Podcast Summary: "Salty and Cheesy Snackable Bakes (Food for Thought)"

Podcast: All Of It with Alison Stewart, WNYC
Airdate: September 26, 2024
Guest: Jesse Sheehan, cookbook author of Salty, Cheesy, Herby, Crispy Snackable Bakes
Theme: Exploring the world of accessible, savory baking and sharing practical techniques, tips, and recipes from Sheehan’s latest cookbook.

Episode Overview

On this Food for Thought Thursday, Alison Stewart chats with recipe developer and baker Jesse Sheehan about her new book, Salty, Cheesy, Herby, Crispy Snackable Bakes. The episode dives into the unique appeal of savory baked treats—with recipes that are quick, require minimal equipment, and highlight robust, non-sweet flavors.

Listeners call and write in with baking questions, and Sheehan offers professional tips, practical advice, and a handful of her signature, easy approaches to making snackable bakes at home.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. What Makes a Bake "Savory"? (02:00 – 02:37)

• Savory = Not Sweet: Sheehan defines savory bakes as those that generally lack significant sugar and instead focus on cheese, herbs, vegetables, meats, and plenty of salt for flavor. A touch of sugar is still used for moisture and color, but sweet isn’t the focus.
  • Quote: “This is a book where you’re not going to find a lot of sugar… The flavors that are going to pop are going to be your cheesy flavors, your meaty flavors, your veggie flavors, your salt, your herbs, all of that.” – Jesse Sheehan (02:01)

2. The "Easy Peasy" Baking Philosophy (02:45 – 03:28)

• Sheehan’s previous book focused on sweet, quick, low-effort bakes. Her new book is the “savory sibling,” designed for “savory people.” All recipes can be assembled in 20 minutes or less, using standard ingredients and just a bowl, whisk, and spatula—no fancy tools required.

3. Essential Savory Baking Tips (04:02 – 08:22)

• Greasing Pans (04:02 – 04:50):
  Cooking spray is easy and clean, but spray over the sink (or, from listener advice, the open dishwasher door [09:11 – 09:24]) to avoid accidents.

  • Quote: “Spray your pan over the sink and it just, it makes for a clean, easy situation.” – Jesse Sheehan (04:02)

• Grease & Flour vs. Sugar for Release (04:55 – 05:26): In sweet bakes, try greasing and coating with sugar for sparkle and easy release, especially with bundt cakes.

• Rotating Pans Halfway (05:29 – 06:02): Rotate for even baking due to oven hot spots.

• Freezing Dough Before Baking (06:02 – 06:42): For cookies or biscuits that might spread, chill or freeze before baking for best results. Example: blue cheese thumbprint cookies.

• Weigh, Don’t Measure (06:42 – 07:34): Sheehan now prefers weighing all ingredients, even liquids, in grams for consistency.

  • Quote: “I’m grams or go home.” – Jesse Sheehan (06:50)

• Easy Melted Butter Shortcut (07:34 – 08:22): Melt butter until a few chunks remain, then whisk off heat to quickly cool; essential for easy baking without the wait.

4. Handling Recipe Mishaps

• Over-salted Bakes (08:22 – 09:11): If it’s too late, serve with something that balances the saltiness (like cream cheese). Earlier intervention can involve adding more ingredients to dilute, but prevention is best.

5. The Definition of "Snackable Bakes" (10:00 – 10:57)

• Snackable bakes are quick, low-mess, spontaneous bakes—especially appealing for impatient bakers looking to satisfy cravings within an hour.
  • Quote: “I am a very impatient person and I am also a hater of dirty dishes… just a bowl, just a whisk, no fancy equipment, and the speed is because of my own kind of quirky personality traits.” – Jesse Sheehan (10:40)

6. Savory Cookies and the Science of Chewy Textures (11:00 – 12:09)

• Savory oat "cookies" work beautifully with cheese. For sweet cookies with no rest times, Sheehan uses a bit of shortening to reduce spreading.

7. Recipe Development Principles (12:09 – 12:50)

• Must be quick, unfussy, and avoid unnecessary rest times. An entire bread chapter is warned as “the slow one” for those who are truly impatient.

