Iran at a Crossroads

Summary

Podcast Summary: Amanpour – "Iran at a Crossroads"

Host: Christiane Amanpour (CNN International)
Air Date: January 17, 2026

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Overview

This episode of Amanpour explores Iran’s volatile political landscape in the aftermath of brutal crackdowns on widespread protests. Christiane Amanpour hosts a series of conversations with key figures, including Nobel Laureate Shireen Ebadi and former U.S. Special Envoy Elliot Abrams, to dissect the roots of the unrest and the international response. The episode also touches on broader themes of foreign intervention, women’s rights in Iran, U.S. ambitions in Greenland, and humanitarian storytelling from Gaza.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Iranian Protests and Their Fallout

• Start: [01:20]
• Context: Beginning late December, protests over economic collapse in Tehran spread to over 180 cities.
• Regime’s Response: Severe crackdowns; thousands are dead according to a U.S.-based rights group ([01:20]).
• Government Narrative: Claims of a foreign-led escalation; Iran’s Foreign Minister accuses outside "terrorist elements" and an "Israeli plot" ([02:16]).
• U.S. Reaction: President Trump initially promised support but later backed off military action ([02:52]).

2. Interview: Shireen Ebadi on Iranian History and Hope

• Start: [03:22]
• Guest: Shireen Ebadi, Nobel Peace Prize-winning Iranian lawyer and activist.
• On the Tragedy and Global Attention:
  • "The world has shut its eyes to the killing of our young people." – Shireen Ebadi ([03:53])
• On the Suffocation of Protest:
  • Points to the international community's muted response and pushes for European diplomatic action: expulsion of ambassadors, restricting Iranian state media ([04:25]).
• On External Intervention:
  • "We are against military strikes against Iran because that will just lead to the killing of more people." – Shireen Ebadi ([06:30])
  • But makes a controversial call for targeted actions against regime leaders, drawing parallels with prior assassinations ([06:30]).
• Revisiting the 1979 Revolution:
  • "In the 1979 revolution, the number of the protesters killed, not even one thousandth of those killed by the current regime. Such brutality had never been seen in Iran." – Shireen Ebadi ([07:44])
  • Reflects on past mistakes and promises eventual liberation: "In 1979, I believe that the Iranian people had unfortunately decided to throw themselves into a well. And now we've decided to emerge from that well..." ([08:35])

3. U.S. Policy Debate: Interview with Elliot Abrams

• Start: [09:59]
• Guest: Elliot Abrams, former Trump Special Envoy for Iran and Venezuela.
• On U.S. Response:
  • Advocates for "more than just verbal support" for Iranian protesters – e.g., cyber actions, targeting regime infrastructure, stricter sanctions enforcement ([11:23]).
  • "If there are reasonable targets, hitting, for example, Revolutionary Guard headquarters sites... they are reasonable action for the president to take." ([12:15])
• Is the Regime Close to Collapsing?
  • Notes the "difference this time"—protests began with middle class, not students, and are nationwide.
  • "There is a new focus on Reza Pahlavi, a figure who didn't appear in the past." ([12:58])
  • Yet, has not seen the critical "breaking up of the security forces" or their disobedience ([13:30]).
• Risks of U.S. or Israeli Intervention:
  • Argues the regime can no longer rely on nationalism: "Nationalism now works against the regime." ([14:40])
  • Acknowledges the history of U.S. and British interference in Iran.
• On Military Options:
  • Cautions "there is no snatch and grab option in Tehran" ([16:20]).
  • Suggests more aggressive enforcement of oil sanctions as a medium-term pressure point ([16:50]).

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• "The world has shut its eyes to the killing of our young people."
  — Shireen Ebadi ([03:53])

• "We cannot deal with a regime that is armed to the teeth. We urge the west for help."
  — Shireen Ebadi ([04:25])

• "We are against military strikes against Iran because that will just lead to the killing of more people."
  — Shireen Ebadi ([06:30])

• "In 1979, I believe that the Iranian people had unfortunately decided to throw themselves into a well. And now we've decided to emerge from that well and come out of that. And I promise you, one day we will come out of this. We will."
  — Shireen Ebadi ([08:35])

• "I think we should show more than just verbal support for the Iranian people."
  — Elliot Abrams ([11:23])

