Tiny Habits Perform Live

Summary

Podcast Summary: Tiny Habits Perform Live

Podcast: All Of It (WNYC)
Air Date: June 27, 2024
Host: Koosha Navadar
Guests: Tiny Habits (Cinya Khan, Maya Rae, Judah Mayowa)
Theme: Exploring the personal and musical dynamics of Tiny Habits, a rising acoustic folk trio, through live performances and an intimate conversation about friendship, creativity, and navigating the current music landscape.

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Episode Overview

This episode features the up-and-coming acoustic folk trio Tiny Habits, who have garnered significant attention for their soulful harmonies and heartfelt songwriting. Host Koosha Navadar welcomes the group into Studio 5 for live performances and a candid discussion about their origin, creative process, and the emotional foundation of their music and friendship. The episode provides an engaging look at the group’s debut album All for Something and explores how their collaborative spirit shapes both their sound and their approach to the challenges of the modern music industry.

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Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. Introduction to Tiny Habits and Their Journey

• Origin: The group met at college (Berklee College of Music) and began by posting cover songs on TikTok from their dorm stairwell, quickly gaining a following and praise from artists like Elton John.
• Breakout Moments: Their viral harmonies led to features on NPR’s Tiny Desk and collaborations with artists like Lizzy McAlpine and Kacey Musgraves.
  (01:16–02:46)

2. Performance: “Mudroom”

• Song & Symbolism: "Mudroom" uses the metaphor of a domestic transitional space to express the hesitation and hope of entering a new relationship after past hurt.
  (02:46–06:21) Performance
• Songwriting Process:
  • Cinya Khan: Explains the personal significance of the mudroom as a metaphor for emotional liminality.

    “I sort of, like, felt like there was a tie to the experience of entering a new relationship after maybe a bad one... and the hesitance that comes with entering something new. And so that's the space you're in right before you enter is the mudroom.” (06:49)

  • Judah Mayowa: Reflects on how the group supports the songwriter.

    “It feels like we’re... holding her hand and her experience with this song.” (08:08)

  • Maya Rae: Adds that their close friendship enriches the creative process, making collaborative arrangement special and authentic.

    “We’re all such feelers, and we’re all so sensitive...we always arrange our harmonies together, and that always feels really special.” (08:46–09:25)

3. Creative Group Dynamics

• Harmony Decisions:
  • Group describes their collaborative approach, choosing who solos based on what feels right for the song—no egos, just serving the music (“Pretty organically... we prioritize what is, like, just best for the song overall.” – Judah, 09:34).
• Lyrical Alignment:
  • Sometimes lyrical meaning matches the personality or experience of the singer, making solo choices more intuitive (“Our personalities sort of match up with the lyrics, and it’s like, this makes sense for you to sing.” – Cinya, 09:52).

4. Performance: “I Don’t Have The Heart”

(10:59–14:17) Performance

• Songwriting Origin:
  • Maya Rae: Shares that the chorus emerged from Cinya’s voice memo recorded while in the shower, highlighting the spontaneous, organic nature of their writing.

    “Cinya actually got the chorus idea when she was in the shower, which is like a super funny story.” (14:28)

  • Cinya Khan: “You can, like, hear the shower in the background.” (14:36)
• Musical Evolution:
  • This song marks a stylistic shift for Tiny Habits, being more upbeat and pop-leaning than their usual gentle, acoustic material – broadening their comfort zone as artists.

    “The produced track is, like, super upbeat and, like, more of a pop thing than we’re used to doing, but I think that was a really cool thing for us.” – Maya (15:17)

5. Live Performance & Audience Connection

• Onstage Fun: The band notes that performing upbeat numbers live brings a new dimension to their shows, allowing them and their audience to unwind and celebrate together.

  “To just party with people, like, that's so much fun.” – Cinya (16:29)
  “We have a good time.” – Maya (16:49)

• Instrumentation Choices:
  • Growing venues and evolving music call for expanded instrumentation beyond acoustic guitar and voices for fuller, richer soundscapes in live shows (17:05–17:28).

6. Navigating the Music Industry

• Support System:
  • Judah and Cinya reflect on the importance of mutual support within the trio amid the challenges of touring and creating in an increasingly competitive, digital music landscape.

