Amanpour — “Finnish President Reacts to Trump”

Podcast: Amanpour | Host: Christiane Amanpour (CNN)
Episode Date: January 21, 2026

Episode Overview

In this wide-ranging episode, Christiane Amanpour interviews Finnish President Alexander Stubb live from Davos, delving into the global shock following President Donald Trump’s aggressive stance on acquiring Greenland, his wavering commitment to NATO, and what America’s new “might makes right” foreign policy means for European security. Conversations also address shifting power dynamics, Europe’s defense capabilities, transatlantic relations, and the existential challenge posed by AI-generated sexual abuse, with additional insight from former Trump trade adviser Kellyanne Shaw and Atlantic writer Charlie Warzel.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Trump’s Greenland Gambit and NATO Turmoil

• Trump’s Mixed Messages: President Trump opens by retracting his threat to use force for acquiring Greenland but insists on immediate negotiations for its “acquisition,” stoking European uncertainty ([01:51]).
  • Trump: “All the United States is asking for is a place called Greenland...” ([00:09])
  • “I won’t do that [use force]. Now everyone’s saying, oh, good. That’s probably the biggest statement I made…” ([01:51])
• European Alarm: Amanpour frames Trump’s shifting positions as undermining NATO’s solidarity and security, raising questions about the U.S. long-term commitment ([02:30]).

2. Interview with Finnish President Alexander Stubb – Rebalancing the World Order

A. Immediate Reactions to Trump’s Davos Speech

• Stubb distinguishes between “good, bad, and ugly” scenarios:
  • “Good would be to find an off ramp...through NATO. Bad, tariff war. Ugly, military intervention. Two positive takeaways: no military intervention and a desire to improve Arctic security.” ([03:21])
• Stubb remains cautiously optimistic but emphasizes that resolution is not yet assured.

B. Diplomatic Process & Arctic Security

• Describes dual-track negotiations:
  • Washington meetings between Denmark, Greenland, and U.S. officials, aiming for a solution within 3 months ([04:31]).
  • Hope for a parallel NATO-led Arctic security initiative ([04:31]).

C. Miscommunication & Sovereignty

• Addresses misunderstanding over NATO troop deployments to Greenland, clarifying they’re for joint exercises, not to threaten the U.S. ([06:32]).
  • “It was a misunderstanding...they went on a reconnaissance mission which was agreed with us.” ([06:32])
• On sovereignty: “It is for Denmark and Greenland to decide about their own destiny.” ([06:32])

D. European Defense Capacity & NATO’s Future

• Finland's military readiness and recent NATO accession emphasized:
  • “Finland...the strongest Arctic military force in the alliance...we have the biggest artillery in Europe.” ([07:55])
  • “If I am asked...can Finland defend itself? The answer is yes, we can. And we have done it before.” ([07:55])
• Stubb: U.S. wants Europe to “take more responsibility,” but warns against utopian scenarios of a NATO without America ([09:39]).
  • “I think it’s in the vested interest of the United States to stay engaged in NATO...”
  • “Calm down, take a sauna, take an ice bath, we’ll sort this out.” ([09:39])

E. European Frustration and the Changing World Order

• Quotes from other European leaders:
  • “We are in the midst of a rupture, not a transition.” — Canadian PM Mark Carney ([11:26])
  • “Being a happy vassal is one thing. Being a miserable slave is something else.” — Belgian PM ([11:42])
• Stubb distances himself from “appeasement” language but stresses the sanctity of territorial integrity and acknowledges a historical hinge point:
  • “There are elements in this friendship that I think are holy: territorial integrity, sovereignty, independence.” ([12:45])
  • “We’re looking at a world change...similar to the one we saw after WWI, WWII, the Cold War.” ([12:45])
  • “The big tension...multilateralism...versus multipolarity: deals, transaction and spheres of interest.” ([14:27])

F. Proposals for Global Rebalancing

• Stubb advocates reforming international institutions:
  • Recommends doubling UN Security Council membership to reflect Latin America, Africa, and Asia ([15:15]).
  • “We need to reform...so countries that don’t feel they have agency or say, get it.”
  • Warns against a return to spheres of influence.

G. Finland-U.S. Relations & Arctic Concerns

• Details Finland's value to the alliance and direct cooperation with the U.S. ([20:17]):
  • “We have thousands and thousands of American soldiers who come and train with Finnish soldiers...sold 11 icebreakers which the United States desperately needs.”
• “There is very much a mutually beneficial relationship between the United States and Finland.”

H. Ukraine, Russia & Peace Negotiations

• Stubb optimistic about recent cooperation among Ukraine, the U.S., and Europe but doubts Russia’s good faith ([17:25]):
  • “We got new momentum into these negotiations when Jared Kushner joined in and started making things practical…”
  • “Russia’s not winning this war...The human cost has been over 1 million dead or wounded Russian soldiers.”
  • Stubb is content not to be Europe’s top envoy for Russia-Ukraine talks but acknowledges someone will need to speak directly to Moscow in due course ([21:40]).

