Is Cultural Criticism Dead?

Summary

Podcast Summary: "Is Cultural Criticism Dead?"

All Of It with Alison Stewart – WNYC
Original Air Date: September 22, 2025

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Overview:

This episode tackles the state and future of cultural criticism in the age of shrinking media budgets, the proliferation of user-generated review platforms, and the dominance of short-form, recommendation-driven content. Host Alison Stewart is joined by Charlotte Klein, New York Magazine features writer and author of "Do Media Organizations Even Want Cultural Criticism?" The episode weaves together industry trends, personal anecdotes, listener calls, and reflections on how criticism is evolving—or disappearing—and why that matters.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. What is Cultural Criticism?

• Definition: Transitioned from primarily written, essayistic responses to art into a wider multimedia approach (audio, video, online formats).
• Discovery & Depth: Historically, print allowed readers to stumble onto compelling criticism, which now happens less with algorithm-driven, siloed online content.

“A book review, you need not have read the book to feel moved by the review or to care about it… now we consume things online in such siloed manners that you don't really have that room for discovery, which is why I feel like a lot of places are moving away from it.”
(Charlotte Klein, 01:44)

2. Industry Shifts & Job Losses

• Multiple major outlets have eliminated or reassigned critics: AP cut book reviews, Chicago Tribune and Washington Post lost longtime film critics, and others are “rethinking” criticism roles.
• No single reason: Financial pressures, changing readership habits, and adaptation to new media formats all play a role.

“AP... got rid of its book reviews… Chicago Tribune's film critic took a buyout. The Washington Post film critic took a buyout. The New York Times… had a shakeup… Vanity Fair got rid of Richard Lawson, their chief critic... It seems like a pattern and a moment worth visiting this topic.”
(Charlotte Klein, 03:03)

3. From Criticism to Recommendations

• Platforms like Goodreads, Letterboxd, and TikTok have democratized opinions but replaced deep analysis with quick takes and ratings.
• The shift is also shaped by how digital consumption habits limit attention spans and prioritize “service journalism” (e.g., “If you liked X, try Y”).
• Debate: Is anything lost when criticism is a crowd-sourced, rapid-fire enterprise?

“People sort of just want recommendations sometimes. They want rankings. They don't really want the whole meditation on why something is worth reading or not.”
(Charlotte Klein, 19:10)

4. Review vs. Criticism

• Reviews: Summative, plot-focused, consumer guidance.
• Criticism: Contextual, interpretive, often essayistic—asks larger questions about meaning, history, and the critic’s personal connection.

“A review in the traditional sense is probably reviewing what you saw... Criticism puts it in a much broader context... it's as much about the world that the book creates as the book that created the world.”
(Charlotte Klein, 08:26)

5. Democratization vs. Expertise

• More voices can now participate, but the loss of trained critics means reduced access to deep scholarship and historical perspective.
• The merits of “gatekeeping” are weighed; some mourn the loss of expert-guided discovery, others embrace broader participation.

“It's so democratized now and in a lot of ways for the better... But there's also, I think, a reason that we have these critics who are like, true scholars and know so much about the history and just come from a different place.”
(Charlotte Klein, 13:14)

6. AI and Aggregators—A Crisis of Critical Thinking?

• AI can aggregate and summarize, but lacks the subjective, personal engagement that marks genuine criticism.
• Flood of “AI slop” and information overload have made trusted critics more vital, even as the profession shrinks.

“AI is very good at reviews... but it doesn't deal with engagement. It doesn't deal with a personal take on something... that's what criticism provides that reviews don't.”
(Roy, Professor at The New School, 24:27)

7. Generational & Cultural Shifts

• Traditional critics often came from narrow demographics, limiting perspectives.
• There's a new emphasis on inclusion, but sometimes at the cost of strong, clear opinions; younger critics may be less willing to be "tough."
• Callers and Klein reflect on how this diffuses the sharpness and individuality of criticism.

“People shying away from being tough has... maybe that is a generational difference... then you lose that strength of like a strong point of view as a critic has.”
(Charlotte Klein, 20:32)

8. The Role of Podcasts & Alternative Formats

• Podcasts and conversational formats may allow for more nuance, context, and personal voice than some written reviews.
• Hosts and guests celebrate podcasts for bringing expertise and personal reaction together in accessible ways.

