The Unique Culinary Traditions of Vermont

Summary

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Podcast Summary: All Of It – “The Unique Culinary Traditions of Vermont”

Host: Alison Stewart (WNYC)
Guest: Gesina Bullock Prado (Pastry chef, Food Network host, author of My Vermont Table)
Airdate: November 23, 2023

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Overview

This episode explores the unique culinary culture of Vermont with guest Gesina Bullock Prado, who discusses her new cookbook My Vermont Table: Recipes for All Six Seasons. Through personal anecdotes, historic recipes, and lively listener participation, the conversation delves into Vermont’s distinct sense of place and home, how its geography shapes food traditions, and the comforting role of family recipes—most notably, the legendary Dog Team Tavern Sticky Buns and Helga’s (her mother’s) potato salad.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Vermont’s Unique Culinary Identity

• Vermont symbolizes comfort and nostalgia in American culture, evoking images of coziness, solitude, and natural beauty.
• Gesina observes Vermont is often shorthand for comfort:
  Quote: “You just have to say Vermont, and it’s the code word for comfort and solitude and loveliness.” (02:57)
• Vermont identifies six seasons: spring, summer, fall, stick, winter, and mud season—each with its foods and rituals.
• Stick season is the eerie interval after leaves drop but before snow, an unsettling but magical moment that shapes cooking and creativity.

2. Connection to Place and Family

• Gesina’s multicultural background (childhood in D.C., time in Germany and Austria, previous careers as lawyer and in entertainment) left her feeling “always slightly displaced.” But arriving in Vermont, she immediately felt at home.
  Quote: “Heart just opened up and sang. I’m like, this is home.” (04:52)
• Vermont’s hybrid of Bavarian village charm and Appalachian hills resonated deeply.

3. Vermont’s ‘Six Seasons’ Explained

• Mud Season: Roads turn to impassable muck during the thaw; the air is filled with scents from nearby sugar houses (maple syrup processing).
  Quote: “Driving through mud... is as close to quicksand as I was promised.” (05:50)
• Stick Season: Trees are bare, the landscape is quiet post-tourist season, and the mood is tinged with Halloween eeriness. (06:17)

4. Signature Vermont Ingredients & Recipes

• Maple Syrup as a Versatile Seasoning:
  • More than a sweetener; it replaces sugar in savory dishes, enhances sauces, and even flavors coffee.
    Quote: “It incorporates instantaneously because it is liquid... it’s a superfood. And it’s maple. It’s like such an American thing, right?” (07:09)
• Specialty Baked Goods:
  • Dog Team Tavern Sticky Buns: Legendary for their use of potatoes and potato water, creating extra-tender, “spongy, glorious” buns.
    Quote: “You can make them monstrous dinner-plate size... but the bottom line is you need that potato to make them tender, tender, tender.” (10:24)
• Classic German Heritage:
  • Helga’s Potato Salad—a Christmas Eve-only staple in Gesina’s childhood, now shared with the world.
    Quote: “You will realize that potato salad should be, and could be, a meal of its own.” (12:23)

5. Farm-to-Table Lifestyle & Local Food Culture

• Callers and guest highlight the taste of local Vermont products (milk, cheese, butchered meats, craft beer).
• Community-oriented farming and direct-from-farmer markets foster a slower, more mindful, and joy-filled cooking experience.
  Caller Todd: “Whatever it is, it just seems to taste better in Vermont... there’s something so enjoyable about getting local ingredients and slowing down.” (09:03)
• Even transplants from other states are surprised by the availability of specialty items like pancetta, guanciale, and fresh pasta from small producers.
  Caller Amy: “We’ve just been so impressed, and we’re eating better than ever, growing our own vegetables and of course all the maple and the maple creamies.” (15:15)

6. Tips and Practical Wisdom

• Baking Advice: For thin, lacy oat crisp cookies—ensure proper oven heat and preheating; use an oven thermometer because “ovens are big fat liars.” (16:40)
• Choosing Maple Syrup: Four grades (golden, amber, dark, very dark)—choose darker for stronger flavor, especially in baking.
  Quote: “If you’re baking with it, go for very dark... a Vermonter will go for a syrup that is darker because we want that flavor.” (17:39)
• Vermont Law on Apple Pie: Law requires a “good faith effort” to serve apple pie with milk, cheddar cheese (minimum half an ounce), or vanilla ice cream. (18:23)
  Gesina’s recipe goes historic with the Marlboro Apple Pie (includes sherry and pureed apples), and she marvels at this quirky law for state pride.

