All Of It with Alison Stewart

Episode: The Story of King Records

Air Date: October 6, 2025
Guest: Yemi Oyediran, Director of King of Them, the Story of King Records
Main Theme: Exploring the history, influence, and lasting cultural impact of Cincinnati’s King Records, a groundbreaking, racially integrated record label.

Episode Overview

In this episode, host Alison Stewart dives into the fascinating history of King Records, a Cincinnati-based label often overshadowed by Motown or Sun Records but deeply influential in shaping American music. Stewart speaks with Yemi Oyediran, musician, filmmaker, and director of the new PBS documentary King of Them, the Story of King Records. The conversation explores King’s origins, its founder Sid Nathan, its pivotal role in racial integration in the music industry, and the unique relationships that helped launch iconic artists like James Brown.

Key Discussion Points

The Origins and Diversity of King Records

• King Records’ Founding:

  • Sid Nathan launched King Records in 1943, recognizing a business opportunity in the intersection of Black and white musical forms as post-war migration brought diverse populations to Cincinnati.
  • Cincinnati, though overlooked, became a “musical mecca” due to this influx and King’s embrace of multiple genres.
  • Quote: "King Records was kind of hiding in plain sight...it’s just not a Cincinnati story. It’s an American one." — Yemi Oyediran [02:49]

• Early Integration and Cultural Exchange:

  • King was among the first racially integrated labels—both in its artist roster and business operations.
  • The company catered to working-class folks, selling both “race” (Black) and “hillbilly” (white) music at a time when major labels ignored these markets.
  • Quote: “King music is not about highfalutin stuff. It was from its very beginning, it was made for working class folks.” — Yemi Oyediran [03:39]

The Entrepreneurial Spirit of Sid Nathan

• Background:

  • Described as a “knockabout,” Sid Nathan had tried many trades—pawn shop owner, wrestling promoter, even operating a “rigged” shooting gallery—before entering the record business by chance.
  • His opportunism and reluctance to let any “penny” go to waste became legendary.
  • Anecdote: “They wait the entire 15 minutes [at the parking meter] because Sid insisted on getting every last penny that he paid for...” — Yemi Oyediran [08:24]

• Innovative Business Practices:

  • Frustrated by corruption in the record-pressing industry and empowered by a visit to the Society for the Blind, Nathan decided to press records himself—initial attempts were subpar, but it allowed for full vertical integration.
  • Quote: “He got into pressing because he didn’t want to have to pay other people to do basically things that he thought he could do.” — Yemi Oyediran [07:59]

Talent Scouting and Roster Diversity

• Discovery of Artists:

  • Leveraged proximity to the powerful 50,000-watt WLW radio station to meet local musicians who dropped by his record shop, hungry for material or exposure.
  • Early signings included Grandpa Jones (“He dressed up as an old man...started doing this in his 20s...aged into it”), Merle Travis (inventor of Travis picking), and Cowboy Copas, before pivoting to rhythm & blues.

• Global Reach:

  • A caller, Roy from Roanoke [11:36], highlighted King’s diversity by noting the Tokyo Happy Coats, a Japanese group signed in 1970.
  • Sid Nathan sought “amateur musicians”—the overlooked talent of any background, reflecting both his empathy as a Jewish American and shrewd business instincts.
  • Quote: “He wanted to give everybody an opportunity and the people who don’t normally get a chance. He felt that he could find gold mining in that space.” — Yemi Oyediran [12:38]

Racial Integration and Company Culture

• Workplace Inclusion:
  • Notable for Sid Nathan’s hiring of Ben Siegel to ensure “a totally open company” without race or religious barriers.
  • Musicians like Philip Paul recount how King was an oasis of equality, contrasting Cincinnati’s racial exclusion elsewhere.
  • Clip Quote: “[At a club] they wouldn’t serve me, they’d serve him. But it was different at King Records.” — Philip Paul [13:57]
  • Sid gave Black executive Henry Glover stock and real decision-making power—unprecedented in the 1940s.
  • Quote: “Sid did other things that were unique...bringing people to the table by actually giving them not only a seat, but also a plate, a piece of the pie.” — Yemi Oyediran [15:12]

The Sid Nathan–James Brown Dynamic

• Friction and Partnership:
  • James Brown, described as a “Tasmanian devil” in the studio, bewildered Nathan with “Please, Please, Please,” which Nathan initially loathed but released (after firing then rehiring the producer when it became a hit).
  • Their relationship swung between contention and loyalty—lawsuits, contract disputes, but also business innovations that helped Brown transition from “hardest working man in show business” to the “Godfather of Soul.”
  • Quote: “Both of them were visionaries and both of them were very stubborn...Their attention kind of made history.” — Yemi Oyediran [16:45]
  • Despite legal and personal clashes (“They sued each other several times”), Brown was a pallbearer at Nathan’s funeral, underscoring their bond.

Notable Quotes & Moments

• On King’s Impact:

  • “Much of that [funk legacy] was created here in Cincinnati.” — Documentary Voiceover [00:53]

• On Sid Nathan’s Entry into Records:

  • “Somebody...had borrowed money from Sid’s pawn business...said, here are the rest of my records. If you sell this stack right here, that'll make your six bucks back. And that’s what got him in...” — Yemi Oyediran [05:37]

• On Company Culture:

  • “We all got along. Maybe after we came out of the studio, we went our separate ways, but we all got along in the studios.” — Philip Paul [14:56]

• On Artist Development:

  • “You can’t really [become] the Godfather of Soul without the two principal characters in [James Brown’s] business life, which was Sid Nathan and Ben Bart.” — Yemi Oyediran [18:25]

Timestamps for Important Segments

• 00:09–01:13 — Setting the scene: King Records’ legacy and the new documentary.
• 01:58–02:49 — Yemi Oyediran introduces his personal connection to King.
• 03:27–04:31 — Discussion of King’s working-class audience and early business model.
• 04:37–06:37 — Sid Nathan’s life before King Records and how he entered the record business.
• 06:51–08:12 — How Sid started pressing his own records.
• 08:24–09:00 — Sid Nathan’s frugality and eccentricities.
• 09:31–11:36 — How King found talent and early artist discoveries.
• 11:42–13:38 — Audience call on Tokyo Happy Coats, embracing overlooked talent.
• 13:57–15:07 — Philip Paul on King’s racially integrated workplace.
• 16:25–19:09 — Sid Nathan and James Brown: friction, partnership, and music history.

Summary & Takeaway

King Records, through entrepreneurial risk-taking, diversity, and sheer doggedness, became a crucial force in American music, nurturing some of the industry’s most transformative figures and sounds. Its story is one of chance, struggle, integration, and the unpredictable relationships that make great art—and historic change—possible.