OK Go in the Studio

Summary

All Of It: OK Go in the Studio – Detailed Summary

Published on May 29, 2025, by WNYC's "All Of It" hosted by Alison Stewart.

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Introduction and Episode Overview

In this episode of All Of It, Alison Stewart welcomes the innovative band OK Go—comprised of Damien Kulash, Tim Norwin, Dan Konopka, and Andy Ross—to discuss their latest endeavors. Known for their groundbreaking music videos and infectious melodies, OK Go celebrates the release of their fifth album, "and the Adjacent Possible", which marks nearly two decades since their viral sensation, "Here It Goes Again". The band shares insights into their new album, upcoming tour, and fresh creative approaches.

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Album Creation and Development

Damien Kulash opens up about the extensive process behind their new album. "We started writing these songs, believe it or not, about six, seven years ago," he explains (04:50). The band faced various challenges, including extensive touring, the complexities of producing elaborate music videos, and significant life changes such as parenthood and the global pandemic. These factors contributed to a nearly decade-long journey in crafting the album, allowing the songs ample time to mature and evolve.

Dan Konopka adds, "This is the most time we've ever had really, to just incubate the songs," emphasizing the value of patience and perspective in their creative process (05:38).

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The Impact of Parenthood on the Band

The conversation delves into how becoming parents has reshaped the band's dynamics and creative output. Dan Konopka notes, "It certainly changed the way we thought about touring and being out of town and, you know, just being away from them," highlighting a shift towards a more balanced touring schedule to accommodate family life (06:06).

Damien Kulash reflects on the emotional transformation, stating, "Having kids made life fresh again all over the place... It's like holding my 3-year-old hand and feeling an emotion that I have had so many times, but having it so fresh and rediscovered" (06:29). This newfound perspective inspired songs like "Love," which explores the profound emotions tied to parenthood.

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Band's History and Long-term Collaboration

The band reminisces about their early days, having met at Interlochen, an arts camp, around the age of 11 (07:31). Damien Kulash shares, "It was like taking off your space helmet... we weren't the same people—we were just there because we wanted to be around creativity" (08:08). Their long-standing friendship and shared passion for music have been pivotal in sustaining OK Go's creative endeavors over the years.

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Evolution of Songwriting and Creativity

Damien Kulash discusses the evolution of their songwriting approach over the years. "We’ve given over more to the idea that we're not really in control of it," he says (13:46). The band now focuses on experimenting with sounds, chords, and melodies to capture emotional moments rather than strictly adhering to predefined ideas. This shift prioritizes emotional authenticity and spontaneous creativity.

Dan Konopka echoes this sentiment, explaining, "It's just like playing with sounds and rhythms and beats and sonics until you've got something that just makes like, yeah, that sounds awesome" (15:47). This experimental approach marks a departure from their more traditional songwriting methods, fostering a space for innovation and artistic growth.

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Visual Storytelling and Semiotic Influence

Visual creativity remains a cornerstone of OK Go's identity. Damien Kulash, a former semiotics major, connects his academic background to the band's approach to music videos. "Semiotics is the study of signs and symbols and meaning... it's sort of like just loving why it's made and where it's come from," he explains (18:50). The band continues to integrate intricate visuals into their projects, viewing video production as an extension of their musical artistry.

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Navigating Social Media and Content Platforms

The band addresses the challenges and implications of modern social media platforms. Damien Kulash critiques the short-form video trend, stating, "The problem with the short form video, for us as a band at least, is that it is all about, like, quantity" (20:52). OK Go prefers investing time in creating meaningful, high-quality content rather than producing a constant stream of quick, ephemeral videos required by platforms like Instagram and TikTok. They emphasize that their art flourishes through depth and careful craftsmanship rather than rapid content turnover.

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Deep Dive into Specific Songs

Alison Stewart inquires about the song "Good Good Day At Last," which features collaborations with Shayla Fearing, Sam from Beginners and Laxs, and Ben Harper. Damien Kulash describes the song as embodying "rollicking, kind of like out of control joy," drawing inspiration from classic tracks like Eric Burdon's "Magic Mountain" and Funkadelic's vibrant energy (22:32). The collaboration with Ben Harper, a close family friend, infuses the song with a unique and dynamic spirit.

