Podcast Summary: All Of It – Get Lit: Susan Choi's 'Flashlight'
Host: Alison Stewart (WNYC)
Guest: Susan Choi (author of Flashlight)
Date: December 12, 2025
Episode Overview
This episode of All Of It, WNYC’s signature culture show hosted by Alison Stewart, centers on Susan Choi’s acclaimed novel Flashlight. Touted as one of the year’s best books, Flashlight was the November pick for the “Get Lit” Book Club, and in this live conversation Choi delves into the novel’s inspirations, its multifaceted characters, themes of otherness, identity, and family, as well as her creative process. Drawing from Choi’s own background and lived experiences, the discussion offers listeners new perspectives on immigrant identity, trauma, and the peculiar resilience of families.
Main Themes and Purpose
- Exploring family dynamics and trauma across cultures and generations
- Navigating cultural otherness and biracial identity
- The creative process of weaving perspectives and timelines
- Tactful representation of chronic illness and difficult subjects in fiction
Key Discussion Points & Insights
1. What Flashlight Is Really About
[00:08–03:02]
- Choi describes Flashlight as fundamentally a family story:
"I think I usually start by saying that it's about a family and they're a small family but larger than they realized." – Susan Choi [02:35]
- The story begins with three—Sirke (Sirk), Anne, and Louisa—but soon reveals hidden layers and members, making it “larger than they realized.”
2. Early Influences: Japan and Unfamiliarity
[03:02–04:21]
- Choi’s childhood trip to Japan inspired the book’s setting and tone:
"It was a quality or an experience for me of just total unfamiliarity. ... I had been growing up in Indiana...to be dropped into Japan in the late 70s ... it was kind of life changing in a modest way." – Susan Choi [03:13]
- She recounts being immersed in a culture where she didn't speak the language, which fed into the novel’s themes of alienation.
3. Korean Identity in Japan
[04:21–05:23]
- A pivotal influence was Sonia Riang’s scholarship on the Zainichi Korean experience (ethnic Koreans living in Japan after WWII).
"There had been ethnic Koreans in Japan during the colonial period, not just Koreans in Korea, dealing with Japanese, which was really surprising to me." – Susan Choi [04:56]
4. Narrative Perspectives & Structure
[05:23–07:15]
- Choi confesses the multi-perspective structure emerged organically:
"I found that I could only write about one at a time...I kept accumulating these perspectives." – Susan Choi [05:39]
- Louisa’s voice emerged first, with Ann’s close behind; scenes were sometimes rewritten from different character viewpoints.
5. The Character of Sirk / Identity and Names
[07:15–09:02]
- Sirk’s three names—Japanese, Korean, and the anglicized “Sirk”—mirror his complicated identity:
"I feel like his third and final name, Cirque ... represents the person he wants to be. He really wants to remake himself American." – Susan Choi [07:50]
- His sense of “otherness” breeds secrecy and emotional isolation, paralleling experiences from Choi's own family.
6. The Character of Ann / Impulsivity and Escape
[10:09–11:05]
- Ann’s impulsiveness and desire to be “different” draw her into her marriage with Sirk.
"I wanted Ann to be ... somebody who was so interested in being different that she would go headlong into something without stopping to think about it." – Susan Choi [10:16]
7. Secrets and Silence: Sirk’s Hidden Family
[11:58–13:56]
- Sirk withholds information about his North Korean family out of shame and fear, emblematic of Cold War anxieties and immigrant “stains.”
"He’s terrified that anyone will learn. And then it's like a stain. So he keeps it a secret." – Susan Choi [13:45]
8. Illness and Paralysis as Both Literal and Metaphorical
[13:56–16:55]
- Anne’s MS (multiple sclerosis) is first mistaken for psychosomatic, mirroring her emotional paralysis in a foreign land.
- Walt, Ann’s later partner, is depicted as an ordinary yet deeply attentive man drawn to her independence.
9. Louisa: Prickly, Perceptive, and Divisive
[16:55–21:16]
- Louisa’s point-of-view opens the novel, initially introduced in a New Yorker story; Choi admits there was little advance planning in making her the “entryway.”
