B (2:42)

Let's talk about a young Edgar growing up in the early 1800s, a Boston transplant in Virginia. What pushes him towards the more dark and stormy sides of life?

C (2:55)

Right. Well, he of course, had many challenges during his lifetime with losing people who are close to him. He loses his mother just before he turns three years old and he actually they are traveling, the family's traveling for her acting career and that's how he ends up in Richmond Virginia, she dies there in Richmond during a performance run, and the Allen family adopts him. And so a little bit later, after he becomes really close to his foster mother, she also dies quite young. And I think. Yeah, and we think we all know that he's going to lose his wife, Virginia, when she is very young. She dies from tuberculosis. So it's not uncommon for people to lose loved ones who are young during that era. But just so many people who are so close to him dying, it's just so much. And then, you know, he. He loves Lord Byron from an early age. And Lord Byron is a dark figure in literature, and so he's gravitating toward those kinds of ideas. And yeah, it just kind of becomes his life.

B (4:08)

He was a literary critic to pay the bills. What do his takes on the writings of others about? What does it tell us about his purpose when he writes?

C (4:21)

Just for writing the literary criticism or just in general?

B (4:28)

I'll say in general.

C (4:30)

Okay. Yeah, so you're right. He. He was impoverished throughout his life, so there is this need to write fiction, poetry. He tried his hand at a play at one point. Definitely the literary criticism. He's, he's. He has a novel eventually. He's doing whatever he can to make some money. But he's also trying to hold himself to a high standard. And for him, that high standard is to innovate and create and do something original. So it really bothered him when he saw derivative works or read things by people who were trying to teach a moral lesson. He just felt like that was not what literature should be doing for poetry. He really privileged that beauty should be the subject of the poem, and beauty could be enhanced if a beautiful woman, for example, had just died. Right. He's famous for saying the death of a beautiful woman is the most poetical topic in the world, which is a little problematic for me as a feminist, but yeah, yeah, so he was definitely. As he's riding to survive, he's also trying to put out a high quality product, if you will. And he's trying to read his literary market, give audiences what they want. And some of what they wanted was this sensationalist fiction that we love today, these horror stories.

B (5:59)

Explain the sensationalists, what that meant for people at the time.

C (6:03)

Yeah, so the. This is something that Charles Dickens also would do. I think today we would just call it gory stuff, graphic stuff, if you will, that we see in horror films, for example. So in the Telltale Heart, we have a dismemberment scene. Right. Things like that. Yeah.

B (6:23)

Listeners we want to bring you into this conversation. What are your favorite works by Edgar Allan Poe? What do you think makes his writing so compelling, perhaps makes it so grim? What resonates with you? Our lines are open at 2124-3396-9221-2433. WNYC. Or you can ask a question of Dr. Amy Branham Armiento about Pove. She is our guests. Where did Poe's sense of the wide world come from? Because he wrote about so many different places, about Africa, he wrote about Asia, he wrote about a whaling boat being marooned off of Antarctica. Where did this world come from?

C (7:06)

Well, he was certainly a voracious reader. He often reviewed novels and nonfiction works. So he could imagine these places by reading about them. When he was a child, the Allen family went to England. John Allen is Scottish. And he was. Had some business affairs in that area. So Post spent about six years in a boarding school in London or being educated in London, part of that in a boarding school. So he had actually gone abroad as a young man and. And he liked to, you know, just like I said, read a lot about the world. Read a lot of newspaper stories as well. Many of pieces are based on articles that he would have read in the paper, given, giving him ideas, if you will. So, you know, he had a great imagination and a little taste of traveling abroad as a. As a young person.

B (8:02)

Before he started writing, what was the concept of horror, that genre? What was it like before he started writing?

C (8:12)

So the Gothic tradition, the Gothic novel is appearing in the mid-1700s with Horace Walpole, Walpole's Castle of Otranto. And so he's inheriting the Gothic tradition from writers like Walpole and Radcliffe and Lewis. Names that maybe we don't know so much today, but he certainly knew. And there was an American writer named Charles Brockton Brown from Philadelphia who was writing Gothic works, and we know those influenced Edgar Allan Poe's style. And of course, Washington Irving of the Legend of Sleepy Hollow fame, he was writing too. So these Gothic works. So the Gothic is definitely an influence. And when we say the Gothic, right, we think of castles and secret passageways and people who are maybe locked in and they can't. They need to escape. Right. For various reasons. And the ghosts and the chains and all those eerie sounds we might hear. So that's what he's inheriting.

