The music of 'Sinners,' hyper-pop and more: The Contenders, Vol. 9

Summary

All Songs Considered: The Music of 'Sinners,' Hyper-Pop and More - The Contenders, Vol. 9

Released on April 29, 2025, NPR’s "All Songs Considered" hosts Robin Hilton and Stephen Thompson delve into the evolving landscape of music and its intersection with cinema, explore the intricate layers of hyper-pop, and celebrate their 25th anniversary by reflecting on influential tracks from 2010.

---

1. The Surge of Horror Movies and Their Musical Underpinnings

Robin Hilton opens the episode by addressing a timely question: the unexpected proliferation of horror movies outside the traditional Halloween season. She cites films like "Woman in the Yard", "Stepsister", and the intriguingly titled "Robin", a horror movie centered around an evil robot doll.

Robin Hilton: "Why are there so many horror movies out right now? Have you seen this?"

Stephen Thompson concurs, noting the shift from seasonal traditions to a more constant influx of horror-themed content.

Stephen Thompson: "Normally you would have thought of them as a sort of Halloween tradition. And then, boom, you get a bunch of horror movies."

The conversation pivots to the movie "Sinners", a historical vampire horror set in the 1930s, directed by Ryan Coogler and featuring Michael B. Jordan in dual roles. The duo discusses how music, particularly blues, plays a pivotal role in the film’s narrative.

Stephen Thompson: "This movie centers blues music very heavily, and Miles Caton has a very, very soulful voice."

---

2. Exploring the Soundtrack of 'Sinners'

Miles Caton, a backup singer turned actor, introduces a transformative musical moment in "Sinners". His song, "I Lied to Youo," serves as a critical turning point without revealing spoilers.

Stephen Thompson shares insights into the song's blend of classic blues with modern elements:

Stephen Thompson: "Think of blues as, like, a source code for so much soul music all the way up through rap... Miles’s vocal performance is at the center of that thing as it churns outward in all directions."

Robin Hilton responds enthusiastically, highlighting the song's unique fusion:

Robin Hilton: "This totally stands on its own... it's such a powerful performance."

The discussion acknowledges Ludwig Goransson’s contribution to the film’s score, while Raphael Siddiq crafted the blues-infused songs, enriching the movie’s emotional depth.

---

3. Spotlight on Fox Warren and Their Narrative Song 'Yvonne'

Transitioning from film to individual artistry, Robin Hilton introduces Fox Warren’s latest track, "Yvonne," from their upcoming album "Two".

She shares a personal anecdote reflecting on the beauty found in everyday moments, paralleling the song's themes.

Robin Hilton: "Fox Warren has a new album coming out called Two. This song, 'Yvonne,' captures the essence of observing someone in pursuit of their dreams."

Stephen Thompson analyzes the song’s subtle storytelling:

Stephen Thompson: "The singer is at a remove from the subject... observing them, appreciating what is happening."

The harmonies and ambient sounds, including seagull recordings, enhance the song’s narrative of distant admiration and love.

---

4. Deep Dive into Hyper-Pop: An Anatomy of a Microgenre

As part of their 25th-anniversary celebration, Robin Hilton and Stephen Thompson explore the intricate world of hyper-pop, guided by Stephen’s insightful piece titled "Anatomy of a Microgenre: Hyper Pop's Next Evolution."

Robin Hilton admits her initial struggle to connect with hyper-pop's chaotic and abrasive nature:

Robin Hilton: "I have a hard time connecting with it beyond sort of the surface of it."

Contrastingly, Stephen Thompson champions hyper-pop's DIY ethic and innovative soundscapes.

Stephen Thompson: "It's about the sounds and aesthetics of a time... Jane Remover is the pinnacle of what hyper pop can be."

The discussion highlights Jane Remover’s album "Revenge Seekers", particularly the track "Match Point," which epitomizes the genre's blend of glitchy textures and catchy hooks.

Robin Hilton: "I think in a lot of ways hyper pop is the most now sounding music being made... It feels like there's a detached quality to it."

Stephen Thompson echoes this sentiment, linking hyper-pop’s detachment to the online community’s influence.

Stephen Thompson: "There is a dissociation that is happening. You are at a natural remove from a lot of what you are experiencing."

---

5. Mal Blum’s 'I'm So Bored': A Melodic Exploration of Emotional Detachment

Shifting gears, Robin Hilton introduces Mal Blum’s new single, "I'm So Bored," from the album "The Villain." She praises Blum’s ability to infuse personality and nuanced emotions into seemingly simple melodies.

After a brief lyrical snippet, the hosts dissect the song's layers, uncovering themes of relationship strain and emotional numbness masked by upbeat tunes.

Robin Hilton: "It's a little playful, a little quirky, super melodic, super hooky. But there are some real hints of some darker things going on."

