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Former Colombian President Ivan Duque

Amanpour

Thu Dec 04 2025

Summary

Amanpour – Episode Summary

Episode Title: Interview with Former Colombian President Ivan Duque
Date: December 4, 2025
Host: Christiane Amanpour, CNN Podcasts
Episode Focus:
Christiane Amanpour interviews former Colombian President Ivan Duque, discussing U.S. military actions targeting Venezuela, the regional response to Nicolas Maduro’s regime, Colombia’s anti-narcotics efforts, and the shifting political landscape in Latin America.

Main Theme

The episode centers on the sharp escalation of U.S. military operations against Venezuela under President Trump, regional reactions to these actions, and the deeper geopolitical and domestic undercurrents affecting Colombia, Venezuela, and Latin America at large. Ivan Duque provides insight into anti-narcotics policies, the case for ousting Maduro, and the dilemmas facing U.S. and regional policy.

Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. U.S. Military Operations Against Venezuela

The Trump administration has intensified strikes on drug trafficking targets, with specific focus on Venezuela and its leader, Nicolas Maduro.
The U.S. now has more military resources in the region than at any point since the Cuban Missile Crisis ([01:13]–[02:21]).
Quote:

“The US has now deployed more military resources and forces in the region than at any time since the Cuban Missile crisis.”
— Christiane Amanpour ([01:41])

2. Regional Support and Perceptions

According to a Bloomberg Atlas poll, 53% in Latin America support U.S. military intervention in Venezuela ([02:24]).
Duque frames the U.S. campaign as a critical anti-narcotics and anti-terrorism effort, referencing cooperative operations such as the Orion Complaint ([02:51]).
He justifies support for U.S. actions as necessary deterrence to narco-terrorism, highlighting Venezuelan provision of “safe haven to narco-terrorist organizations” ([03:19]).

3. Colombia’s Role and Changing Policy after Duque

Duque refers to Colombia’s history of bipartisan cooperation with the U.S. against cartels and criticizes his successor, President Petro, for being more permissive and closer to Maduro ([04:17], [05:35]).
Quote:

“We had that kind of a relationship. Today, sadly… because Petro has aligned with Maduro, we don't have that level of support.”
— Ivan Duque ([04:31])

4. Is it Really About Narco-Terrorism?

Amanpour questions the narcotics rationale, citing facts: Colombia produces most cocaine, while Venezuela is mainly a transit point, and there’s no Venezuela connection to the fentanyl trade ([05:35]).
She suggests regional exhaustion with the Maduro regime is the real driver.
Quote:

“Colombia…sent 3,000 tons of cocaine to the US…accounts for about 70% of the world's overall cocaine production…there's literally no Venezuela connection to the fentanyl trade…”
— Christiane Amanpour ([05:51])
Duque maintains that Venezuela under Maduro is nonetheless central to the problem, pointing to the “Cartel de los Soles” and safe haven for Colombian groups like FARC dissidents ([06:51]).

5. Why Not Regional Action Against Maduro?

Amanpour presses: Why doesn’t the region act alone, without the U.S.? ([09:09])
Duque turns to the Inter-American Democratic Charter, saying the region is obligated to defend democracy but acknowledges U.S. power and interest are key and draws parallels between Maduro and Milosevic for human rights abuses ([09:22], [10:37]).
Quote:

“Nicolas Maduro is also an equivalent of a Slobodan Milosevic in Latin America—brutal violations of human rights, systematic annihilation of opposers…”
— Ivan Duque ([10:37])

6. Legal Basis and Criticisms

Amanpour outlines criticism of the legal basis for the U.S. campaign; Trump claims he doesn’t need Congress for strikes ([11:19]).
Reference to opposition figure Maria Corinna Machado, who supports intervention and even dedicated her Nobel Peace Prize to Trump ([11:40]–[12:29]).
Amanpour notes support for intervention is far higher among Venezuelan diaspora (64%) than within Venezuela (34%), probing the complexities of internal versus external opinion ([12:40]).

7. Migration and Human Rights Crisis

Duque emphasizes the migratory catastrophe, over 7 million Venezuelans fleeing, and widespread human rights abuses ([13:13]).
Suggests any operation should enable a unity government and democratic transition for Venezuela ([13:13]–[15:15]).

