edgefield who was enslaved and who made these giant vessels, and he would inscribe poetry on these vessels. And. And. But a lot of people really know Edgefield for face jugs, which are small, smaller vessels that have faces sculpted on them. And what's really interesting about this tradition is that, you know, the. There was a slave ship called the Wanderer, which traveled to America after the transatlantic slave trade was abolished, as a lot of vessels still did carry captive, enslaved Africans to America. And that most of its cargo, most of the people on this ship, wound up in Edgefield, South Carolina, and they hailed from what is now the Congo region. And that region has this tradition of vessels, wooden vessels, but they're called menkisi. They're these power figures. And these vessels are filled with herbs or different objects, depending on what it was. Kind of like a talismanic object to either, you know, bring some sort of good fortune or to ward off evil. Spirits. And those vessels are now seen as sort of these newly arrived enslaved Africans coming into Edgefield and reinvigorating the community, the African American community there with kind of renewed African spiritual traditions. And then this incredible art form just flourished towards the end of the 19th century in the pottery industry in Edgefield.
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Alison Stewart
We're talking about the book A Short History of black craft in 10 objects with rebel Oweke, the designer and the author of the book. We'll have more after a quick break. This is all of it. Here's a way you can support WNYC in our centennial year. Donate your used car. We'll turn your old car into the news and conversation that we've been serving to the community for over 100 years. Many listeners have already donated their cars to WNYC. It's an easy way to support the station and you'll get a tax deduction. Learn more@wnyc.org car.
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Robel Oweka
This week on the New Yorker Radio Hour, Bill Gates on dinner at Mar a Lago. President Trump is going to make a lot of policy decisions and I would say the range of possibilities in many areas has never been as broad. Bill Gates on the politics of technology in 2025. That's the new Yorker Radio Hour from WNYC Studios. Listen wherever you get your podcast.
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Alison Stewart
This is all of it on wnyc. I'm Alison Stewart. My guest is Robel Oeka, designer, chairmaker, researcher and author of the new book A Short History of black craft in 10 objects. Before we get back to the objects, I want to ask about you. When did you first become interested in craft work?
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Robel Oweka
Yeah, so I think it was through trade work and through working construction. You know, I dropped out of college and it just wasn't for me. And you know, I wanted to work with my hands and I did. And you know, I think I, I ended up getting more interested in Furniture about 10 years ago and largely self taught. The only real formal, you know, training I had was a two week workshop at the North Bennett Street School, which is a craft school in Boston. And it was there that I kind of learned how to use traditional hand tools. And then from there I was just kind of, you know, really often trying to, you know, for the just make things and push my skill set. And a few years ago I got really into chair making and that's kind of, kind of what I do now. And the type of woodworking that I do is called green woodworking. So I start from a log and I split the log and process all my parts. And I primarily Use hand tools to make my chairs.
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Alison Stewart
How does your skill, your self taught skill, how did it help you in the research for this book? Being a craftsperson?
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Robel Oweka
A lot, A lot. I think it also just speaks to the journey of a lot of black craftspeople being self taught. I think it's way easier for me, you know, given that there's YouTube and books and like so much information out there for me to access. It makes it easier to kind of like be an autodidact or whatever. But I think back then it was a lot more difficult, you know, and so many folks really did figure things out on their own. And I think a lot of that also led to very unique styles and very unique work.
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Alison Stewart
All right, we'll talk about from one chair maker to another chair maker. Richard Pyron chairs. He has a mule eared ladderback chair. How are his chairs unique?
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Robel Oweka
Yeah, so Richard Poynter was one of the first stories that I really delved into because I'm interested in chairs. I make chairs. And he was a chair maker from central Tennessee operating in the early to mid to late 19th century. And he took a very rustic Appalachian style of chair just called a ladderback. It looks like what it sounds like. The back looks like a ladder. And typically farmers made these chairs in the off season, in the winter months to supplement their income. But he really refined the style and made it elegant and a lot more comfortable through a few design tweets. And also he was skilled enough to assemble his chairs without any fasteners or glue. So no screws, no nails, no glue, which, which a lot of chair makers in this time made their chairs that way because glue was harder to come by. Nails were expensive, and if you had a good understanding of wood, you could, you could pull it off. But you did have to be highly skilled to do it.
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Alison Stewart
I also want to point out there are beautiful illustrations in your book.
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Robel Oweka
Yes.
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Alison Stewart
Tell us a little bit about the illustrator.