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Performances from the Studio

The session includes intimate acoustic performances of both new and classic OK Go songs, highlighting the band's versatility and the emotional depth of their music.

"A Stone Only Rolls Downhill" is performed first, showcasing the band's melodic intricacies and lyrical depth. Later, "This Too Shall Pass" is shared, offering a nostalgic nod to their earlier work while presenting it in a fresh acoustic arrangement.

"Love" serves as a poignant finale, with Damien Kulash describing it as capturing the essence of human connection and the beauty of life through the lens of parenthood (23:39). The song’s heartfelt lyrics and emotive delivery resonate deeply, encapsulating the album's central themes.

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Conclusion and Final Thoughts

As the episode wraps up, OK Go expresses gratitude for the opportunity to share their music and creative journey with the All Of It community. Damien Kulash remarks, "It's been nothing but a gift" to merge their musical and visual storytelling passions (18:47). The band leaves listeners with a profound understanding of their artistic evolution and the meaningful intersections of their personal lives with their creative endeavors.

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Notable Quotes:

• Damien Kulash (04:50): "We started writing these songs, believe it or not, about six, seven years ago."

• Dan Konopka (05:38): "This is the most time we've ever had really, to just incubate the songs."

• Damien Kulash (06:29): "Having kids made life fresh again all over the place..."

• Damien Kulash (13:46): "We've given over more to the idea that we're not really in control of it."

• Damien Kulash (18:50): "Semiotics is the study of signs and symbols and meaning."

• Damien Kulash (20:52): "The problem with the short form video... is that it is all about, like, quantity."

• Damien Kulash (22:32): "It’s like acoustic funk gone off the rails a little bit."

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Stay tuned to All Of It on WNYC for more engaging conversations exploring the nexus of culture and creativity.

Transcript

[Alison Stewart]

All of it is supported by Progressive Insurance. Do you ever find yourself playing the budgeting game? Well, with the Name youe Price Tool from Progressive, you can find options that.

[Damien Kulash]

Fit your budget and potentially lower your bills.

[Alison Stewart]

Try [e-mail] progressive casualty insurance company and affiliates price and coverage match limited by state law. Not available in all states. This is all of it on wnyc. I'm Alison Stewart. OK Go. OK Go is back with a new album, a new tour, and yes, a few new music videos. It was almost 20 years ago OK go revol revolutionized videos for their song Here It Goes Again. I mean, who couldn't stop watching four band members dancing and gliding and gliding under treadmills all in one take? In the pre TikTok era, their videos feel prescient. Last month, OK Go released its fifth album called and the Adjacent Possible. It's great, by the way, and we're going to hear some songs from it. Hello to Damien Kulash, Tim Norwin, Dan Konopka and Andy Ross.

[Damien Kulash]

Hey guys, thanks so much for having us.

[Alison Stewart]

What are we going to hear?

[Damien Kulash]

We're going to start with a song called A Stone Only Rolls Downhill.

[Alison Stewart]

And you have some guests.

[Damien Kulash]

Yeah, we have. We have New York City's own WNYC's very own professional clapsters. They. They. I should say they wanted to be called the Clap, but I'm not sure they want to stick with that name. Shall we do it?

[Alison Stewart]

Yeah, let's do it.

[Damien Kulash]

One.

[Tim Norwin]

I wish I could say it would all be all right it'll all be all right I wish I could tell you it would all be fine it'll all be just fine but I Stone only roads downhill these things there'll be one someday soon you'll look out from the hilltop your heart w out I'm trying to make sense of the art which only bends one way.

[Damien Kulash]

You.

[Tim Norwin]

Rightly afraid it don't seem to be the way you thought I wish I could say be all right it'll all be all right I wish I could tell you it all be fine it'll all be just fine but I stone only roads downhill these things there'll be one day will what they will but oh, the inertia of a ravenous spread up the rest of our selfishness it was just too much to overcome now we're overrun and I wish I could say it would all be all right It'll all be all right Wish I could tell you it would all be fine It'll all be just fine oh, how I wish I could Sing could tell ya it would be alright could tell ya it'll all be fine It'll work out I wish I could tell you oh how I wish I could tell you I'll be fine It'll all be just fine oh how I wish I could sing could tell you it would be all right could tell tell you and I'll be fine It'll work out I wish I could tell you How I wish I could tell you in law I'll be fine It'll all be just fine It'll all be just fine.

