How to Pack a Great Lunch

Summary

All Of It with Alison Stewart: “How to Pack a Great Lunch”

Date: September 12, 2024
Guests: J. Kenji Lopez-Alt & Deb Perlman (Co-hosts, “The Recipe with Kenji and Deb” podcast)

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Episode Overview

This episode of "All Of It" dives into the art and strategy of lunch packing, for both kids returning to school and adults back at work. Host Alison Stewart convenes acclaimed food writers and podcasters J. Kenji Lopez-Alt and Deb Perlman to share practical tips, favorite tools, and philosophies for making lunches that are appealing, satisfying, and realistic—moving beyond the standard PB&J and battling lunch boredom for every age.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Lunchbox Philosophies: Variety, Flexibility, and Realism

• Kenji’s Approach (02:32):
  He recommends a “baby-led weaning” philosophy: pack a variety of healthy options, incorporate diverse colors and textures, and let kids choose what they want.

  “Let them choose and don’t really push them… Sometimes they eat all of it and sometimes they eat only the peas and sometimes only the pasta or dessert. The key is to be nonjudgmental…”
  (J. Kenji Lopez-Alt, 02:54)

• Deb’s Evolution (03:36):
  Deb describes how her strategy has changed as her children aged. As a default, she relies on bento-style lunches and gives leftovers a starring role, especially for her teenager.

  “We started out very cute, and it’s sort of gone downhill since—or gotten more realistic.”
  (Deb Perlman, 08:16)

2. Common Mistakes & Pitfalls

• Don’t Be Too Aspirational (05:53):
  Both Kenji and Deb warn against packing lunches based on what you wish your children (or you) would eat, rather than what they realistically enjoy.

  "If I push it, it's just going to come back uneaten, which is a waste of everyone's time, and then they're hungry."
  (Deb Perlman, 05:53)

• Situation-Appropriate Packing (04:32):
  Consider how kids eat at school–often distracted and on-the-go. Focus on easy-to-grab, fun-to-interact-with foods, rather than plated meals requiring utensils.

  “Thinking about it as if it’s a meal they’re eating at home… is probably a mistake.”
  (J. Kenji Lopez-Alt, 04:32)

3. Essential Tools & Techniques

• Bento Boxes & Thermoses (06:40, 08:48):
  Both guests love compartmentalized lunch containers. Wide-mouth thermoses are excellent for soup, pasta, or stew, especially in winter.

  “We have probably every lunchbox under the sun, but something we like a lot are thermoses with the wide mouth… and the little fold-up spoon or fork.”
  (Deb Perlman, 08:48)

• Keep it Simple, Keep it Interactive (05:08):
  Deconstructed meals and bite-sized foods add fun and autonomy, whether it’s sandwiches kids assemble themselves or toppings for noodles.

4. Lunch Packing Staples & Go-Tos

• Produce and Leftovers (06:40):
  Always stock cut-up fruits and veggies—cherry tomatoes, cucumbers, snackable fruits. Big compartment for leftovers, “satellite” spots for produce and small snacks.

  “…Raw fruits, vegetables and things that… give them more color, texture, and flavor contrast.” (J. Kenji Lopez-Alt, 07:07)

• Thermos Lunch Ideas (09:28):
  Hot meals can include pastas (al dente!), soups, or stews. Reheat food piping hot so it cools down nicely by lunchtime for better texture (11:25).

• Handheld Lunches (18:07, 21:10):
  For kids needing a no-fork, no-wrap meal, Kenji touts onigiri/rice balls, assembled with fillings and nori sheets packed on the side for fun, tasty interactivity.

5. Special Dietary Needs & Fun Tips

• Low-Cholesterol, No-Hummus Lunches (09:28):
  Kenji recommends a hearty kale salad with marinated chickpeas and veggies, which holds up well and stays crisp.

• Keeping Food Hot/Cold (10:49):
  Hot tip: heat lunches to piping hot before packing, even if they’re eaten at room temperature later, for better flavor and texture.