8. Historical Parallels and Cautionary Tales

Amanpour brings up the Iraq War as a cautionary tale for U.S.-led intervention ([15:15]).
Duque acknowledges differences, argues U.S. has learned lessons, and foresees a non-occupation transition for Venezuela ([15:56]).
Quote:

“I don't think the US is thinking in Venezuela as an occupation operation as it did in the case of Iraq. I think there is a great room to create a unity government…”
— Ivan Duque ([16:37])

9. U.S. Double Standards

Amanpour critiques apparent contradictions: Trump pardoning Honduran ex-president convicted for drug trafficking, while ramping up drug war rhetoric against Maduro ([17:23]–[18:13]).
Duque calls for fighting all cartels equally and hopes for more transparency on the pardon ([18:22]).
Quote:

“I just believe that it is a duty at this moment to keep on fighting the cartels, fight the Soles cartel, denounce Maduro, because I think that's the most important objective…”
— Ivan Duque ([19:35])

10. The Political Tide in Latin America

Amanpour observes a conservative swing in Latin American politics, but points out the U.S. has historically intervened to install, not topple dictators ([20:11]).
Duque champions democratic norms and “pedagogues not demagogues”—arguing a rejection of populism and polarization in favor of technocratic governance ([20:39]–[21:56]).
Quote:

“People now prefer no more demagogues, but more pedagogues…”
— Ivan Duque ([21:31])

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

On U.S. military escalation:
“The US has now deployed more military resources…than at any time since the Cuban Missile crisis.”
— Christiane Amanpour ([01:41])
On Colombia–U.S. anti-cartel operations:
“We, we started a plan that was called the Orion Complaint…Colombia participated actively with the US and 18 more countries…
— Ivan Duque ([02:54])
On regional hypocrisy:
“Colombia… accounts for about 70% of the world’s overall cocaine production…96% of fentanyl seized by the United States is intercepted on the Mexico border.”
— Christiane Amanpour ([05:51])
On Maduro as the region’s Milosevic:
“Nicolas Maduro is also an equivalent of a Slobodan Milosevic in Latin America…”
— Ivan Duque ([10:37])
On U.S. lessons from Iraq:
“I think the United States has learned lessons from occupation operations and I don't think they're planning to do an occupation operation in the case of Venezuela.”
— Ivan Duque ([15:56])
On policy consistency:
“It is a duty at this moment to keep on fighting the cartels, fight the Soles cartel, announce Maduro, because I think that's the most important objective…”
— Ivan Duque ([19:35])
On the new political climate:
“People now prefer no more demagogues, but more pedagogues…”
— Ivan Duque ([21:31])

Important Timestamps

Opening Discussion & Framing of U.S.–Venezuela Standoff:
[01:13]–[02:21]
Duque Endorses U.S. Anti-Narcotics Operations:
[02:51]–[03:55]
Amanpour Questions Cocaine/Fentanyl Narrative:
[05:35]–[06:51]
Debate Over True Motives: Narco-Terrorism vs. Regime Change:
[05:35]–[08:29]
Regional Responsibility & the Case Against Maduro:
[09:09]–[11:19]
Legal Justifications and U.S. Criticisms:
[11:19]–[11:59]
Diaspora vs. Homeland Opinions on Intervention:
[12:40]–[13:13]
Reflections on Iraq and the Prospect of Occupation:
[15:15]–[16:33]
U.S. Policy Contradictions & Pardoning Honduran President:
[17:23]–[19:35]
Latin America’s Political Shift and Democratic Values:
[20:11]–[21:56]

Episode Tone and Language

Direct and Forthright:
Amanpour presses for honesty — “Can we just please discuss honestly what this is really about?” ([05:35]).
Decisive and Urgent:
Duque maintains a firm stance on regional security and democracy.
Nuanced and Critical:
The conversation does not shy away from double standards, legal ambiguities, and the complexities of regional intervention.

Conclusion

This episode offers a penetrating look at the complexities of U.S. interventionism, Latin America’s narco-politics, and the waiting game by regional and American actors to force regime change in Venezuela. Ivan Duque defends the need for decisive regional action, denounces Maduro as more than just a dictator but the region’s chief narco-terrorist, and insists on the importance of technocratic, law-bound governance. Amanpour’s probing questions and cold facts add nuance, pressing against selective political narratives and placing today’s maneuvers within a longer history of intervention and its consequences.