    “I don’t think I could be able to do this without them. Touring, making music—all of that has been so easy having two people that are experiencing the exact same thing.” – Judah (17:46) “We are so vocal about our gratitude to each other. I think that’s what keeps us so close.” – Cinya (18:19)

• Handling Challenges:
  • The group emphasizes open communication and each person’s unique contributions as the foundation for weathering difficulties together.

    “We could not do this without one person...everyone’s essential that makes Tiny Habits what it is.” – Judah (18:44) “We’ve also...become, like, really good communicators with each other.” – Cinya (19:08)

7. Performance: “Tiny Things”

(19:53–22:21) Performance

• Song Theme: Cherishing everyday acts of love, the comfort and beauty found in domestic spaces, and valuing “all the loves in tiny things.”
• Memorable Moment: The group adds a subtle sound at the end (“doing dishes”), playfully underlining the song’s embrace of ordinary, joyful moments.

  "I love that little addition at the end of the song of doing dishes. It's a nice little pop right at the end." – Koosha (22:21)

8. Impact of Berklee College of Music

• Artistic Identity:
  • Judah discusses the challenge and importance of finding one’s individual artistic voice in a competitive environment, an experience both humbling and clarifying.

    “How to find individuality amongst so many talented people...I was able to kind of be like, okay, what does Judah have that is, like, good for Judah and, like, nobody else has, and still being able to be confident in that.” (22:46)

• Synergy as Tiny Habits:
  • Cinya reflects on how coming together as a band helped her understand her distinctiveness as an artist, with their collaborative harmony and blend defining the unique “Tiny Habits” sound.

    “Before Tiny Habits, I didn’t know what was different about me until I really met these two... we’ve created something so specifically Tiny Habits, which is, like, the crunch and, like, the blend of our voices.” (24:16)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Emotional Vulnerability:

  “It’s just nice to have a little part in, you know, our best friend’s experience with love...we tell each other everything, talk about everything. So, yeah, it’s kind of nice to translate that into music.”
  — Judah Mayowa (08:08)

• On Harmony and Friendship:

  “Our close friendship makes the creative process special. Because we’re such good friends, we feel it even more.”
  — Maya Rae (08:46)

• On Group Identity:

  “All of us have our own...everyone’s essential that we bring, that makes tiny habits what it is.”
  — Judah Mayowa (18:44)

• On Authenticity:

  “What does Judah have that...is good for Judah and, like, nobody else has?”
  — Judah Mayowa (22:46)

• On Band Synergy:

  “We’ve created something so specifically Tiny Habits, which is the crunch and, like, the blend of our voices.”
  — Cinya Khan (24:16)

• Memorable Endings:

  “I love that little addition at the end of the song of doing dishes. It’s a nice little pop right at the end.”
  — Koosha Navadar (22:21)

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• [01:16]–[02:46]: Introduction to Tiny Habits and their rise
• [02:46]–[06:21]: Live performance of “Mudroom”
• [06:21]–[10:59]: Deep dive into writing “Mudroom” and group creative dynamics
• [10:59]–[14:17]: Live performance of “I Don’t Have The Heart”
• [14:17]–[17:28]: Song origin stories, evolving sound, and live show experiences
• [17:28]–[19:46]: Navigating the industry, supporting each other, communication
• [19:53]–[22:21]: Live performance of “Tiny Things”
• [22:21]–[24:52]: Reflecting on Berklee’s impact, authenticity, and the unique Tiny Habits blend

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Conclusion

This episode offers an intimate, joyful, and insightful portrait of Tiny Habits—a band defined by their close friendship, vulnerability, and harmony both literally and metaphorically. Their live performances interweave with thoughtful conversation, revealing how their experiences, personalities, and synergy fuel their art. Listeners come away with a sense of warmth and inspiration, understanding both the craft and heart behind Tiny Habits’ music.