• Apple Browning Trick (12:33):
  Listener April shares:

  “Put sliced apples in salted room temperature water to prevent browning, instead of using lemon.”
  (Caller, 12:33)

• Make Lunches Feel Special (14:02):
  Adding a joke card or arranging food playfully—like rice balls with sesame seed eyes—helps kids feel thought of, even if sometimes the lunch is just breakfast leftovers.

6. Adult Lunches—Taking the Boredom Out of Salads

• Grain & Bean Salads (19:13):
  Add textural and flavor variety: toasted nuts, cheese, chopped apples, sourdough on the side. Deb loves udon or buckwheat noodle salads, too.

• Marinated Ingredients (19:34):
  Kenji keeps fridge containers of marinated beans, veggies, or artichokes for flavorful, ready-to-pack punch.

• DIY “Instant Noodles” (23:48):
  Kenji layers pre-cooked noodles, toppings, miso, and dehydrated ingredients in a jar: just add hot water at work for fresh, customized “instant” soup.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

On Lunch Philosophy:

“You want to make your kid feel like someone’s thinking about them... Everyone wants to feel special.”
(J. Kenji Lopez-Alt, 14:02)

“…We’re just speaking purely aspirationally here today.”
(J. Kenji Lopez-Alt, 15:22)

On Practical Tips:

“If your kid is a soup eater... that stuff is fantastic in the winter. You could make a big batch of it and they can have it for a few days.”
(Deb Perlman, 08:48)

“Foods are better when they have cooled down to room temperature as opposed to warmed up to room temperature.”
(J. Kenji Lopez-Alt, 11:25)

“Lunchables got it right… Deconstructed. Kids like to put things together themselves.”
(J. Kenji Lopez-Alt, 15:51)

On Adult Lunch Troubles:

“Don’t discount the cold noodle bowl!”
(Deb Perlman, 20:49)

“Keeping marinated vegetables in the fridge is sort of my trick.”
(J. Kenji Lopez-Alt, 20:44)

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• Kids Lunch Philosophy & Variety: 02:32 – 03:36
• Packing Mistakes & Aspirations: 04:27 – 05:53
• Go-To Lunchbox Items: 06:30 – 07:38
• Lunch Gear & Thermoses: 08:16 – 09:28
• Special Diets and Salad Ideas: 09:41 – 10:49, 19:13 – 20:49
• Keeping Food Warm: 10:49 – 11:25
• Listener Apple Browning Tip: 12:33 – 13:16
• Making Lunch Special/Joke Cards: 14:02 – 15:01
• Dressing Up the PB&J: 16:36 – 16:58
• Handheld Meal Ideas: 18:07 – 21:10
• Favorite Adult Lunches: 23:14 – 24:32

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Resource & Community Shoutout

• Listener Kim from Harlem (22:36):
  Recommends “LunchBots” website for lunch ideas and quality containers.

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Closing Thoughts

Kenji and Deb's advice balances the aspirational with the practical, focusing not on Instagrammable perfection but on options that actually get eaten, foster a sense of autonomy and pleasure, and work for busy families. Whether for kids or adults, the real secret is variety, flexibility, and a touch of surprise or specialness—even if, some days, the best you manage is wrapping up an old egg sandwich.

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Panelists:

• Alison Stewart (Host)
• J. Kenji Lopez-Alt
• Deb Perlman

Podcast: All of It on WNYC

Episode: “How to Pack a Great Lunch” (September 12, 2024)

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For recipes, lunch ideas, or to hear more from Kenji and Deb, tune into “The Recipe with Kenji and Deb” wherever you get your podcasts.

Transcript

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[J. Kenji Lopez-Alt]

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[Alison Stewart]

This is all of It on WNYC. I'm Alison Stewart. School is back in session and more people have returned to the office for recent work, which means a lot more people will have to think about what to have for lunch during the week. On today's Food for Thought, we're talking about how to meal prep a great lunch to help us do better than PB&J sandwiches are J Kenji Lopez Alt and Deb Perlman, co hosts of the Recipe with Kenji and Deb podcast. Kenji and Deb, welcome back.