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Transcript

Christiane Amanpour (0:04)

Hello everyone and welcome to Amanpour. Here's what's coming up.

Ivan Duque (0:09)

Venezuela sends us drugs, but Venezuela sends us people they shouldn't be sending.

Christiane Amanpour (0:16)

Trump ramps up threats against Venezuela. The administration faces serious questions from Congress. But do the President's actions have support in the region? I'll ask Colombia's former president Ivan Duquet. Then.

Christiane Amanpour (0:35)

Defiance in Iran. Journalist Farnaz Fassi. He tells me about the younger generation breaking taboos. Plus, as Putin threatens Europe, is peace in Ukraine really possible? And what will it take? Journalist Joshua Yaffa, chronicler of Putin's Russian Russia joins Michel Martin.

Christiane Amanpour (1:13)

Welcome to the program, everyone. I'm Christiane Amanpour in London. The Trump administration has some serious questions to answer as Congress probes the so called double tap strike that killed survivors during an attack on an alleged drug boat in the Caribbean, a potential war crime. The administration insists that what it did was legal. They've hit 21 boats in recent months as part of their self declared war on narco terrorism. Of course, it's all part of a wider campaign though, that seems aimed at Venezuela and its despot leader, Nicolas Maduro. The US has now deployed more military resources and forces in the region than at any time since the Cuban Missile crisis. So are the alarm bells ringing in Latin America?

Farnaz Fassihi (1:58)

We.

Christiane Amanpour (1:59)

Well, not really. The president's actions have plenty of supporters there, like my first guest tonight, Ivan Duque, who was president of Colombia from 2018 through 2022. Millions of Venezuelans fled to his country at that time. So there's no love lost there for Maduro. Welcome to the program.

Ivan Duque (2:21)

Thank you so much, Cristiano. It's always a pleasure to be with you.

Christiane Amanpour (2:24)

So you're joining me from Yale University where you're teaching. So you're seeing the American reaction and you know what's happening obvious in your own country and on your own continent. But how do you explain. I've said that you're a supporter of Trump's actions. That 53%, according to a poll, 53% of people across Latin America support US military intervention in Venezuela. That's according to Bloomberg Atlas. Paul?

Farnaz Fassihi (28:17)

Well, I think today, you know, the judiciary chief said that we're gonna try to find ways to. To make women observe the hijab law, or we're going to try to find ways to bring, you know, bring people back in. But there's been pushback by the president because he campaigned on more social freedoms. And I think because, again, they recognize that they. This is too many people. It's not limited to a pocket in northern Tehran or here and there. It really is a nationwide phenomena. And they can't arrest everybody. They can't crack down and fine everybody. And, you know, he has said that, look, my policies are not to create, I quote, he said, I don't want to create a conflict that I can't really then contain in society. So there's been hesitation by the government to unleash sort of the morality police or crackdown and arrest. And it's sort of to the extent that they have fined a business that is holding sort of a DJ or a dance party or canceled an event here and there at the design show. It's like playing a game of whack a mole. They crack down, they arrest somebody, they find somebody, but it's too widespread. It pops up at another whack a mole. So I think this is really, it's totally a game of whack a mole. And it's really like, you know, it's interesting because, you know, conservative politicians are acknowledging this. They're saying that, look, we, we are facing a generation that is not. Is indifferent to power, that is not allowing us to tell it what to do. And this is where Iran is going to change. And this is where Iran is changing. The things that we're saying are not happening with, you know, with bombs, they're not happening with military intervention. They're not happening with opposition figures telling people in Iran what to do. This is a grassroots movement from within. And I think this is why people that we spoke to in Iran, sociologists, young people, political analysts, said this is so grassroots that we think that this is the youth and the women are going to win the long game.

Joshua Yaffa (40:23)