Transcript

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[Koosha Navadar]

This is all of it on wnyc. I'm Koosha Navadar. Exactly a month ago, the acoustic folk trio Tiny Habits dropped their debut album titled all for Something. Recognized for their buttery and soothing vocal vocal harmonies, the trio met in college just two years ago and started posting covers of popular songs from the stairwell in their dorm. The group's smooth arrangements wooed viewers on TikTok and even grabbed the attention of musical legends like Elton John, who described their warm harmonies as delicious. The Guardian named them one to watch and said the group's transcendent soul bearing harmonies have dominated their sound ever since, with twinkling finger picked guitar and piano chords and lyrics that explore the fragility of being human. And I get why. Since posting covers in a dorm room, Tiny habits appeared on NPR's Tiny Desk singing backup vocals for singer songwriter Lizzie McAlpine and performed with country music icon Casey Musgraves. Members Cynthia Khan, Maya Rae and Judah Mayowa joined us for a live performance in Studio 5amonth before the album's release and Maya's graduation. From the Berklee College of Music, let's take a listen to their song Mudroom. Here it is.

[McDonald's Employee]

You're a porch swing at a sunrise in a backyard under blue skies with my boots wet in the mud room I'm not sure yet if I'm alright if I'm ready to go inside we're the last one we're the ship breath when you drown once it's scary to swim again But I see the warmth inside you Kitchen towels, Christmas lights, what I need I think that scares me so I'm waiting in the mud room oh, oh There are people that I don't want to end up like but we're all sequels to our parents lives. Does hesitation do a good thing? May the wounds need more healing. O God, I see the warmth inside you Finish sheets Story time Wanted me to leave you I need a man in the mud room I can see the warmth inside Copy keys. Sweeter rivals Grab my co Take off my shoes Go inside leave them as room.

[Interviewer]

We're here live in Studio 5 with the acoustic folk trio Tiny Habits. There's Sinya Khan, Maya Re, and Judah Mayowa. That line that you had the invitation to something good. Just got to point out the harmony on that was so smooth and beautiful. I want to get into the song of it a little bit. Cinya, you wrote this, right?

[Maya Rae]

Yeah, I did.

[Interviewer]

The mudroom is a real, like, kind of liminal space between the inside outside of the house. And you're talking about love here. Break that down. Where did it come from?

[Cinya Khan]

Well, I don't know. I had this. This idea of a mudroom. I grew up in New Jersey, right across the pond, which is, like, why we have mudrooms, I guess, because I know a lot of people in, like, California don't have them. But it's basically before you enter the house where you, like, take your shoes off, take your coat off. And so I sort of, like, felt like there was a tie to the experience of entering a new relationship after maybe a bad one, or like just entering any new experience after something that maybe didn't end so well, and, like, the hesitance that comes with entering something new. And so that's the space you're in right before you enter is the mudroom.

[Interviewer]

That's what it is. And you wrote it. Judah, Maya, how did you contribute to this song? Judah, let's start with you.

[McDonald's Employee]

Well.

[Judah Mayowa]

I have very small contribution, but when she first sent us the song, first of all, I was like, whoa, that's insane. The songwriting is insane. But then we just kind of added some harmonies to it to kind of habify it, I guess, as we like to say. And then it kind of just came together, and it feels like, at least in my brain, it feels like we're.

[McDonald's Employee]

Like.

[Judah Mayowa]

Holding her hand and her experience with this song.

[Cinya Khan]

That's so sweet.

[Judah Mayowa]

And like, I don't know, it's just nice to just have a little part in, you know, our. Our best friend's experience with love and, you know. Yeah, we tell each other everything and, like, Talk about everything. So, yeah, you know, it's kind of nice to translate that into music.

[Interviewer]

Happify is such a wonderful verb that I think you just coined for all of our listeners across the Maya. Would you say that's how the creative process normally works? It sounds like there's this real intersection or, I guess, convergence between what you share musically and also what you share as, to borrow Judah's term, best friends. What do you think about that?

[Maya Rae]

Always? Yeah. I mean, it's always how it goes. Like, you know, one of us writes a song, and that's one person's experience, but I think we're all such feelers, and we're all so sensitive, and so although that's maybe one person's experience, we still can, you know. Yeah. Empathize with them so much, and I think because we're such good friends, we feel it even more. And, yeah, I think in terms of how we all contribute, I think it's in a variety of ways, but I think we always arrange, like, our harmonies together, and that always feels really special because that's kind of each of our contributions to a song that someone wrote or. Yeah, it's always. It's always an amazing process.

