Power, Faith, and Fearless Voices: From Busan to Belgrade

Summary

Podcast Summary: Amanpour – “Power, Faith, and Fearless Voices: From Busan to Belgrade”

Date: November 1, 2025
Host: Christiane Amanpour, CNN International
Notable Guests: Matt Pottinger, Marianne Buddy, Gail Young

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Overview

This powerful episode of Amanpour spans the globe, weaving together high-stakes diplomacy, the personal practice of courage, press freedom under threat, and cultural resilience. Christiane Amanpour takes listeners from President Trump’s pivotal Asia tour and fragile US–China détente, to the fearless acts of a bishop, up to the hard-won triumphs and ongoing dangers for journalists in Egypt, Serbia, and Algeria—and finishes with a vibrant celebration of Mexico’s Day of the Dead.

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Key Segments & Themes

1. Trump’s Asia Pivot: High-Stakes Diplomacy

[00:07–09:29]

• Summary:
  President Trump’s recent whirlwind Asia tour resulted in a fragile trade “truce” with China, rare public rapprochement with Xi Jinping, and a recommitment by the US to nuclear weapons testing after 33 years.
• Major Points:
  • Trump’s trade deal included US tariff reductions and promises from Xi to crack down on state-backed fentanyl production.
  • The trip included a controversial announcement to resume US nuclear weapons testing, positioning it as a response to Chinese and Russian moves.
• Timestamps & Quotes:
  • On China’s leverage:
    “China is not going forward with its most draconian threat, which was to regulate all trade between all nations so long as goods contain trace amounts of Chinese rare earths... That would have led to a global recession.” — Matt Pottinger [02:49]
  • On the US–China rivalry:
    “The stakes really are that high. And it was something that... Premier Li Keqiang laid out for President Trump back in 2017... China’s gonna dominate all technology… The United States isn’t gonna sell China anything except for corn and soybeans.” — Matt Pottinger [05:00–06:09]

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2. The Nature of Courage and Faith: Bishop Marianne Buddy

[09:51–18:57]

• Summary:
  Bishop Marianne Buddy, Episcopal Bishop of Washington, reflects on courage during turbulent times—her plea to President Trump, the reaction it provoked, and the enduring need to challenge injustice with faith-fueled bravery.
• Major Points:
  • Her new book, We Can Be Brave, aims to teach children that courage is a lifelong journey, not a trait reserved for heroes.
  • She describes the mixed reaction to her public challenge to Trump: censure from his supporters, gratitude from the marginalized.
  • Bishop Buddy decries a “culture of contempt” spreading through US society.
• Timestamps & Quotes:
  • On courage:
    “Courage isn’t something that only brave people have, but that it’s a lifelong journey of lessons and practice and efforts that we make large and small.” — Marianne Buddy [12:22]
  • On speaking truth to power:
    “I ask you to have mercy, Mr. President, on those in our communities whose children fear that their parents will be taken away... and that you help those who are fleeing war zones and persecution... to find compassion and welcome here.” — Marianne Buddy [13:47]
  • On polarization:
    “The intensity of this polarization and this culture of contempt sustains a threat to destroy us... actively promoted by those within and outside the United States who benefit... from our division.” — Marianne Buddy [15:32]
  • On faith leaders uniting:
    “To see the highest of leaders do so in a public way to demonstrate that common purpose was... inspiring. It brought tears to many eyes.” — Marianne Buddy [18:13]

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3. Global Press Freedom Under Threat

[19:01–35:49]

a) Serbia: Crackdown on Protest and Media

[19:01–23:20]

• Summary:
  • The Novi Sad train station disaster in Serbia, mass protests, and the subsequent alarming escalation of attacks on journalists.
  • Authorities accused of repression by the European Parliament and media watchdogs.
• Quotes:
  • “Journalists are being berated, bullied, spied on and physically assaulted and intimidated... more than 270 cases of different attacks and pressure on journalists from the beginning of the year.” — Jelena Petkovich [20:47]

b) Egypt: Reporting on FGM, Driving Reform

[23:20–31:40]

