Medium Build's 'Country'

Summary

Podcast Summary: ALL OF IT (WNYC)

Medium Build's 'Country'

Date: June 20, 2024
Host: Koosha Navadar (in for Alison Stewart)
Guest: Nick Carpenter (Medium Build)

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Overview

This episode of ALL OF IT features an intimate listening party and interview with Nick Carpenter, the Alaska-born singer-songwriter behind the indie/folk/country project Medium Build. In the wake of his April release "Country"—his first studio album since 2019—the conversation delves into Carpenter's creative process, the role of nostalgia, finding authenticity as an artist, and memorable facets of his personal journey, including tips from an unusual internship and sentimental tributes to Shrek.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Authenticity in Songwriting

• DNA of the Album:

  • Carpenter wanted "Country" to feel imprinted with his personal DNA, meaning music that is deeply personal, honest, and doesn't chase mass appeal.
  • Quote: "I'm not interested in telling anyone else's stories, but mine or the stories that I want to tell... I'd rather make something that I like and hope that the people that are into it come along." (04:04–04:45)

• Authenticity as Medium Build’s Core:

  • Since inception, Medium Build has always foregrounded honest, real-life narratives, even when that means being less palatable.
  • Quote: "That's been the recipe since the beginning. It's just been say the honest thing, say the real thing..." (04:51–05:09)

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2. The Role of Nostalgia and Memory

• Song: "In My Room" (06:00)

  • Inspired by a childhood bedroom songwriting prompt; reflects on lonely, imaginative childhood moments with humor and pop culture references.
  • Host observes numerous relatable '90s references (Matrix, The Simpsons, Weird Al).

• Intentional Use of Nostalgia:

  • Carpenter is careful not to let nostalgia sugarcoat pain, using it to highlight rather than obscure emotional complexities.
  • Quote: "Generally nostalgia is a bad detour... It's like sugar. You don't want to use too much of it, but in the right doses it can be really effective, right?" (07:22–08:25)
  • Describes blend: "What I'm really doing is... internal family system therapy work, but I'm couching it in this humor and nostalgia device." (07:22–08:25)

• Finding the Right Balance:

  • Early Medium Build songs went "too much" into introspection; now aims for a "union between the material and the delivery method," mixing vulnerability with accessibility.
  • Quote: "This song felt... my favorite song from the record to play live. And it feels like I nailed the—let's do both. Let's laugh, let's look back, and let's give that kid empathy and... a voice." (08:42–09:36)

• Evolving Sound:

  • Tries to create music his mom would appreciate, leaning into simplicity and clarity.
  • Quote: "...she was just like, this stuff is so yucky and difficult to listen to... every year I try to make something Lydia would like a little bit more." (09:54–10:38)

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3. Travel, Change, and Creation

• Song: "Cutting Through the Country" (10:57)
  • Born out of a literal and metaphorical journey: relocating solo from Alaska to Nashville after a breakup, capturing the manic, hopeful energy of reinvention.
  • Quote: “We made it... This is the demo... I wanted the cadence of the lyrics to have sort of the feel of like an Earl Sweatshirt song. ...There’s no break, it's just brain just coming to you..." (12:26–13:55)
• Recording Process:
  • The studio take was a creative "Frankenstein," pieced together from several partial performances, so performing live was a new challenge.
• The Subaru Legacy:
  • The old car that carried him cross-country also stars in the music video, a symbol of journey and resourcefulness.
  • Quote: "That Subaru is rocking... It's the official car of Alaska." (15:23–15:33)

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4. Organization, Craft, and Lessons from the Industry

• Disney Publishing Internship:
  • Lessons in cataloging and organization profoundly impacted his approach to songwriting and archiving ideas.
  • Quote: "I learned write less and write everything down. Just be organized because there's so many beautiful songs just lost on people's phones." (16:12–16:54)

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5. Aging, "Coolness," and Acceptance

