Amanpour – Egyptian Foreign Minister Badr Abdelatty

CNN Podcasts | October 15, 2025

Episode Overview

This episode centers on two major themes:

1. Middle East Peace Process: Christiane Amanpour interviews Egypt’s Foreign Minister, Badr Abdelatty, a key mediator in the Gaza ceasefire negotiations. The discussion addresses the challenges in implementing the ceasefire, the future of Gaza, relations with Israel, and the prospects for a two-state solution.
2. Venezuelan Democracy: Amanpour also speaks with Maria Corina Machado, Nobel Peace Prize laureate and Venezuelan opposition leader, about her ongoing struggle for democracy against the Maduro regime, recent US interventions, and the humanitarian and political crisis.

Notable supporting segments include a deep-dive conversation on America's "unfinished revolution" with The Atlantic’s Jeffrey Goldberg and Walter Isaacson.

MAIN SEGMENT: Interview with Egyptian Foreign Minister Badr Abdelatty

(00:56 - 19:27)

1. Status of the Gaza Ceasefire and Humanitarian Aid

Key Points:

• Egypt played a pivotal role in brokering the ceasefire with direct US involvement, including President Trump.
• Implementation of phase one (hostage and body exchange, humanitarian aid) is ongoing but complicated by difficulties locating and returning all deceased hostage remains.
• Humanitarian situation in Gaza is described as “catastrophic.”

Notable Quotes:

• [03:09] Badr Abdelatty:
  “...collecting the remains will take some time because they are under rubble and you have a lot of explosive materials... But we are doing our utmost... to collect the deceased bodies and to hand them over to the Israeli side in implementation of the agreement...”
• [06:10] Badr Abdelatty:
  “The situation on the ground is catastrophic. And we need literally, literally to flood Gaza with food and with relief materials and the medical equipment.”

2. Security and Policing Arrangements in Gaza’s Transition

Key Points:

• Interim policing in Gaza may temporarily involve Hamas, but the plan is to train and deploy vetted Palestinian police, potentially up to 10,000 officers, in partnership with Jordan.
• There is an urgent push for Hamas to disarm, with President Trump threatening force if compliance isn’t achieved.

Notable Quotes:

• [08:30] Badr Abdelatty:
  “We are working... by providing training to the Palestinian policemen... in cooperation with Jordan... so in total, we can have 10,000 policemen on the ground who will be entrusted with issues related to law enforcement and policing Gaza.”
• [09:20] Badr Abdelatty:
  “President Trump announced at the end of this war... we cannot allow the resumption of hostilities again. People paid a very, very heavy price...”

3. The Prospect of a Two-State Solution

Key Points:

• Egypt sees the establishment of a Palestinian state as the “only game in town” for a sustainable peace.
• Plans for a November conference in Cairo to focus on reconstruction, with participation from a broad international coalition.

Notable Quotes:

• [12:26] Badr Abdelatty:
  "We believe that in order to bring an end to the Palestinian Israeli conflict, the only game in town will be, of course, the establishment... of the Palestinian state."

4. Israel’s Position and Regional Dynamics

Key Points:

• Egypt honors its peace treaty with Israel but insists that “mighty power cannot bring stability.”
• Arab normalization with Israel is contingent upon resolving the Palestinian issue per international parameters.
• Netanyahu did not attend the recent peace summit.

Notable Quotes:

• [15:27] Badr Abdelatty:
  “Mighty power cannot bring stability or security to any country or to the region. We must have a just, comprehensive settlement...”

• [16:45] Badr Abdelatty:
  "Many Arab and Muslim countries are waiting... for normalization with Israel. As long as we are settling the Palestinian cause..."

• [18:40] Badr Abdelatty:
  “We are tired, Christian. We are. There is a fatigue, you know. So we must move forward with settling down this conflict. And that's why the only game in town is President Trump peace plan.”

SECOND SEGMENT: Maria Corina Machado, Nobel Laureate & Venezuelan Opposition Leader

(20:16 - 37:46)

1. Recognition for Democratic Struggle

Key Points:

• Machado views the Nobel Prize as international acknowledgment of Venezuela’s struggle against a "criminal structure" (the Maduro regime), which has caused severe poverty and forced mass migration.

Notable Quotes:

• [21:35] Machado:
  “This is a recognition for a whole society that... has struggled and has suffered much more... from a tyranny... a criminal structure that has brought poverty intentionally...”

2. Repression and International Pressure

Key Points:

• Post-election, Machado and supporters faced severe repression, including arrests, disappearances, and human rights abuses.
• She argues the Nobel Prize increases the cost for the regime to harm her.

[23:07] Machado:
“After we won the elections, a few hours afterwards, I was accused of terrorism... the worst repression wave was unleashed.”

3. Hope for Democratic Change

Key Points:

• Machado credits the unity and resilience of Venezuelan society, projecting optimism for transition and regional ripple effects.