• Summary:
  • Gail Young’s work in the 1990s exposing female genital mutilation (FGM) in Egypt; the broadcast’s shock value provoked national and international calls for reform.
  • President Mubarak, after public questioning by Amanpour, implemented hospital bans and education campaigns; current rates of FGM are dramatically lower.
• Quotes:
  • “I want you to know, Daddy, that I didn’t want to be circumcised. And you did it to me.” — Voice from original report, as recounted by Gail Young [27:35]
  • “It blew up and everyone was talking about it... And then the next day you did that thing you do with an interview with President Mubarak where you held him accountable.” — Gail Young [27:56]

c) Algeria: Journalists Under Fire

[31:40–35:49]

• Summary:
  • The brutal civil war in 1990s Algeria claimed journalists’ lives at an unprecedented rate; Amanpour’s reporting chronicled their courage and the government’s belated (and imperfect) efforts at protection.
• Quotes:
  • “You talk, you die. You stay silent, you die. So talk and die. As long as we’re alive, we will talk.” — Zubir Souisi, Algerian journalist, recalled by Amanpour [35:23]

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4. Cultural Resilience: Mexico’s Day of the Dead

[35:49–End]

• Summary:
  Amanpour closes by turning to Mexico’s vibrant Dia de los Muertos celebrations, this year marked by special Aztec remembrances—standing in stark contrast to the previous stories of loss and threat, but underscoring the importance of cultural memory and resilience.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On fragile international agreements:
  “This looks to me like a fragile truce.” — Matt Pottinger [04:08]

• On lived courage:
  “We are always crossing thresholds of things we’ve never done before... I think we are created to do that very thing.” — Marianne Buddy [09:51, 12:57]

• On journalistic perseverance under threat:
  “We will never. Shut up, I say. The pen and pictures are extraordinary forms of resistance.” — Amanpour quoting Algerian journalists [35:17]

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• Trump’s Asia Tour Analysis with Matt Pottinger: [00:54–09:29]
• Bishop Marianne Buddy on Faith and Bravery: [09:51–18:57]
• Attacks on Press in Serbia: [19:01–23:20]
• Gail Young on FGM Reporting in Egypt: [23:20–31:40]
• Covering Algeria’s War on Journalists: [31:40–35:49]
• Mexican Day of the Dead Feature: [35:49–End]

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Tone and Style

Amanpour’s signature blend of incisive international journalism, empathy, and moral clarity anchors the episode. Voices of courage—whether from diplomats, clergy, or frontline journalists—are given space to recount their struggles and insights, driving home the episode’s major theme: standing up, often at personal risk, in the face of power and division.

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This episode is a must-listen for anyone interested in the state of the world—how high politics, moral courage, resistance, and cultural pride all intersect on the global stage.

Transcript

[Christiane Amanpour]

Hello, everyone, and welcome to the Amanpour Hour. Here's where we're headed this week. Golden gifts, royal welcomes, red carpets and high stakes. As Trump toured Asia, a former top national security advisor to the president tells me what went right and wrong. Then facing your fears with faith. The bishop of Washington, Marianne Buddy, on learning to be brave and challenging even a president.

[Marianne Buddy]

Courage isn't something that only brave people have, but that it's a lifelong journey of lessons and practice and efforts that we make large and small.

[Christiane Amanpour]

Also ahead, CNN's former Cairo bureau chief on reporting from an ancient land and her shocking revelations on FGM that brought change for little girls, that she didn't.

[Gail Young]

Want it and that they forced it on her. I think that was the most powerful point of that story.

[Christiane Amanpour]

And from my archives, when we journalists were hunted down during Algeria's brutal civil war. And finally, as Mexico marks Dia de los Muertos, an extraordinary monument to its Aztec roots. Welcome to the programme, everyone. I'm Christiane Amanpour in London. And this week, the Trump presidency pulled off its own pivot to Asia. A whistle stop tour where the president danced in Malaysia, received a replica ancient gold crown in South Korea and secured that all important meeting with China's leader Xi Jinping, he announced a thaw, stripping back some US Tariffs in return for Xi giving on rare earths and soybeans. But behind the deals was an undoubted show of force as the president backed South Korea's plan to build nuclear powered submarines and announced his own order to begin testing new nuclear weapons for the first time in 33 years, saying that he's only following China and Russia's lead. It had to do with others. They seem to all be nuclear testing. We have more nuclear weapons than anybody. We don't do testing. We've halted it years, many years ago. But with others doing testing, I think it's appropriate that we do also. So was the whole trip a success? And what does it mean for world stability, superpower competition and crucially for consumers caught in the middle? And I asked President Trump's former deputy National Security Adviser, Matt Pottinger. Matt Pottinger, welcome to the program.