[J. Kenji Lopez-Alt]

Thanks for having us.

[Deb Perlman]

Thanks for having us on, listeners.

[Alison Stewart]

Let's get you in on the conversation. Do you have kids that you meal prep for during the week? What do you prefer to pack for their their meals? Are you a salad person or a sandwich maker? How do you spruce things up or prevent your meals from Getting boring? Our numbers 2124-339692-22433 wnyc. You can reach out to us on Instagram. We want your suggestions for excellent meal prep. By the way, you can share photos and recipes as well on social media. Kenji let's start with the little kids because children and adults sometimes have different tastes about what makes lunch great. What is the basis for a school lunch that is both appetizing and filling?

[J. Kenji Lopez-Alt]

Well, it's, you know, it's the same as what I do at home, which is that, you know, we follow what's called baby lead weaning. So our goal is basically provide a variety of things that are all sort of healthy and then let them choose and don't really push them towards anything. Let them Kind of choose themselves. But that's sort of the same philosophy I take with school where I pack a variety of things and I try and get a mix of colors and textures in there and then you know, they bring home what they bring home and sometimes they eat all of it and sometimes they eat only the peas and sometimes they eat only, you know, only the pasta or only the dessert. And you know, I think the key is really to be sort of nonjudgmental about that stuff because you don't know what reasons they left things behind and you don't want them to. Well, you don't want to build in any insecurities about the food because really you want, what you want them to do is be open to trying things again in the future because you know, tastes change day to day. And so, so it's very easy to get offended when they come home with a lunch that is only half eate. But you have to remember it's not, it's not you, it's them.

[Alison Stewart]

So Deb, you mentioned in Food52 that you have a system. You have two vegetables, one fruit, one piece of dried fruit and something savory. What are your strategies?

[Deb Perlman]

Oh, go ahead. Oh, I was gonna say I probably changed that system so many times over the years as my kids shift, their ages shift and I have two different kids who eat very differently. But it's a good, it's a good central philosophy. But I do a lot of what Kenji does. We do a lot of these bento style boxes, especially when the kids were younger where they can just have a bunch of little and they can just pick what works. You know, maybe it's a vegetable, maybe it's a fruit, maybe they graze. And that works a little better as my kids have gotten older. Especially the teenager, he loves the sandwich which makes it fairly straightforward and he also loves leftovers. So if we're eating dinner and he's like, oh this is really good, maybe I can take it to lunch, I will stop eating. I will be like that's it. It's insane. But you're like, let's put this in a thermos right now. We get too excited just to have it sorted. But your leftovers tend to be a very good place for us to start lunches.

[Alison Stewart]

Actually Kenji, what do you think the biggest mistake people make when they're packing their lunch?

[J. Kenji Lopez-Alt]

For kids, the biggest mistake? Well I, you know, I think, you know, really what I try and do is I think, I try and think about the situation. My kid is going to Be in during lunch. And to be honest, most of the time it's going to be among friends and totally distracted. And so thinking about it as if it's a meal that they're eating at home, one where they're going to sort of sit down and really focus with, you know, with a. With a fork and a knife and a spoon or something like that, and actually sort of focus on. On eating the meal properly. I think that's probably a mistake that you. That you shouldn't make because that's not the way the kids are going to be eating at school. And so, you know, as Deb said, having things that are sort of a little bit easier to graze on and things that are just, you know, I find what I try and do is I either make things very small, things that. That kids can pick up and eat easily, or I try and add sort of some level of interaction to it, you know, where. Where if it's a sandwich, I'll send the sandwich in deconstructed, for example, or if it's. Or if it's a. Say, some noodles, I'll send in a little bit of. I'll send in the noodles and broth in one thing, and then I'll send a little bit. A little cup of the toppings. Some. Some. Something that's going to give them a little bit of interaction. Something that's going to give them sort of something to do beyond just feeling like they're, you know, they're trying to fuel their bodies so, you know, making it fun and really sort of thinking situationally about what the kids are going to be doing while they're eating. I think is. Is the most important thing that. That I tend to. Well, that I try to remember that I think people tend to forget. You know.