• Song: "Can't Be Cool Forever" (17:09)
  • Written during a lonely Thanksgiving in London, reflecting on changing definitions of purpose, community, and lasting relevance.
  • Quote: "I started to feel like maybe I don't have anything to say or maybe what I have to say is not for everyone. ...I am a niche thing, and that's okay. I'm more interested in finding my people...” (18:06–19:31)
• Priorities Now:
  • Focused on honesty, health, presence, and meaningful connections rather than chasing "universal" acclaim.
  • Quote: "I'd rather do less work and more appreciating." (19:41–20:21)

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6. The Shrek Factor: Humor and Pop Culture Roots

• Shrek as a Touchstone:
  • Childhood inspirations; Shrek’s antihero status and cultural crossover appeal resonate.
  • Funny anecdote: Banned from a school talent show for singing the Shrek version of "I Like Big Butts".
  • Host and guest bond over shared childhood karaoke Shrek performances.
  • Quote: "Shrek’s just kind of a hero... the like, the millennial and like, Zoomer kind of crossover..." (20:38–21:17)
  • Favorite Shrek character: The sassy mirror on the wall. (21:33)

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7. Memorable Quotes and Moments

• On Authenticity:
  • "I'd rather make something that I like and hope that the people that are into it come along." (04:43)
• On Nostalgia:
  • "Generally nostalgia is a bad detour... it's like sugar. You don't want to use too much of it..." (07:22)
• On Personal Growth:
  • "I'd rather do less work and more appreciating." (20:21)
• On Shrek:
  • "I was banned from, you know, fifth grade talent show because of my relationship with Shrek." (20:38)

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Notable Timestamps by Segment

• 02:14 – First live performance: "Known by None"
• 03:45 – Introduction of Nick Carpenter and 'Country'
• 04:04–04:45 – Discussion on honest, DNA-driven songwriting
• 06:00 – "In My Room" performance
• 07:22–08:25 – On nostalgia’s limits and benefits in songwriting
• 10:57–12:04 – "Cutting Through the Country" performance and creation insights
• 13:55–15:33 – Moving from Alaska to Nashville; Subaru story
• 16:12–16:54 – Disney Publishing: industry lessons
• 17:09–17:59 – "Can't Be Cool Forever" performance & reflection on changing priorities
• 18:06–19:31 – Embracing artistic niche and community
• 20:38–21:17 – Shrek discussion; cultural references and personal anecdotes

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Final Thoughts

This episode showcases Nick Carpenter’s heartfelt approach to art and self, blending emotional candor with dry humor and nostalgic warmth. His reflections on balancing personal honesty with accessible songwriting, navigating change, and prioritizing genuine connection over coolness offer inspiration for both creators and listeners. The conversation’s lighthearted moments—like the Shrek karaoke stories—underscore the importance of not taking oneself too seriously, even when doing emotionally heavyweight work.

Medium Build’s “Country” is out now.

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For full context and performances, listening to the episode is recommended, but this summary encapsulates all major narrative threads and the episode’s inviting, thoughtful tone.

Transcript

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[Nick Carpenter (Medium Build)]

Let's go.

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[Nick Carpenter (Medium Build)]

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[Nick Carpenter (Medium Build) - Singing]

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[Nick Carpenter (Medium Build)]

Listener Supported WNYC Studios.

[Koosha Navadar (Host)]

You're listening to ALL of it. I'm Koosha Navadar in for Allison Stewart. Now let's wrap up today's show with a listening party.

[Nick Carpenter (Medium Build) - Singing]

When I was young I want everyone.

To know me.

Eventually one day I wake up alone on a couch.

Now.

You got the house and the dogs.

And I just keep on running yeah, God would wonder get to be known by none but here we are.

[Koosha Navadar (Host)]

That'S Known by None from Medium Build, the indie pop country folk fusion project of Alaska based singer songwriter Nick Carpenter. He recently released his fifth studio album titled country back in April. It's his first full length project since his album Wild in 2019. And on the 12 track album, the Rising music star explores the idea of of home through relatable tales and introspective lyrics over soulful melodies and twangy guitar strings. It also features singles such as Cutting through the Country, Crying over you and in my room. A Rolling Stone UK article states the famously snowy state is a central character for Carpenter, whose blend of honest indie folk songwriting has landed him support slots with the likes of Holly Humberstone, Finneas and Louis Capaldi. Country is out now and Nick Carpenter, AKA Medium Build, joins us to discuss. Nick, hey. Welcome to all of it.

