Journalism, Performed: Reporting On Weight Loss Drugs Like Ozempic

Summary

Podcast Summary: All Of It – Reporting on Weight Loss Drugs Like Ozempic

Introduction

In this episode of All Of It, hosted by Alison Stewart on WNYC, the conversation centers around the burgeoning topic of weight loss drugs such as Ozempic and Wegovy. All Of It, a show dedicated to exploring culture and its consumers, collaborates with Theater of War Productions to present journalistic pieces through dramatic readings followed by in-depth discussions. This particular episode delves into the complexities of weight loss medications, their impact on individuals' lives, and the societal perceptions surrounding their use.

Reading of the Journalistic Piece

The episode features a poignant excerpt from Rebecca Johns' article, "A Diet Writer's Regret," which is performed live by actress Hope Davis. The reading provides an intimate glimpse into Johns' personal struggles with weight gain and the subtle, everyday choices that contributed to her gradual weight increase over decades.

"I didn't think much about food because I didn't have to. But unlike some friends I know who don't care at all what they eat or who treat meals like brushing their teeth, a necessary form of self maintenance that doesn't require much attention or result in much pleasure."
— Rebecca Johns [01:47]

Johns reflects on her transition from enjoying food to experiencing uncontrollable weight gain despite efforts to maintain a healthy lifestyle. The emotional depth of her narrative sets the stage for a broader discussion on weight loss medications and the societal stigmas attached to them.

Guest Insights

Rebecca Johns, the author of the featured piece, joins Alison Stewart and Brian Doris, Artistic Director of Theater of War Productions, to discuss her experiences and motivations behind her writing.

Rebecca Johns shares her transformative journey with Manjaro, a GLP1 weight loss drug, highlighting both the physical and psychological impacts:

"The food noise just goes away immediately. All that kind of background noise of what am I going to have for lunch and what am I going to make for dinner? ... It really surprised me."
— Rebecca Johns [12:00]

She emphasizes the dual nature of these medications—while they offer significant benefits for individuals with medical conditions like diabetes, they also present challenges when used for cosmetic purposes. Johns candidly discusses the stigma associated with taking such drugs, advocating for a more compassionate understanding of their role in health management.

Brandon Johns, Rebecca's husband, provides a personal perspective on the changes witnessed in their relationship and the broader implications of weight loss medications:

"Seeing that snap of where she just would not want to eat anymore... And I think it does get at the idea that we often judge people who struggle with their ability to eat as weak people as moral failing, when there just is clearly so much more going on there."
— Brandon Johns [13:54]

His insights shed light on the emotional and relational dynamics influenced by Rebecca's weight loss journey, challenging societal judgments about weight and personal responsibility.

Theater of War's Role in Cultural Discourse

Brian Doris elaborates on how Theater of War Productions integrates dramatic readings with journalistic work to foster meaningful conversations:

"We're going for the human... one of the maladies we suffer from as a culture is that we are numbed, we are inured to the news we consume."
— Brian Doris [05:32]

He explains that by performing these journalistic pieces, actors like Hope Davis infuse emotional resonance into the stories, making them more relatable and impactful. This approach aims to break through cultural numbness and encourage audiences to engage deeply with the issues presented.

Audience Participation and Community Engagement

Throughout the episode, Alison Stewart and Brian Doris encourage listeners to share their own experiences with weight loss and weight loss drugs. This interactive element underscores the show's commitment to building a community around diverse perspectives and lived experiences.

Insurance and Accessibility Concerns

Rebecca Johns discusses the financial barriers associated with prolonged use of weight loss medications:

"The maintenance dose is the one that the insurance company will only pay for twice a year. So if I want to continue to stay on it, I might have to find a way to pay for it out of pocket."
— Rebecca Johns [17:09]

She highlights the privilege of having insurance coverage that partly supports her treatment, raising important questions about accessibility and equity in healthcare.

Conclusion

The episode concludes with a reminder of the upcoming live discussion airing on March 22nd at 2 PM on WNYC. Brian Doris and Rebecca Johns reinforce the need for open, nuanced conversations about weight loss medications, their benefits, and the societal stigmas that accompany them. By blending dramatic readings with thoughtful discourse, All Of It successfully illuminates the intricate interplay between personal health journeys and cultural perceptions.

Notable Quotes

• "The key idea is that actors bring emotional weight to what they're reading, making the journalism feel alive and human."
  — Brian Doris [05:32]

• "There is a biological component to weight loss and a mental component, a head component to weight loss that was just impossible for me to get over before."
  — Rebecca Johns [08:08]

• "We often judge people who struggle with their ability to eat as weak people as moral failing, when there just is clearly so much more going on there."
  — Brandon Johns [13:54]

This episode of All Of It offers a compelling exploration of the personal and societal dimensions of weight loss drugs, inviting listeners to reflect on their own experiences and the broader cultural narratives that shape our understanding of health and wellness.

