A (2:31)

What do you, what's your suggestion?

B (2:32)

Depends on how much I'm doing. If I'm doing the whole meal, I might try to get one or two things out of the way this point of the week. Like maybe I would make a cookie dough, a pie dough. I might make a dough that'll keep in the fridge. I might be dry brining my turkey by now. There's a bunch of things you could do if I could get it out of the way. But side dishes like these ones that come in casserole dishes and this, it doesn't have to be a creamy, cheesy over the top thing, although one dish should be, I think that's really important for like balance and stuff. But most of the things that they keep well. So you could really just have it all assembled and bake it either right before, bake it that morning and reheat it right before the meal. There's some flexibility to it, so use it to your advantage.

A (3:13)

Listeners. We're doing a small steaks. Big opinions about Thanksgiving side dish options. What is a side you love? What's one that you cannot stand? Do you have family that's a family, one that is non negotiable or one you would wish would finally disappear? Give us a call at 212-433-WNYC 212-43396. Okay, you give us a bunch of side dishes that we can prepare. We said, yes, these are good side dishes. You have crunchy brown butter baked carrots. And this starts with a bag of baby carrots, which are not really baby carrots. Don't tell anybody. What led you to this recipe?

B (3:55)

You know, I started thinking it would be really nice to do a carrot. Usually we do roasted carrots and they're delicious. But it's not ideal to do a sheet pan roasted vegetables before Thanksgiving meal. If you're not gonna get it out at exactly the right time, they're gonna kind of shrivel, they' gonna get soft, they're gonna lose those nice crispy edges. And I thought, I wonder if there's a way we could bake them with flavors that are great with carrots. There's some capers in there, some herbs. Brown butter is really nice. And I also, as I was peeling and chopping the carrots, I was like, what if we just started with one of those 99 cent bags of baby carrots? Like, what if we just made this really easy and economical and it worked and it's delicious. And I just, I want it to be easy for us. And there is still some decadence. There's some brown butter, breadcrumbs on top and a little bit of cheese so you get this crunchy top layer. But the carrots are per.

A (4:41)

Yeah.

C (4:41)

I want to ask you about.

A (4:42)

You described it a browned breader sense. Sorry, a browned and bread crumbed sensibility. As you're gratin.

C (4:49)

Why is gratin good for carrots?

B (4:51)

You know, I think it can be good for a lot of vegetables, but I think that it helps to lose the idea that it has to just be butter and cream. There is some brown butter in there, but I'm using a brothy sauce. There's a vegetable broth in there. You could use a turkey if you want. But I'm using vegetable to keep it vegetarian. So there's a little bit of flour for thickener, but you're basically building this just gently thickened brothy sauce. And I love it because you can actually still taste the carrots. The vegetable will taste like the vegetable that it is, but better flavored, not just buried in things that are gonna convince you you wanna eat it. I promise they can. Carrots that taste like carrots can still be good. I promise.

C (5:27)

And I think I heard you mention capers.

B (5:29)

I put a little capers in at the end.

C (5:31)

What do the capers do?

B (5:32)

How do you feel about capers?

C (5:33)

I like em.

B (5:34)

Okay. I feel like they have. People have very strong opinions on them and I'm like, how could you hate those little like ping pong? Like they're like tiny little pickles. So I stir them in right before I put the ch crumbs on top and I just feel like it brightens it up a little bit because carrots are pretty sweet naturally and brown butter is going to give it a little nutty sweetness. So I feel like the capers add like a nice punctuation and brightness.

C (5:55)

How do you bring a sense of richness or indulgence to this dish?

B (6:01)

Cheese.

C (6:03)

Did you say cheese?

A (6:04)

Cheese.

D (6:05)

I said cheese.

B (6:05)

I have my priorities straight.

C (6:09)

Oh, I'm sorry. This text makes me laugh. It says I need a good sweet potato dish that isn't sweet potato casserole with the brown sugar and marshmallows. Maybe something more savory.

B (6:20)

I've got you covered. Okay. So this does break my casserole, my casserole rule.

C (6:24)

It's all right.

B (6:25)

But they're so easy. On my website, there is a recipe for slow roasted sweet potatoes. You bake them For a few hours. I know that sounds insane. You could do it a day before. It doesn't matter. You rub them in a tiny bit of olive oil and a nice amount of salt and pepper, and you bake them low and slow. And they become almost caramelized and almost candy like inside without you adding any sugar. You're really, like, taking care of their natural sweetness. And you do not need anything on top because they're gonna come out really crunchy on the outside and really sweet and tender on the inside. We usually just do a pat of salted butter and that is it. And if you wanna make them a day or two in advance, just reheat them while the turkey's in for the last like 30 minutes. They're really forgiving.

