Podcast Summary: All Of It – “Emma Stebbins, Bethesda Fountain Sculptor and New Yorker You Should Know”

Host: Alison Stewart, WNYC
Guest: Carli Wurzelbacher, Chief Curator, Heckscher Museum of Art
Date: October 21, 2025

Episode Overview

This episode of "All of It" illuminates the life, artistry, and legacy of Emma Stebbins—the first woman to receive a public art commission in New York City and sculptor of Central Park’s iconic Bethesda Fountain. Host Alison Stewart speaks with Carli Wurzelbacher, chief curator at the Heckscher Museum of Art, about Stebbins’ work and the museum’s landmark exhibition, "Emma Stebbins: Carving Out History." The conversation reveals Stebbins' pathbreaking career, her pioneering role among women artists, her life in Rome, her representation of American laborers in sculpture, and her enduring cultural impact.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

The Heckscher Museum’s Connection to Emma Stebbins

• Heckscher Museum as a Stebbins Repository
  • The museum is home to the largest collection of Stebbins' works in the country, originally acquiring two sculptures in the 1920s and adding more during the pandemic, now totaling five rare works. (01:16)
  • “We were actually the first museum in the country to acquire her work… In the 1920s, we were gifted two examples of her sculptures… and during the pandemic, we were fortunate to be able to acquire three additional sculptures.” — Carli Wurzelbacher [01:16]

The Exhibition: "Emma Stebbins: Carving Out History"

• The exhibition presents 14 Stebbins sculptures plus drawings and sketches for the first time, accompanied by the first scholarly publication devoted to her art. (02:21)
• Research involved piecing together limited historical records and making discoveries such as the previously unpublished "Joseph the Dreamer" sculpture, traced to Belfast Public Library via Facebook. (03:00)
  • “Perhaps the most exciting work is called Joseph the Dreamer… we found it on Facebook… It’s in the exhibition, the first time it’s been on view in the United States ever.” — Carli Wurzelbacher [03:00–03:46]

Stebbins’ Artistic Technique and Themes

• Known for her luminous, small-to-medium marble sculptures designed for 19th-century domestic interiors—rich in detail and layered with references to ancient literature and contemporary events. (04:10)
  • “They hold the room… so detailed and intricate… She’s layering all sorts of allusions… chock full of meaning.” — Carli Wurzelbacher [04:10]

Early Life & Artistic Development

• Born in New York City to a wealthy family in 1815; little is known about her early life, and she didn’t move to Rome to become a sculptor until she was 40. (05:08)
• Unable to attend formal art school, she trained privately with various artists—her achievements are especially remarkable given these constraints. (05:22)

Life and Career in Rome: Community and Freedom

• Rome was an international art hub where Stebbins observed excavations, networked with other artists (especially American women), and enjoyed more personal and creative freedom. (05:43)
  • “Stebbins was going and watching these sculptures come out of the ground. She was very inspired by that…Also talking to…American women, who were her friends and colleagues.” — Carli Wurzelbacher [05:43–06:28]

The “Jolly Bachelors” and Personal Life

• Stebbins belonged to the "Jolly Bachelors," a group of women artists living unconventionally in Rome, often centering on actress Charlotte Cushman—Stebbins’ lifelong partner. (06:28)
• Their relationship was considered a marriage by themselves and their circle, though not legally recognized. Cushman wore a ring and described herself as “already married.” (08:05)
  • “Charlotte Cushman in one letter says to a friend, Do you not know that I am already married and I wear the band on the third finger of my left hand?” — Carli Wurzelbacher [08:05]

Gendered Challenges in Sculpture

• While sometimes celebrated, Stebbins and her female peers faced skepticism—especially accusations of relying excessively on assistants, a practice also common among male sculptors. To counter this, Stebbins and others purposefully reduced their use of assistants, limiting their productivity and professional success. (08:37)
  • “They were subject to this different type of scrutiny based on their gender.” — Carli Wurzelbacher [09:21]