Stephen Thompson delves deeper into the duality presented in the lyrics, highlighting the facade of boredom as a coping mechanism for deeper relational issues.

Stephen Thompson: "There is a dejection that can be read as apathetic... yet the feeling that they arrive at is boredom."

---

6. Men I Trust’s Enchanting 'Land Keeper' from 'Equus Asinus'

Stephen Thompson features the Canadian indie group Men I Trust, focusing on their latest album "Equus Asinus" and the captivating track "Land Keeper."

He describes the song as "spellbinding" and "incandescent," noting its dream pop essence that draws listeners into a layered auditory experience.

Robin Hilton reflects on the song’s enchanting qualities, likening the atmosphere to a perfect, overcast day where the sun intermittently peeks through clouds.

Robin Hilton: "It's the kind of day where you could go with shorts or jeans... it is a vibe."

---

7. Celebrating 25 Years: Reflecting on 2010’s Influential Tracks

As part of the anniversary celebrations, Robin Hilton and Stephen Thompson reminisce about their top songs from 2010, emphasizing personal connections and the music's impact during pivotal life moments.

Andy Schaff, contributing to the conversation, shares his selection:

Andy Schaff: "The album just bloomed like a sunflower and was full of optimism and possibility... it was the exact moment I needed after my divorce."

He lists influential tracks from that year, including works by The Antlers, Sufjan Stevens, and Sharon Van Etten, highlighting how these songs provided solace and reflection during challenging times.

Robin Hilton: "This is a great pick. And this is gonna be the second week in a row, which means the second year in a row where I picked something completely opposite of that."

The discussion underscores the diverse emotional landscapes that music can navigate, from euphoria to melancholy.

---

Conclusion

"All Songs Considered" seamlessly intertwines film, genre exploration, and personal storytelling, offering listeners a rich tapestry of musical discourse. From dissecting the soulful blues in "Sinners" to unraveling the complexities of hyper-pop and celebrating milestone memories, Robin Hilton and Stephen Thompson provide an engaging and insightful journey through the sounds that shape our lives.

Notable Quotes:

• Robin Hilton [07:57]: "This guy's cooking, like, the first minute and a half or so of the song, you're like, all right, I'm totally down with this."
• Stephen Thompson [08:20]: "Miles is anchoring it right there. And you can feel the soul of it through all of its transformations."
• Robin Hilton [31:14]: "What a great last line. That is killer."
• Stephen Thompson [41:42]: "It's like seeing a light off in the distance, and you can see this light in the darkness."

---

For more insights and music discoveries, tune into NPR’s "All Songs Considered" and join Robin Hilton and the NPR Music family each week.

Transcript

[Sheldon Pierce]

Support for this podcast and the following message come from Dignity Memorial. When your celebration of life is prepaid today, your family is protected. Tomorrow, planning ahead is truly one of the best gifts you can give your family. For additional information, visit dignitymemorial.com Sheldon Pierce.

[Robin Hilton]

Can we just get right to the big question that I think is on everyone's mind?

[Stephen Thompson]

Let's get to it, right?

[Robin Hilton]

Why are there so many horror movies out right now? It's have you seen this?

[Stephen Thompson]

It's a great question. They are popping. Normally you would have thought of them as a sort of Halloween tradition.

[Robin Hilton]

Right.

[Stephen Thompson]

You settle into the darkness of fall daylight savings time.

[Robin Hilton]

Exactly.

[Stephen Thompson]

And then, boom, you get a bunch of horror movies. Now we're seeing them.

[Robin Hilton]

You've got Woman in the Yard, which the trailer for that. I know because a lot of these trailers were showing during the NCAA tournament and I was watching them with my kids. So all I know is their screams and them running from the room every time all these trailers would come on or putting, you know, had their hand over their eyes, got ugly. Stepsister something called it feeds the movie Sinners. There's a new Megan movie coming. Did you know there's a horror movie out now called Robin?

[Stephen Thompson]

I didn't. Are we living it right now on this podcast?

[Robin Hilton]

Robin. A horror movie out now. It's called Robin and it's all about some, like, evil robot doll.

[Stephen Thompson]

I mean, that seems to be the newest craze, right? How, how can technology terrorize us?

[Robin Hilton]

I'm sure we could do an entire episode on why we're getting all these scary movies in the as there's such a disconnect. But there's one in particular that actually has a music angle, and it's Sinners. And I know you've seen that movie.

[Stephen Thompson]

Yes, Sinners, the new sort of blockbuster feature from the writer director Ryan Coogler, which features the actor Michael B. Jordan in two roles playing twins, takes place in the 1930s. It's a bit of a historical drama that also doubles as a vampire horror story. But music really is at the center of the whole thing. It introduces the singer and actor Miles Caton, who sort of came out of nowhere for this role.