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Listener Participation & Memorable Moments

• Community Shout-outs:
  • Earth Sky Time Farm in Manchester, VT—beloved for its bread and community events. (08:04)
• Caller Recipe Innovations:
  • Chris shares an improvised tarte Tatin with maple instead of sugar (“nobody’s ever rejected this”). (13:36)
  • Gesina celebrates such happy accidents and the use of maple for depth in classics.
• Family Pride:
  • Gesina reveals her mother Helga was a literal opera diva, and that passing down her sacred potato salad is both a personal and symbolic act. (13:28)

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Notable Quotes

• “Heart just opened up and sang. I’m like, this is home.” — Gesina Bullock Prado (04:52)
• “When you say Vermont, when you eat as a Vermonter, you think of comfort and loveliness and joyfulness.” — Gesina Bullock Prado (02:57)
• “Driving through mud... is as close to quicksand as I was promised.” — Gesina Bullock Prado (05:50)
• “If they don’t look like a starchy whale breaching the soup... it’s done wrong.” (On German potato dumplings) — Gesina Bullock Prado (11:14)
• “You will realize that potato salad should be, and could be, a meal of its own.” — Gesina Bullock Prado (12:23)
• “Ovens are big fat liars. We can’t live without them, but they lie to us all the time.” — Gesina Bullock Prado (17:09)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• 02:57 — What makes Vermont’s food culture unique?
• 04:52 — Gesina’s journey to calling Vermont “home.”
• 05:50 — Vermont’s mud and stick seasons explained.
• 07:09 — Maple syrup as seasoning in savory dishes.
• 09:03 — Caller Todd on why food “tastes better” in Vermont.
• 10:24 — The story behind Dog Team Tavern Sticky Buns.
• 12:23 — The secret and importance of Helga’s Potato Salad.
• 13:36 — Caller Chris’s maple tarte Tatin adaptation.
• 15:15 — Vermont transplants marvel at specialty foods and local agriculture.
• 16:40 — Troubleshooting lacy oat crisps.
• 17:39 — How to select the right grade of maple syrup.
• 18:23 — Vermont’s official apple pie law and recipe reflections.
• 20:18 — Episode closes with Noah Kahn’s “Stick Season.”

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Conclusion

This episode is a heartfelt exploration of how Vermont’s landscapes and seasons create a singular, comfort-driven food culture, illuminated by Gesina Bullock Prado’s rich family history and deep affection for her adopted home. From quirky state laws and family recipes to practical kitchen tips, listeners leave with a new appreciation for the Green Mountain state’s enduring culinary traditions.

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Transcript

[A]

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[B]

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[B]

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[C]

This is all of it from wnyc. I'm Alison Stewart. On today's show, we're thinking about food and family. Our next guest cookbook touches on both it is stick season up in Vermont, that unique time towards the end of the year in between fall and winter, after the leaves have fallen but before the snow has come. It's a season that Vermont singer songwriter Noah Kahn made famous with his hit song. Pastry chef and Food Network host Gesina Bullock Prado also loves stick season and she's written a new cookbook called My Vermont Recipes for All Six Seasons. The book is a love letter to her state and the kind of food you can expect to be served to you throughout six seasons spring, summer, fall, stick winter and mud season. No, it is not just all maple inspired recipes, although who doesn't love some freshly tapped Vermont maple syrup? There are recipes for apple pie and Dog Team Tavern sticky buns inspired by a beloved local restaurant. And as for the family element, Gesina is the sister of Sandra Bullock. And yes, the book contains their German mother's potato salad recipe. Her name was Helga, by the way. Before we get into it, you will hear callers throughout this conversation, but this is an encore presentation so we aren't taking calls today. I started by asking Casina what makes the culinary culture of Vermont unique?