“I think podcasts actually allow for maybe more nuance than written forms have in the past... It's both, you know, deeply personal, their own responses, but then their expertise.”
(Charlotte Klein, 26:55)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On the Value of the Essay:

  “I agree, that the essay still holds its weight in society. Reviews are a dime a dozen. Everyone has a say now, and frankly, it’s exhausting.”
  (Listener Text, 12:50)

• On Roger Ebert’s Legacy:

  “I miss his film criticism because they were more like essays, not just film reviews... Through his essays, he always established a personal connection and an empathy to what he just watched.”
  (Marcos, Caller, 07:00)

• On the Danger of Losing Critical Thought:

  “The death of cultural criticism is so much tied to the death of critical thought in itself.”
  (Charlotte Klein, 26:28)

• On Social Media & Marketing:

  “Social media's focus on aesthetic and trends often promotes books that are not necessarily even well written, just well marketed.”
  (Savannah, Listener Text, 28:00)

• On Teaching Criticism:

  “I need their response because that's what I’m missing. I can understand the history and my perspective, but I need their perspective...”
  (Roy, Professor, 24:27)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• 00:10: Introduction – What is good criticism? The value of Kael, Tate, Morris.
• 01:44: Charlotte Klein explains the changing definition and formats of criticism.
• 03:03: Breakdown of major media layoffs and editorial changes affecting critics.
• 08:26: Distinction: review vs. criticism.
• 13:14: Democracy vs. expertise—the role of the gatekeeper.
• 15:38: Caller Lauren’s story about how criticism changed her daughter’s reading.
• 17:47: Discussion of why criticism is more necessary now, yet less supported.
• 19:45: Generational shifts in the tone and perspective of criticism.
• 24:27: Roy, New School professor, on teaching criticism/wrestling with AI.
• 26:55: The power and nuance of podcasts for criticism.
• 28:00: Trends in social media’s influence on recommendation culture.
• 29:41: Charlotte Klein’s favorite modern critics and current critical venues.

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Listener Participation – Key Themes

• Nostalgia for Critic-Led Discovery: Callers reminisce about following specific critics for guidance and discovery.
• Criticism as a Teaching Tool: Teachers emphasize introducing students to criticism to foster deeper understanding.
• Concerns about Superficiality: Many lament the rise of "star" ratings and crowd reviews over in-depth engagement.
• Diversity and Perspective: Discussion on broadening the critic's demographic—but questions about whether newer voices are empowered to be truly analytical or critical.

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Final Reflections

• Cultural criticism is in a period of profound transition. While accessibility and democratization have increased, there is a palpable sense of loss around depth, expertise, and critical engagement.
• New formats—especially podcasts—offer hope for nuanced dialogue, but professional criticism as a craft faces existential threats from economic pressures, AI, and shifting consumption habits.
• The episode closes with appeals for renewed appreciation of criticism—not just as consumer advice, but as an essential part of how we think about and engage with culture.

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For further reading:
Read Charlotte Klein’s original article, "Do Media Organizations Even Want Cultural Criticism?" in New York Magazine.

Listeners’ picks for favorite critics include:

• Roger Ebert (film)
• Ann Powers (music)
• Helen Rosner (food)
• Wesley Morris, Richard Brody, and others

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Summary compiled for listeners who want depth without the digression—just the “all of it” that matters.

Transcript

[Alison Stewart]

Good cultural criticism can help you decide how you should spend your time. Really good criticism can deepen your understanding of a piece of art, even if you disagree with it. Think about Pauline Kael, Greg Tate or even Wesley Morris's Pulitzer Prize winning writing on the Fast and the Furious franchise.

[Caller Pedro]

And.

[Alison Stewart]

But in the age of media cutbacks and with the rise of apps like Letterboxd, Goodreads and TikTok, critics and reviewers and getting the two conflated, perhaps it's reached a crossroads. New York magazine ran a piece titled do Media Organizations Even Want Cultural Criticism? It was written by Charlotte Klein, who joins me now in studio. Welcome to the studio.

[Charlotte Klein]

Thank you. Thanks for having me.