• "Nationalism now works against the regime."
  — Elliot Abrams ([14:40])

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• Opening, framing the episode: [00:07]–[00:58]
• Overview of Iranian protests and crackdown: [01:20]–[03:16]
• Shireen Ebadi interview: [03:22]–[09:44]
• Elliot Abrams on U.S. options: [09:59]–[17:31]

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Additional Features and Thematic Threads

4. Women’s Rights Struggles in Iran: Historical Perspective

• Start: [33:38]
• Archival reporting focuses on Iranian women’s long quest for equality, restrictive legal and political environment, and incremental social changes.
• Notable reflection:
  "I think the problem is it's not only the government and the system that doesn't give enough rights for the women. Even the women themselves, they don't know their rights." – Gulshifteh Farahani ([34:30])
• Link to Current Uprising: Amanpour reminds listeners that today, women are more openly defying mandatory hijab in the wake of Mahsa Amini's death ([37:01]).

5. Greenland and U.S. Ambitions: Interviews on the Ground

• Start: [18:42]
• Greenlandic politicians and business owners voice fears about potential U.S. takeover.
• Memorable moment:
  "I'm afraid that he [Trump] understands everything and that he doesn't care." – Mia Chemnitz ([22:03])
• Concerns over identity, environment, and sovereignty are paramount.

6. Human Storytelling: 'The Voice of Hind Rajab' and the Gaza Crisis

• Start: [25:55]
• Interview with Tunisian director Kaouther Ben Hania on her film retelling a child’s final hours in Gaza, using her real voice recordings.
• Notable quote:
  "This is not a story. This is history. We can't afford to look away." – Kaouther Ben Hania ([26:35])
• She discusses the need to "bear witness" and the film's challenging path to U.S. distribution despite international acclaim.

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Conclusion

Iran at a Crossroads delivers a nuanced look at Iran’s protest movement, international diplomatic maneuvers, and the heavy cost paid by Iranian civil society. Amanpour’s conversations illuminate the echo of history, the persistent fight for women’s rights, and the pitfalls of simplistic foreign intervention. The episode weaves in contemporary global crises, drawing insightful parallels between local struggles—whether in Tehran, Greenland, or Gaza—and the larger contests over rights, truth, and who gets to shape the future.

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Transcript

[Kauta Ben Haniya]

Foreign.

[Christiane Amanpour]

Hello everyone and welcome to the Amanpour Hour. Here's where we're headed this week. Iran at a crossroads. After a crackdown on nationwide protests. I speak to Shireen Ebadi, Iranian lawyer, women's rights activist and Nobel Peace Prize winner. Then what does President Trump plan to do next? I ask his special Iran envoy from 1.0, Elliot Abrams.

[Elliot Abrams]

I think the question is, are there ways of weakening the regime and its security forces?

[Christiane Amanpour]

And from my archive looking back at the long fight by Iranian women to be treated as more than second class citizens. Also in the program, amid talk of intervention in Greenland, a special report from nuke. Are they ready for an American takeover?

[Nick Robertson]

Does Donald Trump understand Greenland?

[Kauta Ben Haniya]

I'm afraid that he understands everything and that he doesn't care.

[Christiane Amanpour]

Then the new film, a movie about a young girl's final hours using her own voice before she was killed in Gaza. I speak to the director.

[Kauta Ben Haniya]

This is not a story, this is history. We can't afford to look away.

[Christiane Amanpour]

Welcome to the program everyone. I'm Christiane Amanpour in London. And all eyes have been on Iran. Protesters have been fighting for a new future and paying in blood for thousands are dead according to a U. S. Based rights group. All week, horrifying images emerge from Iran like this one of bodies piling up outside a morgue. The true toll could still be higher. Information is limited by an Internet and communications blackout for the past 10 days. The protest began late December in Tehran's bazaars over the government's handling of the economy. Seeing their currency collapse and cost of living soar, they quickly swelled to more than 180 cities and towns, becoming a general protest against the regime. The regime organized pro government rallies and state TV showed funerals for security forces who've been killed. Here's what the Iranian foreign minister told Fox News late this week.

[Nick Robertson]

For 10 days it was peaceful legal demonstrations and protest for economy shortcomings. But after that 10 days, for three days we had completely different story. A terrorist operation, when terrorist elements led from outside, you know, entered this protest, they wanted to increase the number of deaths. Why? Because President Trump has said that if there are killings, he would intervene and they wanted to drag him into this conflict. And that was exactly an Israeli plot.