[B]

Well, Vermont, it's one of those touchstone states that when you just say the name, it reads comfort. It's like a code word in TV shows that, you know, scandal. The president was going to retire to Vermont, Right? And, friends, we're going to go for a romantic weekend to Vermont. I mean, you just have to say Vermont. And it's the code word for comfort and solitude and loveliness and. And I think of the food that way as well. And because we have those six unique seasons, or at least we recognize them, there is a flow to our year that is so quintessentially Vermont. And what we look forward to, what we talk about, what we're craving, what we're all thinking about for the next month, that it is quintessentially Vermont. So the ephemerals in the spring, the gardening in that tiny, tiny season of summer, and then mud season, of course, where we're all tapping or thinking about tapping or smelling that lovely scent that comes from the sugar houses. It is. It is so uniquely Vermont. But it is something that I think every American shares that knowledge of. When you say Vermont, when you think Vermont, when you eat as a Vermonter, no tea, you think of comfort and loveliness and joyfulness. Tapping for maple sugar, by the way, and vamaner Vermonter. There's no tea like Mitten is mitten.

[C]

Gotcha. Okay. My guest is Gesina Block Prado. The name of the book is My Vermont Table. So for people, your story in the intro in the book, you say up front, you know, I grew up in D.C. in the Arlington area. And you spent a lot of time there, obviously, you spent a lot of time in Germany and Austria with your grandmother helga, great name, L.A. you had a previous career as a lawyer and in the entertainment business. And then almost 20 years ago, you find Vermont, or at least you decide to put down roots in Vermont. What was it about Vermont that called to you?

[B]

Well, when I was in Virginia, I was always a German girl. When I was in Germany, I was always the American girl. And I don't think that's an unusual thing for many Americans to feel is slightly displaced and never knowing where you belong. But when my husband took me, we were a courtin, and he took me to Vermont, first New Hampshire. And then we rode across the bridge into Vermont, across the Connecticut River. Heart just opened up and sang. I'm like, this is home. And because Vermonters often look at most people who live in Vermont as outsiders, I'm among very good company. I'm not alone. My people are there. So I Found home in that place because it spoke to Bavaria about the sweet little villages in Bavaria. It spoke to the Appalachian Mountains, which I adore because I love those gentle rolling hills. And it just spoke to comfort and. And it became home.

[C]

Could you describe the two extra seasons that Vermont has?

[B]

Yeah. And mud season, which they're so practical. It's like. Oh, yeah, of course. That's what it's called, mud season. Because when the big thaw happens, the majority of our roads are dirt, and when the big thaw happens, there's lots of water and that dirt becomes mud. So, you know, driving in the. In the winter, no problem, but driving through mud, it's like when. When I was a kid, I was promised quicksand would be, you know, something that would. I would have to avo in my adulthood.

[C]

That's what they told us, wasn't it Gilligan's island in the Brady Bunch?

[B]

Yeah, yeah. I was like, I'm expecting quick. So that never materialized. However, the mud is as close to quicksand as I was promised, so you're not going anywhere. But the good thing is, is that when you're stuck in the mud, you're going to smell the beautiful wafts of maple coming your way, because it's also sugaring season. And then stick season is when the leaves have fallen and it gets quiet because all the tourists have gone and the snow has not yet come, and you look up at the trees and all you see is sticks. But it's also near Halloween, so that eeriness is perfect. Right? It's like, it's a little foggy. It's a little creepy. It's a lot of perfect because it's Halloweeny time.

[C]

Let's talk about some parts of the book that are really particularly interesting. Use maple syrup as seasoning.

[B]

Yes.

[C]

All right. What's an example of using maple syrup as seasoning?

[B]

Well, oftentimes in recipes, it calls for granulated sugar, and I'm talking about savory recipes. And the most typical would be, like, grandma's gravy, like a tomato sauce, where the tomatoes are never quite as sweet as they should be. So granulated sugar is usually added, but I say add the maple because it incorporates instantaneously because it is liquid. It also has that backbone of, like, that buttery ness to it. It is three times as sweet, but has fewer calories than sugar. Not that when you're making something super yummy, that that's what you're thinking about, but those are all. And it's a superfood. And it's maple. It's like such an American thing, right? Only we in the Americas make maple syrup. So it is such a beaut addition to things that need just that little, little hint of sweetness.