C (7:06)

One of our big opinions. This text says, lose the marshmallows. Where do you stand on marshmallows? On sweet potatoes?

B (7:16)

Once a year. Once a year. It tastes so good. I'm not saying you have to embrace it. I didn't actually grow up with it, but my mother in law always makes this version and she does mashed butternut squash and a couple other squashes. She puts a little bit of dried cranberries in there so it's not directly sweet. And those marshmallows on that, I love it. I love it.

C (7:36)

This text says my opinion. Jelly cranberry sauce that comes in a can. I can eat the entire contents. What do you say?

B (7:46)

I'm pro. I didn't really grow up with it. I love like a cranberry sauce just from the back of the bag recipe, but I respect it. And I've also seen. I've seen a lot of chefs this year kind of doctoring it up with a little orange zest or chopped pistachios. Like, I feel like we could make it a little prettier, but I like it.

A (8:07)

Our next side dish. It's not a side dish. You have to have stuffing. You have to have stuffing and you suggest a challah stuffing. Challah. I couldn't help myself. How does your go to challah stuffing reflect a doable approach to Thanksgiving?

B (8:27)

I love it because you can be insane like me. We know I'm not like a normal person. This is a strange thing I've chosen for a job. So I will go ahead and make an extra challah because my recipe makes two. And so you basically have one for French toast. Okay. But store bought is absolutely fine here. And we live in New York. You can get store bought challah easily. I love it because the natural sweetness and richness of challah goes so well with stuffing without adding sugary things. The rest of it is very classic. It's butter, it's onion, celery, a lot of herbs. You could add sausage if you like sausage. You could add another vegetable if you like that. But I like that it's very simple and. And you cannot mess it up.

A (9:05)

If I had to buy a storhala, do you have any suggestions?

B (9:09)

I am actually not very picky. I mean, don't get me wrong, if I'm eating it directly, I would love it to come from Elbow Bakery or Bread's or one of the wonderful bakeries we have in the city that make them. But if you're just using it to dice it up, honestly, the stuff I get from Fresh Direct is just fine.

A (9:24)

And you have a really simple recipe involved with celery, leeks and herbs. How did you land on that? That's enough.

B (9:33)

Just stop. I feel like sometimes there's too much going on and we have so many ingredients in so many dishes. And I don't know how you feel at the end of the Thanksgiving meal, but I sometimes wish there was two less ingredients, two fewer ingredients on my stuff.

A (9:48)

No, it's true.

B (9:48)

It's just too much and sometimes just a really simple thing. Like to me, the leeks, the celery, the herbs, the butter, the broth, I feel like that's it. We got it. Like we just stop, stop, stop.

A (10:01)

Talk to Gregory online. One who's calling from the Bronx. Hi, Gregory. Thanks for making the time to call. All of it.

E (10:09)

Hello, ladies. How are you doing?

A (10:10)

Doing well.

E (10:12)

Okay. I couldn't resist once you touched upon the sweet potato casserole. I'm making it right now for Thursday. I'm hosting for a bunch of students and their families Thanksgiving dinner. I'm not. Normally when I go visiting, I'm not allowed to come in without having first in my hands to present my sweet potato casserole, which is not really mine. It's the Ruth's Chris Steakhouse sweet potato casserole with a pecan crust. The recipe I use, I get it from the website. The girl who ate Everything and I do it. It's very easy, very accessible for most every cook. The one substitute I do is I substitute one and I double the recipe when I make it in the casserole. I substitute one third of the sweet potato puree for butternut squash puree, which I roast. And one thing so that you don't make the mistake. I did make sure that you roast the butternut Squash. You cut it in half and roast it cut side down so that the moisture cooks out. If not, you'll have a soupy mess.

B (11:11)

I mean, I would eat that. You could just tell us what time to come over and we'll like, we heard you were making it today, so if you don't mind, we'll stop by.

A (11:18)

Thanks for calling, Greg. It's our Small Steaks Big Opinion series. We are talking side dishes for Thanksgiving. Our guest is Deb Pearlman, founder of Smitten Kitchen. Our number is 2124-3396-9221-2433. WNYC. What is a side dish you love? What's one that you cannot stand? After the break, we'll get into green bean Cass. You're listening to all of it on wnyc. I'm Alison Stewart. My guest is Deb Pearlman, founder of Smitten Kitchen. And we're talking about Thanksgiving side dishes for our Small Steaks Big Opinion series. The dishes that can truly make or break the meal. This says, shout out to my Swedish homies, Lingonberries. Instead of cranberries, this one says Smitten Kitchen's apple and cheddar. And crisp salad is the ideal salad for people who don't think they like salad. I make it for my family every year.

C (12:26)

Aw.