[Matt Pottinger]

Thanks, Christiane. Good to be with you.

[Christiane Amanpour]

So tell me, is this a big deal? Give me the sort of the wins and loses, if any, on what Xi got, what Trump got, what China got, what the US Got out of their meeting.

[Matt Pottinger]

Yeah. So this is the first time that President Trump has met in person with xi Jinping in six years. It was back in OSOC at the G20 in 2019 that they last met. So I would call it sort of a fragile truce on trade matters that came out of this. China is not going forward with its most draconian threat, which was to regulate all trade between all nations so long as goods contain trace amounts of Chinese rare earths. And of course, a lot of technology that matters do contain Chinese rare earths. So that would have been a very extreme by China that would have led to a global recession. And at the same time, President Trump has agreed to withhold implementing further tariffs on China. In fact, he even agreed to repeal some of his new tariffs, about 10 percentage points of his tariffs on China, as sort of a down payment on the idea that China's gonna finally rein in its state subsidized support for the fentanyl trade that is killing so many Americans. In fact, it's the leading of death for Americans between the age of or at least men between the age of 18 and 49. So this looks to me like a fragile truce. Christiane.

[Christiane Amanpour]

Okay, so where does this leave the United States now in terms of relative strength vis a vis China? These are two superpowers. Well, one is an ascendant power, and Xi makes no bones about wanting to surpass the United States on all fronts, economic, military, and trade and all the rest of it. You've recently written in the free press that the summit will determine, quote, whether America will remain a technological superpower or if Xi gets his way, becomes an agrarian commune beholden to Beijing. So where are we on this? Because it's crucial to the relative dominance of the U.S. correct?

[Matt Pottinger]

That's right. If President Trump had given indications that he was toying with the idea of talking to China about selling the most advanced USAI chips, the Nvidia B30A, which.

[Christiane Amanpour]

Is.

[Matt Pottinger]

Basically as good if you have two of them, it's as good as the most advanced chip that American companies use. So it looked like President Trump might be putting that on the table. In fact, though it doesn't seem to have come up in the actual meeting with Xi Jinping, I'm very glad that it didn't. I'm glad that there was no concession by the US on that part because the implications would be so severe. Now, when I was talking about this idea that if Xi Jinping gets his way, we go back to being an agrarian country, the stakes really are that high. And it was something that the Chinese late premier, then Premier Li Keqiang, laid out for President Trump back in 2017. I was staffing President Trump when we visited Beijing in 2017, and Premier Li Keqiang came out and said, look, here's what's gonna happen in the not too distant future. China's gonna dominate all technology. The world will be more dependent than ever on China. China's Gonna beat the U.S. at AI, and the United States isn't gonna sell China anything except for corn and soybeans. When China is happy with how the US is behaving.

[Christiane Amanpour]

Whoa.

[Matt Pottinger]

So this was a bit of psychological warfare by the premier to say, you know, we're gonna win the future, so you might as well surrender now.

[Christiane Amanpour]

So that I find really interesting again in the context of a foreign affairs essay. It was titled China Against China, arguing essentially that there's sort of a difference in American diplomats and political analysts view of China. Now. Is China actually more resilient than Washington gives it credit for? Or is China a paper tiger on the brink of economic problems and this and that? And so do you feel that, that there's a division inside? Yeah. Tell me what that'll lead to.

[Matt Pottinger]

When you look at China, you almost have to have a split screen in mind because two things are true simultaneously. On the one hand, China is actually achieving many of its goals in dominating really critical technologies this century. They dominate us in EVs, they dominate us in batteries, solar, manufacturing. China's manufacturing base is now double that of the United States. Twenty years ago it was the opposite. We were double China. So all of those things are real. That's not paper tiger. On the other hand, China's overall economy is, is not going to be carried by just really by making EVs. The consumer economy is a shambles. The overall economy probably is not growing. China claims low to mid single digit growth in real terms. A lot of economists I know think that China is actually shrinking in real terms, becoming a smaller economy in global terms. And relative to the United States, unemployment is off the charts. Many times they don't even report some of their statistics because they're so bad. Both things are true simultaneously. It is a centrally controlled economy that is having big success in areas that they're grossly over subsidizing. And then it's failing in so many of the other key components of what would make for a normal economy. So if the US doesn't lose its nerve, I still think that this is our race to lose. We have more natural advantages, but it's gonna be a close run thing.