[Christiane Amanpour]

Indeed, President Trump did tell protesters that help is on the way.

[Nick Robertson]

And by the way, to all Iranian.

[Elliot Abrams]

Patriots, keep protesting, take over your institutions if possible.

[Christiane Amanpour]

But by the end of the week, he appears to have backed off any military action for now, perhaps after Iran said the protests had ended and the regime would not Execute anyone.

[Nick Robertson]

You know, I can tell you I'm confident about that. There is no plan for hanging at all.

[Christiane Amanpour]

So has this uprising and what comes next? I asked Iranian lawyer and former judge Shireen Ebadi. She's the country's first ever Nobel Peace Prize winner for her work promoting democracy and human rights there. Shireen Abadi, welcome back to our program. So we've talked many times when there have been uprisings. I want to know what you think of this one in terms of the history of modern Iran and the uprisings there.

[Sanjay Gupta]

What has happened in Iran is a tragedy. And the number of those killed is far more than those killed in the previous unrest. And I'm very saddened to see the world has shut its eyes to the killing of our young people.

[Christiane Amanpour]

Why do you say shut its eyes? This is top news all over the world. Even President Trump threatened to go to the rescue the help of the protesters if the killing continue. In the spotlight around the world, they.

[Sanjay Gupta]

Don'T see the real picture of what is happening in Iran. They see a much milder version what is happening. And the people's requests and demands have been ignored. We have urged Europe to expel their ambassadors from Iran, to downgrade their diplomatic relations from Iran, from ambassadorial to charge d' affaires level. We cannot deal with a regime that is armed to the teeth. We urge the west for help. For five days there's been an Internet blackout. We have asked them, just as the Iranian regime has managed to impose an Internet blackout so that the Iranian people cannot access the outside world. We urge you, why can you not do the same thing? Why can you not shut down the Iranian telecommunication towers? Please shut down the Iranian media, state media. Do not allow the voice of the government to be heard outside their propaganda and their mendacious reports to reach the outside world.

[Christiane Amanpour]

Do you think that President Trump was right to promise to help the protesters and then seeming to agree with what he said? He's been told that the killings have stopped, that there will be no hangings, and we don't know if military action is still on the table. Do you think Iran should be liberated, in your view, by external action, like military action, either from America or from Israel?

[Sanjay Gupta]

No, we are against military strikes against Iran because that will just lead to the killing of more people. But the people have urged for so many on so many occasions, just as they managed to target Ismail Haniyeh and kill him in one spot, why can you not have the same targeted assassination against the supreme leader of Iran and the current commanders of the Islamic Revolution Guards.

[Christiane Amanpour]

Cause you remember obviously in June when the Israelis attacked by air and the United States attacked by air, certainly the Israelis took out a lot of the people that you're talking about, the Revolutionary Guards leaders, various security leaders. Do you remember? Can you cast your mind back to 1979, around this time when the Shah's forces were under protest and uprising from people on the streets. What was the difference, do you think? Did the Shah use that much violence? He left, of course. He left the country and Ayatollah Khomeini came back.

[Sanjay Gupta]

I remember very well the 1979 revolution. And unfortunately, I was also one of those who protested against the Shah of Iran at the time. And since then, I have apologized to the Iranian people, especially to the young people, saying, we made a mistake. But I remember very well that in the 1979 revolution, the number of the protesters killed, not even one thousandth of those killed by the current regime. Such brutality had never been seen in Iran. Unfortunately, we were deceived by two issues. First, because at the time, they promised us democracy. But we didn't know at the time that the person who was promising us a democracy didn't even know what democracy meant. And it's only when he arrived in Iran, we realized we were also deceived by religious promises. We thought, a religious person is not going to lie. I want to add one thing. In 1979, I believe that the Iranian people had unfortunately decided to throw themselves into a well. And now we've decided to emerge from that well and come out of that. And I promise you, one day we will come out of this. We will.

[Christiane Amanpour]

Shree Nebadi, thank you very much for joining us. And straight ahead, the special representative for both Iran and Venezuela during Trump's first term. He tells me how he thinks the administration should weaken Iran at this critical juncture. That's after the break.

