Podcast Summary: Kassa Overall's 'Animals' (Listening Party)

Podcast: All Of It with Alison Stewart (WNYC)
Air Date: January 8, 2024

Episode Overview

This episode of All Of It features an in-depth conversation with Kassa Overall, a boundary-pushing drummer, producer, and rapper, about his latest album, Animals. The discussion centers on Kassa's creative process, mental health, and the unique blend of jazz and hip-hop that defines his work. Alison Stewart guides the conversation with thoughtful prompts, while Kassa offers honest, personal reflections on music as therapy, collaboration, and evolving as an artist.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

Kassa’s Artistic Journey & Commitment

• Finding the Confidence to Go Solo (03:37):
  Kassa recounts his years as a gigging musician before releasing his solo debut around age 35. A turning point came when his partner, Lauren DeGraff, challenged him to fully commit:

  "She was like, yo, you put all this time and energy into this album and you're gonna run around playing in everybody else's band all year? Like, if you're gonna do this, you have to, like, commit to it and say no and be broke and just start from scratch.” (04:31, Kassa Overall)

• Persistence Through Setbacks (05:08):
  The pandemic struck just as Kassa’s previous album was gaining momentum. Kassa reflects on honoring the artistic process:

  “If you try to make something good, you try to make something that's better than your last thing—it's done when it's done, and you have to honor that process.” (05:56, Kassa Overall)

Songwriting & Emotional Readiness

• Knowing When a Song Is Ready (06:38):
  Kassa describes balancing older song ideas and new material, choosing tracks emotionally resonant enough to fit the album's narrative.

  “When I'm listening to the music and I'm almost finished with it, and it makes me emotional to listen to it, that's how I know it's time.” (07:13, Kassa Overall)

Exploring Mental Health Themes

• The Meaning of "It's Animals" Skit (08:37):
  The skit "It's Animals" symbolizes the intersection of mental health struggles and institutional responses:

  “It represents...the overlap between people having mental conditions but also being treated just as...normal people...You can't necessarily judge everybody's actions in terms of what a sane person would do.” (08:56, Kassa Overall)

• Music as Therapy (11:20):
  On “Make My Way Back Home,” Kassa raps, “Now the music is my therapist, we talk it out every night in the booth.” Elaborating, he shares:

  “I used music as a means to wash off the world...Practicing is a way for me to cleanse out whatever I'm going through.” (12:26, Kassa Overall) “Those moments [in music] affirmed my existence and my journey and my path.” (12:04, Kassa Overall)

Collaboration & Creation

• Choosing Collaborators (14:45):
  Kassa explains his intuitive process for involving friends and admired artists:

  “Even though I can do it all...I can't do it all emotionally...It's a different vibe that a different person is going to bring.” (15:10, Kassa Overall)

• The Unique Making of "Going Up" (17:05):
  Kassa recounts piecing together the song after losing the full session to a broken hard drive, co-writing with Francis and the Lights, and featuring Ishmael Butler and Lil B.

  “...I know this is a strong song, but I can't figure out lyrically what to do...I got help.” (17:57, Kassa Overall) “I dropped it down this flight of stairs.” (18:43, Kassa Overall, on the hard drive mishap)

The "Backpack Producer" Approach

• On Recording Anywhere (20:55):
  Kassa describes his mobility and preference for recording with others in their space, coining the term:

  “I would put all my gear in a backpack...I go to people's houses...there's something about being in person that you can't really recreate.” (21:19, Kassa Overall)

Paying Homage & Musical References

• “No, it ain't” and Homage to Classic Songs (22:50):
  Kassa confirms the intentional musical nod to “You're All I Need to Get By” and describes the layered trombone arrangements.

  “That's a straight tip of the hat. Yeah, for sure.” (22:54, Kassa Overall)

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Criticism and Artistic Acceptance

  “I've read some things that made me definitely go like, wow. I guess they're entitled to their own opinion, but maybe they also didn't listen that closely.”
  (08:04, Kassa Overall)

• Celebrating Collaboration

  “It's just an honor to have artists...that I look up to, to kind of validate what I'm doing.”
  (16:30, Kassa Overall)

• On Loss and Transformation

  “Yeah, you wouldn't have this song if that didn't happen.”
  (19:07, Alison Stewart, on the hard drive mishap and resulting song)

Music Listening Highlights (Key Timestamps)

• "So Happy" — 02:22
• “It’s Animals” skit — 10:19
• “Make My Way Back Home” (ft. Nick Hakim) — 13:20
• “Going Up” (ft. Ishmael Butler, Lil B, Francis and the Lights) — 19:17
• “No, it ain’t” — 23:45

Conclusion

This episode offers listeners a compelling portrait of Kassa Overall as an artist and thinker—charting his journey through setbacks, creative breakthroughs, and mental health advocacy. The conversation is practical and philosophical, with candid anecdotes and musical excerpts enriching the discussion. Whether debating the value of persistence, honoring collaboration, or unpacking the healing power of music, Kassa and Alison Stewart deliver an inspiring and grounded exploration of artistry in contemporary culture.

For the full music experience, check out the tracks referenced above on Kassa Overall’s album 'Animals.'