Podcast Summary: “Get Lit: Adam Haslett's 'Mothers and Sons'” on All Of It

Podcast Information:

• Title: All Of It
• Host: Alison Stewart
• Episode: Get Lit: Adam Haslett's 'Mothers and Sons'
• Release Date: April 4, 2025
• Description: ALL OF IT is a show about culture and its consumers, aiming to engage thinkers, doers, makers, and creators in discussions about the what and why of their work.

Introduction to “Mothers and Sons”

In this episode of All Of It, host Alison Stewart engages with Adam Haslett, a Pulitzer Prize finalist, to discuss his latest novel, "Mothers and Sons." The conversation delves into the intricate dynamics between the novel’s central characters, the thematic depths of their relationships, and Haslett’s creative process.

Overview of "Mothers and Sons"

"Mothers and Sons" explores the strained relationship between Peter, an asylum lawyer in New York City, and his mother Anne, a former female priest who now co-manages a spiritual retreat in Vermont. Set against the backdrop of 2011 NYC, the novel intertwines Peter’s professional life with his personal struggles, particularly his unresolved guilt over the death of a boy named Jared and his complicated interactions with a young asylum seeker, Vassal.

In-Depth Conversation with Adam Haslett

Character-Driven Narrative and Inspiration

Adam Haslett begins by emphasizing his character-centric approach to writing. He states:

“I start everything I write with a character. I'm always trying to find a way into the mind, the rhythm, the voice of the person that I'm going to spend probably years writing about.”
[02:11]

This focus led him to create Peter, a character embodying estrangement and professional dedication. Haslett explores Peter’s role as an asylum lawyer, highlighting the emotional and procedural complexities of his work.

Choice of Setting: The Year 2011

When asked why he set the novel in 2011, Haslett explains:

“I wanted to... not be as much distracted by, like, electoral politics. Yeah.”
[05:16]

By choosing a period slightly removed from contemporary political climates, Haslett underscores enduring issues within the immigration system, independent of specific administrations.

Exploring Themes: Workaholism and Loneliness

Peter is depicted as a workaholic, a trait Haslett uses to investigate the broader theme of loneliness:

“I wanted to explore what the emotions are underneath that urge to just fill up all the time.”
[07:10]

Haslett connects Peter’s obsessive dedication to his profession with a pervasive loneliness, a common thread for individuals deeply engrossed in helping professions.

Vassal’s Case and Its Impact on Peter

Vassal, a young Albanian asylum seeker fleeing persecution for being gay, becomes a catalyst for resurfacing Peter’s buried traumas:

“Vassal's story reminds Peter of a horrible day years ago... a day that Peter and his mother don't talk about.”
[07:53]

This case not only challenges Peter professionally but also triggers a journey into his past, particularly his unresolved feelings about Jared’s death.

Anne’s Spiritual Retreat and Character Depth

Anne, Peter’s mother, runs a women’s spiritual retreat in Vermont, described as:

“A kind of first wave feminist space... a community of friendship where women can talk about their lives outside of male power structures.”
[13:45]

Her role as a former Episcopal priest adds layers to her character, portraying her as someone deeply committed to helping others, yet emotionally distant from her son.

Multiple Mother-Son Relationships

Haslett incorporates various mother-son dynamics to reflect different facets of familial relationships:

“I wanted to have all these refractions... reflecting closeness and gender differences in parent-child dynamics.”
[17:08]

This pluralistic approach illustrates the diverse experiences of mothers and sons, particularly within queer contexts, highlighting the intensity and complexities of these bonds.

Themes of Agency and Obligation

The novel examines the tension between professional duty and personal agency:

“Our legal duty and our emotional obligations are different. How do you navigate it?”
[26:33]

Peter’s struggle to balance his responsibilities as an asylum lawyer with his personal guilt and desire for connection illuminates the moral dilemmas inherent in his profession.

Haslett’s Writing Process and Style

Haslett discusses his non-linear writing style, using different tenses and perspectives to mirror character experiences:

“Peter is in the first person, present tense... Anne is written in the third person and past tense.”
[15:22]

This stylistic choice enhances the narrative’s emotional depth, allowing readers to empathize deeply with both characters’ internal states.

Loneliness as a Central Theme

Addressing loneliness, Haslett reflects:

“Loneliness is a common human experience... often has a lot of shame attached to it.”
[32:21]

He portrays Peter’s isolation not just as a personal failing but as a societal issue exacerbated by modern living conditions and technological detachment.

Audience Interaction: Questions and Responses

Alison Stewart invites audience members to ask questions, which Adam Haslett thoughtfully addresses, providing deeper insights into his characters and themes.

Question on Anne’s Ministry:

“Anne is a clergy person, and you get the feeling at this revelation that the one person she's not ministering to is her own son. Do I read that correctly?”
Haslett’s Response: “Yes. Her duty as a minister to others contrasts with her inability to connect with Peter, highlighting her internal struggles and the complexities of their relationship.”
[24:15]

Question on Writing Structure:

“How do you develop the overall structure with parallel flashbacks and achieve emotional impact?”
Haslett’s Response: “The book is written in sections that vary in length, mimicking the fragmented nature of memory and dissociation. This structure allows readers to experience the characters’ emotional states progressively.”
[29:06]

Question on Legal vs. Fiction Writing:

“How do lawyers who become novelists handle the transition from precise legal writing to the ambiguity of fiction?”
Haslett’s Response: “While legal writing demands precision, fiction allows for ambiguity and emotional depth. My background in law informs my writing, but I embrace the freedom to explore nuanced human experiences in fiction.”
[30:47]

Conclusion

The episode provides a comprehensive exploration of Adam Haslett’s "Mothers and Sons," uncovering the novel’s intricate character dynamics, thematic richness, and the author’s nuanced writing approach. Through engaging dialogue and thoughtful audience interaction, Alison Stewart and Adam Haslett offer listeners a profound understanding of the human conditions portrayed in the book, emphasizing themes of loneliness, guilt, and the quest for meaningful connections.

Notable Quotes:

• Adam Haslett on Character Focus:

  “I start everything I write with a character... spending probably years writing about.”
  [02:11]

• On Workaholism:

  “A lot of those people in the helping professions... you can not look inward.”
  [07:10]

• On Loneliness:

  “Loneliness is a common human experience... often has a lot of shame attached to it.”
  [32:21]

This detailed summary encapsulates the essence of the All Of It podcast episode, providing key insights into Adam Haslett’s "Mothers and Sons" for both existing fans and new listeners.