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Rob Sheffield
Foreign.
Alison Stewart
This is all of it on wnyc. I'm Alison Stewart. The Beatles still can find their way onto the charts. Last month, Anthology 4 by the Beatles appeared on the Billboard charts. The album is an addition to the recent re release of the original Anthology project. Anthology was a documentary series and album from the mid-90s, featuring then contemporary interviews with George, Paul and Ringo, and accompanied by a triple album full of studio outtakes, unreleased tracks and live recordings. Anthology reinvigorated Beatlemania for a new generation. And in this new re release, another episode has been added to the documentary and a new album of studio gems with an updated mix. Let's listen to an example. This is if I Fell with a bit of studio intro from John.
Callers
Yeah, we're on. We're on the air, folks.
Alison Stewart
Come on.
Rob Sheffield
If I fell in love with you what? If I fell in love with you Would you promise to be true and help me understand? Cause I've been in love before and I found that love was more than just holding hand.
Alison Stewart
Give my heart to you.
I must be sure from the.
Rob Sheffield
Very.
Start that you.
Would love me.
Alison Stewart
More than her.
Contributing editor Rob Sheffield reviewed the album and film for Rolling Stone, calling it a superb new collection. He's here now to walk us through Anthology. Hey, Rob, long time.
Rob Sheffield
Hello, Alison, how are you?
Alison Stewart
I'm doing well. So let's thinking, let's go back to the 90s, get in the time machine. What was the purpose of the Anthology project and how did it come together?
Rob Sheffield
Well, the Anthology documentary was something that had been languishing for a couple of decades. It started in 1970 when the Beatles friend and retainer and Rhodey and all around confidant Neil Aspinall started that documentary and pulled it together. But the four ex Beatles were in no mood at all to work on a collaborative project about their past. They'd just broken up and they were sick to death of each other. So it sat on the shelf for a couple decades until Paul, George and ringo, the surviving three Beatles, went back to it in the mid-90s, early 90s, and decided to tell the story their way.
Alison Stewart
There've been so many books about the Beatles, films about the Beatles, documentaries about the Beatles, but none from the band itself. What did the band want to correct or put out there from, from their perspective?
Rob Sheffield
Well, as they put it, this was their perspective. As Ringo said, you've heard the story from everybody, so why not hear it from us? And the essential thing about Anthology is it's three very different perspectives that the Beatles are three very different People who have this shared history, and it's really the story of their friendship, the story of how they began in Liverpool, the story of their loss of John Lennon, and how that friendship survived in its tattered and battered forms through the years.
Alison Stewart
Listeners, as we discuss Anthology, we want your opinion on this hotly contested topic for what we call small stakes, big opinions. What's your favorite Beatles album and why? Our number is 2124-3396-9221-2433, WNYC. Or even if that's your favorite, what is the Beatles best Beatles album and why? 212-433-969-2212, wnyc. If you've listened to or listen or watch the Anthology Project, tell us your thoughts as well. 212-433-9692. My guest is Rolling Stone contributing editor Rob Sheffield. So you wrote Anthology finally rescued the Beatles from the 60s. How so?
Rob Sheffield
Well, so much of the Beatles story had been told over the years in this really nostalgic sort of this was something that magical that happened in the good old days sort of perspective, and that reflected a lot of the experience of people who are Beatles fans in the 70s. But by the 90s, there was a whole new generation of Beatles fans who just did not remember the 60s and couldn't relate to that sense of nostalgia. For me and my sisters, we grew up in the 70s, and to us, the Beatles were not a band that broke up and was part of the past. It was part of pop music here and now, as the Beatles have always been. They have never faded into the past. And Anthology recognized the Beatles as an ongoing thing that the world was. Was still madly in love with. And it really sort of broke that nostalgic way of looking at the Beatles. And it captured the Beatles as something unique that keeps happening and that we keep experiencing as culture goes on.