- Choi shares readers’ and even her own mother’s strong reactions to Louisa:
"You weren't obnoxious like that. Maybe that is bragging a little bit. But I was relieved." – Susan Choi, quoting her mother [19:37]
- Louisa’s trauma response is realistic:
"Of course she's gonna do the second thing. She's not gonna know how to heal herself." – Susan Choi on Louisa closing up, not opening up [20:51]
10. Tobias: The “Sunny” Sibling and Reimagining Family
[22:11–23:52]
- Originally more of a plot device—a concealed secret—Tobias becomes an indispensable, “irresistible” presence representing unconditional love and connection:
"He just turns up with, like, unconditional love for her." – Susan Choi [23:45]
11. Biracial Identity and Family Resemblance
[24:02–25:14]
- Tobias, who resembles Ann, and Louisa’s biracial identity drive wedges and provoke self-questioning, reflecting Choi’s lived reality:
"It was interesting for me as a writer to...write about these issues of not looking like...a parent...feeling as if you're wearing this conspicuousness all the time." – Susan Choi [24:15]
12. Time Jumps and Pacing of Secrets
[25:14–27:47]
- Choi enjoys “wickedly” big time jumps, adding surprise for readers:
"I wickedly love big, disorienting time jumps. I just really like them." – Susan Choi [25:24]
- The major secret—the fate of Sirk—drifted to the back of the novel during writing, contrary to her original intent.
13. Audience Q&A: Writing Otherness and Illness
[27:50–31:49]
- Choi answers about feeling “other” in America:
"It was a lonely feeling to often have people saying, 'what are you? Where'd you come from?'" – Susan Choi [28:36]
- On chronic illness, she found writing about Ann’s MS cathartic and rooted in her own family experience:
"My mother has MS, and she's had it since I was very young...and so I've grown up with her, beside her, watching her...once I started doing that, it felt ... so good to be seeing it through my writing." – Susan Choi [30:22]
14. Not Knowing the Ending
[31:07–31:49]
- Choi started writing without a fixed ending in mind, but wanted to find a way for the family to eventually reunite:
"I didn't know if they would find each other again. I didn't know if he would be alive at the end ... but I knew that I wanted to try to bring them together again." – Susan Choi [31:13]
Notable Quotes
- "It's about a family ... a small family but larger than they realized." (Choi, [02:35])
- "There was always some sort of sense—solitary quality—that still kind of lingered like an aura." (on Sirk, [09:42])
- "I wickedly love big, disorienting time jumps. I just really like them." (Choi, [25:23])
- "He just turns up with, like, unconditional love for her." (on Tobias, [23:45])
- "Of course she's gonna do the second thing. She's not gonna know how to heal herself." (on Louisa, [20:51])
- "It was a lonely feeling to often have people saying, 'what are you? Where'd you come from?'" (Choi, [28:36])
- "My mother has MS, and ... I was always really scared to write about this. ... Once I started doing that, it felt ... so good to be seeing it through my writing." (Choi, [30:22])
Important Timestamps
- 00:08 – Overview of Flashlight and setup for discussion
- 02:30 – Choi’s summary: “It’s about a family...”
- 03:12 – Childhood Japan trip inspiration
- 04:21 – Learning about Zainichi Koreans in Japan
- 05:23 – Writing in multiple perspectives
- 07:43 – Sirk’s names and identity
- 09:02 – How otherness shapes Sirk
- 10:15 – Ann’s characteristics and role
- 13:56 – Ann’s MS and cultural displacement
- 16:55 – Louisa’s introduction and development
- 22:11 – The role of Tobias in the family
- 24:02 – Biracial identity tensions
- 25:23 – Time jumps and playing with narrative
- 27:50 – Audience questions: otherness and illness
- 31:07 – Not knowing the ending
Memorable Moments
- Choi’s anecdote about readers' divisive feelings towards Louisa, even her mother’s gentle criticism
- Discussion of “secrets” in immigrant families, especially concerning relatives in North Korea
- Choi’s confession that even she was “surprised” by the ultimate fate of Sirk, as her storytelling evolved organically
Tone and Language
The episode maintains an intelligent, reflective, and often humorous tone—Choi is candid about her process, self-deprecating about her “lack of planning,” and deeply empathetic in discussing illness and otherness. Stewart’s questions are thoughtful and allow Choi space to expand on the novel’s emotional core and structural choices.
For listeners and readers alike, this conversation offers an intimate look at Susan Choi’s Flashlight, illuminating its personal influences, intricate family dynamics, and the profound costs—and small redemptions—of being an outsider.