[Elliot Abrams]

We should show more than just verbal support for the Iranian people.

[Christiane Amanpour]

Hey, I'm Anderson Cooper. On my podcast All There Is, we explore grief and loss in all its complexities. You'll hear deeply moving and honest discussions with people who have faced and are living with life altering losses.

[Sanjay Gupta]

Loss is something you have to navigate. It's not a thing where time heals all wounds.

[Christiane Amanpour]

My guest is legendary rock musician, writer, poet Patti Smith.

[Kauta Ben Haniya]

They're sacred wounds.

[Sanjay Gupta]

They're not going to heal. You learn to live with them.

[Christiane Amanpour]

Talking grief, building community, that's what the podcast is all about. This is all there is. Listen and follow wherever you get your podcasts. Welcome back to the program While the world watches Tehran with one eye, the other must be on what the Trump administration will do next if military action is on hold for now. What's Trump's real objective after removing the Venezuelan President Nicolas Maduro from power? Was he gunning for regime change in Iran, too? Elliot Abrams, Trump's former special envoy for Iran and Venezuela, told me what he thinks the president's next move should be.

[Elliot Abrams]

Well, I think he should act. I think he has to now. But yes, I think we should show more than just verbal support for the Iranian people. Just saying, you know, the world is watching or something like that doesn't help them. So what would I think that doing something like hitting missile sites or nuclear sites today doesn't help them? I would hope he would look at, for example, cyber options that actually hurt the regime and its ability to suppress the Iranian people.

[Christiane Amanpour]

So do you not think that they should? Because it's very difficult to pass. Obviously they're not going to tell us what they're going to do, if anything. But some thinking about missile strikes or, you know, the kind of thing that he did around Venezuela before actually abducting the president there, you know, hitting the boats, et cetera.

[Elliot Abrams]

Well, the equivalent would be if there are reasonable targets, hitting, for example, Revolutionary Guard headquarters sites that are actually used in the suppression of demonstrations. If we have such targets, then they are reasonable action for the president to take.

[Christiane Amanpour]

You've been covering, watching, dealing with the Iran file, so to speak, for many, many decades. What is your assessment? Because I know everybody, whether it's in the US Government, in the Israeli government, in the diaspora, wherever there is, every time there is an uprising, and I've covered many of them, people immediately say, this is it, the regime is about to fall. Do you see a difference this time?

[Elliot Abrams]

I see a difference in that it didn't start with students at universities. It started with Bizaris. It started with middle class people and then spread A, B, it's really all over the country. And C, there is a new focus on Reza Pahlavi, a figure who didn't appear in the past. But I would say what I think we have not seen yet, I've certainly not seen, been privy to it is any breaking up of the security forces. I don't see yet disloyalty. I don't see security forces refusing to follow orders. Maybe that's happening and they're covering it up. But that would be a critical ingredient if the regime is really going to start falling.

[Christiane Amanpour]

The regime has said that more than 100 security forces have been killed and they've shown what, what they call the funerals of martyrs on the state television. So they are admitting that those security forces have also been killed, as well as obviously hundreds, if not thousands of protesters. You know as well as I do the history of American intervention, involvement, coups in Iran, not to mention the deposing Mossadegh for the oil, if you remember, along with the Brits during the height of the Cold War in the early 50s and bringing back the Shah, that led to a whole load of backlash that eventually culminated with the 79 revolution that brought the ayatollahs. Is there a risk for the United States in trying to manage any kind of intervention, much less if Israel is involved, Is there a risk that this could all backfire?

[Elliot Abrams]

There's always a risk, but I don't think it's a very great one because I think in past decades, the regime had nationalism in its favor. It doesn't anymore. The people of Iran, the great majority, appear to have reached the conclusion that this regime is ruining the country, that their support for Hezbollah and Hamas, that their nuclear program has wasted tons of money that Iran really does not have, that has created an enemy relationship with the United States and with Israel that they don't need to have. So I think a lot of people thought last year after the Israeli and American attacks, oh, Iranians are going to rise up in nationalist fervor. They didn't. Nationalism now works against the regime.