[Alison Stewart]

Listeners. Do you read reviews? Do you read criticism? Is there a difference to you? Are there critics that you follow? Tell us about a piece of cultural criticism that has really stuck with you. Whenever it was written, what impact did it have? Our phone number is 2124-3396-9221-2433, WNYC. We also want to know what do you look for in criticism and reviews? Do you want to understand a book or do you want to know if something good or bad has happened before you've read it? Do you want a recommendation for something similar? What do you think cultural criticism should offer? Our number is 212-433-WNYC-212-433-9692. Okay, as people get ready, they call in. Join us on air. Charlotte, I wanna ask you a couple of questions. When we talk about cultural criticism, what are you talking about exactly?

[Charlotte Klein]

So I think we're talking about, I mean, it used to be mostly written pieces about different works of art or experiences, but now it's also audio. So this piece focused much more on the written side of it. But I do feel like the audio side is important and actually probably why some places have moved away from the written component. But we're just talking about sort of the, you know, it's not only a review of what happened in a movie, but what it felt like to go to the movies, you know, more broadly, which I feel like A.O. scott at the Times always did very well. And, you know, but some great pieces of cultural criticism, I would say a book review, you need not have read the book to feel moved by the review or to care about it. And those pieces are just, you know, it's more esoteric. It's not as, I mean, when things were packaged in print publications where you could just stumble upon something, you had more of a chance of reading, of reaching someone who might, even if they hadn't read the book, be compelled to consume the review and then maybe feel moved by it. But now we consume things online in such siloed manners that you don't really have that room for discovery, which is why I feel like a lot of places are moving away from it.

[Host or Moderator (possibly a WNYC host)]

I talked about media organizations ditching reviewers.

[Alison Stewart]

Just so people understand. Could you explain who's out of a job?

[Charlotte Klein]

Yeah. So, I mean, the impetus for the piece was just seeing over this past summer how many different sort of changes were happening. AP the Associated Press got rid of its book reviews. They were pretty explicitly saying that it just didn't make financial sense anymore and based on readership and whatnot. The Chicago Tribune's film critic took a buyout. The Washington Post film critic took a buyout. The New York Times is a little bit of a different situation, but basically they had a shakeup in which four of their critics have been reassigned and they have at least announced that they're rehiring for two of those positions. So it seemed like they just wanted to shake that up. And then Vanity Fair got rid of Richard Lawson, who was their chief critic. Again, Vanity Fair is new editor. So there's not really. And then they're sort of rethinking their stance on criticism. So there's not really a unifying reason for all this happening. But, you know, it was enough that it seems like a pattern and a moment worth visiting this topic.

[Host or Moderator (possibly a WNYC host)]

Did you notice was there anything that the critics had in common? Hmm.

[Charlotte Klein]

I mean, I would say they've all been probably been in the job for quite some time, so that that could be part of it. But no, I mean, I think, I think that media organizations are in this position where they're forced to. It's not a new thing to be able to look at analytics and see what people are and aren't reading. But I just think as you have to make these financial decisions and also just like you are so tuned into the way people are consuming, which is increasingly not in written form. All these places turning to video and audio, and I'm talking about video and audio both in the way that the Times does their vertical videos, but also say The Ringer has 10 plus cultural podcasts. So I just think places are definitely trying to adapt to the new form to try to reach people through video and audio. But it is, there's something lost when you're, you know, talking about criticism in a 5 second or 20 second video, you know, and you don't have time to sort of really unpack it and. Yeah.

[Host or Moderator (possibly a WNYC host)]

How long has the trend been going on? Did this happen suddenly or did this happen over time?

[Charlotte Klein]

I mean, I think it's been happening for years, like, in speaking with people. I mean, some people even notice, you know, cultural criticism, specifically arts and theater criticism, have been, you know, in decline since the Internet. Like, I think for so many of these places. Criticism has been in decline since the Internet because, you know, used to. A lot of critics used to be employed by the sheer fact that theater, you know, shows used to need to take out ads on next to the theater reviews and whatnot. And for the local papers, you know, AP used to have a lot of their book reviews syndicated by, you know, different local papers, which are increasingly disappearing. And so all of that has been happening over time. That's certainly not a new thing. But I think with the. The way it feels like this moment accelerated, it's definitely. It feels like we're in a different moment and sort of on the threshold of something else.