[Christiane Amanpour]

Okay, so. And if the US doesn't lose its alliances, because that also is, you know, exponential power to confront China and it's been said that Trump, with all his tariffs and his demands and demanding hundreds of billions of of dollars of Japanese and South Korean and other money to be invested in the US Somewhat destabilizing their economies, he's basically alienating the very allies he needs to be tough with him on China. Do you buy that? Do you think he did enough on this trip to shore up his alliances?

[Matt Pottinger]

So both things can be true there as well? There's friction in the relationship on trade, but at the end of the day, there's no one other than the United States there to serve as the key guarantor of peace and security. And President Trump is just asking them to carry a bigger part of that burden. And I think that's now happening.

[Christiane Amanpour]

Matt Pottinger, thank you. And we'll come back to you for more analysis of this administration down the road. Thank you so much.

[Matt Pottinger]

Thank you.

[Christiane Amanpour]

And coming up later on the show, the news report that first shocked and then brought reform to Egypt and spared millions of girls from FGM, recollections from the field with CNN's former Cairo bureau chief. And after the break, the Episcopal bishop of Washington on how she pushes past fear with faith and facing up to a president.

[Marianne Buddy]

We are always crossing thresholds of things we've never done before. And every time we do, we're learning something about what courage requires. And I think we are created to do that very thing.

[Gail Young]

Hey, friends, this is Audie Cornish, host.

[Christiane Amanpour]

Of CNN THIS MORNING and the Assignment.

[Gail Young]

And guess what? Every story you care about, every angle.

[Christiane Amanpour]

You want unpacked is now streaming on cnn.

[Gail Young]

That means you can catch my show.

[Christiane Amanpour]

Your other CNN programming whenever you want on your favorite device.

[Gail Young]

And a subscription also gets you access to exclusive video series and unlimited articles.

[Christiane Amanpour]

So subscribe to [e-mail] subscription Welcome back. Now, my next guest shot to fame with her calm and principled plea to President Trump from her pulpit at Washington's mighty national cathedral. Marianne Buddy, the 65 year old Episcopal bishop of Washington delivered the inaugural Mass last January and implored the new president to show mercy and compassion for marginalized groups living in fear of his campaign threats. While the president demanded an apology, many lauded her for her courage. And indeed, over the past 10 months since, those groups have felt the full brunt of this administration's policies. Now a book she wrote during Trump 1.0 is being adapted for younger readers. It's called We Can Be Brave, where she explores the nature of courage and concludes that it is much more than just a single act. And Bishop Buddy joined me here this week to explain her journey. Bishop MARION Buddy, welcome to our program.

[Marianne Buddy]

Thank you very much.

[Christiane Amanpour]

I want to start by asking you the obvious. You brought out a book several years ago and you brought it out again for children. If I could say the children's version, We Can Be Brave. Tell me why you've adapted it for younger readers.

[Marianne Buddy]

I was thrilled to have the opportunity to adapt Themes of Courage for younger readers. First of all, because many of the most consequential decisions we make in life have their roots in things that happened to us when we were young and the choices that we made when we were young. So I wanted to underscore that for young readers that they already have important lessons of courage in their lifetime. I wanted to give them as many insights and lessons that I could from my own life and more importantly, from characters and biblical and historical figures that they have known, to remind them, to remind us all that courage isn't something that only brave people have, but that it's a lifelong journey of lessons and practice and efforts that we make large and small.

[Christiane Amanpour]

I mean, can you learn? Can you be taught braveness?

[Marianne Buddy]

Oh, absolutely. I think we all are. I think from the moments from the, from our earliest steps in childhood, we are always crossing thresholds of things we've never done before. And every time we do, we're learning something about what courage requires. And I think we are created to do that very thing, to cross those thresholds. And so absolutely, it is something that we learn throughout our lives.

[Christiane Amanpour]

So I want to ask you this because most people know a very visible demonstration of your courage. You may not call it courage, but some people thought it was the definition of courage. When you spoke truth to power, and you spoke your truth in the form of a supplication, really, to President Donald Trump during his just after his first inaugural.