Alison Stewart
Yeah. How did it attract a new generation when it first came out?
Rob Sheffield
Well, it was really strange at that time to see all three Beatles in the same room. As we all know, it was very difficult when the Beatles broke up. As we saw in the excellent Get Back documentary, there was a lot of tension at the end of the Beatles. And after they broke up late 1969, the four Beatles were never in the same room again. And John Lennon was killed in 1980. And so there was no chance of ever of them having a creative reunion or a personal reunion. And the Beatles who were in Anthology were still creative artists who, for the most part were still making new music and still in their careers and had gone their separate ways as adults, but still had that history in common. And so it was so immensely moving to see them look back on their memories together, to see them sitting on the grass. My favorite scenes are at George's estate where they're sitting on the lawn and they're strumming guitars and singing songs that they remember from the old days, songs that they grew up singing, songs they wrote together. And for a few moments, they're just friends sitting on the grass in the sunshine.
Alison Stewart
Let's talk to the listeners. This text says it has to be the White Album, a perfect work of art, the that also chronicles a band falling apart. Let's talk to Mike in Paramus, New Jersey. Hi, Mike, thanks for making the time to call all of it.
Callers
Hi, Alison, first time caller, longtime listener.
Alison Stewart
All right.
Callers
So my favorite Beatle album by far is Rubber Soul. I think Rubber Soul was the beginning of what I call the second Beetle awakening and creativity, which opened the door obviously to Revolver and then the third awakening, sergeant Pepper. But by far, I think Rubber Soul opened up the floodgates.
By far.
Alison Stewart
Thanks for calling in. Call again. Paul is calling us from Ridgewood, New Jersey. Hi, Paul, you're on the air.
Callers
Good afternoon. How are you?
Alison Stewart
I'm doing well.
Callers
So I'm 73 and a huge Beatles fan, as are my grandsons, which is absolutely amazing. I worked in an Alexander's department store in the camera department, I guess it would be around 1960s. And we had an eight track tape of Abbey Road that we played constantly. It was in the wrong order from the album to fit, you know, in the four stereo tracks on the tape. And I never, ever got tired of it. And it is one of my Desert island discs, so I'll put that out there. But that medley on side two, there's nothing close to it. And what the Beatles have done and they've done some amazing stuff, but that is Abbey Road.
Alison Stewart
Oh, my God. Hey, that you worked in Alexander's. That's incredible. Robin asked you to put this into perspective for us because we had two Beatles fans on the air. How big a deal is this release, this new full album of Beatles takes for fans right now?
Rob Sheffield
Well, it's really a treasure trove if you're a fan. It's so exciting to hear them work together, to hear them so playful. I love that version of if I Fell that you played before where you can hear they're just goofing around, they're playing and then suddenly they lock into the song and it's so emotional and strange. Such a beautiful and weird song. And you can just hear that they go from being playful boys to just totally locking in on the story they're telling.
Alison Stewart
There's an extra new documentary episode added to this anthology release. What will viewers see in this episode?
Rob Sheffield
It's so moving. It focuses on the early 90s when the Beatles were starting to make Anthology. And so after having told the whole story together of the Beatles from the beginning to the band's breakup, we see them in the 90s when they're just sort of getting used to each other's company, getting used to sharing these memories together. And you can see the tensions that they have, but you can also see the love and camaraderie that they have. It's really moving to watch with lots of previously unseen footage.
Alison Stewart
Let's take another call. Danielle on the Upper west side. Hi, Danielle. Thanks for calling all of it. It's a small stakes, big opinions. What's your favorite record?
Callers
Hi. Okay, Rubber Soul was my choice and I wanted to mention that tomorrow night there's the John Lennon tribute concert at the Town Hall. There are tickets still available. It's held every year.
Memorializing him. There's great people who perform at it and people should come on out because I know there is tickets and they reduce the price and everything thing. It's a great, great show.