[C]

I like it in coffee.

[B]

Oh, coffee and tea. The best. Right.

[C]

Let's talk to Mary calling in from Mount Kisco. Hi, Mary, thanks for calling, all of it.

[D]

Hi, yeah, no, thank you. I just wanted to give a shout out to a fabulous community farm in Manchester, Vermont. It's called Earth Sky Time. And they have fresh baked breads and spreads and dips and produce and the food is crazy good. And they have community concerts all the time and they really, they just add a lot to the community. And it's a family, wonderful, delicious place.

[C]

Thank you for calling in. Let's talk to Todd from North Port, Long Island. Hi, Todd.

[E]

Hello. How are you doing? Great. I just so happened to be picking up my lunch and heard this on the radio. And I've never called in, but I thought now would be the time. I've been going to Vermont since I was 12 years old. I'm in my 40s. We have a family home up there. And I find that whatever it is, it just seems to taste better in Vermont as opposed to New York.

[B]

And you're correct. Simple.

[E]

And it's simple and silly stuff like milk and cheese and like meat from the butcher. And even when I go up there, I don't go out to eat that much. I end up cooking a lot. And it is just something so enjoyable about getting local ingredients, like slowing down, going to the farmer's market, going to the, you know, the general store to get stuff. And of course, like the maple syrup and the apples and all that stuff is good. I mean, the amount of craft beer, I'm always astonished every time I go up and delight.

[B]

I hope.

[C]

I think Todd has transported himself midcom.

[B]

I mean, he describes everything that I love Vermont, that it just tastes better. And that's why I wrote the book. It's like I want people to have. This is the book that I needed when I lived in la. That this is like. Because when you need to be transported, you think of those ingredients and that comfort and just relax and you slow down, no matter the season. And you can bring that beauty that Todd is describing into your life no matter where you are.

[C]

You were so kind. Casina to give us two recipes to put on our page on the WMYC website. One of Ms. Dog Te Team Tavern Sticky buns. What makes this different from other sticky buns?

[B]

Well, they are a legend in Vermont. There was the Dog Team Tavern, and it sadly burnt down, but it was a historic tavern. And they were famous for their sticky buns, among other things. And they. The best part was they served them as an appetizer, which, like, as a child, like, as a child, I would have been like, this is my home. But it uses potato, both in that it uses the actual potato and. And the water in which the potatoes are cooked. So what it does is ends up making a very so spongy, glorious, sticky, sticky, sticky bun. And you can make them monstrous dinner plate size, or you can make them smaller, but the bottom line is that you need that potato to make them tender, tender, tender.

[C]

Also potato dumplings. That was the other recipe. And you're insistent in the book that they must be, quote, baseball sized, period.

[B]

I say if they don't look like a starchy whale breaching the soup or whatever it is that you've got them in, it's done wrong. Because they need to be. They need to be big.

[C]

How do you make them big without making them too much? Too much of a good thing?

[B]

Well, I. I don't know. I don't know these words. You say too much. What are these words? You know, baseball size is the perfect size. The other thing that we do with them, if you don't eat all of them, is you slice them up and you fry them as a leftover. So if they aren't big enough, then you're not going to get a good fry. So, you know, I think. I think ahead. I think ahead of all the things that you can do with these things.

[C]

Here is Helga's potato salad. And this is the blurb you write for the little paragraph. My mother's potato salad's a staple on our holiday table, but the holiday was always and only Christmas Eve. We never had her potato salad any other day. Because we limit our Christmas Eve celebrations to immediate family. Only a few, select few had ever tasted the stuff. All right, tell us one about your decision to include this dish. Because you're saying, go for it, rest of the world.