[Marianne Buddy]

I ask you to have mercy, Mr. President, on those in our communities whose children fear that their parents will be taken away and that you help those who are fleeing war zones and persecution in their own lands to find compassion and welcome here.

[Christiane Amanpour]

When you said it, a what was the reaction and how did your congregation react to you?

[Marianne Buddy]

I think it was well known immediately afterwards that the president and his supporters were not at all pleased and thought that I had been, at best, inappropriate and worst, deeply outrageous in my remarks on the other side. There was an enormous outpouring of support and gratitude from around the country and around the world. And so it's an interesting phenomenon to be a part of something like that. But I would say that it was an opportunity for me to lift up some very basic biblical and spiritual values into that space and to honor the very people who were being and are being so dehumanized now. And when you ask about the congregation I serve, I would say that many of the people that I serve support the positions that I've taken because they are not mine. They are part of our broad spiritual tradition. Others disagree. We are not a monolithic church. But they respect my convictions, and I respect those who differ with me.

[Christiane Amanpour]

So you're never under threat of being cancelled?

[Marianne Buddy]

Not at the moment. We live in interesting times.

[Christiane Amanpour]

In a sermon this spring in Germany, you said one of the greatest challenges in the United States today is a culture of contempt that has normalized hateful speech and encourages violence. You've also said that we are deeply divided. The intensity of this polarization and this culture of contempt sustains, you know, a threat to destroy us. It's actively promoted by those within and outside the United States who benefit financially and politically from our division. Tell me a bit more about the culture of contempt that you identify.

[Marianne Buddy]

I think what's important for us as Americans to realize is that we have all been influenced by this culture, and the language of contempt has become increasingly normalized in our daily speech. And so how we can, every one of us pay attention to the ways that we speak to and about one another, and perhaps to have greater curiosity and a willingness to engage with those who see the world differently and not to allow those who put us in caricatures of difference to hold the final word. Now, I do want to make the distinction between the ways that many of us relate to each other in our neighborhoods and in our communities, but the public arena, and increasingly some of our private spaces are marked by greater and greater hostility.

[Christiane Amanpour]

I guess then you must have been encouraged and actually sort of empowered when you saw two of the major world faith leaders meet together in the Vatican, in the Sistine Chapel just recently. Right. The American Pope Leo, Roman Catholic, and the British King Charles iii, head of the Church of England. Two different strains of Christianity. What did you take from it?

[Marianne Buddy]

Well, first of all, it's a very personal connection on both sides of that. As an American, huge admirer of Pope Leo and so grateful for his witness on the global stage, and King Charles and the Church of England. That is the tradition to which I belong in the wider Anglican Communion. And so to see the two of them together and to know something of the backstory of how long the Anglican Communion and the Roman Catholic Church have been in dialogue to. To work to find highest possible ground between us where we can be united in our witness to Christ and his message of love in the world. While acknowledging on so many levels, in fact, my very ordination stands right in the middle of the differences between our traditions. And yet that didn't keep the two of them from not only speaking, but praying together. And I might add that Anglicans and Roman Catholics pray together all the time in other contexts. Right. And I happen to be married to a Roman Catholic. So it's not that we aren't praying together, but to see the highest of leaders do so in a public way to demonstrate that common purpose was, it was, it was inspiring. It brought tears to many eyes.

[Christiane Amanpour]

Well, Bishop Marion, buddy, thank you very much indeed. I'm going to add one word. We can all be brave.

[Marianne Buddy]

Thank you so much indeed. Thank you.

[Christiane Amanpour]

Coming up, one year after a deadly railway station collapse in Serbia that ignited mass protests, journalists there say they are being attacked. Just for covering the fallout, welcome back to a look at global press freedom. Now, today marks a grim anniversary in Serbia, one year since the collapse of a train station roof which killed 16 people. The disaster in Novi Sad shocked the country and sparked massive nationwide protests. Many young Serbs saw it as the culmination of years of corruption and mismanagement. In the past 12 months, the protests have grown in size with many now calling for early elections. It is the biggest challenge in years to the president, Alexander Vucic. But the reaction from Serbian authorities has alarmed many, including the European Union, which Serbia one day hopes to join. A recent European Parliament resolution condemned Serbia's leadership, quote, for escalating repression, normalizing violence and weakening democratic institutions. Take a listen to one MEP One year after we recall violent crackdown, intimidation of peaceful protesters, inappropriate pressure on free media and independent judges, and manipulation of facts for political survival. This is not a government following a path towards the eu. Quite the opposite. And about Serbia, the Committee to Protect Journalists has also noted, quote, an alarming escalation in attacks on journalists in that country. Jelena Petkovich is an independent reporter who specializes in media safety and she told CNN the situation is getting worse.