[Christiane Amanpour]

And to be fair, all those things you say, you know may be true, but the thing that really sparked this one was their quality of life, the poverty they're being plunged into, partly because of maximum pressure that you've all engineered, but also because of total mismanagement by this regime. They want a decent living. This is what Iran expert Suzanne Maloney wrote. Faced with a well entrenched and ideologically committed regime, Mr. Trump has no Venezuela option, no limited operation that removes a malignant leader leader, leaving a newly compliant power structure that maintains some semblance of order. So, a, do you agree that there's no Venezuela option? And B, do you. Have you heard, like some analysts are saying, that perhaps the Trump administration is actually trying to make a deal with the irgc, the Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps?

[Elliot Abrams]

Well, there is no snatch and grab option in Tehran. That's correct. The president this week ruled out negotiations until all of this violence stops. I certainly hope that if it stops, regime still in place, he doesn't immediately start negotiations that will end up actually strengthening the regime and in that sense, forgetting about or even rewarding them for the massive violence against the people of Iran. I do think we have options for weakening the regime, for example, using naval power and air power to prevent them from continuing to violate our sanctions on the export of Iranian oil. We did a lot of that Trump first term. And in the last four or five years there's been less enforcement and a lot more oil has been getting out and going primarily to China. We can stop that. We can certainly try to stop that. That's a medium term thing. That's not going to affect today's demonstrations there. I think the question is, are there ways of weakening the regime and its security forces?

[Christiane Amanpour]

Elliot Abrams, thank you very much indeed for joining us.

[Elliot Abrams]

Thank you, Christiane, after a break.

[Christiane Amanpour]

So much talk of intervention from a president who pledged to end wars, not start them. Next, a report from Greenland where people fear for their future.

[Kauta Ben Haniya]

That is the worst case scenario that, you know, in a month. I'm American.

[Elliot Abrams]

I'm Dr. Sanjay Gupta, host of the Chasing Life podcast.

[Sanjay Gupta]

Just the whole notion of replacing pieces.

[Kauta Ben Haniya]

Of ourselves, how do we do that?

[Sanjay Gupta]

Why do we do it?

[Elliot Abrams]

That's one of my favorite science writers, Mary Roach. For years, she's explored big questions about the human body. This time, however, she's turned her attention to humanity's long fascination with replacing body parts. And the book is called Replaceable.

[Nick Robertson]

You.

[Elliot Abrams]

We're going to talk about what breakthroughs are already changing lives, what's still a work in progress and what it really means to replace parts of yourself that work just as well or maybe even better. Listen to Chasing Life streaming now, wherever you get your podcasts.

[Christiane Amanpour]

Welcome back. Now quote, anything less than US Control of Greenland is unacceptable, says President Trump. European leaders are rallying to head that off. And Greenland and Denmark's foreign ministers went to Washington to explain their red line, which is Greenland is not for sale or for swallowing up. Still, Greenlanders worry about an American takeover. CNN's Nick Robertson went there to speak to them himself.

[Nick Robertson]

Its 11:00am Daybreak off the coast of Greenland, the strategic Danish island President Trump wants for American security. 150 miles from the Arctic Circle, it is a winter wonderland of stark, snowy beauty. Out here in these remote fields, it seems impossible possible to imagine that this tranquil Arctic wilderness could really be at the heart of a geopolitical crisis that has the United States pitted against its NATO allies, potentially threatening to upend decades of global security. Harun Jos Vassan, an Inuit, a native Greenlander, is taking a seal. Hunting food from the land and sea is a core Inuit connection with Nature, a cultural totem. So I know we're waiting for the sea and looking out for the seal, but Donald Trump says there's Russian and Chinese ships here. Where are they from?

[Christiane Amanpour]

China or.

[Nick Robertson]

Donald Trump says that it's not enough just to be friends with Greenland and have a treaty, but he has to own it. What do you say? I'm afraid nature will destroy it and many animals will disappear. Greenland is massive, more than 1600 miles from Arctic tip to Atlantic tail so wide it straddles several time zones. It is also geographically strategic, sits right between the US and Russia, adjacent to newly thawing polar shipping lanes. But despite its size, barely 57,000 people live on the ice shrouded island. Most of them like Aaron Inuit.

[Kauta Ben Haniya]

Inuit have been here in Greenland for.

[Christiane Amanpour]

4,500 years at least, maybe longer.