[Host or Moderator (possibly a WNYC host)]

Yeah. I'm speaking to New York Magazine features writer Charlotte Klein. She's the author of the article do media organizations Even Want cultural Criticism? We want to hear from you. Is cultural criticism important to you? Is the review that stuck with you over time? Should media organizations invest in critics, or should they be rethinking what criticism looks like? Give us a call at 2124-3396-9212-4433. WNYC. Let's talk to Marcos, who's calling in from Brooklyn. Hi, Marcos. Thanks for making the time to call all of it today. Marcos, are you there?

[Caller Marcos]

Yes.

[Charlotte Klein]

Hello.

[Caller Marcos]

How are you?

[Host or Moderator (possibly a WNYC host)]

I'm doing well.

[Caller Marcos]

So I would have to say cultural criticism is still very important for me as an English teacher at a high school. I always tell students to. I always tell students to look at criticism as a way. I am here. Can you hear me?

[Host or Moderator (possibly a WNYC host)]

Yeah, you're on the air.

[Caller Marcos]

Okay. Hi. I just want to point out that a critic that I miss is the late, great Roger Ebert. I miss his film criticism because they were more like essays, not just film reviews, about the negative and positive aspects of film film. Through his essays, he always established a personal connection and an empathy to what he just watched. For example, in his 2008 review of the movie Doubt, starring Meryl Streep, he begins with an anecdote about Catholic school and how certain critics felt Meryl Streep's performance was a caricature. He points out that it's not because in his experience as a Catholic school student, she's exactly the type of archetypical nun that you would see in a film like that. So I really connected with that.

[Host or Moderator (possibly a WNYC host)]

Thank you so much for calling. Marcos, do you want to respond?

[Charlotte Klein]

Yeah, I mean, I think that that's sort of. That's what we were just talking about, which is that some of the best pieces of cultural criticism are, you know, they're intensely personal as well, and they're as much essays as they are, you know, quote, unquote, reviews. And I think these days there's even less need for what you think of as a review, where you're purely recounting information and more for that kind of essayist style.

[Alison Stewart]

Do you see a difference between a review and criticism?

[Charlotte Klein]

Yes. I mean, it came up so often when I was reporting this piece because, you know, people really do differentiate. I would say, like, the broader public probably thinks of them as one and the same just because they. They do get lumped together. But I would say review in the traditional sense is probably reviewing what you saw, like having a take, whether it's summary of the plot and then what you made of it and how it felt, whatnot. And then I think criticism puts it in a much broader context. You tend to have more space. It's not just about the work, but it's about where the work fits into, let's say, the last 30 years of theater history and, you know, the world. It's as much. Someone said this to me when I was reporting the piece, like, it's as much about the world that the, let's say, book creates as the book that created the world in that sense of, like, it's a much more symbiotic thing.

[Alison Stewart]

Let's talk to David, who is calling in from Massachusetts. Hi, David, thanks for calling. You are on the air.

[Caller Lauren]

Hi.

[Caller David]

Thanks for taking my call. And I guess thanks for having the conversation, because I love reading criticism. And it's certainly like the. A crisis in criticism is a kind of. I don't know, it's a topic that's in the air. And I think. And I. I also just appreciate that you cover art on the show. I don't think there's a lot of public radio that covers art. That's part of why I listen to all of it. And in terms of criticism, I think that it is true that there's some changes going on, but I think it's possible that it's not specific to criticism, just about a shift from legacy media to other forms of media. And they help, you know, carry meaning in different ways. And the interesting Stuff happens in different locations.

[Alison Stewart]

David, thank you so much for calling in. This is an interesting text. It says, I think a shift in consumption of critical writing is a broader.

[Host or Moderator (possibly a WNYC host)]

Cultural trend than just media.

[Alison Stewart]

And it goes on.

[Host or Moderator (possibly a WNYC host)]

I'll read the whole thing. It says, I'm very interested in perfume and find that engagement with long form.

[Alison Stewart]

Thoughtful analysis of fragrance and fragrance trends.

[Host or Moderator (possibly a WNYC host)]

Has diminished in favor of quick blurbs and instant gratification. Online discussion forums. That's an interesting point of taking it outside of the art, but also to, to a greater expanse, to more than just media. What do you think?