B (9:13)

Let's take a call. This is Andy, who's calling in from Yonkers. Andy, thank you so much for making the time to call. All of it. You're on the air.

A (9:22)

Good afternoon. I want to thank you both for bringing out Edgar Allan Poe. I have spent time in Poe park in the Bronx, and I really enjoy. I really enjoy his work.

B (9:37)

What do you enjoy about it?

A (9:42)

It's real. It's, I guess you could say, sensational. You made. Your guest made a comment about Amy, right? Yes, Doctor. That's the main thing. Doctor.

C (9:56)

Yeah.

A (9:56)

Maybe slightly exaggerated, the most beautiful thing. But I'm in the sports field and they're calling Ohtani the greatest player ever. Please. You know, he just started. Plus, the Ravens won last night. But he. You know, it's scary, some of his work. The Pendulum, right?

B (10:16)

Yes, it is scary.

A (10:18)

Yeah, it's scary. But I think what's behind it isn't just this gory to be gory thing, and I think you've cited that already.

B (10:29)

Thank you so much for weighing in. We appreciate it. So, Dr. Amy Branham Armiento, former president of the Poe Studies association, we're discussing Poe a little deeper before we hear our version of the Raven. I wanna talk about some of the pieces that people may, they know the name of it, but they're not sure what it's about. The Telltale Heart. The short version is a murderer is driven crazy by what sounds like a heartbeat coming from underneath the floorboards. The interesting thing is readers aren't told why the murder took place.

C (11:02)

Right.

B (11:03)

Why is the why not necessarily important in that story?

C (11:08)

Yeah, and it's interesting even in your characterization because, of course, we think about the heartbeat because it's in the title, but it's the vulture eye, this eye with a cataract act or film over it that actually leads him to the murder. And then the heartbeat is what gives him away. Of course, no one else can hear that heartbeat, but I think that's what's so brilliant about Edgar Allan Poe. It's. It is terrifying. Why did this person kill this old man? We don't know. He seems to have a reason that makes sense to him, but we don't see it as making sense, we being the reader. And I think that's that level of terror. And, And I, and I like Andy bringing up the Pit and the Pendulum because that's frankly the only happy ending of one of the scary stories yet when we're in that story, we don't expect a rescue. And. And so I love that story just because it's an exception. But I think it's, you know, why is this person caught up in the Inquisition, in the pit, in the pendulum? We're not even sure about that? It's just. It's almost like it anticipates existentialism and Kafka and this, like, how did I get caught up into such an unsafe situation? And that's terrifying to not have the why answered in a clear way. And the question being, is this. Can I just chalk it up to maybe the murderer has some kind of mental illness? You know, there's space for that when you read the works. But how. But the person around him that was about to be murdered didn't realize or see any symptoms of this mental illness. So it's terrifying.

B (12:52)

Let's take a call. Lynn from Stockholm, New Jersey. Hi, Lynn, thank you so much for calling all of it on this Halloween.

A (13:00)

Actually, I'm from Clifton, but I just wanted to say, back in the mid-80s, I moved into an apartment on 84th Street. And this is before cell phones. So I walked down to Broadway to call my parents and tell them everything was okay. And I looked up and I realized that I live on 84. 84th street is also Edgar Allan Poe Street. That his family had a farm on 84th street on the west side.

B (13:28)

Is that true?

C (13:30)

So I don't know New York very well, but I can tell you where places are that we know he rented. So he lived on what is now 85 West 3rd street in Greenwich Village. So I'm not sure if that's about where we're at.

B (13:45)

No, but I know you're talking about.