I. Sauna Diplomacy & Russian Critique

• Responds to Russian envoy’s digs at “sauna diplomacy”:
  • “I don’t usually take issue with Russian information wars and propaganda...” ([17:25])

3. Tariffs, Greenland Negotiations & U.S.-Europe Trade Tensions

• Amanpour interviews Kellyanne Shaw, former Trump Trade Adviser ([23:51]):
  • Shaw says Trump’s removal of military options is calculated to “lower temperatures”; but Greenland remains “the number one topic of conversation at Davos.” ([24:51])
  • On negotiation tactics: “The most successful ones meet the president at the core of his issue — national security, threats from Russia and China.” ([26:14])
• Debate over U.S. rights in Greenland (due to historic agreements), and whether Trump’s quest for ownership is more psychological than practical.
  • “When you own something, you’re more incentivized to defend it. What if you rent or lease...?” ([27:17])
• Shaw: U.S. worried about China’s “Polar Silk Road,” growing Arctic ambitions, and sees the matter as urgent ([28:42]):
  • “There are real and present threats here today which are only going to escalate in the future.”
• Europe’s growing engagement with China (e.g. new Canada-China partnership); China pitches itself at Davos as a “credible and reliable alternative to US-centric trade” ([31:16]).

4. Tariffs, U.S. Domestic Policy, and Institutional Tensions

• Shaw acknowledges Trump uses tariffs for “all sorts of purposes”: trade leverage, strategic supply chains, and, at times, as a blunt foreign policy tool ([34:00]).
• Supreme Court’s role in checking Trump’s use of tariffs and attempts to fire Fed officials is discussed:
  • “Unprecedented tactics...The administration is hoping to land this over the next three years, and I think ultimately history is going to judge whether they were successful or not.” ([35:41])

5. AI-Generated Abuse — Crisis of Impunity

• Segment with Charlie Warzel (The Atlantic) and Hari Sreenivasan ([38:20])
  • Warzel exposes the scale and toxicity of non-consensual AI sex abuse via X’s (Twitter’s) Grok chatbot.
  • “This was the combination of all these things. It was like taking 4chan and hooking it up to a popular social network...It basically turned child sex abuse material and...revenge porn style sexual abuse into a meme. And that was...unprecedented.” — Warzel ([38:45])
• Warzel criticizes Musk’s inadequate, belated fixes and industry culture of impunity, arguing for stronger guardrails and real consequences ([41:27], [45:39]).
  • “You have to have teams of people who are willing to protect the users from people who are going to try to break the technology.” ([48:33])
  • “If we do not culturally just say, this is poison, this is cancerous, this needs to be excised...that number is going to go up and real people are going to be devastated by that. And I just think that those are the stakes of this entire scandal.” ([51:43])
• Contextualizes the issue as part of a wider shift—Pandora’s box has opened for AI-enabled abuse worldwide, with the rate of AI-generated child abuse content skyrocketing ([51:43]).

Notable Quotes & Moments (with Timestamps)

• Trump on Greenland’s Value:
  “It’s the United States alone that can protect this giant mass of land...that’s the reason I’m seeking immediate negotiations.” ([01:51])
• President Stubb on Scenarios:
  “Good, bad, ugly...I took two positive takeaways from the speech: no military intervention. He wants to improve Arctic security for national, and I quote, international reasons.” ([03:21])
• Stubb on Europe’s Strength: “I do not under any circumstance want to reduce the deterrence effect of one of the largest and strongest militaries. There’s a reason why we became NATO members so quickly and that is because NATO wanted us and America wanted us as well.” ([07:55])
• Mark Carney (Canada PM) on Global Change:
  “We are in the midst of a rupture, not a transition.” ([11:26])
• Belgian PM’s Emotion:
  “Being a happy vassal is one thing. Being a miserable slave is something else.” ([11:42])
• Stubb on World Order:
  “We’re looking at a world change...It’ll probably take five years for the new order to be built.” ([12:45])
• Stubb on Reforms Needed:
  “That’s why I’ve called for reform of the UN Security Council, doubling the members to 10, with representation from Latin America, Africa, and Asia.” ([15:15])
• Shaw on Tariffs:
  “The president uses tariffs for all sorts of purposes...some of them are just about pure foreign policy goals, like we’re seeing with Greenland…” ([34:00])
• Charlie Warzel on AI Harm:
  “It basically turned child sex abuse material...into a meme. And that was something I think was unprecedented.” ([38:45]) “If we do not culturally just say, this is poison...if we don’t do something about that, that number is going to go up and real people are going to be devastated by that.” ([51:43])

Timestamps for Critical Segments

• [01:51] — Trump’s statement on Greenland negotiations/denial of military force
• [03:01]–[22:29] — Christiane Amanpour interview with President Alexander Stubb
• [23:51]–[36:28] — Interview with Kellyanne Shaw on tariffs, Greenland, US trade
• [38:20]–[53:39] — Charlie Warzel on AI-generated abuse and platform/institutional response

Tone & Language

The episode alternates between diplomatic caution, deep concern, and—especially from the European guests—a sense of adaptive optimism in the face of American unpredictability. Stubb maintains pragmatism and calm (“take a sauna, take an ice bath—we’ll sort this out”), while Amanpour’s tone is incisive and sometimes incredulous. Warzel brings a level of moral urgency to the AI crisis: “The stakes are high...that number is going to go up and real people are going to be devastated by that.”

Summary: Essential Takeaways

• Europe is rattled by Trump’s aggressive posture, especially his insistence on “acquiring” Greenland and transactional attitude towards alliances.
• Finnish President Stubb sees a generational shift—multilateralism vs. multipolarity—advocating institutional reform and pragmatic but principled diplomacy.
• European defense capacity is real but dependent on U.S. engagement for deterrence; leaders are working hard not to let NATO unravel despite provocations.
• Tariff use by the U.S. is now as much for raw leverage as for economics, emblematic of the new “America First” approach.
• AI-generated abuse is spiraling into a social crisis, and structural fixes are lagging behind technological harm.
• Across topics, the episode explores the enduring tension between American unilateralism and European multilateral ideals—with the world order, and real human safety, in the balance.