[Charlotte Klein]

Yeah, yeah, I would agree with that. I mean, it's, you know, the age of Reddit. You just use. Type something into Reddit. Even if it's, you know, the finale of a show. It's like you get, I mean, this is about art. But I'm saying, let's even just say with this, you can get a one line summary and people upvoted it or downvote it, and that's sort of your takeaway from, you know, whatever it is you're watching. Same with restaurant reviews. Same with. But again, I'm still talking about art, I guess. Yeah, I think just, I mean, all of this comes back to the fact that people read less now and people consume information differently. That's not a new thing. But I do think, and I think also, you know, we, like at New York magazine, we're trying to adapt in the sense of just, you know, we're doing some cultural takes, more tied to the news as well, but then also, you know, more on social media. And I think that it's just about being, you know, agile and willing to try different things and not just, you know, but yeah, definitely a decline in just general time spent talking about things like the amount of attention devoted.

[Alison Stewart]

Can you think of a piece of cultural criticism that. That really affected you?

[Charlotte Klein]

Yes. So Claire. What is her name? Claire.

[Alison Stewart]

We'll figure it out. Claire.

[Charlotte Klein]

Claire's on thing. She wrote this amazing piece in the Paris. Claire dedater wrote this amazing pie in the Paris Review. Sort of at the height of MeToo called. It was like, what do we do with all these monstrous men? And I'll never forget reading that piece because that was sort of one of those pieces that was like, it was basically about, you know, do you still watch Woody Allen? Do you still, you know, you still. And it went into sort of different relationships that these artists had with their, with, you know, women and sort of their tortured relationships and whatnot. And I just thought that was such a Smart. It was both like current, talking about Woody Allen and whatnot. But it also went back, I think Kafka's in another, you know, Vera and whatnot. And so it all sort of tied together. So I'll never forget reading that. That was a big one for me.

[Alison Stewart]

This text says, I agree, that the essay still holds its weight in society. Reviews are a dime a dozen. Everyone has a say now, and frankly, it's exhausting. I still read essays in the New Yorker. That's an interesting point because, yes, there are a million views, but it's also taken down the gatekeepers a little bit.

[Charlotte Klein]

Yeah, 100%. And that's, you know, that's sort of a mixed thing. Like, some people feel like we should have more gatekeepers and we should bring that back. I mean, Michael Grimbaum's book about Conde Nasta came out over the summer, was a lot about that. But, yes, it's so democratized now and in a lot of ways for the better. I mean, anywhere from substack to Twitter to like we talked about earlier, Reddit, Goodreads, letterboxd. But I do think there is something to be said about the fact that you would maybe be more likely to read something, say, in the New York Review of Books just simply because of who wrote it. And so in that way, I think you are, you know, more open to discovery because you're not necessarily just reading a piece of criticism about something that you have consumed. And so I think that, yes, it is nice that we have, you know, more amateurs can sort of jump into the conversation. But there's also, I think, a reason that we have these critics who are like, true scholars and know so much about the history and just come from a different place. I mean, those are sort of, I think, the jobs that are really being lost. And so, and I don't think it has to be. It's mutually exclusive. But I do feel like there's a lack of appreciation for, like, actual scholarship expertise, critical expertise.

[Alison Stewart]

And to that effect, we got a text that says, ann Powers, best rock critic. That is all we are talking about. The article do media organizations even want cultural criticism? My guess is New York Magazine features writer Charlotte Klein. We'd like you to weigh in as well. Is cultural criticism important to you? Is there a review that stuck with you? Should media organizations invest in critics, or should they be rethinking about what cultural criticism looked like? And what would it look like? Our number is 2124-3396-9221-2433 wnyc we'll have.

[Host or Moderator (possibly a WNYC host)]

More of your calls and more with.

[Alison Stewart]

Charlotte after a quick break. You are listening to all of it on wnyc. I'm Alison Stewart. My guest in studio is Charlotte Klein. She wrote the piece for New York Magazine. Do media organizations even want cultural criticism? We're gonna get you in on this subject. Let's start with Lauren, who is calling from Oakland, New Jersey. Hi, Lauren. Thanks for taking the time to call. All of you're on the air.

[Caller Lauren]

Hi. I wanted to make a comment. My daughter is in high school, and as a part of her freshman year summer reading, she had to read a separate piece by John Knowles. And now that they're reviewing it in class, he needed to find a critique and then decide if it's something she agreed with or didn't agree with and if it influenced her reading the book. So she didn't really think that was relevant because, you know, the book is a. It's a, an older text and she just didn't really see the value in it. But then as she found different critiques, they really helped her understand the book better and understand how she was reading it, too. So, you know, initially it was, why is this relevant at all? But then it really helped her understand the novel.

