Podcast Summary: "Celebrate New Jersey Folklore With 'The Devil & Daisy Dirt'"

Podcast: All Of It
Host: Alison Stewart, WNYC
Air Date: September 26, 2024
Guests: Alex Dawson (Writer, Director, Narrator), Dan Deanna (Puppet Designer/Operator), Will Rogers (Host of "Guide to the Unknown" Podcast)

Episode Overview

This episode of All Of It dives into the legend of the Jersey Devil, its cultural legacy, and its reinterpretation in the new stage production, "The Devil & Daisy Dirt." Host Alison Stewart is joined by Alex Dawson (writer, director, and narrator of the show), Dan Deanna (puppet designer and operator), and Will Rogers (paranormal podcast host) for a fascinating discussion about folklore, theater, puppetry, and what it means to be a New Jerseyan.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Legend of the Jersey Devil

• Origins & Popularity:

  • Will Rogers introduces the Jersey Devil as New Jersey’s signature "cryptid," much like Bigfoot or the Loch Ness Monster, but uniquely tied to the state (04:31).
  • The legend traces to a 1735 folk tale: the cursed 13th child of Mother Leeds, who exclaimed, "let this 13th child be a devil." The child transformed into a monster on a stormy night and escaped up the chimney—spawning centuries of reported sightings (05:50).
  • Notable anecdote: Joseph Bonaparte, Napoleon’s brother, is said to have claimed a Jersey Devil sighting—though possibly seeking attention himself (06:45).

• Folklore’s Function:

  • Will highlights how myths swirl around unexplained events, serving as campfire tales and shaping regional identity. The Pine Barrens’ atmosphere intensifies the legend’s grip (04:57).

Quote:
"One of my favorite things about monsters and about folklore is trying to unravel the ‘real stories’ behind it all...there is no easy answer."
— Will Rogers, 04:39

2. From Folklore to Folk Stage: Creating ‘The Devil & Daisy Dirt’

• Show Concept:

  • Alex Dawson clarifies, “it's not exactly a musical...we kind of term it a bluegrass tall tale” (07:16).
  • The story features live music and an eight-foot wearable puppet designed by Dan Deanna. It blends New Jersey gothic with alt-folk, invoking both humor and pathos, and themes of acceptance and otherness.

• Personal & Regional Inspiration:

  • Alex shares Southern roots and rural childhood, steeped in monster stories, witch tales, and country music, linking them with his adopted Jersey home to create a unique voice for the show (08:00-09:40).
  • Inspiration struck at Lucille’s Luncheonette in the Pine Barrens—now transformed, onstage, into the story’s Devil’s Diner.

Quote:
"The monster comes out appearing mythical as opposed to monstrous, and the tale is populated with monsters that are human. Why the Jersey Devil? ...Even though I didn’t grow up in the Pine Barrens, you get deep enough in the woods, the sentiments and the voice are very similar."
— Alex Dawson, 07:22, 08:19

3. The Devil Himself: Puppetry, Design, and Craft

• Origins of the Puppet:

  • Dan and Alex co-created a Halloween haunt called "Catch the Devil" in Alex's backyard, debuting an early, oversized puppet to community acclaim—later developing the idea into a stage show (09:49).
  • The first puppet was simple, made from upholstery foam and PVC. The stage version, built over a month, is more complex with carbon fiber, foam fur, and 3D printed elements. It's worn by Dan using a camping backpack structure (11:17-12:54).

• Puppetry Philosophy and Movement:

  • Influences: Big Bird (Carol Spinney) and the "Life of Pi" Broadway tiger puppet—visibly operated, which inspired acceptance of visible puppeteers for added nuance (11:58).
  • Movement design focused on emotional believability and comfort, with dead-black glossy eyes that convey life through head tilts and slow, animal-like gestures rather than mechanical features (20:41, 23:55).