[Alison Stewart]

My guests are. Ok, Go. That was great.

[Damien Kulash]

Thanks.

[Alison Stewart]

So when did you start to make this album, Damian?

[Damien Kulash]

We started writing these songs, believe it or not, about six, seven years ago. Yeah, it's been a long time because we toured a lot on our last record. We made a lot of very elaborate, time consuming videos. Then we stopped for Andy to have kids and then I had kids, or actually our wives had kids and we wanted to stay home for a lot of that. Then there was the pandemic. Then my wife and I directed a film together for Apple. And so that took up two years. And the next thing you know, it had been almost 10 years since we released a record, but we had, we'd been writing and recording the whole time. So the, the. It really gave the song like a lot, a lot of time to grow and change and be revised. It was great.

[Alison Stewart]

Tim, what was it like to go back and to hear the songs after they had been worked on for so many years?

[Dan Konopka]

I mean, it was great to just be able to have some perspective. Yeah, this is the most time we've ever had really, to just incubate the songs and that's. I don't know, that's. As musicians, as songwriters, that's a total gift, you know.

[Alison Stewart]

All right, who had kids? You had kids and I also had kids.

[Damien Kulash]

Yeah.

[Alison Stewart]

Come a little closer to the microphone, friend. So being a parent, how did that change the way you thought about the music, the way you thought about the band?

[Dan Konopka]

I mean it certainly changed the way we thought about touring and being out of town and, you know, just being away from them. And so, you know, our touring schedule is like a little bit lighter. But I think, I mean, I think some of the songs are definitely about this experience and you know, Damian can speak more to that, but it's. I think some of the songs are pointing to that and they came out really great.

[Alison Stewart]

That's Andy, by the way.

[Damien Kulash]

Yeah. Having kids made life fresh again all over the place and I'm sure You've heard a million parents say this, but it's like you're told that you will see the world again through your kids eyes. Guess I wasn't prepared for the feeling that emotions I knew so well would be reborn and rediscovered. I mean the song Love, which we'll play soon is about that. It's about holding my 3 year old hand and feeling an emotion that I have had so many times, but having it so fresh and so it's like that, that childhood dream where you're in your. I'm sorry, that dream where you're in your childhood home and then there's a new door that opens up to like you know, airplane hangar or a museum or some huge place. It felt like that. And it's made me appreciate art and music and everything in life in a whole new way again.

[Alison Stewart]

I'm thinking about little kids. Tim, you met Damian when you guys were like 11ish?

[Dan Konopka]

Yeah, we met Interlaken. We met at a camp called Interlochen. I'm wearing the sweatshirt today. But yes, we were 11 years old and super into music even at that point.

[Damien Kulash]

Yeah, it's so crazy to think how long it's been going on. And it's crazy to watch our kids near the age when we met.

[Alison Stewart]

Oh wow. When you were kid Tim, did you think this is my musical friend, this is my friend who I'm gonna share music with or was it just like two guys who hung out at camp?

[Damien Kulash]

I'm not sure there was much of a distinction at that age. What was so wonderful about that place? It was an arts camp with kind of a focus on music. Back then at least. Was that it it for me it was like taking off your. The space helmet you wore the rest of the year. You know, it's like you go there for eight weeks in the summer and all the other kid were kids were art nerds like you. Like everybody was weird and everybody was really passionate about the stuff they made. And so even at 11, it was like we weren't, you know, we weren't studied musicians. We were just there because we, we wanted to be around creativity and to find other people who felt that way just. It changed everything.

[Dan Konopka]

I think even then though, we thought we'd probably be doing this as adults.

[Damien Kulash]

Yeah, I mean that's the other thing is like to wind up being. To spend your life chasing music, you have to be a little bit deluded in the first place, you know. So it's like at age 11 that was certainly like it was a real possibility. Of course we'll be in a rock band like that. We hadn't learned to be realistic yet.