[Robin Hilton]

Who is this guy?

[Stephen Thompson]

He was a backup singer for her. He got the script for this movie and sent in an audition tape on a whim, and he got the job. And I think you can hear in his musical performances why he got the job. This movie centers blues music very heavily, and he has a very, very soulful voice. There is one particular song that he does that is sort of the turning point of the entire movie. And no spoilers.

[Robin Hilton]

No spoilers.

[Stephen Thompson]

No spoilers. But you sort of cross the threshold with this song. It's called I Lied to youo. Somethin I been wanna tell you for a long time. It might hurt you. Hope you don't lose your mind. Well, I was just a boy about 8 years old. You threw me a Bible on that Mississippi row. See I love you, papa.

[Mal Blum]

You did all you could do.

[Stephen Thompson]

And they say the truth hurts. So I lied to you. Yes, I lied to you. I love the Coopers.

[Robin Hilton]

Somebody take me in your arms tonight.

[Stephen Thompson]

All right.

[Mal Blum]

Somebody take me your arms tonight.

[Robin Hilton]

Somebody take me.

[Mal Blum]

To home tonight.

[Robin Hilton]

Somebody take me.

[Mal Blum]

In your arms tonight all right.

[Robin Hilton]

Somebody take me to your arms tonight. Somebody take me.

[Stephen Thompson]

I hope you can.

[Mal Blum]

Stand it, stand it all when I'm out here. See I'm full of the blues Holy water, too. I know that you hurt you So I lied to you. So preacher, speak your words.

[Stephen Thompson]

I know the truth. Yes, I like I love, I love.

[Robin Hilton]

Are you kidding me? I mean, like, this guy's cooking, like, the first minute and a half or so of the song, you're like, all right, I'm totally down with this. This is some great classic old school blues. And then those 808s kick in. You're like, wait a minute, where are we going with this? And it's not just like, okay, we're gonna add a little electric slide or something like that. I mean, it is.

[Stephen Thompson]

Once it takes off, it just really takes off. And it is moving in so many directions. Really think of blues as, like, a source code for so much soul music all the way up through rap. I mean, that's it. Electro funk, breakbeat, DJing, Hendrix era rock, right? Just, like, manipulated talk box vocals from, like, Roger Troutman. It is moving in so many directions. But the thing that is so cool about it is Miles's vocal performance is at the center of that thing as it churns outward in all directions. He is anchoring it right there. And you can feel the soul of it through all of its transformations.

[Robin Hilton]

This totally stands on its own, right? I mean, it is such a powerful performance. And so, you know, often with movies, there's the score, the original score, and there's the soundtrack. And in this case, this is from the soundtrack. The score, which is the more instrumental, like, orchestrated stuff. That's by Ludwig Goransson, who just won the Oscar for Oppenheimer in this case. They got someone else, though, to write all these songs. It wasn't Ludwig who Wrote these sort of bluesy songs. They got Raphael Siddiq for this one.

[Stephen Thompson]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And there is a little bit of overlap between the work that Raphael Siddiq did on this project and the work that Ludwig did on this project. But you can. Raphael Siddiq has the ultimate soul man's resume.

[Robin Hilton]

Yeah. While my children were screaming with their hands over their faces during the sinner's trailer, all I was thinking is, that looks awesome. I can't wait to see it. And then, like, hearing this music, now, I'm even more all in. I can't wait to see that. Sheldon, do you feel like you're someone who is sort of dialed into the little things in life? You know, like the things that are really, really small but can be full of really deep meaning if you give them any kind of attention?

[Stephen Thompson]

I do consider myself a sort of detailed, oriented person who is trying to, like, stop a little bit and observe what is happening around me. I do think we losing a bit of that as a community.

[Robin Hilton]

Yeah. I mean, I have, like. I remember I used to work in grocery stores. I spent years working in grocery stores. And I remember I was this one time, I was cleaning the floors of some aisle. I was running a buffing machine back and forth, and I stopped and I looked at the end of the aisle and our deli was down at the end of the aisle, and there was this woman working behind the counter, and she was like, scooping or ladling some casserole slop into containers for people, you know, And I just stopped for a minute. And there was something in that moment, watching her do this and hand the food to people and stuff. I just had this moment where I thought, I love people. I love everybody. I love every stupid little moment of life like this. I mention all this because this song that I want to play from the band Fox Warren, I think, gets at this idea a little bit. And I can tell you more about Fox Warren if you don't know them after we hear this song. But Fox Warren has a new album coming out. It's called Two. This is a band fronted by Andy Schaff. He's just such an incredible storyteller. So give a listen to this. It's called Yvonne. And see if you can kind of track the story that he is telling in this song.