Alison Stewart
Yeah. Thank you for remembering him as well. This is that time of year when everyone remembers John. This text says, my first Beatles record was Rubber Soul, which is great. Everyone talks about sergeant Peppers, but I really liked Revolver the best. That's where the experimentation really took off with Tomorrow Never Knows. This one says Revolver, my top album because every single track is a side a hit that is penny for from Westchester. My guest is Rolling Stone contributing editor Rob Sheffield. We're discussing the newly expanded Beatles Anthology collection which Rob reviewed. We also want to hear from you in our Small Stakes Big Opinion series. What's your favorite Beatles album and why? The number is 2124-3396-9221-2433. WNYC. So, Rob, in the year 2025, what new details can still be learned about the Beatles from listening to this new anthology and watching the documentary?
Rob Sheffield
Well, it's the story of a friendship that's gone on for, at this point, 60 years. And Paul and Ringo are still alive, but they still have their memories of the other two. And it's really beautiful to see that bond. Paul was on tour this fall and he was beginning his show with the song Help, which was A Beatles song that he hadn't sung since. Since he was in the Beatles. And it's really moving to see Paul in his 80s going back to a song that his best friend wrote when they were both in their early 20s and still trying to figure this friend out and still trying to make sense of this friendship. It's just a really unique and beautiful lifelong thing. And it really comes alive in Anthology.
Alison Stewart
This is an amazing text. My mother smuggled a Beatles wide album from West Germany to the Soviet Czech Republic in the 1970s. It's her favorite album to this day. That is a great text.
Rob Sheffield
I love that.
Alison Stewart
We'll have more after a quick break. This is all of It.
You are listening to all of it on wnyc. I'm Alison Stewart. My guest is Rolling Stone contributing editor Rob Sheffield. We're discussing the newly expanded Beatles Anthology collection which Rob reviewed. We also want to hear from you. It's our Small Stakes Big Opinion series. What is your favorite Beatles album and why? The number is 2124-3396-9221-2433. WNYC. So, Rob, in your review of the Anthology 4 album, you write, if you love the Beatles, you definitely want to hear this new Baby youy're a Rich Man Now. We're gonna listen to it in just a minute. But why did this song catch your ear?
Rob Sheffield
It's so funny. I just love that. It's 1967. The Beatles are absolutely on top of the world. And you hear them in the studio and John and Paul are just making jokes just to crack each other up. They're just two friends. No matter how much the world idolizes them, there's still two friends who grew up together and just love just making the stupidest jokes together. So John calls out to the roadie Mal and asks them to to bring them some soda pop and refreshments. And Paul says, yeah, and if you've got some cannabis. John says, yes, please. If you got some cannab cannabis, bring it on in. And that they're just, just two boys laughing together. And that's what it always comes down to. It's beautiful.
Alison Stewart
Let's take a listen.
Rob Sheffield
All right, let's hear some Rhythm and.
Callers
Soul from London now. Please come.
Alison Stewart
How does it feel to be one.
Rob Sheffield
Of the beautiful people.
Alison Stewart
Now that you.
Rob Sheffield
Know who you are.
What do you want to be?
And have you traveled very far?
Alison Stewart
Far as the eye can see?
Rob Sheffield
How does it feel to be one of the beautiful people.
There.
Alison Stewart
Often enough to know.
Rob Sheffield
What did you see when you were there?
Alison Stewart
Nothing but doesn't show.
Callers
Baby, you're a rich man. Baby, you're a rich man.
Rob Sheffield
Baby, you're a rich man, too?
You keep all your money in a big brown bag inside a zoo. What a thing to do.
Callers
Baby, you're a rich man, baby.
Alison Stewart
Let's go to John, who's calling in from Montgomery. Hey, John, thanks for calling, all of it.
Callers
Hi.
Alison Stewart
Hi.
Callers
Good to talk to you.
Alison Stewart
Sure.