[B]

Well, I realized far too late. I think I was in my 40s. I'm like, wait a second. I'm a grown woman. I'm allowed to make this potato salad any time of year. But Helga, she had a very strong presence in my life. And the rule was only Christmas Eve. So when I realized, oh, I'm allowed to do this anytime I like, and it is so delicious. We all know potatoes potato salad's very innocuous there's nothing that you can do to it, really, to make it judge it to the point that it's the gem of the table. However, when you put this in your mouth, you will be transcendent. You will. You will realize that potato salad should be, and could be a meal of its own. And the fact that she never shared it beyond that one day and with a handful of people is extraordinary because my mother was a diva and she literally, literally a diva. So you would think the diva would want to share this with the world, but she, like, kept it contained. So now, mom in heaven, I am sharing your potato salad with everyone because you and the potato salad are so.

[C]

Fabulous, and we mean it. Your mom was an opera.

[B]

Yeah. She was an opera singer. Yeah.

[C]

Let's talk to Chris from Andy's New York. Hi, Chris.

[D]

Oh, hi.

[E]

How are you?

[C]

Great.

[E]

Some time ago, I saw Jacques Papin make tarte Tatin on the tv, which. Which was a recipe that was created by the Tatin sisters, and it was kept secret. And people, restaurants from Paris, had to send spies out to find out what she was doing. Anyway, I immediately forgot his technique and made my own and just forgot about the white sugar. Just poured maple syrup in and cooked the apples in that. And then when it's time to put the puff pastry, I weave it into a basket because you're not going to get the crust from the maple syrup. So I don't flip it out. I just slice it with the top, which looks like a basket. Nobody. Nobody's ever rejected this.

[B]

Yes. I mean, happy accidents, right?

[C]

And you have an apple tartan recipe right here on 147. What is. What do you account for the success of your tartan?

[B]

Making a great puff. Making a great puff and great apples. So the two together, it's such a simple recipe with beautiful ingredients. I think in most cases in food, beautiful ingredients will elevate anything and you needn't doctor it too much. But then also, you know, Chris, as Chris noted, maple will not go wrong with most things.

[C]

Amy is calling in from Reigate, Vermont. Amy, thanks for calling in.

[D]

Hi, Amy. Hi. I hope my reception is good. We don't have great cell reception here. We are recent transplants. We moved from Brooklyn a couple years ago.

[B]

Welcome.

[D]

Probably the. Thank you. The only thing that gave us a little pause was that, well, first of all, there's really no place to eat out around here, but we do like to cook. And one of the things we were concerned about was that we wouldn't be able to find the ingredients that we usually cook with. But I have to say we've been happily surprised that even things that you wouldn't necessarily expect to find up here, like pancetta and guanciale and things that we would use to make. We do a lot of Italian cooking. They're here. People are small, producers are making pasta or making these Italian specialty items. You know, we of course, expected great cheese. We live not too far from Jasper Hill, and we live down the street from a dairy farm. But we've just been so impressed, and we're eating better than ever, growing our own vegetables and of course, all the maple and the maple creamies.

[B]

Beautifully done.

[C]

So we have a question from. Whenever we have a cookbook author on, someone usually tries to make something from the book. And our resident cookie monster, Zach, who came in and fixed your microphone, they tried to to make the oat crisp cookies, which were delicious. I've had four in the past two days. But they couldn't get them to come out with that thin, lacy look you describe in the book. Zach wants to give it another go.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

Any suggestion to get that laciness?

[B]

Make sure your oven is hot enough. That is number one. Because what it is essentially doing, because it's so butter forward, you need for that to spread and spread quickly. And with the right temperature of oven, it will do that. And you also want to make sure that it is preheated, heated, so that that cavity is radiating heat. So it's not just the temperature of the oven, it is the fact that it has been preheated. And because ovens are liars, you should.

[C]

Get maybe an oven thermometer.

[B]

I always tell people to get oven because ovens are big fat liars. We can't live without them, but they lie to us all the time. So bumping up that temperature and just making sure that you know you've got it well preheated. And then try again. And just don't put too much down. Put a small amount down so that there isn't much that needs to spread.

[C]

For people who can't make it to Vermont, but they can make it to the green markets of New York, which are excellent. Can you share some advice on picking a maple syrup?

