Podcast Summary: "All Of It" Episode – "Don't Overlook Beauford Delaney's Drawings"

Host: Alison Stewart
Guests: Emmanuel Matana (Playwright and Actor), Louisa Jacobson (Actor)
Air Date: June 26, 2025
Topic: Exploring the Broadway Play Trophy Boys at the Manhattan Theatre Club

Introduction to Trophy Boys

In this episode of WNYC's All Of It, host Alison Stewart delves into the newly premiered play Trophy Boys at the Manhattan Theatre Club. The play, written by Emmanuel Matana, features four non-binary and female actors portraying hyper-masculine teenage boys engaged in a high-stakes debate. The discussion is enriched by the insights of both the playwright and actor Louisa Jacobson, providing listeners with a comprehensive understanding of the play's themes, production, and underlying social commentary.

Background and Inspiration

Emmanuel Matana shares the genesis of Trophy Boys, revealing a personal connection to debate and its impact on her life. “[Debating] was so great for me as a young teenage girl because I was so political. It gave me a space where for eight minutes I got to be uninterrupted and have people listen to me” (02:18). This positive experience, juxtaposed with later societal issues, inspired Matana to create a narrative that examines masculinity and its effects.

Louisa Jacobson's Perspective on Debating

Louisa Jacobson discusses her lack of formal debate experience, stating, “I have no previous experience with debate” (02:56). Despite this, she adeptly embodies the role of Jarrett, one of the teenage boys, highlighting the actors' ability to convincingly portray debaters through rigorous rehearsals under director Donya Taymor's guidance.

Character Development and Themes

The play focuses on a group of prep school seniors preparing for a debate on whether feminism has failed women. Initially confident, the boys confront the complexities of the topic, which challenges their preconceived notions. A pivotal moment occurs when they must argue a position they do not believe in, encapsulating the play’s exploration of performative masculinity and internal conflict.

Key Play Quote:

“Owen explaining how they might win the debate that feminism has failed women”

“My time begins now. Central argument. Feminism has failed women. When it is not intersectional... And therefore, in failing different intersections of women, feminism has failed all women.” (10:32)

Shift from Comedy to Drama

Originally conceived as a comedic take on men grappling with feminism, Trophy Boys evolves into a more dramatic narrative addressing serious issues like sexual assault and accountability. Matana explains, “What starts as something really light is actually a much bigger conversation” (23:23). This transition underscores the play’s commitment to meaningful dialogue, using humor as a vehicle to approach sensitive topics.

Representation and Gender Performance

A significant aspect of Trophy Boys is its casting of non-binary and female actors in male roles, challenging traditional gender norms. Matana articulates, “Gender is a performance... we can liberate ourselves from it” (17:43). This choice not only highlights the constructed nature of gender but also emphasizes the performers' exploration of masculinity from diverse perspectives.

Louisa on Portraying Male Characters:

“There's like this shiftiness in young men... a desperate need for love and acceptance in young men, particularly teenage boys.” (14:46)

Directorial Influence and Cultural Adaptation

Under the direction of Tony Award-winning Donya Taymor, the play was adapted from its original Australian setting to resonate with New York audiences. This involved altering cultural references and enhancing the authenticity of the characters’ experiences. Emmanuel Matana praises Taymor’s empathy and creative vision, stating, “She's been such a guide through it all” (15:01).

Audience Engagement and Social Commentary

The play's confined setting—a single room—serves as a microcosm for examining locker room culture and male camaraderie hidden from public view. Matana emphasizes the importance of confronting what happens “behind closed doors” and the societal implications of holding men accountable for their actions. She hopes the audience will engage with these themes critically and empathetically.

Louisa on Audience Takeaways:

“How do we hold men accountable more? What are ways that... people can feel seen and held.” (24:24)

Final Reflections

Both guests express a desire for Trophy Boys to inspire conversations about gender, accountability, and societal expectations. They aim for the play to be both a mirror and a catalyst for change, encouraging audiences to reflect on their roles in perpetuating or challenging harmful norms.

Emmanuel Matana’s Favorite Quote:

“Art should comfort the disturbed and disturb the comfortable.” (26:21)

Conclusion

In this insightful episode, All Of It masterfully dissects Trophy Boys, showcasing its innovative approach to gender discourse and its relevance in contemporary society. Through the collaborative efforts of Emmanuel Matana, Louisa Jacobson, and director Donya Taymor, the play emerges as a poignant exploration of masculinity, empathy, and the power of performance in fostering social change.

Where to Watch:

Trophy Boys is currently playing at the Manhattan Theatre Club and will continue until July 27, 2025.

Notable Quotes:

• Emmanuel Matana on debate's impact:
  “[Debating] was so great for me as a young teenage girl because I was so political. It gave me a space where for eight minutes I got to be uninterrupted and have people listen to me” (02:18).

• Louisa Jacobson on portraying Jared:
  “Jared is like a soft boy jock artist. He's got so much riz... He wants to bring integrity to all of his endeavors” (08:32).

• Louisa on director Donya Taymor’s advice:
  “These boys aren't stupid... stay with the boys” (15:54).

• Emmanuel Matana on the play's message:
  “What we're actually talking about in the show is we are talking about sexual assault, and we're talking about the fact that men don't get held accountable for their actions” (23:23).

• Louisa Jacobson on audience reflections:
  “I hope that people also come away from this feeling like seen and held” (24:24).

References

• 02:18: Emmanuel Matana discusses the positive aspects of debating.
• 02:56: Louisa Jacobson talks about her lack of debate experience.
• 10:32: Key debate segment from Trophy Boys.
• 14:46: Louisa discusses the portrayal of teenage boys.
• 15:01: Emmanuel praises Director Donya Taymor.
• 17:43: Discussion on gender performance.
• 23:23: Shift from comedy to drama in the play.
• 24:24: Louisa on audience takeaways.
• 26:21: Emmanuel's favorite quote on art's role.

Note: Time stamps correspond to the provided transcript and are used to reference specific parts of the discussion.