Callers
Well, I'll tell you a little bit of my story. I graduated from high school in 62, and that was still in the end of the doo wop era. And then there was the Beach Boys, and then all of a sudden, the Beatles burst onto the scene. And I bought my first album. I'm not even sure if it was Meet the Beatles, but I still have it, along with every other album on vinyl.
Each album broke the mold from the kind of music that preceded it. So I just can't come up with a favorite because each one was so magical, brilliant. And I really. I still believe they were geniuses. And, you know, I was very slow to try out cannabis, by the way, but it's all their fault.
Alison Stewart
John, thanks for the call. Let's talk to Mike, who's calling in from Brooklyn. Hey, Mike, thanks for calling, all of it.
Callers
Hey, how are you? Easily, easily. My favorite Beatles album is the White Album. It's because it seems as if they sort of, like, broke through, because I think they went to India to get that album together. And especially the White Album, because of John Lennon's song, when he sings about his mother, his mother who died, Julia.
That's the reason why, for me, the White Album is easily the best album the Beatles ever made. That and the continuing thing of Bungalow, Bill, you know. Hey, Bungalow. I like that, too.
Alison Stewart
Thanks for calling in. Did you want to respond, Rob?
Rob Sheffield
Oh, wow. He is so 100% right about Julia. That is one of the absolute most beautiful moments of John Lennon's career or anything any of the Beatles did. What a song.
Alison Stewart
Let's talk to Sally, who is calling from the Upper west side. Hi, Sally. Thanks for calling all of it.
Callers
Well, I'm one of your older listeners. I'm in my 80s and my. I have a much younger brother who had come up to New York, and we felt he was too young to go to concerts by himself. So I went to a lot of rock concerts, and I could not understand why in the world he thought this was good music. But Sergeant Pepper made me a fan. I think a lot of us from the classical tradition suddenly realized that these were great Musicians and I still listened to it over and over. And now that I've heard this program, I'm going to hear some of these other recommend cause my brother has all of them and he'll send me copies. But sergeant Pepper, Lucy in the sky with Diamonds is just perfect along with many of the others.
Alison Stewart
Thanks so much for giving us a call, Sally. So Rob Giles Martin is one of the brains behind the Beatles re releases. He's the son of the original Beatles producer, George Martin, and he improved sort of the quality of the recordings and he used what is called a demixing technology. What does it mean to demix a song? How does that work?
Rob Sheffield
Well, it was devised by Peter Jackson and his Wingnut Films team for the get back anthology in 2021. And the Get Back Anthology was such a revelation because those were such muddy recordings and it involves going and isolating the individual elements of the sound. So there was this famous conversation that nobody could hear that John and Paul had in a coffee shop because there was too much noise around it. And they were able to isolate all the different elements in the sound. So they were able to go and find John and Paul's voices with a microphone hidden in a flower pot on the table in the cafeteria. So it was really amazing the world could hear this conversation for the first time. And Giles does that with the audio in the new Anthology. So in the live recordings of the Beatles, which were drowned out by screams at the time he went in and demixed the sound so that we can now hear all the individual instruments and voices in a performance like the Beatles at Shea Stadium. So we're really hearing that clearly for the first time ever.
Alison Stewart
In your review you wrote that you like this is so funny. You write that George is, quote, a master of bitchy one liners.
So tell us a little bit about snarky George.
Rob Sheffield
Oh, I love snarky George. He is so funny and so mean. There's the great scene in Get Back where Paul has brought in the new song I've Got a Feeling. And he's playing it and John is singing along I've got a feeling. And it beats the chorus I've Got a Feeling. And you just hear George say so is this one called I've Got a Feeling. There's a lot of that in the new one. There's a great scene in the new episode nine, never seen before from the new Anthology episode where George and Ringo are making fun of Paul for always hustling them into the studio and making them work so hard. And George says, you'd run out of beauty competitions to judge. And Paul is really defensive. And it's really funny when he says, look, I liked being in the Beatles. I like making music with the Beatles. I'm not ashamed of that. And it's just funny how with their very different personalities, that they're able to have fun making fun of each other.