[Deb Perlman]

I was gonna say, I would add that I think the same mistake I make when I prep kids lunches is the same mistake I could make when I prep my own lunch, which is to be a little too aspirational. This is not really the time to challenge anybody with a new or more wholesome food that any of us are craving. I'm not saying I'm just gonna put like, you know, box brownies in or something like that. But if, you know, you get to lunch and you're like, oh, that very, very healthy thing I prepared for myself is not something I'm craving anymore. For kids, it has to be four times. So. So I really try to just work with a template of whatever they're willing to eat, because if I push it it's just going to come back uneaten, which is a waste of everyone's time, and then they're hungry.

[Alison Stewart]

When you talk about food shopping ahead of time, Kenji, can you give us a good, a few examples of food items that are always going to go over well with kids?

[J. Kenji Lopez-Alt]

Yeah. So, you know, I, I like to use a bento box as well. I find that sort of a compartmentalized box that sort of predefines the number of things you're going to have in there and the portions really helps. And so the, the philosophy I use, generally I'll fill in the big thing first. You know, whatever it is, it'll be leftovers. It might be something fresh, but generally it's going to be leftovers, something the main thing. And then the other little sort of satellite areas I tend to fill with mainly raw fruits and vegetables. So my fridge, you know, I keep cherry tomatoes, I keep cucumbers. We keep all kinds of little fruits and vegetables that we cut up and that tends to be sort of what fills out those extra spaces. You know, sometimes it'll be little snack foods as well. You know, obviously, like everybody loves snacks and little kids love snacks. But as much as I can, I try and fill that out with sort of, yeah, raw fruits, vegetables and things that, that I can do just as fast as grabbing, you know, some chips from the, the, the pantry, but is going to give them a little bit more color, you know, color and texture and, and flavor contrast.

[Alison Stewart]

Listeners, do you have lunch questions or lunch tips? Give us a call at 2124-3396-9221-2433. WNYC. You can also text to us at that number. Do you need to break out of a lunch rut? Our lunch operators are live and standing by. 212-43396. On social media at Olivet WNYC. My guests are J. Kenji Lopez Alt and Deb Pearlman. They are host the recipe podcast. They're giving us some great lunch ideas. Now, Deb, I want to point out this is not to put you at the opposite end of thing. You don't do fancy or cute or fancy lunch boxes.

[Deb Perlman]

Not at all. And less so in the years since I've had kids. My oldest is turning 15 this week, so I've been doing this for a while. I would say we started out very cute and it's sort of gone downhill since or gotten more realistic since, which is why we're at a point where if my son likes our leftovers, that's what he's taking to school and we're thrilled. It was so easy.

[Alison Stewart]

So do you, do you use a certain kind of. No, it's okay. Do you use a certain kind of Tupperware? Do you prefer glass? What do you use as your, as your method?

[Deb Perlman]

We use a mix of stuff. So we have, we have, we have probably every lunchbox under the sun. But something that we like a lot are thermoses with the wide mouth. So it could be used for something like pasta or, or a soup or even like a leftover stew. And I love it when there's a little cup on top. We're often like have a little bag with maybe a piece of bread. And I also love those thermoses that have the little folded spoon or fork in the top. I find those really helpful. And they keep things really warm. And if your kid is a soup eater or they like a soup with pasta in it or they like a stew, something like that, that stuff is fantastic in the winter. It keeps really well. You could make a big batch of it and they can have it for a few days. So that's always been a big hit in the winter.

[Alison Stewart]

We got a question. It says, any suggestions for lunch besides hummus that is low in cholesterol, so no cold cuts or cheese? My husband has OD'd on hummus.

[Deb Perlman]

Let's see, what do you think?

