Podcast Summary: All There Is with Anderson Cooper – Episode Featuring Doris Kearns Goodwin

Episode Information:

• Title: All There Is with Anderson Cooper
• Host: Anderson Cooper (CNN)
• Guest: Doris Kearns Goodwin
• Release Date: January 15, 2025

Introduction to Doris Kearns Goodwin

In this poignant episode of All There Is with Anderson Cooper, historian and Pulitzer Prize-winning author Doris Kearns Goodwin joins Cooper to delve deep into the complexities of grief. Drawing from her extensive personal experiences and her profound understanding of historical figures' sorrows, Doris offers a heartfelt exploration of loss, remembrance, and healing.

Doris Kearns Goodwin’s Personal Journey with Grief

Finding Solace in the Past

Doris begins by sharing a touching discovery from her late father's belongings: a small book titled The Empty Crib by Reverend Theodore Cuyler, memorializing his son Georgie who died of scarlet fever in 1876. Doris reflects on the universality of loss, stating, “In almost every home there are stored away among its most cherished treasures a little photograph or a box of toys... They all tell a story too deep for tears” (01:18).

Experiencing Tragedy in Los Angeles

Currently in Los Angeles covering devastating fires, Doris juxtaposes historical grief with present-day tragedies. She describes the harrowing scenes of destroyed homes and lost lives, resonating with Reverend Cuyler's sentiment: “a story too deep for tears” (01:18).

The Loss of Her Mother and Father

Doris recounts the profound impact of losing her mother at 15 due to a sudden heart attack. She admits, “I didn’t know how to deal with that” (08:09). Her father's subsequent death in her twenties added another layer to her grief, revealing the complexities of navigating loss within a family.

Losing Her Husband, Dick Goodwin

The conversation turns deeply personal as Doris discusses the death of her husband, Dick Goodwin, in 2018. She describes their mutual decision to go through Dick's personal memorabilia, a project that became their “last great adventure of our life” (04:32). Doris shares the emotional journey of Dick’s battle with squamous cell cancer and their profound moments during his hospice care. She reflects on Dick's final words: “you are a wonder” (07:56), highlighting the enduring love and support between them.

Coping Mechanisms and Emotional Healing

Doris emphasizes the therapeutic power of storytelling and remembrance. She explains how documenting and sharing memories of her loved ones allowed her and Dick to keep their spirits alive: “The more you can talk about them and remember them and bring them back to life... sometimes when a person comes to life every time you think about them” (14:33).

Historical Perspectives on Grief: Insights from Doris Kearns Goodwin

Abraham Lincoln’s Grief

Doris delves into President Abraham Lincoln's personal struggles with loss, including the death of his mother at nine and his son Willie at a young age. She notes Lincoln's reliance on accomplishments to achieve a form of immortality: “the only way I live is by accomplishing something worthy so people will remember that I lived” (17:55). Lincoln’s method of coping by remembering Willie through scrapbooks is highlighted as a means to keep his son’s memory vivid and comforting (19:08).

Teddy Roosevelt’s Battle with Grief

The discussion transitions to Theodore Roosevelt, who faced the simultaneous loss of his mother and wife on the same day. Doris explains how Roosevelt's grief led him to immerse himself in work and the rugged life of a rancher in the Dakotas, which ultimately shaped his resilient persona: “He became the Teddy Roosevelt we know because of the grief that he was” (24:29). Roosevelt's philosophy of pushing forward to combat depression is critiqued as a way to deny the true process of grief (22:28).

Evolution of Grief in America

From Public Mourning to Private Sorrow

Doris outlines the transformation of grief expression in America through three distinct phases:

1. Public and Communal Grief: In earlier centuries, death was a frequent occurrence, making grief a public and communal experience. Funerals were commonly attended events where the community participated in mourning together (20:47).

2. Private and Hidden Grief: With advancements in medicine and changes in societal norms, grief became more private. Mourning practices like wearing black or mourning bands faded, and death was increasingly hidden away in hospitals, reducing communal participation in sorrow (25:14).

3. Modern Grieving Practices: Today, the rise of hospices allows individuals to die surrounded by family, and social media provides platforms for sharing and commemorating loved ones. However, traditional practices like visiting gravesites have declined, and grief often remains a solitary journey for many (26:48).

Impact of Social Media on Grief

Doris observes that social media has transformed mourning by enabling people to share memories and receive support online. This digital communal space contrasts with the current trend of declining physical memorial practices, as she shares her own limited visits to her family's gravesites (27:12).

Doris Kearns Goodwin’s Insights and Advice on Grieving

Embracing Remembrance

Doris advocates for actively remembering and sharing stories about those who have passed away. She believes that keeping memories alive helps prevent the deceased from being forgotten and fosters a sense of their continued presence: “The more you can talk about them and remember them and bring them back to life, even in conversation or by reading or thinking about them” (14:33).

Acknowledging and Accepting Grief

She emphasizes the importance of acknowledging one’s pain rather than suppressing it. Doris shares her own struggle with maintaining an optimistic facade and how accepting the reality of her grief has been crucial for her healing: “I think it's been really helpful to just acknowledge that hard things have happened in my life” (13:08).

Individual Paths to Healing

Recognizing that grief is a personal experience, Doris underscores that there is no right or wrong way to mourn. She encourages individuals to find what brings them peace, whether it’s revisiting meaningful places, sharing memories, or simply allowing themselves to feel the sorrow: “It's okay to just do what you need to do to survive the loss” (31:25).

Concluding Thoughts

In the episode’s closing moments, Doris reflects on her husband Dick's serene acceptance of death and the peace it brought to their final days together. She contrasts this with her own initial reluctance to confront her grief openly, ultimately finding strength in embracing her sorrow: “I can close my eyes, I can feel them alive. And that's... it's a remarkable feeling” (21:36).

Anderson Cooper wraps up the conversation by highlighting Doris’s role as an advocate for a healthier understanding of grief, applauding her ability to navigate personal loss while providing invaluable insights to others navigating similar paths.

Notable Quotes

• “In almost every home there are stored away among its most cherished treasures a little photograph or a box of toys... They all tell a story too deep for tears.” – Doris Kearns Goodwin (01:18)

• “You are a wonder.” – Dick Goodwin to Doris (07:56)

• “The more you can talk about them and remember them and bring them back to life...” – Doris Kearns Goodwin (14:33)

• “I think it's been really helpful to just acknowledge that hard things have happened in my life.” – Doris Kearns Goodwin (13:08)

• “It's okay to just do what you need to do to survive the loss.” – Listener (31:25)

Conclusion

This episode of All There Is with Anderson Cooper offers a profound exploration of grief through the lens of Doris Kearns Goodwin’s personal experiences and historical insights. By intertwining her own journey with lessons from revered leaders like Lincoln and Roosevelt, Doris provides listeners with a deep understanding of how grief has shaped individuals and societies alike. Her compassionate advice serves as a beacon for those navigating the turbulent waters of loss, emphasizing the importance of remembrance, acceptance, and personal healing.