[Interviewer]

How do you decide who gets to solo in a specific section? Is it a free for all, or are there folks that are like, all right, it's my turn. Up next. Just put your hand into a hat.

[Cinya Khan]

Yeah, Pretty organically.

[Judah Mayowa]

It kind of just. I feel like we try to prioritize what is, like, just best for the song overall. Like, whose voice fits, like, a specific part? Like, there's no, like, ego sort of situation. Like, it. We're always gonna do what feels best for the music.

[Cinya Khan]

So I also feel like sometimes lyrically, like, our personalities sort of match up with the lyrics, and it's like, this makes sense for you to sing.

[Interviewer]

Can you give me an example of that in Mudroom? Does that play in at all?

[Cinya Khan]

Yeah, I don't know. I guess maybe I, like, close the song with the. The lyrics.

[Judah Mayowa]

What are they in the mud room?

[Cinya Khan]

Grab my coat and take off my shoes and leave the mud room or whatever, which.

[Judah Mayowa]

It feels like it's kind of like you.

[Cinya Khan]

Yeah.

[Judah Mayowa]

Yeah. Accepting them.

[Cinya Khan]

My friends got to help me tell the story, and then I'm like, thank you. I'm, like, launched into the new experience, if that makes sense.

[Interviewer]

Well, that launch into the new experience is a perfect phrase, because I would love to launch into the experience of a new song.

[Judah Mayowa]

Sorry to play.

[Interviewer]

Judah, can you intro it for us?

[Judah Mayowa]

What are you Gonna to say this next song. Is that what I'm doing? This next song we just released called I don't have the Heart.

[McDonald's Employee]

Yeah.

[Maya Rae]

All right.

[Cinya Khan]

It's a little early, so go some grace.

[Maya Rae]

Okay.

[McDonald's Employee]

We spoke for hours in that back room. I've never said that many words in my life. It was a catch up attached to the people we used to be like you keep a lot of me with you hanging onto the flowers when the petals go dry but you've been staring at the rear view and missing all the green lights the answer is not in me do not dance around the truth I know just what you're thinking but I can't give that to you I don't have heart I don't have the stomach the energy to dice you off to get you up and running I don't have the heart to tell you I'm not going when you're tugging all the parts of me that you're still good at knowing I don't have the ways to make ends meet their actual ending I always extend them in with the way you look at me I'm scared it's gonna happen again I keep a lot of you with me Hanging onto your humor and regretting your sins why does this feel like the upbeat waiting to fall into a groove? The answer is not in you that is something that I'm sure and you must stay a place that I don't frequent anymore I don't have a heart I don't have a stomach the energy to dust you off to get you up and running I don't have the heart to tell you I'm not going when you're twisting all the parts of me that you're still good at knowing Wake the heck up. Here you are towing the light again and weasel in your way back and I'm stuck between you and a wall looking for the door I don't have the heart I don't have the stomach the energy that dashed you off to get you up and running I don't have the heart to tell you I'm not going you tested all the parts of me but you're still good at knowing I don't have the I don't have the heart.

[Interviewer]

We're talking to the acoustic folk trio Tiny Habits. I just saw you guys releasing that last piece into there. Maya, tell us a little bit about what the song is, what the process was to write it.

[Maya Rae]

Yeah, this one was fun. Cindy actually got the chorus idea when she was in the shower, which is like a super funny story.

[Cinya Khan]

To tell a voice memo, and you can, like, hear the shower in the background.

[Interviewer]

You had the phone in the shower?

[Cinya Khan]

No, it was, like, like, on the counter.

[Interviewer]

Hell.

[Cinya Khan]

Oh, got it.

[Interviewer]

Eureka.

[Judah Mayowa]

Sorry.

[Interviewer]

Go ahead.

[Maya Rae]

No, it was just funny. And I think this song we feel like, was kind of. Which we talked about, and we kind of feel like it was sort of the missing piece of, like, a bigger thing. And. And so, yeah, when these two brought the song to me and they played it for me first time, I was like, yeah. Like, this feels like something is complete. And it's just. We're not used to, like, writing. I feel like most of our music is, like, very.