Transcript

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[Listener]

Listener Supported.

[Alison Stewart]

This is all of it on wnyc. I'm Alison Stewart. Theater of War Productions has partnered with WNYC to create a series of discussions around topics in the Zeitgeist. The idea is to take a piece of journalism, have an actor read it live in front of an audience and then discuss it. Last month, actor Chad Coleman from the Wire read a heart wrenching piece that ran in the New Yorker about the murder of Jordan Neely. On the subway in April, Oscar Isaacs and others will read a piece from ProPublica about mental health and navigating the insurance industry. And this Saturday WNYC will air the discussion we are about to talk about right now about weight loss drugs. No matter where you are, watching TV or taking the subway, ads for Ozempic, WeGovy and other GLP1 drugs are inevitable. While these drugs can be life changing to those with medical issues like diabetes, they can also be used for cosmetic purposes. And they're expensive. A piece that ran in the Atlantic called A Diet Writer's Regrets by Rebecca Johns was a Theater War event. It was read by Hope Davis. Here's an excerpt from the reading.

[Rebecca Johns]

I didn't think much about food because I didn't have to. But unlike some friends I know who don't care at all what they eat or who treat meals like brushing their teeth, a necessary form of self maintenance that doesn't require much attention or result in much pleasure. I've always enjoyed food. I like the crunch of sunflower seeds on my salad, the melt of cheese on a burger. When I was in college I took a part time job at McDonald's. I could walk there and hey, meals were included. The freshman 15 suddenly turned into 30. I took a weightlifting course and swam laps and bought a bike. I quit my fast food gig for a part time office job. Though the weight gain slowed, it never stopped. Throughout my 20s and 30s I gained 5 to 10 pounds a year, a result not of frequent pig outs but of small daily failures. That one extra piece of pizza, a couple of Oreos after dinner, a slice of the office birthday cake.

[Alison Stewart]

Author Rebecca Johns is here with us. Hi Rebecca.

[Brian Doris]

Rebecca, are you there?

[Rebecca Johns]

Let me check to see if Rebecca?

[Listener]

Yeah, can you hear Me.

[Alison Stewart]

I hear you now. Nice to meet you, isn't it?

[Listener]

Nice to meet you too.

[Brian Doris]

And we're also joined in studio by Theater of War artistic director Brian Stories.

[Alison Stewart]

Welcome, Brian.

[Brian Doris]

Thank you so much, Alison.

[Alison Stewart]

Listeners, we want to hear from you.

[Brian Doris]

Have you struggled with your weight? What has or hasn't worked for you? Are you on or have you ever been on a weight loss drug?

[Alison Stewart]

What was your experience? What do you wish people knew about.

[Brian Doris]

Trying to lose weight? Give us a call at 212-433-WNYC 212-433. You can call in and join the conversation or you can text to us. Brian, how does the series having actors read the words of journalists fit into Theater of War's larger mission?

Sure. Theater of War Productions has been around 18 years. We've got over 40 projects that all use readings of important texts to frame crucial conversations with audiences that often have sort of difficult and taboo subjects at the center of the discourse. We started with the military and that's led us to all kinds of other places, homeless shelters, public housing. Over the span of the last 18 years, we've moved from the ancient texts to Shakespeare, now to journalism. And the idea, the theory behind the work is that we can bring to bear these amazing actors who are part of our company. We've got over 200 acclaimed actors who take part, bringing all of their skills to the reading of long form journalism in a way that not only brings it alive, but brings a kind of an emotional valence to the reading so that we can maybe feel a little bit more what we should be feeling when engaging with the news. And so that's the idea behind the series. We perform the texts from magazines like the Atlantic, the New Yorker, ProPublica, and then we hear from audiences about how they've been affected by the reading. People in the room, Rebecca, how did.

It feel to hear your words read aloud?

[Listener]

Hope was absolutely incredible. I was fortunate enough to sit in on the rehearsals ahead of time and Brian gave her incredible directions. She just got every ounce of nuance out of that piece, both the humor and the sadness. So it was a little surreal.

[Brian Doris]

She said that you directed Hope well.

[Progressive Insurance Ad]

Yeah.

[Brian Doris]

How do you direct a piece of journalism?

Well, here's the thing. As journalists, I'm sure you know that there's this kind of myth of journalistic detachment that journalists can't be emotional. And there's a reason for that. There has to be sort of a kind of objectivity to journalism. But what we're doing is in journalism, it's the performance of Journalism. And there, there's this opportunity for actors to do something else, to, to bring us in touch with our emotions. So the note I give all the actors is to find that place to bring a certain emotional weight to what they're reading. Not to overdo it, but not to undersell it. And I think, you know, when you hear audio of long form journalism right now, it either sounds like AI or it often is AI Often. And that's sort of the opposite of what we're going for. We're going for the human. I would say that one of the maladies we suffer from as a culture is that we are numbed, we are inured to the news we consume. We don't, we're not in touch with how it affects us to read about the stories we hear every day.