[J. Kenji Lopez-Alt]

So I like a good, I find a good chopped like a kale salad, some, some sort of hearty green that, that stands up to, you know. So, so kale salad is excellent because those greens, you can dress them in the morning and they don't. And they'll still be crispy, you know, the next day even. They don't kind of wilt the way a regular salad does. So, so kale salad with that, with a bunch of sort of protein added to it. So it could be something like canned garbanzos that you marinate overnight in some olive oil and vinegar, a bunch of raw, raw fresh vegetables. I mean, I find a good chopped salad to be like a really good lunch in general. And, and that's one that kind of, especially if you do it with hearty ingredients like that and you add plenty of protein in there, it's something that's going to fill you up. It's something that also like, is convenient for lunch because it doesn't matter if it gets shaken. And you know, which is an issue sometimes with, with my kids lunches. My, my daughter sometimes gets up, gets upset if it's the kind of stuff that where, if her backpack gets shaken around and all the things get mushed together. She doesn't love it. But yeah, a good chopped salad I think is good for kids or adults. And, and marinated kale in particular stands up well to, to a lunchbox situation.

[Alison Stewart]

Here's another text. Kids like warm meals, and I have a hard time keeping food cold or hot. Suggestions?

[Deb Perlman]

Definitely the thermos. We do a lot of wrapping, like heating things a lot in the morning, wrapping them in a couple layers of foil and hoping for the best, that it'll make it a few hours. But it's definitely important to assess what foods kids are willing to eat somewhere between warm and room temperature before you start or they're going to throw away something if there's, you know, my kids don't mind a thermos of soup and a grilled cheese sandwich. Even if it's not piping hot, it's still just a little warm. But if your kid's going to throw it in the trash, you know, it's good to know that going in.

[J. Kenji Lopez-Alt]

What, what I find though, with hot foods, especially leftovers, is that foods are better if you're, even if you're going to be eating them whether you're going to be eating them at room temperature or not. Well, if you're going to be eating them at room temperature, foods are better when they have cooled down to room temperature as opposed to warmed up to room temperature. So even if they're going to be eating it four hours later in the middle of the day, generally I will actually reheat their food. Anything that's supposed to be served hot, I'll reheat it till it's like piping hot in the morning right before I pack it into their bento. And so then, you know, by the time it cools down, it might be room temperature, but the texture of everything will be much better than if, than if it had just come straight out of the fridge and into the box. So that's one thing I find actually helps a lot, is heating it up till it's piping hot in the morning, even if it's going to cool down. And as far as safety goes, you know that, that all this stuff is obviously sort of a personal risk that you have to take or personal questions you have to take. You know, the government will tell you, don't put hot food for four hours in a, in a box that you're going to send to your kids. Generally, you know, I tend to play it a little fast and loose with those rules, but you Know, you kind of have to make your own choices there, I think.

[Alison Stewart]

Let's talk to April from Ossining, New York. Hi April, thanks for calling all of it.

[J. Kenji Lopez-Alt]

Hi.

[Caller]

I have a tip about sliced apples in the lunchbox. You don't want them to go brown and common. Please said to sprinkle lemon, but the kids may not like that. It is so simple. You just put some salt in room temperature water and dip the apples in that water and they don't turn brown.

[J. Kenji Lopez-Alt]

I think my mom used to do that.

[Deb Perlman]

Yeah, I was gonna say, I remember us discussing this in a podcast. I feel like it came up once and it's a great trick. I tend to like, I take apples apart, I have them and then I take the core out and then I smush them back together and I'll even wrap them and hope that that limits the browning. But you know.

[J. Kenji Lopez-Alt]

Oh, well, I, I find apples, apples these days to. They come in a variety of sizes. So you just get a tiny apple, right. And you don't have to. And you don't have to worry about speaking.

[Deb Perlman]

Of course it's apples for them. What even, even the high schooler gets that.

[Alison Stewart]

This is speaking of kids, what they'll eat. Someone texted. I was also a bento parent and my kids loved peeled hard boiled quail eggs. They're cute. And one bite.

