Dorie Greenspan's Cookie Tips

Summary

All Of It Podcast Episode Summary: "Dorie Greenspan's Cookie Tips"

Host: Alison Stewart
Guest: Dorie Greenspan, James Beard Award-Winning Cookbook Author
Release Date: December 31, 2024
Duration Covered: [00:14 – 13:32]

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Introduction

On this festive New Year’s Eve episode of ALL OF IT, hosted by Alison Stewart of WNYC, listeners are treated to a warm and engaging exploration of culinary delights centered around cookies. The episode promises a rich tapestry of discussions, including cocktails, emerging music from a Tunisian artist, performances by a local high school jazz band, and insightful conversations with culinary experts. However, the heart of this episode lies in an in-depth conversation with Dorie Greenspan, the esteemed author of Dorie’s Cookies, which won the 2017 James Beard Award for best baking and dessert book.

In-Depth Conversation with Dorie Greenspan

Rolling Out Cookie Dough: Techniques and Tips [01:16 – 04:25]

Alison Stewart introduces Dorie Greenspan as an authority on cookies, highlighting her extensive repertoire of 13 cookbooks. The discussion swiftly moves to the fundamentals of cookie-making, focusing on the technique of rolling out dough.

Dorie Greenspan [02:05]: "If you roll it out repeatedly, it really can make it tough."

Dorie shares her revolutionary method for handling cookie dough to maintain its pliability and prevent toughness:

Dorie Greenspan [02:17]: "I put it between parchment and that's when I roll it out. And then I put it in the refrigerator and, or the freezer. And the dough doesn't seem to care when it gets chilled."

This approach eliminates the traditional challenge of overworking dough, allowing bakers to achieve perfectly rolled cookies without excessive chilling times.

Key Insights:

• Gluten Relaxation: Dorie emphasizes the importance of allowing gluten to relax, which is crucial for achieving the desired texture in cookies.
• Hydration: Proper hydration of the dough ensures a balanced consistency, preventing stickiness while maintaining smoothness.

Listener Interactions and Personal Stories [04:25 – 10:38]

The episode features heartfelt interactions with listeners who share their personal connections to Dorie’s recipes, illustrating the profound impact of her work on everyday lives.

Leah from Brielle, New Jersey [04:25 – 05:27]: Leah discusses her tradition of making multiple types of cookies, including Mexican wedding cookies (known as snowballs in her family), especially during challenging times like job loss.

Leah: "I'm making nine different kinds of cookies this year because we can't all get together... it's kind of special."

Sarah from Mendham, New Jersey [05:27 – 07:56]: Sarah expresses gratitude for Dorie’s “World Peace Cookie,” a family favorite that she shares annually during Christmas.

Sarah: "It has brought us so much joy."

Dorie shares the origin of this recipe, gifted by the renowned French pastry chef Pierre Hermé, highlighting its unique blend of dark chocolate, cocoa, brown sugar, and French sea salt—a combination that transformed the traditional perception of cookies.

Dorie Greenspan [06:14]: "This kind of changed the way we thought about cookies."

Jeremy Online Caller [07:56 – 10:38]: Jeremy recounts his tradition of making Dorie’s “Pumpkin Stuffed with Bread and Cheese” recipe every Halloween, a practice that has become a staple in his household.

Jeremy: "It's one of the most outstanding recipes I've ever had."

Dorie reminisces about the recipe's evolution from "Pumpkin Stuffed with Bread and Cheese" to "Pumpkin Stuffed with Everything Good," reflecting cultural influences and personal touches that enrich the recipe’s legacy.

Dorie Greenspan [09:23]: "It could be stuffed with anything good."

Introduction of a New Recipe: "Good Enough to be Imaginary" [10:38 – 13:32]

Dorie unveils her latest creation, the “Good Enough to be Imaginary” cookie, inspired by Louise Penny’s character Chief Inspector Armand Gamache. This innovative cookie melds elements of a lemon meringue pie into a delightful confection.

Dorie Greenspan [11:03]: "Everything that we love in a pie, but it's a cookie and it's really pretty."

Recipe Details:

• Base: French sable (shortbread) cookies, known for their crumbly texture.
• Filling: Velvety lemon curd that adds a rich, tangy flavor.
• Topping: Crunchy meringue cubes that provide a delightful contrast in texture.

