All Of It – Episode: Rob Franklin's Debut Novel 'Great Black Hope'

Host: Alison Stewart
Guest: Rob Franklin
Release Date: June 10, 2025
Broadcast: Weekdays, 12:00 - 2:00 PM on WNYC

Introduction to 'Great Black Hope'

In this episode of All Of It, host Alison Stewart introduces Rob Franklin's debut novel, Great Black Hope. Franklin presents a compelling narrative that delves into the complexities of race, privilege, and the elite social circles of New York City. The novel centers around David Smith Jr., a black queer man whose involvement in New York's high-profile party scene leads to a significant legal predicament.

Alison Stewart (00:28) summarizes the novel as follows:

"Great Black Hope is out today. Vogue magazine lists it as one of its best books of 2025 so far, saying, 'At its core, the book is a study of privilege, class, race, beauty, youth, intellect, fame and how those advantages intersect, contradict and ultimately fail to protect from human tragedy.'"

Writing Process and Inspirations

Franklin began writing Great Black Hope just before his 26th birthday, grappling with themes of familial expectations and personal identity. Sitting at his parents' kitchen table in Atlanta, Franklin reflects on the divergence between his life and his parents' aspirations for him.

Alison Stewart (01:50) asks about Franklin's initial thoughts during the writing process:

"So what were you grappling with? What were you thinking about as you sat down to write this novel?"

Rob Franklin (01:54) explains:

"I was thinking a lot about familial expectations and how different my life looked from what my parents had anticipated for me."

As he developed the protagonist, Franklin focused on drug use and addiction as lenses to explore broader issues like black respectability politics and the varied societal perceptions of addiction based on race and class.

Generational Mobility and its Fragility

A significant theme in Great Black Hope is the concept of generational mobility and its precarious nature. Franklin illustrates how decades of upward mobility can be undone in a single event.

Alison Stewart (04:02) references an old saying about generational progress, to which Franklin responds by detailing the Smith family's three generations:

"We see three generations of Smith's family. His grandmother, who grew up on a sharecropping farm and became one of the first black women lawyers in Texas; his parents, who pursued upwardly mobile careers as doctors and lawyers; and finally, David Smith Jr., whose life trajectory faces potential derailment."

This exploration underscores the fragility of the progress achieved by previous generations and how a single night can disrupt the family's hard-earned stability.

Reading from 'Great Black Hope'

Franklin reads an excerpt from the novel, vividly depicting David Smith's arrest during a night out in the Hamptons. The passage highlights the sudden shift from privilege to vulnerability, emphasizing how law enforcement interacts differently with individuals based on their social standing.

Rob Franklin (05:05) narrates:

"In the grand scheme of history, it was nothing. A blip, a breath... the night bled cereally. Smith watched himself be searched as if from a perch above..."

This excerpt sets the tone for the novel, illustrating the juxtaposition between the protagonist's privileged lifestyle and the harsh realities of the criminal justice system.

Editing Process and Narrative Style

Franklin discusses the editing process, particularly the challenges of maintaining his poetic writing style. Despite extensive revisions, the opening prose poem remained largely intact, serving as a distinct prelude to the novel's narrative voice.

Alison Stewart (09:30) inquires about the editing:

"What was the editing process like for you?"

Rob Franklin (09:45) responds:

"The opening went through a ton of editing but survived from the first draft. It sets apart formally from the narrative voice of the rest of the novel."

This balance between poetic expression and narrative structure enriches the storytelling, allowing readers to engage deeply with the protagonist's internal and external conflicts.

Character Analysis: David Smith Jr.

David Smith Jr. is portrayed as a comedic and adaptive individual, constantly shifting his persona to fit different environments. This perpetual performance becomes a source of exhaustion, particularly after his arrest and subsequent entry into recovery.

Alison Stewart (14:25) asks about Smith's adaptation:

"How does Smith adapt to his environment?"

Rob Franklin (15:16) explains:

"Smith is constantly determining what to show versus what to withhold, becoming the version of himself that is most palatable in different spaces. This performance is exhausting and confines him."

This characterization highlights the emotional toll of maintaining multiple identities within elite social circles and the broader societal expectations placed upon him.

Exploration of the Criminal Justice System and the War on Drugs

Franklin uses Smith's legal troubles to critique the criminal justice system and the War on Drugs, particularly how these institutions disproportionately impact black men. He weaves historical references, such as Nancy Reagan's "Just Say No" campaign and the downfall of basketball player Lynn Bias, to contextualize the systemic challenges faced by individuals like Smith.

Rob Franklin (12:19) states:

"I was interested in the history of the war on drugs and how Smith's class privilege insulates him from the realities that many other black men face in the criminal justice system."

By intertwining personal narrative with socio-political commentary, the novel underscores the persistent inequalities embedded within societal structures.

Significance of the Protagonist's Name

The choice of the name David Smith Jr. plays a crucial role in the narrative. The commonality of the name provides a layer of anonymity, allowing Smith to blend into the background despite his elite status.

Alison Stewart (17:22) observes:

"He has a very normal name. Dave Smith."

Rob Franklin (17:26) elaborates:

"Smith is an incredibly common surname, and by making it his first name, it becomes distinct and fashionable. It sets him apart from his family unit while maintaining an everyman quality."

This naming convention reflects Smith's internal struggle between individuality and conformity within his social milieu.

Conclusion

In this insightful episode of All Of It, Rob Franklin presents a nuanced exploration of race, privilege, and identity through his debut novel Great Black Hope. The discussion with Alison Stewart highlights the intricate layers of generational mobility, the performative aspects of navigating elite circles, and the pervasive impact of systemic biases within the criminal justice system. Franklin's literary approach, blending poetic prose with potent socio-political themes, offers a profound commentary on the precarious balance between personal aspirations and societal expectations.

Quote Highlight:

"Generational mobility can be undone in a single night." – Rob Franklin (09:01)

For those interested in exploring these themes further, Rob Franklin will be participating in an event at the Public Hotel with McNally Jackson Books and engaging in a conversation with author Roxane Gay at the Harlem School of the Arts.