C (13:47)

Okay, that, that house has been torn down again. He. He never owned a home. So they rented. And the New York University Law School buildings there now are one of their buildings. And so maybe this caller is talking about the Poe cottage out in Fordham in the Bronx or. But they moved often. They. They had to rent many, many places. Often he would try to establish himself in his city. And so they do like a quick short term rental. And then, then once he sort of got the hang of where he was, they'd move again. Sometimes driven by the rent. But then once his wife became ill, they would end up living farther outside of the city for her health. And also it was cheaper. So. Yes, I mean, I apologize, but I don't know the exact location.

B (14:38)

It's okay. We just got it from a source said it's like nabbing a rental in Manhattan. It's not an easy process. Poe had to move to the Upper west side to escape the rents around Washington Square.

C (14:50)

Exactly right. Exactly right, yeah.

B (14:53)

What would you recommend to someone who is now eager to read Poe? What. What Short story?

C (15:02)

So I always in the Telltale Heart. Many people who know Poe know him from that story. It is what sealed the deal for me to become a Poe scholar. I just love that story. So if you haven't read the Tell Tale Heart, please do so. And then, of course, the Raven, which you're about to have the recitation of, and Annabel Lee. Those two poems are really fun. The sound is really fun in the meter. You can practice your own parody like you began with. That's kind of fun sometimes as well. And I recommend, if you already know those works, maybe checking out some of the other horror stories that aren't read so often. Like his story called the Black Cat. Hot Frog is also a favorite of mine, Fall of the House of Usher. And if you want kind of a funny one, like a dark comedy, I recommend the Cask of Amontillado. There are a lot of little jokes in there, but again, they're dark because it's a horror story. But if you like dark humor, definitely recommend that. And if you feel okay about the pandemic situation, you can kind of revisit that kind of world. The Mask of the Red Death is fun as well.

B (16:17)

We've been talking about Edgar Allan Poe with Dr. Amy Branham Armiento. Thank you for joining us.

C (16:23)

Yeah, thank you. She's gonna ask us something on Edgar Allan Poe. I know, but I just know that any moment now, she's gonna call on me and ask me something.

B (16:36)

I don't know. Hopefully after that conversation, you're not as worried as Peppermint Patty or Sally Brown about getting called on to ask about Poe. And hopefully you have a little more to ponder going into our traditional Halloween recitation of the Raven by Sean Carlson.

D (16:54)