[Alison Stewart]

Thank you so much for calling in. Let's talk to Pedro from Bergen County. Pedro, you are on the air.

[Caller Pedro]

Hey, everybody.

[Caller Pedro (continued)]

Good morning. Thank you for having this conversation. I just want to echo what other callers have said. I think the issue of the decline of legacy media is a general trend together with critical thinking, period. I'm from the time when reading John Parelles or Peter Watford's was, you know, I look forward to that. You know, great music critics at the time and. But now I, you know, some of my, one of my kids, one don't want to speak for all of them, but, you know, judges movies by how many stars it's got on some MDB or whatever. And that's how he goes about his friends picking movies. I think critical thinking in general, anything that has to do with, with that, it's just moving to other, to other mediums. But in terms of money making, if you're going to make decisions related to commerce, and I'm thinking, I think it's going obviously, I mean, just look what's going on. It's just going somewhere else.

[Host or Moderator (possibly a WNYC host)]

Thank you so much for calling in. You wrote about this a little bit. The irony of decline of written criticism is that nearly everyone I spoke agrees that it is more necessary than ever. It's in your piece what were the arguments for it being more necessary? Kind of like what Pedro was talking about?

[Charlotte Klein]

Yeah, yeah. I think. I mean, obviously AI and just the amount of AI slop that people are dealing with 24, 7, where they're trying to decipher not only the. Sometimes it's just like, is this real or not? Is this a real factor? Is a real person written this or whatnot? But I do think that. Yeah, it's. I mean, we've. It's both AI and. But it's also. We've just never had more information or more takes or anything just because of the Internet and the many platforms that are to air that. And so in that respect, it really falls to cultural critics to sort of be these bigger voices of like, not only what's good and what's bad, but here's how to understand this, but also what's good and what's bad. I mean, I think there's a huge service component to it. And you can see that a lot of places, like including the New York Times, have sort of leaned into the service. More servicey element of it. Of, you know, if you like the Gilded Age, you should read these five books or, you know, if you, you know, whatever you name it. You know, movies like Fallout or.

[Host or Moderator (possibly a WNYC host)]

Yeah.

[Charlotte Klein]

Or whatnot. But. And that definitely has a time and place. And I think that is part of criticism is sort of weeding that out. But it's not just a matter of recommending things to people. And that's what I feel like is getting lost. And I think in especially having so much information and AI, it's like people sort of just want recommendations sometimes. They want rankings. They don't really want the whole meditation on, you know, why something is worth reading or not.

[Host or Moderator (possibly a WNYC host)]

I want to ask you a question. There might not be an answer for it, and it's something that I have talked to my staff about ever since the show first started, was.

[Alison Stewart]

How much of a critic's point of view is important to the story. Because for people doing reviewing, it was often one kind of person who did that kind of reviewing, a well educated person, often a white man, until like the, you know, 2010s. And that was whose point of view you got about this film. And they may not understand the nuances of a different kind film, of a different cultural film. So my question was, how have the generations changed the way reviewers are? How have the generational differences changed the way critics are being received? Because I may read this and be like, that's this old guy's point of view.

[Charlotte Klein]

Right, Yeah. I mean, it's a great question, and I don't have a perfect answer, but I will tell you that this came up even in responses I got from critics. After my piece came up, which was multiple people mentioned, critics got pretty nice. And that's, of course, that's an opinion. So, you know, people definitely have other ones. But I do think that there was. I mean, even maybe the New Yorker piece about the state of pop criticism, I think also referenced this, where it's either cool find, like, cool finding sort of the is this good or is this not? Or what's a discovery? Or sort of laudatory praising. And I think that people shying away from being, you know, tough has. And maybe that is a generational difference because there's been a need to sort of open, rightly so, open people's minds to different types of. Like you were saying, you know, not being. Not having just one. Not there just being one opinion about it. But I think at the same time, then you lose sort of that strength of like a strong point of view as a critic has.

[Host or Moderator (possibly a WNYC host)]

Let's talk to Nolan, who's calling in from the Bronx. Hi, Nolan, thanks for calling, all of it. You are on the air.