[J. Kenji Lopez-Alt]

Yes. My kids love those. Yeah, we do. We sometimes do. Yeah, I was gonna say we sometimes do breakfast for like my daughter, my older kid Will, she's seven and she'll sometimes request breakfast for lunch. And when we do that, it'll be a couple of hard boiled. Hard boiled quail eggs in there. Yeah. You know that I think that's fun. Bite sized foods are fun. You know, with kids it's like any way you can make it more interactive or make it cute, you know, like they like that. So if you do have the time, and I'm not suggesting that people do have the time to do this generally, but it's like if you can make your, your rice ball into the shape of a cute panda, that's going to make your lunch go over better. Right. And you know, I never really do stuff like I don't really have the time to do stuff like that. But, but sometimes like I'll stick little black sesame seed eyes on her, you know, like on her, on her hot dog pieces or something like that. Some little things like that. But you know, anything that you can do that makes them feel like you thought about and that makes them think, oh, like my, my parents Were thinking about me a little bit. You know, a little. A little. Like, I have these little cards that have jokes on them. I stick them in there. So just things that make your kids feel. Everyone. Everyone wants to feel special. It's. It's the same as when you go to a restaurant. You know, part of it's the food. But really, people go to restaurants because they want to feel good. You know, they want to feel welcome, and they want to feel like they're taken care of. And I think it's the same. It's. You want to make your kid feel like. Like someone. Think someone's thinking about them. Right.

[Deb Perlman]

I don't know. I'm gonna have to ask my daughter. She's upset I didn't send her with a joke card today. I know. I can't believe on a radio show talking about, like, lunches, when we literally sent my daughter today with the egg sandwich she didn't want to eat for breakfast. We made it. She's like, I don't want this. I'm like, wrapp foil and I'm putting it in your lunchbox. And that's. I'm telling you, that's the way some days are here.

[J. Kenji Lopez-Alt]

I mean, we're just speaking purely aspirationally here today.

[Deb Perlman]

Aspirationally, it would have been something freshly made for her lunchbox, but we'll see if it worked. Actually, my daughter asked for bagels with cream cheese and loxalot. I know, that's like the.

[J. Kenji Lopez-Alt]

Oh, yeah, yeah. No, my daughter does that too.

[Deb Perlman]

She loves that for lunch. Sometimes we do it a little bit, like, dissected with a cream cheese on the side so she can dip it and then the lox. And then we'll often do a heart. We do a hard boiled egg. I hadn't even considered quail eggs. And. And we often do a couple pickles in there because that's a big hit with her.

[J. Kenji Lopez-Alt]

No, I mean, you know, Lunchables got it right. You said you. Everything deconstructed. They like the, you know, kids like to put things together themselves.

[Deb Perlman]

Exactly.

[Alison Stewart]

We'll have more about lunch after a quick break. This is all of it. This is all of it on wnyc. I'm Alison Stewart. My guests are J. Kenji Lopez Alt and Deb Perlman. They are the hosts of the podcast the Recipe. With Kenji and Deb, we are talking lunches for kids and for grownups. We wanted to move on to grownups, but we're getting a ton of texts about kids, so let's dive into these a little bit. This one. Any ideas on how to dress up a pbnj? A favorite. What do you think, Kenji?

[Deb Perlman]

You know, we're down. I was gonna say. I say leave it. My kids don't really. My kids. My kids do not appreciate when I judge up classics in general. And my goal is to get them to eat the food, but I might put some stuff on the side. But in general, for me, classic, worst, best. How about you, Kenji? Do you usually your PB and js.