A (12:27)

All right, I have to ask you, Deb, about green bean casserole with crispy onions. A lot of people feel very strongly about green bean casserole. What do you say?

B (12:40)

Pro. But I like it homemade.

A (12:43)

All right, tell me more.

B (12:44)

Okay, so it's really not that crazy to make homemade. When you fry your own onions and they're like these, it's like this big tangle on top. They're so delicious. It's like this great heaping pile, and then underneath, you can take fresh green beans. You can just barely cook them so they're not mushy, and get it just right. And then you're basically making this. You're making a mushroom sauce, and you can leave the mushrooms out if you leave if you're not into it. But it's basically just a butter flour broth with some sauteed mushrooms and garlic. And it's just a completely different thing when you have it from scratch. Now, if your nostalgia is for the canned soup, frozen green beans means French is onion. That's fine. But if that's not your nostalgia, and this is the one that converts everyone.

A (13:28)

About the crispy onions, how do you get them crispy and golden?

B (13:33)

I fry them, but they keep really nicely so you do thin onions, and you toss them with a little bit of breadcrumb and a little bit of flour, and it gives just enough coating for the frying to kind of, like, hang on. And then they keep. You could just leave them in a bowl lined with a paper towel to collect the extra grease. And when the casserole's all warm, just toss them back on, warm it for a couple minutes, and once again, casseroles wins for the win for Thanksgiving.

A (13:57)

And you talk about fresh ingredients being important.

C (13:59)

The green beans, real mushrooms, if you use them, a smooth white sauce, and the crispy onions. What do the fresh ingredients do to this casserole?

B (14:08)

I think it makes it really taste like what it is. When we think of green bean casserole, you're not really imagining the flavor of green beans. No, you're not. But you can taste it here, and you can also taste like that. It's a really nice, crispy, sweet onion. And you can have a lot more of it.

C (14:21)

Let's go to Margit from Manhattan.

A (14:25)

Thank you for taking the time to call.

C (14:27)

All of it.

D (14:29)

Hi. I am such a fan of Deb Perlman. If anybody doesn't know Smitten Kitchen, literally, her recipes never go wrong. It's amazing.

B (14:39)

Thank you.

D (14:40)

And you mentioned the back of the bag on cranberries, and I just have a little tweak. Instead of water, use orange juice and then half the sugar. And it's so good. I. I sometimes have to make it twice because I eat. Literally, I eat the whole thing.

B (14:58)

I'm the same. I actually have an extra container of it, and I've been putting a little scoop on my plain yogurt this week. It's so fun right before Thanksgiving. It's really good with yogurt for breakfast.

C (15:08)

Thanks for giving us a call. This says braise leeks with a vinaigrette cold. That's my go to. Love that. The best side dish that I ever made is yams or sweet potato potatoes mashed with coconut milk and red curry paste. It's been one of the big favorites at Thanksgiving meals at my house for years.

B (15:28)

That sounds amazing. I would love that.

A (15:29)

Let's talk to Juno in Brooklyn. Hi, Juno.

C (15:32)

Thank you for calling all of it.

D (15:35)

Hi, Allison. Hi, Deb. I'm such a big fan of both of you. Thanks for taking my call. So I was just calling to share that one of the dishes that I'm making for Thanksgiving and that I make every year is corn pudding. It's really not fancy. It uses jiffy corn muffin Mix eggs, canned cream style corn, milk, butter. That's pretty much it. And it is so good. It is always a hit at the Thanksgiving table and also is a great thing to bring to, like, the school Thanksgiving potluck has been a hit at everyone that my kids have ever brought it to. So just want to share. It doesn't have to be fancy. It can be really, you know, down home. And it's just delicious. A little bit, little bit sweet, a little bit savory. It's perfect.

A (16:17)

Juno, thanks so for calling. My guest is Deb Pearlman, founder of the Smitten Kitchen. We're talking about Thanksgiving sides for our small stakes big opinion series. We want to hear your Thanksgiving side dish opinions. What is a side that you just love? What is one that you cannot stand? Our phone number is 212433, WNYC 212433. 9692. Call us up and give us your big opinion. All right, we're gonna talk about Mac and cheese, but we're talking about skillet baked Mac and cheese. What made you decide to go with the skillet based Mac and cheese?

B (16:59)

I love the browning that you get on it and I love the ease from stovetop to the oven and then to the table. I feel like it just makes it really easy and anytime you can take a step out of something, it makes it that way.

A (17:11)

Good girl.

B (17:11)

As a person who does the cooking and the hosting, it's really nice. So I have made many good baked macaroni and cheeses over the years, and this was me trying to take everything I'd learned over the years and put it into one dish. There's a couple things that make it a lot easier. One, that we do it all in the same skillet, but also we don't have to pre cook the pasta. We soak it in warm water for 10 minutes. Five minutes, actually. I forgot. Macaroni is much thinner. So you soak it for a few minutes.