[Alison Stewart]

So, Dan, why are you in this rock band?

[Damien Kulash]

Well, I was told. I said you gotta hang out with the smartest people, you know. So I'm, like, kind of stoked that I get to be around these super creative guys. I'm on a great ride with this kind of passion and inspiration.

[Dan Konopka]

So, yeah.

[Alison Stewart]

My guest, holding it down. My guests are Damien, Tim, Dan and Andy. Of course, they make up. OK Go. They're performing some from their new sort of a. An acoustic set, shall we say?

[Damien Kulash]

Yeah. From.

[Alison Stewart]

Is it difficult to perform it acoustically?

[Damien Kulash]

The songs are very different acoustic, but it's. But it also makes them. I mean, it's like. It's nice to discover them in a different way.

[Alison Stewart]

All right, after the break, we're going to hear another song from ok, Go. This is all of it. You're listening to all of it on WNYC. I'm Alison Stewart. I'm here in WNYC Studio 5 with OK Go. Damien, Tim, Dan and Andy. Okay, you're gonna play another song. I've got a big note here that says this is not from the new album. What are we gonna listen to?

[Damien Kulash]

This is called this two Shall Pass. It's a. It's. It's an old. We figured we should play at least something people have heard before.

[Alison Stewart]

Let's.

[Tim Norwin]

If there not that much to love around. Better run like hell when you hit the ground. When the morning comes. When the morning comes. You can stop these kids from dancing. Why would you want to? Especially when you're already getting yours? Cause if your mind don't move, you stop there, people. Don't go banning the kids again. When the morning comes. When the morning comes. When the morning comes. When the morning comes. When the morning comes. When the morning comes. Let it go this too shall pass. Let it go this you shall.

[Damien Kulash]

Know.

[Tim Norwin]

You can't keep letting it get you down? You let me get you down. If there ain't not that much to vibe around. If you can't keep it. Let me get you down. When the morning come. Keep letting me get you down. No, you can't keep letting it. When the morning comes. Keep letting it get you down. No, you can't keep letting it. When the morning comes. Keep letting me let you down. No, you can't keep letting it? When the morning come? Keep letting me get you down. Cause you can't keep letting. Well, the morning comes.

[Alison Stewart]

That's OK. Go. Performing in WNYC's Studio 5. It's interesting hearing a quote, unquote old song performed because I'm wondering, Damien, how much has your songwriting changed from, let's say, your first album to this album?

[Damien Kulash]

I think the thing that's changed the most is I think we've given over more to the idea that we're not really in control of it, that it. I think we believed 20 years ago that you. That we would think about an idea and then figure out a way to make a song about it. And now it's much more the other way around, that it's sort of like we're playing around with sounds and chords and melodies and beats and textures and looking for the moments where something is magical, where something is more than the sum of its parts. Like, suddenly you're not having sounds, you're having emotions. And those sparks are few and far between, and getting them to sort of glow into the ember of a whole part and then the sort of big fire of a whole song is hard. And only then are we able to sort of, like, pull out what it might mean. You know, it's like. It's much more about chasing this feeling than it is about trying to say something.

[Alison Stewart]

So many times writers will tell me that they kind of give up to the voice, give up to the vibe coming to them. Does that happen to you when you write?

[Damien Kulash]

Oh, absolutely. I mean, I think, you know, the flip side of the sort of, like, it's all been done before. I mean, there's only 12 notes kind of thing, is that it really is all out there. These are all geometric, physical relationships of waves in air and the ways that they combined to make reverberations that cause you to have emotions. It just never stops being crazy and magical to me. That's why we named our album the Adjacent Possible. Was that the feeling that you could have these, like, basic physical things that turn into emotions that they cause the adjacent possible of human emotion, it just never stops being magical to me.

[Alison Stewart]

Tim, can you tell the difference in either the songwriting or the sound from the first album to this album?