[J. Kenji Lopez-Alt]

No, we, you know, we, we. They actually don't eat that many PB and js. We're just not a PB and J family. But if I were to send them in with PB and JS again, I would probably follow the same advice I do for all sandwiches, which is send them in deconstructed. Like, send them in with all the ingredients separate so that they can put them together themselves in little. You know, if you get like little. I, you know, I have these bent. These bento boxes from a company called Bent Go, and they make these little cups that snap on and fit inside the boxes. And so I would put my jelly and my peanut butter separate and the bread separate. Maybe I would put some sliced bananas, you know, anything that you might stick into your PB and J. Normally put it all separate and let them assemble it themselves. I think it'll. It'll come back more. More eaten and more enjoyed than if you put it together, you know, and let the jelly soak in. Nobody likes that, right?

[Alison Stewart]

This one says. This text says, during COVID school, breakfast and lunch was free for all. At school. We tried it and never looked back. My picky eater can fight with the poor lunch lady every day. Now instead of me, got another text that says, my high schooler also doesn't have seating for lunch, so he always wants a handheld meal. Tired of wraps and sandwiches and. Any suggestions?

[J. Kenji Lopez-Alt]

Oh, a handheld meal. That's not a wrap or a sandwich.

[Caller]

Wow.

[J. Kenji Lopez-Alt]

Yeah. Cinnamon with like a. Like a tomahawk steak and just hold it by the bone, you know? Yeah. Honestly, I'm not sure. I feel like a sandwich is like the perfect, best taco sandwich. Adjacent things. Yeah, Tacos and wraps.

[Deb Perlman]

Yeah. Maybe it's wrapped inside a pita like a skewer and you don't eat the pita afterwards. But I feel like it's going to be a little bit tricky.

[J. Kenji Lopez-Alt]

Honestly. That's a tough one. Yeah.

[Alison Stewart]

Well, think about it. Maybe it'll come to you. This one says, my grandson loves chickpeas in any form. You can make a Crunchy chickpeas, chickpea salad or just plain loaded with flavor and protein. Someone else said mujdira is a great lunch. Lentils and farique brown rice with sauteed onions. That sounds awesome. So that's gonna be my segue into adults when you, you know, as a kid, as a kid, as an adult we all bring salads. Everybody brings salads. I bring a salad every day. I get really bored with salads. What can you advice can you give me about a salad?

[Deb Perlman]

You know, I'm a big fan. I do love a grain salad, a bean salad. I love a lot of extras in it. It helps me like. So I'll have the toasted nuts and like my favorite cheese and some chopped up apples. I try to kind of make it fun, but I also think it's nice to have some good sourdough on the side or something that makes it feel a little less monotonous. How about you Kenji?

[J. Kenji Lopez-Alt]

So I keep marinated ingredients so it'll be. So typically it'll be some kind of bean in my fridge. And so what I'll do is I'll take the beans. You can do this with canned beans or you can cook them fresh. But you take your beans, you drain them and then you marinate them just in a container with a lot of olive oil, about 2 to 1 olive oil to vinegar. And so for a can of beans it might be about a quarter cup of really good extra virgin olive oil, a couple tablespoons of vinegar. Generally I'll put in some thinly sliced red onions or shallots and you just maybe some chopped parsley, some herbs and you just kind of leave that there's, you can leave it there up to four or five days and the flavor will kind of improve over time. So I'll do that with chickpeas. I'll do it also with certain vegetables. So like cucumbers and red onions. I will salt them and marinate them again in olive oil vinegar and kind of let them sit overnight and they kind of soak up that flavor. So I find if you get these really flavorful marinated like packed flavor packed ingredients. And of course if you don't have the time for that, you could do something like say a canned marinated artichoke or sun dried tomato. But having these really sort of bursts of flavor that you're going to toss in with your salad I think are go a long way to sort of bring bringing the flavor up and you know. Yeah, so it's, it's sort of a mix of Marinated, crunchy ingredients, fresh ingredients, you know, and, and so when, yeah, when I think about a salad, I really try and get all these like a wide variety of flavors in there. And yeah, keeping marinated vegetables in the fridge is sort of my, my trick.