Commission and Reception of Bethesda Fountain

• The commission arose through Stebbins’ social connections, especially her brother, as Central Park was being planned. She was officially hired in 1863, with the fountain unveiled in 1873. (09:48)
• The fountain, crafted in bronze at the Royal Bronze Foundry in Munich, received mixed reviews initially, some critical—possibly due to gender bias—and some appreciative. (10:57)
  • “Other people really made fun of the angel. They said she looked like someone dancing the polka…probably in part because they knew it was created by an artist who was a woman.” — Carli Wurzelbacher [10:57]

Bethesda Fountain’s Enduring Significance

• From the outset, it was iconic, appearing on postcards and in other artworks—the rare monument from that era to retain positive relevance and symbolism of peace, healing, and love. (11:56)
  • “So much of what we have inherited in our public spaces…is either forgettable or objectionable…But the Bethesda Fountain is about peace and healing and clean water and health and love. And people connect with that.” — Carli Wurzelbacher [11:56]

Stebbins’ Unconventional Subjects and the Laborer Sculptures

• The sculptures "Industry" and "Commerce," commissioned by the founder’s uncle, depict working-class American men with realism, deviating from the period’s neoclassical preference for idealized female nudes. (12:59)
  • “She decided to depict these working-class American laborers…represented the idea of commerce in the form of a sailor…industry in the form of a miner…” — Carli Wurzelbacher [12:59]

The First Male Nude by an American Woman: "The Lotus Eater"

• Created in Rome, this work required access to male nude models, which Stebbins could not have secured in New York. The public and critical response was positive, lauding her skill. (14:32)
  • “People thought it was incredibly beautiful and well done. One critic said he couldn’t believe it was by a woman…” — Carli Wurzelbacher [14:32]

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Stebbins' Skill and Meaning:
  • “They are luminous…They have such presence…She’s layering all sorts of allusions and references…” — Carli Wurzelbacher [04:10]
• On LGBTQ+ Identity and Partnership:
  • “Charlotte Cushman in one letter says… ‘Do you not know that I am already married and I wear the band on the third finger of my left hand?’” — Carli Wurzelbacher [08:05]
• On American Laborers in Sculpture:
  • “So Stebbins is really pushing at conventions here by deciding to represent male laborers in the clothing that they would have worn, holding the tools that they would have used.” — Carli Wurzelbacher [13:49]
• On Bethesda Fountain’s Lasting Importance:
  • “But the Bethesda Fountain is about peace and healing and clean water and health and love. And people connect with that.” — Carli Wurzelbacher [12:22]
• On Breaking Artistic Barriers:
  • “She was the first woman to make a male nude sculpture…People thought it was beautifully done.” — Alison Stewart/Carly Wurzelbacher [14:17]

Timestamps for Key Segments

• 00:09 – Introduction to Emma Stebbins and exhibition
• 01:16 – Wurzelbacher on the museum’s collection
• 02:21 – Exhibition research and new discoveries
• 03:00–03:46 – “Joseph the Dreamer” story
• 04:10 – Stebbins’ marble skill and symbolism
• 05:08 – Early life and move to Rome
• 05:43 – Rome’s art scene and inspiration
• 06:28 – The “Jolly Bachelors” and Charlotte Cushman
• 08:05 – Relationship and non-traditional marriage
• 08:37 – Gender-based challenges in sculpture
• 09:48 – Commissioning and installation of Bethesda Fountain
• 10:57 – Mixed reception and contemporary controversy
• 11:56 – Monument’s enduring meaning
• 12:59 – Laborer sculptures: “Industry” and “Commerce”
• 14:32 – “The Lotus Eater” and acclaim for the male nude

Final Thoughts

This episode offers an engaging and enlightening portrait of Emma Stebbins: an artistic trailblazer, a New Yorker whose work still resonates, and a woman who carved her own path—personally and professionally—in the face of 19th-century barriers. Wurzelbacher’s research and the Heckscher Museum’s exhibition invite fresh appreciation for Stebbins’ contributions to art, culture, and public space.

For more, visit the Emma Stebbins exhibition at the Heckscher Museum of Art in Huntington, Long Island.