Once upon a midnight dreary, while I pondered, weak and weary, over many a quaint and curious volume of forgotten lore, while I nodded, nearly napping, suddenly there came a tapping, as of some gently rapping, rapping at my chamber door. Tis some visitor, I muttered, tapping at my chamber door. Only this and nothing more. Ah. Distinctly I remember it was in the bleak December, and each separate dying ember wrought its ghost upon the floor. Eagerly I wished the morrow. Vainly I had sought to borrow from my books surcease of sorrow. Sorrow for the lost Lenore, for the rare and radiant maiden whom the angels named Lenore, nameless here forevermore. And the silken sad, uncertain rustling of each purple curtain thrilled me, filled me with fantastic terrors never felt before. So that now to still the beating of my heart, I stood repeating, tis some visitor entreating entrance at my chamber door. Some late visitor Entreating entrance at my chamber door. This it is, and nothing more. Presently my soul grew stronger, hesitating then no longer. Sir, said I, or madam truly your forgiveness I implore. But the fact is I was napping, and so gently you came rapping, and so faintly you came tapping, Tapping at my chamber door that I scarce was sure I heard you. Here I opened wide the door. Darkness there and nothing more. Deep into that darkness, peering. Long I stood there wondering, fearing, doubting, dreaming dreams no mortal ever dared to dream before. But the silence was unbroken and the stillness gave no token. And the only word there spoken was the whispered word Lenore. This I whispered, and an echo murmured back the word Lenore. Merely this and nothing more. Back into the chamber, turning, all my soul within me burning. Soon again I heard a tapping somewhat louder than before. Surely, said I, Surely that is something in my window lattice. Let me see then what thereat is and this mystery explore. Let my heart be still a moment and this mystery explore. Tis the wind, and nothing more. Open here I flung the shutter. When with many a flirt and flutter in there stepped a stately raven of the saintly days of yore. Not the least obeisance made he not a minute stopped or stayed he, but with mien of lord or lady perched above my chamber door. Perched upon a bust of pallas just above my chamber door Perched and sat, and nothing more then this ebony bird, beguiling my sad fancy into smiling by the grave and stern decorum of the countenance it wore, Though thy crest be shorn and shaven. Thou, I said, art sure no craven, ghastly, grim and ancient raven wandering from the nightly shore. Tell me what thy lordly name is on night's plutonium shore, Quoth the raven, nevermore. Much I marvelled this ungainly fowl to hear discourse so plainly, Though its answer little meaning, little relevancy bore. For we cannot help agreeing that no living human being ever yet was blest with seeing bird above his chamber door. Bird or beast upon the sculpted busts above his chamber door, with such a name as nevermore. But the raven, sitting lonely on the placid bust, spoke only that one word, as if his soul in that one word he did outpour nothing farther. Then he uttered not a feather. Then he fluttered till I scarcely more than muttered, Other friends have flown before. On the morrow he will leave me, as my hopes have flown before. Then the bird said nevermore. Startled at the stillness broken by reply so aptly spoken Doubtless, said I, what it utters, it is only stock in store Caught from some unhappy master Whom unmerciful disaster followed fast and followed faster Till his songs one burden bore Till the dirges of his hope that melancholy burden bore of never nevermore but the raven still beguiling all my fancy into smiling straight I wheeled a cushioned seat in front of the bird and bust and door Then upon the velvet sinking I betook myself to linking fancy unto fancy Thinking that this ominous bird of yore with its grin ungainly, ghast, gaunt and ominous bird of yore Meant in croaking nevermore. This I sat engaged in guessing but no syllable expressing to the fowl Whose fiery eyes now burnt into my bosom's core this and more I sat divining with my head at ease Reclining on the cushion's velvet lining that the lamplight gloated over but whose velvet violet lining with the lamplight gloating over she shall press Ah. Nevermore. Then methought the air grew denser Perfumed from an unseen censer swung by seraphim whose footfalls tinkled on the tufted floor Wretch, I cried, Thy God hath lent thee by these angels he hath sent thee respite, respite and nepenth from my memories of Lenore Quaff, o quaff this kind nepenth and forget this lost Lenore Quoth the Raven nevermore Prophet, said I Thing of evil prophet still if bird or devil Whether tempter sent or whether tempest tossed thee here ashore Desolate yet all undaunted on this desert land enchanted on his home by horror haunted Tell me truly I implore Is there Is there balm in Gilead? Tell me, tell me I implore Quoth the Raven nevermore Prophet, said I Thing of evil prophet still if bird or devil by that heaven that bends above us by that God we both adore Tell this soul with sorrow laden if within the distant Aiden it shall clasp a Satan maiden whom the angels named Lenore Clasp a rare and radiant maiden whom the angels named Lenore Quoth the Raven Nevermore be that word our sign of parting Bird or fiend, I shrieked upstarting get thee back into the tempest and the night's Plutonian shore Leave no black plume As a token of that lie thy soul hast spoken Leave my loneliness unbroken Quit the bust above my door Take thy beak from out my heart and take thy form from off my door Quote the raven nevermore and the raven never flitting still is sitting, still is sitting on the pallid bust of Pallas just above my chamber door, and his eyes all seeing of a demon that is dreaming, and that lamplight over him streaming, throws his shadow on the floor, and my soul from that shadow that lies floating on the floor shall be lifted. Nevermore.

B (23:30)

True crime is one of the most popular genres in entertainment. But why are so many people obsessed with learning about gruesome crimes? And what are the ethics of being a true crime fan? Coming up, we'll discuss it with professor and criminologist Matt DeLisi. For 140 years, MultiCare has been in Washington prioritizing long term solutions, partnering with local communities and expanding access to care. Together, we're building a healthier future. Learn more@mycare.org Since WNYC's first broadcast in 1924, we've been dedicated to creating the kind of content we know the world needs. In addition to this award winning reporting, your sponsorship also supports inspiring storytelling and extraordinary music that is free and accessible to all. To get in touch and find out more, visit sponsorship wnyc. Org.