There are some new dynamics, right. Despite what we talked about a minute ago and that the kind of overall, the kind of the logic of the war has remained constant. Of course, there are dynamics that come up. The most important one is Donald Trump as President of the United States, who has a dramatically different position regarding Russia. And I don't think we need to sort of go over, right, his history of, of conciliatory statements toward Putin. But I think ultimately what's most important is Trump's desire to end the war. If President Biden had a desire to end the war in a way that, as he and European partners understood it, would deliver some kind of, kind of both durable and just peace for Ukraine, Trump is interested in ending the war, getting a victory, a diplomatic victory, his Nobel Peace Prize, like, for example, was the case with the Gaza deal from last fall, where how the war ended was less important than the fact that it did end. And so then it flows from that, that it's only natural, if you're interested in speed, that you effectively put pressure on the weaker party. And that is Ukraine. Right. And Ukraine is the weaker party for a number of reasons, certainly just by looking at the battlefield dynamics. Russian army just objectively, quantitatively, much larger, it's moving forward and Ukraine is losing territory. At the same time, Ukraine is under increasing financial pressure. The Ukraine budget could really be running out of cash, effectively. And the third point is a political crisis coming stemming from a corruption scandal in Ukraine that hits really close to Volodymyr Zelensky, Ukraine's president. People around him, his longtime chief of staff, right hand man, Andrei Yermak, was forced to resign this week under the specter of a corruption allegation. So all of that comes together to, to put Ukraine in a much more difficult and vulnerable position. And it's that position that Russia hopes the Trump administration will effectively exploit.

Joshua Yaffa (43:08)

A little bit of seeing the 28 point Witkoff plan as a kind of pure expression of Russian or Putin priorities. Certainly there was Russian input, we know now about the genesis of that document. But my sources in Moscow, foreign policy circles, I wrote about this in the New Yorker last week, were actually cautious about that Witkoff document. Kind of potentially some kind of attractive for Russia sounding proposals. But how are they implemented? How can Russia count on them? Politicians come and go. Even Trump, as one Moscow source told me, right, is a temporary political phenomenon, right? He could be out of office in three years. And just like US Policy shifted so dramatically from Biden to Trump, it could shift again. Now to the sort of core question, right, What Putin wants. And he's actually spoken about this quite openly, right. And what he thinks is that Ukraine has essentially become, he calls it a quote, anti Russian project, right? It's been led astray by the west, that its integration with Western political and certainly military structures like NATO, right, is the kind of ahistorical aberration that's not Ukraine's place. And it's, it's being kind of led out of Russia's rightful sphere of influence. And, and Russia simply cannot tolerate this, quote, anti Russian project on Russian borders. That the idea that there would be foreign military bases, foreign troops stationed in Ukraine, with a Ukraine that is culturally and historically rejecting Russia, all of that feels like a kind of security threat, as Putin sees it. That is simply a kind of non starter, a non starter for Russia, a non starter for his own political legacy that he's trying to ensure this is right. We're also dealing with an autocrat who's been in power for 26 years and counting. And I think that also kind of affects, affects how he sees the world at his own place in Russian history. What this is not about is territory. It's not about lines on a map. It's not about, you know, where are the borders drawn, who controls what city. All of those issues are proxies for Putin's real issue, which is that Ukraine simply cannot be allowed to be a threat as he defines it.

Joshua Yaffa (47:39)

That's a great question, one I ask often as a reporter myself, who, who lives in Europe. I'm, I'm based in Berlin. I'm talking to you tonight from, from Warsaw. And of course, the view in Warsaw is very different than the view, let's say, in Budapest, Hungary, right. Where Viktor Orban just recently went to Moscow to meet with Putin, or in a place like Portugal, Greece. Right. Frontline states, as they're called, like Poland, have, of course, different view of this than, than, than states elsewhere in Europe. And that's part of the problem. Right. Is kind of how do you triangulate positions among these states that have different sense of urgency, different sense of priority. Some are trying to deal with their own domestic situations. There's little appetite in European populations for, for taking out, for going further into deficit. Right. For provide, for taking out new loans to essentially having new European taxpayers foot the bill for increased aid to Ukraine. But your parent, your point or your question really is, is absolutely the correct one and I don't have an answer to it. Right. The Europeans were so upset about the emergence of these 28 points and how it was done by kind of end run around European states. European diplomats didn't take into account European interest. Well, where is the European peace plan? Right. I mean if in a vac a vacuum will be filled perhaps in ways that you don't like. Right. But, but I didn't see European, you know, diplomats out in front of a U. EU led peace. There was an attempt to create one after witkoff and the 28 points emerged but that plan was quickly discarded effectively both by Russia and Trump. And it seems like, you know, Europe hasn't attempted since. And the point about the money I think gets to the real crux of the matter, which is European politicians say all the right things about the importance of supporting Ukraine, the strategic interest of making sure Ukraine doesn't lose this war, that that Russian aggression cannot be rewarded.