Podcast Episode Summary: "Celine Song on Her New Romantic Drama 'Materialists'"

Podcast Information:

• Title: All Of It
• Host: Alison Stewart
• Episode: Celine Song on Her New Romantic Drama 'Materialists'
• Release Date: June 16, 2025
• Duration: Approximately 31 minutes
• Description: In this episode, Alison Stewart interviews Celine Song, the writer and director of "Materialists." They delve into Song's experiences as a matchmaker, the themes of her new film, the casting process, and insights gained from her previous work.

Introduction to Celine Song and "Materialists"

Alison Stewart opens the episode by introducing Celine Song, highlighting her role as the writer and director of the recently released film "Materialists." The film, described as a romantic drama, explores the intricacies of modern dating and the commodification of relationships. Susan Song's background as a matchmaker provides a unique lens through which the story unfolds.

[00:29] Alison Stewart: "Materialist is playing in theaters now. Celine, welcome to the studio."

Celine Song's Journey as a Matchmaker

Celine Song shares her unconventional path to becoming a filmmaker, revealing that she worked as a matchmaker for six months in her twenties. This experience profoundly influenced her understanding of human relationships and served as the inspiration for "Materialists."

[02:44] Celine Song: "I learned more about people in those six months than I did in any other part of my life."

Key Insights:

• Pragmatic Matchmaking: Song likens matchmaking to being a "stockbroker for stock," emphasizing the transactional nature of relationships based on metrics like height, income, and age.
• Emotional Disconnect: Despite the numerical matching, Song found that authentic love transcends these superficial criteria.

[03:52] Celine Song: "The way that love feels... seems to have nothing to do with any of these numbers or even feeling valuable."

Exploring Themes in "Materialists"

"Materialists" delves into themes of objectification, commodification, and the emotional complexities of modern romance. The film questions whether love is influenced more by personal feelings or external conditions.

Notable Themes Discussed:

• Commodification of Self: The film portrays individuals as commodities in a global dating market, accessible through smartphones and dating apps.

  [05:42] Celine Song: "Turning ourselves into merchandise... is now immigrated into the phone."

• Market Language in Dating: The portrayal of dating using market terminology underscores the transactional aspect of modern relationships.

  [06:00] Celine Song: "Our language about dating is now inseparable from the way we talk about the dating market."

Character Analysis: Lucy

Lucy, the protagonist of "Materialists," embodies the conflict between professional matchmaking and personal desires. As a matchmaker, she is adept at pairing clients but struggles with her own relationships.

Key Points:

• Detachment from Love: Initially, Lucy prefers to focus on her clients' love lives rather than her own, representing the emotional detachment often seen in professional settings.

  [09:42] Celine Song: "She prefers to not deal in it [love], and she's outsourcing anything she might want from it into her clients."

• Personal Arc: Throughout the film, Lucy grapples with her beliefs about love and marriage, questioning their worth and longevity.

  [09:03] Celine Song: "She has real trouble with [love] because she's not sure if it is worth the difficulty or the pain."

Casting Process and Collaborations

Celine Song discusses her approach to casting, drawing parallels between her role as a writer and a matchmaker. She emphasizes the importance of finding actors who resonate deeply with their characters.

Highlights:

• Collaborative Casting: Song describes the casting process as a form of matchmaking, seeking actors who naturally align with the characters they are set to portray.

  [19:03] Celine Song: "I don't write for actors... I go out like a matchmaker in search of their soulmate."

• Actor Contributions: She mentions that actors like Dakota Johnson contributed creatively, even pitching lines that were incorporated into the film.

  [21:12] Celine Song: "There are a couple of jokes that Dakota pitched that were so good that are now in the movie."

From "Past Lives" to "Materialists": Lessons Learned

Transitioning from her previous work, "Past Lives," Celine Song reflects on the lessons that informed "Materialists." Her experience in filmmaking has deepened her understanding of universal themes, particularly love.

Key Learnings:

• Universal Theme of Love: Song asserts that love is a universally relatable subject, essential to human experience and worthy of cinematic exploration.

  [26:16] Celine Song: "The theme of love is completely universal and that it is entirely worthy of cinema."

• Process Over Product: She emphasizes the importance of the creative process, viewing the journey of making a film as integral to the art itself.

  [26:16] Celine Song: "The making of it, the process of it is the art."

Personal and Professional Synergy

Celine Song discusses the interplay between her personal life and professional endeavors, particularly her collaborative relationship with her husband, Justin Kerbus.

Insights:

• Mutual Support: Both Song and Kerbus, a writer himself, provide critical feedback on each other's drafts, fostering a supportive creative environment.

  [29:39] Celine Song: "He reads my first drafts. And I read his first drafts."

• Blending Roles: Their relationship seamlessly integrates personal and professional aspects without compromising their individual creative processes.

  [30:02] Celine Song: "We have to be brutal with each other the way that we are brutal with ourselves."

Conclusion

In this insightful episode, Celine Song offers a profound exploration of modern relationships through her latest film, "Materialists." Drawing from her unique experience as a matchmaker, she crafts a narrative that scrutinizes the commodification of love in today's digital age. Her discussions shed light on the delicate balance between professional detachment and personal vulnerability, making "Materialists" a compelling addition to contemporary romantic dramas.

[30:49] Alison Stewart: "The name of the film is Materialist. I've been speaking with this writer and director, Celine Song. Thank you for coming to the studio."

Notable Quotes:

• On Learning as a Matchmaker:

  [02:48] Celine Song: "I think that so much of the conversation ended up being about the numbers, the height, weight, income, age."

• On Commodification in Dating:

  [05:42] Celine Song: "Turning ourselves into merchandise... is now immigrated into the phone."

• On Universal Themes:

  [26:16] Celine Song: "The theme of love is completely universal and that it is entirely worthy of cinema."

• On the Creative Process:

  [26:16] Celine Song: "The making of it, the process of it is the art."

This detailed summary captures the essence of the conversation between Alison Stewart and Celine Song, highlighting the key discussions, insights, and thematic explorations surrounding the film "Materialists." For listeners seeking an in-depth understanding without tuning into the episode, this summary offers a comprehensive overview of the pivotal moments and ideas shared.