[Deb Perlman]

Lana, don't discount the cold noodle bowl. I love to make udon or buckwheat noodles. And oh yeah, you can put a lot of salady things on that while not maybe feeling like you're eating something with the austerity of a salad salad. But there's so many great dressings and sauces you can put on them and it's kind of fun. You know, you can use your slivered carrots, your marinated cucumbers and all those things go great on it, including even a soft cook egg.

[J. Kenji Lopez-Alt]

So, you know, going back to that question about handheld foods, the classic Japanese answer for that, the one that, that my grandmother would bring on every road trips is onigiri, you know, omusubi. So you're basically rice balls with fillings. And so I do that actually my daughter's lunch boxes a lot, especially if we've had, had fish the night before. You know, say there's like a half salmon fillet that's left over from someone's plate that you don't just want to microwave and reheat. You know, you can shred it up and add it to add it to the leftover rice and season the rice with a little bit of vinegar, salt and then you make it into rice balls. And I pack the seaweed, the nori like separately. You know, the little packets of them, the snack packs of nori that I packed separately. And so they can kind of take the nori, take the little bit of the rice mixed with the fish and make these little sort of, you know, bite sized little mini, mini onigiri that they, that she eats as she goes. So that's a really good sort of handheld, simple, simple way that I use to get rid of particularly leftover seafood.

[Alison Stewart]

Here's a text. Big thumbs up for Deb. Suggestions on a hot entree and a thermos. In addition to leftovers, freshly made pasta is a reliable winner. Just a note, the noodles continue to cook, so start out al dente in the morning. Another benefit of a thermos, an opportunity to teach kids responsibility. Because the thermos becomes disgusting if not cleaned properly.

[Deb Perlman]

Oh my God, we've been there. Oh.

[J. Kenji Lopez-Alt]

And everything in the becomes disgusting if it's not closed up properly and you.

[Deb Perlman]

Have to clean it.

[Alison Stewart]

Let's Talk to Kim from Harlem. Hi, Kim. Thanks for calling Olivet.

[Caller]

Hi. I wanted to suggest parents or even adults consider using Lunchbox L U n C H B O t S. It's a parent who created some really neat ideas for lunches and lunch containers. And at that website you can get lots of lunch ideas. Loads of bento boxes, different wide, hot and cold thermoses of different sizes. And you have stainless steel, so it's more hygienic. But I've used it as a parent and I've packed lunch for 18 years.

[Alison Stewart]

Thank you so much for calling in, Kim. All right, I want to hear your favorite lunch that you bring to work. What do you say? What do you think, Deb? What's the lunch you bring that just brings you joy?

[Deb Perlman]

I am so excited when I have leftover dumplings and a little dipping sauce. It makes me so happy. Even if they're just room temperature by the time I'm eating them. I get so happy when I have extra dumplings. So I'm thinking like, you know, pot stickers or some sort of steam dumpling. I love it with a vegetable filling. It makes me so happy. It feels special.

[Alison Stewart]

How about for you, Kenji?

[J. Kenji Lopez-Alt]

Well, I work from home, so I don't bring my lunch. But you know what I, what I do like to do when I'm packing lunch is I make my own sort of instant noodles, you know, so, so essentially I'll take some pre cooked noodles. It can be rice noodles, it could be ramen, something like that that I've chilled and put them in the bottom of a mason jar. And then I stack a bunch of toppings on top of there so it'll be a bunch of fresh vegetables. Sometimes what I actually like to do is I'll put in some dehydrated like, like beef jerky, like a good quality beef jerky. Some dehydrated meat or some dehydrated seafood, and then a little bit of miso paste, a little bit sauce, some vinegar, lime juice. And then, you know, essentially take that in and all you have to do is add hot water to it and stir it up and you get a nice sort of flavorful instant instant noodle bowl that you can kind of customize in the jar. That's what I like to do.

[Alison Stewart]

Some great advice from Jay Kenji Lopez Alt and Deb Perlman. They are the co hosts of the recipe. Hey, thanks so much for your advice.

[J. Kenji Lopez-Alt]

Thanks for having us.

[Deb Perlman]

For having us on.

[J. Kenji Lopez-Alt]

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