[Nick Robertson]

Sarah Olsvig is also Inuit. A former Greenland politician in the Danish parliament stands up for Inuit rights. But President Trump now says that he has to own Greenland. That's the only way, psychologically, that he thinks that the deal will be right.

[Kauta Ben Haniya]

If the case is so, that he really thinks that gelatin at Greenland is.

[Christiane Amanpour]

So important for the us, well, then there's something to talk about and let's solve it through dialogue.

[Nick Robertson]

Is that dignified dialogue right now?

[Christiane Amanpour]

I think we are far from what we would call a dignified dialogue, as the.

[Kauta Ben Haniya]

I think that's obvious.

[Nick Robertson]

Inuit are traditionally quiet, but what they say now will be the single biggest factor facing a Trump takeover. Mia Chemnitz is a successful businesswoman, has been silent until now. Does Donald Trump understand Greenland?

[Kauta Ben Haniya]

I'm afraid that he understands everything and that he doesn't care.

[Nick Robertson]

She specialises in Inuit clothing, but she's got orders to fill, so she's taking us to her workshop.

[Kauta Ben Haniya]

Donald Trump and his government are very welcome to invest in Greenland. We're always looking for investments we want to develop. I don't think it's about that.

[Nick Robertson]

What's it about?

[Kauta Ben Haniya]

I think it's about land.

[Nick Robertson]

Donald Trump wants a big country.

[Kauta Ben Haniya]

I'm afraid so, yeah.

[Nick Robertson]

Inside her tiny workshop, she is busy, ready to hire more staff. Items like seal mitts, jackets and trousers, making a comeback exports possible because the animals are hunted for food as well as the hides. But Trump's Greenland grab is crimping her business, putting her own expansion plans on hold.

[Kauta Ben Haniya]

Well, if you don't know which country you're living in in a month, then you know.

[Nick Robertson]

It's that real for you right now?

[Kauta Ben Haniya]

No, I don't want it to be real. I really try to push that thought down. But that is the worst case scenario that, you know, in a month. I'm American. We don't even have military in Greenland because we don't do war. We wouldn't be able to resist the American military. No one can resist the American military.

[Nick Robertson]

Trump isn't the first president to try to get Greenland. The U.S. tried shortly after buying Alaska from Russia more than 150 years ago. Tried again in 1910. And then after World War II, U.S. president Harry Truman secretly offered Denmark $100 million in gold. This time, Donald Trump seems determined to have it his way.

[Christiane Amanpour]

And coming up, I was scared to.

[Kauta Ben Haniya]

Death while I was doing this movie.

[Christiane Amanpour]

How one Palestinian child's desperate cries for help captured world attention. I speak to the director of the Voice of Hindrajad after a break.

[Kauta Ben Haniya]

The engagement that broke the Internet.

[Sanjay Gupta]

A Taylor Swift wedding is a pinnacle.

[Kauta Ben Haniya]

Moment of celebrity culture. Could it have a billion dollar ripple effect on the wedding industry? I do the Taylor and Travis now.

[Christiane Amanpour]

Streaming on the CNN app News Cycle. Making your head spin. The have I got news for you Crew is here to help with a comic take on the week's headlines. New episodes premiere January 24th on CNN and next day on the CNN app. Welcome back to the program. In Gaza, death and destruction continue to be part of everyday life and no one is safe. UNICEF says one since October. That's roughly one child a day since the ceasefire began. And it comes after more than 20,000 children were killed under two years of Israeli bombardment. Now a powerful new film is inviting audiences to bear witness. It's hard to forget the heart wrenching sounds of one little girl's call for help. Back in 2024, the Voice of Hind Rajab weaves that real audio into a dramatized account of the mission to try to save her. He is part of the trailer. We are shooting at a car with a little gear inside. Can you imagine that?

[Kauta Ben Haniya]

So do something.

[Christiane Amanpour]

For its part, Israel has not accepted responsibility for the killing of Hindrajab. The film won the Silver lion award and a 23 minute standing ovation at the Venice Film Festival and it is shortlisted for an Oscar. I spoke to director Kauta Ben Haniya. You know, many people have seen it and written that it's almost impossible to watch this. How do you feel about that, given that you're trying to make people watch it and see it and understand.