Notable Listener Q&A and Practical Tips

Difference Between Sliceables and Breads (13:45 – 14:22)

• “Sliceables” = baked in a loaf pan, easily sliced; “Breads” = in square pans and often snacking, single-layer versions.

Sourdough Discard Ideas (14:22 – 15:03)

• Try sourdough discard pancakes—can be sweet or savory.

Gluten-free Baking (15:03 – 15:44)

• Use your favorite reliable gluten-free flour blend as a 1-to-1 swap in most recipes.

Trick for Sticking Cakes in Pans (16:42 – 17:27)

• Sugar works great for release and sparkle; cocoa powder is best for chocolate cakes. Flip out promptly to avoid caramelization sticking.
  • Quote: “Try flipping after it’s been coated in that sugar and see what you think. And I do think it will be beautiful with chocolate.” – Jesse Sheehan (17:09)

Popovers and Gougères: Impressive Yet Easy (18:01 – 19:36)

• Popovers: As simple as whisking, no food processor needed. Black pepper and olive oil make them savory; swap out for a sweet variation if desired.
• Gougères: Savory French cheese puffs using “choux” dough—freezable and bakeable from frozen, perfect for parties.

Most Accessible Recipe for Beginners (24:17 – 25:31)

• Cheesy Old Bay Butter Swim Biscuits: Melt butter in a pan, pour simple biscuit dough over, bake—delicious, cheesy, rich, and great with many meals.
  • Quote: “This recipe, I think will knock your socks off…” – Jesse Sheehan (24:22)

Savory Pumpkin Loaf for Fall (25:57 – 27:23)

• Moist, savory, with pumpkin seeds and spices—unexpected and crowd-pleasing, even for skeptics.
  • Quote: “It has a savory vibe... However, it has all of the moisture and the kind of that pumpkin flavor going for it. It’s just heightened with all of these different spices.” – Jesse Sheehan (26:18)

Ingredient Defaults (27:53 – 28:46)

• Large eggs, unsalted butter are the default unless specified.

Listener Pizza & Flour Tips

• For pizza, use parchment paper on a paddle to transfer store-bought dough—no sticking, easy cleanup. (28:54 – 29:23)
• For alternative flours (keto/paleo): Substitute up to 25-30% to maintain structure (30:33 – 31:10).

Memorable Quotes

• “I am a very impatient person and I am also a hater of dirty dishes… just a bowl, just a whisk, no fancy equipment.” – Jesse Sheehan (10:40)
• “I’m grams or go home.” – Jesse Sheehan (06:50)
• “This recipe…will knock your socks off.” (re: cheesy Old Bay biscuits) – Jesse Sheehan (24:22)
• “Popovers could not be easier... I just tell you to whisk it in a bowl.” – Jesse Sheehan (18:04)
• “I am not a Philo Milo dope gal.” – Jesse Sheehan (31:13)

Timestamps for Important Segments

• 02:00 – 02:37: Defining "savory"
• 04:02 – 08:22: Key baking tips (greasing, freezing dough, weighing ingredients)
• 10:00 – 10:57: What is a "snackable bake"?
• 13:45 – 14:22: Sliceables vs. breads
• 15:03 – 15:44: Gluten-free advice
• 16:42 – 17:27: Tips for cake pan sticking
• 18:01 – 19:36: Popovers and gougères made easy
• 24:17 – 25:31: Beginner's recipe highlight
• 25:57 – 27:23: Savory pumpkin loaf for fall
• 28:54 – 29:23: Listener tip: Pizza on parchment paper

Closing & Event Info

• In-person event: Jesse Sheehan appears at Archestratus Books & Food, Greenpoint, Brooklyn at 6 p.m. (31:51)
• Will be joined by Deb Perlman (Smitten Kitchen); book signings and snack samples—crackers from Sheehan's book with Perlman's dip (32:02).

Tone & Takeaways

This episode is enthusiastic, practical, and inclusive—rooted in New York’s culinary community. Sheehan demystifies baking, making it approachable for busy, everyday cooks and encouraging experimentation within some smart, flexible guidelines. Her focus is on flavor, ease, and fun, with an emphasis on sharing both successes and the realities of recipe adaptation.

Whether listeners are new to savory baking or looking for fresh ideas, this conversation delivers both inspiration and actionable advice.