Podcast Summary: All Of It with Alison Stewart

Episode: Actor Dylan O'Brien and Writer-Director James Sweeney Star in 'Twinless'
Air Date: September 10, 2025

Overview of the Episode

Host Alison Stewart sits down with actor Dylan O'Brien and writer-director-actor James Sweeney to discuss their new indie film "Twinless." The film explores grief, friendship, identity, and loneliness through the story of two very different men who meet in a support group for people who have lost a twin. O'Brien plays twins Rocky and Roman, while Sweeney stars as Dennis. The conversation dives into the inspiration behind the film, the casting and creative process, character development, and the themes the film seeks to unravel.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Inspiration for "Twinless" and the Fascination with Twins

• James Sweeney, not a twin himself, explains his long-term fascination with twin relationships:

  "I always wanted a twin... I did date an identical twin in my 20s and wrote the first draft shortly after he broke up with me. But I think the fascination with twins came from a place of seeing twins imprinted in my cultural landscape. From Mary-Kate and Ashley Olsen to Sister, Sister... it encapsulated the idea of the perfect best friend."
  — James Sweeney (01:44)

2. First Encounter with the Script

• Dylan O’Brien describes reading the script at home in Los Angeles and being captivated by the complete, emotionally vibrant story:

  "I just was immediately so taken by it. It was such a complete script. It was such a wild ride. I really felt like I understood the humor in the voice overall, but just loved that and was really struck by the emotional through-line."
  — Dylan O’Brien (02:55)

• O'Brien confirms he read it in one sitting:

  "Yeah, I devoured it... I couldn't put it down, you know, I absolutely devoured it, choked it down, and then couldn't wait to see who this guy was."
  — Dylan O’Brien (03:54)

3. Casting O’Brien as Rocky and Roman

• Sweeney’s background in casting helped him see past typecasting in choosing O’Brien:

  "I used to work in casting... really the thing that was sort of the 'yes' was just meeting him and seeing what kind of person he was... I was looking for a partner in crime, and he turned out to be all that and more."
  — James Sweeney (04:28)

4. Craft of Casting & Talent Subjectivity

• Sweeney reflects on lessons from casting:

  "It doesn't matter how good an actor is or how maybe not good an actor you might think they are. If they are right for the part, they are right for the part. Talent is... a lot more subjective than that."
  — James Sweeney (05:34)

5. Research and Authenticity in Portraying Twins

• O’Brien did not immerse himself in support groups, focusing instead on the universality of grief:

  "It might be unpopular to say, not a ton. The themes in this film are entirely universal, as well as also being obviously such a fundamentally unique experience and type of loss on this earth... the universal themes of humanity... really resonated with me."
  — Dylan O’Brien (06:42)

6. Challenges as Writer, Director, and Actor

• Sweeney discusses tension between his director and actor-writer roles, notably regarding a sex scene:

  "As a director, I felt it was very necessary. As an actor, made me a bit self-conscious."
  — James Sweeney (08:23)
  "Those are opposing forces, really."
  — Dylan O’Brien (08:47)

7. Friendship, Masculinity, and Grief

• On the film’s exploration of friendship:

  "These are two people who both carry a lot of shame and regret... while they are so different, I think they are very complimentary... I do think the film explores friendship and masculinity in a very contemporary way."
  — James Sweeney (09:22)

• O’Brien adds:

  "The kind of effortless comfort that they provide each other... the effortlessness in sort of just existing with one another, doing a mundane thing... a signifier of an intimate relationship."
  — Dylan O’Brien (10:04)

8. Loneliness as a Central Theme

• Sweeney on the dangers of loneliness:

  "Loneliness is a killer. The science supports that. What we see in this film is a place where loneliness leads to desperation... love can make you do crazy things."
  — James Sweeney (11:59)

9. Building Two Distinct Twins

• O’Brien on differentiating brothers Roman and Rocky:

  "For Rocky, I really wanted [his appearance] to signify his worldly experiences... versus what we see in his brother, which is a lot more stunted... the insecurity that [Roman] feels... in the shadow of his brother."
  — Dylan O’Brien (13:01)

• On avoiding stereotypes:

  "It's a representation of experience on this earth and, like, evolution as a human... Rocky had this fearlessness... some people are quicker to do that than others."
  — Dylan O’Brien (13:51)

10. Director-Actor Collaboration and Trust

• Sweeney on guiding O’Brien’s nuanced performance:

  "The best thing I could do for Dylan was just give him permission and let him know that I trusted him and that he was in safe hands... masculinity and performative femininity exist on a spectrum."
  — James Sweeney (15:00)

• O’Brien appreciates the collaborative process:

  "Communication is so paramount... the thing he said about permission is the greatest gift you can receive from your filmmaker... there's so much to be said for someone who has the confidence to know what they want."
  — Dylan O’Brien (15:53)

11. Long Development and Production (Four Years)

• Sweeney and O’Brien agree that the film’s slow development improved it:

  "Our own friendship parlayed into the chemistry between the characters… letting the themes and the script marinate. There was just a refinement process... all the things that went wrong turned out to be happy accidents."
  — James Sweeney (17:56)

• Notably, all actors in the support group scenes are real twins, adding authenticity (18:15).

12. Constructing Suspense and Editing

• Sweeney on narrative choices:

  "The very first draft of the script was not told with a perspective shift. It was a major revision... the film is like a Jenga puzzle... Everything is connected and intentional."
  — James Sweeney (19:38)

13. Feedback from the Twin Community

• O’Brien describes positive reception from twins who have seen the film:

  "It's been mostly feedback that's been really positive... at least them watching this, knowing that I'm not one myself and being able to take in the story and live in the world and not be bumped or taken out of it by my performance."
  — Dylan O’Brien (21:14)

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On the universal draw of twins:

  "It encapsulated the idea of the perfect best friend. Somebody who wanted to share your clothes and do all the activities you wanted to do."
  — James Sweeney (01:44)

• Actor's delight in script:

  "I couldn't put it down, you know, I absolutely devoured it."
  — Dylan O’Brien (03:54)

• On loneliness:

  "Loneliness is a killer. I think the science supports that."
  — James Sweeney (11:59)

• On authenticity in casting:

  "All the actors in our support group were twins, including the background talent."
  — James Sweeney (18:15)

Important Segment Timestamps

• [01:44] — James Sweeney on the cultural pull of twins
• [02:55] — Dylan O'Brien’s first read-through and reaction to the script
• [04:28] — Why Sweeney saw O’Brien as perfect for the roles
• [05:34] — Casting lessons and talent as subjective
• [06:42] — O’Brien on the limits of research and the universality of grief
• [08:23] — Sweeney discusses director vs. actor decisions
• [09:22] — Sweeney on the heart of Dennis and Roman’s friendship
• [10:04] — O’Brien's view on friendship and comfort between characters
• [11:59] — Sweeney on the film’s exploration of loneliness
• [13:01] — O’Brien on differentiating Rocky and Roman
• [15:00] — Sweeney on trust and identity in performance
• [15:53] — O’Brien on value of communication and creative permission
• [17:56] — Sweeney and O’Brien reflect on the film’s four-year journey
• [18:15] — Decision to cast real twins for support group roles
• [19:38] — Narrative structure and complexity of editing
• [21:14] — Feedback from the real-life twin community

Closing Thoughts

"All Of It" delivers a deep, lively, and insightful conversation with Dylan O'Brien and James Sweeney. The episode tackles creativity, authenticity, and the lived experience of loss through the unique lens of twin relationships—offering a window into both the heart of the film 'Twinless' and the creative minds that brought it to life. The dialogue is warm, humorous, and candid, capturing the mutual respect between guest and host, and between collaborators. Whether you're a film buff or simply intrigued by the complexities of grief and friendship, this episode offers plenty to reflect on.