[Kauta Ben Haniya]

I know that many people have fears. I was scared to death while I was doing this movie. But I think, I think it's important to watch it. Why? Because this is Not a story. This is history. We can't afford to look away. And I often tell people who tell me it's hard, I don't know if I can handle it. I tell them, it's not your life. Thanks God. So bear witness. And if it's really hard, do something about it.

[Christiane Amanpour]

So tell me, you're Tunisian, you were in the middle of doing another movie when you heard this audio that was posted and that it shocked so many people around the world. What did you think when you heard it? You're talking about having to bear witness.

[Kauta Ben Haniya]

You know, the first millisecond I was thinking she was asking me to save her, you know, which was intentional. But her voice was so alive, so immediate, that the feeling I had when I understood the situation was unbearable, you know, hearing a child pleading for life. And I was. I felt helpless. And I hate it when I feel helpless. So I asked myself, what can I do? I'm a filmmaker, you know, I can do. I can give a space at least for this little girl to be remembered and to be heard, you know, because hearing her voice on social media wasn't, you know, the right place to remember.

[Christiane Amanpour]

Tell me a little bit so that our audience fully understands. This happened in 2024. Israel was bombing in response to the horrendous attack by Hamas on October 7, the year before. And she. Why was she in this car? How was she able to call out? What was her situation at that moment where you're describing in this film?

[Kauta Ben Haniya]

Yeah, that day the Israeli army ordered the evacuation of Tell El Hawa neighborhood. So her mother, it was raining. We are in January 2024. And her mother wanted to protect her, so she put her in a car with her uncle, aunt and four cousin to flee, you know, the area. They were shot at like 500 meter away from home. All of them were killed except Leyen and her cousin, Layene, her name, the cousin of Hind. And so she was. The Red Crescent people called the phone and they talked to Layan. And we know this is a very famous, you know, recording piece that was all over Internet. Lain was killed on the phone with the Red Crescent people.

[Christiane Amanpour]

So let us play the first clip that we have. And this is where the medics from Ramallah Red Crescent are speaking to Hind in the car. Now, this is Hindra Job's voice. Your film is called that it is. That it is extraordinary. I don't know whether there are other films, feature films, because this is not a documentary, but all of these others are actors. But Hind's voice is her voice. Tell me about that. Why did you just not do a documentary? What was the artistic and historical witness you wanted to bear?

[Kauta Ben Haniya]

I have to mention that what the actors are saying is word by word what the real person said in those recordings. So I needed to be very faithful and close to those recordings. I, I thought about doing a documentary in the beginning because I'm a documentary filmmaker. But I thought that maybe cinema can do something better than explaining. We are done explaining at some point. You know, cinema can provoke empathy. We can be with those incredible hero trying to save life in a very, very difficult condition. And I needed to be with them, you know, to hear his voice because they are the one who listened. They are the one who tried and did everything and paid a heavy price.

[Christiane Amanpour]

Actually, very quickly about the response because it's been really critically acclaimed and received. We saw images of, what was it, a 23 minute standing ovation at the premiere at the Venice Film Festival. You know, executive producer, producers like Brad Pitt, Alfonso Cuaron, Jonathan Glazer. But as almost all Palestinian films, it has struggled to get a US distribution. What does that say to you and have you made any inroads since this to get it?

[Kauta Ben Haniya]

Yeah, I mean, thanks God the movie is distributed right now in the United States. It was very hard because another movie about another subject with all this praise at Venice Film Festival we won the, you know, the Silver lion and you, you expected to be distributed by huge distributor. It wasn't the case, but I knew it, it would be a fight, you know, and thanks God the movie is being distributed in a small scale, but people are coming to watch it.

[Christiane Amanpour]

Well, good luck to you. It's an incredible story and you've done it in amazing and powerful way.

[Kauta Ben Haniya]

Thank you.

[Christiane Amanpour]

Thank you. Kauta Ben Haniya. Thank you very much. And the voice of Hindrajab is out now in the us, the uk, France, Spain and the Middle East. Coming up after a break. The protests that rocked Iran reminded me of covering the so called Green Revolution in 2009. From my archive, Iranian women's long struggle for freedom. Welcome back. Now, earlier this program we've discussed the crucial role women have played in Iran's protest movements. For many decades. They've bravely rallied in opposition to the rules imposed upon them by the Islamic regime and demanded to be treated as more than second class citizens. Over decades covering Iran, I focused a lot on the, the struggle for women's rights. So from my archives we visit some of those women who were pushing for more freedoms even 20 years ago and before that Here we are in tehran during the 2005 election.