Quote:
"The thing about the devil puppet itself that is so incredible is that it feels alive. Your movement is so sympathetic and animal-like...alarming and frightening, yes...but there's also such a sweet core to it."
— Will Rogers, 22:30

4. Plot & Thematic Richness of the Show

• Basic Plot:

  • “It’s a Pine Barrens ET,” Alex explains (13:53)—a wounded cryptid replaces the alien, with deer hunters as antagonists and a magical portal above Apple Pie Hill.
  • Set during "I Ate the Devil on Devil Day, October 30th," waitress Daisy Dirt finds a wounded Devil behind Devil’s Diner and seeks to save it, paralleling her own search for dignity and autonomy (13:53-15:21).

• The Devil as Sympathetic Figure:

  • Will Rogers discusses how the show is unique for presenting the Devil as wounded and in need of help, subverting its historic role as pure monster. The parallel with Daisy creates a narrative about empathy for outsiders and misunderstood beings (15:38).

Quote:
"The Devil and Daisy Dirt is the first time that the devil has become a sympathetic sort of hero...the devil is not just a capital V villain."
— Will Rogers, 15:53

5. Atmosphere: The Pine Barrens & Jersey Culture

• Pine Barrens Description:

  • Alex: The Pine Barrens is “a stretch of pinelands...insistently rural, just long sandy roads and tall straight trees for miles...you feel the weight of the pines on you as you drive through it” (18:09-18:57).

• Audience Contributions:

  • Multiple listeners text in with personal folklore stories and encounters, highlighting the legend’s enduring power in Jersey culture (17:18, 25:54).
  • Playful banter about a Jersey Devil with a bell collar (26:06).

6. Music, Performance, and Future Plans

• Music:

  • Live 'alt-folk' music is integral, with evocative lyrics about hunger, strangeness, and longing heard throughout (19:33-20:20, 27:49).

• Audience Response:

  • Will Rogers recounts his young daughter’s gentle fascination with the puppet, illustrating its surprisingly accessible and endearing qualities (23:38).

• Touring & Show Plans:

  • While initially designed as a limited run, Alex reveals plans for barn, brewery, and possibly international performances, aiming for "places Tom Waits might play if he was a nobody" (26:28).

Quote:
"We are touring with this. We’re doing a really cool brewery in New Jersey that's in an old barn on a farm...hoping to take this thing to Paris, to Dublin and a tour of the deep South...we’ll hopefully be coming to a town or a patch of pineland close to you."
— Alex Dawson, 26:28

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Jersey Devil Origin:
  • "Be careful what you wish for." — Will Rogers, 05:51
• On Puppetry:
  • "We had all these different eye designs and maybe light up stuff and smoke coming from the inside of the skull and then reality hits...so we make the eyes glossy and black. Right. Like a doll’s eye." — Dan Deanna, 22:26
• Accolade for Movement:
  • "It has all to do with how Dan swings the head, because the expression on the puppet, you think it's changing, but it never changes...evoking the same sort of sympathy and the same sort of empathy...like ET." — Alex Dawson, 24:04
• Audience Call-In:
  • “...couldn’t quite see him, but he was like a shadow and moved fast. Only time I’ve been scared.” — Listener Tom, 25:54

Timestamps for Key Segments

• Jersey Devil Folklore Origins: 04:31–07:00
• Show Conception & Personal Inspiration: 07:16–09:40
• History of the Haunt Puppet: 09:49–13:17
• Technical Puppet Design: 11:17–13:17, 20:32–22:26
• Plot of "Devil & Daisy Dirt": 13:53–15:21
• Sympathetic Devil—Themes Discussion: 15:38–17:18
• Description of the Pine Barrens: 18:09–18:57
• Music Sample from the Show: 19:33–20:20, 27:49
• Audience Stories & Banter: 17:18–18:02, 25:54–26:17
• Touring Future Plans: 26:28

Tone & Atmosphere

The conversation is warm, communal, and a bit mischievous, full of love for Jersey folklore and pride in creative DIY theater. There’s reverence for the tradition of monster tales—but also a heartfelt interest in empathy and subverting the traditional “monster” narrative. The playful, poetic tone carries through the guests’ anecdotes and the musical excerpts alike.

For more:
Catch "The Devil & Daisy Dirt" during its limited stage run or upcoming regional shows. Stay engaged with Jersey folklore and keep an ear out for more monster tales—both scary and sweet.