[Marianne Buddy]

Journalists are being berated, bullied, spied on and physically assaulted and intimidated. The Independent association of Journalists of Serbia.

[Gail Young]

They have recorded more than 270 cases.

[Marianne Buddy]

Of different attacks and pressure on journalists from the beginning of the year.

[Christiane Amanpour]

Indeed, two of the country's non government aligned TV networks, Nova and have followed the protests closely. And President Vucic accuses them of, quote, pure terrorism. CNN has a commercial affiliate relationship with N1, but no editorial control over the channel N1's news director, Igor Bozich, told me about the difficulties they faced. He said their journalists have been physically attacked in the streets by what he called thugs and that the threats they face in person and online amount to intimidation. I mean, I can say that there are thugs. They're doing that on the demonstration. Sometimes even the policemen on the demonstration and the protest are attacking our journalists, even though they have a press vest. Sometimes they are sending us threats via email. You know, when they send you an email and say in that email, we know where you live, what car you are driving, and who are the members of your family, then, you know, reporters will think about twice how he's gonna report in this situation. Now, President Vucic told CNN that he, quote, remains firmly committed to freedom of the press and public discourse. He rejected any suggestion of impunity regarding attacks on journalists and said that the Serbian police had acted, quote, with maximum restraint, ensuring the safety of all citizens, including members of the media. But he's also told Serbian television that if he had wanted to shut N1 down, quote, we would have done so. Of course, all this comes at a time when the Trump administration has repeatedly attacked journalistic institutions in America and cracked down on the news media, while at the same time cutting funding for international broadcasters like Radio Free Europe and Voice of America. It all amounts to a sobering moment for journalistic freedoms and safety. And we must never forget, a free press is a cornerstone of any thriving democracy. As Thomas Jefferson once wrote, our liberty depends on the freedom of the press, and that cannot be limited without being lost. Coming up, a report that shocked the world and helped bring change to Egypt.

[Gail Young]

Negla is 10 years old. She's excited to be the center of attention, fearful of what might happen next. This morning, she'll be circumcised.

[Christiane Amanpour]

Former CNN Cairo bureau chief Gail Young on exposing that brutal practice of FGM and her reflections from a new memoir. Welcome back. And now we have a difficult but necessary story about the rights of young girls and women in Egypt. Female genital mutilation, or fgm, affects millions of girls every year around the world, often before their fifth birthday. My next guest, Gail Young, was a colleague during the 1990s when she was CNN correspondent in Cairo. Bureau chief there. She helped expose that brutal practice, and her report sparked outrage in Egypt. But it did lead to change. Now she's reflecting on that groundbreaking work and on the extraordinary women, past and present, who. Who shaped her journey. That's in a new memoir called Reporting from an Ancient Land. And I must warn you One of the clips we showed during the interview is difficult to watch. Gail Young, welcome to the program. And we know each other for a long time. Used to be a CNN producer and correspondent, and we crossed paths a lot, especially during the 90s. This memoir, though, is not just about your time at cnn, but also it's kind of unusual, as you say. It's about what an ancient scene Syrian queen. She features a lot.

[Gail Young]

Yes, it is an unusual memoir. It is a memoir. It is about my adventures, as you said, in Egypt in the 1990s when I was sort of unexpectedly became a CNN correspondent and bureau chief in Cairo. But I was also always fascinated with Roman history. And on my first assignment in Syria, I became aware of this ancient Syrian queen, Zenobia. And I realized over the years that our paths kept sort of overlapping because we would encounter sort of similar things at the same age. At that time, you know, wars and rebellions and sieges and disasters and also things like, I don't know, recalcitrant camels and warm beer. But 17 centuries apart, you know, I.

[Christiane Amanpour]

Remember you especially with your camera woman, Mary Rogers. You guys made a formidable team in the mid-90s in Egypt. And it was about FGM female genital mutil what led you to this story? And then we're going to play it. It's quite hard to watch and to listen to even, you know, 30 years later.