[Gulshifteh Farahani]

Gulshiefdeh Farahani is 21 years old. She's been an actress since she was 14 and rarely out of work. Iran has a thriving film industry and her movies pack the cinemas and reap awards.

[Kauta Ben Haniya]

I like to work in Iran. I like it because I think it makes me more creative because of these.

[Gulshifteh Farahani]

You know, she's trying to say pressures and limitations, political, religious and social, that force everyone here, especially the women, into subtle forms of self expression. Her latest film was released this week. But Golshifteh knows that her career flourishes at the pleasure of the authorities. Like many Iranian women, she hopes their next president will give women more rights, especially legal rights.

[Kauta Ben Haniya]

I think the problem is it's not only the government and the system that doesn't give enough rights for the women. Even the women themselves, they don't know their rights. They don't know it. So I think that's the real problem.

[Gulshifteh Farahani]

But women's rights advocates point out that all the women who tried to register as candidates for this presidential election were disqualified by the Guardian Council, which vets all contenders.

[Christiane Amanpour]

And this week, groups of professional women.

[Gulshifteh Farahani]

And students held their first public demonstration.

[Christiane Amanpour]

Demonstration since the veil was made obligatory 26 years ago. This time they're demanding their next president improve women's status.

[Gulshifteh Farahani]

Authorities allow women to wear ever tighter overcoats, show ever more hair and makeup, and they tolerate women like Lale Sedir competing in car races. But she too believes that women should pursue their rights more.

[Christiane Amanpour]

If they ask for their rights, by.

[Kauta Ben Haniya]

Sure they will achieve it. And I hope so.

[Christiane Amanpour]

You think it's that easy?

[Kauta Ben Haniya]

By sure, no. But they must try if they want to be successful in everything. Do you remember some colors that we talked about?

[Gulshifteh Farahani]

For now, though, many Iranian women seem more interested in improving their daily lives rather than risking them on political. At this all female English school in Tehran, students are hoping a new language will improve their job opportunities or even be their ticket out.

[Kauta Ben Haniya]

Because of my job, I'm an architect and nowadays we need to learn English because of our jobs to improve yourself. And also I have a plan to immigrate to Canada, so I need it. I want to go to United States because my husband's family are living there.

[Gulshifteh Farahani]

As each shift rotates through this school, Friday's election is on the mind of the students. Women who have always turned out to the polls wonder this time will they vote?

[Kauta Ben Haniya]

I think I will because I love my country and it's my right to participate in what belongs to me.

[Gulshifteh Farahani]

But still they ask, will it make a difference? Christiana Manpour, cnn, Tehran, Iran.

[Christiane Amanpour]

Now, the actress Gul Shifte, who we started talking to in that report, her hopes dashed by the victory then of the hardline conservative Mahmoud Ahmadinejad, like many female artists would ultimately leave Iran. She was not allowed back after shooting the Ridley Scott film Body of lies back in 2008. However, now you'll see so many Iranian women just walking around and going about their daily business with no hijabs. This has been them seizing that right after the death of Mahsa Amini for apparently failing to wear her headscarf well enough while she was in custody by the Iranian police. Now when we come back, they're the brave group of Buddhist monks walking from Texas to Washington, D.C. spreading peace one step at a time. And finally this hour, the antidote to all the violence and division in the world. Now a small group of Buddhist monks and their trusty canine companion are making their way from Texas to Washington, D.C. on foot. And with each step of their tail 2,000 mile route, the walk for peace is gaining global momentum. Large crowds are lining the streets and millions more are following online to hear the monks reflect on unity, healing and compassion as they travel state to state. Since October, they've confronted cold and rainy weather, injury and exhaustion, and yet they keep going. The monks are currently in North Carolina and they aim to make it to the nation's capital sometime next month, planting connection with each step. That's all we have time for, though. Don't forget, you can find all of our shows online as [e-mail] audio and on all other major platforms. I'm Cristiana Manpour in London. Thank you for watching and I'll see you again next week.

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[Christiane Amanpour]

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[Kauta Ben Haniya]

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[Kauta Ben Haniya]

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