[Mal Blum]

Jumping with the static of the TV screen Telling me exactly what she means Sharing her dreams with me oh, I don't know before I don't know what I do without you with her Metallican Telling her what lies within the sand sharing her dream I don't know what I do I don't know what I do.

[Robin Hilton]

So one of the things you hear right off are those harmonies, right?

[Stephen Thompson]

Yeah.

[Robin Hilton]

I mean, that is a staple of Andy Schaff, Fox Warren. But this is one of those songs where I think, you know, it's lyrically pretty spare. It's a very short song, but I think there's a lot going on in this sort of compact little moment. I'm curious what you tracked when you were listening to it, because it's not hitting you over the head. It's not super obvious, but it's in there.

[Stephen Thompson]

Yeah. I like, you know, the field recording seagull sounds sort of floating in the background. It's very clearly trying to set the scene. I think of it as the singer being at a remove from the subject. Like seeing them at a distance, observing them, sort of taking them in. You feel the distance there. You feel the desire to sort of like not disrupt what they're doing, but like this sort of deep appreciation for what is happening. Yeah.

[Robin Hilton]

You know, on the one hand, it seems like a simple little love song. What would I do without you, Yvonne? But who is Yvonne and what is she doing? She's waving her metallic arm around and you're like, wait, is she a robot? What is it? And then you realize, I had to listen to it a couple times. Yvonne is on a beach.

[Stephen Thompson]

The sand.

[Robin Hilton]

Yeah. She's got a metal detector. She's waving back.

[Stephen Thompson]

She's looking for buried treasure.

[Robin Hilton]

Looking for buried treasure. Right. And so, you know, let's say Andy, in this case, the singer is observing her. I think you're right. From a distance. And he's having one of those moments where he's watching this person look for something in the sand that's going to excite them, turn their life around, something, Some sort of treasure. Right. And he's having a moment watching this person from a distance and telling them, I love you. What would I do without you?

[Stephen Thompson]

Yvonne, you have enriched my life in a very meaningful, maybe sort of fleeting, but not any less important way.

[Robin Hilton]

So it's been a minute since Fox Warren had an album out. So were you familiar with them or you have Fox?

[Stephen Thompson]

I was not familiar with this.

[Robin Hilton]

So their last album came out in 2018. It was their self titled debut. That was my favorite album of 2018. But I had come to Andy Schaff as a solo artist before coming to Fox Warren. And so I thought Fox Warren was like his side project. But it turns out he had been in Fox Warren for years Fox Warren just had never put out any music.

[Stephen Thompson]

They weren't releasing.

[Robin Hilton]

Yeah, they weren't doing anything. And so he ended up just starting to put out his own stuff. But it had been so long. Seven years since their last record. Not only did I think it was maybe a side project for Andy Schaff, I thought, oh, it's just a little one off that he did and great to have that one record but so excited to have them back. The album from Fox Warren Again, it's called Two and it is out May 30th.

[Sheldon Pierce]

This message comes from Mint Mobile if you're tired of spending hundreds on big wireless bills, bogus fees and free perks, Mint Mobile might be right for you with plans starting from 15 bucks a month shop plans [e-mail] switch upfront payment of $45 for 3 month 5GB plan required new customer offer for first 3 months only, then full price plan options available, taxes and fees extra. See Mint Mobile for details.

[Stephen Thompson]

This message comes from Schwab At Schwab, how you invest is your choice, not theirs. That's why when it comes to managing your wealth, Schwab gives you more choices. You can invest and trade on your own. Plus get advice and more comprehensive wealth solutions to help meet your unique needs. With award winning service, low costs and transparent advice, you can manage your wealth your way at Schwab. Visit schwab.com to learn more support for.

[Sheldon Pierce]

NPR and the following Message come from LinkedIn ads One of the hardest parts about B2B marketing is reaching the right audience. When you want to reach the right professionals, use LinkedIn ads. LinkedIn has grown to a network of over 1 billion professionals. Target buyers by job title, industry company role, seniority skills, company revenue, all the professionals you need to reach in one place. Get a $100 credit on your next campaign. Just go to LinkedIn.com allsongs Terms and conditions apply only on LinkedIn ads.

[Robin Hilton]

All right, a reminder that if you like the show, share it with a friend. Leave us a glowing review on Apple or Spotify or wherever you listen to your podcasts. Also coming up later, we'll continue our ongoing celebration of our 25th anniversary with a look at our number one songs from 2010. We've been doing a different year in each episode of the show. This spring Stephen Thompson and I were up to 2010, so we're gonna have that for you a little later on plus your weekly reset. So keep listening for all of that. Sheldon, I wanna talk about a piece that you just Wrote that's up on our site right now, all about hyper pop. The headline for anyone who wants to search for it. Anatomy of a microgenre, Hyper pop's next evolution. So I have to be honest, hyper pop, it's one of those genres that I've had a really hard time with. Like, I have a hard time connecting with it beyond sort of the surface of it. You know, a lot of it's pretty abrasive, pretty chaotic, and whatever emotional heart there is to it is often lost in all of that noise for me. But I thought your piece is excellent, and I thought you offered maybe some ways into it.