[B]

Well, it depends on what you're using it for. So there are four grades. There's golden, amber, dark, and very dark. And they look as they are described, but their relative maple punch is different. So if you go for golden, it's very light amber, a little more maple flavor, dark, very mapley, very dark, very mapley. And if you're baking with it, go for very dark. If you just like a hint of maple, go for maybe the amber, which would be the more traditional to most people's maple syrup. It depends on what you're using it for. If you're putting it in your coffee, go with whatever. Right. It's all delicious. A Vermonter will go for a syrup that is darker because we want that flavor.

[C]

All right. Vermont has a law passed in 1999 that reads as follow. When serving apple pie in Vermont, a quote, good faith effort shall be made to meet one of the more falling conditions with a glass of milk. With a slice of cheddar cheese weighing a minimum of half an ounce.

[B]

That's my favorite part.

[C]

With a large scoop of vanilla ice cream. All right, so we have the pie police standing by. You don't necessarily mention this anywhere in your book.

[B]

No, the apple pie that I do have in there is one that is. So it predates 1999. So it's called a Marlboro apple pie. I wanted to go out on technicality. Yeah. I wanted to go full historic. And the Marlboro apple pie is one that uses sherry. You puree the apples and I call. It's like what bananas are to bread, apples are to this pie. You want to get an apple that is a little over ripened and super sweet, almost like alcoholic. And it used to be the staple on Vermont Thanksgiving tables. And it's kind of been lost through the years. There is. There. It's like a custardy thing. So there's like a. There is a dairy element too. So it. It squeaks into. It is not a violation of that law. So. But I just, I think that is the best thing ever. That my favorite part of it, it has to be no less than half an ounce, no less than. And it has to be cheddar cheese. And like. But the fact that they didn't say Vermont cheddar cheese is kind of mystifying to me. And that the vanilla ice cream isn't Ben and Jerry's. These are things that I thought they could have put in there as well.

[C]

Well, maybe just assume that it would be Vermont cheddar cheese.

[B]

One would assume correct. Yeah.

[C]

My guest has been Gesina Bullock Prado. The name of the book is My Vermont Table. So I don't know if you didn't know this, but we happen to have had Noah Khan in our studio. People know Noah Kahn has performed the song Stick Season, which went viral. Viral. He joined us back in December for a listening party and gave did it for us live. So we thought since we were talking about your book, we'd just go out on the live performance.

[B]

That's fabulous.

[C]

Here's Noah Kahn's stick season. The cookbook is called My Vermont Table.

[F]

As you promised me that I was more than all the miles combined. You must have had yourself a change of heart like halfway through the drive because your voice trailed off exactly as you passed my exit sign, kept on driving straight and left our future to the right.

[C]

That was pastry chef and Food Network host Casina Bullock Prado speaking about her new cookbook, my Vermont Recipes for All Six Seasons. And that is all of it for today's show. I'm Alison Stewart. Happy Thanksgiving. Enjoy the food, enjoy the holiday, and I will meet you back here next time.

[F]

She forgot that I exist. Didn't it spread half my fault? But I just like to play the victim. I'll drink alcohol till my friends come home for Christmas and I'll dream each night of some version of you that I might not have but I did not lose. Now your tired tracks and one pair of shoes and I'm split in half. That'll have to do. So I thought if I piled something good on all my bad that I could cancel out the darkness I inherited from dad. No, I am no longer funny cause I miss the way you laugh. You once called me forever now you still can't call me back And I affirm my bitch the season of the sticks and I suck your mom, she forgot.

[A]

Surprise Beach Day. No excuses. I'm in. Give me five. With Bic Soleil Glide Razor, you'll have hydrated, smooth skin that's ready to go on the fly. No shave cream needed. You can prep, shave and hydrate all in one step thanks to moisture bars that hydrate your skin during and after shaving. 5 flexible blades hug your skin for a close shave. Glide into smooth. It's your time to shine with Bix Olay. Buy now at Amazon and Walmart. Ready. Your skin looks amazing. So smooth and beach ready.

[B]

Let's go. NYC now delivers the most up to date local news from WNYC and Gothamist every morning, midday and evening with three updates a day. Listeners get break news, top headlines and in depth coverage from across New York City by sponsoring programming like NYC now. You'll reach our community of dedicated listeners with premium messaging and an uncluttered audio experience. Visit sponsorship.wnyc.org to get in touch and find out more.