[Gail Young]

Well, I had a tutor and she would come to my house, an Arabic tutor, and we would speak Arabic. And one weekend she was all excited because her little sister was going to be circumcised. And I was shocked. I had no idea that that happened in Egypt. I'd never heard anybody mention it. But when I started to do some investigating, it was a lot of girls, all of them practically 97% by some reports at that time. And yet no one ever seemed to talk about it or understand it as an issue. Negla is 10 years old. She's excited to be the center of attention, fearful of what might happen next. This morning she'll be circumcised. Hag Omar is known in Arabic as a hygienic barber. He circumcises thousands of girls each year, as did his father before him. He doesn't bother to wash his hands or the child. A ripped sheet makes a crude bandage around her waist. The family celebrates. The operation will be quick, without anesthetic. Shame on you, Chide the barber. It's finished. Soon you can get up and go play. I want you to know, Daddy, that I didn't want to be circumcised. And you did it to me. Don't be a brat. Your grandmother called. It's over. Says her father. Be brave, Nega. Be brave.

[Christiane Amanpour]

Honestly, it was shocking then and it's shocking now. Obviously we blurred out some of the pictures, which did not happen in its first airing. And what shocked you most about it? Because you were invited in and you thought it was going to be some kind of celebration. I don't know what you expected.

[Gail Young]

The fact that she screamed at her parents, this is a shame upon you, A sin in Islam, and that she didn't want it and that they forced it on her. I think that was the most powerful point of that story. And, you know, not only for the world, but for Egyptians themselves. And once that story aired, it was, you know, it's hard to say something went viral before the Internet, but it blew up and everyone was talking about it. We were both of us interviewed by international press about that story. And then the next day you did that thing you do with an interview with President Mubarak where you held him accountable.

[Christiane Amanpour]

Do you think your government can outlaw that? It needs to explain to the people because if we cannot issue a law, they will not obey it because we will never catch them or never punish them.

[Gail Young]

And not long after that interview, Mubarak, they did order that it would not be performed in public health facilities and that they would start an education campaign. And here we are 30 years later and the number of girls circumcised in Egypt has dropped dramatically. Studies showed it was at 97% before or when we did the stories, and that now some surveys have suggested that only 15% of urban girls are now circumcised. Egypt itself puts that number for all girls more around 30th.

[Christiane Amanpour]

So just to, you know, end up. How do you assess in your memoir and in your thoughts, the results of your journalism, the results of your journey through the Middle east, through Egypt specifically?

[Gail Young]

Well, you know, I saw the 90s as sort of a magical time in CNN because it was a beast that needed 24 hour coverage before going live. Was that easy, right. So I did a lot of human interest stories when I was at cnn and you taught me a lot. And can I please tell this story?

[Christiane Amanpour]

Tell, I don't know the story.

[Gail Young]

Remember we were in Algeria and it was so dangerous and the moment we.

[Christiane Amanpour]

Walked out during the Islamic feast takeover there.

[Gail Young]

Yeah. We walked out of the airport and people were sitting spitting at us and calling us names. And the crew. I brought from Egypt wouldn't go out of the hotel. So I found another crew. We went out, we were on the streets, and as we were shooting some B roll for your story and looking at people, these guys came up behind us. And one of them says, I want to kill you in English. And I'm like, okay, nope, I'm good. We're going to get in the car and go back to the hotel. And you spun the cameraman around, grabbed the microphone and put it and you said, why? Why do you want to kill him?

[Christiane Amanpour]

Really?

[Gail Young]

Yeah. And the thing was, you weren't aggressive. You weren't trying to shame him. You weren't challenging him. It was like you really wanted to know, why do you want to kill us? Why? And, you know, he was so taken aback. But then he started talking and a small group came around and the whole mood changed. And, you know, I love that idea that as journalists we can use our, you know, natural curiosity and our ability to just try to understand and ask that why?

[Christiane Amanpour]

Gail Young, thank you for reminding me and thank you for being such a good colleague.

[Gail Young]

Thank you.

[Christiane Amanpour]

We had a heck of an adventure today.

[Gail Young]

We did in Egypt.