Dorie explains that this recipe was envisioned as a tribute to Gamache, whose literary adventures are frequently accompanied by the comforting presence of lemon meringue pie. This fusion of literature and baking exemplifies how personal inspirations and cultural narratives can shape and elevate culinary creations.

Dorie Greenspan [13:22]: "It's like everything I love in one."

Transition to Upcoming Segments [13:32 – 14:08]

Alison Stewart wraps up her conversation with Dorie, praising her culinary artistry and setting the stage for the next segment featuring Paola Velez, a baker and community organizer who will discuss her new cookbook, Bodega Recipes for Sweets and Treats. This seamless transition maintains the episode’s focus on culture, community, and culinary expertise.

Highlights and Notable Quotes

• Dorie on Dough Handling:

  "I put it between parchment and that's when I roll it out." [02:17]

• On the World Peace Cookie:

  "This kind of changed the way we thought about cookies." [06:14]

• Describing the New Cookie:

  "Everything that we love in a pie, but it's a cookie and it's really pretty." [11:03]

Themes and Insights

• Culinary Innovation: Dorie’s techniques and recipes showcase a blend of traditional methods with innovative tweaks, resulting in superior texture and flavor profiles.

• Community and Sharing: The listeners’ stories highlight how baking serves as a medium for connection, generosity, and maintaining traditions, especially during challenging times.

• Cultural Fusion: The recipes discussed embody a fusion of cultural influences, from French pastry techniques to Dominican-inspired treats, reflecting the diverse fabric of New York City culture.

• Literary Inspiration: The creation of the “Good Enough to be Imaginary” cookie underscores the intersection of literature and culinary arts, illustrating how storytelling can inspire and shape recipes.

Conclusion

This episode of ALL OF IT is a celebration of culinary craftsmanship, community bonding, and cultural storytelling through the lens of baking. Dorie Greenspan not only imparts valuable baking techniques and innovative recipes but also weaves personal and cultural narratives that resonate deeply with listeners. As the episode progresses towards the new year, it underscores the enduring power of food to bring joy, foster connections, and embody the rich tapestry of cultural experiences that define New York City.

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Note: Advertisements and non-content segments were intentionally omitted to maintain focus on the episode's core discussions.

Transcript

[WNYC Studios]

Listener support WNYC Studios.

[Alison Stewart]

This is all of it. I'm Alison Stewart. Happy New Year's Eve. On today's show, we'll share some conversations that help us eat, drink and be merry all the way into 2025. We'll talk cocktails, hear some new music from an up and coming Tunisian musician. We'll also hear some performances from a local high school jazz band to celebrate the fact that as time moves forward, jazz will endure. We'll also spend some time in the kitchen with Paola Veles, who will share recipes inspired by the Dominican bodegas that helped raise her to be the chef she is today. And we'll learn how to get some little helpers involved in the kitchen with Priya Krishna's new cookbook for kids. That's all on the way. But first, just a heads up. In some of our conversations today, you might hear some callers, but because this is an all of it encore presentation, we won't be able to take your calls. So let's get things cooking with some cookies.

[Dorie Greenspan]

Our first guest wrote the book on cookies. Dorie Greenspan is The author of 13 cookbooks, including Dory's Cookies, which won the 2017 James Beard Award for best baking and dessert book. In Dorie's words, quote, there are everyday cookies and cookies for weekends, recipes that take a bit more time. Holidays, you'll be everyone's fave. This year's cookie swap and celebrations. There are bars and brownies and biscotti and the kinds of cookies that make.

[Alison Stewart]

Big batches for parties.

[Dorie Greenspan]

I'm so glad that Dorie Greenspan joins us once again.

[Alison Stewart]

Hi, Dorie.

[Dorie Greenspan]

Welcome back.

Oh, so good to be with you and so happy to have something cheery.

To talk about you and me too. I'm gonna go with some basics to get us rolling. Let's talk about rolling out cookie dough. That's pretty basic.

[Alison Stewart]

Now.

[Dorie Greenspan]

If you roll it out repeatedly, you said that it really can, it can make it tough. So how should I roll out my cookie dough so that I don't have to roll it out repeatedly?