[24:56] Machado:
“Our country is more united than ever... 90% of our population wants the same. Not only Maduro to go, but we want our children back home…”

• [25:50] Machado:
  “...this is going to be an orderly transition because that's what the people want and the center is the people.”

4. US Intervention, Narco-Terrorism Claims, and International Dynamics

Key Points:

• Machado justifies US military action against Maduro’s assets as necessary to cut off criminal revenues; calls for broader international coalition.
• Disputes the US government claim that Venezuela is not a significant cocaine transshipment point, arguing the regime is deeply implicated in organized crime.

Notable Quotes:

• [28:27] Machado:
  “We need the help of the President of the United States to stop this war. Because it is about human lives... And that’s what the regime used for repression and also for, for expanding its criminal activities. And that's what's happening right now. And we totally support it.”

• [31:57] Machado:
  “Using the FBI's own reports... 24% of the world trade of cocaine goes through Venezuela... the regime has turned del cartel de los soles in one of the most powerful criminal structures...”

• [34:03] Machado:
  “We’re getting, finally, a leadership that is addressing this tragic situation... And I did have the chance to speak... with President Trump, and it was a very good conversation. And I absolutely think he deserves a Nobel Peace Prize...”

• [36:20] Machado:
  “We’re calling for the interventions of Russia, China, Cuba and Iran to be stopped and to be expelled. Venezuela right now is a safe haven where Hezbollah, Hamas, the drug cartels... operate freely.”

THIRD SEGMENT: America's “Unfinished Revolution”

Walter Isaacson and Jeffrey Goldberg (38:24 - 52:32)

1. Why America’s Revolution Is “Unfinished”

Key Points:

• The expansion of rights is ongoing; the system is always in flux.
• There are signals of democratic backsliding, particularly over Congressional abdication of its constitutional role.

[38:43] Jeffrey Goldberg:
“No human endeavor ever reaches a stage of perfection... we are 250 years into this experiment... What I mean by unfinished is that we're always trying to figure out better ways to be a representative democracy.”

• [40:32] “Congress is not taking the power granted to it by the Constitution to actually be a check on executive power."

2. Fear of Authoritarianism and Historical Cycles

Key Points:

• Goldberg warns of increased executive power and weaker checks and balances under Trump’s administration.
• Press and media are now more important than ever as a bulwark against authoritarian impulses.

[43:11] Goldberg:
“We have not experienced a person who has, frankly, authoritarian impulses and who believes that the government should be used as a weapon against his domestic political enemies.”

• [45:23]
  “Without the press, we're finished. Obviously, authoritarians... turn the press into the enemy of the people... I don't think [the value of a free press] could be taken for granted anymore.”

3. Wrestling with the American Narrative

Key Points:

• The White House promotes a narrative of “Restoring Truth and Sanity,” pushing against critical history.
• Goldberg identifies three camps: one seeking critical but patriotic engagement, one insisting on unblemished history, and one seeing America as fundamentally evil.

[47:45] Goldberg:
“There are three camps in America... my camp, probably your camp, which thinks America is a wonderful country... that sometimes it's made bad mistakes. But the great thing is that we learn from our mistakes and then we get better.”

4. Reconciling Ideals with Historical Sin (Slavery, Jefferson)

Key Points:

• Annette Gordon Reed’s scholarship is highlighted—America’s contradictory founding, with slaveowners declaring equality, must be confronted honestly.

[50:20] Goldberg:
“...the wall is higher than Jefferson. And the symbolism there is obvious: that the sin of Jefferson is larger than the man... But above that... the opening words of the Declaration of Independence... The ideals that Jefferson held but didn’t live up to as a man... That’s what we’re striving for.”

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Badr Abdelatty (Egypt FM), on the futility of force in the region:
  [15:27] "Mighty power cannot bring stability or security to any country or to the region. We must have a just, comprehensive settlement..."
• Maria Corina Machado, on the future of Venezuela:
  [24:56] “There’s no other society... as cohesive as Venezuelan society. 90% of our population wants the same. Not only Maduro to go, but we want our children back home.”
• Jeffrey Goldberg, on America’s paradox:
  [50:20] “The sin of Jefferson is larger than the man... yet the ideals he held... above him... that’s what we’re striving for.”

Timestamps for Key Segments

| Time | Segment/Topic | |-------------|----------------------------------------------------------| | 00:56–19:27 | Egypt FM Badr Abdelatty: Gaza ceasefire and peacemaking | | 20:16–37:46 | Maria Corina Machado: Venezuela’s crisis and Nobel Prize | | 38:24–52:32 | Jeffrey Goldberg: America’s “Unfinished Revolution” |

Summary

This episode offers an unvarnished look at two high-stakes theaters of global politics—Gaza and Venezuela—through the voices of central actors and expert observers. Despite daunting obstacles and repeated setbacks, the conversations remain grounded in realism, urgency, and—if sometimes cautious—hope that diplomacy, international alignment, and democratic ideals can chart new paths for conflict resolution. The discussions are rich in historical context, personal conviction, and hard-won lessons, making this a must-listen for anyone seeking to understand our pivotal moment.