Do you think because there are too many.

I think there's too many. I think also the media itself is a one way stream in our model. It's a two way discussion. And that's Theater of War productions work for the last 18 years. It's about seating the floor and passing the mic to the audience and believing that there's wisdom in every audience, especially audiences that have something at stake, some skin in the game. So the idea is that actors have this role to play in helping us break through that numbness and really be in touch with how we respond to the news. But that other people in the room also, with their reactions, have a role to play in helping us attune ourselves to what really matters in the stories that we're hearing.

And that's what we're asking you. Audience, become part of the conversation we'd like to hear as we talk about Rebecca's story. Want to hear your story as well. Have you struggled with your weight? What has or hasn't worked for you? Have you ever been on a weight loss drug? Call in and tell us your experience. 212-433-WNYC 212-433-9692. You can call in, you can join us on air or you can text that number. I'm speaking with Brian Dorries, artistic director of the Theater of War production, and Rebecca Johns, author of A Diet Writer's Regret as part of the Theater Awards presented by WNYC series. This is airing on March 22, right?

Yes.

Okay. Rebecca, you wrote this piece after writing for women's magazines about health and dieting while you were struggling to maintain your weight. What prompted you to be so vulnerable?

[Listener]

Well, the use of Manjaro, which I've, I've now lost almost 80 pounds since I started taking Manjaro. It was kind of revelatory that all the things that I had spent so many years trying. I think I had worked under the same assumptions as everyone else that if there was some kind of magic formula, something that would unlock my ability to lose weight, to reduce my food intake enough that the weight would start to come off the. That there was some secret that other people knew that I did not. And the change that occurred when I started taking Manjaro was so immediate and so noticeable and so dramatic that I felt that it was only right that I say something, not just for my own sake, but for the sake of all the people who read all the diet advice I wrote all those years know that. That there is a biological component to weight loss and a mental component, a head component to weight loss that was just impossible for me to get over before. And that has been changed as a result of taking this medication. I also think there's a stigma against taking the medication. I have a good friend who reached out to me after the piece ran and said that she had been prescribed Wegovy for Covid related diabetes and she was resisting taking it because she felt embarrassed or that she shouldn't be taking this drug. And I felt that it was important to say something for people to see that this is part of your overall health journey. It's part of becoming a healthier person, taking care of your health. This friend of mine did not have a weight problem. She was prescribed this drug by her doctor. And I want her to feel like she can take it without feeling ashamed because she needs it for her health, to keep her diabetes in check.

[Brian Doris]

What were some of the issues that you wanted to be discussed or to be talked about a little bit when you talked about Rebecca's story? I'm asking this to Brian, by the way. Brian, what is it that you wanted to discuss in terms of Rebecca's stories? Part of it did you want to take out of the journalism of it?

I mean, what was so powerful about Rebecca is that she, as herself, as a journalist, was being vulnerable in writing the piece. So here we have an actor delivering the emotions of her piece. But she's already taken this huge risk in writing this piece of where she's made herself vulnerable, told her story. So we're asking the audience to do the same, to be present with their own journeys of weight loss, to talk about the stigma of weight, the complexity of GLP1 drugs like Ozempic and Manzaro. There's like you Know, for some, it's a miracle. For 30% of people, it doesn't work at all. For some, people hold moral judgments like Rebecca mentioned. For some, it's seen as failing. For some, it changes the entire game. And so we wanted to create a space that could hold all that complexity because it's a conversation that demands space, a space of complexity where we can hold contradiction and hear each other's perspectives.

[Alison Stewart]

Rebecca, when you first start taking the drugs, did you have any side effects?

[Listener]

Yes, fortunately, my side effects have been pretty minor. I do know some people, including my own husband, who've taken wegovy and had some severe side effects. So it's hardly a cure all for everybody. But, yeah, there's some digestive side effects just because it changes the way you eat. And. But also the biggest side effect, I think, was the mental portion of it, how. And I've talked to other people about this, how the food noise just goes away immediately. All that kind of background noise of what am I going to have for lunch and what am I going to make for dinner? And, you know, how can I hang on and not eat something until it's prescribed, meal times, etc. So all that, all that was gone immediately. That was remarkable. So, and that really surprised me. So I wanted to share that experience, you know, for good or ill. It's not, like I said, it's not going to be a miracle for everybody, but, you know, as somebody who has kind of slowly gained weight over 30 years and then rapidly lost it, I felt like I kind of owed it to be honest about what was actually going on with me. So when people reached out and they were asking me on social media, what did you do? How did you do it? I felt like it was an imperative that I actually be truthful about it, not hide, not equivocate about what was going on with me. And to actually tell the truth, let's.