C (17:36)

You don't cook it.

B (17:37)

You can put it right in. And as it bakes, it cooks the pasta perfect perfectly. And it just, it saves a pot, it saves a colander. Like, it's just. It makes it a lot easier, and it's still incredibly decadent and rich.

C (17:49)

What cheese do you use?

B (17:50)

I use a mix, so I like to use white cheddar. I like to use a little pecorino in there. I feel like you need that salty sharpness. And then I use a little bit of gruyere. You could use Comte or Swiss. That's just for a little bit of nuttiness to round it out. And, of course, you can swap in whatever cheeses you think are perfect there. But I think something salty, something classic, like a cheddar, and then something a little nutty makes a really nice trifecta. And I didn't want to make it too complicated, so I stuck to three cheeses. But you can open up your cheese drawer and whatever you've got in there will probably taste good in it.

C (18:19)

This is a controversial pick. This text says, my controversial pick. My sister makes Maryland crab casserole as she is a DC inhabitant, and the crab is always fresh. Ooh, that sounds pretty good. You're suggesting balsamic braise Brussels with pancetta.

B (18:37)

Yes.

C (18:39)

Why does the pancetta and balsamic glaze go with the Brussels sprouts? That sounds like a lot of different things.

B (18:47)

It's really delicious. So this is a recipe from Suzanne Goen, who is this wonderful chef on the west coast, so you can basically trust any recipe from her. But I started making it probably almost 15 years ago, and I actually. I know we all love our crispy fried and roasted Brussels sprouts, but again, I think it doesn't lend itself well to preparing ahead. And there's something in braising where you get this infusion of flavor and tanginess and this. We still put some crispy crumbs on top at the end with some herbs, but it's just incredible. And I never expected the recipe to be so popular on my website, but people make this one every year, so once again, you can make it ahead. It keeps well, it reheats well, and you just throw those crumbs on right before serving and you're set.

C (19:30)

Someone has a question for you. It says, can Deb share what she thinks of retro dishes like Jell O Salads? I like to surprise my guests with a recipe from the 1960s called Men Like It. It's crushed pineapple, pecan pieces, chopped celery, cream cheese, congealed, and lime jello. What do you say?

B (19:48)

I say that we have an. We do not yuck anyone's yum. That is my family's mantra. That was so good, but I didn't grow up with it, so I don't. It's not a nostalgia point for me, but if you served it to me, I would think it was so cool. Just because you made it for me and it mattered to you.

C (20:08)

This text says, my mom makes a delicious onion gratin. I thought it was disgusting as a kid, and Now I look forward to it. You have a potato and leek gratin. What's the secret to it?

B (20:18)

Cream and butter and cheese. That's my one. I always feel like you need to have one really creamy, decadent dish, and that would be my choice of it. I like the way the leeks sort of break up the heaviness of the potatoes a little bit. It's not insanely heavy. Like, it's still on the thinner side, so you can see the vegetables through it. But it's got just the right amount of decadence, and it's got a nice crispy layer on top, and it really keeps well. And I was gonna say with that onion casserole, See, your mom was playing the long game. She knew. She knew if she kept making it that eventually it would be the taste of Thanksgiving to you.

C (20:49)

If I had to pick one salad to make, what would you suggest?

B (20:53)

I would say a salad that keeps really well. If you're very anti green bean casserole. A green bean salad is really nice. I've got one with an almond vinaigrette that's excellent. Or something with like, maybe cabbage or shredded Brussels sprouts. I've got one on my site with some apples, Brussels sprouts. It's got a little bit of mint, and you put some pomegranate in, and it's just really nice. And it keeps well so you don't have to worry about the lettuce getting wilted. Pick something that's crunchy and stays crunchy.

A (21:17)

What's your favorite side?

B (21:18)

Ooh, God. Maybe that gratin, I was thinking, but I also. Those slow roasted sweet potatoes. It's three ingredients, and it's so good, it's crazy not to make them.

A (21:29)

Deb Perlman is the founder of the Smitten Kitchen. She joined us for our Small Steaks Big Opinion series. Deb, thank you so much.

B (21:37)

Thanks for having me on.

F (21:39)

This is Ira Flato, host of Science Friday. For over 30 years, the science Friday team has been reporting high quality science and technology news, making science fun for curious people by covering everything from the outer reaches of space to the rapidly changing world of AI to the tiniest microbes in our bodies. Audiences trust our show because they know we're driven by a mission to inform and serve listeners first and foremost with important news they won't get anywhere else. And our sponsors benefit from that halo effect. For more information on becoming a sponsor, visit sponsorship.wnyc.org.