[Stephen Thompson]

Yeah, I am on the opposite end of the spectrum. Hyper pop is super formal. I love almost all hyperpop. But I do also understand the resistance to it, how it can be inaccessible for most people. A lot of it is sort of throwing everything in a blender and not putting the lid on.

[Robin Hilton]

It's exactly what it is. And at the end, it's all over you. It's all over the room.

[Stephen Thompson]

It's everywhere. A big mess has been made and you don't know what to do. But I felt like even though it is sort of blown out and excessive and throwing everything at the wall, it had this core DIY ethic. It was all about the music itself and not necessarily the stardom that surrounds a lot of pop music. It's about the sounds and aesthetics of a time, maybe bygone, maybe across eras. Sometimes they're trying to pull all of this Internet history through a think. The artist that we're going to listen to on the show is sort of the pinnacle of what hyper pop can be. Their name is Jane Remover, and the stuff on their new album, Revenge Seekers is sort of a return to the digicore sound that they pioneered as a teenager.

[Robin Hilton]

Well, so what do you want to hear?

[Stephen Thompson]

Yeah, I want to hear one of the sort of Revenge Seekers standouts. It's called dancing with your eyes closed.

[Robin Hilton]

Me, I just want to make sense.

[Mal Blum]

Conversation with diety promise. I like it like that. Sa It Sa this song is called Match Point. We have a flavor.

[Robin Hilton]

Does that not just scramble your brain? I mean, when you listen to it, I mean, how is there anything left?

[Stephen Thompson]

It's absolutely insane. I mean, the music sounds like it's glitching out, but there's. There's also something earwormy about it, and I think that's the hyphen between the hyper and the pop. It's obviously hyperactive. And, I mean, the song breaks down, like four different times. But there is something super hooky about so much of those sections. I think every time it breaks down, it transforms into something interesting and worth following.

[Robin Hilton]

I think in a lot of ways hyper pop is the most now sounding music being made. I mean, it's sort of how the world feels and it's not just the chaos and the noise. But I don't know, check me on this. And I'm curious what you think. To me, it feels like there's this sort of detached quality to it where there's almost a kind of boredom or something behind the music. Does that, you know, like a disassociation or something behind it? Do you. Do you feel that?

[Stephen Thompson]

Absolutely. And I think that's representative in a lot of ways of what it's like to be online. There is a dissociation that is happening. You are at a natural remove from a lot of what you are experiencing. I think that is sort of the irony bouncing back and forth between a lot of what is going on in this music. Because I do think there is a very real sense of community online that built these songs.

[Robin Hilton]

It's in this song too, actually. I wrote down one of my notes is like as icy as this is and synthetic. There is a feeling of unity in it.

[Stephen Thompson]

Yeah, yeah.

[Robin Hilton]

Well, you go a lot deeper in your piece about Hyper pop. What exactly it even is. Yeah, how we got here and everything. So people should definitely, definitely check that out again. It's called Anatomy of a Microgenre. Hyper Pop's Next Evolution. Well, I'm super excited about something that couldn't be more different from that. It's from the artist Mal Blum, who very often will perform just their voice and the guitar. They are an artist that I have loved and played on the show for a number of years now. Their songs have so much personality and life. They're a little quirky, a little playful, but all. You know, there's always just a little bit hint of darkness, I think, kind of lurking around in some of these songs. I think they're a lot more nuanced than they might sound to people when, you know, maybe when you first listen. And I think all of that is definitely true of this new song that I want to play for Mal Black. They've got a new album coming out called the Villain. And the first single that we've got from it is called. Well, appropriately for our previous discussion, it's called I'm so Bored.