[Nick Carpenter (Medium Build)]

Hi, Kusha. Thanks for having me.

[Koosha Navadar (Host)]

Absolutely. Thanks for being here. I love the music. You know, in a statement upon Country's release, you said you wanted this album to have your DNA on it. What parts of your life did you mean by that? Like, where in your DNA did you want to make sure this album gets reflected?

[Nick Carpenter (Medium Build)]

I think that when I said that, I mean, like, so many people are making music and not in a judgmental way, but making stuff that is palatable. And I guess I'm not interested in telling anyone else's stories, but, but mine or the stories that I want to tell. So to have my, yeah, the, you know, the landscape of Alaska, but also like the stories of my parents and my brother and my own ideas and my own concepts and my, my, my faults and failures as well. Like, I, I just, I don't want to make something that everybody likes. I'd rather make something that I like and hope that the people that are into it come along.

[Koosha Navadar (Host)]

Yeah. Do you feel like that's reflective of Medium Build generally? That, that idea of authenticity?

[Nick Carpenter (Medium Build)]

Yeah, that's been the recipe since the beginning. It's just been say the honest thing, say the real thing, and I mean, hope that someone likes it is probably an understatement, but hope that the frequency is tuned in by the right people.

[Koosha Navadar (Host)]

Yeah. Let's listen to a song from the album Country. This track is titled In My Room, which is the second track on the album. Can you tell us. So was there a specific experience or memory that influenced you for this song?

[Nick Carpenter (Medium Build)]

I was doing a songwriter round and someone gave us prompts and they just said, let's like, you know, kind of get you thinking about something else. Like, let's do a song about your childhood bedroom. And so I just sort of started, you know, kind of going back in time and remembering that kid who sat in his room a lot alone and tried to remember what he was interested in and what he wanted. And yeah, I'll let the song do the rest of the work.

[Koosha Navadar (Host)]

Oh, let's do that. It's a great setup. Here's in my room.

[Nick Carpenter (Medium Build) - Singing]

My dad just got off from an 11 hour shift. When he gets home, I lose all TV privileges. Mom stressed out trying to make sure everyone gets fed Big bros numbing out on the PlayStation again I'm in my.

[Nick Carpenter (Medium Build)]

Room.

[Nick Carpenter (Medium Build) - Singing]

Making action figures Kiss in my room wearing the guitar and playing with Mac I'm in my room wondering if I could ever get so rich that I never feel alone when I'm at home.

[Koosha Navadar (Host)]

That was in my room. And something I really appreciate about this track, just gotta say, are all the childhood references to films like the Matrix and cartoons like the Simpsons. There's even a Weird Al reference on there. I feel like you were speaking my language. I just want to put that out there. Really resonates. How much does nostalgia play a role in your music as a songwriter and what stories you end up telling about your life?

[Nick Carpenter (Medium Build)]

Well, I think generally nostalgia is a bad detour. I think nostalgia tends to wash over complicated stuff with sweet memories. And so I try. It's like, it's like sugar. You don't want to use too much of it, but in the right doses it can be really effective, right? And so I think putting nostalgia and putting some of that, kind of couching some of the pain. Because, like, what I'm really doing is I'm doing like internal family system therapy work, but I'm couching it in this humor and nostalgia device, right? So I'm talking about how lonely and isolated I felt as a kid and then putting it in this like, delicious, sort of like, remember the 90s, like, remember like how people were. And so it's. You get all this pain and hopefully healing kind of sandwiched in a little bit of this memory rewind.

[Koosha Navadar (Host)]

Is there a process for you when you know that you're not putting in too much sugar, but you're actually getting to, I guess, the meat of the memory to kind of twist the metaphor. Like, what does it look like for you when you know, okay, this is not just nostalgia for nostalgia Steak. I'm actually saying something here.