So I have this came to me years ago. I don't know why I didn't think of it sooner, but for me, this was a total game changer in the rolling out world. When I make my cookie dough, if it's a rollout cutout cookie or when I make pie dough or tart dough, the rules were in the old world, the rules were that you made the dough and you put, you know, you made it into a ball or a disc you flattened it and you chilled it and you let that dough relax so that you would roll it out when it was cold, but you would take it in the refrigerator and it would be too cold to roll. And so you'd have to take your rolling pin and bash it or you'd have to wait half an hour for it to come to temperature. So this is what I do. I make the dough. It's soft, it's pliable, it'll do anything you want it to do. I put it between parchment and that's when I roll it out. And then I put it in the refrigerator and, or the freezer. And the dough doesn't seem to care when it gets chilled. It needs to be chilled, but it seems to be perfectly happy being chilled after it's rolled out. And it makes it so easy.

That is fascinating. I cannot wait to. And I love you talking about it relaxing because when things get cold, they expand, right?

Well, it's the whole thing about the gluten in the flour and you've worked the flour and so you just want it to relax. You also want for cookie dough, you often want the dough to chill and have some quiet time so that it can hydrate. But if it's a roll out cookie, just roll it as soon as you're finished mixing it. It might be a little sticky. Doesn't make any difference. Put it between parchment or wax paper. Lift the paper now and then so that you're not rolling creases, you know, the paper is increasing and rolling into the dough. Flip the dough over so that you roll both sides. You will be such a happy dough roller. It makes a big difference.

Let's go to leah from Brielle New Jersey Online. 1 Leah, thanks for calling all of it. What are you making?

[Leah]

I am just taking some, we call them snowballs out of the oven. Just a second. I'm in the middle of making three different kinds of cookies right now. And so I listen to the radio and one of the kinds I'm making are Mexican wedding cookies. But my family calls them snowballs. They're not my favorite, but I have to make a lot of them every year because they're other people's favorites. I'm making nine different kinds of cookies this year because we can't all get together and I lost my job. So I said to everybody, okay, I'm not sending presents this year, but I'll, you know, if everybody tells me what kind of cookies you want, I'll send them to your different houses as my Christmas present. And unfortunately, everybody seemed to have a different favorite. I'm going to be baking for days, but it's kind of, it's kind of special.

[Dorie Greenspan]

So Sarah from Mendham, New Jersey is on line too. Sarah, thanks for calling, all of it. You're on with Dori.

[Sarah]

Hi, Dori. Hi, Alison. I just wanted to thank you, Dorie, for your wonderful world peace cookie recipe. It is a favorite of mine and my families and friends. And I bring them every year to Christmas Day dinner. And this year, since we can't be together, I dropped them off at our family's house in the area with our Christmas cards as my two little elves, my nine year old and seven year old. It's brought us so much joy.

[Dorie Greenspan]

Thank you. Thank you.

[Sarah]

Well, just thank you.

[Dorie Greenspan]

The full recipe for world peace cookies and video of you making them dories on Food52's website. What makes this cookie so special, this world peace cookie?

Well, this cookie. So the recipe was given to me over 20 years ago by Pierre Herme. And it's across. He's a French pastry chef and he was thinking of the American chocolate chip cookie when he created this. So it's a cross between a French shortbread cookie and a chocolate chip cookie, but it's dark, dark chocolate. It's made with cocoa. It has pieces of chopped chocolate in it and, excuse me, brown sugar. And it has salt, fleur de sel of French sea salt. And 20 years ago, when I got this recipe, the salt was revolutionary. You bit the cookie, you could taste the salt. And we weren't accustomed to salt salty cookies before. And so this kind of changed the way we thought about cookies. And the original name was the Korova cookie. But a neighbor of mine said, you know, if the world had these cookies, there would be world peace. And I thought that's the name of the cookie. And it is, it's just, I think this cookie could bring peace. And it's a very simple cookie make. It's a slice and bake cookie. And in the old days when we could visit people's homes, I would bring a plate or a package of the world peace cookies and I would bring a roll of the dough and put the dough in my host's refrigerator or freezer. So they were like now and then cookies. You could eat the baked cookies now and have the roll.

For more later, let's go to Jeremy online 4. Hi, Jeremy, thanks for calling all of it.

[Jeremy]

Yes, hello.

[Dorie Greenspan]

Hi, you're on the air with Dory.