[Caller Lauren]

Hi, thanks so much for taking my call. Yeah, really appreciate the conversation. I'm calling from the Bronx. I was born and raised in Wisconsin, and in college I was introduced to art criticism. I grew up, you know, reading Pitchfork reviews and kind of scathing takes on albums that at first I thought were good, and then I listened to it and I thought, maybe I'm wrong. So I guess my comments and sort of question is, you know, I think first it's less about what media companies want, I think, and more about what they're going to have to do to survive, especially under the current administration's takedown and censorship and cancellation and also just the lack of funding for independent media. And then my second point and sort of like, question is, you know, I think we're living in a culture where people are less likely to be open to the fact that they might be wrong about something. People don't really want to hear, that maybe what I thought was not correct. And I think good criticism demands that of people, that our minds are open to thinking the thing I thought and that I was convinced of might not be the right opinion or I might have been misguided. So, anyways, I think it's a really important conversation that has really deep and broad impacts on our culture and society. So thanks for having the conversation.

[Host or Moderator (possibly a WNYC host)]

Thanks so much for Calling. Let's talk to Roy in Montclair, New Jersey. He's a professor.

[Alison Stewart]

Hi, Roy.

[Host or Moderator (possibly a WNYC host)]

Thank you so much for taking the time to call all of it. You are on the air.

[Caller Pedro]

Thank you for taking my call. I teach at the New School, Cultural Criticism and History, and specifically a class. One of my main classes is called the Next New now, the Performance of Culture, from Romanticism to Punk. So I'm covering a lot of different areas and finding. Getting the students to engage in different kinds of cultural expression across the arts and across other forms of culture. And one of the things that we're confronting right now is the influence of AI and the way in which people are using that as an aggregate of different kinds of opinions, and especially in the review versus criticism debate. AI is very good at reviews because it can kind of give you a summary. It can give you an aggregate of different kinds of opinions about what people are thinking about something. But it doesn't deal with engagement. It doesn't deal with a personal take on something and an ability to understand it from a personal perspective. And that's what I'm trying to instill in my students. That's what they have to offer. I can tell them all the details about what may have happened in Weimar Germany, for instance, but they have the response to it, and I need their response because that's what I'm missing. I can understand the history and I can understand my perspective, but I need their perspective in order to get a fuller picture of what's happening in the world right now. And that's something that criticism provides that reviews don't, and something that I think we're missing with the kind of wash of AI and the way in which it's aggregating response rather than engaging people to think for themselves.

[Host or Moderator (possibly a WNYC host)]

Roy, how do your students receive that?

[Caller Pedro]

A lot of times they're confused because they've been given in high school that this is the way you need to respond to something. So I have them write weekly response papers. And I tell them specifically, don't summarize the reading. Don't, you know, have. Have something to say. And they don't know how to respond to that because they have been trained basically to skew back what they've been told. And they don't have the opportunity to open up and engage things, usually by the end of the semester and into their college careers. They can find value in that and come to cherish it, come to see that that is what they have to offer. I'm teaching in a humanities program. You know, these People are going to go out and get jobs, and I'm assuming that they're going to be engaging with the cultural industry because that's kind of where we live in this program that I teach in. So I'm telling them that that's their value, you know, that's what they can bring to the world, that they can open up to something and have a perspective and be able to respond to it and bring together different kinds of thoughts and different kinds of eras and different kinds of imaginations of what might be happening in the world in the past and in the present and in the future and potentially in the future. So they get it eventually, but the first. The first stumbling block is just getting them to open up to doing something that comes from them, rather than what they think they're supposed to do.

[Host or Moderator (possibly a WNYC host)]

Roy, thank you so much for calling. Did he say anything that really resonated with you, Charlotte?

[Charlotte Klein]

Yeah, I mean, I think this just again, talks about sort of like the death of cultural criticism is so much tied to the death of critical thought in itself. I mean, I think it's just a different. It's just a different way of using your brain and. And practicing a certain way to think. And so when you're just looking at reviews or sort of recommendations, you lose that because you're not really engaging with that work and figuring out how you actually feel about it.

[Alison Stewart]

Do you think that's possible to accomplish through podcasts?