Alison Stewart
This is a funny text. It Sundays, in the 70s, I was the manager of a record store in Scottsdale, Arizona. I will never forget the day a quartet of young teen girls about 16 came in and were flipping through the albums. They got to the Beatles section and one of them pulled out one of the LPS and asked her friends with absolute incredulity. Incredulity. Paul McCartney was in a band before Wings.
Let's talk to Dale from Connecticut. Hey, Dale, thanks for calling, all of it.
Callers
Thank you. Thank you. I'm an older listener, like the. Like Sally. I'm in my late 70s and I heard the Beatles living in southern Spain as a teenager on Spanish albums, probably the first one that came out and immediately fell in love. But really for me, it's the way the music was mixed. And he was just speaking about this because so much of rock and roll, the voices became percussion with a tune. But with the Beatles, it was always the stories. And as they matured as writers, it just got better and better. So sergeant Pepper and Strawberry Fields, I'm tied between those two that were the writing and the stories and the emotions you hear like, like Bob Dylan, even when he went metal. I mean, when he went metal, you. You still heard him because the music was mixed properly so the voices were on top. And then much later, I worked as. I've been working as a bartender most of my life. And I worked at the famous old hotel of Bel Air. And I would leave George and Harry Nielsen sitting at the piano, the grand piano, baby grand in the middle of the bar, shut, locked the door. It was a hotel. And the. The off duty LAPD to Texas would keep an eye on him.
Alison Stewart
Wow. Wow. Thank you for calling. By the way, Michelle from Washington Heights. Let's get you in here. Michelle.
Callers
Hi, can you hear me?
Alison Stewart
Yeah, you're on the air.
Callers
Oh, great. Hi. So my name is Michelle, so obviously I have a connection to the song. My parents were huge Beatles fans and they named me after the song Michelle. And I believe. I don't know what age I was maybe one or two when they gave me the album as a gift. And, you know, I was young. I had it like as far back as I can remember. And when I was little I had a Mickey Mouse plastic record player and I played the Rubber Soul album constantly. And my favorite song as a child was Norwegian Wood, even though Michelle was on the album. And I now have a music student, 17 year old, she's a composer and she loves the Beatles. And so it's just going from generation to generation, which is amazing.
Alison Stewart
Thank you so much for calling in. Rob, I want to get one more question in for you. Anthology 4 debuted in the top 10 of five different Billboard charts. What do you think that says about the role of Beatles in contemporary music?
Rob Sheffield
It's amazing. The Beatles are always part of our lives, always part of our dream lives. It's wild that for so many years people thought that the Beatles would be forgotten, that they would fade away into the story of the past, and it just never happens. I love all the people telling stories about their children and students and grandchildren who are crazy about the Beatles. I have the same experience with my nieces and nephews. It's something that just isn't stuck in the past. It's not something that happened long ago. The Beatles just made something permanent that still touches our hearts.
Alison Stewart
My guest has been Rolling Stone contributing editor Rob Sheffield. Rob, thanks for joining us. We really appreciate you being a voice for the Beatles.
Rob Sheffield
Thank you so much.
Alison Stewart
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Podcast: All Of It (WNYC)
Host: Alison Stewart
Guest: Rob Sheffield (Rolling Stone contributing editor)
Date: December 11, 2025
This lively and heartfelt episode of All Of It dives into the ongoing legacy of The Beatles, spurred by the newly expanded release of the "Anthology" project and the debut of Anthology 4. Host Alison Stewart is joined by acclaimed music critic Rob Sheffield, and together with callers and listeners, the episode revels in Beatles memories, friendly debates about the best Beatles album, and new revelations brought by state-of-the-art remixing technologies. The episode embodies the spirit of "Small Stakes, Big Opinions" by sharing deeply personal stories and cross-generational connections to the band’s music.