[Dan Konopka]

I definitely can tell a difference. Yeah. I mean, I think we were working in a much more traditional. Like, we have a guitar. We're gonna try to write a song on the guitar. You know, I remember when I was little, my sister gave me an acoustic guitar with a broken bridge, and you couldn't tune it. And that was the first time I ever tried to write a song, you know, And I would just, like, kind of bang on it, and it was so fun. And that's so much more what it's like to write songs nowadays. You know, it's just like, playing with sounds and rhythms and beats and sonics until you've got something that just makes like, yeah, that sounds awesome. You know? And so, yes, I think we've gotten much further away from, like, traditional songwriting and much more into, like, an experimentation place. That's super fun, Damien.

[Alison Stewart]

That sounds like fun. What do you just describe?

[Damien Kulash]

You know, where our. It's kind of like, if it's not fun, why would you be doing it? And, in fact, I don't. You know, one where those balls of emotion that I keep talking about, like, they don't. They're completely subjective. Like, they don't happen as a matter of course. Like, one song can mean the world to me and mean nothing to you. And so if these. If these, like, little universes that we're creating aren't actually fun and compelling and exciting for us, then what would be the point, you know? And I do think that, like, learning music theory and learning how to play your instrument and everything that feels like the path when you're young. And it is an important path, but it's also like, the same three chords have been in all the best songs and all the worst songs. Figuring out how they relate to each other will only get you so far. Like, you have to discover it like a little child again.

[Alison Stewart]

You know, it's funny. Cause I was writing this sentence. Okay, go. Visual sensibility is. And first I put important, essential. And I said, well, I don't want to assume that. Is it important? Is it essential? Your visual component, the videos, et cetera?

[Damien Kulash]

It is a gift that we get to do that. I mean, it depends if you ask business people. Yeah, it's essential. It's like an essential part of the band's identity and therefore brand and all that kind of like. But for us, it's like it's just back to play again. It's that most of creativity is enabled by logistics and hard work and all the sort of, like, rote stuff you have to do all the time. And those little moments when you get to really play and discover and find something that makes you feel like it's worth being alive in this world and it's all bigger than we are, and it's magical and wonderful. Those are just as easily found in science projects and in, you know, like, weird contraptions that you can film and film in general. And so, like, when we kind of hopped into this place where us doing ridiculous dances went viral, we realized that, like, we're now that video band, and that means we get to just like, make films the way we make music. And it has been nothing but a gift.

[Alison Stewart]

Is anybody a film major, a semiotics major, any of that stuff?

[Damien Kulash]

I was, in fact, a semiotics major. I didn't. I remember, like, everybody's hands pointed at you. Yeah, I was a semiotics major. And I remember, like, for the first five or ten years out of school, like, interviews would be like, because the band had just started, and people would be like, what is semiotics? And I would just be like, it's basically like the best way to not have a job, you know, like. But. And the funniest thing is that now I realize, wait, I'm actually basically doing what I studied. It's, you know, semiotics is the study of signs and symbols and meaning. And it's sort of like while it doesn't, you know, that's not writing pop songs, sort of pulling them apart and going, like, do we get to make a video for this too? Like, can we be the people who build the robots and mirrors Gauntlet in Budapest for our music videos? Like, that comes directly from that sort of, like, tradition of just loving why it's made and where it's come from.

[Alison Stewart]

Is there anything that's on your sort of video, your semiotic list that you want to include that you haven't been able to yet? Anybody?

[Damien Kulash]

You know what? The boy Boy. The Diary of David Holtzman's Diary. It's a good, great experimental film From, I'm guessing late 60s, early 70s. It's like this filmmaker tries to find truth by filming himself and it all goes horribly awry. It's like a mockumentary. It's really great. It's really great.

[Alison Stewart]

Tim, do you use Instagram or TikTok or any of the video platforms these days?

[Dan Konopka]

Do I use it? Yeah, I do. Yeah. You know, I'm human.

[Damien Kulash]

But do you hear how trepidatious he is about that?

[Tim Norwin]

I use it, but I don't want.

[Alison Stewart]

To be sure maybe sometimes.

[Dan Konopka]

Why do you ask?

[Alison Stewart]

Why do I ask? Well, I'm sort of. I'm interested in, like, the short form video versus what you y' all do.