[Cinya Khan]

Gentle.

[Maya Rae]

Yeah, gentle. Like, maybe more. Not that this one isn't, like, so emotional, but, like, I think. I mean, the produced track is, like, super upbeat and, like, more of a pop thing than we're used to doing, but I think that was a really cool thing for us because it was, like, super out of our comfort zone.

[Judah Mayowa]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

What part of it was out of your comfort zone?

[Judah Mayowa]

Just the. The pace of it. Like, the tempo. It was very fast. We're very used to, like, just slow. Like, also, it's like, the production is not. It's a little more aggressive, a little more, like, in your face.

[Maya Rae]

No, but I was gonna say, I think it's kind of interesting, though, because I think, like, it's funny because a lot of the music we make is, like, super gentle and, like, calm and, like, pretty harmonies. But, like, it's funny because we're, like. I mean, I think we're pretty. Like. I don't want to say we're, like, hilarious people. That's like. But, like, our friendship is super. Like, we have a lot of fun together, and I feel like this song reflects that. Like, it's super fun. It's super upbeat. Like, you just want to dance.

[Interviewer]

That is interesting because you're touring now and there's live audiences you're engaging with. Does that sense of fun come out? Is that a key piece of what you are as performers that are live? Talk about that a little bit.

[McDonald's Employee]

Yeah, I don't know.

[Cinya Khan]

I feel like the. Specifically, the upbeat songs have been the thing that, like, really make the show, like, really fun because, like, seeing people sing and, like, jump and dance is, like, that's so cool. Obviously, like, when we were singing the quieter songs, it's so beautiful to see people really intently listening, but, like, to just party with people, like, that's so much fun.

[Maya Rae]

We have. We have a good time.

[Cinya Khan]

It's great.

[Interviewer]

And, you know, your main Instrument is your voice, and you're mainly an acoustic group. But when do you decide how to add maybe percussive instruments or bass guitar to your performances? What's the gap that you always think of, like, I need to fill this in with an instrument.

[Maya Rae]

I mean, I think for this, we've been so used to up until this point, like, just playing the three of us.

[Judah Mayowa]

Yeah. And a guitar.

[Maya Rae]

Yeah. Which has been super awesome. But I think for this specific tour, we're playing, like, a little bit bigger venues than we've had before. And I think we just felt like a lot of this new music that we have and that we've been releasing, like, really requires that extra deserves, like. Yeah.

[Cinya Khan]

To fill it out.

[Judah Mayowa]

Yeah, totally.

[Interviewer]

And you're thinking about new music. You're all young artists, and making music or career has never been easy. But it seems a lot more challenging these days with streaming, social media, intense competition. How are you all navigating the current landscape? Judah, let's start with you.

[Judah Mayowa]

Just each other. Honestly, I don't think at least now in current, like, mental, like, state, I don't think I could be able to do this without them. I feel like touring, like, making music, all of that has been so easy. Having two people that are experiencing the exact same thing that you're experiencing at the same time as you, and, like, it's just. It's just really nice. Yeah.

[Interviewer]

How does it feel to hear your partner, one of your partners say that?

[Cinya Khan]

Cna we say this every day. We are so vocal about our gratitude to each other, I think, which is what keeps us so close, I think.

[Judah Mayowa]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Well, what do you need to remind yourself when things get challenging? What is it about your relationship that you think makes it operate? Because there are a lot of challenges, and you don't always know when they're gonna come or how they're gonna happen. So what is it about the relationship that you feel like can really weather those storms?

[Judah Mayowa]

I would say that at least in regards to us, like, all of us, none of us would be, like, we could not do this without one person. You know what I mean? Like, all of us have our own. Everyone's essential that we bring. That makes tiny habits what it is. And it would not be. It wouldn't be as fun. It wouldn't be as.

[Cinya Khan]

You know, we've also, since we've spent so much time together, have become, like, really good communicators with each other. And I think we're all really good at expressing ourselves and our feelings to the other two members, which I think is something that helps us weather the storm.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. And Maya, it's your last month of school right now, right? Yeah. Congratulations. How are you feeling about it?