Historical Context of Anthology
“The four ex-Beatles were in no mood at all to work on a collaborative project about their past ... So it sat on the shelf for a couple decades until Paul, George and Ringo ... decided to tell the story their way.” — Rob Sheffield (02:11)
Unique Beatles Perspective
“It’s three very different perspectives ... it’s really the story of their friendship ... how that friendship survived in its tattered and battered forms through the years.” — Rob Sheffield (03:01)
Impact on a New Generation
“For me and my sisters, we grew up in the 70s, and to us, The Beatles were not a band that broke up and was part of the past. It was pop music here and now ... Anthology recognized the Beatles as an ongoing thing.” — Rob Sheffield (04:19)
New Album and Findings
New Documentary Episode
“You can see the tensions that they have, but you can also see the love and camaraderie that they have. It’s really moving…” — Rob Sheffield (09:02)
"Baby You're a Rich Man Now" Spotlight
“No matter how much the world idolizes them, they’re still two friends who grew up together and just love making the stupidest jokes together ... just two boys laughing together.” — Rob Sheffield (12:56)
Demixing and Remastering
“They were able to go and find John and Paul’s voices with a microphone hidden in a flower pot ... Giles does that with the audio in the new Anthology ... we can now hear all the individual instruments and voices in a performance like the Beatles at Shea Stadium.” — Rob Sheffield (18:40)
Role of Snark and Friendship
“[George is] a master of bitchy one liners ... There’s a great scene in ... Anthology ... where George and Ringo are making fun of Paul for always hustling them into the studio... it’s just funny how with their very different personalities, that they’re able to have fun making fun of each other.” — Rob Sheffield (19:53, 19:56)
The episode’s unique heart emerges from callers telling their Beatles stories and defending their favorite albums:
White Album:
“That is one of the absolute most beautiful moments of John Lennon’s career ... What a song.” — Rob Sheffield (17:09)
Rubber Soul:
“Rubber Soul was the beginning of what I call the second Beetle awakening and creativity ... opened up the floodgates.” — Mike, caller (06:48)
Revolver:
Abbey Road:
Sgt. Pepper’s Lonely Hearts Club Band:
Cross-Generational Impact
“It’s something that just isn’t stuck in the past ... The Beatles just made something permanent that still touches our hearts.” — Rob Sheffield (23:55)
On the authenticity of Anthology:
“As Ringo said, ‘You’ve heard the story from everybody, so why not hear it from us?’” — Rob Sheffield (03:01)
On the new emotional resonance:
“For a few moments, they’re just friends sitting on the grass in the sunshine.” — Rob Sheffield (05:17)
On the continued presence of the Beatles:
“The Beatles are always part of our lives, always part of our dream lives ... The Beatles just made something permanent that still touches our hearts.” — Rob Sheffield (23:55)
On studio banter and friendship:
“They’re just, just two boys laughing together. And that’s what it always comes down to. It’s beautiful.” — Rob Sheffield (12:56)
On technology transforming how we hear the Beatles:
“So they were able to go and find John and Paul’s voices with a microphone hidden in a flower pot ... for the first time ever.” — Rob Sheffield (18:40)
The episode is warm, conversational, and steeped in nostalgia—balancing musical analysis with affectionate banter and deeply personal stories. Rob Sheffield’s commentary brings a heartfelt and pop-historian’s perspective, while Alison Stewart draws in diverse voices, making the episode a real-time snapshot of enduring Beatles fandom.
The episode proves that debate over the "best Beatles album" remains alive and fiercely personal, mirroring how the band's ever-evolving music continues to resonate across eras. Whether it’s the emotional candidness revealed in new archival tracks or the passing down of Beatles records through generations, the Fab Four’s cultural legacy—perpetually “happening now”—brings together listeners young and old in a shared, joyful argument.