[Damien Kulash]

I. The problem with the short form video, for us as a band at least, is that it is all about, like, quantity. Like, you have to keep going. You just. You just need to put out something every day. And we're kind of the opposite. Like, we'd rather spend six months making the perfect three minute art project. And luckily that's like, we're not. We're not chasing that, like, that stuff for us. While it has, you know, it's great that it brings our music to the world and it's great that it has. It serves a business function. It's mostly there because we like making stuff. It's like mostly for us, an art project. And if Instagram ever felt like an art project for us, I'm sure we would. We would enjoy it more. In fact, I remember when it did. I remember 10 years ago, 15 years ago. I lived here in New York at the time, and I remember walking around town, I would notice details more because it had sort of gamified life where I was like, I'm looking for the beautiful and the weird and the strange things to sort of like document my life in this way. And it has changed so much since then and become this sort of commerce platform for, you know, ideas. And it's just. It's. That's. We use it, but doesn't feel like where our art happens.

[Alison Stewart]

I'm here in WNYC Studio 5 with the band OK Go. They're performing some acoustic versions of songs from their new album and the adjacent possible. I did want to ask about one song before you play another. It's a song Good Good Day At Last.

[Damien Kulash]

Yeah.

[Alison Stewart]

Which has a lot of. Has some guests. Yeah, I thought it was interesting.

[Damien Kulash]

Yeah, it's an interesting lineup. Our friend Shayla Fearing and Sam from Beginners and Laxs are the saucy lady backup band. And then Ben Harper, who you don't really think of as being the average OK Go. Collaborator, but our kids are really close friends and we were hanging out a lot. And I love the way he sings and, you know, we wanted that song to have that kind of like rollicking, kind of like out of control joy that I remember hearing in like Magic Mountain by Eric Burdon in War or like that. There's a Funkadelic song. What's it. Can you get to that? You know, that sort of like. Like acoustic funk gone off the rails a little bit. And I mean, he just. He gave it all that energy.

[Alison Stewart]

Thanks. I wanted to hear about that song. You're gonna play one more song for us? It's love. Is that correct?

[Damien Kulash]

It is, in fact, love.

[Alison Stewart]

You wanna tell me a little bit about it before we hear it?

[Damien Kulash]

This. This is like the. The one that I think gets at the heart of, like, where we are as humans right now, because it really is about, like, new life after having kids and I guess it's just. I can't believe that we are little balls of matter floating around in emptiness that get to have this kind of meaning and emotion and connection, you know, it just. It feels like so. So unlikely and so beautiful and Wonderful.

[Alison Stewart]

This is OK. Go.

[Damien Kulash]

1, 2, 3.

[Tim Norwin]

Cast so long before sound before song falls on your eyes and the dance starts again. And in the scramble room of nothingness your hands are warm with somethingness we swirl and whirl Music's invented again.

[Alison Stewart]

In.

[Tim Norwin]

This grand ballroom of nothingness we soar, we sail to the only song there's ever been Love the only song that's ever felt Just begun Love the only song that's ever found plays again Love Sam. Marvelous just to be anything Circling the hall to divine harmony and in this crown ballroom nothingness your hands so warm with something Something that we swirl and fur Music's invented again in this grand ballroom of nothingness we soar, we sail to the only song that's ever filled Love the only song there's ever been Just begin Love the only song that's ever been Love, the only song there's Ever been ever.

[Alison Stewart]

Love.

[Tim Norwin]

Sam.

[Alison Stewart]

That'S Damian Kulosh, Tim Norwin, Dan Konopka and Andy Ross. They make up ok, Go. Their new album is called and the adjacent possible. Thanks for coming to wnyc.

[Damien Kulash]

Thanks so much for having us.

[Dan Konopka]

Thank you. Thank you. Thanks.

[Damien Kulash]

I'm Ira Plato, host of Science Friday. For over 30 years, our team has been reporting high quality news about science, technology and medicine. News you won't get anywhere else. And now that political news is 24 7, our audience is turning to us to know about the really important stuff in their lives. Cancer, climate change, genetic engineering, childhood diseases. Our sponsors know the value of science and health news. For more sponsorship information, visit sponsorship.wnyc.org.