[Maya Rae]

Oh, man, I'm so excited to graduate. Yeah, I'm ready. I'm ready.

[Judah Mayowa]

She's ready to go.

[Maya Rae]

Yeah, it feels good.

[Interviewer]

Well, speaking of ready to go, I'm full of these segues today. You got one more song for us, right? We do, yeah. Maya, why don't you introduce this to us? And tell us what.

[Maya Rae]

Yeah. This song is the title track of our first project. It's called Tiny Things.

[McDonald's Employee]

All right, here we go. Standing in the kitchen, gottin all the tiles on the floor. Some of them are hidden underneath the rug by the door. Thinking any minute I could hear the sound of the clock. You can grab the linens, we can make the bed all nice and watch a movie in end. Talk about your day all night. Just a proposition, but I think it sounds pretty good to me. How about that? You and me. Lots of love and tiny things. All we have is all I need. All the loves and tiny scratches in the sofa. All the pretty words in your mouth that you call me over just to show me something. Something you found hiding in the attic underneath the box. I forgot about all of this. You and me. Lots of love and tiny things. All we have is all I need. All the loves I'm. Tiny things have gone wrong in the past. And I see looking back but I took for granted. I know that I want this to last so I take a step back and I look at patterns. Love is a verb. It's inaction. It's not a film reenactment. I don't need the moon or mansion. I'm happy to be standing, standing in your kitchen Counting all the tiles on the floor while you do the dishes.

[Interviewer]

We're with the acoustic folk trio Tiny Habits. I love that little addition at the end of the song of doing dishes. It's a nice little pop right at the end. Before you think the song's gonna be over, I wanna talk about where you all went to school. Berklee College of Music, right? Yeah. We mentioned Maya, you're graduating next month. Judah, I'd love to know from you what has going to Berkeley. How has that helped shape your voice as an artist? What is something vital you've learned from your experience?

[Judah Mayowa]

That is a great question. I think I'd say maybe the one thing I've learned is how to find individuality amongst so many talented people. It's so easy to compare yourself to Other people at a school where everybody is doing the same thing, wanting the same thing. And I feel like with the one year I was there. Cause I dropped out, I was able to kind of be like, okay, what does Judah have that. That is, like, good for Judah and, like, nobody else has, like, and still being able to, like, be confident in that and, like, you know, still trying to, like, navigate through artistry and stuff with, like, trying to know who I am while also constantly being compared to other people that are also just as talented, if not more talented than you, you know? So I guess that's. I guess that's the one thing I would say.

[Interviewer]

Well, that idea of. I mean, I see my insignia. Listeners just nodding their heads and going. That seems like that really lands. That idea of authenticity, but also finding what separates you, what makes you unique. So let's broaden that out from Judah, Sinha, and Maya to Tiny Habits. What does Tiny Habits have that no one else has? How would you describe the sound, the separation? Kind of a tough question, but one that I think a lot of listeners would be able to answer for you. So what would you say?

[Cinya Khan]

Well, yeah, I feel like I don't know. Before Tiny Habits, I felt like as a solo artist, I obviously had my own voice, but I didn't know really what was different about me until I really met these two other people. And I felt like we together because we come from such different places and we have such different musical experience, we've created something so specifically Tiny Habits, which is, like, the crunch and, like, the blend of our voices, which is.

[Maya Rae]

I don't know.

[Cinya Khan]

I feel like it's really special. And that's the end of my sentence.

[Koosha Navadar]

That was my conversation with the members of the acoustic folk trio Tiny Habits, Sinha Khan, Maya Rae, and Judah Mayowa about their new album, all for Something. That's our show today. Thanks for hanging out. We'll see you here tomorrow. Take care. Until then.

[Radio Host]

I'mma put you on, nephew.

[McDonald's Employee]

All right, unc. Welcome to McDonald's. Can I take your order, miss?

[Radio Host]

I've been hitting up McDonald's for years. Now it's back. We need snack wraps. What's a snack wrap? It's the return of something great. Snack wrap is back.

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