[Jeremy]

Oh, great. Thank you, Jeremy. Dory, you're famous in Our household for the following reason. If I can give you a little bit of a background story. I used to work for about seven or eight years. I worked in the Green Market in Union Square for a farmer. And we used to sell all range of products, including pumpkins of the appropriate time of year, Halloween. And I had this client customer used to come on a regular basis and a charming woman who actually turned out was a nun. And she was buying pumpkins one day. She said, do you make stuffed pumpkins? And I said, no. She said, well, I've got this wonderful recipe. And she bought me this copy of a recipe published by you in September 2008 called Pumpkin Packed with Bread and Cheese. A recipe in progress. I don't know if you remember it. You said you got it from. Written the article. You got it from a friend of yours in France. I always wondered if you said a recipe in process, if you ever changed it at all or updated it and published it anywhere else. If I don't make this recipe every year around Halloween, my wife complains bitterly. I think it's one of the most outstanding. This is one of the most outstanding recipes I've ever had.

[Dorie Greenspan]

Oh, thank you. So in fact, I had completely forgotten about that early version. The recipe became. The title became Pumpkin Stuffed with everything Good. And it's in my book around my French Table. But I think if you google it, there are lots and lots of, you know, you can find the recipe there. But it was given to me. A friend of mine in France, her sister had. Her sister would grow pumpkins and she would have her children write their names, carve their names in the pumpkins when the pumpkins were very small. And then their names would grow with the pumpkin. And when they would harvest their pumpkins, they would make this stuffed pumpkin stuffed with rice and cheese. Well, it could be stuffed with anything good. Sometimes sausage, sometimes just other vegetables, some cream and. Yeah. So that recipe did grow up to become pumpkin stuff with everything good. Thank you, Jeremy.

[Jeremy]

You're very welcome. I always have the opportunity to thank you for writing it because as I said, we make it regularly every year.

[Dorie Greenspan]

Oh, this makes me so happy. Thank you.

Well, Dori, I have a cookie question to ask you. I think this is going to become my regular Dorie Greenspan cookie. It's a new cookie that you wrote about in the New York Times. It has everything I think is good in the world. It's a lemon meringue cookie. Good enough to be imaginary is the name of this cookie. What is the inspiration for this cookie? I Cannot wait to try this one.

Oh, thank you. It's such a pretty cookie. I think so. The cookie itself is a French sable, a shortbread, and it has lemon curd on top and then it has cubes of meringue. And the inspiration was I made this cookie for my imaginary friend, Chief Inspector Armand Gamache, who is Louise Penny's hero in her novels. And starting she's written, I think, 15 or 16, and from the second book on, there's always been a lemon meringue pie in her books. And it started when the Chief Inspector saw a fisherman who looked at him with such compassion. The fisherman was eating a lemon meringue pie and his eyes were filled with such compassion and understanding that Gamache came to associate Lim Merang pie with. With a higher power. And the lemon meringue appears in various places throughout her books. And in her latest book, all the Devils Are Here, which takes place in Paris, the lemon meringue tart, it's now fringed, so it's a tart for this book is on page one. And I read the book and I thought, I want to make something for ghmech. And I didn't want to. I thought about making a tart, but this cookie came to mind. And so it has, you said it has everything you love in it. It has everything that we love in a pie, but it's a cookie and it's really pretty and it has great texture because the cookie itself is kind of crumbly. The lemon curd is velvety and smooth, and the meringue has crunch to it. So I was very happy when I created that cookie. I thought this is, yeah, you know, you'll work on something. And I mean, it's creating recipes, you know, putting recipes together, baking. Everything about it is satisfying, but there was a particular pleasure in this one. Oh, I'm so glad you're gonna make it.

Oh, my goodness. It's got a book, it's got Paris, it's got lemon curd. It's a cookie. It's like everything I love in one.

Spot, all in a cookie.

[Alison Stewart]

That was my conversation with James Beard award winning cookbook author Dorie Greenspan. The cookbook is called Dory's Cookies. Up next, baker and community organizer Paola Velez talks about her new cookbook, Bodega Recipes for Sweets and Treats, inspired by my corner store, including five kinds of sticky buns, Dominican cakes, and a whole chapter dedicated to what she calls the flan familia. Stick around. This is all of it.

[WNYC Studios]

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