[Nick Carpenter (Medium Build)]

Well, I think I used to overdo that bit. I think a lot of the OG Medium Build songs were too much mental and spiritual digging, you know? So then you have this like five minute song. It's all these heavy verses and there's no fun. And so I think I've tried to crawl into this, this intersection. And I mean, it's an amazing feeling when you're like, I got it, I got it. I. I have this device that will. Because to me it's all about laugh, laughter and tears, right? I want comedy as well as the pain. And so this song felt, this is my. Been my favorite song from the record to play live. And it feels like I nailed the. Let's do both. Let's laugh, let's look back, and let's give that kid empathy and give. Give that kid a voice. There's so many kids that don't have the words to say I was alone, alive.

[Koosha Navadar (Host)]

And I'm sure, you know, we're talking. The nostalgia element so far has just been through the lyrics, but I'm sure that sense of, like, finding the right ground, the right spectrum, is through the music as well. Right. Like the way that you choose to put out the lyrics, the kind of sound that you're going for. Is that fair?

[Nick Carpenter (Medium Build)]

Yeah, I don't think I consciously think about. Thought about that, but I think I. As I've aged, I try to make stuff that my mom finds more palatable. You know, in college, when I started making Medium Build, she was just like, this stuff is so yucky and difficult to listen to. And why. Why do you have all this junk on your vocal? And, you know, she just wants to hear a simple song like she Raised Me on Carole King and James Taylor and Motown. So I think every year I try to make something Lydia would like a little bit more. And this song being like kind of just a three chord, simple acoustic track, I think does feel like there's some sort of union between the material and the delivery method.

[Koosha Navadar (Host)]

Let's listen to a song from the album. The album's country. We're here with Medium Build talking about that album. It came out in April, and we are just going through a fun listening party. The next track I want to talk about is Cutting through the Country. Here it is.

[Nick Carpenter (Medium Build) - Singing]

Cutting through the country on my way to you Running out of race Coming up with truths Cutting through a cornfield Talking to myself Hooking up with strangers Asking them for help Waiting for forever Waiting for your call I know it.

Sounds crazy we could have it all if you needed someone if you needed proof I'm cutting through the country I'm on my way to you I'm cutting through the country Listening for you Someone I could trust Wishing it was us yeah Nothing lasts forever and everybody dies I don't want to leave Unless it's here with you tonight I'm pulling from a bottle Flipping on my phone Looking for a life Looking for a.

[Koosha Navadar (Host)]

That was Cutting through the country And, Nick, you know, I was reading in Atwood magazine a description of the song. They said it was an unrelenting explosion of angst, roaring vocals and turbulent energy with plenty of cinematic guitars and propulsive drums. To boot. Can you tell us about how you thought about the vocals on this track and what the recording process was like for you?

[Nick Carpenter (Medium Build)]

Yeah. So this was one of the last songs we made in the studio. It wasn't, you know, demoed or anything. We. We made it. This is the demo. So I just kind of had this poem cooking in my head. I actually drove my car from Anchorage, Alaska, to Nashville, Tennessee, in September or August of last year, and kind of going through a crazy change and just processing life. And so started these words. And I just wanted the. The. I wanted the cadence of the lyrics to have sort of the feel of like an Earl Sweatshirt song. That's a. A guy I've just kind of taken a lot of notes from and kind of a song without a chorus, there's no. There's no break. It's just like. It's just brain just coming to you, you know? And I. I wanted to. I wanted it to feel overwhelming and sort of chaotic, which is how I felt. And, yeah, we kind of made the beat, and I had a loose script, and we did it maybe four or five times. And Jake, my producer, he just sort of Frankenstein together. This take that ended up being the take that I never actually did fully live. So, by the way, when I had to start learning how to do it live is actually a huge pain. You drove? Oh, yeah. I moved half my life from Alaska to Tennessee, and I drove down in my 2003 Subaru Legacy Wagon.

[Koosha Navadar (Host)]

I was going to ask you what car it was that you drove. Okay, Subaru. How long was that drive?