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Robel Oweka
Yeah. Jonalyn Holland, incredible illustrator. She, you know, that was, it was so fun working with her and just meeting regularly and, you know, sharing these stories and, and you know, she just kind of like took the stories and ran with it and, and just, just couldn't be happier. Amazing artist.
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Alison Stewart
As you were thinking about this book, it's just 10 objects.
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Robel Oweka
Yeah.
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Alison Stewart
How did you decide which 10 objects?
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Robel Oweka
It was hard. It was hard. And I think like, that's why I, I wanted it to be clear, like this is a history, a short history, one of what should be hundreds, thousands of, you know, history to tell these Stories and. Yeah, it was hard. I mean, I think it was just the things that I was interested in at the moment. You know, like I'm. I'm always constantly doing research, even before the book, just because it fuels my own practice. Like things that I make, you know, even, you know, before the book, like, I made a chair that was inspired by Harriet Powers quilt square depicting the Leonid meteor shower. So, you know, it's. It's. I. I think that I would love to see, you know, people carry this on and, and write their own, you know, histories of. Of craft, of black craft.
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Alison Stewart
We got a question and I'll pose it to you. This is from a text. I work as an archivist and I'm always eager to hear about people's research practices, particularly in marginalized topics and cultures. What did you notice when doing the research and how was that experience?
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Robel Oweka
It was very informative because so much of the research came from oral history folklorists self published. You know, I'm thinking of particularly. There's a chapter on the sweetgrass baskets of the low country and the Gullah Geechee tradition of sweet bass, sweetgrass basketry. And there's a book by Joyce V. Coakley, who was a Low country native who self published a book with incredible photo from just kind of like her family and community and telling the story of how that tradition started, how it kind of migrated to the side of the road where there was a scene of a bunch of different basket makers and there was a community there. And it just really informed kind of my understanding. So, yeah, a lot of people, you know, this work has. People have been doing this work and keeping these stories alive. And, you know, and a lot of times it's not in academia, it's not really in the formal archive.
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Alison Stewart
So I want to ask you a little more about the Gullah Geechee sweet baskets, sweet grass baskets. What was the original purpose of the sweet grass baskets?
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Robel Oweka
Yeah, in rice production. You know, the low country back in the day was Charleston was, I think, at a certain point, the wealthiest city in America because of rice production. And these baskets were used to separate the GR from the husks, the rice from the husks. And it eventually evolved into decorative baskets that Gullah people were selling to tourists.
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Alison Stewart
You know, if you go there, you can buy one right on the street.
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Robel Oweka
Yes. Yeah.
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Alison Stewart
Why do you consider sweetgrass baskets an art form?
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Robel Oweka
Yeah, I mean, I think that. I think that. I think before there was like, you know, what we think of as the art world or a speculative art market, there was Craft, that's what it was. That's how everyday people express creativity, you know, expressed brilliance. And I think, like, it's. I am just trying to show that, like this, these, what some can write off as domestic objects, like quilts and like baskets, took a high level of just skill and creativity and that it's art to me, you know, we're gonna.
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Alison Stewart
Stay in Charleston, South Carolina, with Philip Simmons, who you describe as America's 20th century blacksmith laureate. What made his, his ironwork so special?
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Robel Oweka
Yeah, he was an incredible blacksmith. He was a 20th century blacksmith. So this is in a time where arc welding had been invented. So, you know, welding metal together was replacing, you know, using a hammer and anvil and doing it the, the old fashioned way, you know, making things out of wrought iron. And he carried on the Charleston tradition of just, you know, beautiful decorative gates and window grills. And he was working up until the early 2000s for, I think, nearly eight decades. You know, he started when he was a teenager, when he was 13. But he took the, the Charleston style of kind of like really ornate scroll work and added, you know, features from his childhood, you know, low country animals, like, like egrets, like these birds and palmetto trees and things like that. So he really put his own stamp kind of on the local style.
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Alison Stewart
One common feature of many American homes is the front porch. And you argue it's directly tied to enslaved Africans. How so?
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Robel Oweka
Yeah, so in kind of in two ways. You know, the oldest evidence of a front porch is on an enslaved dwelling at Kings Mill Plantation in Virginia. And there's also the history of the shotgun home, and it's always associated front porch, which was popularized by Haitian immigrants after the Haitian Revolution. Free people of color coming into New Orleans. And the shotgun home and the front porch associated with it spread throughout the south and just became, you know, the easiest way for poor and working class people to house themselves all throughout the South. And that feature of the front porch just kind of spread in that way too. It was kind of coming from both sides and in different ways. But, you know, the. There were two scholars, James Dietz, who was an archaeologist, and John Michael Vlach, who was a cultural anthropologist, who in the 70s were, were the ones who were really pointing out the connections to West African residential architecture and the ways in which it came through New Orleans and from Virginia into America.