[Brian Doris]

Listen to another clip from Theater of War's exhibition, exhibition event.

[Alison Stewart]

This is. I'm sorry, this is a piece about her husband, your husband, his name is.

[Brian Doris]

Brandon, and how he had to change his eating habits once you were on the meds.

[Alison Stewart]

Let's take a listen.

[Brandon Johns]

Hi, I'm Brandon. Full disclosure, I'm Rebecca's husband. But I wanted to. I wanted to provide a perspective on what happened to the other half of that cheeseburger that didn't get eaten. And what's been interesting about this journey with Rebecca is that seeing the snap of where she just would not want to eat anymore. And really, when the manjaro kicked in and she would be going through. And we have a lifelong relationship of eating. Going out to eat is one of our favorite things to ever do and to see that just kind of go away. My being raised to not waste food, my desire to eat, the fact that I like to overeat, overeating is fun. It's terrible, but it's fun. And so I wound up in the early times of this, picking up what was left over. And sometimes it was healthy food. It wasn't always like fast food. But that gets to the moral failing issue of it. Was I failing morally? Was I being a glutton? Was I being weak? Whereas this drug was allowing my wife to be able to turn that part of her brain off, and it just acted in an instant. And I think it does get at the idea that we often judge people who struggle with their ability to eat as weak people as moral failing, when there just is clearly so much more going on there.

[Brian Doris]

What did you get out of her husband speaking out?

Well, it just humanized Rebecca's story all the more to hear her partner, you know, in life, talk about observing her journey and how it impacted him. I think he was also speaking to a theme that we were talking about a lot in the room that's part of the installment, which is judgment. And where does that judgment come from? Is it. Is it from our culture? Is it from the media? Is it from religion? Is it from our puritanical heritage? Is it the inner voice that. That, you know, was sort of inculcated when we were children? And how do we move past that voice of judgment to both accept ourselves, to accept help, to pursue paths of healing? So he was opening that conversation up even wider by acknowledging he loves to eat just, you know, and don't we all? And. And also acknowledging the complexity of, you know, when we cast moral judgment upon people who are heavy or overweight or who pursue medical interventions for addressing that, where does that come from, you know, and is it. Are we right to judge and, you know, or have we been taught to judge by external forces that we should also be interrogating? So the conversation is very much about that, too. Let's look at the industrial. Let's look at the food industry. Let's look at the for profit medical industry. Let's acknowledge that this is not a simple question of whether you made a moral choice or not when you ate the cheeseburger or finished it that night.

Interesting text. I'm a nurse who was a chubby kid, curvy young person, and then I became a fat postmenopausal hypothyroid matron. I've always exercised. I did a tough 13.5 mile with 2015. But Wegoli was a game changer. Two years in, 35 pounds lost. No shame here, which I think was very interesting. Rebecca, these drugs are expensive. You wrote in a piece that at a certain point your insurance will stop covering it and you have to make some big decisions. Where are you with that?

[Listener]

Well, I have been reapproved for one more year. I don't know if that will continue. I'm still trying to lose another 20 to 30 pounds before easing off the medication or going down to a maintenance dose. The maintenance dose is the one that the insurance company will only pay for twice a year. So if I want to continue to stay on it, I might have to find a way to pay for it out of pocket. You're supposed to take these drugs every week. So only getting two of my doses covered a year would be, you know, very, very expensive for me to cover if I'm going to stay on it, you know, so I am aware that that is a position of privilege that I have insurance that would cover it partly. I have insurance that would cover it because I was edging into the diabetes range. So it was kind of a necessity for my health. And my, my doctor was very relieved to prescribe it to me. And I should say that the doctors who were in the room for the performance on Thursday were, I think, almost universally in favor of using this as a tool for people with health related, you know, weight related health issues. So, you know, I'm 54. If I were to continue to have diabetes, I could expect some very serious health problems. I think possibly staying on the Manjaro long term is maybe less of an issue than risking going back into, you know, diabetic blood sugar range. But would I want my 16 year old daughter to go on it? I. I don't know. Because we don't know what the long term implications are.

[Brian Doris]

And those are one of the stories that you can, you can discuss in Theater of War.

[Listener]

Absolutely right.

[Brian Doris]

What time does it air on March 22nd? I should know this.

2Pm on WNYC.

Excellent. I've been speaking with Brian Doris, artistic director of Theater of War, and Rebecca Johns, author of A Dieter's Writer's Regrets. It's part of Theater of War presented by WWNYC series airing March 22nd at.

2Pm 2pm thanks for your time. Thank you so much. Alison.

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