[Nick Carpenter (Medium Build)]

I would recommend doing it in longer than I did it. I did it in four and a half days, which was. Yeah, Popped two tires, slept outside, but, yeah, all of that, you know. Yeah. I kind of went through a gnarly breakup last year, kind of a little bit. In part two, the music starting to go. Well, just out of town all the time. And being based in Nashville is cheaper and more efficient than being based in Alaska. So, you know, half of us live in Nashville and half of us are in Alaska. And I don't know, my family's still in Alaska. So I'm trying to just make amends, make peace with what this new life is of success in the industry. And this. This song is just sort of the. The manic thoughts of someone driving alone for five days on the way to a new life, hoping for a little bit of peace.

[Koosha Navadar (Host)]

Is that a lot of how you spent that drive was just thinking of melodies?

[Nick Carpenter (Medium Build)]

Spent a lot of that drive calling people and being like, please talk to me. Please talk to me. I'm losing my mind. Yeah, it was a lot. A lot of humming of. My car doesn't have ac, so it was the windows down. Wow. So it was. Yeah, a lot of. In my head.

[Koosha Navadar (Host)]

Is that Subaru still running?

[Nick Carpenter (Medium Build)]

Oh, yeah. Wow, that Subaru is rocking. Yeah, it's. It's the. It's the official car of Alaska. Is the. Is the Subaru Outback wagon. I've heard.

[Koosha Navadar (Host)]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. You must have a real. I. I have driven all up and down the east coast in. In my own car, which I no longer have, but it is a big part. I'm sure that you have many great ideas that have come in that car for your own career. That's really special.

[Nick Carpenter (Medium Build)]

Yeah. We ended up putting it in the music video for this song, so a little Easter egg.

[Koosha Navadar (Host)]

Oh, interesting.

[Nick Carpenter (Medium Build)]

It's me in the Subaru.

[Koosha Navadar (Host)]

Wow. I know from your background also that you interned for Disney Publishing in Nashville. And I'm interested. What's something you remember doing or learning during that internship that you'll never forget?

[Nick Carpenter (Medium Build)]

I was cataloging the demos of a songwriter and he was not organized. And so I was going through his hard drives of songs he'd written that he had forgotten. So he had to pitch his songs to his song plugger or whatever publisher kind of keeper. And then she had to pitch the songs to like writers and teams of writers. And so it was just all this dysfunction. And I. I learned write less and write everything down. Just be organized because there's so many beautiful songs just lost on people's phones. And yeah, I'm such a better cataloger of my thoughts, I think because of that time.

[Koosha Navadar (Host)]

Oh, interesting. The kind of the method to figuring everything out. I'm looking at the clock. I want to be sure that we get to hear some more songs. Let's listen to a song from your album, Country. The track is titled Can't Be Cool Forever. Here it is.

[Nick Carpenter (Medium Build) - Singing]

I know we can't be cool forever but we can stay plugged into life. I wanna listen and pay attention. I wanna. Then keep trying. I wanna write it down in pencil just in case I change my mind. I'm always coming up with reasons that everybody out here sucks. But last week I saw a concert. Felt this universal crush. Kids were screamin in the theater. The band gave everything to us. I think the big twenties, it's not knowing where you fit. You tried everything to feel something till you're not curious. So once you get a little money, you team up and make Some kids.

But your kids will have big questions. You'll be forced to pick a side.

[Koosha Navadar (Host)]

That was can't be cool forever. Tell us a little bit about the song. Where were you in your life when.

[Nick Carpenter (Medium Build)]

When.

[Koosha Navadar (Host)]

When you were writing the song?