[Mal Blum]

I cried myself to sleep Again. It's embarrassing and I can't believe you made a fool of me you sold me on a pretty light abated life. I booked a flight and promised not to leave I don't think anyone really knows what you're like when you're alone when you send every call I don't think you even know it now close the show and take it out. Enjoy your space figure it out. But I'm so bored I barely even noticed when you never came home. I'm so bored I barely even notice anymore that you're gone cause I'm so bored. Treat your lovers like they work for you. I liked it too upon I guess I look good on my knees. You begged me in the drugstore once saying please don't say you'd be okay if I should have leave. You were so sure of me Showing me everything I want to see. I almost did not believe you were so sure of me. Had to have me then you got me now we only speak through intermediaries. Got on so bored I barely even noticed when you never came home. I'm so bored I barely even notice anymore that you're gone cause I'm so bored. Cry myself to sleep again it's embarrassing. I caught of friends I haven't seen since we met I try to hold a love for you when they ask me I say it's complicated but I don't think it is you don't want to have to tell me twice and I better respond nice. You don't have room for mine so you don't have room for my feelings. But you'd like to stay friends. Okay, what are those again? You don't have friends, you have meetings. I'm so bored. I can't believe we're doing this again. I'm so bored I'm so bored. So let's just give right to the part where you're gone. I'm so bored I can't keep the light going through the chorus. I'm so bored. Did you leave already? I didn't notice.

[Robin Hilton]

What a great last line. That is killer. You know, because they've been singing the whole time about, you know, they're just so bored, you know, they didn't even notice this person they were with is gone. But then they close with, did you leave already? I didn't notice.

[Stephen Thompson]

Yeah, I love this little fourth wall break just before that too. Like, I can't keep the lie going through the chorus. Like, the whole time. The whole time you feel like you're like an outsider, like witnessing this 1v1 dialogue, right between summ somebody in a relationship with somebody else who Just will not sustain the feeling for whatever reason. And then you have this pivot outward where it's like, is that person even here? Am I in dialogue with myself actually? Right.

[Robin Hilton]

I mean, they even say, like, let's just get to the part where you're gone.

[Stephen Thompson]

Right. Can we just.

[Robin Hilton]

I really want to use that sometime when I'm talking to someone I don't want to have a conversation with anymore. Like, can we just. Just skip to the part where you're not here anymore? But, you know, but here's the thing. You. You hear what I'm talking about. Like, it's a little playful, a little quirky, super melodic, super hooky. But there are some real hints of some darker things going on in this song. Like, at one point, Mal Blum sings about, you know, whoever they're singing about, they. They sing, you don't want to have to ask me twice, and I better respond nice. Yeah, that's quite a lot. They're clearly in some sort of threatening relationship. Right, right. Like, you don't want to have to ask me twice and I better be nice or what? You know, it's like, there's almost hints of violence. You know, at one point they say, we've reached this point where we only speak through intermediaries. I'm getting hints of a restraining order or something. Right. I mean, there's some really, like, the more you sit with this, you realize this is not the super bubbly pop song that it sounds like.

[Stephen Thompson]

I mean, the lyric, I don't think anyone really knows what you're like when you're tells you that this person. There's something malicious happening within this relationship. And I think the voice is really selling a lot of the duality of this song. There is sort of like a dejection that can be read as apathetic, as waving off this thing that has withered on the vine and is sort of already dead on arrival, essentially.

[Robin Hilton]

And yet the feeling that they arrive at is boredom.

[Stephen Thompson]

Right.

[Robin Hilton]

So in conversation with the Jane Remover song, you think, like, some of those themes, do you think?

[Stephen Thompson]

Yeah, yeah, definitely. The idea of sort of settling on detachment as a coping mechanism for these sort of horrors of the world.

[Robin Hilton]

Well, that's funny. I never thought of boredom as a survival mechanism. Yeah, but, yeah, for sure. Well, this album from Mal Blum is called the Villain, and It is out July 11th.

[Sheldon Pierce]

Support for this podcast and the following message come from Lagunitas Brewing Company. Since 1993, Laganitas has been challenging the status quo, brewing innovative beer and crafting stories along the way, featuring a wide range of craft brews, cult classics and non alcoholic options. There's a seat at the bar for everyone. Bring the dog to Laganitas Brewing Co. Because every great song deserves a great beer. It's good to have friends. Learn [e-mail] okay, we've got that look.

[Robin Hilton]

At the show's number one songs from 2010 coming up along with your weekly reset. But Sheldon, I know you've got one more that you want to play for us before we go. And let me say that I did not know this song or this artist before you shared this with me and it almost immediately became one of my favorite songs of the year.

[Stephen Thompson]

Yeah, I mean, the stars have aligned. I get to talk about my two favorite artists of the moment. We did Jane Remover and now. Now we get to talk about my favorite band of the moment, the Canadian indie group Men I Trust. I've been keyed into Men I Trust since their album Uncle Jazz was long listed for the 2020 Polaris Prize. The song, Show Me how sort of went viral on TikTok a few years after. They've built a small little fan base in the wake of that, but they are like a truly independent band. Their album was released into the ether in the middle of the week. It's called Equus Asinus, which is donkey in Latin.

[Robin Hilton]

Yeah, okay.