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Alison Stewart
We're going to end on a New York story about Ann Lowe, a third generation dressmaker who designed one of the most famous dresses in American modern history. Jacqueline Bouvier's Wedding dress. How did Ann Lowe get her start in fashion?
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Robel Oweka
So Ann Lowe was a third generation seamstress from Alabama and she was, I mean, basically destined to make dresses. She was sewing when she was 5, she was cutting her own patterns at 10. And at some point in her 20s, she went to fashion school in New York, encountered a lot of racism, made to take classes in a separate room, and eventually would wind up living in New York and running a couture dress shop on Madison Avenue. Mid century. And she also such a fascinating story. She reported on the first fashion week in Paris, was sent there by, I think the New York World newspaper. And when she got there, Christian Dior met her and told her that he was a fan. And you know, she, she was very well known in kind of elite upper crust society in New York. She made dresses for the Roosevelts and the Rockefellers and of course made Jacqueline Kennedy's famous wedding day dress.
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Alison Stewart
I read in your book that because of a pipe burst, she had to remake the dress in 10 days. Did she get it done? Yes, she got it done. But how did she get it done?
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Robel Oweka
She got it done. And not only did she get it done, but she had to take a train to deliver the dresses just because it was getting last minute. She had to work on it till the very last second. And when she got there, she was asked to take the back door. They didn't want her to go through the front. And she threatened to turn around and get back on the train with all of the dresses if they didn't let her in the front. And she went through that front door.
- [23:19]
Alison Stewart
I'm so glad she did. You know, if someone's interested in seeing more of your work, where can they go for more information after they've heard this and they wanted to see your work as a chair maker, where can they go?
- [23:33]
Robel Oweka
Yeah, I have a website. You know, I'm on Instagram. My name, Robel Owaka. The last name is spelled like awake, A W A K E and Robelle is R O B E L L. But I also have a solo show coming up in April, April 18th in Chicago at Volume Gallery. And I had a couple pieces that were just acquired by the Art Institute of Chicago. Two chairs. And then I have a commission coming up for the Baltimore Museum of Art. So excited about that.
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Alison Stewart
How do you hope this book changes how we appreciate the designs and objects that we interact with on a daily basis?
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Robel Oweka
Yeah, I mean, I think there's two things I would love for people to take from this. One is that like you know, black folks were not just the recipients of technology and innovation, but oftentimes were the bearers of it. And also that, you know, I think in this day and age when we're so kind of alienated from doing this type of work, hand work, I hope it's an invitation to maybe try and pursue working with your hands, even if it's just a hobby. Because, you know, we've been making the things that we need for our lives longer than we haven't, you know, for millennia, really. And I think there's this kind of innate thing in us to make things that we interact with and live with. And we need to tap back into that.
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Alison Stewart
The name of the book is A Short History of black craft in 10 objects. It's by Rebel Oweke. It is really nice to meet you. Thanks so much for being a guest on the show.
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Robel Oweka
So nice to meet you. Thanks for having me.
- [25:03]
Alison Stewart
Tomorrow we'll speak with Ira Madison iii. He's a culture critic and co host of the Keep it podcast. Now, he's written a book of essays that blend memoir and pop culture. It's called Pure Innocent Fun. He'll join me in studio. And that is it for all of it. I'm Alison Stewart. I appreciate you listening and I appreciate you. I will meet you back here next time. Our state has changed a lot in the last 140 years. We know because Multicare has been here guided by a single making our communities healthier. That comes from making courageous decisions, partnering with local communities to grow programs and services, and expanding healthcare access to those who need it most. Together, we're building a healthier future.
- [25:55]
Robel Oweka
Learn more@mycare.org this is Ira Flato, host of Science Friday. For over 30 years, the science Friday team has been reporting high quality science and technology technology news, making science fun for curious people by covering everything from the outer reaches of space to the rapidly changing world of AI to the tiniest microbes in our bodies. Audiences trust our show because they know we're driven by a mission to inform and serve listeners first and foremost with important news they won't get anywhere else. And our sponsors benefit from that halo effect. For more information on becoming a sponsor, visit sponsorship.wnyc.org.