[Nick Carpenter (Medium Build)]

I was in. I was in London. We had just finished our first European tour, and I had a couple weeks booked to just write and hang out. And it was actually Thanksgiving Day is my first sort of like missing a family gathering day. And so I was at work on Thanksgiving. You know, in the uk, they don't. They don't care about that. So I was just. I don't know. I think I was just processing. My. My brother has two kids, and he's an excellent dad. And he really kind of weighs. He like, wades into their stuff, into their drama. You know, when his teenager is angry and upset, like, he. He gets in it with them. And I think I realized touring and, you know, I'm well into my 30s now, and I think a lot of my peers, kids coming up are much younger than me. And I started to feel like maybe I don't have anything to say or maybe what I have to say is not for everyone. And I think there's so much. We love artists that are just universally lauded and we. I think a lot of the machine of the music industry wants to see a giant thing that everybody plugs into. And I think I'm slowly just realizing that I am a niche thing, and that's okay. And I'm more interested in finding my people than I am in finding everybody. And I think this song is kind of processing that.

[Koosha Navadar (Host)]

It's interesting you bring that up, because I know that in a bunch of interviews you said that you're not worried about being cool these days. What are. What are your priorities as an artist and as a person?

[Nick Carpenter (Medium Build)]

Honesty, health. Yeah, I want to be present. I'd say it's the same thing I want in my relationships. You know, clear, clear communicator. Speak my needs. Good listener. Take care of my body. Take care of the people around me. Make sure people are well fed and know how I feel about them. And there's so much pain that can come in the shadows of whatever the clout or the hustle. A lot of people work really hard and never tell someone that they appreciate them being around. And I'd rather do less work and more appreciating.

[Koosha Navadar (Host)]

Yeah, yeah, absolutely. I'm looking at the clock. I want to be sure that we hear one more song. But before we go, there was another thing that Came up in a lot of your interviews that I thought was interesting. I hope this isn't too far out from left field, but Shrek 2 seems to come up a lot in your interviews. I gotta ask. Any Shrek?

[Nick Carpenter (Medium Build)]

Any Shrek. When I was in fifth grade, Shrek came out. It was really big for me. I did a Shrek song at the karaoke, like. Or did his little karaoke song at the end that. They have the movie. I did it for a talent show and they. They said I couldn't because it had had an interpolation of Sir Mix. A lot's. I like big butts. So I was banned from, you know, fifth grade talent show because of my relationship with Shrek. Yeah, I just. Shrek's just kind of a hero. I mean, Mike Myers in general. But I think Shrek's kind of become the. The, like the millennial and like, Zoomer kind of crossover of like. Yeah. You know, just the. The antihero.

[Koosha Navadar (Host)]

You want to hear something you and I have in common? My first karaoke song, which I performed at a dance function in middle school, was a song from Shrek. It was All Stars. Let's go real quick. Favorite character from the Shrek universe.

[Nick Carpenter (Medium Build)]

Oh, I think the mirror on the wall. That sassy guy. He's so sassy. Yeah. I think that was a good intro for me for, like, because he kind of lies to Lord Farquaad. He kind of like, you know, like, you can do that. I just love that sort of like third, like that person who sees you for who you are and really kind of just takes. Takes the. Takes the fun out of it. Yeah, that's a great answer.

[Koosha Navadar (Host)]

Oh, thank you so much for answering because I do have this prepared, actually. The gingerbread man with his gummy gummy gum drops. Absolutely. We're speaking the same language. It's been so great talking to you. I want to go out on. On a song from the album Country. Before I do. We're going to finish this segment with that song. So let me thank you first. Nicholas Carpenter, known by his stage name Med Build, is a singer songwriter based in Anchorage, Alaska. His new album is titled Country. Nick, thanks so much for hanging out with us. I appreciate it.

[Nick Carpenter (Medium Build)]

This has been delightful. Thank you so much for having me.

[Koosha Navadar (Host)]

Absolutely. And let's go out on a song from the album Country. This track is titled Cutting through the Country. Here it is.

[Nick Carpenter (Medium Build) - Singing]

I just love laughing with you. The way your face gets all scrunched up. I just love staring at you when you're chewing on your tongue. I get anxious when I when the sun goes down, Gotta get stone so I can sleep. And when the nasty thoughts come rushing in to meet me.

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[Nick Carpenter (Medium Build)]

You could say, ugh, just my luck.

[State Farm Small Business Advertiser]

But you should say, like a good.

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Neighbor, State Farm is there.

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And we'll help get you back in business. Like a good neighbor, State Farm is there.

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