[Stephen Thompson]

The technical term for a domesticated donkey. All of their titles are like that. Their previous album from 2021 was called Unturable Album. So there's a bit of unturable. There's a bit of a wink and a nudge in like everything that they do. But this new record is one of my favorites and I want to listen to, I think, the standout song from that record. It's called the Land Keeper.

[Mal Blum]

Sacred. The soul and heart retreat so many stories many deep the man who left it breathes instead of sowing seeds and he lives on in the land's memory A father love myself at home away from home this soil both far and not the sun intones as life and death goes on the ground I throw out strong arms nurtured heart and kin Given every seed Thought them how to grow within gentle hands that shape the earth and gave it worth below the lasting blood I found myself at home away from home this soil goes far enough the sun intones as life and death goes on the ground I throw out.

[Stephen Thompson]

It's so spellbinding.

[Robin Hilton]

Spellbinding. That's it. That's the word.

[Stephen Thompson]

I think of it like almost like dream pop, inception. Like, it feels like the dream of the pop. Like, three layers deep. Like, I'm so sucked into it. And also, it's like there are lyrics, and they do have meaning, but they also feel like sort of.

[Robin Hilton]

Well, I was gonna ask you if you had any clue what this is about. I sat with the lyrics for a while, and I didn't get very far. Far?

[Stephen Thompson]

Yeah, it's like I. I mean, it's like individual phrases. I mean, they have meaning in the sense of. I feel like I understand their energy, but I can't follow the story. I can't follow the characters, if there are any. But, I mean, her voice just, like, is so. So powerful.

[Robin Hilton]

It's enchanting. You know, when the song first starts off, I thought for sure, sure, I was gonna hear some sort of. Sort of resonant, dreamy sort of speak singing voice, like Jarvis Caulker, you know, kind of come in like I'm Jarvis Cocker. Candy corn, whiskey sour daydreams and unholy hours. I like smoking. Doesn't it just sound like that? It's totally. And so I was blindsided, in a way by her voice when it comes because it is just so enchanting.

[Stephen Thompson]

Yeah. It is also radiant. It's, like, incandescent. There's something lit up about it. It feels like seeing a light off in the distance, and you can see this light in the darkness. There is something so warm and drawing about it, even in its delicacy.

[Robin Hilton]

Well, you know what it is, Sheldon? It's the kind of day where you could go with shorts or jeans. You know, it's, you know, a hoodie or just a straight T shirt. You know, it's that. It's that perfect in between. You know, it's kind of a little overcast, a rainy day, but the sun's peeking through every now and then.

[Stephen Thompson]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Robin Hilton]

It is a vibe. You know, I am happy to camp out in forever. So the song Land Keeper again, from Men I Trust. And that album is Equus Asinus, Latin for donkey, horse, donkey, donkey. But thanks, Sheldon, as always, for hanging out and sharing such great music.

[Stephen Thompson]

Always a great time.

[Robin Hilton]

All right, it's all Songs Considered's 25th anniversary, and we're looking back at the music that defined the show over the years. Stephen Thompson, back to talk about the year 2010. Hey, Stephen.

[Andy Schaff]

Hello, Robin.

[Robin Hilton]

So we're up to 2010, and we're looking at the number one songs from across the past 25 years of all Songs Considered. And maybe it's worth Reminding people that these are not the number one Billboard songs or the Hot 100 or whatever. These are songs that, you know, matter to us, matter to the show, that take us back to that time when we were working on All Songs Considered. What do you think of when you think of 2010?

[Andy Schaff]

I mean, 2010 is such a. Is such a fascinating year. Just for me, in my life, it was a year of massive, massive title shifts in my life. And when I think of the music, music that stood out, it only makes sense that what. What has bubbled to the top is songs that reflect a state of pure euphoria.

[Robin Hilton]

Kishi Bashi. Oh, no, no. Yonzi Yancy. Yonsy. I was thinking 150. Is it 150?

[Andy Schaff]

You were thinking of, like, Bright Whites by Kishibashi. That's not so 2012.

[Robin Hilton]

Yeah.

[Mal Blum]

Make a note. Know that we can anything.

[Robin Hilton]

So our mission. I remember it's called Go do, but I can't remember the album. It's.

[Andy Schaff]

The album is just called Go.

[Robin Hilton]

Okay, Go, right?

[Andy Schaff]

Not okay, Go. That's a whole different band.

[Robin Hilton]

Right, Right. If you want the sonic equivalent of Euphoria, it's hard to do better than this song.

[Andy Schaff]

That whole record is so glorious. And I remember being so endlessly surprised by it because Yonsi had made, you know, by that point, a very long string of these languid, beautiful, kind of lugubrious records with Sigur Ross, you know, that were. That had a sweep to them, had beauty and grandeur to them, but they moved much more slowly. And so, like, oh, he's gone solo. He's gonna move inward like he's gonna find some. Some inner spot that he hasn't found working with. With Siguros. And instead, this record that just bloomed like a sunflower and was full of optimism and possibility. I cannot tell you how much this was the record I exactly needed in the exact moment that I found it where, you know, I was coming out of hardship, I got divorced.