[Charlotte Klein]

I do. I actually. I think podcasts are actually allow for maybe more nuance than written forms have in the past. I think that listening to two people sort of talk about. I mean, I personally, you know, I love the Watch, which is Chris Ryan and Andy Greenwald's show, and the Ringer, and I love nothing more than sort of listening to, you know, watching Task, the new HBO show, and then hearing them talk about it, you know, a day or two later. Because I'm like, I know what I thought about it. I'm so curious to hear what they made of that episode. And they're gonna bring up stuff that I didn't even think about, but they're also sort of gonna talk about this in a broader context that I'm, you know, that I wouldn't have about the person who made the show and the actors and whatnot. But also. And that how it fits into the trajectory of HBO Sunday night shows and whatnot. But then they're also talking about the experience of watching. So that's something that I really appreciate about podcasts when it comes to cultural criticism, is it's like it's both, you know, deeply personal, their own responses, but then their expertise is people who've chronicled this for years in the industry.

[Alison Stewart]

This text says, this is Savannah texting from Nashville. I'm 25 and often see book and.

[Host or Moderator (possibly a WNYC host)]

Movie recommendations on social media. I think social media's focus on aesthetic and trends often promotes books that aren't. Not that are not necessarily even well written, just well marketed. It can be really helpful, though, to have a short list of. If you liked blank, then you might like these. A lot of this is about marketing. We should say that.

[Charlotte Klein]

Definitely.

[Host or Moderator (possibly a WNYC host)]

Tell me a little bit more.

[Charlotte Klein]

A lot of it is about marketing. And also, I mean, it is a service. I've definitely, you know, I finished a book recently and I googled, like, books, like so and so, because I wanted to read more of that. And yeah, a lot is about marketing. I think that it's hard also, too. You know, critics themselves have to be brands these days. So it's not just the work stands alone. They have to sort of market themselves. And some people do that. I mean, our own Jerry Saltz and Eric Mack does that incredibly. And he's a force on social media, and he's still doing written criticism and he's doing videos. So that, I think is a great, you know, example of the way that you can adapt to both, you know, market yourself, but also have your work speak for itself.

[Host or Moderator (possibly a WNYC host)]

This text says, I love and value pop culture happy hour because of their different points of views. And even if I disagree with them, I feel like it enriches my experience. This text says cultural criticism by experts is crucial. Most online amateurs don't have the depth of knowledge or the willingness to do actual research to understand what they are criticizing and how it fits into the larger framework of that discipline or context of culture and. Or politics, or they just don't care. Care. What have you found in terms of modern critics? Who is a modern critic that you like today?

[Charlotte Klein]

Modern critic that I like today. I mean, I've talked. I've already.

[Host or Moderator (possibly a WNYC host)]

Wesley.

[Charlotte Klein]

Yeah. Wesley Morris is incredible. The people you know at the Ringer, Sean Fantasy and Chris Ryan and Andrew Greenwald, I love. And, you know, they're Bill Summons, their boss who does great criticism. I don't know. I mean, you know, Richard Brody I still love at the New Yorker, and I think as far as food, you know, food criticism, Helen Rosdart at the New Yorker and Matthew Schneier at New York Magazine are amazing, and I think they still have great impact. But personally, I find myself either consuming it through an audio perspective or written just because that's, you know, that's sort of, I think if I'm, if I'm also looking for to discover something, then I'm probably going for written. I probably don't want to listen to someone talk about something that I have no idea that I haven't watched or consumed. But with the writing, I think you have more room for that.

[Host or Moderator (possibly a WNYC host)]

The name of the piece is Do Media Organizations Even Want Cultural Criticism? You should take a moment and read it. It's by Charlotte Klein, New York magazine's feature writer. Thank you to all of our callers who called in with such excellent comments, and thank you, Charlotte, for coming to visit us at all of it.

[Charlotte Klein]

Thanks so much.

[Ira Flato]

This is Ira Flato, host of Science Friday. For over 30 years, the science Friday team has been reporting quality science and technology news, making science fun for curious people by covering everything from the outer reaches of space to the rapidly changing world of AI to the tiniest microbes in our bodies. Audiences trust our show because they know we're driven by a mission to inform and serve listeners first and foremost with important news they won't get anywhere else. And our sponsors benefit from from that halo effect. For more information on becoming a sponsor, visit sponsorship.wnyc.org.