[Christiane Amanpour]

And just to note, FGM was in fact officially banned in Egypt by President Mubarak during his time in office. President Sisi has signed a law now to strengthening the penalty for those committing it. As Gayle and I discussed, Algeria was a dangerous assignment. And 30 years ago, journalists were targeted there. Killing journalists has cachet. There have been more killed here in Algeria over the past year than in any other country. After the break, a look back into my archive at the deadliest place in the world for journalists then in the 1990s. Welcome back to a look through the archives. It's been more than 30 years since the height of the brutal civil war in Algeria, North Africa. It was a period of bloody conflict between Islamists and the military regime. It also was a crucial time in the modern fight for press freedom and safety. In the mid-1990s, Algerian journalists were literally under fire, caught between the insurgent militants who saw them as symbols of Western decadence and the military government that jailed and tortured critics. More reporters were killed in Algeria than anywhere else in the world at that time. In 1995, I traveled there to document the courage of those who kept telling the truth. And they told us, talk and die or stay silent and die. And so they talked. Here's our report. Flipping through his photo files, Wahhab shows visitors the horrors he's chronicled during Algeria's three year civil war. Severed heads, bloodied bodies, men, women and children. And that one was a journalist, he says, pointing to a cadaver in a morgue. Algerian journalists have buried 37 of their colleagues. When he's working, Wahab, like others, tries to hide his identity. The worst is when you go to your room. You don't know whether you'll make it through the night. And the next day you go to the newspaper and find out your friend had his throat cut or was shot. It hurts. Instead of awards, photos of dead colleagues decorate the walls of Algeria's newsrooms every morning.

[Gail Young]

When we get together, we are happy.

[Christiane Amanpour]

When we see our friends are still alive. But we don't know who's next on the list. Death threats come in by facts. Algerian journalists are caught in a bind. Their press is not entirely free. Much of their information comes from government communiques or leaks. Islamic militants consider them government mouthpieces and symbols of Western style secularism and therefore legitimate targets. On the other hand, the army backed government is accused of jailing and even torturing journalists who criticize the authorities or sympathize with the Islamists. The danger is everywhere. Killing journalists has cachet. There have been more killed here in Algeria over the past year than in any other country. Every journalist here knows that just one death amongst them has a far greater publicity value than the thousands of others who have died anonymously. So the government has taken the extraordinary step of providing protection for many journalists, lodging them in former tourist hotels. They joke about living in detention camps, about life on the run, about their deadly profession that forces them to live in the shadows, about the pressure to quit.

[Gail Young]

Never.

[Christiane Amanpour]

We will never. Shut up, I say. The pen and pictures are extraordinary forms of resistance. About two hundred and 50 of Algeria's 800 journalists have fled the country. In his guarded hotel room, Wahab is getting ready to leave too. He says he needs a break. In his newsroom office, Zubir Souisi quotes a colleague. The first journalist to be killed. You talk, you die. You stay silent, you die. So talk and die. As long as we're alive, we. We will talk.

[Gail Young]

We are afraid, of course, but we.

[Christiane Amanpour]

Have decided to talk and we will not shut up. Such bravery. Just watching it again gives me chills. The memories are really bad. Of course the war ended. The Islamists were defeated. But there is still political repression in Algeria now. When we come back, one of Mexico's cultural summits, the annual Dia de los Muertos. That's next. And finally, Halloween may be over, but the celebrations aren't all over the world, they're spilling into the weekend. And nowhere is it bigger than in Mexico, where the traditional Dia de los Muertos, or Day of the Dead, celebrations have been kicked into overdrive this year as the country marks the 700th anniversary of the founding of the Aztec capital, Tenochtitlan, the miraculous city on a lake. Ultimately plundered and destroyed by conquistadors in the 16th century, its ruins now lie beneath modern day Mexico City. And to honor that cultural overlap, this week a towering Day of the Dead installation has taken over Mexico City's main square, witnessing parades and other events that trace their origins all the way back to the Aztecs. And that is all we have time for. Don't forget, you can find all our shows online as [e-mail] audio and on all other major platforms. I'm Christiane Amanpour in London. Thank you for watching and see you again. Next, news fatigue. Have I GOT News for you? Is the cure and also the disease. CNN's comedy quiz show is back, making sense of the mayhem and definitely adding to it. Have I GOT News for you. Saturday at 9 on CNN.