[Robin Hilton]

Okay? And I don't want to talk about it. I don't want to get.

[Andy Schaff]

I don't want to talk about it.

[Robin Hilton]

But listen, here's every intimate detail of what I did wrong. And I will say that this is not the direction I thought you were going when you set this up, because I thought you were going to say so. Of course, the songs I picked for 2010 were very melancholy and sad.

[Andy Schaff]

Yeah. I mean, I remember sending a mix because I used to make mix CDs of my favorite songs of a given year, and I sent it to my friend Martin Margaret. And her response was, oh, thank you for sending me. Now that's what I call divorce, volumes one and two.

[Robin Hilton]

Why hasn't anybody made that mixtape professionally? Now that's what I call divorce. Well, that's brilliant.

[Andy Schaff]

It's full of songs by Don Henley.

[Robin Hilton]

Well, this is a great pick. And this is gonna be the second week in a row, which means the second year in a row where I picked something completely opposite of that. Because last time when we talked about 2009, I picked Kettering the Antler song, which was from the album Hospice. And this one isn't that sad.

[Andy Schaff]

But it is not as sad as the song from Hospice.

[Robin Hilton]

Hospice. But it is a decidedly different vibe than what you picked.

[Stephen Thompson]

Great.

[Robin Hilton]

I know you like this band when they were putting out music, but maybe this is too.

[Andy Schaff]

Well, are there vocals?

[Robin Hilton]

There are here. Let's scooch ahead here.

[Andy Schaff]

This isn't. Is this. Is this Lower Dens?

[Robin Hilton]

Oh, Stephen Thompson. A plus. Yes. This song is called I Get Nervous, from their debut album, Twin Hand Movement. This is one of those bands sort of like the Antlers, who, you know, they come up, they just devastate you in all the best ways. They have this huge impact in your life, and their imprint on you is forever. But then they kind of go on and they don't continue. Continue to make music anymore. And Lower Den's not together. It was a band fronted by Jaina Hunter.

[Stephen Thompson]

Yeah.

[Robin Hilton]

And. And they put out their last album in 2019, the competition, and then that was it. But, yeah, this was. I. I thought about going with something like Ab Machines by Sleigh Bells. That was such a big song from that year. Completely different vibe from this. But I wanted to pick something that I know people loved at the time and probably haven't reached for in a while.

[Andy Schaff]

It's one that I have not reached for in probably 15 years.

[Robin Hilton]

Yeah.

[Andy Schaff]

Looking over the track list for. No, that's what I call Divorce, Volume 1. It's such a mixture of euphoria and miserableism. Not only did you have Yonsi, but Cloud Cult put out that song. You'll Be Bright Invitation Part one, that year, which I know I've talked about on this show before, but Blood Buzz Ohio by the National.

[Robin Hilton]

Oh, yeah.

[Andy Schaff]

Really? One of their greatest songs, Sharon Van Etten put out love more in 2010.

[Robin Hilton]

Yeah. Was that from Epic? Yeah, that's from Epic. Well, that was also the year that Sufjan Stevens put out the Age of Odds, which was a huge record.

[Andy Schaff]

My favorite of his records.

[Robin Hilton]

Oh, but it was so wild, though. It really like he was so clearly stretching his music in the most wild ways.

[Stephen Thompson]

That's true.

[Robin Hilton]

Totally brilliant. I mentioned Sleigh Bells, their Treats album came out that year. And then also the Tallest man on Earth.

[Andy Schaff]

Oh, sure.

[Robin Hilton]

Yeah. So we'll go out on this. Thanks as always, Stephen.

[Andy Schaff]

Thank you, Robin.

[Robin Hilton]

At 4, NPR Music, I'm Robin Hilton. It's all songs consider.

[Mal Blum]

Standing.

[Sheldon Pierce]

This message comes from Warby Parker. What makes a great pair of glasses at Warby Parker? It's all the invisible extras without the extra cost, like free adjustments for life. Find your [e-mail] or visit one of their hundreds of stores around the country. This message comes from Bombus. Nearly 30% of marathoners end their race. Blistered Bombas running socks are strategically cushioned to help. Say bye to blisters. Run to bombas.com NPR and use code NPR for 20% off your first purchase. Purchase.

[Stephen Thompson]

This message comes from Tourism Australia. No matter what you're into, Australia has something for everyone all year round, like the Dane Tree rainforest this spring, Melbourne's music scene in the summer, and the wineries of Barossa Valley in the winter. Come and say g'day [e-mail].